From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V1 #265 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk onlyJMDL Digest Tuesday, November 16 1999 Volume 01 : Number 265 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Joni #63 of top 100 performers [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Welcome!! [Julian51469@aol.com] Today in Joni History - November 14 [Today in Joni History ] Costing a Mint. And a half. [Richard Rice ] Joni Early in Detroit [zapuppy2@webtv.net (Penny)] Re: Costing a Mint. And a half. [Mark Domyancich ] Re: Joni in the Malls - "Conversation" LOTC ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: S+L and M of A on cd [Martin Giles ] Re: Jimmy Webb - deciphering MacArthur Park ["Kakki" ] RE: Joni in the Malls - "Conversation" LOTC ["Brett Code" ] Joni in VF "Icons of Rock" [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] JAZZ TAKES and the Grammys [Dflahm@aol.com] See what I mean! [Richard Rice ] Re: Costing a Mint. And a half. [Richard Rice ] Re: BRAVO Les ["Kakki" ] Re: JAZZ TAKES and the Grammys ["Kakki" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 06:29:05 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni #63 of top 100 performers Mark de-lurks: << I guess this ends my lurking since subscibing two weeks ago. Since that time I have read many enjoyable posts (who can read them all?), mostly while listening to Joni Mitchell. I'm relatively new to her music and haven't aquired all her records as of yet but plan to do so. >> Hey, and welcome, Mark! I'm almost in envy of your position, having new Joni music to discover! Although it always seems like just I've heard it all, something wonderful shows up, so I suppose I have a lot still to hear myself. And like you say, the fringe benefits, like finding great artists like Jonatha, are wonderful... Thanks for de-lurking, post away my friend! Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 09:56:05 EST From: Julian51469@aol.com Subject: Welcome!! Welcome to the list Mark, Yes, indeed: <> and... <> ...I agree completely, Julian ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:11:00 -0600 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - November 14 Today's entries are both from Wally's bio page: 1993: Joni receives a Lifetime Achievement Award from the Saskatchewan Recording Industry Association. The presentation was held at the Willows Golf Resort in Saskatoon and attended by her parents and former teachers. Joni said "Awards don't mean that much to me. That people like the music is the best award." After the presentation Joni gave an hour long interview and performed a new song called 'The Magdalene Laundries" that she said she planned to record with Sinead O'Connor on background vocals. 1994: Today, Joni was in London, England for a solo showcase for the media at a townhouse off Gloucester Road in South Kensington. Before the event, Joni was interviewed and performed "Sunny Sunday" and "Sex Kills" on the BBC series "The Late Show." At around a quarter to 7 in the evening Joni went on stage and performed for more than an hour in front of 200 media and record company people from all over Europe. She said to the audience "I don't know how to address you; you're not all Brits..Spain? Italy? France? Do we have France? And I hear there's someone here from Greece." Her set included "Refuge of the Roads," "Night Ride Home," her newest pair of tunes "Loves' Cries" and "Happiness is the Best Facelift," as well as a few selections from the album she was there to promote, "Sex Kills," "Magdelaine Laundries," Sunny Sunday," and "Yvette in English." She referred to Crosby before she sang "Yvette" and the fact that he was in a California hospital waiting for a liver transplant. (He'd actually had the transplant operation a few hours before her show started). An amazing footnote is that Joni didn't smoke a single cigarette for the duration of her show! Further info: http://www.jonimitchell.com/LondonShowcase94.html - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 13:38:42 -0500 From: Richard Rice Subject: Costing a Mint. And a half. Hi Mark, Welcome to the list! I have to agree with you Mark on the expense of that D28. Thanks a lot Sue! You too Howard, Michael et al. Real nice. Don't be hiding your heads. You should be ashamed of yourselves. Thanks to you I have had to fork over huge buckage for a VG8 and Parker! (Which still hasn't arrived yet.) I hold you ALL accountable! It is YOUR fault!!! And all I have to say is, "You better knock it off!" You know we are weak. So weak... So poor now... But oh so very, very blessed. Thank you all. --Now stop it! (Anyone done any new tabs?) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 11:17:55 -0800 (PST) From: zapuppy2@webtv.net (Penny) Subject: Joni Early in Detroit Hey Pat, I guess this is mostly directed to you, but maybe we have others listers who may have input on this. While my e-mail was out last week I ran into the dad of one of my daughter's friends at the grocery store. Sid, the dad, had told me during Joni chatter a few years ago, that he had also played with Joni in her early days in Detroit. The main thing I remember him expressing then was what a jerk Chuck was to Joni! But when I ran into him the other day, I finally got around to asking a couple of specifics. He said he played in a group called The Spikedrivers and Chuck and Joni were the "folkies" sharing the bill, taking turns when the band wasn't onstage the folkies would be, in some combination of either Chuck or Joni or both together. The place they played together was called The Poison Apple. I would have to surmise, if Sid is correct, this must have been before their Cellar days because Sid insists Joni wasn't using alternate tunings yet. Do you have any recollection of their band, that particular club or while Joni did stints there? And BTW Sid is a dead ringer for Jerry Garcia, pun intended ;-), the GD reference, that is. I'll try to get more info out of Sid next time I run into him, which is fairly often. Peace Penny :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Grace dies when it becomes us verses them......Philip Yancey ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 14:13:50 -0600 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Re: Costing a Mint. And a half. Nothing beats an acoustic-sure, the VG-8 may have an acoustic setting on it, but that doesn't make it an acoustic. I really enjoy tuning my guitar, breaking strings, getting the action fixed, etc., that I don't want a VG-8. I haven't done any new tabs for a while now mainly because there isn't much to do anymore (which is a good thing). I have bits and pieces I have figured out from unreleased songs sitting on my HD that need to be finished, though. NP-Talk To Me ___________________________________ | Mark Domyancich | | Harpua@revealed.net | | http://home.revealed.net/Harpua | | ICQ: 21619464 | |_________________________________| Richard Rice writes: > I have to agree with you Mark on the expense of that D28. Thanks a lot > Sue! You too Howard, Michael et al. Real nice. Don't be hiding your > heads. You should be ashamed of yourselves. Thanks to you I have had to > fork over huge buckage for a VG8 and Parker! (Which still hasn't arrived > yet.) I hold you ALL accountable! It is YOUR fault!!! And all I have to > say is, > "You better knock it off!" > > (Anyone done any new tabs?) > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:17:02 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Joni in the Malls - "Conversation" LOTC Brett said: >Does anyone even know anyone not on the list who has ever heard of >"Conversation"? I wonder why they play somewhat more obscure >songs? > The 'classic rock' stations could take a lesson or two from >the mall >music people. Was it the original Joni version or a Muzak version? I'm only asking because sometimes you hear the strangest tunes redone in Muzak format. Sometimes I think whoever records this kind of stuff has a really whacky sense of humour so they'll take something that may have started out as heavy metal, for example, and do a Muzak version of it. I wonder whether it might be kind of an in-joke among musicians who "have" to record watered-down versions of music to make a living, but who want to get in a little dig at the powers-that-be by recording something by Guns'n'roses that Mum is going to hear at the mall and think, "Oh, isn't that a pretty tune?" I can say, from personal experience, that, when I was managing a call centre, I used to sometimes use for the Music on Hold (when I could get away with it!) something a little "different" from what you might normally hear just to see if we'd get a reaction out of anyone. Heh-heh-heh. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:08:40 +0000 From: Martin Giles Subject: Re: Joni voted top 20 Hi Colin Yep, I thought it would go that way. I decided not to watch or vote, as it would all be too depressing. Madonna's OK in her way, but c'mon now!! Best wishes, Martin. > Channel four is showing a music program for people of the millenium, > voted on by the general public. > In the Best Female Singer category, our Joni was number 20 and Madonna > was number 1. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 19:51:19 +0000 From: Martin Giles Subject: Re: S+L and M of A on cd Tony from Oxford said on Friday > Have not seen, over here at least, either Miles of Aisles > or Shadows and Light on CD which I would not mind adding to my collection. Hi Tony I'm reading on Monday evening, so I guess you might have some answers by now, but I thought I'd expand slightly on Jackie in East Sussex's reply to you. Definitely look out for the import version of S&L, because the original single CD version has at least one track missing - Free Man In Paris, I think. The import version is also HDCD if that makes any difference to you. I had to get my copy through CDNow. The video of S&L was available at Amazon a few months back, but only NTSC. So if your video player can only play PAL tapes your out of luck. I love the album so much, I went out and bought a new video player just so I could play the video!! BUT...Be warned - the video is not cheap, and I ended up having to pay import duties and VAT in addition to P&P which took the totla cost up to somewhere in the region of 50 UK style smackers! ALSO, if you are used to the vinyl version of the album, be warned that it is slightly different. Jaco gets a solo on the vid, but Woodstock is missing :-( Seeing as I am now missing an arm and a leg, I play my copy quite a lot. Which is nice. The CD of MofA I ordered from MVC (In Harrow) - I suppose any shop can get it if they can. > To my mind Court through to Don Juan contains my personnel favourites with > Hejira being the greatest by far. Meeeeeeee tooooooooo. > Saw Joni once,at Wembley Stadium, around '84, A vast echoey hall totally > unsuited to her music I was at the box office that night buying Marillion tickets (FOR FREINDS OF MINE, REALLY) when I heard her echoing around. I was so upset at having missed the gig. You probably know that it was broadcast by the beeb some time after, which a friend of mine has on video. I like the show - but I can see how many people wouldn't like the lead guitarist's contributions. Wish I'd seen her live. All the best, Martin in London. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 13:03:09 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Jimmy Webb - deciphering MacArthur Park Anne wrote: > None of us could figure out what MacArthur Park is really about - we decided > it's probably an acid flashback inspired song. I mentioned this over dinner > last night, and my boyfriend looked puzzled and said "no, it's about a > relationship that's ended - the 'cake' being the great relationship that > he's never going to be able to duplicate..." hmmm... and yes, we all had to > admit liking the song (in true Bob-music-slut-fashion) even tho' the lyrics > are um questionable... The quest for deciphering the lyrics to MacArthur Park has been going on ever since the song came out. I don't believe that Jimmy has ever completely explained what they meant - I've only read about him wanting to leave it up to the interpretation of the individual listener. And so the myth grows. However, a friend of mine was a friend of Webb's in the early days of his career in L.A. and related to me what he claims is the real story. There is a real MacArthur Park near downtown L.A. It is one of the oldest parks in the city. Supposedly Jimmy planned a birthday party for a true love, Susan, one afternoon at the park. He also planned to propose marriage to her that day. He asked and she said "no" and he was devastated. Soon after she married someone else. If this account is true, many of the metaphors in the song make more sense. There are also many other early songs he wrote that are supposedly about Susan. One in particular is "The Hive", which I recall is on one of Richard Harris albums of Webb songs. It is a very dark and chilling song about a woman marrying someone who is to never going to really know her and is going to drain her soul by keeping her locked up and repressed in "The Hive". A classic example of Webb "spitting out his bitterness." I don't have the lyrics but have read them and listened to the song with my friend and it reminds me of "A Doll's House" and also themes in some of Joni's songs such as "The Arrangement" and the various characters living trapped lives in HOSL. Kakki NP: Michael Ruff - Seeing For The Very First Time ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 15:35:17 -0700 From: "Brett Code" Subject: RE: Joni in the Malls - "Conversation" LOTC This was the real version, straight from the album. One of the funniest 'muzak' versions of a JM song I've heard was in the locker room of a fitness centre in a hotel - it was a xylophone version of 'In France They Kiss on Main Street'. I laughed, felt horrified at the sound and then got all proud, because I was sure I was the only one in the room who not only knew the song but also knew all the lyrics. I sang along gaily and laughed. Brett Catherine McKay said: Was it the original Joni version or a Muzak version? I'm only asking because sometimes you hear the strangest tunes redone in Muzak format. Sometimes I think whoever records this kind of stuff has a really whacky sense of humour so they'll take something that may have started out as heavy metal, for example, and do a Muzak version of it. I wonder whether it might be kind of an in-joke among musicians who "have" to record watered-down versions of music to make a living, but who want to get in a little dig at the powers-that-be by recording something by Guns'n'roses that Mum is going to hear at the mall and think, "Oh, isn't that a pretty tune?" I can say, from personal experience, that, when I was managing a call centre, I used to sometimes use for the Music on Hold (when I could get away with it!) something a little "different" from what you might normally hear just to see if we'd get a reaction out of anyone. Heh-heh-heh. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 23:05:01 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Joni voted top 20 I think Madonna is way more talented than many give her credit for. I think she is very like Joni in that she has done her own thing and succeeded and is innovative. I am not particulalry a fan-I have only one of her albums-Ray of Light which i like very much. Martin Giles wrote: > Hi Colin > > Yep, I thought it would go that way. I decided not to watch or vote, as > it would all be too depressing. Madonna's OK in her way, but c'mon now!! > > Best wishes, > Martin. > > > Channel four is showing a music program for people of the millenium, > > voted on by the general public. > > In the Best Female Singer category, our Joni was number 20 and Madonna > > was number 1. - -- "It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 23:06:29 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Joni in VF "Icons of Rock" In the "bonus edition" that came with the new Vanity Fair (Paz' pretty pal Meg Ryan on the cover), There's a mini-magazine entitled "Icons of Rock". Given that it was VF and not Entertainment Weekly or something, I knew Joni would be there and voila! there she is in a Joel Bernstein photo, leaping in the air with her hair flying all about. No text, just the photo...but they do refer to her again on page 26 as one of the "granola singer-songwriters" along with JT, Carole, Carly, Jackson, and CSN... Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 23:38:46 EST From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: JAZZ TAKES and the Grammys Hello, everybody: I got a call from ARKADIA JAZZ today, suggesting I alert anyone I know who happens to be a member of NARAS (National Academy of Recording Arts & Sciences) that my CD, JAZZ TAKES ON JONI MITCHELL, is on the preliminary ballot...Field 9, Category 43. This is the first of I-don't-know-how-many steps on the way to a Grammy nomination. I hope I can survive one or two balloting rounds anyway. I knew it was unique and significant when I created it, but the response of the people on JMDL testified to something even more important: that it was pleasurable. You made me very happy. The sequel is moving (inching) forward. Might I speak to the enthusiasm about Jon Hendricks and Annie Ross and just add one thing? The real pioneer in bebop lyric writing was the late Eddie Jefferson. Some of his recordings are still available, including the pathbreaking "Moody's Mood for Love." My favorite is the version he did of "Body and Soul" in tribute to Coleman Hawkins.This is the source of the Manhattan Transfer version. Some of you may have heard that but not noticed that Eddie is credited. I played with him a couple of times in Richie Cole's group at the old Tin Palace on the Bowery in NY. I wish I'd done a better job! Ciao for now, DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 23:38:42 -0500 From: Richard Rice Subject: See what I mean! You guys are cruel. You are soooo nice and soooo considerate and soooo, I dunno, not of this world... I was only kidding when I asked if there were any new tabs. Just added on to my post to show I was being sarcastic. But no. Mark and Anne were so kind, to not only respond to my mailing but to also give regards concerning NEW tabs!!!! GOD! What is with you people? Between Wally, and Les, and Ashara, and Catherine, and Bob... For crying out loud. Don't you guys know how to be shallow, mean spirited, petty, conniving, bitter, or one hundred and one other petty things most of the world is? Is THIS the effect Joni is having on you people? That woman must be stopped! Good music is one thing but to have such deleterious effects on the souls of so many... No wonder most of the world isn't listening to her music. They'd probably melt like the wicked old witch. Now just stop it, ok. Bob, one more mention of some great new tape of unknown Joni content is going to snap my poor little brain. You realize, not only do I have to get the Parker and the Fly, I have to buy ANOTHER TAPE and impose on your kindness yet again! Either that or drive myself crazy knowing there is actual Joni material I don't have. Ahhhhhhhh. And you, Mark! Forcing the purchase of an acoustic on me, eh? Bah! You people are just too damn special. I must to a Google search for 'Creeps On-Line.' Yeah, that's the ticket. (Just kidding. Only kidding. ) Many thanks, Mark, Anne, et al. You have made these past few months very, very special. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 23:52:02 -0500 From: Richard Rice Subject: Re: Costing a Mint. And a half. Howdy Mark, Thanks for the reply. I always enjoy hearing from you all. I had a dream the other night that Joni's new CD was realllllllly bad, just as you feared. I kept thinking, 'Mark was right. Mark was right.' Then I woke up. Whew. Most of the time I dream aliens are taking over the world and I am the last human alive. So this was a pleasant dream... for me. I agree an acoustic sounds so much nicer. I hate that Joni is recording only with a Parker. It lacks all the warmth of hearing slack strings and all. On the other hand, I hate hate hate breaking strings. I so dislike re-stringing, when one breaks I end up letting the guitar sit for a week or two in frustration. ( As is presently the case.) The g, b, and high e strings always seem to go. I have little ear at this point in my novice career, so I marvel at Joni's ability to just zip from one tuning to another. Thanks again for the reply. I hope you (and all) find my post(s) funny. They were meant to be. j. > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 22:14:33 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: BRAVO Les Michael wrote regarding the remastered Jonifest Boxed Set: > << If everyone will rise > now I think we can all give the man a standing ovation. >> And Bob led the group: > And I'll lead the group singing... > > For he's a Joni good fellow > For he's a Joni good fellow, > For he's a Joni good felllllllooooooooooooooow, > Which nobody can deny!!! > > Amen, super job Les! Me's threes. When I received the remastered version the other day I had no idea that Les worked this miracle! The sound quality is utterly amazing. Gee Les, I think you are our own resident Henry Lewy. ;-) Just an in-cre-di-ble job. Kakki NP: Seal Unplugged - Stone Free (oh...my...gawd...also out of this galaxy - Thank you J.V.T.!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 23:29:01 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: JAZZ TAKES and the Grammys David Lahm wrote: > Hello, everybody: I got a call from ARKADIA JAZZ today, suggesting I alert > anyone I know who happens to be a member of NARAS (National Academy of > Recording Arts & Sciences) that my CD, JAZZ TAKES ON JONI MITCHELL, is on the > preliminary ballot...Field 9, Category 43. This is the first of > I-don't-know-how-many steps on the way to a Grammy nomination. I hope I can > survive one or two balloting rounds anyway. Wow, this is wonderful! I hope you make it all the way, David! Congratulations and best wishes! I also am looking forward to your Joni sequel. Kakki NP: Seal Unplugged - Violet ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V1 #265 ****************************** The Song and Album Voting Booths are open! Cast your votes by clicking the links at http://www.jmdl.com/gallery username: jimdle password: siquomb ------- Don't forget about these ongoing projects: Glossary project: Send a blank message to for all the details. FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Trivia Project: Send your Joni trivia questions and/or answers to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? - -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe onlyjoni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?