From: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org (mad-mission-digest) To: mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Subject: mad-mission-digest V3 #154 Reply-To: mad-mission@smoe.org Sender: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk * If you ever wish to unsubscribe, send an email to * mad-mission-digest-request@smoe.org * with ONLY the word unsubscribe in the body of the email * . * For the latest information on Patty's tour dates, go to: * http://www.spectra.net/~ducksoup/pattyg/patttyg.htm * OR * go to http://www.amrecords.com * then click "tour" and fill in the blanks :) * . * PLEASE :) when you reply to this digest to send a post TO the list, * change the subject to reflect what your post is about. A subject * of Re: mad-mission-digest V3 #xxx or the like gives readers no clue * as to what your message is about. mad-mission-digest Friday, May 21 1999 Volume 03 : Number 154 Today's Subjects: ----------------- MM: shy Patty [Dana ] MM: Re: mad-mission-digest V3 #152 [Twan68@aol.com] MM: tape trading [Dana ] MM: Re: mad-mission-digest V3 #152 [Twan68@aol.com] MM: RE: Fags, Queers, Dykes, Breeders, Rugmunchers, Butt Pirates, Gay s, L esbians, etc. ["Paquin, John" ] MM: Q: 6/24 Nashville show? [Julie E Graham ] MM: Re: Re: mad-mission-digest V3 #152 ["James P" ] MM: A NEW TOPIC THAT IS GUARANTEED NOT TO OFFEND OR UPSET ANYONE!!!!!! [H] MM: NPC: A QUICK QUESTION [Hejjira1@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 09:11:02 -0500 From: Dana Subject: MM: shy Patty Patty just seems painfully shy to me with strangers- she is not very chatty on stage and speaks so softly that is often hard to even understand her. We did get to speak with her way back tho. Two years ago she did a show for just a few dozen people. We were in the second row just a few feet away at the Eli Whitney Barn in Ct and there was actually a line afterwards for us to speak with her- like at a wedding. I have not seen that at any other concert I have been to- my daughter Arielle was 10 at the time and knew Patty's music from being trapped in the car with me every day riding to school, etc- she loved Patty and Patty was sweet to her. We then got a t-shirt and went back thru the line to have Patty sign it and Patty remembered Arielle's name! Ari then considered her a friend forever! She was very gracious and ladylike. She does not come across as quiet and shy in her lyrics- she says it outright plain and raw- no frosting ever. I guess that is how she gets it out. I wish she would interact a little more also, but she is who she is and that is what makes me love her music and lyrics, so, ok- it is hard for her to do it- she gives her all in concert and that is more than enough- I have seen her 9 times now in a little over two years and hope to catch her some more - altho I will never know her and don't expect to have any kind of conversation that means anything with her. No different than any other singersongwriter I like, actually. Same goes for Jackson Browne- I would love to know him, but I never will- so, I listen to his music and live my own life in the real world. I once read an old interview from way back maybe 20 yrs ago with Jackson. He was talking about hero worship. {I am only remembering how I understood this- it is not a direct quote and may be off.} He said that if someone comes up to him and tells him that he is their hero- he knows that he will not be able to be friends with that person- that person is of no use to him at all because what he needs is people who can see him for the imperfect person who he really is- he needs their help to get thru- he REALLY needs their help to get thru- not their blind adoration. He said that musicians, singers, famous people for whatever reason, may excel at one particular facet of their life- in his case, lyrics and songwriting and he with much effort and work polished off performing- he was not a natural from the start at that- but that they may have glaring deficits in other areas of their life- totally blowing it- just as human as the rest of us. Maybe their personal life is a wreck, relationships failed, whatever- of course that is the stuff that those songs we identify with can come from, because we all have our own glaring deficits in our lives, failed relationships, whatever. Anyway, I never forget this point of view from a famous person, and altho I know that singers must appreciate that at least a few fans after the show want to talk to them- otherwise, did anybody appreciate them?- still, I don't want to come off as a stalking hero worshipper to them- taking up their time when they need to relax after singing their heart out for me. Dana in CT who is finally leaving her Sweet Lorraine husband of 17 yrs and found someone new. Life is upside down, but going to get better! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 09:37:02 EDT From: Twan68@aol.com Subject: MM: Re: mad-mission-digest V3 #152 In a message dated 99-05-20 18:50:50 EDT, you write: >Okay, someone, anyone, please clarify something for me. There IS a field of >academia called "queer studies," right? I just read a book by Alexander Doty >called _Making Things Perfectly Queer_ which is about "queer" >representations/readings/narratives in television. Doty has trouble >explaining the term "queer" himself but uses it as a blanket term (even >though he says that's what he's trying to avoid) to be all inclusive when >discussing someone or a group who is/are non-straight. And there is a rap group called N*ggers With Attitude, I am not going to use the word to describe anyone. There is a group called the Radical Fairies, I don't want to be called a fairy. I am guilty of using these words myself in the past, but now I honestly do not feel that we take any of the sting out of it by overusing it. My best "breeder" girlfriend ( haha) could call me a fag and I probably woudn't mind that much, but if someone on the street said fag or queer to me, I would be offended and maybe scared for my safety. And let us remember that women are currently being referred to , in popular song, as bitches, slits, skank and so on. Think about how offensive these words are to you. Anthony ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 09:38:10 -0500 From: Dana Subject: MM: tape trading I remember the first boot I ever got about 2 1/2 yrs ago- Stays in Barcelona - Jackson Browne - CD- it was offered from an internet music co- $29 and I got one- it took 6 weeks to arrive and I was so happy that day- More Jackson! I already had all 11 of his tapes- on CD and tape- and I was dying for something new. This was the same songs, but acoustic. From that one CD, I was able to start trading a little with list people and now have about 35 JB boots- many with unrecorded songs, or versions that came off even better than the officially recorded versions- the intros between songs give a great feeling of being present at the concert and help to understand the songs sometimes. Every tape has a different feel. I have given - never sold - many tapes to internet and personal friends- also Patty, Catie, Dar, Richard, Lucy, Indigo Girls- These tapes have enriched my appreciation of artists that I love and already support every chance I can- I trust that anyone who I send tapes to feels the same way. I have even turned people on to Patty and these other singers in this way. There are several people on this list who are now avid Patty fans because I sent them her music- they catch her concerts and buy her music and spread her around to their friends. Everyone at work knows I love Jackson and Patty. They think I am going thru my second childhood- but music helps me get thru- I think I am a great public relations person for Patty and my other faves- I hope that no one I send a tape to allows it to be sold- have a sense of honor - just pass it on- share it- and support the artist as much as possible. I just mailed all my boots and CD's and tapes to my new address as my ex stole the whole collection on me last Sat for revenge, and I was dying- I was more upset about losing the boots than my purchased 175 or so CD's- I thought he might destroy or dump them somewhere- he returned them the next day and as of yesterday, they are out of here safe. I won't see them again until August when I actually move. I do have enough copies to listen to on my drive across country and keep me going until then as I turn the tape deck on immediately after the ignition- have to have music. Yesterday I drove alone 8 hrs- to PA and back to store things at my sister's house- I kept awake by listening to less familiar tapes the whole way. No Patty yesterday- I listen to her too much- but Catie, Richard, Lucy, Janis Ian, Dead Can Dance, Melissa Ferrick. Got home safe- mission accomplished- I have heard that Jackson has said that boots are cool- Catie doesn't seem to mind- as long as no money exchanges hands. I hope Patty dosn't mind but I spread her around as much as I can. She seemed pleased when I asked for an unrecorded song at the Iron Horse a month or so ago- Little God- she said she was surprised someone knew of it- altho I have heard her do it in concert several times now. I hope it is on the next album. Dana ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 09:43:56 EDT From: Twan68@aol.com Subject: MM: Re: mad-mission-digest V3 #152 In a message dated 99-05-20 18:50:50 EDT, you write: > I go to wesleyan university- i just finished my first year and was/am active >in the 'queer' community. i never gave thought to the blanket term because >it's cool to be queer- it's cool to have green hair which is not normal, it's >cool to wear white face paint and black clothes and that's not normal. and of >course there's the fact that ani is an icon of the 'queer' community and many >artists define themselves as queer Whatever! Let someone define themselves as queer, but that doesn't mean you define all homosexuals as queer. It is not cool to be queer. It is a fact. It has nothing to do with coolness. It is not a novelty. Wearing black clothes and white makeup and dying your hair green are all choices. Being gay is NOT A CHOICE! I have offended people in this very group with my blunt hoonesty on certain subjects. And people have been quick to point it out to me. I am making the point that though you may use words like queer or fag in your daily life, you must be aware that there are people on a list like this one that may possibly be offended by them. I don't like being labeled a novelty or a coll but strange thing. Anthony ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 10:57:45 -0500 From: "Paquin, John" Subject: MM: RE: Fags, Queers, Dykes, Breeders, Rugmunchers, Butt Pirates, Gay s, L esbians, etc. Language is interesting tool. It's one everyone uses every day so we think we understand it. It's only when we read the work of great poets that we see what the tool can do in skilled hands. If you think you understand language, look up Réné Magritte's painting "Ceçi n'est pas une pipe" (This is not a pipe). Then go read some e.e. cummings or Hamlet or see some of the movies "John Hodge" has written. In any art form, the tool is unimportant. The result is what's important, and to a large degree the intent of the artist. The way I see it, being offended by the word "queer" it is the same as being offended by Maplethorpe's more "interesting" photographs. It only becomes offensive when you assume the artist's (or speaker's) intent was to offend. - -john P.S. here's a URL for Magritte's painting http://www2.mcps.k12.md.us/schools/kingsviewms/art/gr/pipe.gif ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 12:22:44 EDT From: ABershaw@aol.com Subject: MM: Validity of that Suicide Note Hi all, Many are asking me about that "Eric Harris" note I posted in relation to the Tony thread. I recieved this from a friend who runs a major suicide prevention hotline in NYC. Although I can't personally confirm its validity, I'm fairly certain its legit. I deal with many suicide prevention situations in my work with Jewel's website & my relationship with her online fanbase & I often ask for advice from people with more experience. The person who sent me that note did so in an effort to help me spot danger signs of impending violence. Thats all I can say in reference to its validity. I never meant to offend anyone, Alan ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 11:24:55 -0700 (PDT) From: ruby maroon Subject: MM: Tape Trades/Formal Thank You. This is a formal thank you to all those "Beautiful People" who have made me Patty tapes and shipped them to me. I cant even begin to tell you not only how much I 'Appreicate' it but how 'Vital' it is for me, as a beginning guitar student these bootlegs have proved very beneficial in my learning process. I mean to hear these songs in an acoustic setting with guitar and vocals only has been so great, Ive learned so much from them and CONTINUE learning from them. Just for the price of the tape and shipping. Also I will never not trade or tape or shows. I believe in it for all the obvious reasons! LONG LIVE THOSE HONEST TAPE TRADERS. I too value these tapes more than most of my CD's, that's what Dana said. It does build appreciation for the artist AND it makes us life long fans, it's the labels that are the greedy men in this not us. Have a great day!!! Love and Music always, Jessica _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 13:54:37 -0500 (CDT) From: Julie E Graham Subject: MM: Q: 6/24 Nashville show? Hi Mike and M&M's, I read on Mike's website last night that Patty has a show in Nashville on 6/24.` The site says it's at "Charlse" Fox Guitars and that it is a private (solo) show. Just how private is it? Can I get in? I called information yesterday and they didn't have a listing for Charlse Fox Guitars. Thanks, Julie "Raised by Wolves in Alaska. Learned to yodel at the moon. Lived in a van on the San Diego freeway, only stopped for gas...." - Jewel reflects jokingly of critics' view of her childhood. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 14:15:30 -0500 From: "James P" Subject: MM: Re: Re: mad-mission-digest V3 #152 Anthony and others, I am not attacking, I am asking. I am asking BECAUSE I don't want to offend anyone in my writings. It is very confusing to go to class and devote an entire unit to "queer representations" and have the teacher, who is openly bi-sexual I might add, use the word in an academic sense. Then, when I'm with gay friends, I feel constricted when discussing what I've learned in class because I'm used to hearing the word "queer" in association with the material, but would NEVER want to offend them. There is and never will be an area of academia called, "n*****" studies or "bitch studies," but there IS a legitimate area called "queer studies" and "queer theory," which is almost expressly comprised of "queer" scholars, and THIS is where my confusion comes from. Why would these scholars/writers use the word if they know it offends even ONE member of their "family"? Still Confused, Cristina - -----Original Message----- From: Twan68@aol.com To: mad-mission@smoe.org Date: Friday, May 21, 1999 8:40 AM Subject: MM: Re: mad-mission-digest V3 #152 >In a message dated 99-05-20 18:50:50 EDT, you write: > >>Okay, someone, anyone, please clarify something for me. There IS a field of >>academia called "queer studies," right? I just read a book by Alexander Doty >>called _Making Things Perfectly Queer_ which is about "queer" >>representations/readings/narratives in television. Doty has trouble >>explaining the term "queer" himself but uses it as a blanket term (even >>though he says that's what he's trying to avoid) to be all inclusive when >>discussing someone or a group who is/are non-straight. > >And there is a rap group called N*ggers With Attitude, I am not going to use >the word to describe anyone. There is a group called the Radical Fairies, I >don't want to be called a fairy. I am guilty of using these words myself in >the past, but now I honestly do not feel that we take any of the sting out of >it by overusing it. My best "breeder" girlfriend ( haha) could call me a fag >and I probably woudn't mind that much, but if someone on the street said fag >or queer to me, I would be offended and maybe scared for my safety. > >And let us remember that women are currently being referred to , in popular >song, as bitches, slits, skank and so on. Think about how offensive these >words are to you. > >Anthony ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 15:21:55 EDT From: Hejjira1@aol.com Subject: MM: A NEW TOPIC THAT IS GUARANTEED NOT TO OFFEND OR UPSET ANYONE!!!!!! Hey fellow MM'rs, I was getting ready for work today and was listening to Flaming Red (of course) and it dawned on me that I can probably tell ya what each song on that album means (according to me of course) but I'm really confused as to the meaning behind "Carry Me" and "Go Now".........I'd be interested to hear what you guys' interpretation of the songs may be........any ideas and suggestions. Peace out, Paul Dunn "No need to talk like a hero......take a walk or count down to zero" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 15:41:47 EDT From: Hejjira1@aol.com Subject: MM: NPC: A QUICK QUESTION Does anyone know if a list like this exists for Kristin Hersh??? Email me privately if you do!! Thanks! P.D. ------------------------------ End of mad-mission-digest V3 #154 *********************************