From: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org (mad-mission-digest) To: mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Subject: mad-mission-digest V10 #82 Reply-To: mad-mission@smoe.org Sender: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk * If you ever wish to unsubscribe, send an email to * mad-mission-digest-request@smoe.org * with ONLY the word unsubscribe in the body of the email * . * For the latest information on Patty's tour dates, go to: * http://www.pattygriffin.net/PattyInConcertDB.php * OR * go to http://www.atorecords.com * . * PLEASE :) when you reply to this digest to send a post TO the list, * change the subject to reflect what your post is about. A subject * of Re: mad-mission-digest V8 #___ gives readers no clue * as to what your message is about. * Also, PLEASE do not quote an entire digest when you reply to the * list. Edit out anything you are not referring to. mad-mission-digest Tuesday, August 1 2006 Volume 10 : Number 082 Today's Subjects: ----------------- MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters ["Michael Tatlow" ] Re: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters [Susan ] MM: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters ["Steve Mercer \(MDM\)" ] MM: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters ["Michael Tatlow" ] MM: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters ["hugues" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 09:32:06 -0400 From: "Michael Tatlow" Subject: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 9:19 PM Subject: MM: Best Living Songwriters > Not sure if anybody posted this yet, but the July issue of Paste magazine > has compiled a list of the 100 Best Living songwriters and Patty is #19 > (right between #20 Van Morrison and #18 U2) > > heatherhealy@earthlink.net > EarthLink Revolves Around You. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 07:37:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Susan Subject: Re: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters a ranking is a ranking the times they are a changing..... ever since Joni Mitchell I have not been so deeply touched by a woman singer/songwriter. Michael Tatlow wrote: While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 9:19 PM Subject: MM: Best Living Songwriters > Not sure if anybody posted this yet, but the July issue of Paste magazine > has compiled a list of the 100 Best Living songwriters and Patty is #19 > (right between #20 Van Morrison and #18 U2) > > heatherhealy@earthlink.net > EarthLink Revolves Around You. - --------------------------------- Open multiple messages at once with the all new Yahoo! Mail Beta. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 15:56:21 +0100 From: "Steve Mercer \(MDM\)" Subject: MM: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters Interesting article and good to see Patty up there. Also nice to see Bill Mallonee in there. But....... No Dar Williams/Neal Casal/Shawn Colvin/ Sarah McLachlan???? Also, I thought Jackson Browne would have been higher, but I suppose we would all include/exclude and change position of various artists! Dylan/Joni/Randy/Smokey etc - of course, brilliant. But what about forgotten artists like Jude Cole? Bye for now Steve - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Tatlow" To: ; Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 2:32 PM Subject: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters > While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 9:19 PM > Subject: MM: Best Living Songwriters > > >> Not sure if anybody posted this yet, but the July issue of Paste magazine >> has compiled a list of the 100 Best Living songwriters and Patty is #19 >> (right between #20 Van Morrison and #18 U2) >> >> heatherhealy@earthlink.net >> EarthLink Revolves Around You. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 17:32:48 +0200 From: "hugues" Subject: MM: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters I guess it's hard to dissociate Patty's lyrics from her music and vocals great lyrics + great voice + great music = hard to beat I 'd put Patty Griffin above Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen... - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Tatlow" To: ; <> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 3:32 PM Subject: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters > While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 13:19:14 -0400 From: "Michael Tatlow" Subject: MM: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters Wow, Don't get me wrong, I love Patty's music, especially her live performances, however I sure she wouldn't even put herself in the same neighborhood as Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "hugues" To: Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 11:32 AM Subject: MM: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters >I guess it's hard to dissociate Patty's lyrics from her music and vocals > > great lyrics + great voice + great music = hard to beat > > I 'd put Patty Griffin above Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen... > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Tatlow" > To: ; <> > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 3:32 PM > Subject: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters > > >> While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 15:46:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Olivia Olson Subject: Re: MM: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters Well, Bruce and Neil are iconic classics- in that regard Patty doesn't measure up. But on songwriting merits alone, I wouldn't hesitate to put Patty amongst those giants. While I've always loved Neil Young, I was surprized to see him as the #2 songwriter. Personally, I think Patty (not to mention Joni Mitchell and Paul Simon) is better songwriter than he is. Just mho. Olivia Michael Tatlow wrote: Wow, Don't get me wrong, I love Patty's music, especially her live performances, however I sure she wouldn't even put herself in the same neighborhood as Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "hugues" To: Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 11:32 AM Subject: MM: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters >I guess it's hard to dissociate Patty's lyrics from her music and vocals > > great lyrics + great voice + great music = hard to beat > > I 'd put Patty Griffin above Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen... > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Tatlow" > To: ; <> > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 3:32 PM > Subject: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters > > >> While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. - --------------------------------- Groups are talking. We´re listening. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 16:01:43 -0700 From: "Lawrence Israelson" Subject: Re: MM: Best Living Songwriters Recognizing that this is primarily a list for die-hard fans of Patty Griffin and thus prone to less-than-objective statements (inhales deep breath), here goes... While I wouldn't go so far as to say that Patty is a better songwriter than luminaries like Dylan, Springsteen, Van Morrison and Neil Young (all of whom are extremely well-represented in my music collection), I would say without equivocation that she is absolutely, positively in the same "league." I was in my late thirties when LWG was released. I consider myself quite open-minded when it comes to music, but by that age I was also fairly certain that it was highly unlikely that anybody "new" could crack my personal Top 10 artists/albums/songs, etc. Patty Griffin's music took that assumption and utterly destroyed it. A few years back, Time magazine proclaimed Lucinda Williams something like "best songwriter." (I no longer remember the exact title or criteria.) I really, really like Lucinda Williams. I've seen her perform live, I own "Car Wheels" and "Essence," and I thoroughly enjoy loudly singing along to "Can't Let Go." In my humble opinion, however, Lucinda Williams is not in the same league as Patty Griffin. For me, what puts Patty in that highest echelon is her mastery of both lyric and melody. I would be the first to admit that many of my favorite lyricists (especially Dylan, Young, Elvis Costello and Graham Parker) often seem to treat melody as an afterthought, while I can think of many Patty songs that would be beautiful even if they were just poems or just instrumental guitar pieces. (Does that make sense?) To be honest, though, lyrics have always been "the thing" for me, and so many Patty lyrics simply astonish me with their beauty, their subtlety, and the way they express core truths about humanity: "You can't make somebody see/With the simple words you say/All their beauty from within/Sometimes they just look away" or "Forty years of things you say you wish you'd never said/How hard would it have been to say some kinder words instead?" or "I wish I'd have known you/I wish I'd have shown you/All of the things I/Was on the inside/But I'd pretend to be sleeping" of "It's a mad mission under difficult conditions/Not everybody makes it to the loving cup" Face it, with Patty Griffin I could go on and on. There is no doubt that our society has a short attention span, especially when it comes to matters of entertainment and pop culture. Oscars tend to go to movies released late in the year. "Best of" lists are routinely marred by too many "recent" entries. My teen-aged daughter can listen to Nirvana Unplugged or even 1000 Kisses and have no inkling that "Where Did You Sleep Last Night?" and "Tomorrow Night" were both written before her father was even born. Once in awhile, however, a talent so undeniable comes along that a relatively small "sample size" (in this case, only four studio albums) shouldn't automatically disqualify it from being mentioned as one of the all-time greats. I believe that Patty Griffin possesses that sort of exceptional talent. Peace, Larry I in LA <-----Original Message-----> From: Michael Tatlow Sent: 7/31/2006 10:33:14 AM To: o.hugues@wanadoo.fr;mad-mission@smoe.org Subject: MM: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters Wow, Don't get me wrong, I love Patty's music, especially her live performances, however I sure she wouldn't even put herself in the same neighborhood as Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "hugues" To: Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 11:32 AM Subject: MM: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters >I guess it's hard to dissociate Patty's lyrics from her music and vocals > > great lyrics + great voice + great music = hard to beat > > I 'd put Patty Griffin above Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen... > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Tatlow" > To: ; <> > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 3:32 PM > Subject: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters > > >> While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. .

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Unlimited Email Storage – POP3 – Calendar – SMS – Translator – Much More! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 07:03:31 +0200 From: "hugues" Subject: Re: MM: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters Joni Mitchell is far better than Neil Young... but you know, at some point, the ranking depends of the level of popularity Neil Young has connected with wider, more various audiences - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Olivia Olson" To: <> Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 12:46 AM Subject: Re: MM: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters > Well, Bruce and Neil are iconic classics- in that regard Patty doesn't measure up. But on songwriting merits alone, I wouldn't hesitate to put Patty amongst those giants. While I've always loved Neil Young, I was surprized to see him as the #2 songwriter. Personally, I think Patty (not to mention Joni Mitchell and Paul Simon) is better songwriter than he is. Just mho. > Olivia > > Michael Tatlow wrote: Wow, > > Don't get me wrong, I love Patty's music, especially her live performances, > however I sure she wouldn't even put herself in the same neighborhood as > Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "hugues" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 11:32 AM > Subject: MM: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters > > > >I guess it's hard to dissociate Patty's lyrics from her music and vocals > > > > great lyrics + great voice + great music = hard to beat > > > > I 'd put Patty Griffin above Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen... > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Michael Tatlow" > > To: ; <> > > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 3:32 PM > > Subject: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters > > > > > >> While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. > > > > --------------------------------- > Groups are talking. We´re listening. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 07:13:47 +0200 From: "hugues" Subject: Re: MM: Best Living Songwriters I tend to think that most people can't imagine Patty and Lucinda (who I personally put at the same level - though they're different artists) as big as Dylan, Young and Springsteen for the simple reason that they're aren't widely recognized as such. But personally I don't wait for wide recognitions to get my opinion. Actually I use to judge with my own heart, mind and soul. Some people will base the greatness of "new" artists from old criterias whereas the new artists create new greatness with new criteria. And actually each real artist creates his individual criteria. Never did Dylan, Young and Springsteen move as much as Lucinda and Patty. How should I explain that? Hugues ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 07:00:22 +0200 From: "hugues" Subject: MM: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters She's not the best placed to judge herself... and she's too humble to ever do that - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Tatlow" To: "hugues" ; <> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 7:19 PM Subject: Re: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters > Wow, > > Don't get me wrong, I love Patty's music, especially her live performances, > however I sure she wouldn't even put herself in the same neighborhood as > Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "hugues" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 11:32 AM > Subject: MM: Re: Re: Best Living Songwriters > > > >I guess it's hard to dissociate Patty's lyrics from her music and vocals > > > > great lyrics + great voice + great music = hard to beat > > > > I 'd put Patty Griffin above Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen... > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Michael Tatlow" > > To: ; <> > > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 3:32 PM > > Subject: MM: Re: Best Living Songwriters > > > > > >> While I love Patty's songwriting, this is a very generous ranking. ------------------------------ End of mad-mission-digest V10 #82 *********************************