From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V8 #171 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Wednesday, September 9 2009 Volume 08 : Number 171 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] H&O [Jenny Grover ] Re: [loud-fans] H&O ["R. Kevin Doyle" ] Re:[loud-fans] Beatles mastering [outbound-only email address Subject: Re: [loud-fans] H&O Andrew Hamlin wrote: > Jen might enjoy "Rich Girl" more with Nina Simone singing it. Then > again, she might not. > I doubt it. I just loathe the song itself. > Oh, and I've been wondering for weeks which record Jen destroyed in > her misspent youth... > You mean when I was 2 or however young and trying to play it? It was a Peter Pears album. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2009 00:27:59 -1000 From: "R. Kevin Doyle" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] H&O > Yeah, I remember fishing Daryl Hall's first solo album out of the > JDC's record files and exclaiming, "What the hell are you doing with > this?!" To which the JDC responded loftily with the Fripp connection. Do yourself a favor and listen to that solo album ('Sacred Songs") if you like Fripp. Fripp made an argument that, had it been released when it was recorded (around the same time Fripp was working with Bowie) instead of when it was released (1980), Hall would have been regarded as America's answer to Bowie. I don't necessarily agree with Fripp in this regard. The songs are categorically very different from Berlin-era Bowie in both style and substance. However, as far as "Frippertronics meets pop" goes, "Sacred Songs" may be the highlight. Listen to the version with the "You Burn Me Up I'm a Cigarette" and "North Star" bonus tracks on it if you can. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2009 11:27:31 -0400 From: outbound-only email address Subject: Re:[loud-fans] Beatles mastering Chris: >> Because the original analog tapes survive, it doesn't make the 1980's digital remixes the final word. The tech for separating sounds and performing digital magic upon them is far, far advanced over what it was when those remasters were done. I imagine those '80's digital masters were completely scrapped and work was done from the original studio tape from scratch. ...and yes, on the mono mixes at least, the results are noticeable, and in most cases spectacular. My '80's mono remaster of Revolver pales in comparison to the new version. McCartney's bass on "Taxman" has to be heard to be believed. << In case I can't make it intrinsically clear, this is a sincere question, not a snarky/sarcastic one. Most of what I think about when I think of modern mastering tech is about compression -- look-ahead, brick-wall limiting, etc. This certainly suits some material, but I think it also sometimes affects the musicality of pieces (mostly in lost dynamic range, also increased sibilance and lack of definition in higher frequencies). Are these re-masters really better (for someone who doesn't love the super-compressed sound), or just louder? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2009 09:12:13 -0700 (GMT-07:00) From: treesprite@earthlink.net Subject: Re:[loud-fans] Beatles mastering >Most of what I think about when I think of modern mastering tech is >about compression -- look-ahead, brick-wall limiting, etc. This >certainly suits some material, but I think it also sometimes affects >the musicality of pieces (mostly in lost dynamic range, also increased >sibilance and lack of definition in higher frequencies). Are these >re-masters really better (for someone who doesn't love the >super-compressed sound), or just louder? I haven't heard the Beatles remasters, but I would generally disagree that compression is the only difference between the mastering of 20+ years ago and today. The most important changes are in the conversion from analog to digital -- the quality of that conversion is the most important thing and the improvement in that technology has been enormous. I would recommend an a/b comparison of the original Frank Sinatra CD releases and the 24-bit releases from 2002 -- the dynamics are intact, but the detail and richness of sound are much improved. Other big differences (and there are folks here who can actually explain this kind of stuff in technical terms) include changing trends in the use of EQ -- the difference between the original CD of Kirsty MacColl's Kite and the reissue seems to rest largely in the handling of the low and high end information. In my opinion, a lot of records from the 80's made an uncomfortable transition to CD because the vinyl format manipulated the sound in such a way (primarily: distortion) that the glossy highs and water-y lows weren't as obtrusive as they were in the digital format. Recent remasters of 80's records have been sensitive to those quirks and have resulted in more flattering transfers (ie Prefab Sprout's Steve McQueen, the Rhino Smiths' best-of...) I'm guessing the Beatles remasters will be somewhat like The Band remasters -- more of an audiophile's faithfulness to , or attempt at, "original sound" rather than a general "loud-ening"! B ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2009 19:57:06 EDT From: Markwstaples@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Beatles mastering I have the British copy of this CD, and it is old, but I never thought it sounded bad, but from what you're saying, it must really sound great now (for some who may not know, it's the album called TWO WHEELS GOOD in the US, with the motorcycle and band on the cover in that autumnal setting). I did buy the original Blondie CDs from the '80s, and they suffered with the problems you mentioned. They got it right with the next generation. Just a little tidbit I think is pretty great: a girl in my h.s. graduating class (and a former friend when I was on Facebook) has her head and hair perfectly photoshopped over the girl in the band (Wendy Smith) on the back of the Triumph motorbike from that album cover on her Facebook page, which I thought was fitting, since it came out in '85 and we graduated h.s. the same year--she had/still has a crush on Paddy McAloon. - --Mark In a message dated 9/8/2009 12:31:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, treesprite@earthlink.net writes: ie Prefab Sprout's Steve McQueen ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V8 #171 *******************************