From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V7 #23 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Tuesday, January 30 2007 Volume 07 : Number 023 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] Review of I AM ATOMIC MAN ["Larry Brantley" ] Re: [loud-fans] Cotton Mather? ["Steve Holtebeck" ] Re: [loud-fans] Review of I AM ATOMIC MAN [CertronC90@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Review of I AM ATOMIC MAN [2fs ] Re: [loud-fans] Shooting Birds At The Stars [CertronC90@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Shooting Birds At The Stars [2fs ] Re: [loud-fans] Shooting Birds At The Stars ["Stewart Mason" ] Re: [loud-fans] You have been warned. [Jon Tveite ] Re: [loud-fans] You have been warned. [CertronC90@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 08:13:06 -0500 From: "Larry Brantley" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Review of I AM ATOMIC MAN On 1/27/07, Gil Ray wrote: > > Serves Edie > Brickell right. (her label played a very funny trick > on GT in 1988 - they prevented us from a $ bonus > situation in Atlanta when we ended up being knocked > off the headlining spot when her label put her there... > > Gil > Hey, I remember that show. A Deadhead from the office saw me there and said, "I didn't know you liked Edie Brickell." I replied, "Oh, I'm here to see Game Theory." He gave me a look like I was speaking a different language. Larry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 09:59:12 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: [loud-fans] Cotton Mather? Am I hallucinating, or am I correct in remembering that some time ago, someone here mentioned something about a forthcoming Cotton Mather recording, or maybe just something the main guy from CM (whose name slips my mind) was working on? - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 09:19:57 -0800 From: "Steve Holtebeck" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Cotton Mather? On 1/29/07, 2fs wrote: > Am I hallucinating, or am I correct in remembering that some time ago, > someone here mentioned something about a forthcoming Cotton Mather > recording, or maybe just something the main guy from CM (whose name slips my > mind) was working on? Cotton Mather is no more. Robert Harrison has a new band called Future Clouds & Radar (http://www.futurecloudsandradar.com) who have a new disc forthcoming. There's one mp3 on the site above and some songs on myspace (http://www.myspace.com/futurecloudsandradartx) as well. - -Steve ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:27:33 EST From: CertronC90@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Review of I AM ATOMIC MAN In a message dated 1/27/2007 7:32:16 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, ggilray@yahoo.com writes: Yep, there's a new kid on the block! Serves Edie Brickell right. (her label played a very funny trick on GT in 1988 - they prevented us from a $ bonus situation in Atlanta when we ended up being knocked off the headlining spot when her label put her there, and even though our contract said a bonus was due if the show was a sell-out, turns out most of the tickets were radio give-aways. It was a long drive to Ft. Lauderdale that night...) It's almost like Game Theory was singled out by the music gods for discrimination and neglect. It's just not right. It's almost like a curse or something. I just don't quite understand why--did it need more T&A or spandex or something? I worked at Camelot Music back in '88 and they put that Edie Brickell record on sale for $5.88. They really were slick with the marketing for that one. - --Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:58:47 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Review of I AM ATOMIC MAN On 1/29/07, CertronC90@aol.com wrote: > > > It's almost like Game Theory was singled out by the music gods for > discrimination and neglect. It's just not right. It's almost like > a curse or > something. > Ah, but GT was as blessed by the gods compared to the accursedness of LF... I mean, at least GT's stuff got reviewed in major outlets, you could find it in stores, etc. - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:17:07 EST From: CertronC90@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Shooting Birds At The Stars In a message dated 1/29/2007 2:30:34 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jeffreyw2fs.j@gmail.com writes: Ah, but GT was as blessed by the gods compared to the accursedness of LF... I mean, at least GT's stuff got reviewed in major outlets, you could find it in stores, etc. I never had a problem finding Loud Family albums. I bought PLANTS AND BIRDS on the day of release in Greenville, South Carolina. No biggie. Same with all the other ones--release day, right there--no special ordering--they even carried the Game Theory reissues on CD, and were right there on release day also. I guess it doesn't matter now in hindsight, but I really feel like Game Theory got the royal screw. There's just no reason for them not to have a hit at least of the magnitude of The Church's "Under The Milky Way." It's not something I can put my finger on, but my intuition says something just isn't right there. An opportunity was taken away, someone purposely didn't play a record during a critical time period, etc. I can't prove it, but I simply believe it to be true. (we INFJs are really intuitive, but we're almost always right) - --Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 16:27:09 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Shooting Birds At The Stars On 1/29/07, CertronC90@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 1/29/2007 2:30:34 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > jeffreyw2fs.j@gmail.com writes: > > Ah, but GT was as blessed by the gods compared to the accursedness of > LF... > I mean, at least GT's stuff got reviewed in major outlets, you could find > it > in stores, etc. > > I guess it doesn't matter now in hindsight, but I really feel like Game > Theory got the royal screw. There's just no reason for them not to have a > hit at least of the magnitude of The Church's "Under The Milky Way." It's > not something I can put my finger on, but my intuition says something just > isn't right there. An opportunity was taken away, someone purposely didn't > play a record during a critical time period, etc. I can't prove it, but I > simply believe it to be true. > I dunno...I think it's simply that who's a success and who isn't has a large dollop of chance involved. I mean, we can point to the reasons GT (or LF, for that matter) should have done better, commercially...and probably, we can also point to reasons neither band was likely to get huge. (Scott's lyrics, voice, complex chord sequences...and that's just on the musical end, never mind the biz, etc.) I tend to believe that in fact GT did about as well as could have been expected at the time - a shame the band broke up when it did (although didn't Enigma implode shortly thereafter?), because it *might* have had better luck in the first flush of early '90s alternamania, before it all turned to xerox-grunge. LF, on the other hand, had almost nothing go its way: from timing, to label distribution issues (I'm thinking of the fact that TTOOL wasn't in stores when the band was touring the album, if I recall), to...well, we've all talked about a lot of this stuff here. I think the band could have been more popular - although, again, I'd've been very surprised if they'd become truly successful in a commercial sense. Could they have been, say, Archers of Loaf? Possibly (if AoL hadn't been on the same, resource-limited label)... Could they have been Nirvana? The Improbability Drive has just transported us directly into Angelina Jolie's bedroom. - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 16:50:19 -0600 From: Chris Prew Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Shooting Birds At The Stars Spot on -- Despite what we all like to think as we worship at its altar, early mid-80's US indie/alternative/college rock in general didn't really sell very well, relative to similar bands since and current, and in other countries. I remember reading an article that said that the Minutemen's "Double Nickels" LP, an era defining record by most critics standards, sold less than 10,000 copies in its initial release. Didn't Clap Hands Say Yeah sell over 100,000 without a label? That would never have happened in the 80's, at least not till Fugazi came along. Note I said "US" & "indie" above -- US bands, US sales, independent labels. Relatively speaking, GT was a pretty big band in those circles. I think their sales were at par with a lot of their contemporaries -- but that's speculation on my part. Chris > > I tend to believe that in fact GT did about as well as could have been > expected at the time - a shame the band broke up when it did (although > didn't Enigma implode shortly thereafter?), because it *might* have > had > better luck in the first flush of early '90s alternamania, before > it all > turned to xerox-grunge. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:06:35 -0500 From: "Stewart Mason" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Shooting Birds At The Stars - ----- Original Message ----- From: "2fs" > I dunno...I think it's simply that who's a success and who isn't has > a large > dollop of chance involved. I mean, we can point to the reasons GT > (or LF, > for that matter) should have done better, commercially...and > probably, we > can also point to reasons neither band was likely to get huge. > (Scott's > lyrics, voice, complex chord sequences...and that's just on the > musical end, > never mind the biz, etc.) The biz stuff alone was enough, though. The Church were signed to three different major labels (Capitol, WB and Arista) in the states before they finally had a chart hit off of, what, their fifth or sixth album, which had been recorded by proven hitmakers (Fleetwood Mac, Jackson Browne, etc.) in a deliberate attempt to score a chart hit and therefore had enough of a promo budget to make sure that money hadn't been wasted, and they also toured like hell behind its release. On the other hand, Game Theory weren't even signed to Enigma, but to Rational, which made them even further removed from the byzantine layout of that label -- where as far as I could ever figure out a handful of their higher-profile releases were distributed by Capitol/EMI and the rest (including Game Theory) were distributed by Restless through indie distributors like JEM -- all of which means that the entire GT promo budget for their entire career was probably less than the studio catering budget for the average major-label release. Plus the band had day jobs, which preclude going off and touring the country for a year at a time to break themselves at the grassroots. Bands at that level never had a chance to have a chart single. S ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:48:43 -0800 (PST) From: Gil Ray Subject: [loud-fans] more good Atomic Man news! It has been a good couple of days! My cd has been nominated for a Rondo Award at my fave horror/sci-fi message board (Classic Horror Film Board)! Sue put up a nicer link than I would be able to, so I'll link ya'll to the 125 Records news page. http://www.125records.com/news.html Pretty cool! Gil ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:50:54 -0600 From: Jon Tveite Subject: Re: [loud-fans] You have been warned. Quoting CertronC90@aol.com > That Phelps guy is unbelievable to me. He's worse than a Pharisee, > and Jesus called those guys a "brood of vipers." I personally think > with all his ranting, he's simply gay, and frustrated with himself > (like that military guy in AMERICAN BEAUTY). Yeah, that kind of hatred is clearly rooted in serious inner conflict. I've been to a gay pride event in Topeka: they are a polite, quiet bunch of folks. You don't wake up in the middle of Kansas believing that homosexuality is a terrible threat to civilization unless that fear is coming from deep inside you. I once met a man who was formerly with the Phelps organization. He finally left because he could no longer deny his own homosexuality and push the Phelps brand of hatred. When they were on protest excursions, he used to sneak out and cruise gay-porn stores -- and he often ran into other people from the Phelps crew. When I met him he was still very religious and screwed up, but he had at least come to decide that God accepts his orientation and is not a Phelps fan. Living in Kansas, I've seen Phelps people at a number of events. They will basically go anywhere, anytime, to piss people off (and stay as long as there are TV cameras around). They don't care if there is any connection to their "issue" or not. Now their big thing is picketing the funerals of soldiers who died in Iraq, to inform attendees that God is killing our soldiers to punish America for being too tolerant of homosexuality. It takes a special kind of crazy to come up with something like that. Jon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 23:38:54 EST From: CertronC90@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] You have been warned. In a message dated 1/29/2007 11:01:11 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jontv@ksu.edu writes: It takes a special kind of crazy to come up with something like that. Jon The kind of emotional damage this man does to the families of the dead people whose funerals he pickets is unfathomable. I can only imagine the psychic pain the mothers of the dead experience with his presence. Marilyn Manson is more of a Christian than he is. Thanks for posting that, - --Mark ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V7 #23 ******************************