From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #13 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, January 11 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 013 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: sensitivity to the insensitve? [M.Russell@iaea.org] Re: JONI IN NEW ORLEANS!!!!!!! [MGVal@aol.com] Cover of Cold Blue Steel And Sweet Fire [Ginamu@aol.com] Re: Amour, mama, not cheap display! ["Mark or Travis" ] Crosby ["Bill Dollinger" ] Re: "Soloman kept his head in all his glory"? ["Catherine McKay" ] Another Joni Tribute? [Steve Dulson ] Re: Amour, mama, not cheap display! [Kathleen Kajioka ] London 70 BBC FM With James Taylor- Any Great Recordings of this anywhere? ["timothy schroeder" ] Re: (JGC) Joni Guitar Content. ["Mark T. Domyancich" ] Re: (JGC) Joni Guitar Content. [Phyliss Ward ] Re: JM in NOLA ["Michael Paz" ] Re: real good for free ["Bill Dollinger" ] Re: real good for free [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #17 [Riveragelsinger@aol.com] this saskatchewan girl loves quebec [Kate ] Re: Amour, mama, not cheap display! ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Both Sides, Now doesn't come cheap! ["Mark T. Domyancich" ] RE: Old but vintage (VLJC) ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: BSN pre-release order [CaTGirl627@aol.com] (JGC) Joni Guitar Content. [Richard Rice ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 10:30:24 +0100 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: Re: sensitivity to the insensitve? kb420@webtv.net (gr8fuldave) wrote: >Also, the last time Les posted the numbers >it was revealed that approximately 2% of the >subscribed were on the Joni-only list. So all >that tagging of NJC is done by 98% for under >50 people. I think this is an interesting statistic and good reason to change the procedure. IMO, it makes more sense that we tag messages about Joni herself as JC. This would be much easier to remember and I'm sure there would be many fewer mistakes that would irritate the only-Joni listers. But this begs the same question that Kakki and Catgirl asked, what do the only-Joni folks consider only-Joni? JC seems like it should really pertain only to Joni herself - her public appearances, concerts, interviews, art shows, stories from people on the list who have met her in person, rumours about upcoming events - i.e. anything related directly to Joni. Personally, I find very interesting the stories of when we all first discovered Joni, how we feel about her music, what we think the lyrics mean, etc. However, none of that is really strictly JC - it is about ourselves - how Joni has affected/influenced us. Even the Jonifests are not strictly JC, even though they are in tribute to her (if Joni had not attended, what would have been the difference between Joni's Jazz and the Jonifests that have been held so far, other than that the performers were famous, paid, and professional and you had to pay to get in? - please don't flame me!!!). I am NOT in the only-Joni list. I appreciate all that I have learned so far from reading the NJC posts and I wouldn't want to miss anything potentially interesting - because I feel such a bond with the listers I have met and corresponded with - I really value what people in JMDL think. I understand that some only-Joni listers also value these things, but just don't have the time to read all of the NJC posts. I specifically did not mark this as NJC because I would like to hear views of the only-Joni listers. Marian Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 06:58:23 EST From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Re: JONI IN NEW ORLEANS!!!!!!! In a message dated 1/10/00 9:09:56 PM Pacific Standard Time, Harpua@revealed.net writes: << He says she is booked to play the NATPE >Convention (TV producers and actors etc.) later this month for a private show on the 28th of January at a local hotel ballroom. >> Seeing that I'm not going skiing or anything that weekend, count me in, too! Mandatory month end close at work be damned!! MG np: my youngest coughing away and scuzzing up my pillow ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 07:00:27 EST From: Ginamu@aol.com Subject: Cover of Cold Blue Steel And Sweet Fire Hi! Has anyone heard a recent Mountain Stage show that featured, among others, Toshi Reagan? On the show that was broadcast in my area last night, just before Ms. Reagan went on, I heard a woman performing CBSASF but because of the activity of my household, I was unable to catch the name of the performer. Anyone? Take care, Gina ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 06:40:41 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Amour, mama, not cheap display! Kathleen wrote: I would think Joni > picked it up from 'France proper'. Perhaps from hearing to Edith Piaf on the radio. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 07:31:45 -0800 From: Louis Lynch Subject: RE: JONI IN NEW ORLEANS!!!!!!! Michael, Please, please, please invite us! Some of us missed the PWWAM concert. A lot more of us missed the LACE opening. So we would really love to come to New Orleans! We'll behave ourselves, we promise! Harper Lou ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 11:25:35 -0500 From: "Bill Dollinger" Subject: Crosby Either I have been misunderstood or my post has been hijacked... My problem is with the idea that we as a society encourage going to great lengths to reproduce. It bugs me just as much when I read about a straight couple who spend huge amounts of money on fertility treatments. Sometimes the woman gives birth to mega-tuplets and tells the world how they were blessed by god... It's ironic that this is now being pegged as a gay issue. As a gay man I have experienced the subtle and sometimes not-so-subtle pressure to have children. While I often have heard "don't you want to have children?" I never hear "Don't you want to adopt a child." Granted, it's a free country and look at the mess in China with abandoned female babies. The human population is growing by approximately 95 million people per year. If current trends continue, human numbers will sail past 10 bilion in the middle of the next hundred years. The quality of human life will certainly suffer. Is this Melissa's fault? Of course not. But I don't see how we can continue to blindly assert that everyone has the right to a Mini-Me. I don't think that health-care resources should be allocated on fertility treatments, especially with so many children with no caretakers. Bill NP -Little Green (hence the adoption rant) - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2000 7:55 AM Subject: Re: "don't believe the hype...(njc) > In a message dated 1/11/2000 12:19:35 AM Eastern Standard Time, > KerriLynn@aol.com writes: > > << c'mon... they probably just wanted to shut everyone up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > toooooooo funny.... >> > > I'm with Kerri on this one. My guess is this was either a joke on their part, > or someone else started a rumor...unless they named the children Stephen and > Graham... > As a huge advocate for adoption (I have two adopted kids), I still have to > agree with the other posters who say that, gay or not, it's an individual > choice as to how one wants to have a family. It's the most natural thing in > the world to want to have a biological child! Why shouldn't gays have the > same feelings about that as heteros? > > Terry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 16:21:39 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: "Soloman kept his head in all his glory"? >Jesus was a beggar - he was rich in grace >And Solomon kept his head in all his glory >It's just that some steps outside the Boho dance >have a fascination for me. > >Boho Dance > Vince said: >I can't speak for Joni but I suspect that she is comparing the > >humility/humble >life style of Jesus with the ornate riches of Solomon (both sons of >David >in >some sense, for what it is worth). > I don't know the Bible all that well but thought of it as Solomon's wisdom (keeping his head - common sense - as well as not letting his riches go to his head). I don't know much about Solomon but wasn't he the one asked to make judgement on a case of 2 women, both claiming to be the mother of a baby? Solomon thought about it for a while, then said the baby should be cut in half so they could each have half. Then one of the women said she'd rather let the other woman have the baby than have it cut in half and Solomon declared her to be the real mother since the real mother would rather give up her child than see it dead. (We're talking REAL mother, not necessarily biological, y'know?) I see it as Joni wondering aloud if being rich or poor affects whether you can be full of grace and/or wisdom. She's trying to make that choice - can I be rich and still keep my head about me? If I step outside the Boho dance (I think of it as the grungy but cool kind of jazzy beatnik existence where you can still be you, penniless but free) and I go for fortune or fame, can I still be true to myself? This is a question that comes up often with her. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 11:52:54 -0800 From: howard Subject: JM in NOLA I would check your dates on the appearance of JM in NOLA. I am going to the NATPE convention and the last day of the convention is the 27th of Jan. No one will be there on the 28th, just exhibitors tearing down their booths. In any case, if she is performing, I will be there for the convention and I want to see her, so reserve for two, please. Howard M. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 10:16:28 -0800 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Another Joni Tribute? I have not heard it yet, but Chicago s/ser Kristin Lems has a new CD out called "Oh Mama - plus!", and this is her description of one of the tracks: "The Three Madonnas - Judy and Joni and Joan - guess who this is a tribute to?" ######################################################### Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ (Website under construction!) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 13:57:53 -0500 From: Kathleen Kajioka Subject: Re: Amour, mama, not cheap display! Mark or Travis wrote: > Kathleen wrote: > I would think Joni > > picked it up from 'France proper'. > > Perhaps from hearing to Edith Piaf on the radio. > > Mark in Seattle Perhaps, but I think it's safe to assume she's spent some time in France: "Sitting in a park in Paris France..." (California). Kathleen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 12:44:38 -0700 From: "timothy schroeder" Subject: London 70 BBC FM With James Taylor- Any Great Recordings of this anywhere? I have both the Teddy Bear Release as well as the one volume in the 3 Volume Joni Mitchell boot series that came out on cd. Both sound like they were both derived from the same early bootleg lp from the early 70`s. Does any one have a tape source of this or a copy of the BBC recording from the radio station only discs? I can burn cds and have a number of rare recordings of Joni, Jackson Browne , James Taylor, Bob Dylan ect. Any help is definitely appreciated. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 13:59:28 -0500 From: Richard Rice Subject: (JGC) Joni Guitar Content. Hello everyone! I just had the most amazing, long, chat with Fred Walecki, the fellow who built Joni's guitar!!!! O my gosh, o my gosh!! Silly me did not have my Monica Lewinsky Tape Player going so I am trying like crazy to remember all that was said; it was soooooooo cool. Anyway, I've been thinking of buying a Parker (thanks to Mike Paz for all his amazing and wonderful help), and had a few questions , so in a moment of brilliance thought, heck, why not go to the original source. After trading a few emails, Fred Walecki asked me to ring him about what gear to buy, yadda yadda. Well today I gave him a call and he talked my ear off for at least a half hour regailing me with story upon story about Joan's introduction to the parker. Like Joan, Fred joking mentioned being kind of long winded, and when the two are together, they go on and on for hours trading tales. She is good at it, he can't sleep nights afterwards, all buzzed from her imaginative conversations. Lucky stiff. Well said lucky stiff is a long standing friend of Joni's. She has purchased a good many of her guitars from him, so he was long aware of her frustrations with open tunings. As luck would have it, he received one of the first two or so Roland VG8's and spent quite a few long hours on the phone to Japan dealing with the bugs in it. The first guitar he built using it was for a friend's wife who wanted one. She eventually returned the guitar and Fred set about improvements for Joan, changing pic ups and all. It was a stratocaster stripped down and made to run to the VG8. Of course Joan loved it instantly. Fred later traded stories with Ken Parker about the new guitar he made Joni. Ken, being a big Joni fan, asked Fred if it were ok, to have a go at making one for her himself. Very quickly, Ken had designs in the mail to Fred that absolutely wowed him. Still, he didn't show Joan the designs for fear they might change in production.When Fred passed along the information that Ken Parker wanted to build her a guitar, he said she was totally disinterested. She liked his guitar and was perfectly happy with it. Fred begged on, trying to convince her that Parker was leagues above him and that she would be majorly impressed by his work. Nothing registered with her until he mentioned that it would be even lighter than the one he built. 'Lighter?', she says. Well that got her interest. Finally the product came into his shop and he invited her over for a look. Knowing how cool it was, and certain she would like it, he left it in the box so seeing it would be a total surprise. He said she stood there arms crossed like, this is a waste of my time until he finally undid the wrapping... her eyes lit up and she said something like, "This is the most beautiful design I have ever seen." And it is too. Tease that Fred is, he ho-humly calls Ken to talk business like on the phone about the guitar, until Joni pops on the line and puts Ken through the roof with something like, 'This is Joni. Your guitar is a work of art. It is the most beautiful design ever'. The two of them chat for a long while. Some time later Ken comes out to L.A. to meet with Fred Walecki and go over business dealings with him. So Fred calls up Joan and says, let's go out to dinner tonight. There is someone I'd like you to meet. And Fred says to Ken, let's go to dinner, and by the way, I need to pick someone up on the way. So they are driving through Joan's neighborhood, Ken totally none the wiser, so he starts asking a few questions...Where are we going? So who is this person? And Fred is like, no prob. She's a song writer. I think you heard of her stuff. Just as they pull up to the house Ken finally gets it. Surprise!!! Out comes Joan and the two of them join her in her 'tin' pick up truck, which Fred knew would be her preferred means of transportation, for a drive into the city for dinner. Well, they are on the freeway, and for no reason Ken whips off his seat belt with such vigor it makes a ringing sound against the door. Concerned, Fred is asking, 'What's wrong? What's wrong?' And Ken says something like, ' I am riding here in this old truck with you and Joni Mitchell. If we get in an accident and die, this is the way I want to go!' Now if I have this straight, the guitar Fred Walecki remodeled Strat that Joni has named 'Greenpeace.' It is the instrument that most of TTT was recorded with. Today she plays Ken's Parker mostly, which suits Fred Walecki just fine. The Greenpeace goes along on tour as a back-up. It has a different tone to it, a lot more 'drive' Joni says, and she prefers to use it on certain songs. As for Ken, the Parker he made for her, called the Concert Parker Fly, is 'basic' in its pick ups and made for the VG8. May we say it is going gangbusters for him? And why not, it is a stunning piece of art! Very beautiful. Fred Walecki is just a wonderful man. And if you let him, he will talk your ear off. You can tell how much he loves Joan from his coversation. He mentioned that he was considering joining the discussion list. I told he should, but not as forceful as I should have!!! Sucks, not a forceful guy, me. But he was so excited to hear about my interest in all things Joni. I thought, heck, I am just the tip of the iceberg, sitting bottom row left. Anyway, one other major note of interest to the list. Joni is going to sell her guitars from the Hejira tour and Fred was curious if I thought the list would be interested in knowing that. --I plan on robbing several banks myself, after I finish typing this. It seems she is tired of them taking up space in her recording studio. By the way, said studio is about to be deconstructed and turned into a painting studio. (Yipes. Sometimes we learn so much regarding her life I feel a little squimish about it.) Anyway, among the guitars are six George Benson's that were set for different tunings for the shows. Fred made a point of mentioning they have very low serial numbers, like 0745, which I assume means they are of particular worth. All with pearl inlays and other special touches for Joni. She even has her second electric guitar, it seems the first was from Neil Young, but he liked the gift so much he took it back. Neatest of all, Joni wrote a short letter for each guitar, giving a brief history of it's place in her artisty and wishing the new owner well. As I said, Fred Walecki is offering more information to the list regarding them and I felt it would be better if someone more official, and more knowledgeable handle this. Anyone care to tackle? Les? Certainly I am sure he would be wonderful for an interview for the list. He has a lot of curiosity about all that is going on here, he even wanted to know if I knew Wally, but alas, I hated having to say no. I told him I would try to contact someone here about having the sites make a more offical contact. Someone please help me in that regard. Well, that was that. A most interesting afternoon. Happy to share it with you all. Wow, I just love how these two great awesome sites are magnifying my love of Joni's beautiful artistry. - --And all the beautiful people too! Thanks for listen. John. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 14:19:10 -0600 From: "Mark T. Domyancich" Subject: Re: (JGC) Joni Guitar Content. Great story, John! Ooh, if I had the money I would definitely buy one of Joni's old guitars... the only thing problem is that I would be afraid of breaking it! (You know that Joni guitar I bought for $5000, well, the neck fell off!) If you get a chance to talk to Fred again, John, see if he can find out the string gauges from the Shadows and Light tour. I would be very interested in finding those out! NP-Joni-Last Waltz-Furry Sings The Blues At 1:59 PM -0500 1/11/00, John wrote: >Joni is going to sell her guitars from the Hejira tour and Fred was >curious if I thought the list would be interested in knowing that. >--I plan on >robbing several banks myself, after I finish typing this. It seems she >is tired of them taking up space in her recording studio. By the way, >said studio is about to be deconstructed and turned into a painting >studio. (Yipes. Sometimes we learn so much regarding her life I feel a >little squimish about it.) Anyway, among the guitars are six George >Benson's that were set for different tunings for the shows. Fred made a >point of mentioning they have very low serial numbers, like 0745, which >I assume means they are of particular worth. All with pearl inlays and >other special touches for Joni. She even has her second electric guitar, >it seems the first was from Neil Young, but he liked the gift so much he >took it back. Mark Domyancich Harpua@revealed.net http://home.revealed.net/Harpua ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 14:24:34 -0500 From: Richard Rice Subject: of marginal content, but I'm sending anyway... Sorry, no real Joni content but had to send anyway. I just read my post after sending it. Yipes! All the grammatical errors, please forgive them. I was too excited to read through. Next time I'll try to catch my breath and check my posts over. Hmmm, cost of a Parker, a trip to New Orleans for a priv Joni show, Paz's Joni Fest, 2 special edition Both Sides Now, a trip to S'katoon, a baby Collings, and the electric guitar Joni used for her Hejira tour...hmmmm, let's see, nine bucks in the wallet... you people should be ashamed of yourselves!!!! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 20:08:28 +0000 From: Martin Giles Subject: real good for free Hi everyone! Here's one for all the great musicians on the list. I was listening to the S&L version of Woodstock again the other day, and started thinking about how different it is to the original piano based version. Joni picked up the guitar, worked out one of her weird and wonderful tunings and recreated the song with a haunting new sound. I got to wondering if I could take another song of hers (namely real Good For Free) and do the same thing with it. So I picked up my guitar and fiddled for a few hours before giving up in disgust. I got nowhere. I couldn't work out how to go about it. At one point I was toying with DGDGBD, but it was too straight, it just wasn't 'minor'ish enough. So I was wondering, has Joni ever explained how she developes/creates a tuning for a song? Has she ever been asked about Woodstock in particular? Does she have a method, or is it a more improvised thing? (I read somewhere that Joni has worked out 'a system' of around fifty tunings, which sounds like an organised project.) Any thoughts? atb, Martin. In London. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 13:14:11 -0800 From: Phyliss Ward Subject: Re: (JGC) Joni Guitar Content. Wow! - I loved reading your post and I undertand your excitement at such a great conversation. I'm was doing finances in my head too! I kinda figured that Fred must be pretty good friends with Joni when I found out that he is the 'Freddie' in No Apologies...BTW - I didn't even notice any grammar problems - the content was too exciting! Richard Rice wrote: > Hello everyone! > > I just had the most amazing, long, chat with Fred Walecki, the fellow > who built Joni's guitar!!!! O my gosh, o my gosh!! - -- Phyliss pward@lightspeed.net http://www.bodywise.com/consultants/bpward ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 14:46:14 -0600 From: "Michael Paz" Subject: Re: JM in NOLA Howard wrote: > I would check your dates on the appearance of JM in NOLA. I am going to > the NATPE convention and the last day of the convention is the 27th of > Jan. No one will be there on the 28th, just exhibitors tearing down > their booths. > > In any case, if she is performing, I will be there for the convention > and I want to see her, so reserve for two, please. > > Howard M. Hi Howard- As I stated before, none of this is confirmed. I also noted that NATPE ends on the 27th because I am attending. Last year there was really nobody left on the last day, so I AM WORRIED. That is one of the reasons I told my boss it might me wise for us to pad the audience (as it were) to ensure a good crowd. I will do my best for all of you who have requested attendance. Peace Michael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 16:40:07 -0500 From: "Bill Dollinger" Subject: Re: real good for free The only thing I have repeatedly heard in this regard is that she tunes to her environment, finding "sonic references" from birds, water, wind etc. I don't think it is a method, since our joni would not be one to fall into any kind of formula. Bill - ----- Original Message ----- From: Martin Giles > > So I was wondering, has Joni ever explained how she developes/creates a > tuning for a song? Has she ever been asked about Woodstock in > particular? Does she have a method, or is it a more improvised thing? (I > read somewhere that Joni has worked out 'a system' of around fifty > tunings, which sounds like an organised project.) > > Any thoughts? > > atb, > Martin. In London. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 19:20:41 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: real good for free Martin asks: << So I was wondering, has Joni ever explained how she developes/creates a tuning for a song? >> Well, sure, but there are different methods which she has used. For instance, for Magdalene Laundries, she says that she went to the coast and tuned the guitar to the sounds the birds were making, because she wanted to write a happy song. Later that day, she was at the grocery store, saw the tabloids and the story of the Magdalene Laudries, and her happy bird song was changed into that not so happy number... There are probably as many different tuning stories as there tunings... Bob NP: Days of The New, "The Shelf in the Room" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 19:58:54 EST From: Riveragelsinger@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #17 I like your analysis of "In France They Kiss..." I would only add that Mitchell's use of obviously real adolescents, including herself in a more innocent time of life, pushes an agenda at the heart of rock'n'roll, how in some other cultures sexuality is overtly healthier than what we have been taught or not taught..."removed from romance...broken and molded.." Is she just stereotyping French people, who can seem very discreet in public, as well as very warm and affectionate with their loved ones in public and private? Or is it just a banner cry to exemplify sexual, sensual exuberance? I believe she was in early middle age when she wrote this...early thirties?? Is she the girl in bloom or the fading woman? Is she either? What I love and hate is the deliberate obscurity and obliqueness with which she writes characters in her poetry, the things left out, the incomplete characters that my own imagination wants to, but cannot quite fill in. It feels like a night of fun and racing around that I've done both here and in France and a couple of other places. Running around and having fun..."thrilling..." to whatever words can turn us on. I suppose it's part of the reason I flipped open to this song, as a first to take a look at. Anybody have any other comments or insights about lyrics or music? What other work relates to sexuality? She has something on her last CD. And then there's "Come In From the Cold." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 11:24:11 -0700 From: Kate Subject: this saskatchewan girl loves quebec You called? >Hell no... not on the prairies, anyway. Here you see bigtime resentment >against Quebec, There is anti-Quebec sentiment, but you won't notice it in anyone who's been out east and lived there for awhile. I lived in the french-speaking northern New Brunswick and travelled through and visited Quebec, as well as living in a semi-communal situation with 1/3 of the people being from Quebec. I speak French fairly well (the Acadian version of it, anyway!) and have fond memories of my time there and the people I knew. You won't hear any anti-french sentiment from this girl. I live in a half-french community right now, as a matter of fact, so I hear French spoken on the street often and there is a French-speaking school here as well as the English one. I regret that I rarely speak it myself. I would love to live in a totally French culture again, so that is all I would hear and speak. I love the language and the culture as well, but I don't know how it compares to France's, having never been there. But the structure of language does affect thought.... >and French really is a small minority of Saskatchewan >culture... I'd say the biggest ethnic groups here are Aboriginal, >Ukrainian, and Germans... A lot of Scandinavians where I come from ( the Parkland region of Ssaskatchewan, not the Prairies, but people rarely make the distinction) - - Norwegian, Swede, Finnish - as well as many Poles and Czechs; not that many Germans, and of course most of the Aboriginal people live on the reserves if they are not in the poorer parts of the larger cities. In my hometown (of about 200 people) there was only one native Indian family in the time I was growing up, and they were on a farm. And one French family, from France. How do those ratios sound? >I did a paper on this once, and I think that >is what the results were. You are probably right in overall numbers, which might not reflect the different ratios in certain pockets of the province. >Anyway, I think it's safe to say that Joni's >love of all things French doesn't stem from just being Canadian. >Basically, French Canada is like a foreign land to most people on the >prairies. I dunno, Kate in Alberta, you are from Saskatchewan too, what >do you think? I can't think of any French influence apart from a few >French Metis settlements around Duck Lake.Evian I agree with you. Most people I know, from here, haven't been to Quebec or been influenced by it. For many, their only experience of French is the language class they were stuck with at school (and a teacher who couldn't pronounce French properly in most cases anyway) and lately the emotionally-charged politics connected with the Quebec government's stated goal of separating from Canada. The Francophone people whose pioneer ancestors settled out here in the west ( they consider themselves French from France, not from Quebec) don't support the separatist agenda and neither do the Francophone people who are here from Nova Scotia. More than you wanted to know? Joni's appreciation for the romance of France and things French probably comes from being there herself. That's my guess. Kate of the North, who can't even consider joining the JMDL audience in New Orleans this month ($$$) but will happily relish every report on the exulted event, and who WILL be in Saskatoon in June come hell or high water. Yippee!! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 18:28:46 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Amour, mama, not cheap display! > Perhaps, but I think it's safe to assume she's spent some time in > France: "Sitting in a park in Paris France..." (California). > > Kathleen > But the song is about the teen-aged Joni. Long before she became famous & went anywhere outside of Canada. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 19:05:34 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Fw: Amour, mama, not cheap display! Kathleen asked me to forward her most articulate response to the list as she neglected to do so. > > Mark or Travis wrote: > > > > Perhaps, but I think it's safe to assume she's spent some time in > > > France: "Sitting in a park in Paris France..." (California). > > > > > > Kathleen > > > > > But the song is about the teen-aged Joni. Long before she became > > famous & went anywhere outside of Canada. > > > > Mark in Seattle > > Yah, BUT...:-) It's written later, when she would have had experience > in France, and could easily translate it back to the time she's writing > about. I don't think that she necessarily adheres to the range of her > experience in the time she is writing about, but could insert it > retroactively for the sake of poetic potence. In this case, the France > image isn't simply an "argument" against her mother, but is used as an > analogy to frame the whole phenomenon of youth liberating themselves > from parental tyranny: "In the war of independence" to me refers both > to the youthful war of independence from parents and to the French > revolution where the populus ("youth") were fighting for freedom from > the despots ("Parents"). My point is that the reference runs to deep to > make whether or not France was a part of her teenage experience an > issue. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 22:05:27 EST From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Both Sides, Now doesn't come cheap! In a message dated 1/11/00 6:45:01 PM Pacific Standard Time, revrvl@pathwaynet.com writes: << I was not expecting the price of $43 something bucks. I ordered it, but why the pricey price? >> Joni's new CD just appeared in our data base. (if you order from CD Now, you get your music shipped from my company's warehouse). I, too, noticed the hefty price tag, MSLP is about $44. The database has little available notes beyond the street date of 2/8/00 and the notation: "limited edition, contains original lithographs." Not sure what that means, but I've been checking with anyone whose debits I've graciously credited over the past few years to see what's what and beg a favor or promo. More news as it develops. MG - back to lurk mode np: My son's hacking cough ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 19:09:32 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: BSN pre-release order Rev. Vince wrote: >So I fixed that, ordered BSN from cdnow (and as always, >used the link through the Joni page). I was not expecting >the price of $43 something bucks. I ordered it, but why the >pricey price? You may have been offlist when some of us reported about the Special Edition BSN being released Feb. 8th. Some of us saw the prototype the night of the LACE exhibit. As Joni describes it in the KCSN interview, the CD and separate, miniature lithos of her four new paintings are packaged in an "aubergine (deep purple) taffeta-covered round candy box." It is really wonderful and I think the suggested retail price of $49.99 is not bad considering the beauty and detail in it. I'm so stoked over it I'm going to get two! Also, Robbie Cavolina made some mention of more surprises in it that he would not disclose to us. I think you will be happy when you see it. The "regular" jewel box CD is not being released until sometime in March. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 21:36:23 -0600 From: "Mark T. Domyancich" Subject: Re: Both Sides, Now doesn't come cheap! Does anybody think this is unfair? It's like, if you really want the new album you're going to have to shell out 45 bucks and if you don't feel like paying that much you'll have to wait another month. NP-New Bohemians-Hard Rain's Gonna Fall At 10:05 PM -0500 1/11/00, MGVal@aol.com wrote: >Joni's new CD just appeared in our data base. (if you order from CD Now, you >get your music shipped from my company's warehouse). I, too, noticed the >hefty price tag, MSLP is about $44. The database has little available notes >beyond the street date of 2/8/00 and the notation: "limited edition, contains >original lithographs." Mark Domyancich Harpua@revealed.net http://home.revealed.net/Harpua ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 19:50:25 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: (JGC) Joni Guitar Content - Westwood Music (long) John, What a fantastic conversation with Fred Walecki! It would be incredible he if joined the list. I would love to hear him yak on and on with Joni stories! About a year ago I reported to the list of buying my Baby Taylor at Guitar Center from a gentleman named Keith who used to work at Westwood Music with Fred and who also regaled me for an hour with Joni stories! Joni must like him very much - in the liner notes of TTT she gives him and Brian Blade special thanks for "rekindling my desire to make music." I hope some of us around here can make a bid on the Hejira guitars. If anyone wants me to check in at the store on this, please let me know. I've copied below some excerpts from Westwood Music's website, which of course, includes Joni content! ;-) ***** Westwood Music is known throughout the country as the leader in understanding and anticipating a musician's needs and for developing the technology to meet those needs. We create solutions to problems that even musicians at times are unable to articulate. Since our beginning 50 years ago, we have always been known for treating each customer, from beginner to pro, with legendary warmth and service. Since the '60's, Westwood Music and its owner, Fred Walecki, have been at the center of rock and roll legend-making. The stories abound--like the time the Stones went to see Sonny and Brownie at the Ash Grove, driven by Fred in his mom's station wagon. Or when Bernie Leadon promised to stand good for a Westwood Music charge account for his new band, which had come up with the questionable name of "The Eagles". Those were wild and heady days. Founded first as a rare violin, harp, and orchestral instrument store by Hermann Walecki in 1947, Westwood Music gained international stature as Hermann sold some of the most important rare instruments of this century: the " Lord Nelson Stradivarius", the "Markivich Stradivarius", and the "Mendolson Stradivarius", to mention only a few. When Hermann fell ill in 1966, his son Fred, at the age of nineteen, took over the business. Realizing his sensibilities lay more with guitars and other modern instruments, Fred gradually phased out the rare instrument side of the business and began to cater to clients involved in the new sounds of the '60 's. Within a few short years Fred had been befriended by such music legends as Buffalo Springfield Band, Bernie Leadon, Ned Doheny, Jackson Browne, Joni Mitchell, Poco, Linda Rondstadt, The Birds, Hearts and Flowers. And the rest, as they say, is Rock and Roll history, as evidenced by the abundance of Gold Records lining the walls of the store from groups both past and present. Through the '70's, 80's, and 90's the client list has grown and grown for one simple reason-no other music store in southern California is really involved with what large stage groups need, i.e., custom length, high quality cords; kel lights, batteries, gaffers tape, custom anvil cases measured for the clients at their rehearsal halls, and personal, 24 hour commitment to service. Late night phone calls at home to Fred from a group in a bind are common. Twelve hours to a guy on the road who is unable to get a three-dollar item that will make or break the pedal steel player seems like an eternity. With Westwood Music behind them, that item is there next day by FedEx, delivered to the guy's room by the bell hop with the morning coffee. These days it's hard to imagine what our store is like if you haven't been in, but it's a relief from the supermarket-type stores. The small profit margins of the chain stores seem to dictate impersonal treatment, but it doesn't have to be that way. We meet their prices but not their lack of service. Buying a guitar used to be a great time and it still can be-picking up and playing twenty or so Martins before choosing the perfect one, or having the same people who set up Bruce Cockburn's guitar set up yours. That 's very cool. It helps that we have such a long and rich history with the old companies like Martin and Gibson. Things are a bunch easier when you actually know the humans you are speaking to at these big companies. How do we know them? First, we like the people at the big companies, and they like us. Heck, some of the high lamas at the big companies worked with us in our store years ago, like Ren Fergison back in the 60's, or Chris Martin in the 70's. Ren is one of the high guys at Gibson acoustic in Bozeman, and Chris is the main person at Martin now. Beginning student, talented songwriter/bar player, and the fortunate few who have became musical legends-Westwood Music has been loyal to them all. We aren't big but we are powerful when you need real help from real people who sell the good goods. It is not unusual on any given day to find Joni Mitchell or Lyle Lovett, Gram Nash or David Crosby, Kevin ("Kebmo") or Chris Hillman, visiting Westwood Music, talking with the other regular customers. If you would like to see or hear from some of Westwood's customers, see that section of our site called "store pals". It would be nice to hear from you and feel free to call. Or, better yet, come in some day soon, hang out, and have the "Westwood Music experience". ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 22:01:58 -0600 From: Michael Paz Subject: Old but vintage (VLJC) wallyK wrote: "wallyk, losing my mind thinking that i might see joni live for the first time in my life and not too decrepit yet at that." Wally to think that you are going to spend some of your vacation i the city of my hatching (Detroit), yes my secret is out, is a little too much for me right now. I have to think that with all of the other synchronicity that is happening right now that you will get your props and be one of the many of us that HAS to get into this event come hell or high water or la plaga del inferno. I hope you have a wonderful journey and please get in touch whilst you are being your salacious self throughout the land of the free and the home of the brave. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 01:15:22 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: Old but vintage (VLJC) >I hope you have a wonderful journey and please get in > touch whilst you are being your salacious self throughout the land of > the free and the home of the brave. > > Michael i will and keep a seat or whatever warm for me. i'll drag my ass down to vampireland to see joni with all my decadent fellow joniphiles!!! wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 23:32:59 EST From: CaTGirl627@aol.com Subject: Re: BSN pre-release order In a message dated 1/11/2000 10:12:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, kakkib@att.net writes: << As Joni describes it in the KCSN interview, the CD and separate, miniature lithos of her four new paintings are packaged in an "aubergine (deep purple) taffeta-covered round candy box." It is really wonderful and I think the suggested retail price of $49.99 is not bad considering the beauty and detail in it. I'm so stoked over it I'm going to get two! Also, Robbie Cavolina made some mention of more surprises in it that he would not disclose to us. I think you will be happy when you see it. The "regular" jewel box CD is not being released until sometime in March. Kakki >> Well if kakki is going to buy TWO then I am too! whoo-hoo! And then (yes of course) I will just have to buy the jewel case one as well. One will stay hermeticaly sealed for posterity!! OH YEAH BABY!!!! Catgirl WHOO-HOOO! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 22:45:21 -0500 From: Richard Rice Subject: (JGC) Joni Guitar Content. Hello again, Mr. Walecki. I have to fess up, I wrote to the Joni Mitchell Discussion List today and told as much of our chat as I could recall. I was so excited I could not resist sharing. Anyway, since I was liberally quoting you from memory, I thought it best to let you know what I wrote. If I did anything in error, please feel free to slap me on the wrist. I can take it. Again, many thanks to you for a neato cool experience. --I am beside myself with excitement!!! Hello everyone! I just had the most amazing, long, chat with Fred Walecki, the fellow who built Joni's guitar!!!! O my gosh, o my gosh!! Silly me did not have my Monica Lewinsky Tape Player going so I am trying like crazy to remember all that was said; it was soooooooo cool. Anyway, I've been thinking of buying a Parker (thanks to Mike Paz for all his amazing and wonderful help), and had a few questions , so in a moment of brilliance thought, heck, why not go to the original source. After trading a few emails, Fred Walecki asked me to ring him about what gear to buy, yadda yadda. Well today I gave him a call and he talked my ear off for at least a half hour regailing me with story upon story about Joan's introduction to the parker. Like Joan, Fred joking mentioned being kind of long winded, and when the two are together, they go on and on for hours trading tales. She is good at it, he can't sleep nights afterwards, all buzzed from her imaginative conversations. Lucky stiff. Well said lucky stiff is a long standing friend of Joni's. She has purchased a good many of her guitars from him, so he was long aware of her frustrations with open tunings. As luck would have it, he received one of the first two or so Roland VG8's and spent quite a few long hours on the phone to Japan dealing with the bugs in it. The first guitar he built using it was for a friend's wife who wanted one. She eventually returned the guitar and Fred set about improvements for Joan, changing pic ups and all. It was a stratocaster stripped down and made to run to the VG8. Of course Joan loved it instantly. Fred later traded stories with Ken Parker about the new guitar he made Joni. Ken, being a big Joni fan, asked Fred if it were ok, to have a go at making one for her himself. Very quickly, Ken had designs in the mail to Fred that absolutely wowed him. Still, he didn't show Joan the designs for fear they might change in production.When Fred passed along the information that Ken Parker wanted to build her a guitar, he said she was totally disinterested. She liked his guitar and was perfectly happy with it. Fred begged on, trying to convince her that Parker was leagues above him and that she would be majorly impressed by his work. Nothing registered with her until he mentioned that it would be even lighter than the one he built. 'Lighter?', she says. Well that got her interest. Finally the product came into his shop and he invited her over for a look. Knowing how cool it was, and certain she would like it, he left it in the box so seeing it would be a total surprise. He said she stood there arms crossed like, this is a waste of my time until he finally undid the wrapping... her eyes lit up and she said something like, "This is the most beautiful design I have ever seen." And it is too. Tease that Fred is, he ho-humly calls Ken to talk business like on the phone about the guitar, until Joni pops on the line and puts Ken through the roof with something like, 'This is Joni. Your guitar is a work of art. It is the most beautiful design ever'. The two of them chat for a long while. Some time later Ken comes out to L.A. to meet with Fred Walecki and go over business dealings with him. So Fred calls up Joan and says, let's go out to dinner tonight. There is someone I'd like you to meet. And Fred says to Ken, let's go to dinner, and by the way, I need to pick someone up on the way. So they are driving through Joan's neighborhood, Ken totally none the wiser, so he starts asking a few questions...Where are we going? So who is this person? And Fred is like, no prob. She's a song writer. I think you heard of her stuff. Just as they pull up to the house Ken finally gets it. Surprise!!! Out comes Joan and the two of them join her in her 'tin' pick up truck, which Fred knew would be her preferred means of transportation, for a drive into the city for dinner. Well, they are on the freeway, and for no reason Ken whips off his seat belt with such vigor it makes a ringing sound against the door. Concerned, Fred is asking, 'What's wrong? What's wrong?' And Ken says something like, ' I am riding here in this old truck with you and Joni Mitchell. If we get in an accident and die, this is the way I want to go!' Now if I have this straight, the guitar Fred Walecki remodeled Strat that Joni has named 'Greenpeace.' It is the instrument that most of TTT was recorded with. Today she plays Ken's Parker mostly, which suits Fred Walecki just fine. The Greenpeace goes along on tour as a back-up. It has a different tone to it, a lot more 'drive' Joni says, and she prefers to use it on certain songs. As for Ken, the Parker he made for her, called the Concert Parker Fly, is 'basic' in its pick ups and made for the VG8. May we say it is going gangbusters for him? And why not, it is a stunning piece of art! Very beautiful. Fred Walecki is just a wonderful man. And if you let him, he will talk your ear off. You can tell how much he loves Joan from his coversation. He mentioned that he was considering joining the discussion list. I told he should, but not as forceful as I should have!!! Sucks, not a forceful guy, me. But he was so excited to hear about my interest in all things Joni. I thought, heck, I am just the tip of the iceberg, sitting bottom row left. Anyway, one other major note of interest to the list. Joni is going to sell her guitars from the Hejira tour and Fred was curious if I thought the list would be interested in knowing that. --I plan on robbing several banks myself, after I finish typing this. It seems she is tired of them taking up space in her recording studio. By the way, said studio is about to be deconstructed and turned into a painting studio. (Yipes. Sometimes we learn so much regarding her life I feel a little squimish about it.) Anyway, among the guitars are six George Benson's that were set for different tunings for the shows. Fred made a point of mentioning they have very low serial numbers, like 0745, which I assume means they are of particular worth. All with pearl inlays and other special touches for Joni. She even has her second electric guitar, it seems the first was from Neil Young, but he liked the gift so much he took it back. Neatest of all, Joni wrote a short letter for each guitar, giving a brief history of it's place in her artisty and wishing the new owner well. As I said, Fred Walecki is offering more information to the list regarding them and I felt it would be better if someone more official, and more knowledgeable handle this. Anyone care to tackle? Les? Certainly I am sure he would be wonderful for an interview for the list. He has a lot of curiosity about all that is going on here, he even wanted to know if I knew Wally, but alas, I hated having to say no. I told him I would try to contact someone here about having the sites make a more offical contact. Someone please help me in that regard. Well, that was that. A most interesting afternoon. Happy to share it with you all. Wow, I just love how these two great awesome sites are magnifying my love of Joni's beautiful artistry. - --And all the beautiful people too! Thanks for listen. John. ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V2000 #13 ******************************** Don't forget about these ongoing projects: Glossary project: Send a blank message to for all the details. FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. 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