From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #405 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Friday, October 20 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 405 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- kenny [Robert Holliston ] Re: Songs I Wish Joni Would Cove [Jerry Notaro ] Fwd: Re: Kenny Grant (from Marian Russell) [Les Irvin ] Fwd: Fw: Kenny, fare thee well (from John Van Tiel) [Les Irvin ] RE: Memorial to Kenny [Catherine McKay ] RE: Joni's Soprano? [Catherine McKay ] Re: Joni's Soprano? [Jerry Notaro ] RE: Kenny Grant ["Susan" ] RE: Memorial to Kenny [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: Joni's Soprano? ["cassy" ] Re: Joni's Soprano? [Catherine McKay ] Re: Joni's Soprano? [Catherine McKay ] Re: Joni's Soprano? [Jerry Notaro ] Kenny ["Kate Bennett" ] fisher ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Kenny Grant ["Lori R. Fye" ] Re: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent [FredNow@aol.com] Sand and Water ["kerry" ] Re: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent ["Hell" ] Re: Joni Covers and Birthday ["Hell" ] RE: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Kenny [SAVtheWAVE@aol.com] Re: Songs I Wish Joni Would Cove [Dflahm@aol.com] Re: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent ["Diane Evans" ] Re: Joni's Soprano? ["Mark or Travis" ] Joni Interview [Michael Paz ] Re: kenny grant [Heather ] sopranos and coloratura sjc long and wallyesque ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: sopranos and coloratura sjc long and wallyesque ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 02:31:48 -0700 From: Robert Holliston Subject: kenny Like so many people on the list, I'm thinking of Kenny and remembering the times we spent together with great affection and, now, with a sadness that has been deepening all day. I first met Kenny and Steven a few hours before Joni's Vancouver show in May '98 - a bunch of us (including Ken Slarty, Cul Heath, and Brett Code) met for dinner and drinks and much lively talk; afterwards, we partied and talked and had a great time playing and singing Joni's songs - - Kenny's voice was so sweet and his memory for lyrics formidable. My first impression on meeting Kenny in person was - and remains - that he was a generous bestower of hugs. Within a couple of weeks, a tape of that concert arrived in my mailbox - I hadn't asked for it or even known it existed: Kenny just sent it as a gift, because he knew I'd appreciate it. Later that year, some of us met for dinner at Tanti Baci in NYC, so I got to see Kenny and Steven again. A wonderful night! When I last saw him at Ashara's in 1999, he was looking very fit. He'd had some discouraging times professionally, about which he talked with openness and salty humor, but not bitterness. It's unimaginable that Kenny won't be at Ashara's next year with his open arms, his big heart, and his uniquely Kenny Grant view of life. Kenny......I'm so sad that you're gone, way too early. It breaks my heart that your life was taken away from you just when you were hitting your prime. We will miss you very much, and love you always. Roberto ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 08:46:07 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Songs I Wish Joni Would Cove Eric Wilcox wrote: > If we're talking about her new jazz standard phase--- I'd love to hear Joni > sing "The Man that Got Away"-- made famous by Judy Garland. :) In the meantime, get Jeff Buckley singing it on Mystery White Boy. It is spectacular. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 09:44:07 EDT From: Seulbzzaj@aol.com Subject: RE: Songs I Wish Joni Would Cove I'd love to hear Joni sing The End Of A Love Affair, and There's A Lull In My Life. - Scott In a message dated Thu, 19 Oct 2000 10:30:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, "Eric Wilcox" writes: << If we're talking about her new jazz standard phase--- I'd love to hear Joni sing "The Man that Got Away"-- made famous by Judy Garland. :) eric - --- eric wilcox edwilcox@students.wisc.edu "It is absurd to divide people into good and bad. People are either charming or tedious." -Oscar Wilde - --- - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of Happy The Man Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2000 11:07 PM To: joni@smoe.org Subject: Songs I Wish Joni Would Cove Maybe it I just missed it somewhere but I heard Ella's version of "Someone To Watch Over Me". I would love to see her do it. Peace, Craig - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away. "He who was seated on the throne said, "I am making everything new!" Then he said, "Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true." He said to me: "It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To him who is thirsty I will give to drink without cost from the spring of the water of life. He who overcomes will inherit all this, and I will be his God and he will be my son. (Rev. 21:1-7) >> ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:44:32 EDT From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: Re: Songs I Wish Joni Would Cove My vote would be for Joni to sing another song very closely associated with Billie Holiday, "Strange Fruit." Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:46:52 EDT From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Kenny Hi friends, I just read about Kenny and am in total shock. So much so, that it brought me out of jmdl reclusion I've imposed upon myself this past year because of over-commitments. And it made me realize how much I miss my Joni friends here. Kenny and I shared a ride from the airport to Ashara's 1 1/2 years ago and he immediately set the tone for what was to come that weekend- he was funny, charming and warm. Though I had met him at Julie's fest in Pittsburgh, we hadn't had the chance to talk then. Kenny was one of the originals on this list and he will be sorely missed. Blessings to his loved ones. Terry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:13:47 EDT From: LasaterJ@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's Jazz, and upcoming tribute albums. 100% JC Wow, Jane Siberry singing "A Strange Boy," I would love to have a copy of this show... is there any chance anyone in the Tape Tree world would be willing to share these tracks on Napster or Scour? I've been off and on the list for the past 6 months or so, but I do remember at one point some JMDLers proposing the use of using Napster as a replacement or supplement for snail mail came up. Did anyone have an argument against this? I have a fast connection and I'd be happy to offer Tape Tree material from my PC. - -John in NC NP: Emmylou Harris, "Red Dirt Girl" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:35:43 -0500 From: "Eric Wilcox" Subject: A Strange Boy I remember someone mentioning that Joni has never performed "A Strange Boy" live. Is this true? And if so-- why? This gem of a song has always been my favorite. eric - --- eric wilcox edwilcox@students.wisc.edu "It is absurd to divide people into good and bad. People are either charming or tedious." -Oscar Wilde - --- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 09:37:13 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: Fwd: Re: Kenny Grant (from Marian Russell) >I feel so sad that Kenny has passed away. It's so hard to believe that he >is gone. He was such a kind person and he reached out to me on more than >one occasion. I remember him most intensely from Julie's Jonifest - how he >knew the words to all the songs and sang along with his whole heart. He was >a contributor to the JMDL Cookbook which we sent to Joni and I thought >others might like to read his email to me with his bio and three of his >favorite recipes. > >Rest in peace, Kenny. I will always remember you. > >Marian >Vienna > >+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > >Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 1998 9:16 AM > >Hey Marian, > >Here it is -- sorry for the dealy. > >Please delete my other email and go off this, as I changed the name of the >Garlic Bread and the amount of wine in the clam sauce!!! > >"You Know I've Been To Sea Before" Shrimp Al Vino Bianco > >2lbs. Jumbo Shrimp >(let fish store shell and devane) >1/2 lb. butter >6-10 cloves garlic, chopped fine >the juice of 1 lemon >1 cup white wine >fresh chopped parsely >salt >pepper >milk >flour > >Dip shrimp in milk, then flour. Heat large frying pan with butter. Fast >pan >fry shrimp. Remove shrimp. Add some more butter and fry garlic. Add all >other ingredients. Simmer. Replace shrimp to heat. > > *** Goes Great With *** > >Linguini With "Crown And Anchor Me" White Clam Sauce > >2 dozen fresh clams >(let the fish store shuck the clams for you, >and give you the juice on the side) >fresh garlic >olive oil >3/4 cup white wine >clam juice >fresh chopped parsely > > >Lightly brown garlic in olive oil. Add wine, clam juice, and a handfull >of chopped parsely. Bring to a boil. Put in clams, lower flame, cover pan, >and simmer 5 minutes. Cook and drain linguini. Cover with clam sauce. Add > >some more parsely. > >Serve with "Golden In Time" Garlic Bread > >loaf of Semolina bread >slice in half >butter well >sprinkle bottled garlic powder generously across bread >sprinkle a pinch of bottled minced garlic evenly across bread >toast until top is brown > >BIO > >Name/email address: Kenny Grant (kg@ibm.net) >Favorite book: The Firm >Favorite author: Tennessee Williams >Favorite albums/music: Turbulent Indigo, For The Roses, Hejira, Mingus; Pink > >Floyd, Yes, Getz/Gilberto, Sarah Vaughan, Neil Young, Rod Stewart, Stevie >Wonder, Rolling Stones >Favorite cuisine: Italian >Favorite color: blue >Favorite pets: Monique - a.k.a. Lauchita ("little mouse" in Argentine >Spanish) > (deceased 1993, age 20) >Favorite angels: the author of Tin Angel >Favorite quote: "live long enough and you'll see everything" >Favorite restaurant: Forest Court (Italian), London Lennies (seafood) - >both >here in Forest Hills, Queens >Favorite movies: Annie Hall, High Anxiety, The Bird Cage, Imitation Of Life, > >Fargo, A Place In The Sun >Favorite actors: Bette Davis, Olivia de Havilland, Shirley MacLaine, Jodie >Foster, Jack Lemmon, Michael Douglas, Jack Nicholson > (I know, none of them were in any of my "favorite movies") >Favorite director: Alfred Hitchcock >Favorite hobbies: watching movies, listening to music, internet >Occupation: Purchasing Agent ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 09:44:11 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: Fwd: Fw: Kenny, fare thee well (from John Van Tiel) >From: John van Tiel >Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2000 9:18 AM >Subject: Kenny, fare thee well > >A memory ... > >the day after Labor Day 1999 -- On our way to Atty Mays. Was it you, >Kakki, squeezed in the back between a slightly oversized Dutchman and a >slightly oversized New Yorker? Kenny, New Yorker XXL, talked but still >seemed relatively silent in the company of Paz, Kakki and me. He looked so >relieved when we stopped at a gas station and he managed to get three (3 >!) packets of cigarettes of his favourite brand. At Atty Mays, Kenny sat >at the bar ... slightly withdrawn ... but enjoying everything immensely. >Kenny seemed -- like so many JMDLers -- an observer. But Kenny's face >showed that he had found a home among friends. > >Another memory ... > >The day before Labor Day 2000 -- Claud and I sit outside Ashara's house, >in the garden, on the picknick table, practicing Joni songs for the Fest. >Like Kenny, we are among the early arrivals. Kenny joins us ("No smoking >inside the house." Has Kenny ever seen the inside of Ashara's house?). He >starts singing along with A Woman of Heart and Mind. It makes me smile. >Again, Kenny's face showed that he had found a home among friends. > >You were never a woman, Kenny. >Your heart gave in. >Your mind was silent on the outside only. > >Empty, never smoke another. > > From the coast of Holland, smoke is curling your way, Kenny. >Fare thee well > >John > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 08:53:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Songs I Wish Joni Would Cover Well fantasy sports games are all the rage, so why not a fantasy covers album game? Just so long as we all realize that's *exactly* what it is ... lest some who know who they are question the point. ;-) With that crucial caveat, here's my track list: "Tangled Up In Blue" -- Bob Dylan "Hope You Like The New Me" -- Richard Thompson "Cemetary Gates" -- The Smiths "Manhattan Skyline" -- Julia Fordham "Not Like This" -- Al Jarreau "The Dangling Conversation" -- Simon & Garfunkel "Superstition" -- Stevie Wonder "Still Dreaming of Paradise" -- Rogers & Hammerstein (might have the title wrong on this one ... not sure if it's "This Nearly Was Mine") "I Grow Weak" -- Alison Moyet "Secret Gardens" -- Judy Collins Yeah, that would be great! Don Rowe ===== My debut CD "Closer Now" is now available at http://www.mp3.com/donrowe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:12:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: RE: Memorial to Kenny - --- Wally Kairuz wrote: > > les, > how wonderfully thoughtful of you! thank you for > giving us this opportunity > to share all our fond memories of kenny. > kenny's page can found at > > http://www.jmdl.com/kennygrant.cfm > > thank you, dear les! > wallyK > Les, what a sweetheart you are! _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:23:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: RE: Joni's Soprano? - --- Wally Kairuz wrote: > joni's voice is still that of a soprano, she hasn't > become a mezzo or a > contralto What are the limits for the different voices? What determines whether you're a soprano, a mezzo or an alto? _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:46:15 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni's Soprano? Catherine McKay wrote: > > What are the limits for the different voices? What > determines whether you're a soprano, a mezzo or an > alto? Your vocal range (notes you can hit.) Highest notes - soprano next - mezzo lower - alto Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:18:36 -0500 From: "Susan" Subject: RE: Kenny Grant All of my love to Kenny's family, friends and especially to Steve. Although, not all of us knew him personally, he was a brother in our family here. I bid Kenny rest in peace, but I also know first hand that Steve needs some semblance of peace now as well. My heart goes out to you in this time and remember he lives in you! Love & Peace Susan ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 13:34:14 EDT From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: RE: Memorial to Kenny Yes, Thank You Les Rose ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 14:32:16 -0400 From: "cassy" Subject: Re: Joni's Soprano? Catherine McKay asked... >What are the limits for the different voices? What >determines whether you're a soprano, a mezzo or an >alto? Catherine, the range of notes the voice is able to register comfortably determines which "part" the voice sings. Here are the definitions of the soprano and alto in case you would like more specific details. Soprano: the highest human vocal register, extending approximately from middle C to the second A above. A voice with a range approximately from the A below middle C to the second F or G above is termed a mezzo-soprano. Soprano generally refers to female voices, although it is also applied to boy sopranos (also called trebles) and to male castrati singers of the 16th, 17th, and 18th centuries. In music written in four parts, the soprano part is the highest part. Soprano can also designate a high-pitched member of an instrument family (e.g., soprano saxophone). The term derives from Italian sopra ("above") and corresponds to the earlier Latin term superius, which in the polyphonic (multipart) music of the 13th-16th century referred to the highest part. Alto: (Italian: "high"), in vocal music the register approximately between the F below middle C to the second D above--the second highest part in four-part music. The word alto originally referred to the highest male voice, singing falsetto (see countertenor). Alto derives from the term contratenor altus, which in Renaissance music referred to the part immediately above the tenor part. Female alto voices are often called contralto. The term alto is also used for musical instruments having a more or less comparable range--e.g., alto saxophone, alto clarinet, alto flute. The meaning of alto in French is "tenor violin" or "tenor saxhorn"--a pitfall for translators; contralte in French means the English "alto." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 14:52:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Joni's Soprano? - --- Jerry Notaro wrote: > Your vocal range (notes you can hit.) > Highest notes - soprano > next - mezzo > lower - alto > Sorry, I didn't express that very well. How high do you have to sing to be considered a soprano (and so on?) I've heard the same female voice (I'm thinking of Judy Collins, but I've heard this about others as well) described as both a soprano and an alto. If you're a "real" soprano, how high would you have to be able to go? _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 14:55:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Joni's Soprano? - --- cassy wrote: the range of notes the voice is able to > register comfortably > determines which "part" the voice sings. Here are > the definitions of the > soprano and alto in case you would like more > specific details. Thanks - this is what I was really trying to find out. _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 15:00:02 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni's Soprano? Catherine McKay wrote: > > Sorry, I didn't express that very well. How high do > you have to sing to be considered a soprano (and so > on?) I've heard the same female voice (I'm thinking > of Judy Collins, but I've heard this about others as > well) described as both a soprano and an alto. If > you're a "real" soprano, how high would you have to be > able to go? Cassy answered this one like a pro! Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:42:54 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Kenny My sincere condolences to the family & loved ones & those on this list who knew & loved Kenny. He sounded like a very wonderful human being. May he rest in peace. ******************************************** Kate Bennett featured this month at Taylor Guitars www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/ www.katebennett.com www.cdbaby.com/katebennett www.amazon.com ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:42:51 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: fisher Someone asked about Fisher. The CD is called One. My understanding is that they are a band that has been picked up by a major label after having mega success as an independent band via the internet. They had a song in the Great Expectations movie a few years ago. You should be able to find them on amazon.com or your favorite retail music site. ******************************************** Kate Bennett featured this month at Taylor Guitars www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/ www.katebennett.com www.cdbaby.com/katebennett www.amazon.com ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 14:23:56 -0700 (PDT) From: "Lori R. Fye" Subject: Re: Kenny Grant We already miss you, Kenny, friend of spirit ... knowing you're in a more peaceful place is our only consolation. Lori __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 17:35:12 EDT From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Re: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent Murphycopy@aol.com wrote: >Somebody told me that at >one of her gigs, someone was shouting out for her to do "Big Yellow Taxi," and >she was like, "My God! I bet Van Gogh never got people shouting out, 'Paint >another "Starry Night"!' Music is one of the few art forms where people >are constantly demanding that you repeat yourself. My pet peeve alarm just went off ... I've been up on this soapbox before, but it's been awhile and this gives me the perfect excuse to climb on again. Now, I dearly love Joni Mitchell in so many ways, but she (and Boy George) are dead wrong about this. Singing is a performing art, painting isn't. No one was asking her to *write* (create, paint) another "Starry Night," only to *sing* (perform) it again. Songs, by their very nature and function, are meant to be sung again., and while I completely support any artist's prerogative to sing or not sing something, her analogy is false. And now, of course, even Joni herself is revisiting older material. To sing a song again is *not* repeating oneself, because no one -- especially someone of Joni's caliber, with her improvisatory, jazz musician's sensibility -- could ever sing a song the same way twice. In fact, that's the exact point of singing the same songs over and over again ... change is a constant, the world turns every day. Even if the day-to-day differences are subtle details, it's never the same; a great artist can potentially breathe new life born of cumulative years of living into it. - -Fred Simon ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 17:04:49 -0500 From: "kerry" Subject: Sand and Water Craig wrote: >>They played Sand and Water on ER tonight. One of those passionate songs that Beth wrote after her husband passed away. She always said she learned music from listening and singing Joni. Good song really helped the moment of the show.>> I agree that this is a beautiful song and I wanted to share the words, especially for those grieving the loss of Kenny. Sand and Water, by Beth Nielsen Chapman All alone I didn't like the feeling All alone I sat and cried All alone I had to find some meaning In the center of the pain I felt inside All alone I came into this world All alone I will someday die Solid stone is just sand and water, baby Sand and water, and a million years gone by I will see you in the light of a thousand suns I will hear you in the sound of the waves I will know you when I come, as we all will come Through the doors beyond the grave All alone I heal this heart of sorrow All alone I raise this child Flesh and bone, he's just Bursting towards tomorrow And his laughter fills my world and wears your smile All alone I came into this world All alone I will someday die Solid stone is just sand and water, baby Sand and water and a million years gone by ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2000 12:14:30 +1300 From: "Hell" Subject: Re: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent Fred wrote: > My pet peeve alarm just went off ... I've been up on this soapbox before, but > it's been awhile and this gives me the perfect excuse to climb on again. Now, > I dearly love Joni Mitchell in so many ways, but she (and Boy George) are > dead wrong about this. Singing is a performing art, painting isn't. No one > was asking her to *write* (create, paint) another "Starry Night," only to > *sing* (perform) it again. Songs, by their very nature and function, are > meant to be sung again., and while I completely support any artist's > prerogative to sing or not sing something, her analogy is false. > > And now, of course, even Joni herself is revisiting older material. To sing a > song again is *not* repeating oneself, because no one -- especially someone > of Joni's caliber, with her improvisatory, jazz musician's sensibility -- > could ever sing a song the same way twice. In fact, that's the exact point of > singing the same songs over and over again ... change is a constant, the > world turns every day. Even if the day-to-day differences are subtle details, > it's never the same; a great artist can potentially breathe new life born of > cumulative years of living into it. This is something I've always been puzzled by for the same reasons. Asking someone to sing a song again, is the same as asking a painter to "show" their work again, not paint it again. Fred is absolutely right - painting a picture is like writing a song, and showing a picture is like singing a song. Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2000 12:22:04 +1300 From: "Hell" Subject: Re: Joni Covers and Birthday Bob wrote: > Very true, Kakki, what I've seen is that any DEFINITIVE list is going to be > lacking, and I certainly had no idea what I was getting into, but I gotta say > I have loved every second of it! The strength of the project has totally been > the GROUP effort here. Nowhere is there a record of an obscure New Zealand > girl group doing "Big Yellow Taxi" as a B-side, but thankfully we have a > musically-informed Kiwi that knew about it! Same with Sharon Cuneta from the > Phillipines, and all the others that have been shared. Special thanks HAVE to > go to JJ and Leslie for sharing Wally B's tapes - that was really a special > thing, so many unreleased live performances! I'd forgotten I'd sent you the "When The Cat's Away" version of Big Yellow Taxi. And it was more obscure than you possibly realise, since this group was a kind of ad-hoc collaboration between 5 Kiwi singers that lasted for 2 summers, and they only released 2 or 3 songs - no albums, other than a live album on tape only, that is possibly more obscure than the singles (but which is in my collection - music-slut that I am)! Thanks for acknowledging me Bob, and I must say, it was nice to be able to contribute to the project! I'd also like to add my vote for a full set to be presented to Joni, but presented in a special way. I'm picturing a hand-made box containing all the CD's, with an appropriate image etched on the top. I'm even volunteering to make it, assuming someone (ie. Bob) provides me with the required dimensions, or at least the total number of CDs!? And even if it doesn't turn out nicely enough for Joni, it might make a nice Jonifest raffle prize for someone a little less discerning?! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 20:29:37 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent fred!!!! thank you so much for putting it so clearly! i've always felt that this analogy was faulty but i couldn't put my finger on what was wrong. man, you are a logician! wallyk - -----Mensaje original----- De: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]En nombre de FredNow@aol.com Enviado el: Viernes, 20 de Octubre de 2000 06:35 p.m. Para: joni@smoe.org Asunto: Re: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent My pet peeve alarm just went off ... I've been up on this soapbox before, but it's been awhile and this gives me the perfect excuse to climb on again. Now, I dearly love Joni Mitchell in so many ways, but she (and Boy George) are dead wrong about this. Singing is a performing art, painting isn't. - -Fred Simon ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 16:56:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Alison E Subject: Re: Kenny Grant Well, I just got the news on Kenny today. I am so saddened by this loss. Kenny was one of the first JMDLers that I met; no one could have been more accepting, gracious or friendly. He struck up a conversation with my mom at the MSG Joni show in May, and she ended up talking to him for a great part of the time at Judy's Chelsea. She was so excited at not being made to feel like an outsider (as was I)...and it was due in large part to Kenny. I just wanted to express my love and sorrow at this sad event. All love, hope and beauty to Kenny's family and friends. Alison Einerson (now in NYC) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 20:15:22 EDT From: SAVtheWAVE@aol.com Subject: Re: Kenny I met Kenny at Ashara's in Topsfield and from what little I know of him from that one weekend, I can truly say and believe that we now have another Ambassador in Heaven spreading the word about Joni. He knew every lyric to every JONI song when I was around him. I will especially remember him for his kindness to all around him, even to a stranger like myself. Only being on this list since early Spring, I did not know him as well as many on the list, but I still feel saddened by his passing. To all on the list, his family and loved ones, deepest sympathies are out to you all. The one thing I have noticed about this list is everyone's closeness and think that is why this is making me sad too. I sent a personal HUG to Ashara and now want to send one to everyone that is going to feel a huge loss with his untimely passing. Think of us all hugging one another, comforting each other and saying good bye to a passion filled human we all had the pleasure of feeling touched by somehow, someway, no matter how slight. Light a candle, read a Join lyric, play a sad song, play a happy song, remember how he touched you and be happy for having had that. I plan on doing just that as a small tribute and good bye to a member of this community that truly loved Joni. He will be fondly remembered and missed by so many. JOE ( in Rhode Island) NP: James Taylor "Walking Man" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 20:19:22 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: Songs I Wish Joni Would Cove Scott, I agree totally; she is a fine candidate to revisit the Anita O'Day-Chris Connor-June Christy repertoire from the mid--50s. (I have a great set of chord changes for "All About Ronnie.") DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 20:02:21 EST From: "Diane Evans" Subject: Re: BOY GEORGE on Bowie, Joni, Vincent Fred, In reference to your opinion about Joni's van Gogh comparison, I had always gotten a kick out of her reparte. But I had never really considered it as you put it. A song IS meant to be repeated again and again but it doesn't mean an artist is always destined to do only that one tune (even in endless variations), don't you think? Part of the joy of a concert is going with the mood of the performer and that way you're treated to what the performer is in best form/frame of mind to give you. If THE devine Ms. M was excited about her new material I can see how she would be frustrated about being asked to do the same old thing. As a visual artist I can see the analogy working as: you have a gallery full of your latest "visions" and some one says, "Yeah, but where's the one you did last time? Why don't these look more like that one?" You also said: >Singing is a performing art, painting isn't. Although it's a somewhat trite argument, painting can be a performing art. Some painters need the public reaction to do what they do. Have you ever visited the Louvre? The dozens of artists who set up outside and along the river hawking their work and painting with such showmanship give a different spin to performing art. {Mind you, I'm not commenting on their overall talent, just their vehicle of performance.} Just my take on it.:-\ Diane _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 21:04:36 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: RE: Joni's Soprano? Hi Wallyk, I'm confused. I don't know anything at all about the names of ranges although I think they come from the world of classical voice, like opera. Right? And you are an opera buff, right? I thought that to have a soprano voice meant that you sing very, very high. How can Joni still be "a soprano" if she sings lower now? I'm not being a smart alec here- I'm looking for wisdom. :) All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 18:02:30 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Joni's Soprano? > > Your vocal range (notes you can hit.) > Highest notes - soprano > next - mezzo > lower - alto Then what is a 'coloratura'? Mark in Seattle thinking of a line from 'Victor/Victoria' ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 21:05:26 -0700 From: Michael Paz Subject: Joni Interview Hello Gang Yea it's the weekend! I need to veg awhile. It has been a rough week. While in Guitar Center today i found a mag called Inside Connection (October issue). In a section of it called "music from yesterday and today" (I thought that was a Beatle record) they have an article called "Women of Heart and Mind- A rare interview with Joni Mitchell by Steve Matteo. It is only a few hundred words and nothing that I did'nt know and strangely enough I feel like I read all of these same words somewhere else and this is just a repackaged reprint. Anyway I am forwarding a copy to Les Irvin for his archives. I also have a couple of other copies if anyone else is a diehard collector. Paz NP-Pagayez-Zachary Richard/coeur fidele ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 22:28:25 -0400 From: Heather Subject: Re: kenny grant I am in utter shock. I was not close to Kenny but I considered him a pal I could talk to. In fact, at the Jonifest this year he saw me eating alone and came to join me. Some things had been bothering me lately and he listened. Kenny ..... you were so sweet to me. I'm so glad he was able to be part of the "second row gang" at the Connecticut Both Sides Now show. God Bless You Kenny. XO Heather np - Lost Horizon - TR (in honor of Kenny) At 09:25 PM 10/18/00 -0400, patrick leader wrote: >i got a call from steven, kenny grant's lover. kenny passed away this >sunday evening. > >they believe it was a heart attack. steven told me that kenny had a stroke >about six months ago, (which means it may have been before the may concerts >we saw together). he'd been to a bunch of cardiologists and was about to >embark on a program of cardiac rehabilitation. > >steve said kenny'd been listening to joni all last week, especially the >tribute concert (i think the tnt one). steve knew how fond kenny was of the >jmdl; some of us even met steve at a couple of the joni gatherings and the >1998 msg show. > >joni was central to kenny's life; his first moment of rapture was borrowing >his sister's 'hejira' and listening to side 2 first. he could talk >endlessly about 'song for sharon'. > >the funeral is tomorrow at 1 pm, in florida. steven may have a gathering of >some sort here, in new york, and i've asked him to keep me posted. > >patrick > >np - joni in camden nj, 06/02/00, one of many gifts he sent to me. > >ps. i didn't know kenny very well, but we shared some lovely joni moments. >we also shared a birthday, and i'd like to share with you this huge joni >content email he sent me a couple of years ago on our mutual day. > >--------- > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Kenny Grant >Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 1998 10:25 AM >To: Patrick Leader >Subject: Happy Birthday!!! > >Gonna sing a quick litte song, lemme set it up for you. > >Picture it, Sicily, 1914...no, on second thought, New York City, 1998, it's >3:40am, you're heading home after hanging with some friends who took you out >for your birthday, you pass the Blue Note, and see that Joe Sample is >performing so you stop in, they don't ask you for a cover as its so late and >the show is almost over, you sit down at a small table and order a beer, its >dark, and only about 50% full. > >About two minutes later, Joe finishes the song he was playing as you walked >in, and says "Ladies and Gentleman, an old friend is in the audience, and >she'd like to come on stage and jam with me, please give a warm welcome to >Miss Joni Mitchell." > >She gets on stage, wearing a long black dress, the crowd gives her an >exuberant welcome, they hand her a baby blue Martin, and she begins >strumming...."Heatwaves on the runway, as the wheels set down, he takes his >baggage off the carousel, takes a taxi into town." > >Joe joins in on Centerpiece, and Joni whips out a husky voice, and breaks >into some of her best jazz singing ever: "The more I'm with you pretty baby, >the more I feel my love increase..." > >"Shining hair and shining skin, shining as she reeled 'em in, to tell him >like she did today, just what he could do with Harry's House, and Harry's >take-home-pay." > >The crowd roars. Cassandra Wilson is in the audience, a little embibed, and >gives a loud standing ovation. > >Joni looks around the room and spots you, and says "you're Patrick from the >JMDL, right? I recognize your picture from one of Wally's party pages. >Isn't today your birthday? > >Smiling from ear to ear, she waves you onstage, you're a little shy, but >she's warm and encouraging, as you approach the stage she turns to Joe. "Do >you know happy birthday?" Joe begins to play it in some weird minor chord, >Joni accompanies him on guitar, playing a note here and there, as she sings >in a deep, rich voice: > > "Happy birthday to you, happy birthday to you, happy birthday dear >Patrick, happy birthday to you." > >Cassandra Wilson has made her way to the stage, grabbed a free mike, and >adds: > > "And many more" > >She spreads those 4 syllables out for a good 15 seconds. The drummer >brushes the cymbals. Joe's fingers are dancing on the piano. > >Joni takes off the guitar and gives you a warm embrace and a wet kiss on the >cheek. > >The lights are brightened a bit, they announce last call, and Joe and his >band go into their final selection. > >Happy 40, Patrick, and many more!!! > >Huggs, > > -Kenny > > o o o o o o > | | | | | | > (===========) > (___________) > (===========) > (-----------) > >(p.s., I stole this cake from Mark D, I don't bake :-( ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 23:29:38 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: sopranos and coloratura sjc long and wallyesque first off, i'd like to answer jim's question: Hi Wallyk, I'm confused. I don't know anything at all about the names of ranges although I think they come from the world of classical voice, like opera. Right? And you are an opera buff, right? I thought that to have a soprano voice meant that you sing very, very high. How can Joni still be "a soprano" if she sings lower now? I'm not being a smart alec here- I'm looking for wisdom. :) All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu once a soprano, always a soprano. the fact that joni is singing in a lower range doesn't mean that she has changed her register. she may not be able to hit very high notes, and she may be using her lower range now, but being a soprano is pretty much an anatomical fact, something related to the way your vocal cords are designed, the length and thickness of your neck, the capacity of your lungs, etc.. technique will give you better muscular control, and you may eventually hit very high notes, but being a soprano or a mezzo is very much like being a blonde or a brunette. some singers begin their careers as mezzos and later start singing soprano parts or vice versa. when you read their biographies, you find that the author usually says ''she was first a mezzo, and then she became a soprano''. that's a wrong way to put it. she [this hypothetical singer] may have discovered that she was a soprano with great lower notes [or chest voice] but she was always a soprano that could sing mezzo parts. some singers are very hard to classify because they had such extensive ranges that they could sing virtually any part. but if you listen carefully you can tell whether the singer is a soprano with great lower notes or a mezzo with great highs [head voice]. an example: birgit nilsson, one of the most fantastic dramatic sopranos [another category for you, mark!!!] ever, retired when she was about 65. in her 70's, she returned to the US to salute james levine on his 25th anniversary at the MET. she astounded everyone by singing a brief wagner piece. you could tell that she was an old woman but she was still every bit of a soprano. joni, in turn, has vocal problems that have to do with her emission and the damage that has been caused to her vocal cords [i don't know if by smoking or what else.] regardless of whether she's more expressive now or more mature or worse dressed or you name it, she is a soprano whose voice hasn't aged well. there are scads of cases like joni's. once glorious elena souliotis was hailed as callas successor. however, her voice lasted exactly 4 years. later she did some mezzo parts because she couldn't hit the highs and she still had a good chest voice, but you could tell she was a ravaged soprano trying to make a buck. one more thing: we are all something or other. it doesn't matter if you can't carry a tune even with the help of a towing truck: you're still a soprano, a tenor, a baritone, etc.. you can even tell when the person speaks. roberto could tell that i was a tenor after two sentences. the coloratura question: a coloratura is a musical ornament. by extension, all voices, not only sopranos, that specialize in the coloratura repertoire are called ''coloratura'' mezzo, ''coloratura'' soprano, etc.. the typical coloratura voice is very agile and can perform fast scales and ornamental figures. more than to a type of voice, the term refers to a school of singing. roberto is rehearsing [or performing already] the barber of seville by rossini. the part of the leading female role in that opera [rosina] was written for a coloratura mezzo and later adapted to coloratura soprano. if you listen to its most famous aria, ''una voce poco fa'', you'll notice the million notes the singer has to squeeze into every bar. 19th century composers specialized in coloratura writing, although mozart and handel wrote a lot of coloratura too. think of the queen of the night part in die zauberflute. it is less common in contemporary opera, although leonard bernstein included a coloratura aria for soprano in candide, and richard strauss composed what is arguably the most difficult coloratura aria for the character of zerbinetta in ariadne auf naxos. if you want to listen to the epitome of coloratura writing, get an amelita galli curci or a lily pons cd. those women could outsing a battalion of nightingales, by which i don't mean AT ALL that you'll be thrilled to hear them. great coloratura singers [in terms of technique though not always in terms of the quality of their voices] include: marilyn horne [contralto], edita gruberova [soprano], natalie dessay [great soprano], nicolai gedda [tenor], maria callas [supernatural being, goddess supreme and mother of all creation], renato bruson [bass], mady mesple [soprano], teresa berganza [mezzo], geraint evans [bass], june anderson [lesser kind of soprano]. composers that specialized in the writing of coloratura parts: bellini, donizetti, delibes, rossini, gluck, handel, mozart, verdi [ sempre libera, in traviata], and many operetta composers. a very sad example of how coloratura can become [literally] a circus act is the life of jenny lind. this swedish soprano had such amazingly agile voice and extensive range that she caught the attention of p. t. barnum, under whose ''sponsorship'' she fell. needless to say, she became little more than a circus freak. to give you an idea of the number of categories that are used to classify classically trained voices, let me mention that sopranos can be coloratura, lirico, spinto, falcon, lirico-spinto, dramatico, young dramatico, heroic dramatico, de agilita, etc.. add all the categories for mezzo, contralto, countertenor, tenor, baritone and bass, and you'll have a mountain of words you can use the next time you play scrabble. it is also important to mention whether the singer is pre- or post-war, since singing schools changed radically after WWII. there! wallyK, listening to leyla gencer, post-war lirico-spinto soprano de agilita. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 22:26:39 -0400 From: "cassy" Subject: Re: Joni's Soprano? Mark in Seattle asked... >Then what is a 'coloratura'? Mark, within each type of vocal ranges there are sub-categories. The term soprano, while typically referring to the highest ranges of female and young boy's voices is divided further into sections within sections. The highest female voice found is the extra high and light coloratura soprano and the mezzo-soprano is found in the lower registers of the high end of female voices. There are many divisions of voice ranges both male and female, Soprano, Alto, Tenor, Baritone, Bass and each of those is sub-divided based on the best quality of sound from the vocal chords and the body-types which resonate the sounds emanating from within. It has to do with frequencies and it's quite a science. If we want to get into it deeply we could talk about "chest voice" and "head voice" and tension of the vocal cord, force of glottal closure indicated by the glottal resistance, and expiratory air pressure. But somehow stripping it down to science seems to take away the magic I feel when I hear a particularly lovely aria. The Gregorian chanters seemed to do well dividing their chanters into "parts." Operas and choral music depend on the richness of sound provided by a good blend of the different ranges. Then for others... parts is parts... Regards Cassy NP: Quincy Jones "Body Heat" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 23:00:10 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: sopranos and coloratura sjc long and wallyesque Wallyk, Wow, THANK YOU! I think I called you an opera 'buff'. It's now obvious that you're way more than a 'buff'! Thanks for the education. This kind of exchange is one reason why I love this List! It's either read the List or watch bad (american) sitcoms. :) Jim L'Hommedieu ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2000 00:05:47 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: sopranos and coloratura sjc long and wallyesque oh but you can always watch judge judy!!!!! remember how joni recommended judge judy to wally breese? best, wallyK - -----Mensaje original----- De: Jim L'Hommedieu [mailto:jlamadoo@one.net] Enviado el: Sábado, 21 de Octubre de 2000 12:00 a.m. Para: _JMDL - June 98; Wally Kairuz Asunto: Re: sopranos and coloratura sjc long and wallyesque Wallyk, Wow, THANK YOU! I think I called you an opera 'buff'. It's now obvious that you're way more than a 'buff'! Thanks for the education. This kind of exchange is one reason why I love this List! It's either read the List or watch bad (american) sitcoms. :) Jim L'Hommedieu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 23:10:00 -0400 From: Heather Subject: A funny moment with Kenny I had first met Kenny at Julie's in 1998. He seemed kind of shy. I think it was a surreal moment to many of us there .... meeting JMDLers and singing Joni tunes. We we're all more or less strangers but yet felt uniquely bonded. On the ride back to the hotel that evening I sat next to Kenny in the car. Something or someone bought up the movie " Serial Mom" (a John Waters film) we both looked at each other and said "you do not wear white after Labor Day" and chuckled. My first words with Kenny! A pleasant memory I will cherish. Heather ( eyes swelled with tears) ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #405 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list at ------- Siquomb, isn't she?