From: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org (mad-mission-digest) To: mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Subject: mad-mission-digest V2 #106 Reply-To: mad-mission@smoe.org Sender: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-mad-mission-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk * If you wish to unsubscribe, send an email to * mad-mission-digest-request@smoe.org * with ONLY the word unsubscribe in the body of the email * . * For the latest information on Patty's tour dates, go to: * http://www.spectra.net/~ducksoup/pattyg/patttour.htm * OR * go to http://www.amrecords.com/road/index.html * and fill in the blanks :) * . * PLEASE :) when you reply to this digest to send a post TO the list, * change the subject to reflect what your post is about. A subject * of Re: mad-mission-digest V2 #xxx or the like gives readers no clue * as to what your message is about. mad-mission-digest Friday, April 24 1998 Volume 02 : Number 106 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: MM: Patty in Chicago? [EMSTER68 ] MM: Lilith List [EMSTER68 ] MM: ticketmaster numbers [LeShawnte ] MM: Lillith Fair-Mary Arden Collins!!! [Horter3 ] Re: MM: Patty in Chicago? [Joel Robert Nettesheim ] MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe [Scott Strickland] Re: MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe [Jerry Zigmont ] [none] [hkoehler@admin.austin.isd.tenet.edu (Holly Burton Koehler)] Re: MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe [ABershaw ] RE: MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe ["Luca, Joseph" ] MM: Flaming Red [Chris Kornmann ] MM: Sunday backyard LRT featuring Lisa Sanders, Joy Eden Harrison, et al. ["Larry S. Greenfield" Subject: Re: MM: Patty in Chicago? Mercury lounge is in NYC! I purchased my tickets by calling (212) 269-4TIX. I believe you can purchase them on the web at www.ticketweb.com! I just found out as well that the show was changed to May 15th! See you there! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:27:54 EDT From: EMSTER68 Subject: MM: Lilith List Could someone repost the Lilith Fair emailing list address again? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:32:41 EDT From: LeShawnte Subject: MM: ticketmaster numbers DATE: CITY/STATE: VENUE: TICKET ON-SALE DATE: 19-Jun Portland, OR Portland Meadows 9-May 20-Jun George, WA The Gorge 2-May 21-Jun George, WA The Gorge 2-May for the above dates, can any kind soul give out the information concerning the Portlad and George ticketmaster numbers to purchase tickets... Thanks, Shawnte' ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:31:38 EDT From: Horter3 Subject: MM: Lillith Fair-Mary Arden Collins!!! One of my favorite new artists who may be familiar to you all is competing for a spot on Lillith Fair!!! Who? Mary Arden Collins (and other finalists, but who cares about them) Where? At the TLA (Theater of Living Arts), South St, Phila PA When? This Wed, April 29th, doors open at 7pm. Show at 7:30pm. How? Tickets available thru Electric Factory Concerts (215)569-9400 for $3 Why? To help Mary win the one spot open for the Lilith Fair!!! I plan on being there. Hope to see you come out too! GO MARY!!!!!!!! (there she goes, blushing again ;-) Apologies for the crosspost. Feel free to forward to whomever you can think of since the audience decides who wins. The more, the merrier!!! Enjoy! Tom ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:33:50 -0500 (CDT) From: Joel Robert Nettesheim Subject: Re: MM: Patty in Chicago? On Thu, 23 Apr 1998, Twan68 wrote: > I understand that Patty was here in Feb. Does anyone know if she will be in > the Chicago area soon? I have to know. I am dying to know. Please Regarding Patty in Chicago, I do not know when she will be coming back; however, with her new album coming out I assume she will touring at the end of Summer. She also said she loves Chicago very much, so I presume it will be another stop on her tour. I saw her at the first show at Schuba's, I don't mean to make you feel bad......but it kicked ass!!!!\ \ Joel ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Strickland Subject: MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe Folks: Though I've been on this list for a couple of months this is the first time I've posted. I regret that I must speak a heresy, but so it goes. David Dey played "Toni" from _Flaming Red_ on WXPN's "World Cafe," a syndicated eclectic show done at the University of Pennsylvania and broadcast through Public Radio International. Since he announced that he would at the first of the show, I didn't move an inch. I couldn't have been more disappointed. I'm not a folk purist by any stretch of the imagination, and I do love my rock 'n roll; what is more, I've been around long enough to know all the great singer songwriters in the first wave when they weren't oldies and goldies. My aesthetic judgment of Patty couldn't be stronger. I honestly believe _Living With Ghosts_ is one of the most powerful recordings I've ever heard, and Patty is more than affirmation of it in performance. But "Toni" sucks in a big, big way. It's overproduced--there are at least three things going on in addition to her singing and playing at any one time, and they don't blend; more importantly, she's just another screaming singer whose lyrics don't mean s--- to a tree, to quote Grace Slick. I've heard the song in performance and it's beautiful. And the final coupe de "degras" is that the band sounds like a reprise of Grand Funk Railroad at the best and maybe even Iron Butterfly. I'd almost rather sit through another set of the guy Patty was traveling with a couple of months ago than hear a whole record like "Toni." Sorry to be so harsh, but that's how I feel. I'm not asking her to be something she doesn't want to be, but where is the feeling and artistry of _Living With Ghosts_? Oh well, give me your best shot. Scott ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:56:16 -0400 From: Jerry Zigmont Subject: Re: MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe Grand Funk Railroad, Iron Butterfly, Grace Slick?? The 60's are over Scott ! If this is your frame of reference, then we should weigh your opinion with a large amount of discretion. >And the final coupe de "degras" is that the band sounds like a reprise of Grand Funk Railroad at the >best and maybe even Iron Butterfly. Shame on you, it sounds nothing of the sort! "Flaming Red" is going to be a breakthrough album for Patty. It's not "Ghosts" nor is it intended to be. If your afraid to see Patty change, then don't but the CD. It's not for the faint of heart or "scaredy cats". Excuse me, while I go back to listening to my Vanilla Fudge albums. Jerry "Flaming Red" - A Patty Griffin Website http://nw3.nai.net/~zigmont/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:08:16 -0600 From: hkoehler@admin.austin.isd.tenet.edu (Holly Burton Koehler) Subject: [none] >According to Scott Strickland, "... 'Toni' sucks in a big, big way. It's >overproduced--there are at least >three things going on in addition to her singing and playing at any one time, >and they don't blend; more importantly, she's just another screaming singer >whose lyrics don't mean s--- to a tree, to quote Grace Slick. I've heard the >song in performance and it's beautiful... " Granted, I haven't heard the recorded version yet, but I don't understand how the lyrics can not "mean shit to a tree" on the recording, but the song still be beautiful in performance. Do you mean that, in performance, the song is beautiful DESPITE the lyrics? Please clarify. Oh, and I really really like the lyrics to "Tony." HBK ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 13:35:49 EDT From: ABershaw Subject: Re: MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe In a message dated 4/24/98 12:45:20 PM, zinzani@sprynet.com wrote: <<>> Hi Scott & all the people you likely put "the fear" into ;-) I've been lucky enough to have listened to "Flaming Red" in its entirety at least a dozen times & although I personally love the album, I must say that "Tony" is the weakest & least realized track, especially in comparison to its solo live incarnation. The "toned down" feel on Tony is exactly the opposite of what she's done with other recent live favorites. My point is---definately reserve judgement until hearing more. "Tony" is by no means representative of the rest of the album. The album is definately gonna blow many a mind of folks obsessed with the stark arrangements on LWG, though. On the album, Wiggly Fingers, Blue Sky & Flaming Red are 3 of the most seriously hellraising arrangements you could possibly imagine! I'm real curious to hear what she does with the band live. We're definately not in Kansas anymore, toto! Alan PS to Scott--Anyone who quotes the lyrics to "Eskimo Blue Day" sounds like someone I'd enjoy knowing! Hope you find the rest of "Flaming Red" MUCH more enjoyable. :-) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 13:43:15 -0400 From: "Luca, Joseph" Subject: RE: MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe Howdy; de-lurking here for a moment. Look, as Scott anticipated, his comments were provocative. Nonetheless, it does seem that he is a fan. And it would be nice if this list were a place where people could post controversial opinions without suffering ad hominem attacks. My guess is that he was not actually disparaging the lyrics to "Tony"; he acknowledged their power when performed live. It sounds like he was frustrated by their being lost in the mix and rendered ineffectual. Obviously, he wrote in the heat of passion; Iron Butterfly is not a reference easily or commonly or, perhaps, even correctly made. It's okay to be disappointed in or wary about a new version of a song, or in the new direction of an artist. We went through this a lot on the Dar-list when her latest CD came out and it featured a band. Most of the 1200-or so people on there, I daresay, now love the disc. There's room for everyone's opinion. For what it's worth, the other night I was parking the car; my wife and my dog were with me, and it was kind of hectic. But I heard on 92.5 (The River in Boston) that they were about to play new Patty. I paid as close attention as I could amid the confusion of parking in Coolidge Corner and dodging an energetic Border Collie passenger, so I can't give you a definitive review. In fact, I can't even tell you what song it was, since I had to exit before the DJ came back. But I must admit disappointment in what I heard. It didn't even sound like Patty; her trademark powerful, passionate vocals (and, hence, the lyrics) were nearly completely muted, almost lost in the mix. The band per se wasn't the problem; it just seemed way overproduced. Now my reaction might have been a function of my mood, or my too-high anticipation, but I really felt let down. Yes, I will buy the CD, and listen ad infinitum, and will doubtless grow to love the disc. I can't wait to see her live again. But my initial disappointment doesn't make me less of a fan or mean that I fear change. One might argue that there are some of us who unquestioningly announce that we love everything Patty does just because she's Patty. I'm sure she would want to be judged and appreciated on her merits, not her laurels. So let's keep this debate, and this list, courteous. And before any of us quickly fires off a passionate post, wait a moment, and re-read it, and then decide if it's still indicative of your feelings. And then tell us what you feel. Sorry for rambling; have a great day! Ciao, Joe ---------- From: Jerry Zigmont[SMTP:zigmont@mail2.nai.net] Sent: Friday, April 24, 1998 12:56 PM To: mad-mission@smoe.org Subject: Re: MM: Flaming Red on World Cafe Grand Funk Railroad, Iron Butterfly, Grace Slick?? The 60's are over Scott ! If this is your frame of reference, then we should weigh your opinion with a large amount of discretion. >And the final coupe de "degras" is that the band sounds like a reprise of Grand Funk Railroad at the >best and maybe even Iron Butterfly. Shame on you, it sounds nothing of the sort! "Flaming Red" is going to be a breakthrough album for Patty. It's not "Ghosts" nor is it intended to be. If your afraid to see Patty change, then don't but the CD. It's not for the faint of heart or "scaredy cats". Excuse me, while I go back to listening to my Vanilla Fudge albums. Jerry "Flaming Red" - A Patty Griffin Website http://nw3.nai.net/~zigmont/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:03:17 -0400 From: Kerry Bernard Subject: MM: Yes, it's different. :) I, to, am actually lucky enough to have heard all of Flaming Red (truth be told, I'm listening to it right now!) and I have to say, the word "different" is almost an understatement. I was pretty disappointed at first (for those who've heard the album, tell me your jaw didn't DROP when the opening riffs of "Flaming Red" came bellowing out?!) but it's really growing on me and Tony is, in fact, my favourite track on the album (right now, anyway). It's classic Patty- moving lyrics (verge of tears every time I hear it), driving guitar, and sheer emotional intensity. The arrangement is different, yes; there's more backing instrumentation, yes; but my gawd it's an incredible song. At any rate, I can only echo Joe's comments that everyone try to be courteous and respectful of other people's opinions. Let's not make this a big flame-fest (contrary to the name of the album ;) where everyone just leaps on each other saying, "You're wrong! I'm right!" It got reeeeally tedious on the Dar-list and I hope it doesn't get that way over here, too. Bickering doesn't do anyone any good. Kerry :) - ------------------------------------------------------------------ Kerry Bernard "If I'd come a long way, Young/Hunter Management you wouldn't be calling me baby." yhkerry@shore.net - My rooomate's t-shirt - ------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:09:33 -0400 From: Chris Kornmann Subject: MM: Flaming Red I have been listening to Flaming Red for the past month and I too am disappointed...although, it does grow on you because the songs are great (as witnessed in her live performances) but the production of the whole album is not...terribly over produced with so much stuff going on that you can't hear her voice like you should...and in the process, the lyrics and the true meanings of the songs do tend to get lost a bit. As far as her backing band...my first reaction was that they sounded like a classic rock band that lack a certain chemistry and soul...they obviously haven't played together much and are probably studio musicians. On certain tracks, they are way too loud, in particluar, "Wiggly Little Fingers", which starts out with the same rift as Jimi Hendrix's "Foxy Lady" and the loud guitars continue to blare over her voice throughout the entire song. It's sad...because this album could've been great! If she had the right producer and a more solid backing band this album would've been as phenomenal as Living With Ghosts...in addition to breaking new ground, which I am all for! Sometimes you gotta take a chance and I respect Patty for doing so. But, I am not going to call it a great piece of work, just because it is Patty. I am going to recognize it for the work that it is. It's too bad that the producer didn't have the insight to capitalize on Patty's best asset..her voice. The songs are there, however they are not represented the best way that they could be. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:26:56 -0700 From: "Larry S. Greenfield" Subject: MM: Sunday backyard LRT featuring Lisa Sanders, Joy Eden Harrison, et al. Hi, all! I wanted to take this opportunity to remind everyone about the Living Room Tour in Los Angeles this Sunday (April 26), starting at 3 p.m. Joining headliners Lisa Sanders and Joy Eden Harrison will be Aife Wells (a stunning acoustic-guitar-playing singer/songwriter who opened for Counting Crows last Sunday at L.A.'s Viper Room), and, newly-announced, "Starbelly," featuring the haunting vocals of Cindy Wasserman, plus some special guest appearances. Please email me for location and directions if you can come. I hope to see a lot of you! - -=-Larry-=- ------------------------------ End of mad-mission-digest V2 #106 *********************************