From: owner-navy-soup-digest@smoe.org (navy-soup-digest) To: navy-soup-digest@smoe.org Subject: navy-soup-digest V2 #162 Reply-To: navy-soup@smoe.org Sender: owner-navy-soup-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-navy-soup-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk navy-soup-digest Wednesday, November 10 1999 Volume 02 : Number 162 In This Digest: ----------------- RE: names ["Julian C. Dunn" ] Re: vertigo [James McGarry ] Re: vertigo ["Julian C. Dunn" ] Re: vertigo [James McGarry ] Trying to describe unheard songs [karen hester ] Re: Trying to describe unheard songs [James McGarry Subject: RE: names On 08-Nov-99 Steve I wrote: > Anyway I think once in IRC (back when I still used it), someone made an > honest mistake in mixing up names which prompted a whole round of mixing > and matching names, > > "Tori McSlean" and "Tara MacAmoSLean" and that sort of nonsense. Hmm, the first sounds like a new "Taste of the Week" at Mickey D's. And the second, I would say, is Apple's successor to the hugely popular iMac. :) Now, with a free copy of "Passenger" in the CD-ROM drive! :) Anyway, just being silly :) - - Julian [ Julian C. Dunn - jdunn@aquezada.com WWW: http://www.aquezada.com/ ] [ programmer, web designer, unix user, fumbler, writer, and future engineer] [ FuE exfe94 a+++ Ifte/slc lonca r- ps++ bs+ t++/*t C+++$/C! w+++ p7 LF+++ ] [N++/N! cd260 pr++ g+++ S-/S *x++ Fa+++/Fa$/Fa! m1 b+ fc+++/ E>+ rl-- *d s!] [ "roll the tape, i'll show you how the ending began" - emm gryner ] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 09:58:26 -0500 (EST) From: James McGarry Subject: Re: vertigo On Mon, 8 Nov 1999, Tab Siddiqui wrote: > Ever since that night, I've been wondering myself *how* on earth she does it > - especially the ones with the band! I mean, I know most of them were > clutching sheets of looseleaf and following along on some of the brand-new > numbers that night, but, but... they were amazing! Totally on the ball, > sounded like they'd known the songs for years! Crazy... "Duncan" sounded > like it'd been in the Slean canon forever, and "Sweet Ones" completely > rocked my world, even if Sarah thinks it's lightweight. ;-) How does she do > it, and how do they keep up with her? Honestly, I have no clue, but I'm not > even going to ask - I'll just bask in the resulting blissful music, thanks. Sarah answered this question actually, well in a roundabout way ;-) It was a Glenn Gould answer, that he "appropriated" from someone else. Its the centipede answer. It was in The View magazine out of Hamilton. I'll type it up and post in a day or so... James. ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 10:08:48 -0500 (EST) From: "Julian C. Dunn" Subject: Re: vertigo On 09-Nov-1999 James McGarry quoted Tabassum as follows: >> Ever since that night, I've been wondering myself *how* on earth she does it >> - especially the ones with the band! I mean, I know most of them were >> clutching sheets of looseleaf and following along on some of the brand-new >> numbers that night, but, but... they were amazing! Totally on the ball, >> sounded like they'd known the songs for years! Crazy... "Duncan" sounded >> like it'd been in the Slean canon forever, and "Sweet Ones" completely >> rocked my world, even if Sarah thinks it's lightweight. ;-) How does she do >> it, and how do they keep up with her? Honestly, I have no clue, but I'm not >> even going to ask - I'll just bask in the resulting blissful music, thanks. Well, just speaking from experience -- after you've played an instrument or been a musician for many, many years, one can pretty much just improvise a lot of stuff on the fly. It seems funny to say this, but the untrained human ear can't pick up a lot of mistakes that a musician might incur while improvising, or even instances where the musician stops playing because he/she is lost! :) For example, during Sarah's CD release party, one of the cellists got completely flustered and lost, but nobody seemed to notice; she just pretended she knew what she was doing and it sounded fine. Sometimes if you're good enough you can just make stuff up in the correct key until you find your place. :) It's -experience- (along with a healthy dose of talent, mind you) that enables musicians like Sarah to write good-sounding songs twenty minutes before her set, or lets Natalie Merchant make up songs about Henry Kissinger and the Sultan of Brunei on the spot. :-P - - Julian - -- Julian C. Dunn ASIC Architecture / Validation Group Matrox Graphics Inc. - Typhoon Technologies Division Tel: (905) 944-4900 x7006 Fax: (905) 944-4909 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:49:27 -0500 (EST) From: James McGarry Subject: Re: vertigo On Tue, 9 Nov 1999, Julian C. Dunn wrote: > of stuff on the fly. It seems funny to say this, but the untrained human ear > can't pick up a lot of mistakes that a musician might incur while improvising, That's true... ...I've explained this to a number of musicians. I can pick up about half those mistakes... they can pick up all of them... ...I can't count the times I've replied to a comment like, "Man, we really ****** up that song tonight..." with, "Yeah, but no one noticed, trust me!" > set, or lets Natalie Merchant make up songs about Henry Kissinger and the Just for this Julian... "Henry Kissinger How I'm missing yer You're the Doctor of my dreams With your crinkly hair and your glassy stare And your machiavellian schemes I know they say that you are very vain And short and fat and pushy but at least you're not insane Henry Kissinger How I'm missing yer And wishing you were here" And I'm sure we all can guess where this is from. James. ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 09:26:00 +1300 From: karen hester Subject: Trying to describe unheard songs If it were possible, I'd ask you blessed people to describe these unrecorded songs in a way that would simulate the listening experience for the reader! But even with full musical notation and lyrics there is so much missing - how a performer deviates from the precise rhythm, drops her voice or lets it catch, the interplay between the instruments and vocals, how the listener will react to each turn in the song. Ack, there is just no way to put it into words, is there? There's an article in Smithsonian magazine (Sept) about the Malaysian fruit called the durian which Alfred Wallace described as tasting like a custard "flavoured with almonds ... onion sauce, brown sherry, and other incongruities." Describing music ends up being as confusing, beyond establishing genre and speed and lyrics. Why is language so bad at describing the experience of the senses? Anyone want to try describing Last Year's War or one of these other songs in a way that will produce the sounds in my head!?! (ha) karen. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 15:59:11 -0500 (EST) From: James McGarry Subject: Re: Trying to describe unheard songs On Wed, 10 Nov 1999, karen hester wrote: > describing the experience of the senses? Anyone want to try describing > Last Year's War or one of these other songs in a way that will produce the > sounds in my head!?! (ha) Sounds? Well, hmmm. LYW is sadness distilled, purified and then magnified. Its that second you feel that the one you love most of all doesn't love you back and maybe never did and its also the feeling you have after a particularly bad break up when you first see someone new who you think you'll like but don't talk to because all the emotion of "last years war" returns to you like a swelling tide over your sand castle of love. "Duncan" has "Eliot" flavours, but a less rarified feel. If "Eliot" is a nice oak-aged burgundy with good legs, "Duncan" is a sturdy beaujolais nouveaux. Vertigo I'm not sure how I would describe it... ...I think I'd have to hear it a few more times. Like the ring of real crystal, maybe... James. ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: 09 Nov 1999 17:01:36 EST From: Jennifer.M.Pease@Dartmouth.EDU (Jennifer M. Pease) Subject: Re: Trying to describe unheard songs - --- James McGarry wrote: Vertigo I'm not sure how I would describe it... ...I think I'd have to hear it a few more times. - --- end of quote --- Well, I only heard it once myself but I remember being reminded of that scene in the movie "American Beauty" with the bag and the leaves just being blown around by the wind, circling and being suspended in the air... I don't know why, but I thought that "Vertigo" would be the perfect soundtrack to that scene... it just evoked the image of floating and blowing around, completely propelled by nature, not driven by any human force... But then, I only heard it once... but that's what I thought of. - -jennpease ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 18:36:46 EST From: Songbird22@aol.com Subject: Re: vertigo Our friend James says: > Sarah answered this question actually, well in a roundabout way ;-) It was > a Glenn Gould answer, that he "appropriated" from someone else. Its the > centipede answer. It was in The View magazine out of Hamilton. I'll type > it up and post in a day or so... This is not related really (well kind of) but I have to say Glenn Gould RULES... I am finally getting around to reading all of a great bio by Peter Oswald (sp?) that I bought like a year ago but haven't had time to read... anyway, it's very well written and full of insight on his life, music, etc. Also, i rented a film last weekend called "twenty two short films about glenn gould" (hey boys, there's a way to impress sarah, rent it and talk to her about it :p) and it was interesting (kind of slow, but i liked how it was made and the idea behind it)... Gould was such a genius... it's odd b/c he and Sarah are sort of similiar in a lot of ways (in terms of when they started playing piano, they both dropped out of a music program--college--to pursue music full-time, etc.)... anyway... :) Jessica www.aquezada.com/jess | www.mp3.com/jessweiser ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:21:32 -0500 From: "Christine Evans" Subject: Re: Trying to describe unheard songs - -----Original Message----- From: James McGarry To: karen hester Cc: navy-soup@smoe.org Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 4:03 PM Subject: Re: Trying to describe unheard songs James wrote: >Sounds? Well, hmmm. LYW is sadness distilled, purified and then magnified. >Its that second you feel that the one you love most of all doesn't love >you back and maybe never did and its also the feeling you have after a >particularly bad break up when you first see someone new who you think >you'll like but don't talk to because all the emotion of "last years war" >returns to you like a swelling tide over your sand castle of love. James, this is absolutely beautiful. How completely representative of the way LYW makes one feel... wow. It made me shiver. And you're absolutely right - this song conjures up just about every angstfully loving/lovingly angstful feeling that you possess, whether you're aware of it or not! It's a VERY experiential and personal song, although I can't even begin to try to rival James' explanation of it. Jess wrote: >I have to say Glenn Gould RULES... Yes, he certainly does! An absolute genius, visionary, artist... he's so irresistible because he's so the quintessential artist... constantly wearing gloves and scarves (even in the warmest weather), flaky, and eccentric. His work is unparalleled, and on top of all that, he's sooooooooo good-looking! (Sorry, girl thing. You know - flaky artist. Good looking. All the right criteria. :-) ) >>he and Sarah are sort of similiar in a lot of ways (in terms of when they >>started playing piano, they both dropped out of a music program--college--to >>pursue music full-time, etc.)... anyway... Has Sarah really dropped out of U of T's music program for good, or does she plan to return sooner or later? Last I heard she was, "taking some time off" (understandably!! A show in New York followed by an 8:00 AM class the next day would certainly NOT be fun. :-) ) Chris, the Photoshop-rendered Sarah photo looks great! I can't wait to see it on the website! And... to everyone who attended the Riv. show on the 4th, I'm interested in all the buzz Sarah's 'pop' song is getting. So far I know that she took a kind of humourously sarcastic view of it, but that it was all in all a fun song with a lot of talent behind it. I'm curious as to what its subject matter was, though! Was this actually a POSITIVE love song? :-) Any way, talk to you all later! I made thumbnails on http://www.angelfire.com/id/thepiano/sarahslean.html , but I haven't added anything. You can go and look at the thumbnails, though. (I figured out how to make them, okay? So I deserve to gloat a little... :-) ) Love you all, - - Christine Evans :-) evans_ent@msn.com http://nevermind.thesociety.net ------------------------------ End of navy-soup-digest V2 #162 *******************************