From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2001 #96 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Saturday, March 24 2001 Volume 2001 : Number 096 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. Information on the 4th "Annual" New England JoniFest: http://www.jmdl.com/jfne2001.cfm The Joni Chat Room: http://www.jmdl.com/chat.cfm ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Joni's Smoke Signals: Pow Wow, Now [Gordon Mackie ] Re: *Joni and smoking [christopher blake ] re: gallery update...sort of [christopher blake ] Joni BSN LA Smoking. [Jennymac48@aol.com] Making Money [Jennymac48@aol.com] chat room help [christopher blake ] Re: runaway from the record biz [SMEBD@aol.com] 2nd flik and arch. digest ["P. Henry Boland" ] smokin' [Anne Sandstrom ] whoa! ["P. Henry Boland" ] Re: 2nd flik and arch. digest [RoseMJoy@aol.com] RE: runaway from the record biz (minor JC) [BarBearUh ] Come to the Sunshine ["Craig" ] Hugs [AsharaJM@aol.com] Re: runaway from the record biz ["Kakki" ] Re: Ramona ["Garret" ] Re: Come to the Sunshine [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Paging Arthur Bostrom! (now a little Joni content) [Catherine McKay <] Subject: Re: runaway from the record biz ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Shadows and Light video [Mark Domyancich ] re:runaway from record biz - tiny JC [christopher blake ] Furry revelation ["Janine Sherman" ] Re: runaway from the record biz ["Kate Bennett" ] re:showbiz runaway [christopher blake ] Re: Subject: Re: runaway from the record biz [Alison E ] Confessions/Back to the garden ["BRIAN SYMES" ] RE: *Joni and smoking ["patrick leader" ] Joni books ["kerry" ] Got Till It's Gone ["Louis Lynch" ] Re: Joni books [Mark Domyancich ] Covers #15 Lotto [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] RE: Hugs ["Brett Code" ] Re: Hugs ["hell" ] RE: Amelia - futility? you can't be serious ["Brett Code" Subject: Joni's Smoke Signals: Pow Wow, Now Sorry about this one.... but I am reminded of the old joke about not minding if someone smokes....as long as they don't burst into flames. Anyhoo, I was recently reading the lyric parodies and laughing to myself and thought....maybe I should have a go. er...so here is my feeble attempt. I was thinking about it in the car on the way to work yesterday and finished it off making spaghetti bolgnese last night with a glass of red wine in hand. I don't think it's as good as 'Moo' but I think it will do as an alternative 'Blue' (or 'alternate' as Americans say). If people want to add/amend/change bits it would be good to see how a collaborative effort would look. Ta ta ....( ta -fa -ti- fi- ta....oh the trials of Scottish school music education in the '60's) Gordon [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type application/msword which had a name of Shoes.doc" ; x-mac-type="5738424E" ; x-mac-creator="4D535744] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 05:25:14 -0800 (PST) From: christopher blake Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking - --- AsharaJM@aol.com wrote: > Christopher wrote: > > > my joni BSN show was the oakdale theater in > > wallingford, ct (anyone else?). no sight of joni > > smoking and i was close to her - so close... :) > > > > I was in the second row center in CT with many of my > JMDL buddies including > our dear Kenny, may he rest in peace, and I seem to > remember saying to > Patrick that it was amazing that she didn't smoke at > all through the whole > thing!! (Patrick, am I remembering that right, or is > old age quickly seeping > through?) Anyway, too bad we didn't know you then, > Christopher! You could > have joined us for a great evening of dinner and > show!! :-) > > Hugs, > Ashara once again ashara makes me :) i was three rows up to your left at that show. i went alone but caught up to some friends. i certainly would have enjoyed your company. perhaps i talked to you and your troupe without knowing you, i'm pretty gregarious when left to my own devices before an event. the rich and famous were behind you that evening by the way. Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 05:36:56 -0800 (PST) From: christopher blake Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking - --- "Lori R. Fye" wrote: > > This is interesting to me. Of all the tours during > which Joni might have > smoked on stage, I would think BSN would have been > the most appropriate, > at least as far as musical genre and glamour are > concerned. > > Lori, who was in only the 8th row, stage left, but > loved being there, > near DC > ~ > Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ i agree with you on the genre and glamour. with all the storytelling between songs, i'm suprised she didn't go for the stage ambience of the songs' era with cigarette, cigarette holder, blue spot... - - have an awesome day, christopher (nothing wrong with row 8) Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 05:52:41 -0800 (PST) From: christopher blake Subject: re: gallery update...sort of hi pat i just saw the shots and i must say, "wow!". excellent job, thank you. - - christopher. Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 08:51:49 EST From: Jennymac48@aol.com Subject: Joni BSN LA Smoking. Oyaaa, sure. She came out in opening (only) night of BSN at The Greek here in la la after Intermission with a new outfit (brown sweater, brown top and blue and brown Ganesh or Krishna printed long straight skirt) with ciggies one lit, and a glass of red wine, to sing the "extra" stuff. I loved it. I turned to the stranger woman next to me and she turned to me and at the same time she said "She doesn't need to smoke now" I said "Cool, Joni's smoking". So... I loved that she did. I'd watch Joni thumb through the yellow pages...and so would anyone else in this list. So let's quit all this smoking police crap right now. Love Jenny ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 08:58:05 EST From: Jennymac48@aol.com Subject: Making Money OK, does anyone else besides me think that the term "my records don't make any money" may be relative? Geez Love Jenny ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 06:09:05 -0800 (PST) From: christopher blake Subject: chat room help okalee-dokalee, so i'm at the main jmdl site, and i log in successfully, i click on'chat room' and now i am at a large grey screen with a list of helpful topics except how to begin chatting or viewing the chat. the 'joining the chat' is of no use to me because i see no 'connect' button or a place to enter my username. please help a friendly newbie :} meet others like yourselves. thank you have an awesome day - christopher Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:23:11 EST From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: Re: runaway from the record biz In a message dated 3/23/01 12:12:32 AM Eastern Standard Time, KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: > She and Geffen had a strange business trade-off, I think. > She made no money but keeps her name/art out there; he mades no real money > in the short term but gets to claim her as a prized trophy (class-added > Hi Kakki! Do you exactly what Joni's deal was with Geffen? I know they had a rather sour parting after many years of friendship--I'm pretty certain it had to do with her product not being pushed by the company. I seem to remember Joni talking about the fact that they courted her, only not to promote her. I think she made a comment about being the "status artist" in the stable. I'm very curious what the deal was and why she signed with him if not for money. All the best, Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 02:00:15 +1000 From: "P. Henry Boland" Subject: 2nd flik and arch. digest another slideshow flik: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/SmashCast?u=1502641&mode=view&smashID=100064070&smashTitle=Joni+Show+2 ...and I think I recall someone looking for this a while back... http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1418610419 cheers, pat - --- "A liar never believes anyone and a thief always locks his doors." Who needs Cupid? Matchmaker.com is the place to meet somebody. FREE Two-week Trial Membership at http://www.matchmaker.com/home?rs=200015 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 11:04:48 -0500 From: Anne Sandstrom Subject: smokin' Quote: "Any coward can quit smoking. It takes a real man to face cancer." - - -marcel OK, I had to laugh at this one. (I'm going through recent digests in reverse order.) Lest you think I'm all doom and gloom, I wore a t-shirt to all my chemos that said "Anything worth taking seriously is worth making fun of." lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 02:05:29 +1000 From: "P. Henry Boland" Subject: whoa! whoa! and here's for that person who was looking for the S&L video disk... looks like a bargain to me! I thought this thing was $60.00! pat - --- "A liar never believes anyone and a thief always locks his doors." Who needs Cupid? Matchmaker.com is the place to meet somebody. FREE Two-week Trial Membership at http://www.matchmaker.com/home?rs=200015 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 11:38:46 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: 2nd flik and arch. digest Wow, Joni Rocks!!! LOL Excellent Pat :~) Thank You Rose in NJ rosemjoy@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 11:54:26 -0500 From: BarBearUh Subject: RE: runaway from the record biz (minor JC) Jim wrote: > RE: runaway from the record biz > > I know that's what she says. I just think it's uh.... incorrect. Let's > break it down. If she wasn't making money, she'd find a way out of her > contract. She's not a victim; she's a survivor. she probably doesn't make any money on her albums. because she works with quality musicians & studio talent and always has rather complex packaging,, it's tough to pay the record company back before sales of about 400,000 (my understanding). now, that's not to say that the record companies don't practice some pretty nasty creative bookkeeping, but the advertising for film & music usually costs more than the production of it. [she still gets those pennies everyday for radio play of records going back 30 years, and she made good choices with early money, which put her in the position of being rich]. > Where I work, we recently contracted a promo CD for a radio station. > The > person in charge of production told me that the printing, cutting, > folding, > and stuffing of the cover cost _more_ than the CD pressing. > > I'm not believing it for a minute. No offense to those accountants and > bookkeepers in the record industry. this is actually true. i've been looking into making VHS dubs for distribution, and this might serve as a good example. the dub will cost approx. $2. 5 cents to put a label on each tape. 5 cents to put each tape in a box or sleeve. i haven't gotten a printing estimate yet, but when we did 4-color small postcards, they cost us 50 cents each - getting both sleeves and labels will be at least 4x as much, plus there's the cost of folding and getting the artwork done. these costs decrease with volume, but they're still relevant to each other. we expect it will cost $4.50-5.50 for each tape all said & done, $2 of which will be the tape itself. and we can make about 80 tapes for the cost of running one 1/4 page b&w ad in a college newspaper. i make mixes as gifts every year, and i've been making double CDs. i made about 60 this year (120 discs in 60 boxes). these are my approximate costs (and i just hand labeled the CDs with markers - didn't print on discs or make disc labels)... $95 - raw CDs $110 - ink $60 - paper $75 - jewel boxes.........ie, just about $5.65 each for materials, 1.60 of which is the CDs themselves. and labor-wise, it takes 25 minutes to burn each CD set, but only 1 minute of that is active labor; while it takes at least 8 minutes of active labor to cut & fold the jacket & insert, label the CDs, and put everything in the case. in a major label situation you'd have these costs be significantly smaller because of volume. if you add the production costs to both of these things, chances are that the studio production, mixing & mastering cost a lot more than the design of the artwork. i would imagine that joni's production costs are in the $200-300,000 range, and design around $40-50,000. but even so, when you distribute those costs per unit, you still end up with packaging higher when you're doing volume. the killer is advertising & publicity - warner's got to have spent at least $1M each on the last few albums. BTW, the way timmins can buy a farm - record label advances (which rarely get made back enough to get any money after the first payment), and royalties for airplay, licensing & covers. licensing is a great way for musicians to make money. ani difranco can get paid $60,000 for the use of a song in a movie. i think that's what's kept jane siberry alive. i think it costs something like $300,000 to use a clip from a beatles song. for TV ads, those licensing fees go up exponentially. i'd also like to add that this is by no means giving record companies an excuse for their outrageous behavoir. they've set it up so they make big profits, not the artists, and far too many artists have been ripped off by the system. barbara np: joy askew, the same desperado PS. about to undergo an address change, replying to me may not work. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 09:10:54 -0800 (PST) From: Alison E Subject: Re: 2nd flik and arch. digest - --- "P. Henry Boland" wrote: > another slideshow flik: > http://albums.photopoint.com/j/SmashCast?u=1502641&mode=view&smashID=100064070&smashTitle=Joni+Show+2 pics of joni, with music by kid rock! how innovative. and it kicked ass! i didn't even think i liked kid rock, but that song was not bad. keep up the good work, pat. both of these animated picture shows were very fun to watch. alison e. in nyc Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 09:31:59 -0800 From: "Craig" Subject: Come to the Sunshine Last night I was introduced to a few Joni songs I had never heard, Come to the Sunshine and Ballerina Valerie. I checked the Joni web site and found the lyrics. Just wondering if any of you all listers have heard these old songs. I think they're written around the same time as Song to a Seagull. Craig ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:20:19 EST From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Hugs I just finished reading over 150 backlogged posts, and I see the tensions are high lately. I can only imagine there is some astrological reason for this....Wally????? Anyway, I just can't help asking that *everyone* take a nice deep breath.....close your eyes....and remember the wonderful community we have formed here of newbies, oldies, and just plain old middle agers. We all have so much to offer this community in own own way. Now, does everyone feel just a little better, and perhaps a bit more generosity for each other? :-) Hugs, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 09:51:33 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: runaway from the record biz Hi Stephen, I don't know what her deal was with him. My comments are based on what she and Geffen have discussed in various interviews. Your recall below is pretty much the same as mine. Geffen was positioned as the cool, up-and-coming label in the early '80s - maybe Joni was initially drawn to that and maybe she thought she would make money with her old friend promoting her and being on a "hip" label. Just didn't quite turn out that way. Kakki > Do you exactly what Joni's deal was with Geffen? I know they had a rather > sour parting after many years of friendship--I'm pretty certain it had to do > with her product not being pushed by the company. I seem to remember Joni > talking about the fact that they courted her, only not to promote her. I > think she made a comment about being the "status artist" in the stable. I'm > very curious what the deal was and why she signed with him if not for money. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 18:50:01 -0000 From: "Garret" Subject: Re: Ramona I had thought this was the same artist i read about on the list a while back, but couldnt remember her name. and it is Marian, thanks!! from your comments she sounds like someone i'd like to hear!! you must keep us informed!! the pictures on your site are nice. she is indeed an attractive woman. and if shes half as talented as you've said, she must be great! i do look forward to eventually getting to hear her! GARRET Marian said of Ramona Kasheer > Ramona is a young Austrian woman who composes truly > beautiful/interesting/complicated original music and performs frequently in > Vienna with her band - drummer, bass player, soprano sax player - who are > also very talented to be able to learn Ramona's complex songs. I've been to > three of her concerts now and the overall flavor of the music strikes me as > kind of a mixture of Jonatha/jazz/flamenco/african/gypsy - sometimes all > within one song. She has had some training in Flamenco guitar, but mostly > she is self-taught. She uses a lot of open tunings. She has a very clear > beautiful singing voice. She also plays piano and accordion and is learning > to play the flute. She is a musician to the depths of her soul and is > probably the most creative musical/poetic person I have ever had the good > fortune to be able to talk to for longer than 5 minutes. She's also > beautiful to look at and you can see some pictures of her and her band at: > > http://www.jmdl.com/guitar/marian/ramona.htm > > She has enough original material for 3 CDs and will hopefully produce one > sometime within the next year. I will certainly let everyone know when this > happens. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:36:49 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Come to the Sunshine << Just wondering if any of you all listers have heard these old songs. I think they're written around the same time as Song to a Seagull. >> A lot of those songs are on the "Second Frets" collection, Craig...it's a 2-CD set featuring the following unrecorded Joni gems: Brandy Eyes Mr. Blue Eastern Rain Born To Take The Highway Carnival In Kenora Winter Lady Just Like Me Blue on Blue London Bridge Ballerina Valerie Go Tell the Drummer Man And of course a lot of other songs she would later record & release. Even as we speak I'm burning a set for Stephen P, and right after him a set for Brigitte, and then....you? ;~) I'm assuming you're somewhat of a "newbie", since this stuff gets discussed fairly often. So to you I offer a laurel & hardy handshake and a WELCOME! :~) Bob NP: Bill Soden, "Urge For Going" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:19:24 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Paging Arthur Bostrom! (now a little Joni content) - --- Paul Castle wrote: > Azeem AzeemAK@aol.com wrote: > > >Arthur, I have just seen your potted biog in the > JMDL gallery, and notice > >that you like Kiki Dee > > I'll second Azeem (Hi there!) on Kiki Dee - > particularly her recent > collaborations with superb acoustic guitarist, > Carmelo Luggeri. A > recent show at the Jazz Cafe was great. Apart from > her own stuff - > 'Amoureuse' is a classic - she has some great covers > in her live set - > and on her live album 'Almost Naked > http://www.tickety-boo.com/kiki/. Ahem. Amoureuse was not written by Ms Dee. It was written by Veronique Sanson - Kiki Dee did a cover of it in English. Signed, A fan of V. Sanson Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 11:12:35 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Subject: Re: runaway from the record biz Yes its true & oh so common to be a well known artist who sells lots of records & still be deeply in debt to a major label. It has very little with CD duplication & a lot to do with artist promotion costs. Believe what Joni says. Here are just a few other examples: Shawn Colvin: http://www.billboard.com/daily/feature/010320colvin.asp "Touring is is also Colvin's livelihood. After 12 years on Columbia, the artist says she has yet to make any money from her album sales. 'A Few Small Repairs,' Colvin's top-seller, has moved 872,000 units in the US, according to SoundScan. "'I still have a huge debt to the record company,' Colvin says. 'There are video costs, promotion costs. I have one record that went platinum, and the rest went nearly gold. I'm going to have to sell a whole lot of records to get into the black. Jonatha Brooke: now indie Was dropped by her label, then released Live, her first record on her own label & the most successful to date. Amiee Mann: now indie Aimee Mann still owes her LAST label, Geffen. Prince: Prince changed his name to an unpronouncable symbol (his contract was with Prince) and wrote "Slave" on his cheek. Courtney Love: http://www.latimes.com/business/updates/lat_love010228.htm where you can read about why she is suing her record company. Or this widely publicized rant on the music biz: http://www.hole.com/speech/ And finally, this info from a friend who used to work at a major label: I can't tell you how many deals I've watched ruin artists and bands in every way, shape and form. It's not about major label evils, it's about the artist and band being aware of what's to come so that you don't end up in recoupable hell (aka being in debt). The label doesn't tell you that each and every can of Pepsi you drink you WILL pay for... When an artist plays a gig at say, The Roxy, in celebration of their cd release and in an effort to win and woo commercial radio, that artist pays for each and every industry rep there, each drink and dinner bought that evening, the promo and label folks airfare, treats, magazines, gas, you name it. While a major label act is performing their first too-cool show in LA under their new major label contract, the label is spending thousands that night, most of which is friendly little versions of payola, little expenditures that the artist ends up owing for and they never even know. Contracts are not necessarily the problem, it's what a contract becomes and what an artist ends up paying for when signed that is the problem, that leaves the artist in debt. To simplify it into a funneled example, Boyz II Men not only paid my salary and the likes of a hundred other folks, they paid for my lunches, my dinners, my coffee, my cigarettes, my nights out on the town... How? Well, if a group of Motown employees goes to dinner, it get's written off on the artists recoupables, and each and every thing that possibly can, does. And of course, the label doesn't share that upon signing, or ever, even. You think an artist or band is allowed at Cost Marketing meetings come Friday morning at the record label? And wow, guess who pays for the donuts (no, scratch that) the continental breakfast and coffee provided at the Cost Marketing Meeting? Or Motown night at the race track? The VP's trip to Ikea for new shelves for his office? Who pays? The artist... Shawn Colvin is paying for each and every bit, bite and blunder from the bottom up and as long as she is in that contract, th label continues, without her knowledge, charging up each and every thing they can in her name. THAT is the problem, not the contract. ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics www.polysonics.com Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 11:40:39 -0800 (PST) From: christopher blake Subject: Re: Hugs - --- AsharaJM@aol.com wrote: > I just finished reading over 150 backlogged posts, > and I see the tensions are > high lately. I can only imagine there is some > astrological reason for > this....Wally????? > > Anyway, I just can't help asking that *everyone* > take a nice deep > breath.....close your eyes....and remember the > wonderful community we have > formed here of newbies, oldies, and just plain old > middle agers. We all have > so much to offer this community in own own way. > > Now, does everyone feel just a little better, and > perhaps a bit more > generosity for each other? :-) > > Hugs, > Ashara i do. you make-a me happy :) christopher. Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:48:22 -0600 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Re: Shadows and Light video Thanks to everyone who replied about the Shadows and Light video. Roberto in Canada is helping me out. Thanks Roberto! WOB tax: Joni @ New Orleans Jazz & Heritage Festival, 5/6/95, 1 80min disc, B&P to first US'er to reply privately ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 12:03:54 -0800 (PST) From: christopher blake Subject: re:runaway from record biz - tiny JC hi! wow - jane siberry. one of my favorite lines in song: "this stick was signed by jean beauliveau so don't f***in' tell where to f***in' go!" from the song "hockey". not for the f's but for being the first song i know of to mention jean and maurice richard. great melody. and as strong a statement about canada as joni's 'oh canada' in "a case of you". i thought the other informative bits were good too... - - christopher. Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:24:37 -0600 From: Nancy Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking I keep thinking that Joni made a comment, something like "Yes, I'm smoking!" when she came back outmaybe she caught someone's disapproving look? Does this seem familiar to anyone who was at the Chicago concert? I really don't think I'm dreaming! And yes, I *did* see Amy Grant there! :-) Nancy/IA >At the Chicago concert, where I could see her facial expressions much >better, I saw her grin knowingly, as if we all expected her to show up with >a fag in her hand. Like she was giving us what we expected. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 16:02:23 -0500 From: "Janine Sherman" Subject: Furry revelation Hi all, After a quarter of a century of listening to the album Hejira- vinyl and now CD, last night I had a major revelation. In the song, Furry Sings the Blues, have any of you heard Joni muttering or whispering two repeated lines???? I thought I was hearing things and I even brought it up to a list guru in the chat room last night. Please listen closely to this song and kindly post to tell me what you hear in between these lines: But there was one song I could really feel and There's a double bill murder at the......... Honest to goodness, I hear her saying a line, twice. I know what I think it is, I want to know what you think it is. How could I just hear this after twenty-five years???? If you don't hear anything, maybe I have a rare copy (NOT) I am not(like my husband teases) playing it backwards like it was rumored people did to the Beatles White album.......... Please help me confirm my sanity and auditory discrimination. Have a great weekend, XOXOXOXO Janine _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 12:48:09 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: runaway from the record biz >>I seem to remember Joni talking about the fact that they courted her, only not to promote her.<< A very common business practice. The company signs several artists & only promotes a few of them. The others are stuck with a contract that paralyzes their ability to record, play, etc. Sometimes it is a result of one artist showing the potential to sell, so the company puts their promo money into that artist & does nothing for the others (but they are still under contract). Sometimes it is more sinister in that the record company signs an artist just to keep them out of the competion. ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics www.polysonics.com Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:21:20 -0800 (PST) From: christopher blake Subject: re:showbiz runaway thinking 'bout all these broke recording artists... recorded music is a way to introduce the artist to the public so they may tour. touring is how most artists make their livelihood. now, if JONI would tour more often... have a great weekend all! - -christopher Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:33:01 -0800 (PST) From: Alison E Subject: Re: Subject: Re: runaway from the record biz very informative and interesting, kate. thanks for the insight. > Prince: > Prince changed his name to an unpronouncable symbol > (his contract was with > Prince) and wrote "Slave" on his cheek. it sucks for example that everyone thought prince was a nutball for changing his name to a symbol, when in fact it was brilliant strategy to escape the "shackles" so to speak, of the contract. it's all clear, now, since the contract expired. it was an inspired move. don't forget, too about ani difranco and her "righteous babe" records. she was motivated more by artistic freedom, i think, but the end result is the same. she owns the label, she pays herself and keeps the money her albums make. which is fairly substantial, i think. does anyone know if joni makes any "real" money off the sale of her paintings? i am thinking not, i dont' remember anyone mentioning it. i'm just curious. hasn't she done a couple of art shows in europe? alison e. in nyc Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 18:07:42 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Furry revelation << Please listen closely to this song and kindly post to tell me what you hear in between these lines: But there was one song I could really feel and There's a double bill murder at the......... >> Hey Janine, Sorry that you don't have a rare collectors' item worth a gazillion bucks! :~) I've always heard Joni singing (as Furry) "Ol' Furry's got nobody, ol' Furry's got no-o-o-o-o-body"... Of course, on the '79 tour, she sings (in that same space) "I got a woman on Monday, she shines up my shoes, Tuesday's woman brings me nothin' but the blues"...or something close to that. It's a masterpiece of a song, ain't it? The song is one good line after another, but this one: "he points a bony finger at you and says, 'I don't like you', and everybody laughs like it's Furry's standard joke, but it's true - we're only welcome for our drink & smoke" is incredibly chilling to me... Bob NP: Stevie Wonder, "Summer Soft" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 11:53:59 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: chat room help Christopher wrote: > okalee-dokalee, so i'm at the main jmdl site, and i > log in successfully, i click on'chat room' and now i > am at a large grey screen with a list of helpful > topics except how to begin chatting or viewing the > chat. the 'joining the chat' is of no use to me > because i see no 'connect' button or a place to enter > my username. please help a friendly newbie :} meet > others like yourselves. thank you Just be patient - sometimes it's take an AGE for that grey screen to go away, and for the logon on screen to finally appear in it's place. At times I've even gone away for 5-10 minutes before it finally shows itself. I guess it depends on the amount of traffic on the server, and the speed of your connection. But at least the grey screen means it's thinking about it! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 16:29:15 -0800 From: "BRIAN SYMES" Subject: Confessions/Back to the garden So i escaped from work after lunch to get a Jonatha Brooke Ticket at the Aladdin Theatre its a pefect day in Portland finally 75 SUNNY the plums, pears camelias azealeas magnolias all bloming while im cruising back to work the long scenic way with Miles of Ailses on tape playing.I was driving slow on Fremont St when Woodstock came on so i had to turn it way up and sing along with Joni. Then I passed a lady trying to trim the suckers of a young Plum tree along the street I quickly pulled over a jumped off my white cloud and pulled out my very sharp "Felco Sectuers" and trimmed them off like they were warm butter. She asked me who i was and I replied "Archangelo" in my best Italian accent. The reason I drive down Fremont is that over the last Decade i have planted about Twenty Street Trees along this pleasant road,thru the Friends of Trees.please check them out on the web at www.friendsoftrees.org Love to All Brian Symes - ----------------------- Free Email Service provided to you by Office.com, a service from Winstar ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 20:33:46 -0500 From: "patrick leader" Subject: RE: *Joni and smoking ashara, i think you're right, joni didn't smoke at that show. i think she did at the msg theater show i saw a couple of days earlier. in the 98 fall tour, she always smoked during 'comes love'. made an event out of it. patrick, still remembering the joy of seeing joni from the second row. probably because i'm a dancer, i'm very twitchy and movey even while sitting listening to music. when joni looked down and saw me bopping in my seat to 'sometimes i'm happy', she gave me the biggest smile, and smiled my way a couple more times. i even think she forgave me for flirting with that cellist on the right... what a magnificent evening. np - handel - l'allegro, il penseroso ed il moderato. >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of >AsharaJM@aol.com >Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2001 9:34 PM >To: nymets69_2001@yahoo.com; joni@smoe.org >Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking > > >Christopher wrote: > >> my joni BSN show was the oakdale theater in >> wallingford, ct (anyone else?). no sight of joni >> smoking and i was close to her - so close... :) >> > >I was in the second row center in CT with many of my JMDL buddies >including >our dear Kenny, may he rest in peace, and I seem to remember saying to >Patrick that it was amazing that she didn't smoke at all through the whole >thing!! (Patrick, am I remembering that right, or is old age >quickly seeping >through?) Anyway, too bad we didn't know you then, Christopher! You could >have joined us for a great evening of dinner and show!! :-) > >Hugs, >Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 20:39:37 -0600 From: "kerry" Subject: Joni books This may have been discussed before, but I was checking out Amazon's Joni stuff and they listed 2 books: "Joni Mitchell Complete", vols. 1 & 2, due to be published this month. Is this just an updated version of "Complete Poems & Lyrics?" They also listed this book: "Rock Troubadours: Conversations on the Art and Craft of Songwriting with Jerry Garcia, Ani DiFranco, Dave Matthews, Joni Mitchell, Paul Simon, and More" by Jeffrey Pepper Rodgers (Editor). Has anyone read this? It sounds interesting... Kerry NP - Jonatha Brooke, Linger - Yes, I caved in to peer pressure again! First, Emmylou, then Patti Smith... I wish you people would recommend some GOOD music, for a change. (insert heavy sarcasm into last sentence) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 21:59:44 -0500 From: "Louis Lynch" Subject: Got Till It's Gone Hi all, I just had a Joni moment with MTV -- Janet Jackson's "Got Till It's Gone" video, where she samples Joni singing that line over and over. The one man raps "Joni Mitchell Never Lies" about three times. It was enthralling. The music was very sexy. But I don't understand what the hell the video was about! It was rather eerie visually, and I didn't understand the close-ups of the beaten man. I noticed that Joni had the distinctive honor of being the only Caucasian, via film clip, to enter on the video. Anyone know more about this? Is there a background that I am missing here? To Kate: Thanks for the insight into the record business. I'm glad I'm independent after reading how musicians end up buying everyone else's drinks - -- it SHOULD be the other way around of course. To Artheo, Catman, Jan and all: Having been the brunt of attacks because of certain unpopular views, and having been chastised for my big mouth and outspoken opinions, I have been watching these comments with interest. Honestly, I think that we should ALL BE FREE to say whatever we want any time we want. Generally, I've noticed that if someone crosses the line and becomes too offensive, too denigrating, or too nasty, the others on the list jump in and give the offender a "what-for." I personally love that dynamic about the list. I also love the fact that we're all pretty well educated people, with open minds. And even though opinions and tempers flare, we're all bound by the same muse -- so if we want to be vengeful little goddesses (or gods) sometimes, what the hell? Even with the occasional name calling and flare-ups, we are still more civilized than 99.99% of the general human population!!!!!! Oh, and I don't buy into Venus in retrograde causing all this bickering. It just doesn't work for me -- blaming things borne of human will on planetary spheres. I simply don't believe astrology is all that worthwhile. I guess that makes me a typical Libran, eh? Regards to the stars, the starry eyed, the supernova flare-ups of the list, Harper Lou ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 22:17:25 -0600 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Re: Joni books At 8:39 PM -0600 3/23/01, kerry wrote: >This may have been discussed before, but I was checking out Amazon's Joni >stuff and they listed 2 books: "Joni Mitchell Complete", vols. 1 & 2, due to >be published this month. Is this just an updated version of "Complete Poems >& Lyrics?" This is two book guitar anthology. More info can be found at: http://www.jmdl.com/guitar/songbooks.cfm Don't know about the other one though, sounds interesting! More than likely it's a collection of interviews that Jeffrey did with all of them for the Acoustic Guitar magazine. NP-New Bohemians, 2/24/91-Strange Thing ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:23:44 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Covers #15 Lotto Just a reminder, y'all... A lot of you have made a guess to win a FREE copy of the 2-CD Volume of Joni Covers #15. Alas, many have not. So just in case you missed my post of a couple days ago, shoot me a 3-digit number and maybe you'll win! After all, somebody has to, it might as well be you! I promise that Ed McMahon won't show up on your door. Vad, get with it man, the contest expires Monday night! ;~D Bob NP: Del Beazley, "Big Yellow Taxi" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:04:09 -0700 From: "Brett Code" Subject: RE: Hugs I have been totally afraid to turn up at a jonifest, 'cause I have little music al talent. It occurs to me on this discussion that I may be useful. By September, I'll have my full yoga teacher accreditation. Anyone think there'll be time for a little yoga out there? Brett ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:34:56 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Hugs Brett wrote: > I have been totally afraid to turn up at a jonifest, 'cause I have little > music al talent. It occurs to me on this discussion that I may be useful. > By September, I'll have my full yoga teacher accreditation. Anyone think > there'll be time for a little yoga out there? Oh no! If musical talent is a requirement for attendance, then I'm in big trouble! The only time I ever sing, is when I'm drunk enough to actually think I can, and that's usually when I'm at my worst! I'm coming for the conversation and the music, but only intend to actively participate in one of these! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:38:56 -0700 From: "Brett Code" Subject: RE: Amelia - futility? you can't be serious Sorry, this just is not possible. Futility. Remember the first Lilith Fair tour? At every show, those incredible artists and up and coming artists acknowledged the trail blazed by Joni every night by coming out on stage and singing Big Yellow Taxi as a tribute to Joni and the possibilities she had opened up for them. Amelia did the same - opened up possibilities. To me, the result is dramatic, and the world is a better place. Futility would have been if they all came out and sang 'Pretty Woman'. Virtually every female performer out there has a "Kiss my ass" debt to pay. For 3 years, during Lilith Fair, they gave something back. I understand the attraction of the maudlin poetic interpretation, but, in my humble opinion, it has nothing whatsoever to do with Joni or her career. Brett - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of Vince Lavieri Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 8:41 PM To: Yael Harlap Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: Amelia The lyrics end with Joni alone in a motel room - alone, in a place one goes to on a journey, alone in a place where one goes with a lover, she is alone. Dreams, dreams, and false alarms... whatever Joni had hoped for, whatever her dream was, it was crashed, it had crashed (see penultimate verse), just as Amelia Earhart had a dream, a journey she wished to make, she flew in the icy altitutdes, and her dream crashed and she was alone - and dead. Amelia was the pioneer woman who had a dream in man's world, Joni has her dreams in an induistry also male dominated and they both pushed the limits of doing it their war. I see the song "Amelia" as an elergy, as an evocation of a place that Joni is in, an emotional or psychological place, where seeing the ending of a dream. The dream may have been, for Joni, a happy relationship. Whatever it was, it had crashed and Joni's dream, like Amelia's, ended in futility. A related, somewhat opposite, image appears in the movie The Great Waldo Pepper, made about the same time, where in the end Waldo has accomplished his dream and flies off in his bi-plane into a cloud, alone, never to land; his bi-plane lost its landing gear, but the crash that is to come (and kill him) is meaningless as Waldo has accomplised his dreams and flies off, alone, in the cloud. The above: all IMHO. Greg Kot of the Chicago Tribune has written of that song as if it is the one that moves him the most. Even my very obtuse former partner, who said when we were halfway through the S&L video, "have we had enough Joni?," was caught by the poignancy of that song. Amelia, whether we understand the words, we all understand what she feels, what she is saying beyond the mere words with her music, with the entire sound. Like an opera, we don't need to understand the words to relate to the emotion. That is why IMHO "Amelia" is one of Joni's most moving songs. (the Rev) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 00:59:09 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Confessions/Back to the garden What a beautiful picture you painted! Have fun at the Jonatha concert and give her my love. Best, Paz NP-Noise starting to subside! I am giving them 30 more minutes then I am getting the stun gun out. on 3/23/01 4:29 PM, BRIAN SYMES at briansymes@office.com wrote: > So i escaped from work after lunch to get a Jonatha Brooke Ticket at > the Aladdin Theatre its a pefect day in Portland finally 75 SUNNY the > plums, pears camelias azealeas magnolias all bloming while im > cruising back to work the long scenic way with Miles of Ailses on > tape playing.I was driving slow on Fremont St when Woodstock came on > so i had to turn it way up and sing along with Joni. Then I passed a > lady trying to trim the suckers of a young Plum tree along the street > I quickly pulled over a jumped off my white cloud and pulled out my > very sharp "Felco Sectuers" and trimmed them off like they were warm > butter. She asked me who i was and I replied "Archangelo" in my best > Italian accent. The reason I drive down Fremont is that over the last > Decade i have planted about Twenty Street Trees along this pleasant > road,thru the Friends of Trees.please check them out on the web at > www.friendsoftrees.org > Love to All > Brian Symes > > > > > ----------------------- > Free Email Service provided to you by Office.com, a service from Winstar ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2001 #96 ******************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?