From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #147 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, April 18 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 147 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Covers and Contributions Project ["Kakki" ] Re: Amazon.com sales ["Reuben Bell" ] Joni in People Magazine - a few pages later [WirlyPearl@aol.com] Re: Joni in People Magazine - a few pages later [Don Rowe ] Re: Una vita per Joni [Catherine McKay ] Joni Tribute [Bounced Message ] NEW AND IMPROVED FOR ALL YOU Alternate tuning nuts!! [Susan McNamara ] Re: Joni Fever on the Dot Coms [michael w yarbrough ] Re: k.d. and respect for Joni [catman ] Black Crow covers ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: k.d. and respect for Joni [IVPAUL42@aol.com] tribute casual ["Kate Bennnett" ] Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #198 "Im new" [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: What is everyone's favorite JM album? ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Joni's Tribute ["Mark or Travis" ] tribute show on the road! ["gene mock" ] This Just In!!! QUITE LONG (for me) [Michael Paz ] Re: Joni Fever on the Dot Coms ["Brenda J. Walker" ] Re: Record Biz 101 ["Kakki" ] Re: Record Biz 101 ["Brenda J. Walker" ] Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #198 "Im new" [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] tribute [MP123A321@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:03:00 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Covers and Contributions Project Joseph wrote: > Sharon Cuneta is a hugely popular movie and TV actress in >Manila. BSN is included in Sharon's latest "When I Love" >album and because she is as popular as the Philippine >President, I am glad that BSN will be embraced by her >legions of fans and will continue to be popular. I am glad that >Kakki likes her version of BSN. So does millions of Filipinos. Wow, thanks for the background, Joseph. I'm glad I did not know in advance that she was a huge pop icon - it may have colored my initial reaction. I'm glad you sent her to Bob (so to speak, that is ;-) And Helen - sorry I couldn't remember who it was who has been raving about Jacqui Fitzgerald, but I do recall the raves. She is really amazing - does she ever tour the U.S.? I'd love to do a music trade with you for more Jacqui. Hearing some of these covers makes me wonder if Joni knows or listens to all of them as they come out? Maybe we (Chili?) should also pass along the "Covers" boxset to her. I bet she'd like having them collected all together on CD. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:10:49 PDT From: "Reuben Bell" Subject: Re: Amazon.com sales You're right about this in terms of sales maybe, but I think that the spot on Amazon.com is measured by viewer interest, not strictly by sales. I think that for every copy of BSN sold through Amazon, there are additional hits to the site to see the cover, read the tracklist, listen to samples, etc. The number of hits that it took to bump this record to the #1 spot is incredible in itself, aside from whatever the sales figures may reflect. This album has also gotten Joni's name out in the general air again, with more to it than the ususal griping about the industry that usually masquerades as an Joni Mitchell album campaign. The fact that this many people are interested is incredible. How many of Joni's albums in the last 15 years have generated this much public interest? Reuben >From: "howard_scptv" >Reply-To: "howard_scptv" >To: joni@smoe.org >Subject: Amazon.com sales >Date: Tue, 18 Apr 00 14:09:43 -0500 > >first of all, I don't want to take anything away from JM but I have to say >this > >it doesn't take much to become a bestseller on Amazon.com. She's probably >sold a couple thousand copies--and that's good--but it isn't tens of >thousands >by a long shot. > >I know this because we are dealing with a book that jumped from No. 122,000 >to >No. 7 on Amazon's best sellers, after an appearance on Who Wants to be a >Millionaire. After a Today show appearance, it jumped to number two. In >all, >the book sold a little over 2,000 copies to get to that point. > >Don't get me wrong. I'm happy for the 2,000 sold and I'm happy for Joni's >rise on the charts. But she ain't gonna knock N'Sync out of the top spot >any >time soon. > >Howard M. > >Am I killjoy? > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:28:09 EDT From: WirlyPearl@aol.com Subject: Joni in People Magazine - a few pages later Hi again, I was flipping through the People Magazine a little further and there she is again...this time it's a fabulous full page ad that was also the large poster for the tribute concert...Joni in the sexy black dress holding her guitar, leaning against a black and white striped background. Definitely frameable and worth getting!! I wouldn't be surprised to see it on eBay soon. Someone recently sold a newsprint ad of the same thing for over $9.00. Go figure. Pearl ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:36:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Joni in People Magazine - a few pages later Yes I saw that too, and was thinking how odd that that image is being used to promote an album where, for the first time, I'm pretty sure, Joni doesn't even touch a guitar! Don Rowe - --- WirlyPearl@aol.com wrote: > full page ad that was also the large poster > for the > tribute concert...Joni in the sexy black dress > holding her > guitar ===== "I want a stillness inside, and a quiet of mind, and to stop dreaming of the comfort of strangers." -- Julia Fordham __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:45:26 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Tribute In a message dated 4/18/00 8:42:02 AM US Central Standard Time, RSTM@aol.com writes: << I am new to the list. Being a long suffering male Joni Mitchell fan, I really appreciated the entire show. >> Welcome Ron, from a fellow long suffering male Joni fan with a 13-year old. Watching the tribute with my son made it that much more enjoyable for me, like I was passing a torch of sorts. When JT played "River", my Nathan said that he didn't recognize it, so I'm not playing that record enough! :~) I informed him that Mr. Taylor was just making the song his own! ;~) Bob in Ess Cee ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:59:21 -0700 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Joni Fever on the Dot Coms Kakki wrote: >> > I think every unit sold counts toward the gold - Penny posted earlier that > the internet sales count in some way. Can't recall how Billboard gets their > numbers - from Soundscan? But I don't think they count every single sale. The Billboard chart reflects total sales including the internet. RR ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:00:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Una vita per Joni OK, people, I'm no translator and I've probably mis-translated a few of Angela's words, but even at that, I think I've done a better job than the Alta Vista translator. I certainly hope they're not using this in diplomatic negotiations or we're all in a s***-load of trouble! - --- Bounced Message wrote: > From: "Angela Incardona" > Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 19:20:06 +0200 > > Ciao a tutti quanti. Mi chiamo Angela, sono italiana > e soprattutto una > fan di Joni, sin dai tempi di Blue. Hello, everyone. My name is Angela. I'm Italian and, above all, a Joni-fan since "Blue". >La sua voce, la > sua musica e le sue > poesie mi trasmisero subito sensazioni che nessun > altro mai riuscito > a darmi. Her voice,her music and poetry make me feel like no one else has ever been able to. >Ho seguito nel tempo i suoi cambiamenti e > sempre ne sono > rimasta affascinata. Over time, I've followed her and I've remained fascinated. >Amo molto THOSL ed Hejira. I very much love HOSL and Hejira. >Ogni > suo album ha > segnato la mia vita e ha sottolineato i miei momenti > di felicit e di > tristezza. > Ciao > Each of her albums has been a part of my life and has underlined for me all my moments of happiness and sadness. [Note from Catherine, Ciao, Angela - benvenuta a la jmdl} ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:04:14 -0600 From: Bounced Message Subject: Joni Tribute From: "Ramcey tCH" Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:55:53 -0400 I thought the Joni tribute was amazing, like most of you. Unreal to see her getting all this attention after so many years and she seemed a little uncomfortable with it. Highlights for me was the incredible performance by Diana Krall, Sweet Honey in the Rock and Richard Thompson. I'm definitely in the minority (as usual) when it comes to Richard's version of Black Crow. I found it spell binding and unbelievably good. I honestly think that Joni prefers the artists to make the song their own, and he certainly did. And when she closed her eyes and lost herself in Diana's interpretation, it wasn't because she didn't like it! I think she was blown away. A great overall show and TNT should be commended. Ramcey tCH ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:16:25 -0400 From: Susan McNamara Subject: NEW AND IMPROVED FOR ALL YOU Alternate tuning nuts!! In case you haven't already heard, the spanking new web home of the Joni Mitchell Discussion List also includes a state-of-the-art search and enjoy database of all the Joni guitar tabs you could ever want in any way you want them. here's a look inside a Joniphile's mind: Gee, I've just been watching for the 15th time since Sunday the All-Star Tribute to My Own Personal Goddess, and I just flipped when I saw Wynonna playing You Turn Me on I'm A Radio. I wish I could play that song. I think I'll go to the Joni Mitchell Guitar Tabs page and see what Sue, Marian, Howard and Mark have been doing lately. WHOA! There's the tab, and it's in my favorite tuning open D. Gee, I wonder if I can list all the songs that are in that tuning so I can do my open mike set tonight? WHOA! There are fifteen songs in that tuning! I can play all night or until they start throwing stuff at me!! Gee, I wonder if I can simply retune my guitar to songs in a family of tunings (just like Joni did before VG-8). Let's check out the GENERIC tuning function. WHOA, I'm in heaven. Also there are many other Great Features on the new site, including lists of newly updated tabs, Howard's HOW TO's on tablature and Joni's notation style, and Marian's fabulous tuning patterns list. Also, Mark is working up a Joni Mitchell guitar FAQ that will try and answer any question you may have about her vastly inventive and peerless guitar style. In the "Coming Soon" category, Michael Paz is helping me with a VG-8 page that will be unveiled in the near future. I personally would like to thank over and over and over again the tireless work of my compatriots--Marian Russell, Howard Wright and Mark Domyancich, who more than any other beings I've ever met, love Joni's music and are sticklers for getting these files in their most perfect state (which is defined as "HOW JONI PLAYS IT.") Without their help, I don't know how this database would have been born. Also, thanks so much to Les, our masterly webmaster, for the wonderful opportunity to house these tabs in the place where they need to be, and for teaching us how to use the database software. It rocks!!! We would all love to hear your feedback, so please email us at guitarists@jmdl.com or me at sem8@cornell.edu. ____________________ /____________________\ ||-------------------|| || Sue McNamara || || sem8@cornell.edu || ||___________________|| || O etch-a-sketch O || \___________________/ "It's all a dream she has awake" - Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:52:45 +0100 From: "Matthew Hall" Subject: Re: k.d. and respect for Joni I can't believe that this topic is getting so much attention, however, I will now proceed to add to it: I think that kd lang showed enough respect for Joni simply by turning up to sing one of her songs. I don't believe for one second that she would dress like that just to get noticed; she has a voice that will do that for her. With regards to image and talent, I don't think that the two go hand in hand; they are separate entities, and whilst image (and money) is what makes the wheel of publicity go round (and round), there still has to be some sort of axis at the centre of it otherwise it will just spin into nothing. So I think you are doing Madonna a great injustice to presume that her success over 17 years is based wholely on her hairstyles and fashion sense. It is also rather insulting to me as a fan to suggest that her music is simply a by-product of her fame; over the years I believe that Madonna has been just as daring as Joni in the musical choices she has made. There are plenty of people in this world with interesting fashion sense and strong opinions (I daresay many of them belong to this list) but the reason Madonna gets noticed is because of her enduring popularity as a singer/songwriter/producer/performer. Just listen. Matthew (now thinking of a suitable Mick Jagger quote to convince everybody that my opinion has substance). NP: Tidal - Fiona Apple - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2000 6:08 PM Subject: k.d. and respect for Joni > > In many cultures, a sign of respect is the removal of your shoes before > entering a home, a temple, before walking on sacred ground. Ms. Lang's lack > of shoes before Joni could be considered an act of reverence and submission. > > More realistically, I think k.d. did it to get noticed. I thought what she > was wearing was very manly and she reminds me of all my straight male friends > whose unironed clothes she could have been wearing that night. That's par t > of k.d.'s act, to be an out lesbian and butch it up. It really works for > her, gets people to notice her, and it's marketing as much as it's an > exaggerated expression of who she really is. She's an amazing talent, but > that isn't enough. Someone like Madonna, who has a minimum of talent ("a > thimbleful of talent in a sea of ambition" - Mick Jagger) succeeds only > because she always gets people to talk about what she's wearing, what she did > to her hair. If you ask me, what k.d. wore and didn't wear was an extension > of her persona. She works her masculinity the way Cyndi Lauper works her > own fun, goofy idiosyncrasies. > > I think k.d.'s singing was pristine and heartfelt and she only honored Joni. > I don't know that Joni ever sang in bare feet, but we've seen plenty of > pictures of her without shoes, especially in the hippie days. And Joni is > awfully fond of sandals that exhibit her feet with their red painted toe > nails as recently as two years ago. > I noticed a general lack of glitz in the outfits of all the musicians which > is fine with me. That places the emphasis on the music, not on image, and > the focus remained on Ms. Mitchell. > > - Clark > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:26:29 -0700 (PDT) From: zapuppy2@webtv.net (Penny) Subject: Re: Joni fever on the dot coms <> Although I was having a blast watching other sites too, I was posting what was happening on Amazon, largely because they update hourly. It was like watching a really good day on the market!! ;-D Here's the most current stats I've found: From Amazon, which Billboard lists as the leading online music store. And this site's weekly bestseller lists are based on shipments. (Their latest weekly chart listed (4/8/00) has BSN at number 6) Their latest hourly top sellers list Joni's as follows: 1.....BSN (it's remained there since Sunday afternoon) 21....Blue 27....C&S 36....Hejira 40....Hits 57.....LOTC 79.....FTR These sites update daily and this is what they show currently: Barnes and Noble......BSN....#4 CDnow........BSN.....#13 And Tower also updates daily and they base their rankings on chainwide sales: BSN....8 Blue.....172 Hits.......223 C&S......225 LOTC....315 Hejira....426 Clouds...427 MOA.....499 HOSL...541 FTR......676 STAS....901 TI..........903 (all of these place higher on their chart then when Patricia O'Connor posted them yesterday) <> Me too!! ;-) That's why I posted last week if anyone knew of a source where we could get actual numbers, instead of just charts. I didn't see a reply to my question. Does anybody know? I can only find real numbers on a hit and miss basis. Randy Remote, do you know? Regardless of how huge or small the sales have been, in my minds eye, just the fact that there has been a dramatic increase of movement in Joni's albums, gives me a lot of encouragement about her not being so dismissed, sales wise, in the general public. ;-) Penny :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Grace dies when it becomes us versus them......Philip Yancey ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:47:49 +0100 From: "Jamie Zubairi" Subject: The JMDL site Hello all While not being able to talk about the Tribute Concert LIVING IN ENGLAND!!!! I was wandering into the JMDL site. I was there yesterday and nothing had changed but today!!!! It looks great! I even posted to Mark regarding a couple of things! And THANKYOU Les for making me not my Dad, the member of the JMDL! (a little bit of humour passed betw us, as when I was first on the list, I used my Dad's email, since he never used it, so it stuck for two years on the site that Hassan Zubairi was the member not Jamie... oh little things please little minds... I'll be even gladder when the Gallery is up and running. The guitar site is astounding indeedly-do. Jamie Zoob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:49:32 -0500 (CDT) From: michael w yarbrough Subject: Re: Joni Fever on the Dot Coms Gold, platinum, etc. awards are bestowed by the Recording Industry Association of America and are based on albums shipped, not albums sold. It is up to the record company to submit an album for the award and pay a fee once it qualifies. Billboard sales rankings are based on Soundscan figures of albums actually sold. I am about 80% sure that internet album sales are also included in these figures. In the larger context of things, Internet album sales are still tiny, but are sure to become more significant over the next few years. Generally speaking, however, the inclusion or exclusion of those sales would make little difference in the weekly Billboard ranking. Of course, for artists like Joni who probably aren't selling over 20K albums a week but whose fanbase is more wired than avg, it may make a slight difference. But not more than 10 spots. Record club sales do not count toward Billboard rankings. The mechanism of keeping track is just too slow. Furthermore, these albums have always been out for some time before they reach the clubs, so they are generally no longer hot sellers in the stores. (Shania Twain et al excepted). So again, these totals would make not a lot of difference in Billboard rankings. BUT these totals are reflected somehow in record certifications of gold, etc. Since the clubs generally manufacture the CDs, etc., themselves, I am not sure if they report a # manufactured or a # sold to qualify for gold status. But they do play a role in there somewhere. RE: TV specials. I do not know how TNT operates, but it is probably somewhat similar to MTV, where standard operating procedure is that the record label pays production costs for the special, MTV promotes it, and MTV retains copyright ownership after it's done. The production costs incurred by the record company are then recoupable from artist royalties. All of this is, of course, subject to negotiation, and in-demand artists and their labels may be able to extract more from the network. My guess is that Reprise paid for the production of the special, TNT paid for promotion, TNT now owns the show, and Joni owes Reprise for the production costs but benefits from the free TNT promotion that is also in effect promotion of her album. All of this I learned in dribs and drabs as an ardent music fan, so while it is mostly accurate, don't quote me on it! :-) - --Michael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:08:39 -0700 From: Phyliss Ward Subject: Re: k.d. and respect for Joni Matthew Hall wrote: > I think that kd lang showed enough respect for Joni simply by turning up to > sing one of her songs. We should also note that K.D. showed up for PWWAM and the LACE opening. I didn't care for what K.D. wore for the tribute, it was just....well...sloppy, and certainly wouldn't be my choice. She looked much nicer at the other 2 events On the other hand, it didn't bother me either. In my mind, Artists are suppossed to be unique and creative in the way they dress. Joni certainly is, although I prefer her taste to K.D.'s. But then I prefer her music too. Phyliss, who is reminded of being shopping for clothes shortly after she decided to put the business world on the back burner and become an artist. A friend told her to buy something not the norm for her. "You're an artist now" she said, "you should dress more artsy". : - ) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:15:12 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: k.d. and respect for Joni but the reason > Madonna gets noticed is because of her enduring popularity as a > singer/songwriter/producer/performer. Matthew-I think this may be precisley why Madonna gets trashed. It has nothing to do with her talent or lack of it. It has everything to do with her success and popularity. There are people who will trash anything that is popular because they feel they have superior taste to the common heard. Personally, I have liked a few of her hit singles and own one album Ray Of Light which I really enjoy. To say she has no talent is ludicrous. That Mick Jagger should say this makes me laugh when i consider the awful racket he makes! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:40:08 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Black Crow covers And I like Bryan Thomas'es Black Crow best of all- better than Joni's even. dax said, "I love Cassandra Wilson and I must say that I like her version of BLACK CROW better than Thompson's" All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu near Cincinnati ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:42:40 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: k.d. and respect for Joni In a message dated 4/18/00 5:19:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jim50@hall7068.freeserve.co.uk writes: << Matthew (now thinking of a suitable Mick Jagger quote to convince everybody that my opinion has substance). >> ANY Mick Jagger quote would certainly destroy your credibility in my eyes. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:37:14 -0700 From: "Kate Bennnett" Subject: tribute casual When I saw how casually everyone was dressed I thought it was very cool because it gave the tribute an air of sincerity and intimacy as opposed to those other award shows where people dress as weird as possible to get attention? In my opinion the downplay on fashion showed respect for what it really was about- the music. And as a performer I can tell you it really is important to me comfortable because performing is a very athletic event. I too, love performing barefoot, too- its kind of grounding in some a way. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:01:20 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #198 "Im new" In a message dated 4/18/00 12:21:00 PM US Central Standard Time, m_hicks@aiken.k12.sc.us writes: << I'm just glad to be here. I am looking forward to "being with" people that have this taste for music. >> Hiya Mike! And welcome to the list! I couldn't help but notice your e-mail addy...are you in Aiken, SC? Is there actually ANOTHER South Cackalackian here? :~) Anyway, I taped both showings of the special Sunday night. If you want one of the copies, e-mail me and we'll work it out! Bob NP(Now Playing): Judy Collins, "BSN" (just doing quality checks on my copies!) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:12:54 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: What is everyone's favorite JM album? My favourite Joni Mitchell > album is always her next. The reason is because each of her recordings has > left me > wanting more. The human soul can never get enough of what it desires the most: > beauty, meaning, truth - in short, all those qualities that define Joni's work. I bought BSN the day it came out. And now I wait with a > worm on > my tongue (bated breath, ha!) for her next album, already my > favourite. Joni has > left me wanting more yet again. > > Cheers to all Joni listers. Perhaps I'll join again once the summer rolls > around. Cheers to you, John in Edmonton! This is exactly the way I feel about Joni! Mark, wherever he is, whose favorite Joni album is *not* HEJIRA *or* FOR THE ROSES ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:20:20 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's Tribute << Hi everyone! I'm back!>> Welcome back, Sherrelle!! << I was really blown away by Cindy(sp?) Lauper's version of Carrie. >> Glad to see that somebody besides me misspelled the title of Joni's song...that's the perils of being a music & a movie fan I guess! :~) <> Michael's a good guy, does lots of fundraising and stuff, but I can't believe he had the nerve to re-record "Dock of the Bay" & "When a Man Loves a Woman"...like Otis Redding & Percy Sledge didn't do the songs justice the first time 'round? Bob NP: LA Express, "Nordic Winds" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:49:38 -0700 From: "Kate Bennnett" Subject: Tribute Musings My happy surprises were Wynonna & Brian and Elton- did not expect any of them to be as good they were. My top favorite performances were Cyndi, Diana, and Shawn & Chapin on Amelia but the first one they did seemed over produced by the band which drowned out their beautiful harmonies (hear them acapello to know what I mean- goose bump material). Ashley was adorable and sincere, Hilary was the opposite. Sweet Honey were great, James made River his own but why change long to wide? Loved the preview of kd ("bitch to sing this son") then she proceeded to miss the interval change entirely- endearing moment I thought. I agree that many performances seemed slightly hesitant as if needing some more rehearsing. But really the whole event was just wonderful and I sat through it twice. The most wonderful unexpected thing happened during the show. I was in tears a lot, trying not to let it be known too much and looking over at my husband (whose musical tastes are quite different from mine and who was watching because I asked him to) who had TEARS in his eyes listening to Carey especially. He said that one really hit him emotionally and so did Case of You and he loves River (is it because I play live every Christmas?). He is a songwriter too, and I could see for the first time he really GOT Joni's brilliance as a songwriter. Oh yes, I also loved Susan S's speech- was she the one who spoke of the redemptive quality of Joni's songs- - that is it! And of course watching Joni watch the others, and then singing Both Sides Now. And really feeling the words, especially the chorus I thought. Kate Bennett Singer Songwriter kate@katebennett.com www.katebennett.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:34:27 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Joni's Tribute > All in all, it was so nice to know that others in the public spotlight > feel the way we do about Joni. Thank you TNT for bringing this to us! > Take care everyone!!! > Sherelle! Welcome back! {{{{{Sherelle}}}}} Mark in Seattle (just so Sherelle knows who it is!) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:45:18 -0700 From: "gene mock" Subject: tribute show on the road! think we can get tnt to put the joni tribute show on a road tour? WOW! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:52:23 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: This Just In!!! QUITE LONG (for me) Hello Folks- Yes it's me the (in)famous Michael Paz coming to you LIVE from just outside (in the swamp) New Orleans. I just wanted to let all the newbies know what is actually going on in the world as we know it. BTW welcome all you newbies even you folks who have different tongues (that was a sexy post from Italy {thanks for the translation but I kinda enjoyed thinking I knew what she was saying}). JONIFEST2000 New Orleans is a tribute-celebrationOmusicOjoni-fundraiser for charity-fundraiser for jmdl.com and jonimitchell.com-memorial to our beloved Wally-get together-open mic-.... you get my drift. Anyway, it all starts on Friday May 26 in my home with a party for jmdl and their guests only party, followed by a gourmet dinner in the French Quarter on Saturday (and certainly much more music and general disruptiveness in general) and a Brunch/JMDL ONLY concert at the the Howlin' Wolf on Sunday at noon (or whenever we get there from the party the night before) till 4pm when we will regroup (and do costume changes, blood transfusions (yes Keith Richards and Marcel Deste are rumored to be attending), and other necessities. At 8pm sunday night at the Howlin Wolf will be the *TRUE* ALL STAR TRIBUTE TO JONI MITCHELL. This will feature artists from ALL OVER THE GLOBE with a heavy input from my musical brothers and sister from the great state of Louisiana. WATCH FOR DETAILS ON JMDL.COM!!! (thank you Les) This will run till 12 midnight or so (depending on how good of a stage manager/producer I think I am) when BY POPULAR DEMAND I will be forced to open the mic up to anyone who wants to sign up and do something. Since I let out the press releases (which haven't even been interpreted to print yet) the freaking phone is ringing off the wall with "I wanna do that" "How come you didn't call ME" "I'll (insert promisary anything here) if I can do (insert any of the following: Case of You, Blue, All I Want, Carey, Circle Game....) You get the idea. Anyway a host of New Olreans talent is already booked like: Jason Marsalis, Anders Osborne, Theresa Anderson, Little Queenie, Leslie Smith, Brian Stoltz (The Meters), Billy Gregory (It's A Beautiful Day), Kim Prevost & Bill Solley, + many more. We will also be featuring perfomances by a ton of the jmdl list members that I will not name yet as the list has been expanding ( and I think I should leave that announcment to our MOST humble leader), but I will leak that are coming as far away as England, Vienna, and Buenos Aires (we be INTERNATIONAL). While I have been informed that I am lean TOO much towards towards the music (DUH!) there will be other stuff going on like contests, prizes, games (this is TOO deep to go into in this forum), LIVE discussions, Joni Mitchell guitar lessons, etc. While I would love to tell you that Joni will be sitting in the balcony holding court over the proceedings, I cannot, she will be in Boston with ASHARA (AND ENTOURAGE) IN CONCERT WITH & 70-SOMETHING PIECE ORCHESTRA. I DO promise some surprise guests and a wonderful time amongst a family that has become as important to me as blood! I have a meeting this week with another sponser that I am negotiating with to do a LIVE web cast of the event. I am hoping this will come thru (true). My next goal will be to get a monitor backstage at the concert in Boston so I can show Joni, Ashara and the gang HOW we do it in New Olreans. Come on you TV producers and movers and shakers and help me get this happening. Maybe we could get a big screen set up and have a simulcast sent to us as "frosting on the King Cake" of Joni doing "Case of You" FROM BOSTON. OH YEAH BABY!!!!!!!! Ok wake up Paz. Anyways, I am multitrack recording this for archival purposes and the whole thing is being shot on CAMERA by Jim Lamadoo (of the Cinncinatti Lamadoo's). And the plan is to video tape it as well, even though that Plan "A" looks doubtful right now. I have blithered on like this to try and give you fence post people ( AND NEWBIES) a chance to make reservations come on down to New Orleans (where we have special rates at downtown hotels {$99 at a $180 hotel}). ESPECIALLY if you ever wanted to play a tribute show to the most wonderful songwriter of ALL time. If you are so inclined to sign up, please email me privately or sign up at jonifest2000neworleans@egroups.com . I am SO excited about this happening and I think it is going to be "one to remember". Thanks to everyone who has encouraged and supported this effort. Michael Paz P.S. Notice that I am goin to a NEW email address at michaelpaz@telocity.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:57:12 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Crinkly Dress THIS JUST IN! OH MY GAWD! I have just found out that crooner and musico extrodinaire, Marcel Deste, will be having several costume changes during his set and according to my sources at least one outfit will be a "crinkly number" that he borrowed from an undislosed "queen" from our very own list. Stay tuned to this channel for more info on this developing story. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:05:50 -0700 From: "Brenda J. Walker" Subject: Re: Joni Fever on the Dot Coms Hi! I'm Brenda. I'm new to the list but a huge Joni fan. I joined after reading the news about Wally. Just want to stay up on all things Joni. Although I've moved out of the business last year, I worked in the music industry at major labels for more than ten years and can shed some light on some of these issues. michael w yarbrough wrote: > Billboard sales rankings are based on Soundscan figures of albums actually > sold. I am about 80% sure that internet album sales are also included in > these figures. In the larger context of things, Internet album sales are > still tiny, but are sure to become more significant over the next few > years. Generally speaking, however, the inclusion or exclusion of those > sales would make little difference in the weekly Billboard ranking. > Online sales are included in Billboard numbers. I've heard different estimates for what portion they make up. Some say as low as 3%; others say as high as 9%. They would only make a difference in the Billboard ranking if there was a huge increase. > Of course, for artists like Joni who probably aren't selling over 20K > albums a week but whose fanbase is more wired than avg, it may make a > slight difference. But not more than 10 spots. It's unlikely that online sales would generate much of a shift in the chart unless you're in the lower parts of the chart. For instance, the Very Best of Cat Stevens is at 196 with 6,985 sales for the week. An increase of 1,000 units would move him to 177. Joni's sales for the week ending 4/9 were 14,860. It'll be interesting to see how the tribute effects the sales. We really won't know until next Wednesday when sales for this week are reported. (I have access to Soundscan and would certainly report sales to the list for anyone interested.) BTW, opening week sales for the regular package were 18,079. There were 5,500 copies of the special package sold. Without the special box, she would have undoubtedly sold more than 20K that first week. But then we wouldn't have the box to enjoy! : ) > Record club sales do not count toward Billboard rankings. The mechanism > of keeping track is just too slow. Furthermore, these albums have always > been out for some time before they reach the clubs, so they are generally > no longer hot sellers in the stores. (Shania Twain et al excepted). So > again, these totals would make not a lot of difference in Billboard > rankings. > > BUT these totals are reflected somehow in record certifications of gold, > etc. Since the clubs generally manufacture the CDs, etc., themselves, I > am not sure if they report a # manufactured or a # sold to qualify for > gold status. But they do play a role in there somewhere. My understanding was that they report the # sold. However, record clubs are on the wane, and it's unlikely that they will be much of a factor at all in the future of the business. > RE: TV specials. I do not know how TNT operates, but it is probably > somewhat similar to MTV, where standard operating procedure is that > the record label pays production costs for the special, MTV promotes it, > and MTV retains copyright ownership after it's done. The production costs > incurred by the record company are then recoupable from artist royalties. > All of this is, of course, subject to negotiation, and in-demand artists > and their labels may be able to extract more from the network. My guess > is that Reprise paid for the production of the special, TNT paid for > promotion, TNT now owns the show, and Joni owes Reprise for the production > costs but benefits from the free TNT promotion that is also in effect > promotion of her album. This really depends on how the deal was structured. Since there were "sponsors" of the special, that time was sold to cover production costs, with TNT keeping the "advertising" revenue. If Reprise paid for any part of the special, then they own it not TNT. TNT would have a broadcast license for a certain period of time and for a certain number of airings. It's highly unlikely that the expense of the production is recoupable for Joni against her record sales. They probably have plans to release it at some point as a video and would recoup against the video. I used to work with the President of Warner Records and could certainly find out, if anyone wants to know the details. Or at least as much of the details as he will part with. Brenda ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:09:20 EDT From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: TNT Hi Folks, I'm new to the list. I've enjoyed reading the past few posts regarding the Tribute concert. I was one of the lucky souls to be there for the live performance. It was wonderful seeing Joni there just enjoying all the attention being given her. During one of the short intermissions I got up the courage and walked right up to her, introduced myself and shook her hand. I could not believe no one stopped me. I was determined though. She was eating a banana and I do believe she got some on my hand. Needless to say that hand didn't get washed for a while. She couldn't hear a word I said, but appreciated the gesture nonetheless. What I was trying to say to her was how grateful we all were for what she had done for Wally. I'm a huge supporter of the homepage. She really is a kind person. After that I could hardly contain myself. I was shaking so bad and had to step outside in the night air to have a smoke and ask myself if it was all a dream. I went back inside and wasn't interested in any of the performers except when "Joan the Bone" got up there to sing Both Sides Now. Why did JT call her that? Does anyone know? Funny huh? JT has always been one of my favorites. I love that mans voice and fine guitar strumming. I only wish he wrote more songs. What frightened me a little is how some of these people aged. Even Joni. Seeing her up close I studied all the lines on her face. She's still a beautiful lady though. SIQUOMB, isn't she. I love her dearly as I know all of you do too. Any fans of Joni are certainly a friend of mine! I loved Cyndi Lauper's rendition of Carey. I'll be at the BSN concert at MSG on the 22nd. Would not miss that one for the world. Maybe I'll meet some of you there. Later... Rose from New Jersey ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:11:52 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Party/Fest List I have recieved quite a ferw requests for a list of everyone that is coming to the fest in New Orleans. Here it is: Chuck and Barb WallyK MG CatGirl + eric Bob Muller Kakki Terry M Marian Steve and Leslie Mixon waytoblu@mindspring.com (Victor) +Holley Ric Jimmy FMYFL@aol.com Lori Hakulinen lorireason@hotmail.com Les Irvin Barbara Burst Marcel and Soizec Jerry Notaro (26, 27, 28, with Steve) Steve polifkas@milwaukee.tec.wi.us Julius Mills Bill Dollinger Pearl and Steve Medric Faulkner megg56@yahoo.com + Clifton Phyliss Ward (pward@lightspeed.net) David Lahm Brian Thomas Jim Lamadoo Bern Bern44105@aol.com Dan Haas (Kleronomos@aol.com) Jody (johnsonjs@earthlink.net_ Clark Craig Happy The Man John Van Teil If you ARE coming and I have had somne sort of brain malfunction please notify me asap. Here is alist of people who regretfully have had to cancel. I hope there will be no more on this list, but also please advise. BTW Harper Lou people have been screaming because you cancelled! The artists are always the ones that are missed the most! I hope you folks that cancelled can work things out to change things around AGAIN! Cancelled: Brett Code Julian51469@aol.com + wife Rick Hobbs AngelinoCoyote@aol.com Harper Lou Ashara&Sal Julie Webb ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:22:50 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Record Biz 101 Forgive me list for further engaging my nerdish tendencies ;-) Randy wrote: > The Billboard chart reflects total sales including the internet. The dilemma with Billboard basing their numbers on Soundscan is that it really does not pick up and record every single record sale because Soundscan is not used in many of the non-chain, mom and pop, indie stores or as Michael indicated, the record clubs. Even where Soundscan is used, there is still a margin of error due to the occasional technical problems, mis-scans, non-scans, etc. And how are all the non U.S. sales recorded? The chains in non-U.S. countries may be using Soundscan or something equivalent, but the total sales again may not be picked up from merchants who do not record them or use Soundscan. I suppose an argument can be made that it gives a "best guess" average total and at least they are picking up the internet sales, but I don't think Billboard should be taken as the absolute, final authority on real total numbers. Michael wrote: > RE: TV specials. I do not know how TNT operates, but it is probably > somewhat similar to MTV, where standard operating procedure is that > the record label pays production costs for the special, MTV promotes it, > and MTV retains copyright ownership after it's done. The production costs > incurred by the record company are then recoupable from artist royalties. > All of this is, of course, subject to negotiation, and in-demand artists > and their labels may be able to extract more from the network. My guess > is that Reprise paid for the production of the special, TNT paid for > promotion, TNT now owns the show, and Joni owes Reprise for the production > costs but benefits from the free TNT promotion that is also in effect > promotion of her album. I want to believe that Joni would have been considered an in-demand artist for this one. She has remarked lately in interviews on how well Reprise has been treating her and it would be nice if they decided to foot the whole production bill considering that they are going to also profit from this promotion with the temporary upsurge of sales of her older catalog product. Years ago, it was not uncommon for record companies to foot production and other costs and never recoup it from the artists' album sales. But then the artists were not as protected in other ways back then, either. > All of this I learned in dribs and drabs as an ardent music fan, so while > it is mostly accurate, don't quote me on it! :-) Michael, if you were in my class, I'd give your "paper" a 100% A+ ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:41:53 -0700 From: "Brenda J. Walker" Subject: Re: Record Biz 101 > The dilemma with Billboard basing their numbers on Soundscan is that it > really does not pick up and record every single record sale because > Soundscan is not used in many of the non-chain, mom and pop, indie stores or > as Michael indicated, the record clubs. Even where Soundscan is used, there > is still a margin of error due to the occasional technical problems, > mis-scans, non-scans, etc. And how are all the non U.S. sales recorded? The > chains in non-U.S. countries may be using Soundscan or something equivalent, > but the total sales again may not be picked up from merchants who do not > record them or use Soundscan. I suppose an argument can be made that it > gives a "best guess" average total and at least they are picking up the > internet sales, but I don't think Billboard should be taken as the absolute, > final authority on real total numbers. Not to belabor the point, but Soundscan is pretty close, for domestic sales anyway. Sales are weighted for the independent stores to make up for the stores that don't scan. Even CD's sold by bands touring get counted in Soundscan, provided that someone from the road sends in the report. Having looked before at what is netted in a project and what Soundscan reports, at the end of the day they are remarkably close, especially on projects selling under a million units total. It's when you get to huge releases (more than a couple of million) that the numbers look a bit off. Sales outside of the U.S. are a definite crap shoot. They are mostly based on what is shipped and then adjusted for returns. Some territories (India and China in particular) have such rampant piracy, that you really can't judge how many people have bought the music. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:01:20 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #198 "Im new" In a message dated 4/18/00 12:21:00 PM US Central Standard Time, m_hicks@aiken.k12.sc.us writes: << I'm just glad to be here. I am looking forward to "being with" people that have this taste for music. >> Hiya Mike! And welcome to the list! I couldn't help but notice your e-mail addy...are you in Aiken, SC? Is there actually ANOTHER South Cackalackian here? :~) Anyway, I taped both showings of the special Sunday night. If you want one of the copies, e-mail me and we'll work it out! Bob NP(Now Playing): Judy Collins, "BSN" (just doing quality checks on my copies!) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:32:25 EDT From: MP123A321@aol.com Subject: tribute The tribute was much better than expected (IMHO) from all I've read in the many recent posts. I can barely keep up with the digests. It was really strange watching the show after reading all the reviews from the listers. A few things that I am wondering about: Larry Klein can't shake Joni calling him her EX all the time. Does anyone think this bothers him? I found the extended shots that zoomed in on Joni during the performances were long enough to be more like a sociological study than to capture a reaction or moment. Lots of talk about the shoeless k.d. Lang, seems as though Cyndi Lauper may have been barefoot also..I'll have to look again. If this was taped and edited ...I wonder if they gave Tony Bennett an opportunity to right that Joseph O' Keefe reference? I thought someone on this list said he tried to correct himself, did I miss it? Jimmy mentioned about the commercials. Did anyone put together that Buspar is used quite a lot help people with withdrawal from nicotine? I thought that was a very strange coincidence considering Joni is such a high profile cigarette smoker. Great video considering what is available on the tube. The band, performers, production and broadcast was above what I expected from a TNT special. Last thought.....I do think StoneTemple Pilots would have been very out of place for this show. Maurice (also playing all day: P. Gabriel - Secret World Live) ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #147 ********************************* ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe onlyjoni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?