From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #63 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Monday, March 4 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 063 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Today in History: March 3 [les@jmdl.com] Today's Articles: March 3 [les@jmdl.com] Re: hello [colin ] Re: hello ["Sharon L. Buffington" ] "About a boy" - the movie [Gertus@aol.com] Judy Collins & Dylan vljc ["Mark or Travis" ] Re:dreamland.../ grammy grumblings ! [WARREN901@aol.com] Re: "About a boy" - the movie [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Judy Collins & Dylan vljc [Jerry Notaro ] Re: dreamland.../ grammy grumblings ! [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: dreamland.../ grammy grumblings ! [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] chuck mitchell, anyone? [Yael Harlap ] Re: chuck mitchell, anyone? [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Keys/Norah sjc, long ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] Joni,Joan & Judy ["brian symes" ] Re: March Madness!! Covers #27 - Davey Graham/Joni (long) ["Kakki" Subject: Re: hello Welcome, Nathan. You do what you like now. Just read. Read and and reply. Write whatever you choose. It's your choice. There are ,oads of Joni fans here! bw colin Nathan La Freneer wrote: > Hello, I'm in on this discussion cafe thing but not sure what it's about. I > love Joni Mitchell's music. Ok what happens next? > Plainly written nlafreneer > > _________________________________________________________________ > Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. > http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 07:45:53 -0600 From: "Sharon L. Buffington" Subject: Re: hello Welcome Nathan: This is a wonderful list, full of knowledgeable people concerning the history of Joni's music, discussions of the meaning of her lyrics, the name of her dawg, and much, much more. (hoping I put in enough commas and in the right places). Enjoy. I have learned so much from people here...and made some wonderful, lifelong friendships. And we do have a Jonifest too! Peace....Sharon colin wrote: > > Welcome, Nathan. You do what you like now. Just read. Read and and reply. > Write whatever you choose. It's your choice. > There are ,oads of Joni fans here! > bw > colin > > Nathan La Freneer wrote: > > > Hello, I'm in on this discussion cafe thing but not sure what it's about. I > > love Joni Mitchell's music. Ok what happens next? > > Plainly written nlafreneer > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. > > http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:07:46 EST From: Gertus@aol.com Subject: "About a boy" - the movie The film of Nick Hornby's book "About a Boy" is being released on April 26 in the UK with Hugh Grant playing Will. I'm slightly worried about the way Joni's image and music will be portrayed in the movie - sensitively, I hope, as I'm sure Hornby is a fan. I watched "High Fidelity" again the other night and the Joni content was minimal - just the one line, I think, but it has to be much greater in this one as the whole story could be said to hinge upon the affect Joni's music has on Marcus and his mother. With Hugh Grant in the lead, a big audience should get to see it, so let's hope it sends a positive Joni message. Jacky ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:25:37 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Judy Collins & Dylan vljc Recently I've been listening to 'Colors of the Day' and 'Forever' by Judy Collins. Before I bought these cds the only Judy Collins I had was a vinyl copy of 'So Early in the Spring', another retrospective, and, buried away somewhere, the single of 'Both Sides Now' (which was my first exposure to Joni's writing.) But I have been enjoying these two compilations quite a lot. I don't think her voice is quite what it used to be but in her heyday it was gorgeous. Very clear and expressive. From what I get from her liner notes on 'Forever', she has tried to use her music as a way to send out healing to people during some of the turbulent times she has lived through. A lot of it is very soothing and beautiful. So I'd like some suggestions as to which of her albums that are not 'greatest hits' or retrospectives I should get next. I put a bunch of them on my wish list at CDNow (although I'm a little miffed at them at the moment) and any suggestions from the group would be welcome. As to Dylan, I've listened to the three cds I bought a couple of times (well two of them anyway) and I have to say I am really liking 'Blonde on Blonde' and 'Blood on the Tracks'. The song 'If You See Her, Say Hello' really gets to me. But I'm wondering if part of the key to appreciating Dylan is getting the humor in a lot of his songs. Do people maybe tend to take him too seriously? A lot of his music seems to be on the playful side to me. Usually it has a bite to it but there's a lot of humor there. At least that's my overall impression. That may change as I become more familiar with these cds. Happy Sunday! Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 14:47:13 EST From: WARREN901@aol.com Subject: Re:dreamland.../ grammy grumblings ! hello all...i think i might be able to clear up the " dreamland " confussion. the roger mcguinn album in question, which included joni's song " dreamland , " was released before DJRD. i had a friend who i turned on to joni back in the early 80's . when i played DJRD for him his first remark on hearing " dreamland " was that he'd always really like that mcguinn song. ( of course i set him straight as to who the real writer of the song was, he didn't realize she had written " woodstock " either !!! ) needless to say he is a big joni fan now. about the grammys... veiwing the show for the first time in god only knows when i was reminded of why i had stopped watching them in the first place. ( i missed joni winning for TI because i just wasn't keeping track of the awards since sometime in the 80's ! ) anyway i must say what a waste of time. not only did i not know most of the people there, i was left not wanting to after the show was over. i can't beleive the minuscule amount of time spent on our joan !!! ( how dare they...) the show seems to have been boiled down to the industry's least attractive elements...banality and capitalism ! i guess you know what i won't be watching again. i could go on but enough of that... lots of joni, warren keith p.s. JONI RULES ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 14:50:09 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: "About a boy" - the movie << With Hugh Grant in the lead, a big audience should get to see it, so let's hope it sends a positive Joni message. >> Hugh Grant is a perfect match for that role as well. When I read the book, he was the actor I mentally cast in the part. As for the JC in the movie, it probably won't change people's minds one way or the other, and who knows, it may enlighten some folks who've never heard of her. Bob NP: Joni, "Trouble Man" (Day In The Garden) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 15:39:38 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Judy Collins & Dylan vljc Some suggestions: Living In My Life Wildflowers Judy Sings Dylan Live at Newport The Fifth Album Whales and Nightingales Classic Broadway ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 15:01:19 -0600 From: "Dolphie Bush" Subject: Re: Judy Collins & Dylan vljc Mark. I am a big fan of Judy Collins but no expert. Have four of her albums. Always lament the fact that I don't have more but something else always seems to be that of which I would rather have, at the moment. "True Stories" is superb, especially Secret Gardens which will melt your heart. It also has the priceless Cook With Honey on it and Song for Martin, which could be my favorite Judy tune, of those I have heard. "Recollections" is good. It may be some kind of compilation but I don't believe it is a greatest hits since I had never heard most of the selections on it. She does Dylan tunes on this one, plus others, including Mr. Tambourine Man, Farewell, Tomorrow is a Long Time, and Daddy, You've Been on My Mind. I found it a little too folksy for my taste but it is still excellent. "The Fifth Album", I notice, has some of those same tunes on it. Again, too folksy for me. My favorite is "Hard Times for Lovers" which someone here has mentioned previously was a bomb, according to the critics. It is marvelous and I long ago wore it out but continue to turn it around the player. Very romantic. You cannot lose with that one and Scavullo's pic of Judy on the cover is very nice. Not so much of a homosexual that I don't know beauty when I see it and Judy's backside definitely is something I don't mind looking at. Course the expert on this list to tell you about Judy is Tim Spong. Hope that helped somewhat and hope you are well. Mack - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark or Travis" To: "JMDL" Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 12:25 PM Subject: Judy Collins & Dylan vljc > Recently I've been listening to 'Colors of the Day' and 'Forever' by Judy > Collins. Before I bought these cds the only Judy Collins I had was a vinyl > copy of 'So Early in the Spring', another retrospective, and, buried away > somewhere, the single of 'Both Sides Now' (which was my first exposure to > Joni's writing.) But I have been enjoying these two compilations quite a > lot. I don't think her voice is quite what it used to be but in her heyday > it was gorgeous. Very clear and expressive. From what I get from her liner > notes on 'Forever', she has tried to use her music as a way to send out > healing to people during some of the turbulent times she has lived through. > A lot of it is very soothing and beautiful. > > So I'd like some suggestions as to which of her albums that are not > 'greatest hits' or retrospectives I should get next. I put a bunch of them > on my wish list at CDNow (although I'm a little miffed at them at the > moment) and any suggestions from the group would be welcome. > > As to Dylan, I've listened to the three cds I bought a couple of times (well > two of them anyway) and I have to say I am really liking 'Blonde on Blonde' > and 'Blood on the Tracks'. The song 'If You See Her, Say Hello' really gets > to me. But I'm wondering if part of the key to appreciating Dylan is > getting the humor in a lot of his songs. Do people maybe tend to take him > too seriously? A lot of his music seems to be on the playful side to me. > Usually it has a bite to it but there's a lot of humor there. At least > that's my overall impression. That may change as I become more familiar > with these cds. > > Happy Sunday! > > Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 21:43:24 From: "Timothy Spong" Subject: Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #62: Years -- CD reissues? On Sat, 02 Mar 2002, "William Waddell" willytheshake100@hotmail.com> wrote, on Subject: Media Spin: > >I was using my Windows Media Player and happened to go into the Media Guide >section. I looked up our Joan and was astonished to see how wrong the dates >of some of her albums were. Hejira for example was attributed to 1991; >Blue, >LOTC, STAS and Clouds all 1987. Can't believe anything in the media these >days. Osama being DNA-ed, yeh right! Spin spin spin. >WtS ... and I ask: Could these be the (correct) years that these "albums," meaning the content, were first reissued on CD, having been originally issued on vinyl LP and various tape formats? Inquiring minds want to know! Tim Spong Dover, Del., U.S.A. _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 16:20:21 -0600 From: "kerry" Subject: Ani Difranco discusses Bob vs. Joni I just came across a recording of a concert that Ani Difranco did in Australia at the Port Fairy Folk Festival in 1998. She said some interesting things about Joni between songs: Ani was having trouble re-tuning her guitar and said, "These alternative tunings always seem like a real good idea when I'm at home and they're written out in front of me. I once saw Joni Mitchell play a show and she was just standing there for like ten minutes going, 'ah..., ah...' trying to re-tune her guitar to some ridiculous tuning. I felt that it affirmed my whole life..... You know it's funny, I spent last August with Mr. Bob Dylan. I was touring/opening shows for him and ever since then...all the interviewers keep asking me..'What was it like touring with God?' and 'What words of wisdom did he bestow upon you?'...There's this kind of religion of hyperbole that surrounds Bob and 'long live the church of Bob.' You know, I would never attempt heresy in that area, especially not in my line of work, but it's funny because Bob was never really a deity for me, not anywhere near the scope of which Joni Mitchell was and I think that respecting his work...is a good idea...he's done quite a few cool things...but it seems that in the states, the canon of Bob seems to become deeper and richer and more ingrained in my culture every day and Joni seems to be systematically forgotten and periodically condescended to by the media....It's really strange to me, not as strange as I wish it was to me. It's actually quite familiar. I think there's something very elusive about, the sort of liberal, open, inclusive, revolutionary, folk singing, change the world 60's scene that wasn't quite ready for a babe. To listen to people talk these days, it seems like all those voices have come down to one, in our collective memory. Anyway, I'd just like to put my vote in for Joni....as I'm struggling with this tuning..." Any thoughts on this? Kerry NP - Ani - "Sorry I Am" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 17:51:39 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: dreamland.../ grammy grumblings ! In a message dated 3/3/02 2:47:55 PM Eastern Standard Time, WARREN901@aol.com writes: > hello all...i think i might be able to clear up the " dreamland " > confussion. the roger mcguinn album in question, which included joni's > song > " dreamland , " was released before DJRD. The last time I saw Richard X Heyman, he played this song for me just as we were trying to leave his apt. in NYC. I would have stayed all night, but his wife Nancy was so tired. We were talking Joni, so he seemed to know it was her song. Do you know happen to know what McGuinn album this is on Warren? rose in NJ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 22:50:14 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: dreamland.../ grammy grumblings ! << Do you know happen to know what McGuinn album this is on Warren? >> It's on his LP "Cardiff Rose". I like McGuinn on a song like "Chestnut Mare", but he can't get the rhythm or the melodic line of Dreamland and it's pretty horrible. Bob NP: Mingus Dynasty, "Dry Cleaner From Des Moines" (they seem to have the tempo down pretty good! ;~D) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 23:07:48 -0500 From: Yael Harlap Subject: chuck mitchell, anyone? hey all- dipping back in to say i just noticed that chuck mitchell is going to be playing in ann arbor in may. here's the scoop: Sunday, May 12, 2002 CHUCK MITCHELL Integrates his love of acting with his music creating a delightful, loveable performance. Combining his talents as a balladeer, actor, singer, and old-time folk guitarist, CHUCK MITCHELL'S one-man shows are delightful tapestries of poetry, cabaret songs, and lively banter. Coming out of the coffeehouse circuit of the late '60's when he performed with his former wife Joni Mitchell, his intimate presentation style reflects his love of the theatrical. TICKETS: $15 Show begins at 7:30 pm, doors open at 7:00 pm. i don't know how much he's been touring around, so i have no idea how noteworthy this is, but i thought someone might like to know. :) - -yael ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 23:11:06 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: chuck mitchell, anyone? << dipping back in to say i just noticed that chuck mitchell is going to be playing in ann arbor in may. here's the scoop: >> Very cool info, Yael...I was just this week dubbing the track from his "Combinations" LP onto CD, and saw that he shows the writer of "The Circle Game" as "R.J. Mitchell". I found that a bit odd-sounding. I had thought that this was a studio recording but it turns out that it was recorded in July 1977 at The Raven Gallery in Southfield, MI in front of a small audience. He has a fairly warm-sounding folkish voice, but it sounds to my ear that he takes a few shortcuts as a guitarist. Night all... Bob NP: Mingus Dynasty, "A Chair In The Sky" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2002 00:08:06 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: Re: Keys/Norah sjc, long Fred, I'm away for the weekend so I won't be able to post this till Sunday night. Great post. I love the way you wrote this. The word choice. The phrasing. I had no idea that there was a word for the vocal gymnastics made popular of late. "melisma" I looked it up at www.webster.com and found: > 1 : a group of notes or tones sung on one syllable in plainsong 2 : melodic embellishment > Thanks for teaching me a new word about music. I read this paragraph several times, then read it aloud for my friend. This post made my day and made me glad to still have a toe in this community. "faux soul caricature": wonderful phrase, Fred. All the best, Lama p.s. Obligitory Joni content: Example of "melisma" by a master [I took my share down by the sea Paper plates and Javex bottles on the tide Seagulls come down and they squawk at me Down where the water skiers gli-i-i-i-i-i-de] "Banquet" by Joni Mitchell Fred Simon said, >>I may be in the minority, but I don't really think Keys is all that, plus she's got melisma flatulence like crazy, just like almost every other latter-day nu-soul/R&B singer. Enough already. Listen to Mahalia Jackson, or Stevie Wonder, or Aretha, if you wanna hear some tasteful, proportioned melisma. I mean, it was bad enough when Mariah Carey came on the scene, but now every little Britney and Christina is obliged to stretch every syllable into a hundred notes of faux soul caricature.> ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Mar 2002 00:39:29 -0500 From: "brian symes" Subject: Joni,Joan & Judy Back when TTT was released I also bought Gone from danger by Joan Baez and Shameless by Judy Joan collection of songs by others except one, have excellent musicians and backup vocals by Dar Williams and Alison Moorer. Joan's voice is in excellent shape and expresses itself with soulful variations. Judy wrote all the songs as a companion to a book she wrote about the music biz. The melody's and arrangements are simple and the only irration might be the echo reverb that comes with her vocals on all the cut's. Last but best is TTT sure grannie Joni has smoked to many cigs but the poetry of "Stay in Touch" with Waynes Sax minimal notes simple as a falling tear on an old lovers wrinkled cheek. I only wished i could have watched Femi,Dan and Tony, Engineer this CD. Good Night Gracey NP Tiger Bones - -- _______________________________________________ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 22:56:07 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: March Madness!! Covers #27 - Davey Graham/Joni (long) Bob, first thank you for sending me the latest Covers installment! I was very surprised about the Davey Graham - you wrote: >16. Davy Graham - Both Sides Now: Here's the medallion-piece of this CD to me...mostly because this one is hard to find, >and well worth the hunt! Anything BUT ho hum. About 7 minutes long, with a "Cotton Ave" like guitar intro, in a raga mode, >then Davy breaks into a guitar lick EXACTLY like what Joni did in "In France They Kiss On Main Street" (this song was >recorded in 1968) then the tempo picks up and it's an acoustic roller-coaster ride. Boy is it great!! A few years back I recommended to the list a quite incredible book that might interest a number of people here, "Unknown Legends of Rock and Roll - Psychedelic Unknowns, Mad Geniuses, Punk Pioneers, Lo-Fi Mavericks and More" by Richie Unterberger which includes a sample compilation CD in the pocket and some Joni content. It covers tons of the very greatest (mostly well-known and not "unknown") and the Davey Graham chapter always stood out in my mind. Here are a few excerpts (including the Joni content): "You could not, by most stretches of the imagination, call Davey Graham a rock guitarist. But the fact is, you couldn't really call him a blues, folk or jazz guitarist, either. He's all of those things and none of those things. What Graham did in the 60s was bring an unsurpassed eclecticism to the craft of guitar virtuosity. He both anticipated and influenced the British psychedelic rock, blues-rock, and folk-rock scenes to an extent that is woefully underappreciated to this day.... Like [John] Fahey and [Sandy] Bull, Graham was one of the first Western guitarists of any sort to incorporate middle eastern modes and Indian ragas into his music. Unlike Fahey and Bull, however, Graham is mostly unknown in the U.S., even on a cult level, as most of his records were never released stateside....Paul Simon, who met Graham in the mid-60s during a residency in England,even asked Davey to join him as an accompanist at one point. When you hear Jimmy Page play intricate acoustic guitar leads in Led Zeppelin's quieter moments, or Richard Thompson genre-hopping between folk, blues and more, you're also hearing Graham's legacy, British songwriter Pete Brown, who co-wrote several Cream classics with Jack Bruce, calls Graham 'one of the first world musicians.' and sees him in the start of 'a whole kind of genre of people,' extending through Renbourn, Jansch, and Thompson in particular.....Graham's particular genius was his ability to rearrange blues and jazz standards in a way that made them sounds exotic and fresh. An especially striking example is his 1968 overhaul of Joni Mitchell's 'Both Sides Now,' which moves from amore or less straight Indian raga into explosive folk-jazz verses." Notes from his album "Large as Life and Twice as Natural" (1968 Decca, UK) which features members of Pentangle..."several sparkling raga-folk fusions, particularly "Blue Raga," and the daring cover of Joni Mitchell's "Both Sides Now." ...only available as a rare, out of print UK import, and crying for CD reissue." Kakki NP: Steely Dan - King of the World - The Record Plant, 3/20/74 (thanks to Bob for this one, too. Ahhh, incredible!) ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #63 ******************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?