From: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org (mad-mission-digest) To: mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Subject: mad-mission-digest V6 #159 Reply-To: mad-mission@smoe.org Sender: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk * If you ever wish to unsubscribe, send an email to * mad-mission-digest-request@smoe.org * with ONLY the word unsubscribe in the body of the email * . * For the latest information on Patty's tour dates, go to: * http://www.pattygriffin.net/PattyInConcert.html * OR * go to http://www.atorecords.com * . * PLEASE :) when you reply to this digest to send a post TO the list, * change the subject to reflect what your post is about. A subject * of Re: mad-mission-digest V6 #___ gives readers no clue * as to what your message is about. mad-mission-digest Thursday, April 25 2002 Volume 06 : Number 159 Today's Subjects: ----------------- MM: Re: Not an opinion [David Tumbarello ] MM: Thanks to the list starters... [SteadyOnDC@aol.com] MM: RE: I hate Jewel ["Willms, Gregory J." ] MM: Re: RE: I hate Jewel ["Sheryl Novak" ] Fwd: MM: Re: Stop that! [Femboty2k@aol.com] Re: MM: RE: I hate Jewel [beccasean@peoplepc.com] RE: MM: RE: I hate Jewel ["Kunkel, Robert G" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 08:06:00 -0700 (PDT) From: David Tumbarello Subject: MM: Re: Not an opinion Shery, Actually, the first person who wrote the sentiment about Jewel said "Do you guys HAVE to keep mentioning Jewel in the same breath as Patty?......" This is not an opinion. It is more like an invitation for Jewel fans to respond. DT p.s. Don't you all just get a kick out of how this has backfired--someone wants us not to use Patty & Jewel in the same sentence and look what happened. - --- Sheryl Novak wrote: > I believe -if I may speak for the both of us- we > were referring to the > comparison of the two...or, as happens so often, > using the two names in the > same breath as if they are the same person. An just > as you stated, we all have > our opinions... > sorry for the confusion... > s. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: David Tumbarello > To: Sheryl Novak ; MactheMutt@aol.com ; > mad-mission@smoe.org > Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2002 8:55 AM > Subject: Re: MM: Re: Stop that! > > > Give me a break. This is music we are talking > about. > What one person likes is what they like. > > I like vanilla ice cream and detest chocolate ice > cream. But I'm not going to go around and say > that > anyone who likes chocolate is out of their mind > and > I'm not gonna say I'm gonna barf if I'm in the > presense of chocolate ice cream. > > Same thing with Patty and Jewel. If you don't > like > the way Jewel interviews, then turn off the TV. > But > some people like her music, so be tolerant. > > I have only heard Jewel's first CD and like it. > It is > minimal, for the most part it is just Jewel and > her > guitar and her emotion. Hmm, not much different > than > LWG. > > I sure hope the fans on the Jewel site will be > understanding when Patty is mentioned on their > list. > For us MMers, Patty is the best out there. For > them, > Jewel is. But this is music we are talking about. > The choice is just personal preference, like ice > cream. > > DT > > > --- Sheryl Novak wrote: > > hey, my sentiments exactly.... > > s. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: MactheMutt@aol.com > > To: mad-mission@smoe.org > > Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002 11:45 PM > > Subject: MM: Stop that! > > > > > > In a message dated 4/24/02 10:28:19 PM Central > > Daylight Time, > > frglflm@hotmail.com writes: > > > > > > > > > I'm a big fan of Hal Hartley flicks, as well > as > > Patty (and Jewel), but > > > the track hasn't struck me as Hartley-esque. > > > > Do you guys HAVE to keep mentioning Jewel in > the > > same breath as > > Patty?......I'm gonna barf. Everytime I see > Jewel > > on TV, I wanna throw a > > brick thru my screen. The way she's always > there > > Whining about something > > else > > with her eyes half closed in an attempt at > sexy(?) > > or stoned(?) or > > something. > > I wish she'd go away. She doesn't belong on > the > > same page with Patty > > Griffin. > > > > (OK, it's late, I just worked a double at the > > Steel Mill...I'm cranky)(but > > it's true) > Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and > more > http://games.yahoo.com/ Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more http://games.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 11:11:26 EDT From: SteadyOnDC@aol.com Subject: MM: Thanks to the list starters... In a message dated 4/25/02 10:50:54 AM, owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org writes: << The truth is that if it weren't for Jewel, this list never would have existed. I promise. This is a well documented fact. I can provide diagrams and flow charts if you'd like. >> I'm not a Jewel hater (or big fan either)...and I'm very grateful for those fans who started this Patty list. However, I DO believe that A Patty Griffin fan list WOULD exist or come into being eventually on it's own though. Patty has a pretty intense fan base and it's growing all the time. But most the time...this is how the lists get started and how the music gets recommended...from fans on other lists. So big thanks to the Jewel fan(s) who started this one! - -DC ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 11:13:45 -0400 From: "Willms, Gregory J." Subject: MM: RE: I hate Jewel At one point, I thought Jewel hung the freakin' moon. I now loathe her. I find her music to be trite, contrived, pretentious, and commercial. Her performances and interviews are the same. If I never hear that story about her living in a van again, it will be too soon. Just the sound of her voice grates on my nerves and makes me want to kick her right in her crooked teeth. I do, however, thank Jewel for indirectly introducing me to Patty. *Disclaimer: This opinion is not necessarily the opinion of Patty Griffin, the Mad Mission list moderators, list members or anyone else affiliated with Patty Griffin. It is the personal opinion of the author and should be taken as such. How's that? - -----Original Message----- From: beccasean@peoplepc.com [mailto:beccasean@peoplepc.com] Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2002 10:40 AM To: mad-mission@smoe.org Subject: MM: I hate Jewel I mean I really think she is horrible. I love Patty, hate Jewel, but don't mind the fact that others want to talk about her. Sean np-R.E.M. - Superman On Thu, 25 April 2002, TheGirlsHateHer@aol.com wrote > > You know, this list was created by fans from the Jewel list after Patty opened for Jewel at Jewelstock, so it's to be expected that there will be a lot of Jewel fans on this list, and that in some way, Patty and Jewel are connected. I'm sorry if you don't like Jewel, but you shouldn't expect people who do like her to stop talking about her. ________________________________________________ PeoplePC: It's for people. And it's just smart. http://www.peoplepc.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:17:39 -0500 From: "Sheryl Novak" Subject: MM: Re: RE: I hate Jewel I like that disclaimer! s. ----- Original Message ----- From: Willms, Gregory J. To: 'beccasean@peoplepc.com' ; 'mad-mission@smoe.org' Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2002 10:13 AM Subject: MM: RE: I hate Jewel At one point, I thought Jewel hung the freakin' moon. I now loathe her. I find her music to be trite, contrived, pretentious, and commercial. Her performances and interviews are the same. If I never hear that story about her living in a van again, it will be too soon. Just the sound of her voice grates on my nerves and makes me want to kick her right in her crooked teeth. I do, however, thank Jewel for indirectly introducing me to Patty. *Disclaimer: This opinion is not necessarily the opinion of Patty Griffin, the Mad Mission list moderators, list members or anyone else affiliated with Patty Griffin. It is the personal opinion of the author and should be taken as such. How's that? -----Original Message----- From: beccasean@peoplepc.com [mailto:beccasean@peoplepc.com] Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2002 10:40 AM To: mad-mission@smoe.org Subject: MM: I hate Jewel I mean I really think she is horrible. I love Patty, hate Jewel, but don't mind the fact that others want to talk about her. Sean np-R.E.M. - Superman On Thu, 25 April 2002, TheGirlsHateHer@aol.com wrote > > You know, this list was created by fans from the Jewel list after Patty opened for Jewel at Jewelstock, so it's to be expected that there will be a lot of Jewel fans on this list, and that in some way, Patty and Jewel are connected. I'm sorry if you don't like Jewel, but you shouldn't expect people who do like her to stop talking about her. ________________________________________________ PeoplePC: It's for people. And it's just smart. http://www.peoplepc.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 11:17:48 EDT From: Femboty2k@aol.com Subject: Fwd: MM: Re: Stop that! i have never understood why people feel it is necessary to put down other people for no real reason but for their own need to be heard. I don't know how many times someone has asked me what type of music I like and has turned around and replied with something like "they suck" as if I asked for their opinion. This is not to say that I don't believe that people have a right to an opinion. But when your opinion has no positive affect, you might be a better person by keeping it to yourself sometimes. I need remember this myself. Later, Tina Return-Path: Received: from rly-xc04.mx.aol.com (rly-xc04.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.137]) by air-xc05.mail.aol.com (v84.10) with ESMTP id MAILINXC53-0425101000; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:10:00 -0400 Received: from smoe.org (jane.smoe.org [66.89.201.78]) by rly-xc04.mx.aol.com (v84.10) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINXC49-0425100947; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:47 -0400 Received: from smoe.org (ident-user@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smoe.org (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g3PE9dVU026450 for ; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by smoe.org (8.12.2/8.12.2/Submit) id g3PE9dgd026449 for mad-mission-outgoing; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp-out.na.baesystems.com (smtp-out.na.baesystems.com [208.19.133.17]) by smoe.org (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g3PE9aVU026427 for ; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from baemail.na.baesystems.com (baemail.na.baesystems.com [10.63.2.20]) by smtp-out.na.baesystems.com (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA02487; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp-core.na.baesystems.com ([10.63.2.17]) by baemail.na.baesystems.com (PMDF V5.2-33 #44999) with ESMTP id <0GV400CN5NBUTE@baemail.na.baesystems.com>; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from usa07.cs.na.baesystems.com ([166.18.21.62]) by smtp-core.na.baesystems.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g3PE9To19893; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: by usa07.cs.lmco.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <2V22HKF2>; Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:29 -0400 Content-return: allowed Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 10:09:28 -0400 From: "Connell, Michael P" Subject: RE: MM: Re: Stop that! To: "'David Tumbarello'" , mad-mission@smoe.org Message-id: <41575B2947B7D411A03C00508BCFF16208813C29@usa07.cs.lmco.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-type: text/plain Sender: owner-mad-mission@smoe.org Precedence: bulk David T wrote: > Give me a break. This is music we are talking about. > What one person likes is what they like. I have to agree with David. One policy we have on the list for that other artist some here say they barf about is that it's not nice to bash other artists. As a matter of fact it IS a policy not to do so. Why? Well, for one, it's not nice. Two, it is safe to say on most large or semi-large lists such as this that most musical artists out there likely have fans on this list. Bash that artist and someone here will take offense, as they like that artist. Each and every singer or group out there has fans whose booty they shake. Many of them are here on this list. Why can't we respect each others' right to like the music of the artists we choose and not cut that artist down? it's not a nice thing to do on many fronts. Mike ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 08:30:53 -0700 (PDT) From: beccasean@peoplepc.com Subject: Re: MM: RE: I hate Jewel I can buy that. The first time I saw Patty, Jewel was there (this was right as Save Your Soul was breaking big) and I had no beef with her. My then girlfriend (now wife) had the album Pieces of You, which I never thought of as anything more than background music.(with the exception of the song Pieces of You - absolutely horrible, a fifth grader could have written it) Seeing her live was fine, she didn't fall down or anything, so life went on for me, but soon things would take a turn for the worse. At some point in time (I don't recall the exact date) you could not escape her, and that too was fine. I thought, oh well, another artist who I went from somewhat liking to "would they stop playing that damn song!" no big deal right? Wrong! Then her next album came out! I was forewarned....Run for the hills! I took no heed, and now the rest, as the say, is history, and as I say, I hate Jewel, but don't mind people talking about her or even liking her. I enjoy the discourse on this list and think the list is too stale otherwise. There are only so many times we can all agree about how great Patty is. Which brings me to another reason I hate Jewel. While she is doing whatever it is she does, better artists (who are unfortunately considered in the same genre) such as Patty, Gillian Welch, et al. go virtually unnoticed. Gillian's last album might have been the best album of 2001, and about 23 people heard it. Sad. Sean np - Paul Westerberg Dirt to Mud On Thu, 25 April 2002, "Willms, Gregory J." wrote > > At one point, I thought Jewel hung the freakin' moon. I now loathe her. I > find her music to be trite, contrived, pretentious, and commercial. Her > performances and interviews are the same. If I never hear that story about > her living in a van again, it will be too soon. Just the sound of her voice > grates on my nerves and makes me want to kick her right in her crooked > teeth. I do, however, thank Jewel for indirectly introducing me to Patty. > > *Disclaimer: This opinion is not necessarily the opinion of Patty Griffin, > the Mad Mission list moderators, list members or anyone else affiliated with > Patty Griffin. It is the personal opinion of the author and should be taken > as such. > > How's that? > > -----Original Message----- > From: beccasean@peoplepc.com [mailto:beccasean@peoplepc.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2002 10:40 AM > To: mad-mission@smoe.org > Subject: MM: I hate Jewel > > I mean I really think she is horrible. I love Patty, > hate Jewel, but don't mind the fact that others want to > talk about her. > > Sean > np-R.E.M. - Superman > > > > On Thu, 25 April 2002, TheGirlsHateHer@aol.com wrote > > > > > You know, this list was created by fans from the > Jewel list after Patty opened for Jewel at Jewelstock, > so it's to be expected that there will be a lot of > Jewel fans on this list, and that in some way, Patty > and Jewel are connected. I'm sorry if you don't like > Jewel, but you shouldn't expect people who do like her > to stop talking about her. > > > ________________________________________________ > PeoplePC: It's for people. And it's just smart. > http://www.peoplepc.com ________________________________________________ PeoplePC: It's for people. And it's just smart. http://www.peoplepc.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 11:35:51 -0400 From: "Kunkel, Robert G" Subject: RE: MM: RE: I hate Jewel Sean wrote: >Which brings me to >another reason I hate Jewel. While she is doing >whatever it is she does, better artists (who are >unfortunately considered in the same genre) such as >Patty, Gillian Welch, et al. go virtually unnoticed. >Gillian's last album might have been the best album of >2001, and about 23 people heard it. Sad. And **that's** a reason to hate Jewel???? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 08:40:53 -0700 (PDT) From: beccasean@peoplepc.com Subject: RE: MM: RE: I hate Jewel Sure it is. It's called displaced hatred or something, but it's enough for me. You'll notice that I say it is ANOTHER reason for me to hate her. Shitty songs is the other. Sean > And **that's** a reason to hate Jewel???? ________________________________________________ PeoplePC: It's for people. And it's just smart. http://www.peoplepc.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 15:46:53 GMT From: Jon Schneider Subject: MM: Jewel, etc. I'm pretty new to this whole process and am finding the whole Jewel controversy mildly entertaining. Here's my view of the situation: The list is made up of intense Patty Griffin fans; that's why we bother with it. Most on the list are also interested in hearing about other artists that other Patty Griffin fans may like, hoping to ocdcasionally find some new music to listen to and trusting that the common Patty interest will lead them to other great music. The problem is when there is a lot of talk about one artist who some Patty list devotees don't particularly like. When that happens, they find all of the talk to be meaningless and at times annoying. I say you can't stifle others' thoughts and in the end you wouldn't want to. Music is a very subjective thing; there are even some misguided folks out there who don't appreciate the artistry of Patty Griffin. I may be flogged for this, but I don't particularly love "Living With Ghosts". Patty can and has done much better. 1000 Kisses is the best album I've heard by anyone in years. Obviously many of you disagree, but that's the way it goes. Personally, I'm not a Jewel fan, but I do want to find out about other artists through this resource of other Patty fans. I've gone on way too long. Long live Patty!!! NewPattyFan ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ End of mad-mission-digest V6 #159 *********************************