From: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org (mad-mission-digest) To: mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Subject: mad-mission-digest V6 #35 Reply-To: mad-mission@smoe.org Sender: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk * If you ever wish to unsubscribe, send an email to * mad-mission-digest-request@smoe.org * with ONLY the word unsubscribe in the body of the email * . * For the latest information on Patty's tour dates, go to: * http://www.quackquack.net/pattyg * OR * go to http://www.amrecords.com * then click "tour" and fill in the blanks :) * . * PLEASE :) when you reply to this digest to send a post TO the list, * change the subject to reflect what your post is about. A subject * of Re: mad-mission-digest V4 #xxx or the like gives readers no clue * as to what your message is about. mad-mission-digest Tuesday, February 5 2002 Volume 06 : Number 035 Today's Subjects: ----------------- MM: Re: mad-mission-digest V6 #34 [Amy Silver ] MM: Long Road? [David Lewis ] RE: MM: 1000 Kisses - MORE first impressions ["Mare :-)" ] MM: Re: 1000 Kisses - first impression ["Lisa Zwick" ] MM: Re: New vs. Used. ["Lisa Zwick" ] MM: from the january 31 edition of the statesman's xclent. . . [amber bas] MM: Re: New vs. Used. ["Eugene Wendland" ] Re: MM: NPC: Used v. New [Fbichick42@aol.com] Re: MM: NPC: Used v. New ["Lisa Zwick" ] Re: MM: NPC: Used v. New [Mooodeee@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 17:51:32 -0500 From: Amy Silver Subject: MM: Re: mad-mission-digest V6 #34 Okay, Andy, I happen to be free this weekend ... where in Charlottesville do you live? Amy in Rileyville >Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 15:33:34 -0500 >From: "Scheiner, Andy" >Subject: RE: MM: 1000 Kisses - MORE first impressions > >Yea I know, I'm sorry. I was certainly ambivalent about posting my >mini-review for that very reason. I didn't want to get all of us MM'ers - >me excluded ;-) - all excited with still 2+ months before the official >release. In fact, I presented Jen with this very dilemma this morning before >posting the review. She advised me to go ahead with it, so you can all blame >her!!! (kidding, of course, Jen). Umm, well, you can all come over to my >house this weekend for a listen - does Table Talk pies deliver? > > - Andy > >- -----Original Message----- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 19:34:52 -0400 From: David Lewis Subject: MM: Long Road? Question to the list member in NYC with the advance copy of 1000 Kisses... so is "Long Road" the same song as "Long Ride Home"... a song about woman riding to her husband's funeral in a "Long Black Limousine... shiniest car I've ever seen"... or is it a new song? I'm guessing it's a new song... but I would be so happy if it is actually Long Ride Home. God I love that song. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 00:14:39 +0000 From: "Mare :-)" Subject: RE: MM: 1000 Kisses - MORE first impressions Umm, well, you can all come over to my house this weekend for a listen - does Table Talk pies deliver? I am not sure that they deliver, but you know if you are in NYC I would be driving right through Worcester, home of Table Talk Pies, to get there so I could pick up as many as you want.....I am so jealous, my sister works in the promotions department at a record label and so she does plenty of "trades" with other companies but she has yet to track down anyone from ATO..... > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 19:27:05 EST From: Rongrittz@aol.com Subject: MM: New vs. Used. Regarding purchasing only used (vs. new) CDs, some cheap guy writes: >> is this wrong? << Of course it is. And -- in my opinion -- you have at least some guilt about it, or you wouldn't be asking. So if you're looking for justification for your disingenuous actions, you're not going to find it here. You do know, don't you, that those promo copies you've purchased say "Promo, not for resale" for a reason, yes? You know that when you buy a used CD, not one cent goes into the artist's pocket, yes? You know that these artists need to sell CDs to keep their record deals, yes? That record store sales help build local radio station buzz, which in turn helps build more record sales, yes? Hell, in your second post, did you not even avoid the question regarding where you buy your used CDs because you're afraid that law enforcement agents might get involved and close down your "source?" Then how can what you're doing be right? Honestly . . . how is what you're doing different than just borrowing a CD from a friend and burning a copy for yourself? There are only two circumstances under which I will ever purchase a used CD. One, if the CD is now out-of-print, and absolutely cannot be purchased elsewhere. And please, don't give me the "assuming I can find one" argument. Most artist's websites -- particularly the more independent ones like Mark Erelli -- have links to places (like FolkWeb) where you can buy their CDs. Or you can always get one at their shows. The second circumstance is when I have ALREADY PURCHASED A NEW COPY FOR MYSELF and then find a used copy to give to a friend who may not already be familiar with the artist, in the hopes that they'll become a fan and buy other releases. >> By being a "superior shopper," I have built a collection far beyond my means, and it is one of the great joys of my life. << "Superior" to whom? A shoplifter? "Superior" by making sure that the hard work of a musician gets into your hands for a fraction of what it's worth? Imagine how much joy you'd feel if you'd actually built this collection legitimately. Sorry, but you asked. Sleep well. RG ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 19:35:49 -0500 From: "Lisa Zwick" Subject: MM: Re: 1000 Kisses - Advance Copy I don't think it's wrong. Someone already paid full-price for the cd, they just decided they didn't like it (or whatever the reason) so they sold it again. The cd was already paid for. It's not like you made the cd on a cd-r instead of buying the the real cd. I also found some great cds for $1. I decided once with some friends that we were each goign to buy 20 cds each for a buck and then see if we get anything good. I happened to get Eleanor McEvoy and Eliza Carthy without even knowing who they were, and fell in love with them. I then started searching for Eleanor's other cds, and was able to get one in the same store for 6 bucks, but had to order the other two online. I even saw Flaming Red there one time for $1- the full cd- and I can't believe i didn't buy it just because I already owned it. Anyway, the point is, i would have never bought her other cds if I hadn't got that other one for $1. It gives us a chance to discover new artists without having to buy full-priced cds we don't even know we like. - -XC - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Israelson Family" To: "Griffin, Patty list" Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 12:09 PM Subject: MM: 1000 Kisses - Advance Copy >This all leads to the $64,000 > question: is this wrong? Or, is it similar to the time-honored industry > practice of "loss leaders," where some music is practically given away in > hopes of garnering radio airplay and/or "buzz"? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 19:37:27 -0500 From: "Lisa Zwick" Subject: MM: Re: 1000 Kisses - first impression What store in NYC did you find it at? And was there more than 1? - -XC - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scheiner, Andy" To: Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 10:00 AM Subject: MM: 1000 Kisses - first impression > Hi All, > > I was lucky enough to find an advance copy of 1000 Kisses at a record store > in NYC over the weekend, and, after listening to it about 3 or 4 times, I > thought I post a mini-review: ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 20:01:02 -0500 From: "Lisa Zwick" Subject: MM: Re: New vs. Used. When someone recommends a whole list of cds for you, do you go out and buy them all before you even know whether you like it? Unless you do, I don't think you're justified in saying what you did in your last post. When there is an artist I like, I buy their cds new. But if you never heard the person before, and you find a cd for $1 that looks good, what's wrong with buying it? Most of the time the used cds aren't any good anyway, but once ina n while a good one gets mixed in. So you lose some, you gain some. I have about 40 $1 cds, most of which suck and I will never listen to them. The artist would not have gotten my money anyways. And why should the artist get my money if I don't like the cd? I've seen thr same crappy cds going for full price in other stores. However, when i do like what I hear, I go and buy the other cds of that artist. And you have no idea how hard it was to find Eleanor McEvoy's other two cds....even online! If I find an artist I like, I'll gladly spend full price on it...but I don't want to pay full price for the ones I'd throw away. And if we have the chance to discover new artists without going broke, then what the hell is wrong with that!?! You really shouldn't judge people so quickly. - -Lisa - ---- - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 7:27 PM Subject: MM: New vs. Used. > Regarding purchasing only used (vs. new) CDs, some cheap guy writes: > > >> is this wrong? << > > Of course it is. And -- in my opinion -- you have at least some guilt about > it, or you wouldn't be asking. So if you're looking for justification for > your disingenuous actions, you're not going to find it here. > > You do know, don't you, that those promo copies you've purchased say "Promo, > not for resale" for a reason, yes? You know that when you buy a used CD, not > one cent goes into the artist's pocket, yes? You know that these artists > need to sell CDs to keep their record deals, yes? That record store sales > help build local radio station buzz, which in turn helps build more record > sales, yes? > > Hell, in your second post, did you not even avoid the question regarding > where you buy your used CDs because you're afraid that law enforcement agents > might get involved and close down your "source?" Then how can what you're > doing be right? > > Honestly . . . how is what you're doing different than just borrowing a CD > from a friend and burning a copy for yourself? > > There are only two circumstances under which I will ever purchase a used CD. > One, if the CD is now out-of-print, and absolutely cannot be purchased > elsewhere. And please, don't give me the "assuming I can find one" argument. > Most artist's websites -- particularly the more independent ones like Mark > Erelli -- have links to places (like FolkWeb) where you can buy their CDs. > Or you can always get one at their shows. > > The second circumstance is when I have ALREADY PURCHASED A NEW COPY FOR > MYSELF and then find a used copy to give to a friend who may not already be > familiar with the artist, in the hopes that they'll become a fan and buy > other releases. > > >> By being a "superior shopper," I have built a collection far beyond my > means, and it is one of the great joys of my life. << > > "Superior" to whom? A shoplifter? "Superior" by making sure that the hard > work of a musician gets into your hands for a fraction of what it's worth? > Imagine how much joy you'd feel if you'd actually built this collection > legitimately. > > Sorry, but you asked. > > Sleep well. > > RG ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 19:25:14 -0600 From: amber bass-patterson Subject: MM: from the january 31 edition of the statesman's xclent. . . . . . It looks like a busy spring at the Mercury, which hosts Rufus Wainwright April 2, Plaid April 8 and a "surprise" Patty Griffin show a few days later. . . could this possibly be a cd release gig? keep your eyes and ears open austinites! amber "Through Movement We Find Health" The Nia Technique ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 21:06:32 -0500 From: "Eugene Wendland" Subject: MM: Re: New vs. Used. > Regarding purchasing only used (vs. new) CDs, some cheap guy writes: > > >> is this wrong? << > > Of course it is. And -- in my opinion -- you have at least some guilt about > it, or you wouldn't be asking. So if you're looking for justification for > your disingenuous actions, you're not going to find it here. Hey Ron, I love your idealistic approach. I happen to work for one of the big three auto makers in Detroit. Wouldn't it be lovely for us if everyone bought their cars new? Using your argument, only newly bought cars would bring back the money into the pockets of designers, engineers, assemblers, etc. And imagine, no one would sell their cars if they got tired of them, they'd just store them somewhere and let them collect dust (much like most cd collections). I'm sure you never bought a used car (that would be hypocritcal) like that "cheap guy" you mention and I'd like to thank you right now. Thanks buddy! > You know that when you buy a used CD, not > one cent goes into the artist's pocket, yes? Nor the generous record company, we all know how understanding they can be. > Sleep well. > > RG > Pleasant dreams EW ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 23:17:38 EST From: Fbichick42@aol.com Subject: Re: MM: NPC: Used v. New In all this debate over whether it's okay to buy used ("cheap)CDs or whether its better to buy the CD full price to support the artist, may I suggest an alternative? Maybe, if its possible, you could go to your local library and find material by the artist so that you can preview before you buy. This is something I do often and it works well. You can try it and see if it works for you. Of course if you don't have a reliable library in your area it won't really pan out... Andromeda ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 23:46:15 -0500 From: "Lisa Zwick" Subject: Re: MM: NPC: Used v. New It's hard enough to find the BOOKS I want at the library...much less cds! - -Lisa - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 11:17 PM Subject: Re: MM: NPC: Used v. New > In all this debate over whether it's okay to buy used ("cheap)CDs or > whether its better to buy the CD full price to support the artist, may I > suggest an alternative? Maybe, if its possible, you could go to your local > library and find material by the artist so that you can preview before you > buy. This is something I do often and it works well. You can try it and see > if it works for you. Of course if you don't have a reliable library in your > area it won't really pan out... > Andromeda ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 00:12:54 EST From: Mooodeee@aol.com Subject: Re: MM: NPC: Used v. New Here's an idea... Since labels use promos as business cards, after enjoying the promo until April 9th (right?) buy your regular copy for yourself then and loan the promo out to someone who has never heard of Patty before. Or use it as a spare, rather than burning a spare. Really, concert tickets are the best way to support an artist. If you turn someone onto Patty, they'll support her by coming to her shows, and they'll tell all their friends, and her popularity grows, and labels will benefit. That's certainly better than throwing promos in the trash. Be glad the used store got it. It ended up in the hands of someone who can appreciate it and might possibly use it to help introduce Patty to others. The used car analogy is a good one! My first Honda was used. I liked it enough to buy one brand new one a few years later. Mimi ------------------------------ End of mad-mission-digest V6 #35 ********************************