From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #36 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk onlyJMDL Digest Friday, January 28 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 036 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Apologies!!! [john low ] Re: Joni Songwriting ["rick novosel" ] Re: BSN [catman ] Saskatoon exhibit news: current and future ["Pitassi, Mary" ] Re: BSN ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: BSN ["Mark or Travis" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 07:53:26 +1000 From: john low Subject: Apologies!!! My first post for a while and I go and make a boo boo! My sincere apologies to Joni-onlys for not attaching NJC to "Fav. Album & Dylan". Fortunately it was a brief post so I won't have wasted too much of your time. Cheers, John (in Sydney). __________________________________________________________________ Get your free Australian email account at http://start.com.au ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 15:00:35 -0800 From: "rick novosel" Subject: Re: Joni Songwriting Don wrote: > Okay heretics -- here's a word-UP: Joni Mitchell has > forgotten more about songwriting than you or I will > ever know. This was never in question, Don. I do appreciate the "craftsmanship" (Am I going to catch it for using that word?) of much of Joni"s latest work and would argue with anyone that her use of the language is almost unequalled in modern songwriting. And we all know she is fearless when it comes to doing whatever she feels like doing in the studio. But here's the but: Nothing comes close IMHO to the feelings she stirred inside me when she sang phrases like "I'll lock the vagrant winter out and bolt my wanderin' in" with her youthful and achingly beautiful soprano. As someone else posted, maybe it's the first exposure to Joni (or anyone) that will always be the most meaningful. I think what this all means is that I seem to be someone who appreciates music based more on my feelings than on analysis. Rick, reeling from an atypical bout of self-analysis;) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 23:35:47 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: BSN Louis Lynch wrote: > Catman, > > Sorry if you thought I misquoted you. Actually, I was giving you the > benefit of the doubt. > > In your post, you said "I just can't imagine Joni being able > to sing these songs. I don't see Joni as a singer, rather as a > songwriter at which she excels." > > Regardless of what Dorothy Rowe says about misinterpretation, in the music > business, when you say someone is "not a singer," it means that you don't > like to hear the person sing. Actually, Ms Rowe is right on the button. Because you misinterpreted what I wrote, period. You gave it the meaning you are used to, even though the rest of my mail makes it clear i do not dislike her voice. Come on, who would buy 15 or more albums by a person whose voice they did not like? Why would they even be a fan? > > > To me, your comment that she's UNABLE (see below) to sing is a stronger > put-down than saying you don't like her voice. Well I didn't say I don't like her voice, nor can I help you construing what iw rote as a put down. I have listened to PWWAM-and to me her voice sounds shot. Listening to her voice on the albums I love, NRH and TI it still doesn't sound like someone who can really sing to me. > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 17:32:12 -0600 From: "Pitassi, Mary" Subject: Saskatoon exhibit news: current and future On the recommendation of SMEDB@aol.com (Steve?), I e-mailed Natalie Kallio in Communications at the Mendel Gallery, where Joni's exhibit will be taking place, this morning. I explained that I was interested in attending the exhibit, as were other members of the Joni Mitchell Discussion List, and that I wanted further information about dates, especially opening night. Here is her response: ">Dear Mary, > >The date of the opening is set for June 30th, but exact details are not yet >settled. I will keep your name and email on file with the exhibition, but >if you would like to email me back in the spring, I will be able to provide >more information and details. Thank you so much for your initiative; the >outpouring of interest has been exhilirating and enthusiastic! I do hope to >see you in June, and keep in touch! > >Natalie Kallio >Communications >Mendel Art Gallery" So that's the most up-to-date information we have at present: pretty much what we knew before. However, I then wrote back to Ms. Kallio, explaining a little more about the nature and functions of the JMDL, and asked if I could post the above reply. She responded with great enthusiasm, stating that she'd be happy to keep in contact with me and/or the list over the months to come, and requesting the JMDL website address, as she herself is "certainly interested in all news, information, and discussion surrounding Joni" (!) The long and the short of it: I expect to hear from Natalie in the future, and will immediately post any news she transmits to the list. In the meantime, it's great to know we've made a new contact, and will receive news on the exhibit as it breaks! Thanks again for your reply, Steve. Waiting for June, Mary P. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 23:40:40 +0000 From: Jason Maloney Subject: Trouble With The Tiger (was Re: BSN) I thought the change of subject line was appropriate, as this post of mine is more about TTT than BSN.... Louis Lynch wrote: > OK, Eric, OK. > > I'll take back my comment about the "rambling" on Taming the Tiger. Maybe > I'm just not used to the new form she was using. I don't know what it is about TTT that makes it difficult to love in anywhere near the same way as just about any other Joni studio album I have heard (which is all of them bar FTR and Mingus). I devote my full attention and concentration to music when I listen to it, and the phenomenon of "drifting off" while my chosen CD is playing is extremely rare. Which makes the fact that just about every time I try to settle down to TTT, I find my mind wandering and interest waning by about track 7 so surprising. It's not something I'm accustomed to, certainly not with Joni's music. You could explain it away maybe once or twice, but every time? So, is it something to do with track sequencing? I haven't tried an alternative running order, but maybe I should. Why does it seem to me that so many of the tracks sound remarkably alike, if not in melody or subject matter, then ambience or tone? It's one thing creating an overall mood that ebbs and flows (Hejira), or a stunning sequential narrative (NRH), but TTT doesn't seem to have the impact on me that I sense it could (or should) have. It must sound odd voicing these thoughts so long after TTT's release, but I was hoping that time would bring the album closer to me. I still *like* it, of course, it's Joni after all, but I feel weird not loving it more. I'd also like to be able to stay awake for the entire duration of the album! Jason. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 16:46:15 -0700 From: Bounced Message Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #51 Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 18:14:39 -0600 From: dave fairall / beth miller I'm new to the Digest but a lifelong Joni fan. Saw her at Yasgur's farm, (Day in the Garden), and again at College Park Md. last year, (couldn't sit through Dylan after hearing Joni and her great band) and I'll never be the same.....truly magical. Ordered one of Sue McNamara's pics for my brother's Christmas gift last year, and it's proudly displayed on his wall. Thanks Sue. Persuing the various posts, I'd like to chime in to say that as a musician, I too think S+L is her greatest accomplishment, although the entire body of work is just amazing. In particular the work of Jaco, Brecker and Metheny is very special on that record, (a desert island album) and I'd love to see her collaborate with Michael and Pat again, (maybe even some kind of tribute to Jaco). I once read an interview w/ Robben Ford who was quoted as saying that of all the musicians he's worked with in the past, Joni is the one he would love to record with again.... that would also be way cool.....Robben may be the best blues guitarist on the planet. Thanks, Dave Fairall Baltimore MD ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 18:48:47 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: BSN The silky edge & feeling phrasing > of her recent vocals surpasses Billie Holliday's entire career! I suspect you just don't have an ear for great jazz. Wellllll, Eric.....I know this was just your humble (I assume) opinion.....however.....in my maybe not so humble opinion, judging from the above statement, you have no room to talk. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 20:55:09 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: BSN > > I agree totally Fred. I think her coming out with these songs now shows us that > even she regrets to some degree her change in song writing genre. I think this is a pretty rash supposition to make just because she chose to reinterpret 2 of her older songs to go on a covers album. She chose a story or theme for BSN and these 2 songs happened to be part of it. I can't imagine that Joni 'regrets' the direction her music has taken in any phase of her career. She loves > those old songs more than she has let on, but just didn't want it to seem like > she was "leaning" on her early successes. IMHO She HAS grown as an artist, and > that's a good thing. And who knows? Maybe she will yet write another BSN or > Circle Game or Urge for Going. And to me the songs you mention here are mere primers compared to what she has done on her last 3 albums. I could cite examples. I've done that before but it wouldn't change anybody's mind. But I can't resist at least one lyrical example: He said 'I wish you were with me here The leaves are electric They burn on the river bank Countless, heatless flames' I said 'Well send me some pictures then And I'll paint pyrotechnic Explosions of your Autumn Til we meet again.... I don't think she could have written something like that even 20 years ago. Certainly not when she started. It doesn't get any better than that. I don't agree that standards are easy to sing. They're familiar to a lot of people but some of them have very complex melodic lines and it is *not* easy to sing them *well*. 'Stormy Weather' comes to mind. Most Harold Arlen tunes have very sophisticated, unique melodic lines. Not just any old singer can pull them off. A pretty voice does not necessarily make a great singer. I do think that intonation & enunciation are very important but, again, that isn't all there is to it either. Phrasing & a strong rhythmic sense play a part but there's still more to it. Joni had a pretty voice at one time. Its tones have deepened & darkened and maybe even coarsened a little as time has gone on. She has always had good intonation, enunciation, phrasing & rhythic sense. As she has practiced her art over the years these skills have only sharpened and gotten better. But I think the most important element to Joni's singing is her ability to tell only the absolute truth as she perceives it and to communicate that truth in a way that her listeners instantly recognize & empathize with. That is her gift and like all of the skills she has applied to it, that gift has only been enhanced, deepened & magnified with time. She now feels confident & free enough to use her singing talents to interpret material she has always loved in a way she has always wanted to do it. And she now has all those years and everything she has learned both in the art of singing and the living of her life to bring to this endeavor. I expect it to be no less than breathtaking. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it does not take a smooth, silky, pretty voice to interpret these songs. It does, however, take a lot of skill and artistry to interpret them well. Joni has that in spades. So I really hope that Colin will be surprised when he hears BSN. Pretty doesn not equal beautiful. You couldn't call voices like Janis Joplin's, Louis Armstrong's, Marianne Faithful's or even Billie Holiday's pretty. Oh, but what beautiful music they made/make with those voices! Of course there are a few lucky ones who did/do have pretty voices and all the rest of those qualities as well: Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughn, Judy Garland, Nat King Cole, Johnny Hartmann, Barbra Streisand (yes, she does belong there, dammit!) and most recently k d lang. Aren't they the luckiest singers in the world? Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #36 ******************************** Don't forget about these ongoing projects: Glossary project: Send a blank message to for all the details. FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? - -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe onlyjoni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?