From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V7 #481 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Tuesday, August 19 2008 Volume 07 : Number 481 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners ["Tom Marcinko" ] Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners ["Andrew Hamlin" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 11:15:48 -0700 From: "Tom Marcinko" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners That's quite an endorsement, and you would think that somebody would have, like, used it in an ad or something. On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 10:52 PM, Tom Galczynski wrote: > The ONLY reason I am a Scott Miller/Loud Family/Game Theory fan is because > I read an interview with Aimee Mann and she said when she writes a song she > thinks "Would Scott Miller think this is a good song". So I went out and > bought PABARAT and then everything else in short order. I have always > contended it is the record label's job to sell the artist and it pains me > when Scott writes otherwise, that somehow HE is to blame (or rather his > songwriting sensibilities) for not being more well known. > > Tom Galczynski tgalczynski@comcast.net > --------------------------------------- > Call on God, but row away from the rocks. -- Indian proverb > > > > > > John Swartzentruber wrote: > >> On 8/17/2008 6:18 PM JRT456@aol.com wrote: >> >>> In a message dated 8/17/08 4:45:00 PM, andrew.hamlin@gmail.com writes: >>> >>> >>> >>>> ...and b) >>>> sign with *any* label *other* than Alias. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> In Alias' defense, their publicist at the time was Brett Milano, and it's >>> hard to imagine that any other label could have offered one that was so >>> honestly enthused about a Scott Miller project. >>> >>> >> Without Brett (specifically his Stereo Review reviews) I imagine a few of >> us would never have heard of Scott to this day. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 13:40:29 -0500 From: Tom Galczynski Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners Granted, this interview was in 1996. Here is a link to it: http://thebostonphoenix.com/alt1/archive/music/reviews/01-18-96/AIMEE_MANN.html And the bit about Scott that changed my music-listening life: [Aimee] The difference with the new album is that there were some modern records I was listening to that were as much an influence as the older stuff. And that's funny, because it's almost a taboo in interviews to admit you've heard anything recent. If somebody says that you sound like Nirvana, you're supposed to immediately deny it. But a couple of years ago, there were a couple of albums that were so good I would consider them classics: Beck's Mellow Gold, the Posies' Frosting on the Beater, and the first Liz Phair album. And the Loud Family, as you know. Q: Right, Plants & Birds & Rocks & Things made me see God, and you seemed to have the same reaction. A: Scott Miller is the best songwriter out there, in my opinion. I often think about that when I'm writing: "Would Scott think this song is any good?" Q: Would you put yourself in the same category with those kinds of people? A: I would love it if they put me in the same class. Maybe I have some songs that are better than some of Jon Brion's, and some that are better than some of Squeeze's. But at their best -- forget it. And Scott's definitely better than me. Tom Galczynski tgalczynski@comcast.net--------------------------------------- Any clod can have the facts, but having an opinion is an art. -- Charles McCabe Tom Marcinko wrote: That's quite an endorsement, and you would think that somebody would have, like, used it in an ad or something. On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 10:52 PM, Tom Galczynski wrote: The ONLY reason I am a Scott Miller/Loud Family/Game Theory fan is because I read an interview with Aimee Mann and she said when she writes a song she thinks "Would Scott Miller think this is a good song". So I went out and bought PABARAT and then everything else in short order. I have always contended it is the record label's job to sell the artist and it pains me when Scott writes otherwise, that somehow HE is to blame (or rather his songwriting sensibilities) for not being more well known. Tom Galczynski tgalczynski@comcast.net --------------------------------------- Call on God, but row away from the rocks. -- Indian proverb John Swartzentruber wrote: On 8/17/2008 6:18 PM JRT456@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 8/17/08 4:45:00 PM, andrew.hamlin@gmail.com writes: ...and b) sign with *any* label *other* than Alias. In Alias' defense, their publicist at the time was Brett Milano, and it's hard to imagine that any other label could have offered one that was so honestly enthused about a Scott Miller project. Without Brett (specifically his Stereo Review reviews) I imagine a few of us would never have heard of Scott to this day. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 14:23:24 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners On 8/18/08, Tom Marcinko wrote: > That's quite an endorsement, and you would think that somebody would have, > like, used it in an ad or something. Might work even better if somebody would, like, release a certain album she's been sitting on for no apparent reason. "AH, but nobody ever said life was fair..." Andy "Let there be no inscription upon my tomb; let no man write my epitaph: no man can write my epitaph." Robert Emmet (17801803), from his Speech on his Trial and Conviction for High Treason, September, 1803 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:08:48 EDT From: Markwstaples@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners In a message dated 8/18/2008 12:55:22 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, tgalczynski@comcast.net writes: I have always contended it is the record label's job to sell the artist and it pains me when Scott writes otherwise, that somehow HE is to blame (or rather his songwriting sensibilities) for not being more well known. Well, my opinion (I know, nobody asked!) on this matter will sound elitist for sure (but not racist!). I used to, in my younger days, think that it was simply Scott needing a break somewhere, somewhow, through somebody, or something. I now, in my older ones, have come to believe that Scott is simply above the head of John Q. Downloadbuyer, who, upon listening, just doesn't get it. If you haven't noticed, his fans are extremely bright, educated people with extremely high intelligence (except it went wrong somewhere in there for me--when I first joined this list, I was SOOO intimidated by the smarts on here). Another thing is, the target audience Scott originally appealed to is most of us demographically--in our 40s or close to it, and college educated. We aren't a huge album purchasing lot these days--having kids and all that entails take album money (and, I'm not sure I'm against that--kids are how I make a living!). When Scott made his mark with most of us is when we were college age. We on here do buy a lot, but we are exceptions to the rule--because w e are so passionate about music, which is why we "get" Scott in the first place. I think that passion is a prerequisite. I think that Scott's stab at ever achieving a major label type fan base at this point is very slim to none. The window of opportunity that was there in 1989 is closed--the target audience has grown up and out of music buying for a large part. Scott has grown older as well. Even R.E.M., the band that GT was supposed to be, fell out of favor and are now making a comeback, but they certainly aren't as popular as they were in 1987 ir 1992. The kids want the records of kids, or at least young adults--it's normal. So, older artists, not all but most, to stay in the business, try and look young--have you seen how artificial the B-52's look in the cover art for FUNPLEX? They've always been artificial, but they're getting in Joan Rivers territory these days. How 'bout Siouxie Sioux's latest? Granted, she's always been rather artificial looking, especially in that Cleopatra crossed with buddy Robert Smith's phase she was in for years--but in that photo of her as the main publicity shot, not a pore or grey hair or wrinkle. Not one. Freaky scary. For Scott to make it now with any kind of ripple respectably, he'd have to appeal to the older crowd in the "Adult Alternative" catergory, but again, what is the buying power of that demographic? That would mean that Costello and Mann would need to give Scott a little room in there for a chunk of their lion's share (perhaps this is the real reason why that album never surfaced?--competition? Maybe it isn't Aimee but her "people" that saw that danger--I don't know--it's just a thought and I'm throwing it out there). It would seem to me that the people buying in this category already know of Scott Miller, at least a goodly amount of them. Nah, scratch that, probably not--they would think he's that guy who fronts The Commonwealth. His own name is his downfall! The youth market is where the real money is, and, judging from what I've seen with the youth of today (and I know how "bitter old man" this sounds, but so be it) about the only way Scott could become huge is if he dumbed his lyrics WAAAY down, turned the testorone WAAAY up and got some T&A in his cover art--or maybe some shit that 14-year-old boys think is evil cool. Still works for Ozzy. And, cookie monster vocals wouldn't hurt, either. But, that wouldn't be Scott, and, for Scott to be Scott, he must remain as he is. I wouldn't have him any other way. Praise Satin--and Rayon for that matter (and beware of Obamma--he's a bad mamma jamma), - --Mark **************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 16:39:11 -0700 From: "Tom Marcinko" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners I would certainly second that, if only because I'd like to, you know, freaking HEAR it. And I am a massive Aimee fan. (Weighing in at...) On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 2:23 PM, Andrew Hamlin wrote: > On 8/18/08, Tom Marcinko wrote: > > That's quite an endorsement, and you would think that somebody would > have, > > like, used it in an ad or something. > > Might work even better if somebody would, like, release a certain > album she's been sitting on for no apparent reason. > > "AH, but nobody ever said life was fair..." > > Andy > > > "Let there be no inscription upon my tomb; let no man write my > epitaph: no man can write my epitaph." > > Robert Emmet (1780 1803), from his Speech on his Trial and Conviction > for High Treason, September, 1803 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:42:04 -0400 From: Dave Walker Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners On Aug 18, 2008, at 7:08 PM, Markwstaples@aol.com wrote: > The kids want the records of kids, or at least young adults--it's > normal. > So, older artists, not all but most, to stay in the business, try > and look > young--have you seen how artificial the B-52's look in the cover > art for > FUNPLEX? They've always been artificial, but they're getting in > Joan Rivers > territory these days. How 'bout Siouxie Sioux's latest? Granted, > she's always been > rather artificial looking, especially in that Cleopatra crossed > with buddy > Robert Smith's phase she was in for years--but in that photo of her > as the > main publicity shot, not a pore or grey hair or wrinkle. Not one. > Freaky > scary. from Grace Slick's Wikipedia page: > Slick's longevity in the music business helped her earn a rather > unusual distinction: the oldest female vocalist on a Billboard Hot > 100 number one single. "We Built This City" reached #1 onNovember > 16, 1985, less than three weeks after her 46th birthday. The > previous record was age 44 for Tina Turner, with 1984's number-one > hit, "What's Love Got To Do With It". Turner (who is, coincidentally > within a month of Slick's age) turned 45 two months after the song > topped the charts. Slick broke her own record in Summer 1987 at age > 47 when "Nothing's Gonna Stop Us Now" topped the U.S. charts. Her > record stood for 12 years, but was ultimately broken by Cher, who > was 53 in 1999 when "Believe" hit number one. So, yeah on the "pop music is a young person's game" thing. -d.w. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 20:37:39 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners > So, yeah on the "pop music is a young person's game" thing. To which, I'll add, Neil Diamond recently became the oldest person to take an album to #1 in America. On top of which, Neil's the performer who's waited the longest, after career inception, for this, his first #1 album--42 years, if you "career inception" as the release of his first album in 1966. So aside from Scott's probable complete disgust with and dismay at the record industry by now, he might have a shot after all, Andy 'Guitar Hero' whiz aiming higher By Matt Ehlers, Staff WriterComment on this story It's a small plastic thing, resembling a guitar in basic appearance only. But Blake Peebles brings energy to the room when he slides the strap over his skinny shoulder and steps atop the wooden box that serves as a stage. As the music begins, Blake quickly presses buttons on the guitar in time to a speed-metal tune blasting from the giant TV. It is an odd sensation, to watch a young man control the sounds of a rock song with a toy instrument, but this is "Guitar Hero," one of the most popular video game franchises in recent memory. Blake is one of the better players in the country. Other than his fingers, Blake barely moves while playing. His feet are set in place and his eyes are locked on the screen as he peers through a mop of curly brown hair. Gaming for him is serious business. It's his job. Among the prizes he's won playing "Guitar Hero" tournaments: gift certificates, gaming equipment and chicken sandwiches. Blake is 16, resides in North Raleigh and lives to play video games. On this night, he's at the Fox and Hound in Raleigh's North Hills shopping district. It's the restaurant's regular Sunday "Guitar Hero" night, and Blake and his family have come to watch and play. His brother and sister are here, as are his mom and dad, an aunt and an uncle, some cousins and some friends. But in the end, it's not the people related to Blake who confirm his plastic-guitar prowess. It's the group of 20-somethings sitting at a nearby table, who applaud when Blake finishes playing along to "Through the Fire and Flames," viewed as the game's toughest song. "It's pretty sick," says Andrew Gambling, 27, who describes himself as a casual player. "He's talented." Blake is appreciative of the applause and grins shyly when it is mentioned to him. But he's not very happy with his score. "That's probably the worst I've ever done," he says, which seems impossible. The game moves at warp speed, so Blake's fingers do too. This is not a competitive environment, so the score hardly matters. But his attitude about it underscores some Peebles family truisms: Blake is so dedicated to gaming that his parents let him quit school so he can better concentrate on it. They pay for home tutors instead. Mom and Dad do this, even though there are very few people in this country who make their living playing competitive video games. Blake very much would like to be one of them, but a boy cannot live on chicken sandwiches alone... [--from http://www.newsobserver.com/2766/story/1155589.html ] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:14:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Gil Ray Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re:Jam for Beginners - --- Dave Walker wrote: >Slick broke her own record in > Summer 1987 at age > > 47 when "Nothing's Gonna Stop Us Now" topped the > U.S. charts. Her > > record stood for 12 years, but was ultimately > broken by Cher, who > > was 53 in 1999 when "Believe" hit number one. > > So, yeah on the "pop music is a young person's game" > thing. > > -d.w. I think there is is huge difference in Scott's "pop" and commercial "pop". His stuff is just too eclectic. It is indeed great, but for a limited (yet passionate) audience. Gil ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V7 #481 *******************************