From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #44 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, February 12 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 044 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Today's Articles: February 11 [les@jmdl.com] Joni in fiction [Tara Lindsay ] Re: Nash's party (why pink, Ms. M, press) ["hell" ] Dave Van Ronk has died (SJC) [Deb Messling ] Re: Joni in fiction [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: New articles... [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Back to Joni ["Laurent Olszer" ] Joni on ESPN ["Sybil Skelton" ] men killing women ["Mike Pritchard" ] RE: Boston are JMDLers...........(GCC) (Gregg Cagno Content) ["Donna J. B] Re: men killing women ["Bree Mcdonough" ] Re: Joni in fiction ["Rob Ettridge" ] Re: Shake that fist, Ludwig! [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: Joni in fiction [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: Shake that fist, Ludwig! [Nuriel Tobias ] Re: Shake that fist, Ludwig! [Murphycopy@aol.com] Joni's piano - cover art ["michael o'malley" ] Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #70 [PPeterson4@aol.com] Re: Joni in fiction [jan ] Re: Joni's piano - cover art [RobSher50@aol.com] Joni References in Books, etc. [Lindsay Moon ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 03:23:47 -0500 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Articles: February 11 On February 11 the following articles were published: 1991: "Night Ride Home" - People (Review - Album) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/910211p.cfm 2000: "Both Sides Now" - Entertainment Weekly (Review - Album) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/000211ew.cfm - ------------------------ http://www.jmdl.com/articles ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Jan 1980 10:12:36 -0800 From: Tara Lindsay Subject: Joni in fiction Hi, This is my first post on this list. I've been a fan of Joni Mitchell since when I was about ten and shared a room with my big sister who listened to Hejira constantly. Two books I read recently had Joni references - The Hissing Of The Silent Room by Paul Charles Who Will Run the Frog Hospital by Lorrie Moore Hope this is what you were looking for. bye for now, Tara (in Dublin,Ireland) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 00:15:49 +1300 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Nash's party (why pink, Ms. M, press) Phyllis wrote: > Damn! It looked like Bette to me but I thought "Naw, probably not" She > HAS gotten quite thin though so it makes sense. I managed to zoom in on the singers photo, and I think it looks a lot like her. The hand action is very "Bette" too! I couldn't see anyone that looks like Joni. > Oh no, not neccesarily. And anyhoo, she WAS there as confirmed by > Rick's snooping at the Madonna Inn a few days later. I'm put money on > it that she it the one in the pink vinyl/leather outfit. I think that this could be Joni too - the profile is right, and it's the sort of thing she'd wear. I did notice that the woman in this one is wearing large, pink hoop earrings, which aren't present in the singers photo, where the woman at the end (who others have suggested might be Joni) seems to have curly hair, and is wearing a feather boa (and no cap). Is there anyone on the CSN list (maybe even Croz?) who can confirm or deny? Enquiring minds wanna know! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 07:05:26 -0500 From: Deb Messling Subject: Dave Van Ronk has died (SJC) Dave Van Ronk, the legendary folk musician, has died of colon cancer. He was a friend of Joni's in the early days and can be heard on the Second Fret set. He wrote an odd little "Song for Joni" and he recorded Both Sides Now, Chelsea Morning, River, Song To A Seagull , That Song About The Midway, and Urge For Going . http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20020210/en/people-vanronk_2.html - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Deb Messling -^..^- messling@enter.net - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 08:30:44 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni in fiction <> Hi Tara, and welcome! What are the Joni references in these books? Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 08:29:05 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: New articles... Les posted this link: Read the full article here: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/981024ocx.cfm Great article. Of course, this passage leapt out at me: "Hendrix took his own portable reel-to-reel recording equipment wherever he went. The Experience Music Project has more than 200 hours of tape he recorded on his travels. Somewhere among them is a recording of Joni Mitchell performing at L'Hibou. " OK, so who's been to this museum? How good is security? ;~) Bob, ready to don black clothing and form a JMDL "Mission Impossible" stealth team...:~) NP: Peter Gabriel, "Fourteen Black Paintings" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 14:03:33 -0000 From: "Laurent Olszer" Subject: Back to Joni It's saturday night, I'm waiting for Pete Townshend on VH1 to start the VCR. In the meantime I'm zapping stations and there's this 1956 movie Rock, Rock, Rock with Alan Freed. So I figure I may catch some early Chuck Berry or Buddy Holly. But no, it's still 1-2 years too early and the music is really pathetic. Then comes the hightlight of the show: it's Frankie Lymon and the Teenagers. Pretty good. What do you know, they perform "(I'm not a) Juvenile Delinquant" and it's the actual sequence used in the Shadows & Light video. Back to Joni..... Laurent ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 08:45:09 -0600 From: "Sybil Skelton" Subject: Joni on ESPN Yesterday morning I was watching "Outside the Lines" on ESPN - part of my weekend sports junkie fix. It had just started and I was only half listening while getting some coffee, when I heard the host Bob Ley say the words "star maker machinery" in reference to some Olympic speed skater. My respect for ESPN skyrocketed. A Joni Mitchell reference on ESPN, a Led Zeppelin song in a Cadillac commercial. Can the Apocalypse be far behind? Sybil _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:29:30 From: "Mike Pritchard" Subject: men killing women Im writing an academic paper for a conference in October on the theme of domestic violence and murder of women by their husbands/lovers. I know there is probably some stuff about the Jackson Browne / Not to Blame controversy in the archives (and Ill look there) but Id appreciate any other type of help on this theme. The Jackson Browne thing is a very small part of the paper but Id like to get it right. Im particularly interested in the male closing of ranks against women (as in the above song) and also in the difference between crimes of passion committed in the heat of the moment and the premeditated murder, both with and without previous threats of violence. I will be looking at the lyrics of some popular songs which seem, to me, to attempt to justify male violence against women. More general comments would be appreciated too. Can you good people think of any songs in which the lyrics seem to underplay the seriousness of male violence and / or attempt to blame the victim? All help appreciated, off-list if you prefer. Thanks a lot. mike in bcn. NP This Flight Tonight by Nazareth (unplugged version) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 10:00:38 -0600 From: "Donna J. Binkley" Subject: RE: Boston are JMDLers...........(GCC) (Gregg Cagno Content) Thanks Nawlins! Tell us about Mardi Gras! I was wondering if you went this weekend. db - -----Original Message----- From: les@jmdl.com [mailto:les@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of Michael Paz Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2002 2:17 AM To: Donna J. Binkley; AsharaJM@aol.com; joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: Boston are JMDLers...........(GCC) (Gregg Cagno Content) Texas- U know you can always count on us music sluts. Houston ain't that far off for me. Paz NP-Woodstock-Pine Knob83 on 2/7/02 8:52 AM, Donna J. Binkley at djb@binkleybarfield.com wrote: > What enquiring minds want to know, is when is Gregg Cagno going to play in > Texas? > > Also, i would like to have a mini Jonifest at some point. If i did, would > anyone come this far? > > db ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 09:56:42 -0800 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Re: men killing women >I will be looking at the lyrics of some popular songs which seem, to me, to >attempt to justify male violence >against women. More general comments would be appreciated too. Can you >good people think of any songs in which the lyrics seem to underplay the >seriousness of male violence and / or attempt to blame the victim? "You know the night you left you put me in my place I got you in a stranglehold baby then I crush your face" Stranglehold by Ted Nugent. In fairness to Mr..Nugent, I don't know the story behind this song. You know it could be something out of the headlines he is retelling in this song and the thoughts are not from him? But I think the place for your research would be rap music......this would be the place to look. IMO,there is a lot of misogyny going on there. I'm sure abuse of this kind has affected most every family. I use to get aggravated at my sister for putting up with spousal abuse for so long. (I would become more p.o. at her for staying then her blank of a husband) I realize now I didn't understand all the underlining reasons she stayed. I have a friend that works in ER and she sees the results of this epidemic first-hand. She has told me about the bruises,broken noses, cracked tailbones.....THE DENIAL. Good researching to you Mike! Bree >NP This Flight Tonight by Nazareth (unplugged version) > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:32:59 -0000 From: "Rob Ettridge" Subject: Re: Joni in fiction I read 'Who Will Run the Frog Hospital?' about the same time as I first heard Blue, and I've been meaning to search for the quote for ages and share it with the list, but never got round to it. I just had a quick flick through hoping the relevant page would reveal itself, but alas it didn't work this time. I just did a quick search on Google which has come up with pretty much what I remember of the quote. It's taken from a site (http://www.jenniferdavidson.com/bookreviews.htm) which gives a nice nod to jm.com: There is a passage in this book that I find particularly haunting. Berie, speaking of the Joni Mitchell song "Little Green" (be a gypsy dancer...) says: "Twenty years later at a cocktail party, I would watch an entire roomful of women, one by one and in bunches, begin to sing this song when it came on over the sound system. They quit conversations, touched people's arms, turned toward the corner stereo speakers and sang in a show of memory and surprise. All the women knew the words, every last one of them, and it shocked the men."* faber and faber, 1995 *(I tested myself, and I can sing along to every word too. You can find the full lyrics by going to http://www.jonimitchell.com/, a marvelous website created by Wally Breese.) Tara, welcome! Is there any more reference to Joni in 'Frog Hospital'? It's been a while since I read it. By the way, on the site, the review directly below is of a very good book - Morvern Callar by Alan Warner. At times I thought I wasn't going to enjoy this book, but in the end I thought it was one of the most original pieces of fiction I'd read in a long time. Camus with a modern British slant, maybe? Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com To: walkinggreen@eircom.net Cc: joni@smoe.org Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 1:30 PM Subject: Re: Joni in fiction <> Hi Tara, and welcome! What are the Joni references in these books? Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 13:50:05 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Shake that fist, Ludwig! In a message dated 2/11/02 2:24:01 AM, nuriel@wowmail.com writes: << when Beethoven died his last defiant act was to shake his fist at a raging thunderstorm outside >> Thanks, Nuriel, for adding another layer to my ever-expanding understanding and appreciation of Joni's lyrics. Although I have to wonder . . . how disturbing would thunder be to a deaf man! --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 14:00:01 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni in fiction In a message dated 2/11/02 5:26:55 AM, walkinggreen@eircom.net writes: << Two books I read recently had Joni references - The Hissing Of The Silent Room by Paul Charles Who Will Run the Frog Hospital by Lorrie Moore >> Welcome, Tara! How nice of you to make your first post to the list such a helpful one. I am looking forward to hearing more from you. I have put a hold on "Who Will Run the Frog Hospital" at my local library through their Web site. They don't have "The Hissing Of The Silent Room" anywhere in their shared network of about 100 libraries, though, so I'll check the bookstores. Thanks for your help. --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:21:51 -0800 (PST) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: Re: Shake that fist, Ludwig! The song has a lot to do with being deaf, sounds that "might as well be mute", to see but hear nothing so you can only "keep the pictures", the fact you play an instrument, feel it's touch, but you can't hear it because a piano is not like a "long body" that you touch and 'hear it's song' even if you're deaf. No tongue in the bell And the fishwives yell But they might as well be mute So you get to keep the pictures That don't seem like much Cold white keys under your fingers Now you're thinking "That's no substitute It just don't do it Like the song of a warm warm body And like Ludwing, even in silence, "the gift goes on". And if you're sick of being deaf and tired of "the silent night" - Yell it. "Strike every chord that you feel" because you're deaf, and to deaf ears there's no wrong chord. btw, i always thought that "In the court they carve your legend" is Ludwig's piano and the "apple in its jaw" being the artwork, the ilustation on the wood (as pianofortes were always covered with decoration and images back then) I find it very interesting that Joni sings "a song to a deaf person" if you understand what i'm talking about. Thanks, Bob, for making me spend some time with this song again. Nuri - --- Murphycopy@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 2/11/02 2:24:01 AM, nuriel@wowmail.com writes: > ><< when Beethoven died his last defiant act was to shake his fist at a raging >thunderstorm outside >> > >Thanks, Nuriel, for adding another layer to my ever-expanding understanding >and appreciation of Joni's lyrics. Although I have to wonder . . . how >disturbing would thunder be to a deaf man! > > --Bob _____________________________________________________________ Free email, web pages, news, entertainment, weather and MORE! Check out -------------------------------> http://wowmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:01:33 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Shake that fist, Ludwig! Nuriel writes: << i always thought that "In the court they carve your legend" is Ludwig's piano and the "apple in its jaw" being the artwork, the ilustation on the wood (as pianofortes were always covered with decoration and images back then) >> I always thought she was saying that because of his insatiable carnal appetite, the court considered him a pig, (as in the image of a roast pig with an apple in its jaw which one might see at a lavish banquet of that era). --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 20:21:04 -0500 From: "michael o'malley" Subject: Joni's piano - cover art Hi there, My compilation CD of Joni piano tunes is nearing completion. I'm now looking for a photo of Joni at the paino for cover art. I have one B&W profile shot from Anaheim (that doesn't really show her face), and I've also seen Pearl's Toronto profile shot. Although both of these images are copyrighted, is there a problem using one of them for this non-commercial project ? Also, I'd like to know if there are any other Joni-piano images out there? I've scoured the Net and believe me, photos of Joni at the piano are rare indeed. My fantasy is to find a shot taken across the strings through the open piano top, showing Joni singing. Does such a thing exist? All contributions gratefully received! Michaelo NP: Virginia Rodriguez, NOS ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 01:07:11 EST From: PPeterson4@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #70 In a message dated 2/11/02 11:05:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, les@jmdl.com writes: > << Can you good people think of any songs in which the lyrics seem to > underplay the > seriousness of male violence what about Joni's own most troubling lyric: "You're a mean old Daddy, but I like you". ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 21:49:36 -0800 From: jan Subject: Re: Joni in fiction At 10:12 AM 1/4/80 -0800, Tara Lindsay wrote: (snip) >Who Will Run the Frog Hospital by Lorrie Moore (snip) Great book. So far I've read everything by Lorrie Moore, and it's all been great. - -jan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 01:21:16 EST From: RobSher50@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's piano - cover art Dear Michael, I am very excited about your compilation CD of Joni piano tunes. Could you tell me a little more about it. I wasn't aware you had a CD project going on. Sounds great! Sherelle In a message dated 02/11/2002 8:05:58 PM Pacific Standard Time, les@jmdl.com writes: > Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 20:21:04 -0500 > From: "michael o'malley" > Subject: Joni's piano - cover art > > Hi there, > > My compilation CD of Joni piano tunes is nearing completion. I'm now > looking > for a photo of Joni at the paino for cover art. I have one B&W profile shot > from Anaheim (that doesn't really show her face), and I've also seen > Pearl's > Toronto profile shot. Although both of these images are copyrighted, is > there > a problem using one of them for this non-commercial project ? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 22:56:05 -0800 From: Lindsay Moon Subject: Joni References in Books, etc. I found a Joni reference recently while reading Stephen King's "Hearts in Atlantis": (On page 524 of the paperback edition) "So, what's the answer? Why did we laugh?" "Because we're human. For a while, I think it was between Woodstock and Kent State, we thought we were something else, but we weren't." "We thought we were stardust," Skip said. Almost with a straight face. "We thought we were golden," I agreed, laughing. "And we've got to get ourselves back to the garden." Lindsay P.S. Heard "Cold Blue Steel & Sweet Fire" in Starbucks today. One of my all-time faves. : ) P.P.S. Also saw "Rock Star" recently, with Jennifer Aniston and Mark Wahlberg about a wanna-be rock star who idolizes a heavy-metal band and mimicks their every nuance in his "tribute" band. He argues with another similar type in a rival tribute band about the color of embroidery thread on a jacket worn by one of the metal band's members on an album ... I kept saying to my husband, "Hey, I was never *that* intense about Joni. Was I?" ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #44 ******************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?