From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #220 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe onlyJMDL Digest Monday, May 29 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 220 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: The devil's chord ["P. Henry" ] Re: The devil's chord ["P. Henry" ] Re: Just wanted to share this..... ["lpeakes" ] Re: Least favorite [catman ] Twisted... [pat holden ] Re: Twisted... [catman ] Boston Herald review [Deb Messling ] A Night Like This: Joni Mitchell in Boston, 5/28/2000 ["mjf 2001" ] Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #285 [Catherine McKay ] Re: Joni in the Detroit News ["P. Henry" ] joe, new to list - concerts/internet - jc ["patrick leader" ] Re: the "mystery" of Hissing [B Merrill ] Re: Hartford Courant Review [Heather ] Re: Least favorite ["Jamie Zubairi" ] Re: Connecticut Concert May 27, 2000 [Catherine McKay ] Re: Least Favorite Songs [Catherine McKay ] joni dissed by judy collins? [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: Least Favorite Songs [catman ] Re: the "mystery" of Hissing [Catherine McKay ] RE: Joni in New York magazine [Catherine McKay ] Re: Just wanted to share this..... [Catherine McKay ] Saskatoon [susan+rick ] Re: the "mystery" of Hissing [Catherine McKay ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 00:03:03 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: The devil's chord Date: Sun, 28 May 2000 18:10:21 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: mark wrote: >Hey everyone, I can't remember if anyone came to the conclusion about what chord Joni was talking about when she said the 'devil's chord,' but in the report I did on Joni for my Music Apprecation class, my teacher called it a diminished 5th. He also noted that it was correct that it provoked doubt...> mark, I'm not sure if this relates but I recall years ago on one of those 'educational' spots they started doing on fm radio years back, somewhat like the 'the more you know' spots on nbc, they reported that scientific tests had been done, on humans, no less, and that it'd been found that the rhythm used in Queen's 'we will rock you' and also in Hendrix's 'foxy lady' measurably diminished muscle tone in subjects exposed to long, loud doses of it. interestingly also associated with hendrix is the primary chord (dis-chord?) from 'purple haze' which I have heard some refer to as 'the devil's chord' as well. there is an exposition on it, with sound samples at: http://www.experience.org/jimi/purplehaze/3.asp (one of the neatest artist sites I've ever seen!) and here's the text: There's a strange-sounding chord that many of us associate with "Purple Haze." It sounds like this. Once you start to recognize the sound, you hear it all over Jimi's playing. "Stone Free" is another example from Are You Experienced. A generation of guitarists grew up calling this the "the Purple Haze chord." What exactly is that sound? Jimi's playing and choice of equipment make up a big part of it... like the new "Octavia" he used for the first time on "Purple Haze." The chord itself is usually called a "seven-sharp-nine." Someone from Jimi's generation might have called it the "Hold It" chord, after the Bill Doggett tune that James Brown used to play so much. But, of course, it's been around forever. Where did Jimi learn it? We don't know, but he was playing it long before "Purple Haze." Just listen to his playing with the Isley Brothers on "Testify." The history of the 7 sharp 9 chord goes back a lot further than "Hold It." Here's an orchestral version, from the principle theme of William Grant Still's 1st Symphony. Jumping to the 1950s, Ray Charles builds "Lonely Avenue" around that 7 sharp 9 chord at the beginning of the tune. And jazz players were using the chord liberally, as on John Coltrane's "Blue Train," Miles Davis' "Kind Of Blue," and Jimmy Smith and Wes Montgomery's "James and Wes." Back in the rhythm and blues world, James Brown not only recorded Bill Doggett's "Hold It" as an instrumental, he used it as a segue between tunes throughout his live show in 1962. Another Bill Doggett instrumental that featured the 7 sharp 9 was "Backwards," featuring Billy Butler on guitar. If we had to guess where Jimi first picked up the 7 sharp 9 chord, these Bill Doggett tunes might be a good bet -- Jimi's boyhood friend Pernell Alexander recalls that he and Jimi were blown away by a Bill Doggett matinee show they attended in Seattle in 1957. By the mid-'60s, lots of rock groups had discovered the 7 sharp 9. The Beatles used it for the "The Word" in 1965, and The Byrds based the instrumental "Captain Soul" on the chord in 1966. By the end of 1966 it had become Cream's favorite chord for beginnings and endings, as shown on the album Fresh Cream by "I Feel Free," "Spoonful," and "Toad." Around that same time, "Stone Free" appeared on the flip side of "Hey Joe," and January 1967 saw the release of the Spencer Davis Group's "I'm A Man." Then "Purple Haze" was released March 17, 1967, and this sound became forever associated with Jimi Hendrix. cheers, pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 00:06:02 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: The devil's chord Date: Sun, 28 May 2000 18:10:21 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: mark wrote: >Hey everyone, I can't remember if anyone came to the conclusion about what chord Joni was talking about when she said the 'devil's chord,' but in the report I did on Joni for my Music Apprecation class, my teacher called it a diminished 5th. He also noted that it was correct that it provoked doubt...> mark, I'm not sure if this relates but I recall years ago on one of those 'educational' spots they started doing on fm radio years back, somewhat like the 'the more you know' spots on nbc, they reported that scientific tests had been done, on humans, no less, and that it'd been found that the rhythm used in Queen's 'we will rock you' and also in Hendrix's 'foxy lady' measurably diminished muscle tone in subjects exposed to long, loud doses of it. interestingly also associated with hendrix is the primary chord (dis-chord?) from 'purple haze' which I have heard some refer to as 'the devil's chord' as well. there is an exposition on it, with sound samples at: http://www.experience.org/jimi/purplehaze/3.asp (one of the neatest artist sites I've ever seen!) and here's the text: There's a strange-sounding chord that many of us associate with "Purple Haze." It sounds like this. Once you start to recognize the sound, you hear it all over Jimi's playing. "Stone Free" is another example from Are You Experienced. A generation of guitarists grew up calling this the "the Purple Haze chord." What exactly is that sound? Jimi's playing and choice of equipment make up a big part of it... like the new "Octavia" he used for the first time on "Purple Haze." The chord itself is usually called a "seven-sharp-nine." Someone from Jimi's generation might have called it the "Hold It" chord, after the Bill Doggett tune that James Brown used to play so much. But, of course, it's been around forever. Where did Jimi learn it? We don't know, but he was playing it long before "Purple Haze." Just listen to his playing with the Isley Brothers on "Testify." The history of the 7 sharp 9 chord goes back a lot further than "Hold It." Here's an orchestral version, from the principle theme of William Grant Still's 1st Symphony. Jumping to the 1950s, Ray Charles builds "Lonely Avenue" around that 7 sharp 9 chord at the beginning of the tune. And jazz players were using the chord liberally, as on John Coltrane's "Blue Train," Miles Davis' "Kind Of Blue," and Jimmy Smith and Wes Montgomery's "James and Wes." Back in the rhythm and blues world, James Brown not only recorded Bill Doggett's "Hold It" as an instrumental, he used it as a segue between tunes throughout his live show in 1962. Another Bill Doggett instrumental that featured the 7 sharp 9 was "Backwards," featuring Billy Butler on guitar. If we had to guess where Jimi first picked up the 7 sharp 9 chord, these Bill Doggett tunes might be a good bet -- Jimi's boyhood friend Pernell Alexander recalls that he and Jimi were blown away by a Bill Doggett matinee show they attended in Seattle in 1957. By the mid-'60s, lots of rock groups had discovered the 7 sharp 9. The Beatles used it for the "The Word" in 1965, and The Byrds based the instrumental "Captain Soul" on the chord in 1966. By the end of 1966 it had become Cream's favorite chord for beginnings and endings, as shown on the album Fresh Cream by "I Feel Free," "Spoonful," and "Toad." Around that same time, "Stone Free" appeared on the flip side of "Hey Joe," and January 1967 saw the release of the Spencer Davis Group's "I'm A Man." Then "Purple Haze" was released March 17, 1967, and this sound became forever associated with Jimi Hendrix. cheers, pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 03:16:52 -0400 From: "lpeakes" Subject: Re: Just wanted to share this..... > welcome valerie!!!! > there are quite a few of us here that love carole king too!>> Now, here's someone who's worked in the furnaces, stokin' the star-maker machinery, although not in the aspect of dealmaking - holed up in the Brill building, cranking out the hits - King's a disciplined tunesmith. "When the Jazzman's testifying, a faithless man believes" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 09:31:36 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Least favorite Sue Icouldn't agree with you more about Last Chance. i always skip it. Sue Cameron wrote: > > Hi all, > > Many songs that have been listed are some of my least favorite as well. > I mean, seriously, how many times can you listen to Ethopia consecutively? > > In that same vein Last Chance Lost just sort of grinds on me. The first few > strains of Joni's voice almost sound like a whinning child. Laaaaast chance > lawwwwwwst...Yikes! > > Sue Cameron ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 05:56:11 -0500 From: pat holden Subject: Twisted... Colin wrote: <> I love Twisted! It IS so much fun ... ever try singing along to it?? Cannot help but giggle all the way through! It is one of my favourites. I forget who wrote that? Can anyone 'help me'? *snicker* Mags - -- - --------------------------------------------------------------------- _~O / /\_, ___/\ /_ - ----------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:00:08 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Twisted... ever try singing > along to it?? all the time! and yes, i giggle too. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 08:35:13 -0400 From: Deb Messling Subject: Boston Herald review Mitchell charts new ground: Versatility shines with orchestra by Sarah Rodman Monday, May 29, 2000 Often when popular performers start singing standards and touring with 70-piece orchestras it signals the beginning of the end of their creativity. Last night at the FleetBoston Pavilion, folk icon Joni Mitchell's exquisite performance of Tin Pan Alley classics was simply the addition of another page to the rich and varied story of her musical life that spans folk, pop, jazz, avant garde, world music and now, with her latest release "Both Sides Now," a kind of large, economy-sized torch singing. As her album does, the first part of Mitchell's two-hour performance tracked the movements of a love affair from first thrilling crush to dashed-on-the-rocks despair and after intermission healing and tentative hopefulness with the aid of 12 classic songs, including two of her own. As Mitchell put it, it was time to "put down the guitar, get away from the piano and just sing." And sing she did in a voice that has become dusky and copper-edged with age. The 56-year-old Canadian native's soprano has gone from ethereal flute to smoky clarinet, its slight rasp and bright tone the perfect complement to these sepia-toned songs of jubilance and melancholy. The night began softly with the brushed drums and gentle strings of "You're My Thrill" and Mitchell singing lines like "You send chills right through me" with palpable excitement. Resplendent in an ornate and flowing red ankle-length coat, Mitchell made "At Last" a breezy caress with the aid of a bright and airy flute lending sweet charm. The noir-ish "Comes Love" - with its swaggering after hours brass and muted, foreboding trumpet solo - was the first sign of danger on this romantic path and "You've Changed" began illuminating the dark shadows as Mitchell sang "the sparkle in your eyes has gone." It continued from there with Mitchell heading to the bar for a conversational take on her own "A Case of You," blowing about in "Stormy Weather" and coming to the realization about the mercurial nature of life with her own "Both Sides Now." Mitchell also performed another handful of her own tunes with the local orchestra's crisp accompaniment including satisfyingly boppy "Be Cool," and the bustling jazz of "Hejira" and her I hate show business folk classic "For the Roses." Mitchell returned for an encore to a standing ovation. Just as we were leaving to meet deadline obligation we heard her break into a sassy take on Marvin Gaye's "Trouble Man." Deb Messling messling@enter.net http://www.enter.net/~messling/ ~there are only three kinds of people: those who can count, and those who can't. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 12:50:18 GMT From: "mjf 2001" Subject: A Night Like This: Joni Mitchell in Boston, 5/28/2000 "Once in awhile In a big blue moon There comes a night like this..." -Joni Mitchell, "Night Ride Home" It was the summer of 1978, I believe, when I last held a ticket to a Joni Mitchell show. Her concert scheduled at Colt State Park in Bristol, R.I. was cancelled, and my dream was dashed... I'll never quite forget how sad I was over this missed opportunity to experience Joni live under the stars. She has captivated me with her wit and creative genius since the release of "The Hissing of Summer Lawns". I had eventually made some sort of peace with that missed date. Somehow through the years, I guess Joni and I kept missing each other. Up until the release of her most recent masterpiece, "Both Sides Now", the thought of maybe never getting to see Joni perform was beginning to gel. She took care of all that tonight at the FleetBoston Pavilion in Boston, and in stunning form, she exceeded my every expectation. Joni's performance of her current "Both Sides Now" album took on a brilliance that's hinted at on the CD, but not as fully revealed. Her voice shone, and soared, and shimmered, and simmered! Joni is clearly having the time of her life singing these tunes, and in live performance, she truly gave them something that no one else could give.... she gives them JONI. As she moved with the music, seemingly slow-dancing with it, romancing it, caressing it, she swept us all away on her journey through the stages of romantic love. This is her time to "put the guitar down, step away from the piano and just enjoy singing, y'know ...", she told her warm and affectionate Boston audience at the start of the show. And sing she did, in beautiful voice and with exquisite styling and nuance. The FleetBoston Pavilion was the perfect venue for this production, with its beautiful outdoor harborside ambience enhanced by a cloudy and misty dusk sky. Joni's opening orange hooded ensemble illuminated the stage, as did her gracious smile and demeanor. Joni carried herself last night like a young girl who is very proud of a new dress, alternately showing off with a thrown-in scat or "doo-bee-doop", and giggling nervously to the audience, "...got carried away there!" Before almost every song in the now-standard set list for this tour, Joni stopped to address the crowd and introduce the song, taking interruptions from fans screaming her name and song titles in stride by simply saying "Much obliged", "Thank you", or "That's me!" "Comes Love", "Be Cool", and "Trouble Man" were swinging testaments to Joni's jazzy "coolness", and she torched on torch classics like "You've Changed" and "Stormy Weather" with all of the passion and conviction of Lady Day. It was the performance of her own material, though, that brought the Boston crowd to its feet several times, with frenzied applause and with over 10 bouquets presented to her from the front of the stage. Her performance of "A Case of You", which had a little more rhythm behind it than her most recent re-recording of this song, was pure magic. Time literally seemed to hang in the balance as she brought this song achingly to life, and in its new incarnation here on BSN it works beautifully. Her new version of "Both Sides Now", performed in the second set of the show, seems to have taken on a whole new life and meaning. Standing awash in multi-colored light in her second-set black pleated ensemble, Joni sang this classic triumphantly, proudly... there weren't many dry eyes in my row at this point in the show. It was the last set of five songs that I was looking forward to most of all: "Be Cool", "Judgement Of The Moon and Stars", "Hejira", "For The Roses" and "Trouble Man". Of these, I think I enjoyed "Judgement" the least; it sounded almost too grand and blasting as a full-out orchestral piece, losing much of its original intimate feel. "Hejira", however, was the jewel of the group. Bringing out Larry Klein (to yet another well-deserved standing ovation) to provide beautifully intricate bass work, Joni sashayed her way through this song's new rhythm and brought this piece to a new level of beauty and grace. I must say that during "For the Roses", when she pantomimed playing a guitar while singing the line about "the soundhole and your knee", I went absolutely cold. This song ("my I-hate-show-business song", she called it), was also beautifully done. Joni complimented the orchestra of talented local musicians several times throughout the course of the show, saying she wished she could bring them along everywhere ("We get a new band in each city we go to, just like Chuck Berry!", she quipped). She was clearly pleased with their performance of the material, and told the audience at the show's end, "Thank you, Boston. I'll always remember this night! What a special night... thank you so much for your flowers!" Every reaction that I heard from individual audience members was overwhelmingly positive... there was no grumbling over the guitar's absence, and everyone here seemed more than willing to let Joni show us her latest work HER way. For my part, I will always want to see Joni play a guitar, sing, or otherwise perform in ANY way she chooses. She is truly a legend and has earned my trust and respect as an artist and musician; I would happily follow her down any artistic road she leads us. This "Both Sides Now" show was the experience of a lifetime... I was honored to have been there and (finally!) enjoyed Joni's live magic. THANK YOU SO MUCH, Joni, for "a night like this" is one I will never forget. ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 06:09:46 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: Joni in the Detroit News cassy quoted: >...Joni Mitchell, having gotten hitched in the Mitchell back yard in Rochester, and was living with her husband in an apartment building called the Verona at the corner of Cass and Ferry. "We used to call it 'the castle' because the building was big and fortress-like," Landra Rosenthal says...> when I moved to this neighborhood in '68, Chuck and Joni had moved on but this building was still called the castle and had also become Detroit's best known commune. groups that played at the Grande' Ballroom at the time often stayed there and the diggers had set up a soup kitchen there for street people. the bands stayed there mostly because they could get as wasted as they pleased and not get hassled, including Janis Joplin, Cream, Jimi Hendrix and others. I lived in another commune down a couple blocks. >...After the festival - Joni said she'd written a new song and wanted to play it for us to see what we thought. So we went into their hotel room, and she sat on the bed and played us 'The Circle Game.' I was one of the first people on the planet to hear that song. She absolutely transported us with this amazing piece of writing." whoa! THIS is history! Chuck and Joni Mitchell began performing as a duo. "They played together," Rosenthall recalls, "but you were always aware of the two individuals. Chuck had his repertoire of Brecht art songs and traditional folk, and Joni had the things she was writing - I thought they were both incredibly talented, though in different ways." this is accurate and one wouldn't get this impression unless they'd seen them play live, up close and personal. from this I'd say this woman's account is authentic. thanks so much for posting this cassy! :o) pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 09:18:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #285 - --- NoeysMaMa@aol.com wrote: > :) I guess I should be able to get the lyric right > after 8 billion > listenings today... > > "Who in the world can this heart-(d/h/st)ealer > be..?" > > Knew I quoted it wrong as soon as the song came back > into my head. :) > By Jove, you may be on to something! Consider this: another facet of Joni's lyrics is that they can be heard/read in different ways by different people and still make sense (?) For some reason, in the Magdelene Laundries, I never hear, "They wilt the grass they walk upon/ They leach the light out of a ROOM", but rather "They leach the light out of the sun" - to me it makes perfect sense. (Never mind the fact that Joni - bless her! - always includes lyrics in her offerings. I've got rotten eyesight and can't read the teensy-weensy print on CD inserts, even with my coke bottle bifocals.) ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 06:39:33 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: Joni in the Detroit News david observed: >Hmmm....might that be the source of the line "I had a king in a tenement castle"?> wow! I can't believe I had all this first-hand info all these years and I missed this! no, not 'might', david, there's no doubt about it!!! *excellent* observation! :o) pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 12:01:52 -0400 From: "patrick leader" Subject: joe, new to list - concerts/internet - jc hey joe, welcome, finally, to the list! i loved reading your review, especially "patrick and his crew were absolutely crazed after sitting through the first act in the second row." so true! this seems to me a particularly jmdl story. when kay ashley and i sat in our lucky $60 seats at the tnt tribute, we sat with joe from long island, a passionate joni fan. told him all about the site and the discussion list, of course. great company for a great evening. so then this same joe goes up to wallingford for joni, ends up sitting next to simon, finds out they both know patrick from the jmdl, comes down and says hi! jmdl sychronicity. joe, however was wearing a fantastic long-sleeved white t-shirt from the tnt tribute. i didn't know such a thing existed. the only negative emotion i experienced at that concert was green jealousy over joe's t-shirt! les has reported that discussion list membership is up. i think just general visitation to jonimitchell.com must be way up, too. in new york and in wallingford i met folks who have been following the reports, keeping up with the site reviews and so forth. that's certainly part of why each audience has seemed more aware that the setlist isn't going to change. it's fascinating to me. patrick, still in a haze from the joni concerts... np - mimi - soak >From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of >joseph tischner >Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2000 1:32 PM >I just wanted to give a warm thank you to Simon, Patrick and Ashara for >befriending me last evening at the Joni show in CT. What a great bunch of >people! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 10:22:07 -0400 From: B Merrill Subject: seductive hissing At 10:24 PM 05/28/2000 -0400, Patricia O'Connor wrote: >Joni is the snake, metaphorically, hissing in the lawn, offering the fruit >of music and poetry, to make us question the "paradise" for which we've been >sold a bill of goods: the suburban ideal, the bohemian ideal, the >patriarchal ideal, political power, financial power, law, the devil, God, >charity, youth and physical beauty. Joni is the snake?? I'll have to think about that one... I see that this simile connects with your reference to our "fortunate fall" from Eden's naivete: >The best known snake is the one which resided in Eden, which convinced Eve, through the use of cunning language to eat a fruit from the tree of knowledge, thus to become conscious and capable of independent thought. But for me hissing links with the antithetic theme of the primitive. And also seduction: by the snake in Eden, by drugs, by affluence and swimming pools and groomed lawns, by romance and the erotic, by beauty creams. Hmmm, but maybe she looks kinda snakey & seductive in her bikini? Re the primitive, thanks for digging up that past extended riff, Mark. >Joni is Eve, becoming conscious and questioning the same things. > >"Don't interrupt the sorrow, Darn right" The counterpunch to the Kingpin. Bruce ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 09:46:17 -0400 From: B Merrill Subject: Re: the "mystery" of Hissing Hello David, Thanks for your comment. I take it that the most important aspect of Joni's liner notes is the beginning, when she announces that "This is a total work, conceived graphically, musically, lyrically and accidentally-- as a whole." She is directing her audience to appreciate it as such. This also the most extraordinary aspect of Hissing: the case that it is a whole, so much more than the sum of its parts. It is (for me) *by far* the most integrated "total work" of any other album I am aware of, by Joni or anyone else. But she does not lay out how and why it is-- graphically, musically, lyrically-- a total work. That is the "mystery" for us to figure out. Even tho she offers us "clues" concerning the "unfolding" of the whole, I don't see this mystery merely as a matter of puzzle-solving, a la Agatha Christie-- tho it does have this aspect of fitting different parts together, i.e. noting the thematic links that you find in the lyrics (as Mark, Patricia, et al have been pointing out.) There is no definitive final Christie "AHA," but a succession of smaller ahas as you are able to knit it together. And I don't see her attitude towards the interpretation of this album as so open-ended as you do, when you write: >>>> she intended to create a piece >that could be interpreted in many ways and on many different levels, >perhaps without herself even being consciously aware of all of them. <<<<<<<< True, she is >not "officially sanctioning" one >interpretations over others because she does not identify her notion of the whole. But, at the same time, in saying that it was "conceived... as a whole" she I believe she is underlining her conception (and pre-conception) and not leaving it open for anyone to interpret it as they see fit. It sounds to me as if Joni has a definite whole in mind. Bruce >On Sun, 28 May 2000, B Merrill wrote: >> Patricia, thanks for the exchange, but I still disagree with you: The >> "mystery" does not refer to the unfolding as opposed to the whole. As you >> note, we don't have any access to the history of the unfolding-- but Joni >> presents the mystery as a puzzle which we do have access to, which is for >> us to solve, aided by those clues. David Wright: >Hello Bruce, > I still am not really sure what you mean by the "mystery" of HOSL, >and the "clues" we're supposed to look for. Do you mean you think there is >some kind of Agatha Christie-type mystery concealed in the >lyrics/music/art of HOSL? ("Aha -- but the poison could not have been in >the band's beers, because Gail and Louise drank them!") I always took that >thing about "it is not my intention to unravel that mystery for anybody" >to simply be Joni saying that each listener's individual response to or >interpretation of the album (because there are many possible ones) is >equally valid -- that she was not "officially sanctioning" one >interpretations over others -- and that she intended to create a piece >that could be interpreted in many ways and on many different levels, >perhaps without herself even being consciously aware of all of them. > >--David ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 12:38:17 -0400 From: Heather Subject: Re: Hartford Courant Review I have to agree, Mark. I didn't get the Nelson Riddle(ness) flavor from the performance that writer Roger Catlin is referring to. For the most part, Catlin always writes pretty good reviews but I think he was off the mark here. I thought Joni with an orchestra was absolutely stunning and it was a performance that is engraved in this JMDLer's mind for a long time to come. I was really thrilled to be able to enjoy this performance with other giddy JMDLer's (Patrick, Ashara, the Chili's, Kenny, Jenny and Jackie). I apologize to my guests for not being over this stupid cold: (sung to the tune of Stormy Weather) why oh why must my sinuses be clogged (big sigh) stuffy heather .... In any event, I had a wonderful time! I could not take my eyes off Joni ! And when you are sitting that close she DOES make eye contact. That in itself made a very personal 'Joni evening' for me :-) I was infatuated by the way she moves her fingers with every song. I swear that during Ludwig's Tune she was playing the 'air' piano with her right hand. You can see and feel her emotions in every song! Simply wonderful! I could kick my self for not going to the Boston show (or one of the NYC shows). For Joni's next tour I'll know better ;-) As ever - Heather - who is off to take a nap :-) At 06:47 PM 5/28/00 -0700, you wrote: > > The liveliest arrangements of Connecticut-born Vince Mendoza, who >also > > conducted, added a Nelson Riddle pizazz similar to the in-studio >orchestral > > work of Sinatra in the '60s. > >Am I the only one who doesn't think the arrangements on Both Sides Now >sound like Nelson Riddle? To me Vince Mendoza's arrangements don't so >much have 'pizazz' as they have drama. The ballads remind me of the >scores of classic films composed by the likes of Max Steiner or >Korngold and the more swinging numbers have a lighter touch to them >than Nelson Riddle's stuff did. I think they're tailored very well to >Joni's persona & voice. > >Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 17:21:37 +0100 From: "Jamie Zubairi" Subject: Re: Least favorite Here we go I absolutely LOVE Last Chance and especially the intro. It's a little painfully wrought (I believe she's at the top of her chest voice here) and it aptly describes the painful end to a relationship, it's strained, it hurts, it's going out with a bang.) I admire her vocally in this song but I can't listen to it over and over because of the honesty that's going on in there. I love the harmonies she has going on underneath. It'a a simple song structure with not-so-simple emotions going on. I must admit to being a miserable git and liking the difficult songs to begin with.... Whether it's her and Larry or not, I'm not the one to do the conjecturing but it coincides and that's good enough for me. My 'least favourites' are usually from her earlier work, namely, 'Clouds' . Not many songs I can bear listening to from that album but sometimes the lines filter through my day... I Think I Understand is one of the best few and The Song About The Midway but only cuz she paraphrases Shakespeare... My least favourite must be Songs To Ageing Children, Chelsea Morning, Roses Blue (but described a so-called friend of mine about 10 years ago when I was into the early stuff). Jamie Zoob Oh BTW Sue, When are you coming UK way? August I here you mention? When when when? Much Joni! - ----- Original Message ----- From: catman To: Sue Cameron Cc: Sent: 29 May 2000 09:31 Subject: Re: Least favorite > Sue Icouldn't agree with you more about Last Chance. i always skip it. > > Sue Cameron wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > Many songs that have been listed are some of my least favorite as well. > > I mean, seriously, how many times can you listen to Ethopia consecutively? > > > > In that same vein Last Chance Lost just sort of grinds on me. The first few > > strains of Joni's voice almost sound like a whinning child. Laaaaast chance > > lawwwwwwst...Yikes! > > > > Sue Cameron > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:18:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Connecticut Concert May 27, 2000 This is a great review and I particularly LOVED this line! - --- PPeterson4@aol.com wrote: >The audience was 80% forty- and fifty- somethings. I >never saw so many wide >asses, pot bellies and grey hair in one place - I fit >right in! LOL! ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:16:27 -0400 From: "cassy" Subject: Joni/Detroit Preview The previous article I posted is now up on the web with a lovely diva-like photograph of Joni at: http://www.detnews.com/2000/entertainment/0526/jonimitchell/jonimitchell.htm and here is the latest article: Mitchell Brings up Standards Terry Lawson Detroit News Entertainment Section Sunday May 28, 2000 Linda Ronstadt might yet turn out to be one of the most underestimated pop artists of her time. Aside from influencing an entire generation of female country singers and bravely recording Spanish-language songs two decades before Ty Cooder reconvened the Buena Vista Social Club, it was Ronstadt who taught the remedial class in the Great American Songbook. CHANGING THE GAME In the early '80s, with punk and funk rendering California hippiness and prog-rock pretension, even the revered Joni Mitchell struggled to retain artistic credibility and relevance. While Mitchell attempted to impose her literate romantic riskiness on the blinded-by-science diagrams of such new-wave posers as Thomas Dolby, Ronstadt made a bolder move. Hooking up with Sinatra's most sympathetic arranger, Nelson Riddle, she recorded albums of the very songs rock 'n' roll had buried in the old folks' home. No one with an ear could argue that Ronstadt's readings of "What's New" and "Little Boy Blue" improved on versions by such big band singers as Anita O'Day or Rosemary Clooney, much less great interpreters such as Sinatra or Tony Bennett. Yet the familiarity of her voice, beautiful in its limited way, and the undeniable brilliance of the compositions had subtle impact. MAKING A SCORE Two decades later, everyone's on standard time. Everybody from country cowpokes to opera divas has cozied up to Cole Porter and rendezvoused with Richard Rogers, so Mitchell's belated dip in the well earlier this year with "Both Sides Now" appeared an afterthought. Only the ornateness of the orchestrations, and the presence of second-generation jazz giants Herbie Hancock and Wayne Shorter, argued for its significance. Mitchell is supporting "Both Sides Now" with an undoubtedly expensive tour that stops at Pine Knob on Wednesday. She will be accompanied by a 70-piece orchestra, which would impress even Sinatra and might have thrown Billie Holiday, whose late-period vulnerable-but-embraceable tone Mitchell emulates on "Both Sides Now," into a full-blown anxiety attack. What finally separates "Both Sides Now" from Ronstadt's rediscoveries of the greatest songs of the greatest generation is not only Mitchell's lovelorn, lived-in huskiness or her understanding devotion to the mature sentiment of a song. It's the fact that her most-recorded composition "Both Sides Now" (which even Sinatra covered), and the even better "A Case of You" turn out to be the best things on Mitchell's standards album. She's not just revisiting a romantic past, she's investing in it's future. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:28:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Least Favorite Songs - --- catman wrote (of "Come in from the cold": > 'bonfire in our soine' OK, I give up. What is a soine anyway? Catman, are you speaking French again? ;) ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:31:42 EDT From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: joni dissed by judy collins? From Richard Johnson's Page Six in today's NY Post: DIANA ROSS TICKET SALES IN A RUT DIANA Ross and Joni Mitchell may be as different musically as night and day, but when it comes to diva-esque behavior they can both belt it out. While such A-list entertainers as Bruce Springsteen and Tina Turner are asking for $67 and $150 (respectively) for their summer tours' top tickets - if you can even get them - Ross's "Return to Love" Supremes "reunion" tour seats are maxing out at an astounding $250 a pop. But foxnews.com's Roger Friedman reports that fans of the mercurial superstar aren't biting. As of last week, Ross's planned June 17 concert at Cleveland's Gund Arena had sold only 5,000 of its 14,000 seats. Similarly, Boston's FleetCenter had reportedly sold a scant 5,000 of its 19,600 tickets. And according to a spokesman at Atlanta's Philips Arena - where Ross is scheduled to play June 22 - ticket sales there are going "slow." Even in Ross's hometown Detroit, a source at the 17,000-capacity Palace says there are "plenty of tickets at all prices" available for her June 19 show. Insiders say that Ross fans are being put off by the fact that although her show is billed as a "Supremes reunion," neither original member Mary Wilson nor longtime Supremes substitute Cindy Birdsong is performing. Ross, who is reportedly being paid $15 million (plus a percentage of the box-office take) for the tour, offered a measly $4 million to Wilson, and even more paltry $1 million to Birdsong. "We're moving ahead, and sales have picked up," insists tour publicist Rick Gomes. "There are no plans to cancel any dates." In a similar what-goes-around-comes-around situation, "Circle Game" warbler Joni Mitchell is taking a few hits from her acoustically-inclined colleague Ju dy Collins over not getting credit where it's due. Collins, who bolstered Mitchell's career when her cover of Mitchell's "Both Sides Now" became a Grammy-winning 1968 hit, was inexplicably left out of the performer lineup for TNT's recent "All Star Tribute" to her folkie protegee. "No one called - not Joni, nor the producers," Collins told Friedman at Mitchell's Monday night Madison Square Garden concert. "And I made a bundle of money for her when I did ‘Both Sides Now.'" Asked to appraise Mitchell's shaky performance of standards off her new album, Collins commented, "Don't ask me about that." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 18:43:22 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Least Favorite Songs > > > 'bonfire in our soine' > > OK, I give up. What is a soine anyway? Catman, are > you speaking French again? spine! sorry-yrt another typing error ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:52:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: the "mystery" of Hissing - --- Alan Lorimer wrote: > All the discussion on this topic is great, > especially Mark's analysis but I > can't agree with "Boston Jim" that "The Kingpin" is > just an attractive, > local rich guy". To me: > > "Women he has taken grow old too soon > He tilts their tired faces > Gently to the spoon" > > indicates drug addiction. > I agree with the Tasmanian ;) The kingpin may be a *small-town* mobster, but he's still a mobster. Most of the time, as far as I'm aware, when someone refers to a person as a "kingpin", they're talking about Da Mob. This guy uses these women, gets them hooked on drugs, then dumps them when they start looking too old. ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:54:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: RE: Joni in New York magazine - --- Wally Kairuz wrote: > hon, take a break at once!!!! give that head of > yours a chance. > hug mc for me! > wallyk > > > MG - still trying to keep busy and ignore the > migraine pain. I'm up to > > laundry load #12 and the back of the fridge is now > spotless. > > Thank you for that Wally. MG's got me worried. God, if she can accomplish ALL THAT in mid-migraine, it's frightening to contemplate what she does when she's feeling good! Martha Stewart, watch your behind! ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:20:09 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: A great artist "It must be the mark of a great artist, a master, to create such timeless work, that has beauty and deep meaning for a 10 year old child, a college sophomore and for the same woman as she enters middle-age." Beautifully expressed! And yes, she is her own genre. If I could, I would take away genres anyway. My HUGE aplogies for my previous post where I forgot to delete the entire digest following my message. Kate Bennett Singer/Songwriter PO Box 31001 Santa Barbara, CA 93130-1001 email kate@katebennett.com website www.katebennett.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 14:11:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Just wanted to share this..... - --- catman wrote: > Valerie-how wonderful. A super hubby and tickets to > Joni. what more > could a girl ask for? I agree. Valerie, can we trade husbands? Mine probably wouldn't recognize Joni if he tripped over her (no matter how many times I've tried to make him see the light!) ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 14:13:38 -0400 From: "Patricia O'Connor" Subject: Re: joni dissed by judy collins? >No one called - not Joni, nor the producers," Collins told Friedman at >Mitchell's Monday night Madison Square Garden concert. Maybe they were afraid you'd want to sing. >"And I made a bundle >of money for her when I did ‘Both Sides Now.'" And Joni made a bundle of money for you when she wrote it. Patricia O'Connor p.a.oconnor@att.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 14:18:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: squeaky strings - --- Siresorrow@aol.com wrote: >on the squeek issue,,,,or is it squeak issue.... "squeak", but maybe we can change it to "skweek" ;) >i personally like hearing >them and have no problem with them. but i remember a >few years ago this >thread ran and a particular woman told me i was sick >if i liked the sound of >fingers on joni's recordings. to me they added >intimacy to the music. Oh brother, if anyone is "sick", I don't think it's you. I'm a skweek fan myself. Maybe I'm a squeak freak or a squeek geek. I like your wording: "they added intimacy to the music". You're right - the finger-noises do make you think you're right up close. Maybe that's what I like about it - when I first started playing guitar, I *aimed* to get those darn squeaks because to me, it just sounded really cool. (I was younger then, OK?) ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 11:47:03 -0700 From: susan+rick Subject: Saskatoon Hey all 'Tooners I recently received the program for the Saskatchewan Jazz Festival which is concurrent with the first few days of the Mendel show. Diane Krall is performing two nights, the first of which is the same night as the exhibit opening and at approximately the same time (8pm). The second is the following Sunday. If my extreme budget travel plans work out and I can get there, I plan to spend most of Friday night at the Mendel soaking in as much Joni aura as I can. I'm imaging that the place will be very crowded because it's free, everyone is invited, it's not that large a venue, and people are coming from very far away. Like someone else who posted recently, I'd like to go back when the gallery is a little less crowded for a more intimate viewing of the works. The Jazz Fest program also mentions an "big announcement on new headliners" coming in May, specifically for Saturday, July 1. Could this be.....? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 15:03:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: the "mystery" of Hissing - --- "James L. Leonard" wrote: > Hey, Alan. :-) > > I'll confess that the line you excised from "Edith" > (below) might create a > problem for my theory that the Kingpin and Harry are > the same guy. I'm may > be trying (and I should have admitted this in my > other post) to force the > proverbial square peg into a round hole, just so as > to make my imagined > "story" work. > > Who (or what) do you think the Kingpin is? Is he a > pimp? Is he a mobster? > How about you, too, Mark? Any theories? > OK, so you didn't ask me, but don't let that stop me! I think of Edith and Harry's wife as being friends from way back when, school chums, hanging out with Joni, Gail and Louise, and Chicky, Ron and Leadfoot Melvin. Harry's wife (we don't know her name) ends up marrying into the middle-class (I would say more like upper middle class) American dream when she snags Harry. Edith hooks up with this supposedly glamourous Kingpin guy - I see him as a small-time mobster in the illicit drugs racket ("Small town, big man. Fresh lipstick glistening". They're both prisoners in a way - Edith to her drugs and her mobster; Harry's wife to Harry and his house and his take-home pay. (Harry is a prisoner too, of the boardroom, the lifestyle, the trophy wife and her incessant need for yet more material things; it's possible that the Kingpin is a bit of a prisoner to Edith as well - "Edith and the Kingpin, each with charm to sway, are staring eye to eye - they dare not look away" - they may be equals after all, or at least, Edith thinks she can stand up to him, but she could be mistaken). I see Edith and Mrs Harry as having been good-looking girls with lots of dreams of the good life and how to get into it, gold-diggers possibly, or maybe just dreamers who have bought into certain lifestyle aspirations but, having arrived at the spot they thought they'd like to be in, they find it isn't all it's cracked up to be. They are disappointed. Scarlett, another one of the old crowd, still imagining herself as a young woman, has had affair after affair with numerous men without ever finding the perfect one. She may perceive herself as Scarlett O'Hara, but she's more Blanche Dubois than Scarlett O'Hara. She may be another disappointed middle-aged woman with delusions of grandeur, but she doesn't give up - listen to the air of finality and purpose as Joni/Scarlett finishes this song, declaiming: "A woman must have everything". This woman is "cast iron and frail, with her impossibily gentle hands - and her blood red fingernails." You wouldn't want to tangle with her! ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #220 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list at ------- Siquomb, isn't she?