From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V1 #28 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk onlyJMDL Digest Friday, April 30 1999 Volume 01 : Number 028 TapeTree #8 is ready to roll. To sign up go to: http://www.jmdl.com/trading ------- Join the Joni Mitchell Internet Community Glossary project. Send a blank message to for all the details. ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- More info on Joni's musical influences and style [marc.verbruggen@alcatel] Re: Joni gets a degree! (JC) ["Kakki" ] Joni gets a degree (JC) [evian ] Re: Joni on "Jeopardy!" [JRMCo1@aol.com] Re: Hello-HA! DJRD [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] Great Children's Songs--very little Joni content ["Alan Larson" ] Re: Great Children's Songs--very little Joni content [TerryM2442@aol.com] Re: Joni on "Jeopardy!" ["Eric Taylor" ] money distribution in Holly(Geffen)wood (and my dreamland vision of it!) [Gellerray@aol.co] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:28:48 +0200 From: marc.verbruggen@alcatel.be Subject: More info on Joni's musical influences and style My 15 year old daughter is going to write a paper on Joni Mitchell. I gave her a lot of information from the great www.jonimitchell.com website, but she would like to receive more information on her different music styles, the persons that influence(d) her. If anyone can send me more information, she will be very happy. Please mail it to marc.verbruggen@alcatel.be Thanks, also from my daughter ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 00:35:21 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Joni gets a degree! (JC) Dear Joan, This certainly beats that cheesy little R&R Hall of Fame award tossed your way, eh? As you asked, I did melt it down and made a rather nice little sculpture from it for you. You are quite the clever girl, leading everyone to think I was really Klein. But all credit where it is due, he has done such a bloody good job defending himself as "Don Rowe" that is was about time for him to uncover himself. I'm still safe - that Dulson fellow has kindly agreed to come out as me and I think it will be very believable to the folks. His hybrid California-Manchester accent comes through even in his writing. Nice chap, he is. David is here and wanted to say hello so I will pass the keys over to him. See you soon, luv. Graham N.P. Willy - Live at Our House 4/29/69 JOANIE! You're not still mad at me, are you? You don't call, you don't write. I still don't know what I did to tick you off this time. Please...can't we be pals again, huh? I know I tend to go on a roll and run off at the mouth in interviews about the old days.....but hey, you do, too, sweetie! You may have heard me and the boys are working on a tour this summer and we've all agreed you just HAVE to join us. It will be just like Deja Vu all over again....you can smoke to your heart's content riding in the Lear jet, chronicle the journey with a batch of new songs....come on...this beats busing it with The Bob any day. Lion Hugs, Croz NP: The Dawntreader (a new cover I've just worked out with CPR - you gotta hear it!) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 02:14:00 -0600 From: evian Subject: Joni gets a degree (JC) Croz writes: > You're not still mad at me, are you? > Well, DUH! Musselini my ASS, David! You think you are all flowers and butterflies to work with? And that ego! I even prayed for you when you had the operation..... Maybe I will join you for the tour... but one more comment about me having balls, and I will pop you in your chubby nose, my friend! And ANOTHER version of the Dawntreader?? Honey, get over yourself already! np in MY house, David: "THE WINDFALL" And Willy dear, sorry about throwing that Klein persona on you... Les and the gang were starting to get suspicious of Don Rowe... they were figuring it all out, and I needed Klein to stay on the list -- I still needed a spy, and the women sure do love Larry, so I had to use you as a decoy... no regrets, coyote... but Klein still rules the roost, so to speak! Hope to see you this summer on the tour... but please, I don't care if David sweats like a warthog... I am allergic to air conditioning, so tell him to deal with it! love, Joan p.s. the vase is still on the shelf, but the cats are no longer in the yard... after the trouble I went through with Man from Mars, they don't leave the house anymore... Klein/Don Rowe can fill you in on our cat traumas. ....Willie -- there are still so many reasons, why I luv yoooou.... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 05:53:51 EDT From: JRMCo1@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni on "Jeopardy!" Kate said: <> I'm sure you're right, Kate. I made a beeline for the PC anxious to type JC to y'all at the mere mention of Joni and the front end of the question. Could've sworn I heard a contestant chime in out of the corner of my eye. Assumed that one was a gimme...an utter no brainer! Like, duh. Fools, I tell you. Fools...like me. {blush} Thanks for setting the record straight. Geez, nothing gets by you guys. I didn't blither completely, though. I got the category part right. Right? See, I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and doggone it... I've got to get on that show! With questions like the ones tonight I could get my hands on some of that...easy money (is this what Rickie Lee Jones was talking about?). - -Julius np: Jeopordy theme song in my head, over and over and over. No wait. Aghh! Just segued into a dreaded endless loop of "It's a Small World After All" !! Must...dial...9-1-1... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:08:03 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: Hello-HA! DJRD Eric returns: ***Also seriously listened to DJRD the other day and must say I think it is Joni's finest. No wonder Charles Mingus wanted her to compose his final album! Joco is superb!! But Paprika Plains is in a league with Ludwig.... *** Welcome back, Eric! Yes, DJRD is quite a feast - I'd love to hear what folks make of Paprika Plains...I don't even know where to start with it! I love DJRD though, one of the songs I've really felt recently is "Jericho" - such an honest love song, the way that she combines the emotions and feelings with the mechanics of a relationship. "I need your confidence, baby, and the gift of your extra time In turn I'll give you mine Sweet Darling, it's a rich exchange" "Anyone can tell you just how hard it is to make and keep a friend Maybe they'll short sell you - or maybe it's you Judas, in the end When you just can no longer pretend That you're getting what you need Or you're giving out anything for them to grow and feed on" It's words like these that separate Joni from the crowd; most love songs are one-sided, here Joni doesn't talk about the elation of love, or the sadness of love gone bad, but rather the responsibility of love and the realization that if it's not working, it could just as easily be the fault of either party. And she also realizes there are no guarantees..."I'll TRY to keep myself open up to you...". She sings the exact same line (3) times in the song, and each time it means something different: The first time it's almost as if the emphasis is on "open", the promise of the new relationship; the second time it seems like it's "to you", acknowledging the needs of her partner; the final time it plays as if the focus is on "myself", realizing she has to let run free the "wild and gentle dogs" inside of her. Just one great song off of a bonafide masterpiece... Bob NP: Paul McCartney, "Long Haired Lady" (kinda sad to hear this one now) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:36:34 -0700 From: "Alan Larson" Subject: Great Children's Songs--very little Joni content Here is my list of songs I would like to someday be fortunate to perform for children. I play rhythm guitar, an old Gibson J-35 sunburst acoustic, and sing. If anyone knows of any real classic children's songs I'm overlooking, please feel free to add them in reply. thanks. 1. Puff the Magic Dragon 2. Circle Game 3. Paul Stookey's song about baseball, whatever its name. Anyone? 4. The Pony Man -- Gordon Lightfoot 5. Time Was -- Phil Ochs 6. Bad Bad Leroy Brown -- Jim Croce 7. You've Got a Friend -- Carole King 8. House on Pooh Corner -- Kenny Loggins 9. If I Had Wings -- PP&M 10. On the Amazon -- Don McLean I know the age of the children sung to would make a big difference, but I guess I'm shooting at the 8-12 year range. What do you think of these selections? Can you think of any other great ones? alan@ames.net ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 17:55:20 -0400 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: Re: Great Children's Songs--very little Joni content Personally, I would omit "Big, Bad Leroy Brown" especially after Littleton, Colorado. "Day is Done" by Peter, Paul & Mary might be very appropriate, however. There is a Limelighters' album from the 60s called "Through Children's Eyes" that has a ton of wonderful children's songs, if it is still available anywhere. Marlo Thomas had some great stuff in the 70s, and there is always the Beatles "Yellow Submarine." And a great pleaser in my work with kids has always been Loudon Wainwright III's "Dead Skunk in the Middle of the Road." (the Rev) Vince Alan Larson wrote: > Here is my list of songs I would like to someday be fortunate to perform for > children. I play rhythm guitar, an old Gibson J-35 sunburst acoustic, and > sing. > > If anyone knows of any real classic children's songs I'm overlooking, please > feel free to add them in reply. thanks. > > 1. Puff the Magic Dragon > > 2. Circle Game > > 3. Paul Stookey's song about baseball, whatever its name. Anyone? > > 4. The Pony Man -- Gordon Lightfoot > > 5. Time Was -- Phil Ochs > > 6. Bad Bad Leroy Brown -- Jim Croce > > 7. You've Got a Friend -- Carole King > > 8. House on Pooh Corner -- Kenny Loggins > > 9. If I Had Wings -- PP&M > > 10. On the Amazon -- Don McLean > > I know the age of the children sung to would make a big difference, but I > guess I'm shooting at the 8-12 year range. What do you think of these > selections? Can you think of any other great ones? > > alan@ames.net ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:36:35 EDT From: JRMCo1@aol.com Subject: Re: Great Children's Songs--very little Joni content While I haven't heard it played on guitar, "John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmitt" has always been a favorite among kids I've worked with (okay, I like it, too). That and the "Hokey Pokey" have cute little dances that go along with them as well. Then there's "Itsy Bitsy Spider". Oh, to be young again. - -Julius, np: "Who put the 'bop' in the bop shoo bop, who put the 'bang' in the polly walla bing bang." Name *that* tune. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 17:42:55 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Hello-HA! DJRD > Just one great song off of a bonafide masterpiece... And one that's much more interesting and musically diverse than Hejira in my not so humble opinion. I thought David Lahm's comments on Hejira were interesting. I always thought that musically it was rather 'safe' compared to the bolder departure she made on HOSL. It's interesting that a lot of people on the list who say the words are secondary to them in comparison to the overall sound of the music seem to point to Hejira as their favorite. To me this says, 'Come on, you guys! Don't tell me you don't listen to the words and that they aren't as important to you as the music!' Mark in Seattle (Will he *ever* shut up with his Hejira heresy?) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 23:12:34 EDT From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Re: Great Children's Songs--very little Joni content One of my all time favorite children's song is "Thanks A Lot". I've only heard Raffi play it and have no idea whether he wrote it as well. Terry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 01:51:47 -0400 From: "Eric Taylor" Subject: Re: Joni on "Jeopardy!" Julius posted: <> Don't you just hate it when that happens?! DAMN those jingles! I still have commercials from the 60's occupying too many braincells. What I try to do in these situations is replace it with a tune I like. & Paprika Plains is my usual antidote. "When I was three feet small and wide-eyed open to it all..." never fails. & "I'm floating into dreams / I'm floating off, I'm floating into my dreams...." is arguably the the greatest line Joni ever delivered. In My Dweems We Fwy.... E.T. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 02:50:28 EDT From: Gellerray@aol.com Subject: money distribution in Holly(Geffen)wood (and my dreamland vision of it!) In a message dated 99-04-27 16:47:18 EDT, you write: Publishing royalties are completely different and are untouchable. Joni owns all her publishing, not Geffen. It is putting a lien on her personal property to recoup record advances. Totally improper and most probably illegal in all cases, unless for some reason she assigned those publishing royalties to him, which is not the case. Right, that makes sense--i mean especially the first part about how the two royalty types are different beasts. I just needed it spelled out and for that i thank you--and Fred--and Randy. So then my next question is: how were they able to get at her publishing royalties--the bastards! << I also question his statement of "millions" in advances to Joni. Joni herself has been quoted as saying advances for each of the albums in the 80s (under Geffen label) were around $300,000. >> And may I add, however naiive it may sound, however non-bottom line, that I think for any Joni Mitchell album's worth of songs to garner her only $300,000 (considering that is, the way money is generated in the record industry and the way it is doled out in general there) seems sad indeed. Even when Joni doesn't hit her mark in a way that satisfies me (which i found sadly to be the case on the last album) she should be paid BIG BUCKS just for stepping near a microphone and a tape recorder. What that woman has done for our culture is not, for sure, fully measured yet--how could it be? But it is there in many "obvious" ways (The Circle Game at camp and schools, the very phrase Both Sides Now) subtler ways (o god i can't even--there are too many) and in ways that are not only subtle but are not yet fully formed--they're still developing. That's why Sweden, Canada, Billboard, et alia gave her those awards. Now, i know she's not starving by any means, but can we please make sure she has enough money to keep going (in Hejira style), without further insult and humiliation! $300,000. Please. I know I am dreaming to compare them because of the way it all works, but how many millions do Billy Joel and The Rolling Stones and even (everyone's beloved) Janet and (many people's beloved) Madonna, rake in when they sign and sing? Yes, yes, I know--they sell (and they work hard and they're all talented). But Joni invented a genre (the non-genre?), and as she was doing it she told us things that were so deep and yet so recognizable, so pure and yet so sophisticated, so sombre, so serious and yet so ultimately life-affirming that, that, that, well...she should get at least $2 million a record, I say! She should be protected, venerated and well-compensated! I know, I should calm down. (and i know i am preaching to the converted, though others may see it in more realistic terms--that is you get paid what you generate, period). But again: Demi Moore gets 12 million dollars for that stripper movie and all those guys* ( i don't know--like Kevin Costner, and Jim Carrey and Tom Hanks--who, granted, are three "talented" men) get 20 million dollars a movie, and Joni Mitchell gets only $300, 000 per record--if she's lucky! Ugh. And I know--it's capitalism, it's business, it's...how Joni got rich herself. And yet...there is something in there i don't like. all right--it's true--i'm a bit stressed (always) because it's finals time--but i'm sending this anyway, rant and all...r * and let's not forget john travolta--who i know is going to be everyone's favorite (yuk) and i know he's a "good" actor--but 20 million dollars a movie!? ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V1 #28 ***************************** There is now a JMDL tape trading list. Interested traders can get more details at http://www.jmdl.com/trading ------- The Song and Album Voting Booths are open again! 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