From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #352 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Thursday, August 31 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 352 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Dark Secrets VLJC [catman ] Re: hitler and jesus [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re: Dark Secrets jnc [catman ] Re: hitler and jesus [Kenny Grant ] RE: hitler and jesus ["Wally Kairuz" ] RE: hitler and jesus ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: hitler and jesus [byron bentley ] My neighbor John Kelly ["Kakki" ] Re: My neighbor John Kelly [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: Dark Secrets VLJC [MGVal@aol.com] Re: Joni and Joan Baez [RoseMJoy@aol.com] hitler and jesus ["kerry" ] Re: hitler and jesus ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: Joni and Joan Baez ["Gerald Notaro (LIB)" ] Kick off the sand flies [philipf@tinet.ie] Jesus/Hitler ["Blair Fraipont" ] Joni and Joan Baez correction [James O Phillips ] Re: hitler and jesus ["Stephen Epstein" ] RE: Nickel Chief is Golden [Michael Bird ] The last frigging word on Hate-ler & Jesus ["william" ] Favourite Joni to play ["william" ] RE: hitler and jesus ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: My neighbor John Kelly ["Kakki" ] sometimes i forget... [Susan McNamara ] Dark Secrets (vljc) ["Kakki" ] Re: hitler and jesus [Siresorrow@aol.com] Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) [Alison ] Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) [catman ] Re: Marcel's Dark Secrets (vljc) [MDESTE1@aol.com] Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) ["cassy" ] credibility ["Christopher J. Treacy" ] Macarthur Park ["Christopher J. Treacy" ] Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) [michael w yarbrough ] RE: stream of consciousness joni lyric exercise [Slac ] Re: A new idea & a new question 1/2 JC ["Stephen Epstein" ] Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) ["Mark or Travis" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:23:48 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Dark Secrets VLJC > > 2) Despite what everyone says about her, I still feel a great affinity > with Geri Halliwell. I like her voice. husky and raunchy. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 03:18:43 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: hitler and jesus In a message dated 8/31/00 2:14:40 AM Eastern Daylight Time, wallykai@interserver.com.ar writes: << paul, you're just trying to win the sympathy you will never deserve by sounding off like you have a heart or a brain. hitler at least was consistent. wallyk >> Hitler was consistent? what is that? Are you some escaped Nazi living in Argentina with a U-boat in your lagoon? Maybe as a Jewish man I am grossly offended by any mention of Hitler in a civilized conversation, but if you are not, you oughta be. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:34:17 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Dark Secrets jnc > > 5. It is hard to believe, but I never did purchase Donna Summer's > version of MacArthur Park. My loss. tis the only version I have and it is brilliant-the whole 17 min or so suite. colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk http://www.geocities.com/tantra_apso/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 03:46:38 +0000 From: Kenny Grant Subject: Re: hitler and jesus Hey guys, I'm all for "lightening up" but I have to side with Paul here. The name Adolf Hitler does strike a RAW NERVE, with Jewish people (and many non-Jews as well.) He mass-murdered 6 million people. Most of us have seen the news footage of places like Aushwitz and Belsen, and the ways people were violently extricated from society and their every-day lives, rounded-up, incarcerated en-masse in horrid conditions, and ultimately gassed to death. What many don't immediately realize is that is that were some survivors. People who endured years of torture and somehow managed to escape, and the other "lucky" ones who escaped but lost their entire families - never got to spend their lives with a mother, a father, grandparents, sons, daughters, aunts, uncles, cousins.... While Joni makes casual mention of Hitler in Talk To Me, she also makes mention of "concrete concentration camps" in another song - although it's not about Nazi Germany. -Kenny btw, Paul, sorry for my cheap attempt at humor in a private email earlier (What, you wouldn't want Hilter over for dinner?) You're right, there is no humor. IVPAUL42@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 8/30/00 9:29:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > mark.travis@gte.net writes: > > << > And I would ask is there anybody on the list so without humor that > they honestly thought the post about inviting these people to dinner > was meant to be taken seriously? And I don't believe Joni was > planning on inviting Hitler to dinner in 'Talk To Me' either. She > threw his name out as a possible topic of conversation. >> > > Sorry, but when the topic turns to Adolf Hitler, there is no room for humor, > and anyone who thinks so is an insensitive fool or an idiot. > So don't try to laugh it off as a joke. It's not and never can be. > And I can think of 6 million reasons. > > Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 05:37:33 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: hitler and jesus lagoon? what lagoon? maybe you should take offence at your own insurmountable stupidity. wallyK > Hitler was consistent? what is that? Are you some escaped Nazi living in > Argentina with a U-boat in your lagoon? > Maybe as a Jewish man I am grossly offended by any mention of Hitler in a > civilized conversation, but if you are not, you oughta be. > > Paul I > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 05:48:58 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: hitler and jesus i don't agree with you, kenny. nothing is beyond, above or beneath humor. humor has helped many holocaust survivors live with the nightmare. however, the issue at hand is not humor or whether we are allowed to mention hitler in a light-hearted way. the issue here is that no one is to mention hitler lest we infringe upon paul iv's sole claim to fame: the fact that he is jewish. wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 02:44:56 -0700 From: byron bentley Subject: Re: hitler and jesus This particular thread is getting frayed and it's looking ugly. Anyone have any scissors? "Balk, Balk, Balk, Balk...Balk,, Balk, Balk...Chicken squawking!" Did I get on the Adolph Hitler Discussion List (AHDL) by mistake? Wally Kairuz wrote: > i don't agree with you, kenny. nothing is beyond, above or beneath humor. > humor has helped many holocaust survivors live with the nightmare. > however, the issue at hand is not humor or whether we are allowed to mention > hitler in a light-hearted way. the issue here is that no one is to mention > hitler lest we infringe upon paul iv's sole claim to fame: the fact that he > is jewish. > wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 02:37:11 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: My neighbor John Kelly I just found out to my great surprise a few days ago that John Kelly has been staying in my apartment building for the past few months while he was performing in James Joyce's "The Dead" up the street at the Ahmanson Theater. Tonight we finally hooked up, along with Ken Corral, and had a very sweet time. Wowee, he is darling!!!! I'm trying to get him to permanently relocate to L.A. What a fantastic person he is. We started out at my place drinking gin, tequila and wine and listening to the Joni '79 Mingus shows and Carla, too, and then went down to his place with my mini-amp to check out his new Fender Strat and VG-8. (The VG-8 hooks into the mini amp just fine, by the way, Mr. PAZ ;-) I can't tell you enough what a great, talented, charming, witty and interesting person he is. He regaled us with a number of great Joni stories and we heard some of his performances (gorgeous voice - he should rightfully shove his way right in to do a gig with the Irish tenors). Told us about an album he has coming out where he covers, among others, In My Room and Can't Find My Way Home (this was enough to get me going). AUSSIE - TASMAN - KIWI jimdlers - he is coming to Sydney in February with Paved Paradise and hopefully will perform the show in L.A. on his return trip. He's adding the VG-8 to his repetoire. (PAZ - you need to collaborate with him on a few patches). What a special night and what a really special person. John, it was really wonderful to meet you. Please move to L.A.! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 07:16:41 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: My neighbor John Kelly Kakki writes: << What a special night and what a really special person. John, it was really wonderful to meet you. Please move to L.A.! >> Wow Kakki, what another exciting evening for you. (and I always thought Barbie had everything :~) I wish John would bring his Paved Paradise show to Florida sometime. Did you ask him to come to Ashara's? That would be the next best thing to having Joni there. Thanks for sharing your wonderful evening!!! Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 07:49:49 EDT From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Re: Dark Secrets VLJC 1. I get up too early 2. I never listened to Taming the Tiger all the way through: do not like it. 3. Love to eat cotton candy 4. Never saw "Casablanca," (though, like Colin, saw many clips), nor "Citizen Kane." 5. Gobble down "lite" reading by writers such as the Kellermans, Sue Grafton, etc. 6. Although I should boycott it, I'll indulge in "In and Out" hamburgers from time to time. 7. Like whipped cream straight from the can 8. Believed that when cows fell down a hill, their intestines got tangled until I was older than I care to admit and you know there may be more..... MG ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 07:56:31 EDT From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni and Joan Baez Relayer211 wrote: "I love the song "Dida" on Joan's Baez's album "Diamonds and Rust",which came out in 1975. " Me Too :-) Joni sounds beautiful.my question is:Why did Joan Baez ask Joni to be on it? Good question. "I have read a quote of Joni where she said that Joan was very rude and unfriendly towards her,because she regared Joni as competition." Do you remember where you read this quote? I'd be interested. "Why did Joan suddenly change her mind and become friendly to Joni,and invite her to sing on her album?Could it have been the "Hurrican" tour with Bob Dylan that broke the Ice?" I think maybe it was all about Bob that started this rivalry. Anyone with any insight on this one? Rose in NJ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 07:45:38 -0500 From: "kerry" Subject: hitler and jesus Wally wrote: >>>[ALSO FROM A JONI MITCHELL SONG, IN CASE YOU HAVEN'T HEARD.]>>> There's a way of making a point without being rude. Let's drop this whole discussion. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:40:05 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: hitler and jesus Paul I, Sorry to read that it's now politically incorrect to hate Hitler. :) You must try hard to learn that in the 21st century the only unacceptable value is to HOLD a value. :) I can identify with your struggle because it was 3 months ago that I learned that wishing death upon the inner circle is not only acceptable but funny. Lama - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wally Kairuz" To: Cc: Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2000 4:51 AM Subject: RE: hitler and jesus > i don't agree with you, kenny. nothing is beyond, above or beneath humor. > humor has helped many holocaust survivors live with the nightmare. > however, the issue at hand is not humor or whether we are allowed to mention > hitler in a light-hearted way. the issue here is that no one is to mention > hitler lest we infringe upon paul iv's sole claim to fame: the fact that he > is jewish. > wallyk > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:47:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gerald Notaro (LIB)" Subject: Re: Joni and Joan Baez I doubt all this quite seriously. I have been a fan ofJoan's for a long time (longer than ener of Joni) and not only have I never heard anything rude about her, but I sure she would never look at any other artist as "competition." It's just not her stlye. Jerry On Thu, 31 Aug 2000 RoseMJoy@aol.com wrote: > Relayer211 wrote: > "I love the song "Dida" on Joan's Baez's album "Diamonds and Rust",which > came out in 1975. " > > Me Too :-) > > Joni sounds beautiful.my question is:Why did Joan Baez ask > Joni to be on it? > > Good question. > > "I have read a quote of Joni where she said that Joan was > very rude and unfriendly towards her,because she regared Joni as > competition." > > Do you remember where you read this quote? I'd be interested. > > "Why did Joan suddenly change her mind and become friendly to > Joni,and invite her to sing on her album?Could it have been the "Hurrican" > tour with Bob Dylan that broke the Ice?" > > I think maybe it was all about Bob that started this rivalry. > > Anyone with any insight on this one? > > Rose in NJ > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:53:11 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: hitler and jesus Wally, Wally, Wally, What is up with you? A Jewish JMDLer takes offense at the idea of Adolf Hitler at a dinner party and you scold him for holding a strong opinion on the matter????? This is an indefensible position, clearly. Furthermore, did you really write this: >. the issue here is that no one is to mention > hitler lest we infringe upon paul iv's sole claim to fame: the > fact that he is jewish. This is a personal attack, stating that because Paul is offended by your humor, that he is a zero. You strip him of everything but his faith, which you obviously don't respect either. What kind of vitriol is this? I'm all for healthy debate, as I've shown over and over and over again. But you have crossed the line here. You said that his sole claim to fame is the fact that he is jewish. That is some harsh shit. Please withdraw this statement at once. Lama - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wally Kairuz" To: Cc: Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2000 4:40 AM Subject: RE: hitler and jesus > lagoon? what lagoon? maybe you should take offence at your own > insurmountable stupidity. > wallyK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 14:10:46 +0100 From: philipf@tinet.ie Subject: Kick off the sand flies I like this review of You Turn Me On I'm a Radio. It's from a book called The Heart Of Rock And Soul by Dave Marsh in which he selected the 1000 best singles ever. You Turn Me On I'm A Radio is number 158 on his chart. It's a great book and his essay about Rag Doll by The Four Seasons alone would make it worth buying. He's so right about the lovely harmonica intro on YTMOIAR which Joni put there for the DJs to talk over. Incidentally on the Miles Of Aisles tour Tom Scott played the intro on a melodica. 158 YOU TURN ME ON l'M A RADIO. Joni Mitchell No producer credited: written by Joni Mitchell Asylum 11010 1972 Billboard: #25 The one indisputably great single of the singer/songwriter movement, a simply magnificent unification of airv folk-pop melody and confessional language amidst the quasi-populism of Top 40 metaphors. Ordinarily. Mitchell is way too icy and unfunky for my particular set of predispositions but on the basis of ' Radio," I've forgiven her almost everything up to and including the pretensions of Mingus. Sung with an ache in her throat that comes from just where you want it to—her heart—what makes the record so fine isn't just its sly, slick. and wicked put-downs of her deejay lover, but Mitchell's conviction that broadcasting her passions and discontents will work. And so it does. At home, on your stereo, this might seem like nothing more than wish fulfilment. Driving around at night, or lying on the beach fighting off those sand flies, encountering "You Turn Me on" by surprise, it's the plain truth delivered in words of fewer syllables than you might imagine. With one of the all-time harmonica rifts, too. - - Dave Marsh. The Heart Of Rock and Soul. (with permission) Philip ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 09:22:22 EDT From: "Blair Fraipont" Subject: Jesus/Hitler How can the notion of having both at the same table sick?? It is just a damn Thread..man, GET A LIFE. The person was just being playful. blair np: the J.B's :doing it to Death _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 08:31:16 -0500 From: James O Phillips Subject: Joni and Joan Baez correction Hey, Not to sound like a correcting type of guy, but the song "Dida" that Joni sings on a Joan Baez album is on "Gracious a la vida" not "Diamonds and Rust" I do know that Joni sang on another song of Joan's that is on "Diamonds and Rust". Maybe what smoothed the ice between them (Joan and Joni) is that for a while, Joan was using Henry Lewy as her engineer for most of her A&M albums. It seems to be the logical answer I think. James ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 09:53:02 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni and Joan Baez correction James O Phillips wrote: > Hey, > > Not to sound like a correcting type of guy, but the song "Dida" that Joni > sings on a Joan Baez album is on "Gracious a la vida" not "Diamonds and > Rust" I do know that Joni sang on another song of Joan's that is on > "Diamonds and Rust". It most certainly is. Here is the song list: 1. Diamonds & Rust 2. Fountain Of Sorrow 3. Never Dreamed You'd Leave In Summer 4. Children And All That Jazz 5. Simple Twist Of Fate 6. Blue Sky 7. Hello In There 8. Jesse 9. Winds Of The Old Days 10. Dida 11. I Dream Of Jeannie / Danny Boy Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 09:58:28 -0400 From: "Reuben Bell" Subject: Re: Joni and Joan Baez correction Jerry's right...not having heard it, I checked out the clip of "Dida" from "Diamonds and Rust" on CDNOW. It is unmistakeably Joni on background vocals. Reuben >>> Jerry Notaro It most certainly is. Here is the song list: 1. Diamonds & Rust 2. Fountain Of Sorrow 3. Never Dreamed You'd Leave In Summer 4. Children And All That Jazz 5. Simple Twist Of Fate 6. Blue Sky 7. Hello In There 8. Jesse 9. Winds Of The Old Days 10. Dida 11. I Dream Of Jeannie / Danny Boy Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 10:08:32 -0400 From: "Stephen Epstein" Subject: Re: hitler and jesus I'm relatively new to the group- a bit of a lurker still, though I did post that I wish to invite both Joni and Van Gogh to my dinner party! It seems that this is generally an intelligent, mature group of people with lots of interesting points of view and unique thoughts to share. To date, I have been enjoying it. This business with Hitler is going way too far! Jokingly or not, I don't believe this is a forum for this type of discussion. It is insulting, anti-semitic, and certainly in bad taste- I am sure that Ms. Mitchell would not approve, and she is the reason that we are all here and participating. I respectfully request we end it now, and perhaps those of you who are so inclined can e-mail each other personally- not in this public forum. Thanks and regards Stephen in Vancouver byron bentley on 08/31/2000 02:44:56 AM Please respond to byron bentley To: joni@smoe.org cc: (bcc: Stephen Epstein/Agmont) Subject: Re: hitler and jesus This particular thread is getting frayed and it's looking ugly. Anyone have any scissors? "Balk, Balk, Balk, Balk...Balk,, Balk, Balk...Chicken squawking!" Did I get on the Adolph Hitler Discussion List (AHDL) by mistake? Wally Kairuz wrote: > i don't agree with you, kenny. nothing is beyond, above or beneath humor. > humor has helped many holocaust survivors live with the nightmare. > however, the issue at hand is not humor or whether we are allowed to mention > hitler in a light-hearted way. the issue here is that no one is to mention > hitler lest we infringe upon paul iv's sole claim to fame: the fact that he > is jewish. > wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 10:22:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Bird Subject: RE: Nickel Chief is Golden Thanks for spreading the word, Stephen. I shall hire you as my publicist, press secretary, and fashion advisor. For anyone interested in seeing the show, be assured there IS Joni Content! Nickel Chief >>>>>>>>>Congratulations to listmember Nickel Chief, who has written a play that is being produced Off-Off Broadway: QUARTET by Michael Bird (a.k.a. Nickel Chief) is being presented September 7-30 Thu-Fri-Sat nights at 8 P.M. DTX 156 Water Street @ Pearl Street, Brooklyn (F to York Street, two blocks downhill on Jay Street, left on Water) tickets $10 reservations/information 212-462-3213 Break a leg Nickel Chief! Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 21:32:16 +0700 From: "william" Subject: The last frigging word on Hate-ler & Jesus Let's put this dumb thread and IV to rest oops at rest. IV negative asked "What kind of person are you?" I replied personally to save any embarrassment. I feel in order to clarify (to all the JMDLers) what kind of person Willy the Shake is, I have to post the original reply that I sent to IVPaul. So here you have it. Oh please relax for IV's sake. It crossed my mind some unenlightened soul may question that. Are you unaware it's merely quoting from Talk to Me? It happens to be the third song on DJRD which came out in 1997 or was it 1928? See I don't know that much either. I'd love to ask Adolf over if only to make him eat his balls that I'd just castrated (though I have heard he only did have one which he used for his brain), then pour lighter fluid over him and let him smell the acrid hairs alight, watch his cursed skin creep under the heat 6,000,000 times (and the rest) if you're able to grasp what I mean. Then watch a slo-mo exocet missile penetrate his eyeball. May he rot eternally listening to Meat Loaf, Michael Bolton. But even they don't deserve such a bad audience. If you know who Martha is do let me know. I invited her to my hypothetical dinner do too. Chezus who might she be? Why would Joni want to talk about Adolf Hate-ler anyway? Maybe I'll post another hypo-supper, nah, it's a stupid thread. Don't you think? I'd much rather discuss beauty, compassion and the lack of it in the world, charity, taking responsibility for one's actions, charity, meditation. What kind of person are you IV? Thanks for your concern, Willy the Shake ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 10:46:34 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni and Joan Baez correction Joni & Joan do TWO distinct versions of "Dida"...one is on "Diamonds & Rust", one is on "Gracias Por La Vida". Both are available on the "Covers & Contributions" collection that has been shared and is open to any JMDL'er who would like them! Bob NP: The Monkees, "I'm A Believer" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 10:47:46 EDT From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: hitler and jesus (md) My only comment about this ridiculous bickering subject matter is that (a)Some Jewish people obviously are overly sensetive to the very word Hitler. (b) Stalin killed more Jews than Hitler so why didnt he get upset about Stalins being invited. (c) Selective outrage over inncouous matters reveals a neurosis only seen (and celebrated) heretofore in Woody Allen movies. (d) Wonder what he thought about Woody's Hitler scene in Zelig. marcel ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 15:32:10 GMT From: "c Karma" Subject: re: Dark Secrets (SJC) Jason, You're not alone there. I also don't own MOA, although it's cover art and photography make me want to find a mint/sealed vinyl copy. Except for the recent tour with Dylan and Van Morrison, I rarely enjoyed seeing Joni perform in big arenas, shows like MOA chronicles. True the album has some wonderful moments, but overall I just felt the performances to be too glossy and incongruously over-amplified (not in terms of volume, but scale): case in point, live "Rainy Night House" and "You Turn Me On (I'm A Radio)." (Though "Cactus Tree" might redeem the whole package, IMHO.) While I like the idea of such a thread as "Dark Secrets" I might caution listers to temper possibly inflammatory political or personal statements. While I believe that great art rises from conflict and contrast, I also believe in the spirit of community and would discourage discourse within the list. We should agree to disagree, but let's not piss each other off. Please don't interpret this as arrogance, I wouldn't mean to censor anyone's deep convictions. CC "I heard there was no sickness And no toil or danger Just mercy and plenty Where peaceful waters flow, Where peaceful waters flow." -- JM _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 22:50:04 +0700 From: "william" Subject: Favourite Joni to play Now this is more like it. I love playing the one where she sings about Jesus and Hitler and How-odd Huge. I get such a buzzz outta that line! Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!!!! I went back to the UK (for the Millenium) after a four-year absence and I thought it might be a good idea to make a CD of mysel-i-f and friends here in Indonesia for my family back home. I chose a running order; Young Blood - RLJ Sara - Dylan Long Ago & ...... - JT Woodstock - Joni Rainy Day Women -Dylan Wild Mountain Thyme - Trad. I sometimes play at our local and am frequently asked to render Sara. I always follow with Woodstock in standard which gets the pint-punters to shut up for 4 minutes and 30 secs. Sometimes (another) Martin is there with his sax. So-o-o haunting. I'd love to have the time and the number of guitars required to play endless Joni tuned but I get "fretful" (pun intended) when I have to retune my cheapo Yamaha. So needless to say my renditions of Joni's catalogue are sparse. The ones I do play are; Carey; A Case of You; Raised on Robbery; Coyote; This Flight Tonight; For the Roses; Cactus Tree; Big Yellow Taxi; Woodstock; All I Want and maybe a few others. Literally, anything after Coyote and there's no comprehending. I admire folks like (JMDLer) Martin who can do it. Hey Martin you strum I'll sing! Getting to Martin's point - which three and why. 1) - Woodstock. The chords are easy to play and I've learned a little from Joni's style; that chop chop and droning sound to make it easily the best I could possibly make of Joni's songs. It's nothing to do with my voice but the emotions in the melody which other folks enjoy. "Who sings that?" they'll ask. Also being in a studio and doing harmonies over one's own voice gave me such a buzz. My mate Paul (not IV) was with me at the recording and he's invariably in the bar when I sing so he does the harmony. So that's my number one. 2) - Raised on Robbery. It's the fact I don't have to pick but just bar and let it rock that I like. Noise can cover up a multitude of sins in bad playing. That's me. It's a shame it's a shame it's a crying shame. 3) - For the Roses. Again it's such a song and the only one I can get a quarter close to in standard that sounds C-grade passable on the original. I'd love to attend a JoniFest. My 2 rupiahs worth Willy the Shake NP - Cherokee Louise from Just Ice ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 14:24:54 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: hitler and jesus jim, unlike paul, you don't even have a claim to fame! your attempt at playing maria von trapp is pathetic in its phoniness. wallyk - ----- Mensaje original ----- De: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Para: "_JMDL - June 98" ; "Wally Kairuz" ; Enviado: Jueves 31 de Agosto de 2000 09:53 Asunto: Re: hitler and jesus > Wally, Wally, Wally, > > What is up with you? A Jewish JMDLer takes offense at the idea of Adolf > Hitler at a dinner party and you scold him for holding a strong opinion on > the matter????? > > This is an indefensible position, clearly. > > Furthermore, did you really write this: > >. the issue here is that no one is to mention > > hitler lest we infringe upon paul iv's sole claim to fame: the > fact that > he is jewish. > > This is a personal attack, stating that because Paul is offended by your > humor, that he is a zero. You strip him of everything but his faith, which > you obviously don't respect either. What kind of vitriol is this? > > I'm all for healthy debate, as I've shown over and over and over again. But > you have crossed the line here. You said that his sole claim to fame is the > fact that he is jewish. That is some harsh shit. Please withdraw this > statement at once. > > Lama > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Wally Kairuz" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2000 4:40 AM > Subject: RE: hitler and jesus > > > > lagoon? what lagoon? maybe you should take offence at your own > > insurmountable stupidity. > > wallyK > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 12:46:44 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: My neighbor John Kelly > Wow Kakki, what another exciting evening for you. (and I >always thought Barbie had everything :~) Jimmy this cracked me up all morning - (well, I am a little punchy after staying up so late last night) This started giving me visions of a little JMDL Barbie complete with miniature Joni lithos, T-shirts, tape trees and a VG-8. ;-) > I wish John would bring his Paved Paradise show to > Florida sometime. I hope you get to see the show and meet him someday. What I didn't realize until last night is the show is only occasional for him - he does so many other projects in song, dance, acting, writing, etc. He told us some great and funny tales of opening for Natalie Merchant on her tour. They even did a serio-comedic rendition of a Joni song onstage. He also is auditioning here next week for a big TV show but I won't say any more so as not to jinx it. >Did you ask him to come to Ashara's? Of course! But he's committed here in the play until next week. Maybe next time! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 16:17:38 -0400 From: Susan McNamara Subject: sometimes i forget... ...just how great Joni Mitchell is. I'm ashamed to say I listened to Ladies of the Canyon for the first time in way over a year today. "And I feel like I'm just being born Like a shiny light breaking in a storm..." sheer beauty. Just had to say that. sue NR: JMDL...hopelessly behind on posts again. ____________________ /____________________\ ||-------------------|| || Sue McNamara || || sem8@cornell.edu || ||___________________|| || O etch-a-sketch O || \___________________/ "It's all a dream she has awake" - Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 13:14:30 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Dark Secrets (vljc) 1. I preferred the Dave Clark Five over the Rolling Stones and still do. 2. The only sports that I can stand to watch are baseball, live ice hockey and surfing, but I'm mad about watching any Olympics competition. 3. Compulsively check out the Weather websites on the net each morning at work. Especially fascinated with "World Satellite" on Intellicast. 4. Sometimes wear nylons with holes in them. 5. Never have seen the movie Casablanca. 6. Not a registered Democrat. 7. Love the song Lead Balloon. 8. Thought the movie "Clockwork Orange" was stultifyingly boring. 9. Snuck in private botanical gardens in the middle of the night and played Lazer Tag until I was 40 years old. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 16:34:53 EDT From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: hitler and jesus In a message dated 8/31/00 10:19:18 AM Eastern Daylight Time, sepstein@agmont.com writes: << I'm relatively new to the group- a bit of a lurker still, though I did post that I wish to invite both Joni and Van Gogh to my dinner party! >> well...i certainly missed this one yesterday. make sure you clear away any china or crystal from the kitchen table! patrick np. come in from the cold ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 14:48:48 -0600 From: Alison Subject: Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) > From: "Kakki" > 5. Never have seen the movie Casablanca. this seems to be a real problem for a lot of people on this list. maybe we should start an "i-havent-seen-casablanca-support-group-list" > 6. Not a registered Democrat. i'll let marcel take that one... > 7. Love the song Lead Balloon. SO DO I and it's not a dark secret imo. its a happy, out in the sunlight secret. > > 8. Thought the movie "Clockwork Orange" was stultifyingly boring. try the book....it could be worse. :-) alison e. in slc. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 22:16:58 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) Alison wrote: > > From: "Kakki" > > > 5. Never have seen the movie Casablanca. > > this seems to be a real problem for a lot of people on this list. > maybe we should start an "i-havent-seen-casablanca-support-group-list" > > > 6. Not a registered Democrat. > > i'll let marcel take that one... > > > 7. Love the song Lead Balloon. > > SO DO I and it's not a dark secret imo. its a happy, out in the sunlight > secret. Not only do I like it but I think it is my favourite from TTT, along with No Apologies. Kakki-what a fun time it must have been with Mr kelly etc. Lucky you! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 17:19:51 EDT From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: Marcel's Dark Secrets (vljc) 1) Im a radical liberal far left centrist Democrat 2) I skydive daily 3) I have a pet great white shark named Howard 4) Im a distant cousin of Michael Paz through a PO Box in Del Rio texas 5) Worship at the East Grand Discount House of Worship 6) Was so occult that they threw me out of the local Wiccan Chapter 7) Have written 25 songs about the worship of Gaia 8) Frequently hold Seances alone just to get myself together 9) Voted for Alexander Hamilton in three distinct elections 10) Have nominated IVPaul for Mr.Congeniality in the national Bert Parks sweepstakes 11) Sailed a U-boat to Argentina to present Wally Kairez with a new pair of ruby slippers 12) Voted for Bill Clinton after cheating off of Howard Ickes in the booth next to me 13) Dated Monica Lewinsky to no avail 14) Was introduced to her by Linda Tripp 15) Had to stop dancing with Janet Reno long enough to be introduced 16) Reached into my pocket to get my wallet which contained my business card to give her 17) Shook hands with Hillary Clinton who was also reaching into my pocket for my wallet 18) Now interviewing with a pest exterminator company in Washington D.C.for a job 19) In round the clock training for de-lousing old mansion-like buildings 20) Received orders to be at the back door of the White House on January 1-5, 2001. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 17:21:04 -0400 From: "cassy" Subject: Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) 1. I'd rather eat whipped cream from my husband's navel than out of the can 2. I pepper my literature with "trashy" novels 3. I pick my nose 4. I know more about sports than most of the men I know 5. I haven't a clue who John Kelly is So now you all know more about me than you cared to.... Cassy N.P. The original soundtrack from South Pacific ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 17:26:19 -0400 From: "Christopher J. Treacy" Subject: credibility Paul wrote:"I didn't bother to read beyond this because you lost all credibility with me right there." That's fine, Paul. I don't need your approval to go on, and furthermore, these are NOT supposed to be crowd-pleasing statements, but DARK SECERETS. If you continue to clench your butt cheeks this tightly, you may break something! Careful now!-Chris. ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 17:32:13 -0400 From: "Christopher J. Treacy" Subject: Macarthur Park Steve wrote:"5. It is hard to believe, but I never did purchase Donna Summer's version of MacArthur Park. My loss." I can provide you with a 17 minute solution to this problem. -Chris. ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 17:05:57 -0500 (CDT) From: michael w yarbrough Subject: Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) 1) I loved _Portrait of a Lady_. The book, not the movie. Though I love Jane Campion, but that's not a dark secret. 2) On that note, I think Nicole Kidman is a positively terrific actress. 3) I voted for the Libertarian candidate in the 1996 IL-01 Congressional race. 4) I failed a 7th grade science test on principle. The numbskull teacher insisted on called cumulus clouds the "highest" rather than the "tallest" type of cloud, and I refused to go along with his misuse of the English language for a mere grade. 5) I used to obsessively correct people's grammar in everyday conversation. 6) I sometimes fail to recognize men clothed whom I'd have no trouble identifying in the buff. 7) I sometimes fail to recognize men in the buff whom I really should have no trouble identifying under such circumstances. 8) I cannot remember the last time I listened to Joni. - --Michael NP: Evelyn "Champagne" King," _Smooth Talk_ - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's hard to be a diamond in a rhinestone world." - --Dolly Parton, "Tennessee Homesick Blues" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 19:32:29 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: A new idea & a new question 1/2 JC Did anyone watch the special Stand & Be Counted last week? I was so impressed with the story of Nelson Mandela who (correct me if I have any of the details wrong here) invited all his all jailers & previous political enemies to his inauguration ceremony. When one of them couldn't make the event, he went to their house to visit them. That is one compassionate & inspiring human being if you ask me. Here's a new question- Does anyone have a favorite opening line of a Joni song? My current favorite is "The wind is in from Africa, last night I couldn't sleep" (maybe that's two) ******************************************** Kate Bennett featured this month at Taylor Guitars www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/ www.katebennett.com www.cdbaby.com/katebennett www.amazon.com ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 15:28:53 -0700 From: Slac Subject: RE: stream of consciousness joni lyric exercise Peg wrote: > Any one? Okay Peg, I'll tack my two bits on the end. > > Nathan grumbled at the grey. "Buy the carphone, call the broker, > > every mean-streets kick-ass, all these jack-offs at the office, > > they're leaning on their spades , > eating sour grapes and smokin' fat cigars. How am I ever gonna know my home with this dark cloud above me? These are the clouds of Michealangelo cold water restrooms I've lived my whole life in clouds and vapor trails - -- Susan L.A. I am your angel ;~) HARLEY PARKING ONLY ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 19:05:03 -0400 From: "Patricia O'Connor" Subject: Re: A new idea & a new question 1/2 JC - ----- Original Message ----- From: Kate Bennett > Here's a new question- Does anyone have a favorite opening line of a Joni > song? My current favorite is > > "The wind is in from Africa, last night I couldn't sleep" That's a great one, my fave is; "No regrets, Coyote" Patricia O'Connor p.a.oconnor@att.net ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 19:49:41 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: A new idea & a new question 1/2 JC In a message dated 8/31/00 6:34:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, kate@katebennett.com writes: << Does anyone have a favorite opening line of a Joni song? >> Everything comes and goes, Marked by lovers and styles of clothes. Luckily the line hasn't hit home (the lovers part anyway), but I still like that opening. Jimmy, who's packing for Jonifest!!! Yeehaa!!! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 18:58:04 -0500 From: Richard Rice Subject: Hejira, You're da greatest baby!!! Hi gangland, What's all the fuss about labeling certain works greater than others? Sheesh. It's not as if you are telling your children you love one of them more than another. There's not a Titian I would not love to own, but I understand the importance of some of his works over others. His 'Portrait of an English Gentleman' was such a joy to see in person!!!! That beautiful creation cannot be oil paint!!! No way!! No how. I know what paint is, and I've never seen any get together and produce anything like that before! Even amongst the finest jewels, there are finer jewels to marvel. It just is. School of Athens, The Night Hawk, Arnofini's Wedding, A Starry Night, - --gee, some things just stand grand and tall. Without a shred of doubt, Hejira is Joni's masterpiece. Which is not to belie or put down any of her other spectacular accomplishments. Sure there's better singing, playing, inventiveness all over her catalogue, before and after. But this disk, as with Blue, stands because it has a wholeness to it that is supremely universal, is beautifully wraught, and is unquestionably unique in all the world. It is her finest poetry, perfectly realized with remarkable tonal painting. And I stick to my guns, even though I realize at least 2 of the songs are better realized on Shadows and Light, than here. It's not like one has to listen and worship this disk at the expense of others. BSN, TTT, TI get a great deal more 'airplay' from me than anything. But Joni's finest overing of ART to the world WAS Hejira. --Now, if I can only convince her to scrap the assinine next 2 projects, maybe she will give us something to top it.Wouldn't that be grand? And one comment towards the 'innovation' thread... Black Crow is probably Joni's wildest open tuning to date. There is NO precident for that one. What WAS she thinking when she cranked this one up??? Did she 'hear' the chords in her head or stumbled upon them??!!! What could possibly have compelled her?? One topic I would love to hear more about, from her and this great group of people, is HOW these tunings and shapes are generated. I know the early tunings were traditional open tunings. Then she started to 'investigate' making stops inbetween the traditional ones. She speaks of tuning the strings to certain sounds around her. These comments lend a great deal of information regarding her music. Obviously, she is being intuitive about the process, letting her imagination and inner critic follow along a path that is radom play. Still, you simply can't crack eggs and get something as remarkable as Black Crow, can one? Does she hear the chords and finds them, or does she find them and hear the chords??? --if you catch my drift. I'm thinking,"My god, the lady sold her soul to the devil." ...it's the only explanation I can think of, other than she was bombarded by Cosmic Rays. --And we all know what those can do. John, not Rich begging forgiveness for the spelling errors... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 20:21:21 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: credibility In a message dated 8/31/00 5:34:48 PM Eastern Daylight Time, magpie119@juno.com writes: << Paul wrote:"I didn't bother to read beyond this because you lost all credibility with me right there." That's fine, Paul. I don't need your approval to go on, and furthermore, these are NOT supposed to be crowd-pleasing statements, but DARK SECERETS. If you continue to clench your butt cheeks this tightly, you may break something! Careful now!-Chris. >> Chris, this was a post sent privately to you. It is against this list policy, and poor netiquette to post someone's private e-mail without their prior permission. There may be occasions where someone's private post was so offensive that it should be shared with the list. I don't think this post fits that category. Paul ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2000 01:43:54 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) > > > 4) I failed a 7th grade science test on principle. The numbskull teacher > insisted on called cumulus clouds the "highest" rather than the "tallest" > type of cloud, and I refused to go along with his misuse of the English > language for a mere grade. You are joking, yes? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 21:11:59 -0400 From: "Stephen Epstein" Subject: Re: A new idea & a new question 1/2 JC So many wonderful openings- one of my fave's: You wanna make Van Goghs, Raise 'em up like sheep....... a brilliant take on the difficulties of the artistic process NP Dog Eat Dog FMYFL@aol.com on 08/31/2000 04:49:41 PM Please respond to FMYFL@aol.com To: kate@katebennett.com, joni@smoe.org cc: (bcc: Stephen Epstein/Agmont) Subject: Re: A new idea & a new question 1/2 JC In a message dated 8/31/00 6:34:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, kate@katebennett.com writes: << Does anyone have a favorite opening line of a Joni song? >> Everything comes and goes, Marked by lovers and styles of clothes. Luckily the line hasn't hit home (the lovers part anyway), but I still like that opening. Jimmy, who's packing for Jonifest!!! Yeehaa!!! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 18:18:57 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Joni and Joan Baez correction > > > Hey, > > > > Not to sound like a correcting type of guy, but the song "Dida" that Joni > > sings on a Joan Baez album is on "Gracious a la vida" not "Diamonds and > > Rust" > It most certainly is. Here is the song list: > 10. Dida > 11. I Dream Of Jeannie / Danny Boy > > Jerry > I didn't know that Dida had been on "Gracias A La Vida' until the Covers Project came out. They are the same ditty but two different versions, apparently. Now I'm wondering why Joan B. decided to redo it for 'Diamonds and Rust'? Did she need filler and Joni just happened to be in the studio or what? Mark in Seattle (who is very sorry he posted anything about the J & H thread) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 18:56:02 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Dark Secrets (vljc) > > > > 4) I failed a 7th grade science test on principle. The numbskull teacher > > insisted on called cumulus clouds the "highest" rather than the "tallest" > > type of cloud, and I refused to go along with his misuse of the English > > language for a mere grade. > > You are joking, yes? > Michael? No, Colin, I don't think so. Love you, Mr. Y! Mark in Seattle (you too, Colin) ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #352 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list at ------- Siquomb, isn't she?