From: les@jmdl.com (onlyJMDL Digest) To: onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: onlyJMDL Digest V1 #17 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk onlyJMDL Digest Wednesday, April 21 1999 Volume 01 : Number 017 Join the Joni Mitchell Internet Community Glossary project. Send a blank message to for all the details. ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Cactus anyone? [Scott Price ] All this talk about Holy-Ness Now [Michael Paz ] Re: Re[2]: Court & Spark as a song cycle (Long & Twisted) ["Mark or Travi] Subject only - Songbooks taken care of; thank you all!! [jeverett@postmas] Re: Re[2]: Court & Spark ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Re[2]: Court & Spark as a song cycle (Long & Twisted) ["Mark or Travi] Guitar playing and Joni [CaTGirl627@aol.com] RE: Painting with words... ["Wally Kairuz" ] Jazz Takes On..>A review [Michael Paz ] Painting with Paz and Marcel? [Michael Paz ] Re: Cactus anyone? [dsk ] Re: Punctuation on C&S ["Kakki" ] Re: Painting with words... where? [Randy Remote ] Re: Painting with words - 2 ["Kakki" ] Re: Painting with words... ["Helen M. Adcock" ] Court and Spark [Zapuppy@webtv.net (Rick & Penny Gibbons)] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:19:39 -0700 From: Scott Price Subject: Cactus anyone? >Bob asked: > >>And what's the deal with cactuses anyway? Cactus Tree, cactuses outside the >>train window, The Cactus Tree motel in Amelia...what do cacti represent? >and Kakki responded: > >>An age-old Joni question, no doubt. She definitely digs those cute prickly >>cacti. This is purely speculation, but as a resident of the northern part of the U.S. I can say that whenever I've seen a native cactus it's a little bit of culture shock at work. I don't think many cacti grow on the Canadian prairies :-) so perhaps they were a bit of a novelty to Joni, hence her references to them. The discussion of "Court and Spark" has been stimulating and I thank all who have posted their thoughts on this brilliant album. I for one would never shy away from it just because it was Joni's most commercially successful and "popular" album. Hmmm...I wonder why? It is perhaps more "accessible" than many of her others but what's wrong with that? Of all her albums, I consider C&S my "best friend." It's so comfortable! Regarding the song "Court and Spark" if I could only use one word to sum it up it'd be "bittersweet." To me it's Joni having to decide whether to go with her heart or her intellect. She's VERY close to really falling for this guy, but after much contemplation decides that no matter how well he relates to her there's just something about him that's not going to work. Is she independent or what? :-) Scott ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 19:33:00 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: All this talk about Holy-Ness Now All this talk about Joni losing it has got me crazy. I think the Painting video is no less than amazing. Even my children dig it. Mikey thinks Joni is totally cool because dad likes her and because he is connecting with the songs (and besides she was on Seal's record on that Batman theme-WHOA!) Julian also is a Joni fan now and does a hell of a read on Big Yellow Taxi. I love her NEW sound and her voice is so rich and still penetrates me to my soul with her words AND feeling. As far as the set list goes, well I am always happy and never happy. I am content with the set she chooses cause it means alot to me that sbe continues to work when she doesn't really need/have/want? to. But then I am the type of person who talks about what I am going to have for dinner while I am dining on cracked crab for lunch. Anyone who thinks she is losing it ought to increase their medication or get off it cold turkey. I'll continue to support her music until she croaks like a frog to sampled farts through a flanger and then I probably will still find that brilliant for some reason, after all SIQUOMB. Love Michael NP-Edith and the Kingpin-David Lahm et. al(who won't get out of my player since yesterday) Continued success and happiness to all of the above! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:47:53 -0600 From: evian Subject: C&S (JC) Just have to say that I love this discussion of C&S... I always wondered why we never seem to mention it. I don't have anything useful to add to the thread, but I just wanted to say that it has always irked me when people said stuff like "oh, they aren't a Joni fan, they jumped off the bandwagon after C&S." Sure, lots of people only bought C&S, and that's it, but so what? I am a Prince fan (I refuse to call him "the Artist"... just simply annoys the hell outta me to do so), and I own, I don't know, 8 or 9 albums of his. However, I quickly got off the bandwagon when he started releasing all that crappy stuff (Disclaimer: I think they are crappy, they may not be, but most of the post Graffitti Bridge stuff just doesn't do it for me), but I still call myself a Prince fan because of his early albums. Likewise, I have bought many cds by various artists that I love, but I just am not interested in grabbing their back catalgue, or keeping up with their new releases. For example, I own Van's MOONDANCE, but nothing else... am I not a fan because I love that album, but I am just not inspired to buy the rest of his catalogue? I think C&S's popularity has hampered our discussion of a wonderful album. C&S is probably the one Joni album I come back to the most, and I am so glad it is being discussed now. Evian np: what else... C&S.... and isn't "Car on the Hill" simply the catchiest tune you have ever heard in your life?????? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:18:29 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Re[2]: Court & Spark as a song cycle (Long & Twisted) > You know Kakki, I was actually going to post on the MUSIC of C&S and comment > on the musicians, etc (and I'll get to that eventually), but after listening > to the record 6-7 times in a row I picked up on the SEQUENCING, how she uses > her glorious piano to segue cautious optimism to exuberant joy to sorrow and > emptiness. Prior to yesterday, I never thought of the record as a cycle at > all, but like we've said before, isn't that the majesty of Joni's canon, > that it provides re-discovered treasure... Ok I'm going to jump in here. One of the things I love about C&S is the sequencing and the way one song seems to flow into the next. It's almost like you have 2 suites the first beginning with 'Court & Spark' and ending with 'The Same Situation' and the second beginning with 'Car on a Hill' and ending with 'Twisted'. > > And what's the deal with cactuses anyway? Cactus Tree, cactuses outside the > train window, The Cactus Tree motel in Amelia...what do cacti represent? > Does she relate to the cactus as a survivor in a desert environment, and > equate herself to it? But I digress... Her heart is full and hollow like a cactus tree. The result of loving your lovin' but not loving it like you love your freedom. Although I've always thought 'Help Me' was one of Joni's most 'commercial' or 'pop' sounding songs, I've also always thought that that one line perfectly summed up the whole confusion wrought by so-called 'free love' in the 70's. That connection with another human feels so good but what might I be missing out on if I commit? > > < sure she closely related to the sentiment in that song.>> > > And while I know the Geffen connection here, I think we can shortchange > ourself by saying "OK, I know what this song's about, on to the next one". I > admit it's the weakest link in the song cycle, though..I'd love to hear what > other folks think about the placement of Free Man on the record... It is rather abrupt. 'Help Me' sort of fades out with the guitar playing over the horns and then BAM - you get those woodwinds sounding almost shrill at the beginning of 'Free Man'. I kind of like what that does though. It's like cold water thrown in your face after the way 'Help Me' makes your mind wander off into the ether. Reality hits home once again. > I agree with you on the use of "fallen angels", I don't have much to say about the song C&S. I think for me to decipher too much of what it's about would detract from it - rob it of it's mystique & mystery. I do love that last line though, both the lyric and the chimes with the horn under them at the end. > > And who knows? But we can all agree that it's a much deeper work than it's > usually credited with being... Here, here! (or is it hear, hear?) > > Hoping this discussion isn't ending but only beginning, And I'm hoping the same. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 02:20:40 +0100 From: jeverett@postmaster.co.uk Subject: Subject only - Songbooks taken care of; thank you all!! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:38:23 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Re[2]: Court & Spark To me Joni's much more like the person in > Twisted.>> > > Which is why she covers the song and places it right after TC...to give > her story a happy ending. I think she threw 'Twisted' in to provide as a contrast to 'Trouble Child' and also to lighten things up. She takes the subject she has tackled so seriously in 'Trouble Child' and covers a song that treats it in a comic manner. Joni is also a fan of Lambert Hendricks & Ross and this was a good chance for her to cover one of their songs (as she does on HOSL with 'Centerpiece'.) as the flip side of one of her own. > > Look at the references: > > 1. In "Help Me", she 'gets that CRAZY feeling again'... > 2. In "People's Parties", she says (as a throwaway) "I told you when I > met you I was CRAZY". > 3. In "Just Like This Train", she realizes that 'jealous lovin' will > make you CRAZY, if you can't find your goodness 'cause you lost your > heart'. > > IMO, when she sees the unattached barfly broad in "Raised on Robbery", > it pushes her over the edge to where she feels she has to DO something - > she knows simple advice and religion aren't going to resolve it, so she > turns to Professional advice in "Trouble Child", probably a combination > of her own experiences with therapy as well as those of others close to > her. It IS tough to think of Joni in this situation as we care for her > SO deeply... > > But (like we've mentioned in the Therapy thread) ultimately she > realizes: > 1. she has to solve her own problems, and > 2. there's really nothing wrong with her at all, and "Twisted" is the > resolution to the whole mini-opera... > > Of course, I could be all wet!! No I think you might be on to something here! Madness or craziness does seem to be a theme that runs through this record. The madman in C&S tempting her to 'lay down the heavy burden of sanity' as Don Quixote would say, the feeling of giving in and losing control in 'Help Me', the craziness of the starmaker machinery in 'Free Man' and the need to escape from it and all those crazy people at those 'People's Parties'. 'The Same Situation' and 'Car on a Hill' are about how you can drive yourself crazy when you're in love and 'Down to You' & 'Just Like This Train' are about how you can drive yourself crazy when you're falling out of love. 'Raised on Robbery' is just a portrait of crazy woman who makes her living off of 'love' and the last two songs are about being perceived as insane, one from a serious perspective and one from a comic perspective. Could the title 'Court and Spark' be translated to 'Love and Madness'? Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 21:41:12 -0400 From: "Eric Taylor" Subject: Re: Painting with words... wallykai@interserver.com.ar misinterpreted me big time: <> Yes I am a Joni fanatic. So I like Joni's voice now more than ever and defend her when people claim she's lost it? Does this make me a frightened, whimpering, childish snob? It was rude for me to call Colin's comment that some tech enhanced Joni's voice on TTT "stupid." And the "Go Carly" comment was a little nasty. But ya gotta admit he asked for it! What's your excuse? ;~D E.T. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 18:46:14 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Re[2]: Court & Spark as a song cycle (Long & Twisted) > Marcel notes: > > < career.>> > > I totally agree, and I think MOA is the closer, just like S&L is the > closer to the second phase... > > Bob > > NP: The Who, "Bargain" (gotta take a break from C&S :~)) This is what I've thought for a long time. 'Mingus' caps the second phase & like Bob says, S&L is kind of a recap. Mark in Seattle > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 22:25:05 EDT From: CaTGirl627@aol.com Subject: Guitar playing and Joni (((((((GREETINGS JONI FRIENDS))))))) I just wanted to take this moment to thank everyone for all the wonderful Joni chat. I just love it!! I love it so much that after over 2 years of not playing her music on my guitar, I put new strings on it and now have one guitar in 'reg. tuning' and one in"Joni tuning". I have been playing mainly "Conversation", "Yvette","Sunny Sunday"...all her stuff from TI. That songbook is great with all the "right" tunings. If I had not been told about this list(Big Thanks Jimmy!) I would still be trying to get my own list going (JoniMItchellfans@onelist.com) and for the most part talking to myself. If my list does not take off soon I will just hit delete. This list ( I know it is huge) has alot more going for it then my own. And because of this list I can call myself a guitar player again! So thank-you all for getting my "court and SPARK" going again!!!! Much love to all! Catgirl prrrrrrrrrrrr ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:06:14 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: Painting with words... i don't think colin was asking for anything. and if you're a self-confessed fanatic, then there's nothing else i have to say to you for the time being. wallyk - -----Original Message----- De: Eric Taylor Para: Wally Kairuz ; JMDL Fecha: Martes 20 de Abril de 1999 19:48 Asunto: Re: Painting with words... >wallykai@interserver.com.ar misinterpreted me big time: > > ><frightened-child whimpering about how much BETTER joni's voice is today >plain stupid too. i wasn't embarrassed watching pwwam, but i wasn't thrilled >either. go carly, indeed! as if we needed to make that kind of choice on the >list. "oh you don't like joni's voice today, well, go mariah!" and help me >isn't necessarily my favorite joni mitchell song either.>> > > Yes I am a Joni fanatic. So I like Joni's voice now more than ever and >defend her when people claim she's lost it? Does this make me a frightened, >whimpering, childish snob? > It was rude for me to call Colin's comment that some tech enhanced >Joni's voice on TTT "stupid." And the "Go Carly" comment was a little nasty. >But ya gotta admit he asked for it! > What's your excuse? > ;~D > E.T. > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 22:23:35 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Jazz Takes On..>A review Helloooo Joni Fans- Hats off to Dave and the band. I think Joni herself will like this take on her music. [Solid Love] was a surprise for me, cause although I like the song, it is NOT one of my faves (originally speaking). Still, the treatment this band gives BOTH versions are interesting and forced me to go back and listen to the original. Not a song that "I" would have picked, but "I'm" glad he did. I like the second version the best. It has a pronounced New Orleans vibe (which is always a good thing for me). [Song For Sharon] Easily one of my faves that I cover. I love the vibes so much! Vibes has always been one of my favorite instruments (thanks Lionel and Gary). David Friedman really does the instrument and the songwriter honor here. What I want to know is, Is the verse that David was singing, "I can keep my cool at poker..."? [Edith and the Kingpin] Another one that I cover (but on piano this time and I have done this one for a long time). I find this version quite sad and it nails it for me because the song IS sad. Randy Brecker plays flugel on this cut and you can just feel the darkness of the lyric even though it is not being sung with words. The piano is understated and quite low in the mix (for my taste especially with the sparseness of instrumentation), but quite expressive as well. The tempo here is divine. [Coyote] Yet another one I cover on piano instead of guitar. I find this song a little busy for my taste, BUT I still love the bass clarinet on this and the opening is great. The flute here reminded me of how shrill her voice could be when she was still young. [Blue Motel Room] I LOVE the organ (Mike LeDonne) AND the harmonica (William Galison) on this song. It has always been one of my faves and I would love to learn this. This version is quite beautifully done and easily one of the best on the record. [Blonde in the Bleachers] One of my personal favorite Joni tunes of all time. This treatment, especially with the combo of violin and vibes creates something very special for me and where it ends up is so out that it might scare even some hardcore jazz enthusiasts into buying this record. [Fiddle and the Drum] Right now this song holds the number one position for me on this record. IMHO this should have been the first song on the record. Ed Neumeister on trombone does a brilliant job. {there is a New Orleans band called MuleBone that has a Bone as a lead instrument that rivals any guitar player and/or fiddle player in town) Once again the piano is brilliantly subtle and SO supportive. [Solid Love] See above (I like this one the best). [Shadows and Light] This take is certainly in left field for me and I really dig the organ work on this song. The changes in rhythms and drums by Kenny Washington are over the top with originality and spontaneity. Some of the best sax work on the album (which is a huge compliment to Thomas Chapin because I have never been a big fan of the saxophone per se, but I certainly appreciate it when it's great and this is). All in all, this album will be on my player very regularly and I am certain I will get other people to discover it's sheer joy and celebration of these compositions. David's arrangements and playing on her leave tons of room for the other musicians to stretch out with their own thing and I always find that truly admirable in a musician these days. While I do not consider myself a "music critic" or "writer" by any stretch of the imagination, I wanted to submit a review of this record because of my heartfelt feelings for the music. David, you must have been around the seasons a few times, I don't think you need any smoke blown up your skirt, but these are my honest feelings and I wish you the best with this project. My ONLY real complaint with this record is: WHERE IS THE REST OF THE ALBUM?. What's for dessert? With her whole catalog out there, this easily could have been a double album. Thanks to Kakki for HER thoughts on this record, that inspired me to go out and get it. Cheers! Who said jazz is dead? Michael NP-Solid Love-The Joni Version ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 22:24:36 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Painting with Paz and Marcel? Don wrote: "I'll defer to Paz or Marcel a bit on this next point, since they're the experts, but I do know that miking for TV sound vs. CD sound are very diffent beasts." Don- Thanks for the kind thoughts but I am no expert. I do know what I like though and I think the DVD sounds fab, as did the broadcast I heard on PPV. I cannot vouch for the tape as I haven't heard it. The old girl is in fine voice and she still gets me hot, maybe even more so now that I am older too and she is sounding so sultry lately. That tart! Ramble on! Paz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:45:00 -0400 From: dsk Subject: Re: Cactus anyone? Scott Price wrote: > > ... I don't think many cacti grow on the Canadian > prairies :-) so perhaps they were a bit of a novelty to Joni, hence her > references to them. Ahh, cacti, another one of Joni's multi-meaning symbols. My first thought is "prickly on the outside to safeguard the tender inside." In interviews that Joni can be rather cantankerous, but she wouldn't be able to write the music she has if she wasn't also tender-hearted. Another thought: the beautiful fragile flowers that bloom on those prickly cacti. Very interesting visual contrast that might have caught Joni's painterly eye. Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 20:32:26 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Punctuation on C&S Bob wrote re: "All the guilty people," > And it could just be a typo, but I wonder why the first segment is a quote > and the rest of it's not...your interpretation sure makes a lot of sense > though. It could be typos in the original lyrics on the album which was perpetuated in the lyrics book, or maybe Joni is quotation mark-challenged. ;-) Or maybe stylistically she just didn't want to clutter up the printed lyrics with too many of them. But it seems there is an inherent implication that she is relating what he said. Kakki, word nerd ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 21:10:43 -0700 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Painting with words... where? Vince Lavieri wrote: > As much as some people are praising Painting with Words etc. and others > aren't, I have a question, as a resident of semi-rural western > Michigan... where are you buying it? Vince and John from downunder: You can get them online. Music Blvd has: PWWAM video $18 DVD $25 Shadows and Light ("special order") $63 They accept credit cards, checks and money orders. They ship fast on in-stock items to anywhere. Go get 'em. http://www.musicblvd.com Also wanted to respond to the question about producing sound for video. It's really the same as doing any live recording. It's the decisions made after recording that matter, because the realization is that alot, probably most people will be listening to it on a 4" TV speaker, so you make compromises while mixing with this in mind. Ideally you try to create a mix that sounds good on any system. I ordered the PPV on satellite ( I think it was $15 or $20), and hooked it up to my stereo speakers. I thought it sounded great. I loved the performance, the band, everything. Sure her voice has changed. This is nothing new. She'd rather smoke than stay a soprano. That's her call. She's still a great singer. RR ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 21:07:39 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Painting with words - 2 Paul T. wrote: > I have never seen Joni live apart from on video, so can't judge whether this was > just an off coupla days, as some have argued. But I was not impressed. I thought Joni sounded wonderful at the actual tapings and did not notice any degradation from the live voice when I watched the PPV or the video. I've brought this up before on the list but feel like saying it again - only a mere week before it was filmed she was "on the road with Bob and Van" and suffering from a horrible case of allergies, flu and bronchial problems. In the most recent interview on Wally's site, she talked about being so ill and out of it from all the medication she was taking, that she doesn't know how she was ever able to get up there and perform and make it through those concerts, much less even get a note out of her mouth. This may have had something to do with the perceived lack of strength in her voice on the video. Don't know if it would have been feasible to have cancelled the whole set-up with the tapings until she fully recovered. People seem surprised that she sounded so much better at Woodstock and MSG. Well, sure she did, she wasn't sick and recovering from an exhaustive tour! >I guess I would have found it easier if it hadn't been for the stories, which > rambled in a way I found very difficult - and surprising considering J's > recent eloquence on the Morning Goes Eclectic (?) radio show... What you see on the video is not what happened real time. The video contains snips all over the place from both nights of the taping, pieced in an order that rarely coincides with the sequence in which it actually took place. Maybe the editing was not superior. Joni herself re-edited the tape after being displeased with the way it was originally edited. I've heard she did wonders with it compared to its original incarnation. But I have not noticed too much choppiness - probably because when I view it all I think of is the magic of it all and also because I know TV shows are always edited and don't follow a straight, unbroken line. >(I was surprised there wasn't more debate or even much mention when PWWAM came out...). There were several comments from those who were successful in tuning in to the PPV or to the abridged CBC TV program. Many expressed technical difficulties and were unable to view it. Some people are just now getting around to receiving their copies of the video (we got it later here in the U.S. than you did in the U.K. and some other countries). > It is OK to criticise Joni on this list, isn't it?? Sure, it happens regularly. But your tone seemed so dismissive and almost mean. Everyone has a right to criticize her but there should never be any surprise when others then come to her defense. Others have the right to be passionate and fanatical about her, too. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:27:39 +1200 From: "Helen M. Adcock" Subject: Re: Painting with words... Wally K wrote: >i don't think colin was asking for anything. and if you're a self-confessed >fanatic, then there's nothing else i have to say to you for the time being. Ah yes, but by definition, we're all fanatics, since the word "fan" is an abbreviation of fanatic. I am certainly a Joni Mitchell fan, therefore, a fanatic! I have to be honest, if everybody agreed about everything, this would be a pretty boring place. Look how much discussion and analysis has taken place since Paul's post! And incidentally, the same thing happened with the Hejira thread. From memory (and I admit, I may be mistaken) it was started by someone saying they didn't like the Hejira album - and look how many posts resulted! In the words of the immortal JM - "He comes for conversation, I comfort him sometimes. Comfort and consultation....." Helen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:57:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Zapuppy@webtv.net (Rick & Penny Gibbons) Subject: Court and Spark From day one I felt Court and Spark was ironicly deep for the commercial success and acclaim it's been given. It never felt like light hearted pop to me. The whole theme seems to be about mental and emotional unbalance, on love and fulfillment topics, searching for answers in the dark, stark and complex realities of life. No Joni album is light or simple fare! Not to step on anyone's toes here (especially Kakki, as she could verbally squish me like a gnat with her intelligence and eloquent writing), but this is a great opportunity to make a point I've wanted made for a long time. I think it's called an argument from greater to lesser. As to if the mystery man in Court and Spark is real or fiction, I don't give a rip. I like to read into her music what applies to me, what applies to relationship or society or the culture as a whole, first and foremost, and only then put Joni into the picture personally. Take Not To Blame as another example. I would hate to see the message of the reality of domestic abuse be dismissed or made the lesser message, if in fact Joni came right out and said it's about Jackson Browne beating up on Darryl Hannah. Man From Mars is another example. It would be a ridiculous shame if, since we're aware Man From Mars is written about Joni's missing cat, that suddenly only feline lovers would be touched by the song, no longer applying the greater message and application to relationship of the song, from not being able to see past the specifics of to whom it was written. Off the top of my head, Two Grey Rooms is another one that comes to mind. I assume most know it's a story written about a homosexual who takes a room along the path of which an old lover takes daily. When knowing the specifics of a story, I certainly hope the beauty of the story doesn't somehow then become tainted or disregarded because the actual background is known and no longer a speculated mystery. We could go on and on. Learning specifics may add some clarity or depth, like Kilauren's reference in Chinese Cafe, but the lyrics and messages are still of a larger scope when viewed in ones own application, Joni's specifics aside. That's how I have always listened to Joni, with me in the first person....Joni as the gifted and eloquent author, but she's more of a secondary subject. Each album becomes an experience in expressing conditions of self and emotions that are ready to be explained and then, hopefully, will blossom. Thanks for letting me go on a little side trip by way of Court and Spark. There's been an off list discussion, on another topic, but with all the same principles, that another couldn't grasp the similar larger picture and concept. I'm trying to kill two birds with one stone. Thanks for putting up with my rambling. Miles of Smiles, Penny ------------------------------ End of onlyJMDL Digest V1 #17 ***************************** There is now a JMDL tape trading list. Interested traders can get more details at http://www.jmdl.com/trading ------- The Song and Album Voting Booths are open again! Cast your votes by clicking the links at http://www.jmdl.com/gallery username: jimdle password: siquomb ------- Don't forget about these ongoing projects: FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Trivia Project: Send your Joni trivia questions and/or answers to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe onlyjoni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?