From: owner-lucy-list-digest@smoe.org (lucy-list-digest) To: lucy-list-digest@smoe.org Subject: lucy-list-digest V6 #180 Reply-To: lucy-list@smoe.org Sender: owner-lucy-list-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-lucy-list-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk lucy-list-digest Wednesday, December 22 2004 Volume 06 : Number 180 In this issue: [lucy-list] Lucy and God [lucy-list] Huh? Re: [lucy-list] Lucy and God Re: [lucy-list] Huh? [lucy-list] December Holidays and The White House [lucy-list] a very insightful article on Christ, Christmas, and Christianity Re: [lucy-list] Huh? [lucy-list] Christmas--the last word Re: [lucy-list] Lucy and God Re: [lucy-list] Huh? Re: [lucy-list] Lucy and God Re: [lucy-list] Lucy and God [lucy-list] List etiquette ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 06:32:26 -0800 (PST) From: Phil Garner Subject: [lucy-list] Lucy and God Phil Garner here, unafraid to pubically avow that I'm a Christian Deb Woodell wrote: Re: our religious discussion, here's something Lucy has sung: Phil here: Lucy has indeed sung songs with Christian lyrics. Do you reckon it was sincere or was an attempt to broaden her fan base? (That's a worthwhile "Lucy related" topic, isn't it?) Gina wrote: I suppose I am considered one of the "hateful and prejudice" that Roxylee called us folkies. This, BTW, is quite offensive and undeserved here. But can we PLEASE not discuss religion, politics or other divisive, non-related issues in this room?!!!!!!!!!!!! What does Chrisianity, God, Christmas, Harry Potter, school prayer etc. have to do with music or the Lucy list? Phil here: If you're offended then you need to get a life, Gina. Christian folk have a better reason to be offended by you than you by them. You're in a small minority of godless folk, if that's what you truly are, and you need to know that you're walking the soil of the USA with a great majority of folk who are not like you. In reality I'm betting that you are not truly godless but rather caught up in a culture where it's to your advantage to act that way and where you've been misled into thinking that such thinking is normal. Now, I don't know what Harry Potter has to do with the Lucy list ........ but I know that Lucy's talent is God-given and that she'd be nothing without Him. (There's another worthy Lucy-related topic for discussion.) She'd have a hard time wholly denying that while singing songs with Christian lyrics (as she has frequently done.) Her public humanistic philosophy does not change a thing. Imagine Lucy taking every musical note and every lyric needed for a good song ............. then putting them into a paper bag, shaking them up really well, ........... then "pouring" them out so to speak. Do you think the random order would produce a song as good as "Ten Year Night"? Of course not. Her God-given talent makes the difference. It's high time the minority of folk stopped getting their little feelings hurt when other folk give credit to God for the things He has done. God made you, Gina. Unless you think someone took all the dust and water needed to make you, shook it up and poured out, then out came Gina. Look at yourself, Gina. The order and magnificance of your existance screams that there is a Creator. And THAT has everything to do with GOD but nothing to do with RELIGION. Religion is another matter entirely and I'm content to leave religion off this discussion list. Peace and love, Phil Garner ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:14:01 -0500 From: Roxylee Subject: [lucy-list] Huh? Gina said: > I suppose I am considered one of the "hateful and prejudice" that > Roxylee called us folkies. HUH? Nothing like spinning my words, sheesh.. Thank you, Deb and Phil, for understanding I was not putting anyone down. I just pointed out the double standard. It's amazing how some people have totally misread or misrepresented my words. Oh, well, nothing new under the sun... By the way, I love my Jewish brothers and sisters, understanding and appreciating the root of christianity. PEACE, Roxy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:17:26 -0500 From: "Doug Fuller" Subject: Re: [lucy-list] Lucy and God - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Garner" > > Phil Garner here, unafraid to pubically avow that I'm > a Christian What makes you think I give a fuck? In case there's any question, I don't give a fuck. > Phil here: > Lucy has indeed sung songs with Christian lyrics. Do > you reckon it was sincere or was an attempt to broaden > her fan base? Maybe she liked the song, dicknose. > Phil here: > In reality I'm betting that you are not truly godless > but rather caught up in a culture where it's to your > advantage to act that way and where you've been misled > into thinking that such thinking is normal. That's rather presumtive, don't you think? And since we're presuming, I presume you're an asshole. > but I know that Lucy's talent is > God-given and that she'd be nothing without Him. Or maybe she worked at it, shit-for-brains. > Imagine Lucy > taking every musical note and every lyric needed for a > good song ............. then putting them into a paper > bag, shaking them up really well, ........... then > "pouring" them out so to speak. Do you think the > random order would produce a song as good as "Ten > Year Night"? Of course not. Her God-given talent > makes the difference. You're an idiot. And what are your thoughts on her banging that guy on the kitchen floor? > It's high time the minority of folk stopped getting > their little feelings hurt when other folk give credit > to God for the things He has done. I think it's high time you shut the fuck up so we don't have to listen to your bullshit drivel. > Religion is > another matter entirely and I'm content to leave > religion off this discussion list. Good. Then we can count on you shutting the fuck up then, right? > Peace and love, > Phil Garner Fuck you. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:26:41 -0500 From: "Doug Fuller" Subject: Re: [lucy-list] Huh? - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roxylee" > > HUH? Nothing like spinning my words, sheesh.. Thank you, Deb and Phil, > for understanding I was not putting anyone down. I just pointed out the > double standard. It's amazing how some people have totally misread or > misrepresented my words. Oh, well, nothing new under the sun... By the > way, I love my Jewish brothers and sisters, understanding and > appreciating the root of christianity. > > PEACE, > Roxy You too. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:29:36 -0500 From: "Steve Gilmore" Subject: [lucy-list] December Holidays and The White House Interesting article on this subject that makes you think: http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=42027 Happy Holidays everyone! Steve Gilmore Charlotte, NC USA Be yourself--it's the one thing that you can do better than anyone else can do. - -- ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:53:47 -0500 From: "Steve Gilmore" Subject: [lucy-list] a very insightful article on Christ, Christmas, and Christianity check out: http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig5/whitehurst2.html It will really make you think. Also in the UK, which is as religiously diverse as its former colony, London's Daily Mail (isn't that supposed to be one of London's better newspapers?) has a section devoted to Christmas in every day's paper. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/christmas/christmas.html?in_page_id=1322 Steve Gilmore Charlotte, NC USA Be yourself--it's the one thing that you can do better than anyone else can do. - -- ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:59:32 -0500 From: "benruth@earthlink.net" Subject: Re: [lucy-list] Huh? How is it that there's all this fighting here all of a sudden? And over religion of all things! Hostility is certainly not going to win anybody over to the other side...and it's not as if there need to be "sides" at the first place. In my family there are: - -three conservative Christians - -four moderate Christians - -three Jews - -two agnostics - -one spiritualist - -five atheists That's counting some people twice, because I can't figure out how to get them into a single category...but anyway, I am going to see many of these people over Christmas, and you can bet we won't be arguing over who believes what. We're going to be too busy enjoying one another's company. That's what bothers me about this infighting in the Lucy-list---it may be a virtual community, and I may be doing more lurking than posting these days, but I still want to be able to enjoy all of your company, and I can't do that when everybody's arguing. I can't PREVENT anyone from arguing...you can argue on or not, that's your choice. But that's not what I choose to think the Lucy-list is about. You can call me idealistic, but it doesn't matter what anybody believes---I am happy that ALL of you are here, and I wish ALL of you a joyous and peaceful holiday. Benay - -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 11:13:27 -0500 From: "Steve Gilmore" Subject: [lucy-list] Christmas--the last word My last post of a link on the above subject: http://federalistpatriot.us/pub/04-5152_Brief.htm Steve Gilmore Charlotte, NC USA Be yourself--it's the one thing that you can do better than anyone else can do. - -- ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 11:18:57 -0500 From: Sdgold60@aol.com Subject: Re: [lucy-list] Lucy and God YO YO YO wait a minute here.. there is one thing about expressing a difference of opinion and understanding that you cannot and will not change someone's mind... its another to pubically call someone out and use profane language to insult and ridicule someone else.. i may not agree with Phil.. who may in fact have his own beliefs about my relgious beliefs..but i think that he should be able to enjoy the safety to say it.. doug im not sure that you helped create a sense of safety and sorry buddy... you were out of line.. the language you choose, though i value free speech is as offfensive to some as the original posts... sharon - -- She said a good day Ain't got no rain She said a bad day's when I lie in bed And think of things that might have been paul simon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 08:24:52 -0800 (PST) From: Gina Golde Subject: Re: [lucy-list] Huh? First of all, please re-read my posts and see if I expressed ANY opinion about anything other than this is NOT the place to discuss these things. Nobody here knows anything about my religious or political leanings. I didn't even give an opinion when Lucy sent the political message to the list. I would really prefer this to be a neutral place without all this kind of stuff that we have to deal with everywhere else. The fighting is exactly why I asked that these sorts of posts not be done. If you want to discuss how you feel about religion in society or political views go to those sites. Read it in the newspaper. Watch those sorts of TV shows. NOT HERE. And yes Roxy, you did call the folk community, or rather people who listen to the same music you do, "hateful and predjudice." Plus you said that your views weren't popular in here, even though these things have never really come up in this room. Your posting your strong opinions about things upon which people are polarized and which have no context in this room does start fighting. You KNOW this because apparently you caused quite a stir in the Richard room. But, still you came here and did the same. A simple "Merry Christmas" would have sufficed if that's what you meant. Instead, you went on a little rant about being Christian etc. I, for one, think that this was not appropriate for the content of this room. Assuming my beliefs and condeming me for having my little minority feelings hurt is just plain RUDE. And again, has nothing to do with the price of tomatoes, which by the way is almost as obscene as all of this. Gina "benruth@earthlink.net" wrote: How is it that there's all this fighting here all of a sudden? And over religion of all things! Hostility is certainly not going to win anybody over to the other side...and it's not as if there need to be "sides" at the first place. In my family there are: - -three conservative Christians - -four moderate Christians - -three Jews - -two agnostics - -one spiritualist - -five atheists That's counting some people twice, because I can't figure out how to get them into a single category...but anyway, I am going to see many of these people over Christmas, and you can bet we won't be arguing over who believes what. We're going to be too busy enjoying one another's company. That's what bothers me about this infighting in the Lucy-list---it may be a virtual community, and I may be doing more lurking than posting these days, but I still want to be able to enjoy all of your company, and I can't do that when everybody's arguing. I can't PREVENT anyone from arguing...you can argue on or not, that's your choice. But that's not what I choose to think the Lucy-list is about. You can call me idealistic, but it doesn't matter what anybody believes---I am happy that ALL of you are here, and I wish ALL of you a joyous and peaceful holiday. Benay - -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 17:02:46 +0000 From: tjhuot@comcast.net (Thomas Huot) Subject: Re: [lucy-list] Lucy and God Isn't this a moderated list? I don't think I have ever seen anything like this one posted on one of these lists. We could be a bit more civil. I have deleted the majority of the message, but I am fairly sure you will all know which one it is. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Phil Garner" > > > > Phil Garner here, unafraid to pubically avow that I'm > > a Christian > > What makes you think I give a .... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 14:11:54 -0500 From: rachel@rachelwrites.com Subject: Re: [lucy-list] Lucy and God I agree, the language is pretty severe. Rachel (a lurker) Quoting Thomas Huot : > Isn't this a moderated list? I don't think I have ever seen anything like > this one posted on one of these lists. We could be a bit more civil. I have > deleted the majority of the message, but I am fairly sure you will all know > which one it is. - -------------------------------------------------- http://www.hostasite.com - Web hosting made simple ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 20:35:40 -0500 From: "Bill McDonough" Subject: [lucy-list] List etiquette I really hate having to play list nanny. Fortunately you guys rarely make me do it. But it appears we need a statement of list etiquette. So here are a few reminders for everyone. As far as I'm concerned, this list is open to discussions of anything regarding Lucy's music, shows, and those things about her life she has decided to make public; as well as discussions on other artists and shows. When you're discussing folk music and/or folk musicians, that usually means also discussing matters of politics and religion, as these things tend to be involved with folk music. All I ask is that we remain civil. This is not a moderated list and I really don't want to make it one, so remember that regardless of your opinion of a post or poster, there is NEVER a reason for a profanity laced personal attack. We all have delete keys. Use yours when you are offended and get the urge to flame someone. Please address any questions regarding this or other List administrative stuff to me personally and not the list. Thanks. Bill Lucy-list geek ------------------------------ End of lucy-list-digest V6 #180 ******************************* This has been a posting from the Lucy Kaplansky mail list digest To unsubscribe send mail to Majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe lucy-list-digest" in the body of the message