From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #6 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Sunday, January 6 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 006 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Today in Joni History: January 5 [les@jmdl.com] RE: Woody + Soon Yi ["owen.duff" ] Re: Girls in the Valley? [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: That's an interesting position there, Bobster. [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Joni on Religion [Abbymusique@aol.com] Re: Girls in the Valley? [Kammass@aol.com] Re: Your first 2002 Joni ["mike pritchard" ] Joni and religion ["mike pritchard" ] Re: rickie & joni ["Mark or Travis" ] Joni 's Piano ["michael o'malley" ] Re: Joni's Piano [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: Girls in the Valley? [Randy Remote ] Re: Girls in the Valley? [Catherine McKay ] Re: That's an interesting position there, Bobster. [Catherine McKay ] Re: Girls in the Valley? ["Brenda" ] Re: Joni's Piano [Mags N Brei ] Re: Joni and religion ["Jamie Zubairi" ] RE: rickie & joni ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Joni's Piano [Abbymusique@aol.com] Re: Joni in fiction again & a suggestion for a new section on the JMDL site ["Bree Mcdonough" Subject: RE: Woody + Soon Yi I read a biography of Woody Allen about a year ago and Soon Yi came across as a bizarre, calculating character who seemed to disregard the feelings of her foster mother completely - probably something to do with her abusive upbringing (she wasn't adopted until she was 5 or 6). Woody would have seen her grow up from being a small child - he and Mia were together from the beginning of the 80s - but he never behaved as a father to any of the children, with the exception of Dylan Farrow, whom he was later accused of molesting. The whole thing is very strange, but from what I can make out, while Woody didn't actually abuse anyone as such (Soon-Yi seems to have had the whole thing planned out to further her career), he behaved absolutely immorally - in Manhattan and other films he mourned decaying values, so he's a hypocrite too. Also, he seemed to have little interest in the raising of the son he had with Mia Farrow, instead lavishing his affection on his son's adopted sister, Dylan. His behaviour is indefensible, but his films are great. Owen ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 08:17:55 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Girls in the Valley? << CD Now lists `Girls in the Valley` as a 2001 Joni import CD. Does anyone have any idea of what this is? >> It's just a re-arranging of the songs on LOTC. Check out the tracklist. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 08:39:38 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: That's an interesting position there, Bobster. << Not often I don't agree with your position because, >> Well, like I said, I was just speculating. I appreciate your points taken from the bio. I've not read it yet. I still contend that Joni made some musical compromises (intentionally or subliminally) with these records due to her romantic and professional relationship with Larry. I don't say that as a negative, the collaboration bore much fruit. But I think that believing that Klein (who's produced many discs before & since) didn't have some pretty heavy influence here is a bit naive. Again, I don't KNOW, but I do know what I hear. <> Oh great! At sixteen I was a tubbo and had a face with more divots than a par-5 tee box! Thanks for sending me back there! LOL! You're right, of course...I should lighten up on Dancin' Clown. Joni's allowed a fun throwaway or two. After all, if she has fun making records, she's gonna keep doing it, right? ;~) Thanks for the good jabber, John. Joni's use of background vocals is an interesting subject, and I think her multi-tracking of her own voice is one of those things that sets her apart from the rest. I'm thinking of all those great self-harmonies in Court & Spark. Think I'll go play it now! Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 08:53:11 EST From: Abbymusique@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni on Religion From what I've gathred over the years, I think Joni is a religious person to some degree, but probably keeps it private. First, I saw on a TV interview that she was healed of polio, and seemed to attribute it partly to when she sang Christmas carols while layed up in bed (My mother sings praise songs to God when she is ill and has been healed from all kinds of things without the help of medicine). I read that she had some kind of born-again experience in either the sixties or the seventies at some event. Then I saw on an interview where she prayed and asked God to send her a man who could play pinball, and soon after that she met Larry Klien, who played pinball with her. Also, some of her songs are very inspiring, like Passion Play (When all the slaves are free). In case there's anyone out there that doesn't know, there's a play held once every ten years in Ober-Ammergau, Germany where the death and resurrection of Christ is reinacted, because back in the middle ages everyone in that area was dying of the black plague, and they made a vow to God that if he would heal them, they would enact this play every year to remember what he did. Now it's every ten years in modern times. Anyway, knowing the background to that story, I've always seen this song as one of my favorites, because she almost narrates it like a play: "Enter the multitudes in Exon Blue, In Radiation Rose..." It's like directions you would read on a script for a play. Once I read an article this guy wrote in the paper criticizing this song and acting like it was all about the environment, but think about it. In plays, the characters usually where brighter colors than they would in ordinary life. Sure, there may be a hint in the choice of "exon" but to me the message of the song is clear, and I find it very inspirational. As for Job's Song of Sorrows, Job was very bitter for most of that story, so for Joni to write that song that way doesn't necessarily suggest that she is bitter at God, only that Job was. Another great by her is "Love" on WTRF. I definitely think she has some kind of spiritual life, but probably keeps the details of it to herself. Abby ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 09:00:56 EST From: Kammass@aol.com Subject: Re: Girls in the Valley? How much should one pay for arrangement cd's like this? kammy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 16:58:06 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re: Your first 2002 Joni >>in that tight little pink halter top and the fuckme pumps.<< First the muumuu and the green go aheads, and now the fuckme pumps. What do they look like? mike in bcn ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 16:59:59 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Joni and religion >>I hear songs like 'Job's sad song' and i'm confused. The one Joni is talking to in that song is God. He's the one her bitter confession is directed to. But how can you talk, blame and criticize something you don't even believe exists? "You make everything i dread and everything i fear come true" - how come? You think he's nothing, an invention - then why even bother? It's confusing.<< Nuri, You're not the only one who's confused. In Joseph Heller's 'Catch-22', Yossarian and Lieutenant Scheisskopf's wife (neither of whom believe in God) are arguing about Him, and Yossarian says some pretty nasty things about God, including a threat to 'grab that little yokel by His neck and.', and the following dialogue takes place: Lieutenant Scheisskopf's wife- "Stop it! Stop it! Stop it!" Yossarian - "What the hell are you getting so upset about? I thought you didn't believe in God." LSW- "I don't, but the God I don't believe in is a good God, a just God, a merciful God. He's not the mean and stupid God you make Him out to be." Y - "Let's have a little more religious freedom between us. You don't believe in the God you want to, and I won't believe in the God I want to. Is that a deal?" does this help? mike in barcelona np ali farke toure - heygana ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 09:04:46 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: rickie & joni > >>But I like RLj as much as Joni. blasphemy.<< > > not blasphemy, i think they both reflect different parts of our being...rlj > being more emotional/ethereal & jm more emotional/cerebral This is a great way of expressing it, Kate. I was trying to think of the right words. I wanted to say Rickie's lyrics were more pure emotion but that would seem to say that Joni's were less so. This says it very well, I think. Joni almost always writes a very straightforward lyric. Rickie's are often more abstract and impressionistic. This put me off at first. Like Joni with poetry, I thought I smelled a rat. Now I'm beginning to like Rickie's writing style more & more. Rickie communicates impressions & feelings that can take you to all kinds of places. To me, Joni is much more specific and to the point. Mark E. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 12:54:35 -0500 From: "michael o'malley" Subject: Joni 's Piano My latest project for the new year is to put together a kind of desert island disc of Joni's piano tunes on CD for myself and any other JM piano fans, *and I know you're out there ! *. Now before I go any further, I thought I'd ask list members if this has already been done. Has it? If so, I would love a copy. If not, then let's do it! Perhaps there are also some unusual piano gems out there in private collections. In the hope this concept wouldn't be *too* piano overdrive, my list of favourites would surely include : Rainy Night House The Arrangement For Free Blue My Old Man The Last Time I saw Richard River Judgement of the Moon and Stars Blonde in the Bleachers See You Sometime Banquet Let the Wind Carry Me Lesson in Survival Down to You Court & Spark The Same Situation Car on a Hill Shades of Scarlet Conquering Two Grey Rooms ( which, incidentally only ranks a paltry 73 in the JMDL song poll ! ) Whew! Now there's a marathon line-up of about 78 minutes! How much can we get onto one CD ? I'm sure you have noticed the recurring chords and rhythms in many of her piano pieces, as if she was searching for some kind of musical / emotional resolution in them. I wonder if she ever did? Or did she just get bored with piano? or reach a dead end? Whatever, I too, wish she would get back to her piano someday. Comments anyone? Michaelo ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 13:27:29 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's Piano In a message dated 1/5/02 1:06:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, michaelo@webnet.qc.ca writes: > Whatever, I too, wish she would get back to her > piano someday. Comments anyone? > > Michaelo > Michaelo, for those of us who were lucky enough to attend the Hommage to Joni in Toronto back in October, she sat at the piano and did a little improvisation. She said she had been working with some unusual chord structures similar to "Paprika Plains". She hasn't lost her touch on the piano, and hopefully we'll hear more on a recording in the near future. Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Jan 2002 12:13:53 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Girls in the Valley? This can't be a legitimate release, can it? With that title and all- Joni would never authorize it...but maybe it's from some country with a different licencing agreement with her. There was that repackage from New Zealand years ago...TheWorld of Joni Mitchell or something like that... RR SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > << CD Now lists `Girls in the Valley` as a 2001 Joni import CD. Does anyone > have > any idea of what this is? >> > > It's just a re-arranging of the songs on LOTC. Check out the tracklist. > > Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 15:34:13 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Girls in the Valley? - --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > << CD Now lists `Girls in the Valley` as a 2001 Joni > import CD. Does anyone > have > any idea of what this is? >> > > It's just a re-arranging of the songs on LOTC. Check > out the tracklist. > What would be the point of this? Is it considered a bootleg? Is it a way of avoiding copyright infringement (if so, I still don't get it.) ______________________________________________________ Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 15:42:27 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: That's an interesting position there, Bobster. - --- johnirving (or maybe it was John quoting Bob - I'm confused) wrote: > My hunches have always told me that behind the > scenes these pairings > were not Joni's idea. If it WAS a natural evolution, > like she says, why > does she basically abandon the approach on her > current records? > One of the things about evolution is that sometimes nature tries something, it doesn't work out, so it dies off. Maybe this is what happened here (the addition of the Klein gene to the Mitchell mix didn't produce a superior entity, and natural selection killed off the Klein influence! ;) Or, as Lisa Simpson once told Bart, "Look, Bart - it says in this magazine that in a few thousand years people are going to have five fingers - isn't that ridiculous!" ______________________________________________________ Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 15:48:26 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Your first 2002 Joni - --- mike pritchard wrote: > >>in that tight little pink halter top and the > fuckme pumps.<< > > First the muumuu and the green go aheads, and now > the fuckme pumps. What do > they look like? > mike in bcn Thank you, mike, for asking the question I wanted to ask but was somehow, uncharacteristically for me, afraid to ask! ______________________________________________________ Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 13:14:41 -0800 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: Girls in the Valley? On 5 Jan 2002, at 15:34, Catherine McKay wrote: > --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > > << CD Now lists `Girls in the Valley` as a 2001 Joni > > import CD. Does anyone > > have > > any idea of what this is? >> > > > > It's just a re-arranging of the songs on LOTC. Check > > out the tracklist. > > > What would be the point of this? Is it considered a > bootleg? Is it a way of avoiding copyright > infringement (if so, I still don't get it.) Originally I thought this was a bootleg, but I've since found out that the label it's released on, Poptones, is a Sony company in Japan. And since Sony administers Joni's publishing, maybe they were able to convince her and Warners to allow them to license the master recordings and package it differently for that market and for Europe. Anything is possible, but it's highly unlikely that a Sony associated company would pursue something like this without having rights. The cover is absolutely hideous. Brenda n.p.: Groove Armada - "Edge Hill" (One of the few albums lately to get my attention simply from the title, "Goodbye Country, Hello Nightclub.") ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 15:16:47 -0800 (PST) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Re: Joni's Piano Let me add to Jimmy's bit *hi Jimmy* about Joni at the piano in Toronto...we were so surprised! and hopeful...and I am sure it had everything to do with us all encouraging her to play ... she seemed almost shy or reluctant or something...said something about her piano chops being a bit rusty ... let me assure you...she is not rusty!!! Joni at the piano is something that Brei and I have longed for ... what an incredible moment...which did seem to go on for a very long time..she walked over with grace, sat down and just played...almost as if she was meditating over the keys..long lost friends perhaps. If you ask Ashara and everyone else sitting on that side of the stage, they can tell you about the look on her face..and I think Pearl has the photos on the site to demonstrate what I mean. And of course, at the end of the night, when it was all over..we looked at each other in disbelief that she even played at all. Anyone know how long it has been since Joni was at the piano in concert? Mags and Brei - --- FMYFL@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 1/5/02 1:06:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, > michaelo@webnet.qc.ca writes: > > > > Whatever, I too, wish she would get back to her > > piano someday. Comments anyone? > > > > Michaelo > > > > Michaelo, for those of us who were lucky enough to attend the Hommage > to Joni > in Toronto back in October, she sat at the piano and did a little > improvisation. She said she had been working with some unusual chord > > structures similar to "Paprika Plains". She hasn't lost her touch on > the > piano, and hopefully we'll hear more on a recording in the near > future. > > Jimmy ===== I've got you to see me through, looking out for what I do Spreading sunshine from the skies, placing rainbows in my eyes Got you watching out for me, making sense of what I see When my world is wearing blue, I've got you to see me through . - ---by Eleanor McEvoy on her album Yola (2001) . Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2002 00:41:42 -0000 From: "Jamie Zubairi" Subject: Re: Joni and religion Her last marriage to Larry was rather eclectic. In her words they had a 'Buddhist, Christian, Jewish wedding ceremony, with a little American Indian thrown in! (laughs). That was from a Channel 4 Interview in 1991 when she was exhibiting some paintings in London. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Nuriel Tobias To: Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2002 2:27 AM Subject: Re: Joni and religion > Kakki wrote: > "She certainly isn't some religious fundamentalist or particularly devout about religion but she does have beliefs. She has spoken of them a number of times in interviews. From what I can gather from listening to her she is a kind of Buddhistic Christian with a great appreciation for Native spirituality. ;-)" > > That's what i wanted to know, Kakki. You're so lucky. You can hear interviews with Joni sharing her point of views (Kakki, you even met her face to face for such an amazing conversation) - but me, i never heard anything here in Israel from Joni (not about Joni) in the media other than what i could learn from her lyrics. That was untill i joined the list and even now, as i learn something new about Joni everyday, there are so many things i still realy want to know, and this was one of them. I thought that Joni was a non-religious person only from what seemed to be a non-religious feeling in her lyrics, but that was just my eyes/mind trying to work out the meaning of things, and like i said, i was confused and i knew you guys would tell me what you know. And that was all just an introduction to - Thank you, Kakki:)! > > You and Colin spoke of some ways of belief and of whom one believes in. > (I used the word God in general just to make it easier to understand and for us to talk about) - it was good to read your thoughts and opinions. > > Love, > > Nuri > > p.s. Just to help you understand how sometimes here in Israel (and i'm sure it happenes everywhere) the media makes a mess of facts - > When Joni and her daughter found eachother, the most important news-paper here named 'Yediot Acharonot' (Up to date news in hebrew) wrote that the only thing Joni was sad about when she met Kilauren was that Kilauren didn't have the chance to meet her Grandmother because Myrtle was already dead. When i joined the list and found out that Myrtle was very much alive - i was realy happy. I'm a grannyboy, hehe:) > > That reminds me that i do believe that with that happy ending of the Mitchell women story - Joni should get the Granny award :) > > > > _____________________________________________________________ > Free email, web pages, news, entertainment, weather and MORE! > Check out -------------------------------> http://wowmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 18:18:08 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: rickie & joni impressionistic...that is another good word to describe her music...another songwriter once told me they felt many of her (probably earlier) song structures were a series of hooks put together.... mark wrote >>Rickie's are often more abstract and impressionistic<< ..******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 21:41:15 EST From: Abbymusique@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's Piano Michaelo, That sounds like a good idea. I play piano some myself, and enjoyed learning some of her songs like "He played real good for free" and "Willie". Go for it! I did want to remark on her piano playing and say that she often sounds like she's playing in a "mijor" key, which is neither major or minor, but something in between. One of my favorite piano moments from her is in "Blue" right after she sings, "Lots of laughs...lots of laughs..." Then she plays a few stray notes, and then there's that beautiful key change to get her back to "Everybody's saying that Hell's the hippest way to go out..." Definitely one of the best. I wish I had the music for it. My other fave piano tunes are "Court and Spark," "Down To You," and "Lesson In Survival." Did you think of including "Sweet Bird" or "Boho Dance" from HOSL in your anthology? They have some lovely piano chords, too. Abby ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Jan 2002 21:39:29 -0800 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Re: Joni in fiction again & a suggestion for a new section on the JMDL site I think this is a wonderful idea and great for you to volunteer your time. I mentioned several weeks ago of a Joni mention in Bentley Little's,The Association. p.66.... He sorted through his pile of vinyl and put on an old Joni Mitchell record,staring out at the view. There was something about those folkies of the late sixties/early seventies that complemented nature,that understood the rural lifestyle. There was a wistfulness in the music as well,a tinge of melancholy that somehow bridged the hopes of that era with the reality of today and subtly pointed the disparity. This was music that spoke to him. Of course,Joni Mitchell herself was no longer the Joni Mitchell of those early albums. The last time he'd seen her,on VH-1 at one of those charity concerts,she'd been droning on in a cigarette-ravaged voice,stopping in midsong to lecture the crowd for not paying close enough attention to her lyrics. She'd seemed angry and bitter,a far cry from the open,giggly young woman captured on the live MILES OF Aisles,and it had been depressing and dispiriting to realize how much time and people have changed. With the music on, his creative energy returned........... - ------------------------------------------------------------------ Bob and everyone,has this guy got his facts mixed up? I can't imagine Joni lecturing to her fans about paying closer attention to her lyrics. It doesn't ring true. I know this is a piece of fiction, but... get your facts straight. There is a joni mention in book I read about a year ago, as soon as I can come up with the title, I'll post it. Bree >From time to time on the list, people write about coming across references >to >Joni in modern works of fiction. I posted something about a year ago when I >stumbled upon a couple of Joni mentions in a book I would not recommend >called _Pool Boy_ by someone whose name I've forgotten. And a few weeks >ago, >I think MG and/or Bree mentioned something about Joni in a trashy novel. > >Take care, > > --Bob _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #6 ******************************* ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?