From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #147 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, May 21 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 147 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: question about "For Free" [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: And now for A Case of You . . . [anne@sandstrom.com] Re: question about "For Free" [juancito@juno.com] And now for A Case of You . . . ["J.David Sapp" ] Re: Parker Fly, VG-8 and VG-88; foreword to books ["Timothy Spong" ] Of inscriptions and things rendered unto Caesar [Denny Giovanetti ] Last Waltz box [JRMCo1@aol.com] Re: Last Waltz box [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: What music will play at your funeral? [KJHSF@aol.com] cavolina [Gerald Notaro ] Re: Last Waltz box [JRMCo1@aol.com] how I got on to Joni, plus info on new album! ["Josh Eubank" ] Re: And now for A Case of You . . . ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: 100% joni Content now - and Electricity [Bobsart48@aol.com] Re: FTR live and Covers Volume 29 ["Kakki" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 08:57:45 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: question about "For Free" <> Hiya Jim, Joni performed "For Free" as early as 1969. James' song didn't come out until 'Mud SLide Slim' in 1971. I wouldn't bet the mortgage on it, but I would bet a paycheck that For Free was the earlier song. Welcome to the JMDL...please don't be concerned with "treading old ground". Indeed, as we just saw with the Electricity thread, there is always something gained with doing exactly that. Bob NP: Doogie White, "This Flight Tonight" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 07:30:01 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: Re: And now for A Case of You . . . Sorry if I'm repeating what someone else has said. (I read my e-mail in reverse order 'cuz that's how it comes in...) Anyway, the line "I am as constant as the northern star" is a direct quote from one of Shakespeare's plays - - (Romeo and Juliet, I think?). lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 10:01:03 -0700 From: juancito@juno.com Subject: Re: question about "For Free" Bob, Thanks for your quick and friendly reply. My question was prompted by what I perceive as similarities between the two songs in both structure and theme. Am I the only one who has ever questioned this, or is it all in my head (always a possibility! LOL) Anyway, thanks again. Jim On Mon, 20 May 2002 08:57:45 -0400 SCJoniGuy@aol.com writes: > < James Taylor's "Hey Mister, That's Me up on the Jukebox" ? >> > > Hiya Jim, > > Joni performed "For Free" as early as 1969. James' song didn't come > out until 'Mud SLide Slim' in 1971. I wouldn't bet the mortgage on > it, but I would bet a paycheck that For Free was the earlier song. > > Welcome to the JMDL...please don't be concerned with "treading old > ground". Indeed, as we just saw with the Electricity thread, there > is always something gained with doing exactly that. > > Bob > > NP: Doogie White, "This Flight Tonight" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 10:10:14 -0500 From: "J.David Sapp" Subject: And now for A Case of You . . . kate wrote: This is what I always thought. peace, david ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 15:39:47 +0000 From: "Timothy Spong" Subject: Re: Parker Fly, VG-8 and VG-88; foreword to books Bree wrote, in part: ... > > >Hi josh and everyone.....happy sunny Sunday to you... > >The Parker Fly is a guitar....stratlike. Randy had pointed out that it is >very lightweight. Because of Joni's childhood polio this left her with >very >little muscles in her back. This guitar has been a blessing. I would say >this is the main reason she uses the Parker Fly.... because it is so >lightweight. ... and I add: According to a description read in either a catalog or a buyer's guide, at least one model of the Parker Fly (and maybe all) has a piezo pickup, in addition to the magnetic pickups. The piezo pickup, if used by itself, gives the sound of an acoustic guitar played through amplification, as contrasted to the electric-guitar sound of the magnetic pickups. In a sense, that is redundant when using the VG-8 or VG-88, which have, among their available sounds, acoustic guitars (probably both nylon-stringed and steel-stringed) -- the actual guitar serves as a triggering mechanism, and its sound, as such, is not what comes out the speaker. "Strat-like" may describe the overall way the Fly is made, except for the piezo pickup, but not its appearance, with that oddly shaped top "horn." Also, Susan [Ozwoman312@aol.com] wrote (in part): >~ Bob, in reply to your request for Joni appearing in fiction, I only >*just* >finished re-reading a favorite novel, The Pull of the Moon by Elizabeth >Berg >- - I can't come up with the word for the quote page at the beginning of a >book >(not dedication... inscription... attribution... prologue... >introduction... >foreshadowing... but I'll be d*mned if I can remember what it *is*!), >but... > The term is "foreword," and the word itself usually appears, like a title, on any given book's foreword. Tim Spong Dover, Del., U.S.A. _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 11:01:04 -0500 From: "mia ortlieb" Subject: Joni and Carly question All this talk of Joni and Carly has me thinking. Perhaps this was discussed before, but I was wondering if anybody knows if the man from Carly's "You're so Vain" is the same man from Joni's "Just Like This Train" (my vain darling)? I heard a rumour that Carly was singing about Warren Beatty. Did Joni ever date Warren? Mia _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 11:05:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Denny Giovanetti Subject: Of inscriptions and things rendered unto Caesar Re: ACOY anne@sandstrom.com e-queried >Anyway, the line "I am as constant as the northern >star" is a direct quote from one of Shakespeare's plays >- (Romeo and Juliet, I think?). 'Twas Julius Caesar who spake: But I am constant as the northern star, Of whose true-fixd and resting quality There is no fellow in the firmament. (Julius Cfsar. Act iii. Sc. 1.) . . .unbeknownst that such hubris would soon be gravely punctured "Timothy Spong" wrote: > The term is "foreword," and the word itself usually appears, like a title, >on any given book's foreword. The term is "epigraph," generally a quotation (also applies to building inscriptions, etc.) Denny ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 11:28:10 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: joni on tv last night, late...saw a show on the woodstocks (my generation)...mostly about the 94 & 99 with references back to 69 ... they played joni's woodstock in the background which helped to underscore the contrast they were getting across re the peacefulness of the original as opposed to the others... ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 14:40:55 -0400 From: JRMCo1@aol.com Subject: Last Waltz box Hi. Has anyone gotten the new Last Waltz 4 CD box set yet? My understanding is that the Joni tracks included are unreleased acoustic versions of "Shadows and Light" and "Furry Sings the Blues." I got the new DVD and was disappointed that no new Joni footage was added. Can anyone report on the Joni tunes on the new CDs? - -Julius ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 14:51:08 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Last Waltz box Hi Julius, I don't have it but Stephen did when I visited him in NYC. The Joni tunes on the new boxset are: Coyote (was on the original 2-CD collection) Shadows & Light (with the alt. arrangement she used on her '76 tour as well Furry Sings The Blues Joni also adds backup vocals to The Band's (brilliant) song Acadian Driftwood. Bob NP: Pearl Jam, "Smile" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 14:55:44 -0400 From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Re: What music will play at your funeral? I realize I'm a little late responding to this, but I've been on the road for a few weeks and found myself washed up in the beach town of San Diego, looking for a place to live and a fresh start which is daunting, to say the least. My choices are three pieces of music, Fantasia on a theme of Thomas Tallis by Ralph Vaughan WIlliams, Hejira, and Amelia. I'm in a coffee shop checking up on 300 posts from you guys and I can't tell you how much more connected it's made me feel since I've been so solitary these past few weeks. much love ken from SF now in SD ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 15:12:50 -0500 From: Gerald Notaro Subject: cavolina Does anyone know if Joni's art director Robbie Cavolina is related to the Fez booker Ellen Cavolina? She was a friend and big supporter of Jeff Buckley. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 16:01:39 -0400 From: JRMCo1@aol.com Subject: Re: Last Waltz box Thanks, Bob. I was hoping to get some qualitative information though. How does the Waltz "Shadows and Light" compare to the Shadows and Light live version, for instance? How does Robbie and the Band accompaniment of Joni on "Furry" and "S&L" compare to Pat Metheny, Jaco, et al? Stuff like that. I don't think I'll buy the CD box, as I'm pretty waltzed out after seeing the theater re-release and watching the DVD, both au natural and then with 3 different types of voice-over commentary. Some interesting comments on Joni by Scorsese and the others on the DVD, by the way. - -Julius ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 16:55:47 -0400 From: "Josh Eubank" Subject: how I got on to Joni, plus info on new album! I had gotten an email from the list asking me to write how I got on to Joni...I got in to her thanks to my guitar teacher about six years ago who had made me an assortment tape of different artists! He left the state several years ago so I no longer work with him, but I've started picking up my acoustic once again! I currently put on Joni material usually the later recordings Chalk Mark In A Rainstorm, TI, and TTT! I really enjoy learning some of the chords and the notes to the songs somewhat! Alsi I live in Lovettsville VA, in Loudoun County! Oh by the way, I've heard rumors that TI is out of print! I was hoping to get a copy for a friend! Anyone can answer this question! One more thing, anyone on the list can answer this, anyone know any more about Joni's new upcoming album, song list, release date, etc? Thanks! Josh ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 17:19:43 -0700 From: Lindsay Moon Subject: FW: Undeliverable: Fwd: Virus Yep, I found it too. Lindsay - -----Original Message----- From: Vicki Lewis [SMTP:vlewis@san.rr.com] Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 6:17 AM To: Akram/Rosha Ramezani Cc: Ballerini Court Reporters; Becky Owens; Bill King; Moon Lindsay; Sandy Rowley; Verduzco Kim Subject: Fw: Undeliverable: Fwd: Virus Dear Everybody. I DID find this virus in my system! Follow the directions at the bottom and check that you haven't also been infected. Vicki - ----- Original Message ----- From: "janice castater" To: "jose bello" ; "claudia castater" ; "Claudia castater" ; "david castater" ; "j castater" ; "janice castater" ; "john castater" ; "cdr" ; "cathy a. cosby" ; "Cathy Cosby" ; "sandy davis" ; "gail de la cruz" ; "rocio delacruz" ; "belinda delgado" ; "robert denos" ; "Gen Dodd" ; "Joanie Ecker" ; "Joanie Ecker" ; "Noel Edwards" ; "Els" ; "Celeste Healey" ; "rob jameyson" ; "stephanie kuhne" ; "carol lanfair" ; "valerie legg" ; "vicki lewis" ; "jamie liquori" ; "Anibal Loaiza" ; "anibal loaiza" ; "randall madsen" ; "Irene Martinez" ; "matteo matteo" ; "Kernan McLuster" ; "Danielle Mullineaux" ; "val quaid" ; "joan riese" ; "renee sedgwick" ; "renee sedgwick" ; "tim sandy shaub" ; "elana hubby simmons" ; "anita smith" ; "Robin Sunkees" ; "janet terlouw" ; "janet mike turlouw" ; "mike r. turlouw" ; "wil wilcox" ; "stephanie witte" ; "kim woodworth" ; "kim woodworth" Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 10:41 PM Subject: Undeliverable: Fwd: Virus > I never opened an attachment from the person that this > virus came from, yet I found it on my hard drive. > Please check your hard drive utilizing the > instructions below. > > jmc > > Subject: Fw: Undeliverable: Fwd: Virus > > Date: Sun, 19 May 2002 21:50:48 -0700 > > > > I'm not sure if I passed this along, but just in > > case, please check your > > system. Sorry if I did and for the inconvenience. > > > > Elana > > > Subject: Fw: Undeliverable: Fwd: Virus > > > > > > > As most of you know my system was infected with a > > virus and it > > independently > > > sent itself to corrupt everyone else in my system. > > Please read the bottom > > > instructions on how to locate this "teddybear" > > icon in your system and > > > delete it before it continues. IT DELETED MY > > NORTON FIREWALL & VIRUS > > > DETECTION before sending itself on! I have since > > replaced that with > > another > > > (zonealarmpro). Again, my regrets. K > > > > > > __________________________________________ > > > My Norton Anti Virus always checks both incoming > > > and outgoing messages but this time when i > > checked, I found this virus > > > lurking in a corner waiting to pounce., So-you > > might want to check your > > > system urgently, just in case! > > > > > > My address Book has been infected with the cirus > > > call(jdbgmgr.exe) and it is not currently detected > > by Norton or McAfee > > > anti0-irus systems. > > > The virus sits quietly for 14 days before > > damaging > > > the system. It' s sent automatically by the > > messenger and by the address > > > Book whether or not you sent emails to your > > contacts. > > > > > > Here's how to check for the virus and how to get > > > rid of it: > > > 1. go to Start, then Find or Search option. > > > 2. In the Files/folder option,write the name > > > jdbgmgr.exe > > > 3.Be sure you search your C:drive > > > 4. Click "find now" > > > 5. The virus has a teddy bear icon with the > > > namejdbgmgr.exe > > > 6. DO NOT OPEN IT> Right click and delete it. It > > > will then go to the Recycle Bin. > > > 7. Go to the Recycle Bin and delete it there as > > > well. > > > > > > If you find the virus, you must contact all the > > > people in your address book so they can eradicate > > it in their own address > > > books. As you all appear in my address book it is > > quite likely that > > several > > > recipeients of > > > at his message will have been sent the virus > > > automatically in the last 24 hors - so please > > check and eradicate and no > > > harm will be done. I am sending this just to be > > sure since their are so > > > many viruses at the moment. > > > Beryl > LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience > http://launch.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 17:57:00 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: And now for A Case of You . . . > kate wrote: > ... more than just her love for him pouring out...it could be his > musical/lyrical influence on her that comes pouring out of her... > > add to that the oh canada reference & i think it could be about l cohen...> > > This is what I always thought. > peace, david > I never thought this line was specifically about love or musical influence. She sings: I remember the time you told me You said 'love is touching souls' Surely you touched mine Cause part of you pours out of me In these lines from time to time To me this is more about how two people who share intense feelings for one another and spend a lot of time together tend to rub off on one another. Travis & I will sometimes say the exact same thing at the same time. This also happens with family members. Sometimes I will say something and I seem hear my mother or my father or my brother or sister's words & inflections coming out of my mouth. So yes, she is referring specifically to the lyrics of the song when she says 'part of you pours out of me' but I think she means much more than that. The people we love deeply in our lives always leave a part of their essence with us. Souls touch and intertwine and we change one another. Even after the relationship is over that piece of the other person's soul remains and sometimes we recognize how much a part of that person is now a part of us when we say something in a certain way or have certain thoughts & feelings - and sometimes I imagine it comes out in song lyrics, too. And going back to the 'constant as a northern star' line I would just like to point out that Joni is quoting the man in that line: Just before our love got lost *you* said, 'I am as constant as a northern star' and then she replies: And *I* said, 'Constantly in the darkness Where's that at? Things have gotten bad in this relationship and she is unimpressed with his declaration of constancy. Her answer is kind of flip, imo. Kinda like, 'So? You don't have a clue about this relationship so what does that mean?' But in spite of this, she's hooked on the guy. He's under her skin in a big way and she can't give him up just yet. Part of him will stay with her forever. Mark E in Seattle who loves ACOY - up there in my top 10 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 22:41:12 EDT From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: 100% Joni MDL Digest V2002 #221 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 20:07:52 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: cavolina Jerry asked: > Does anyone know if Joni's art director Robbie Cavolina is related to > the Fez booker Ellen Cavolina? She was a friend and big supporter of > Jeff Buckley. Yes, Ellen is Robbie's sister. Robbie was there the night of the Carly-Chrissie incident, too ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 May 2002 00:09:23 EDT From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: 100% joni Content now - and Electricity Just got back from 10 days in Paris - 1st time, very interesting city ;-). Sure enough, I was sitting in a park, reading the news, and it still sure looks bad, 30 years later. Now, if I ever get caught up, perhaps I will write about the good stuff...... OK - back to business. Topic 1 - Joni's charms - per Bob Mueller, we get started with: Composer (let's count melody, chord structure, rhythm) Lyricist (let's let poet fit in this category ?) Vocalist Instrumentalist (really, her contributions to the guitar - tunings, et al - -are considerable) To this I would add Arranger Producer (she has made a list of noteworthy producers, if I am not mistaken) So, if you are comparing, it is more like a "sextuple" threat. [Speaking of which, if only she weren't so darned homely ;-) ] Oh, right, and as the others said, Painter Raconteur Won't somebody please, please Help Me ? (Isn't that a Beatles song ?) Topic 2 - (Psycho) Analysis Or, why I think I like a song ( "I liked the words, and it's easy to dance to", extended): I sometimes find myself analyzing songs (I am a little strange, but aren't we all ?) breaking them down - for evaluation purposes - into 1. Melody 2. Chord structure 3. Rhythm 4. Lyrics 5. Harmony and counterpoint 6. Arrangement 7. Vocal performance 8. Instrumental performance 9. Production/engineering 10. Magic (the connection among the pieces - especially the Lyrics with the Music) The first 9 items go right back to Topic 1. They also reinforce for me why, on a gut level, I liked the Beatles and Joni the most. Of course, there were '5' Beatles, but there is only one Joni. Topic 3 - Item 10 above I had noted the connection between the music and the lyrics a couple of weeks ago in a post, in which I named a few 'later' Joni songs that I thought "had it" (that magical connection between words and music), and others that were good in the other 9 ways, but did not (IMO). I also quoted a couple of lines from "Lesson in Survival" that I thought captured the essence of this point. FTR (the album) is very strong in this regard, throughout. Electricity is a classic example, and has always been a personal favorite of mine. But Cold Blue Steel is perhaps even more exquisite in this regard. Also outstandingly well connected are LIS, LTWCM, FTR (you can sort of hear the arbutus rustling in that song), WOHAM, YTMOIAR, JOTMAS. Even the Banquet, with its demanding tone (correct for a protest song) and the seagulls squawking and the water skiers gliding. This is very artistic, to me. I do not feel that that the 'connection' is as strong in Barangrill, See You Sometime and Blonde in the Bleachers, but you could do worse that fill out your album with those 3 songs. And 9 out of 12 special connections - when it is rare if even 3 or 4 cuts on an album "have it". Bob S. (had 8 hours on the plane today to list her albums in order of personal preference - only took me 2 hours to do it ;~) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 20:33:37 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: FTR live and Covers Volume 29 Janine wrote: > I, too, have always felt Electricity was about my beloved JT who had to have > torn her heart out, of course, I have to blame it on that darn Cold Blue Steel > and Sweet Fire. I have also wondered if this song was not in response to > Carly's frustrations with JT? She obviously still wants a connection to him > despite the Minus's current lovelessness. My next door neighbor in the college dorm was as much into Carly as I was into Joni and would talk to me about the JT connection. She's the one that alerted me to Carly's song "No Secrets" and said it there was a put down to Joni in it. I've posted the lyrics below. If true, I thought maybe Joni would see the song as sort of a gloat and thought Electricity was her rejoinder. Both albums were released in November 1972. Speaking of Robbie Cavolina, he once told me that Carly and Joni have long been very good friends, so bygones are bygones. ;-) Kakki (We Have) NO SECRETS (Carly Simon) We have no secrets We tell each other everything About the lovers in the past And why they didn't last We share a cast of characters from A to Z We know each others fantasies And though we know each other better when we explore Sometimes I wish Often I wish That I never knew some of those secrets of yours The water was cold The beach was empty but for one Now you were lying in the sun Wanting and needing no-one Then some child came, you never asked for her to come She drank a pint of your Rum And later when you told me You aid she was a bore Sometimes I wish Often I wish That I never knew some of those secrets of yours In the name of honesty, in the name of what is fair You always answer my questions But they don't always answer my prayers And though I know you say that it's me that you adore Sometimes I wish Often I wish That I never, never, never knew Some of those secrets of yours Some of those secrets of yours Some of those secrets of yours We have no secrets Telling each other most everything now ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #147 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?