From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V6 #117 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Thursday, June 22 2006 Volume 06 : Number 117 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] Re: first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" [2fs ] [loud-fans] Re: first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" ["Daniel V] Re: [loud-fans] first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" [Aaron Man] [loud-fans] "Mavis of Maybelline Towers" [Aaron Mandel ] RE: [loud-fans] "Mavis of Maybelline Towers" ["rslloyd" Subject: [loud-fans] Re: first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" On 6/20/06, 2fs wrote: > > > > Song About "Rocks Off" (Scott Miller) > Someone kindly pointed out that my ears need cleaning: in these lines - Maybe it's "goodbye" Maybe it's "Arrivederci Roma" The [?] in black who has your back hands you your diploma - - the third line is clearly "Maybe a man in black." The part I need the most help on is the verse about the dogs. Very very early this morning, I woke up and had a thought - "what if I got distracted by the apparent sequence of 'one' and 'two' dogs, and he's really singing 'horndog' in the first line...?" and worked up an alternate reading. I nearly got out of bed to confirm whether it was correct. I didn't - but this morning I listened again, and alas there's no way some of those consonants are present. Oh well - here's my hypothetical (and wrong) reading anyway - Horndog is gone to dogs - our perfect dog's forepaw is raw so pirouette not over this fond lake swan I wonder if I'd look older in new clothes? - - Not only is there no possible "g" in the last syllable of the first line, "forepaw" loses "faux pas" (which goes with the allusion to _Swan Lake_ and "pirouette" as a dance term - the last itself borrowed from the Stones' song of course). Too many homophones - the plastic-horned devils... - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 09:44:23 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: [loud-fans] "Total Mass Destruction" This is taken primarily from , Aaron Mandel's Scott lyrics page. There are only a few changes, primarily in the last lines. There's a raincoat left on a lifeboat after the flood moved past There's a Jaguar crashed by a filmstar storming right off a cast There's a pawnshop cranking the bebop Quoting the choicest deal in years And the phono wails but we don't know if anyone hears There's a girl's eyes up in a high-rise trying to tell her man There's a mojo down in the dojo trying to tell Japan There's a sweettooth mark in a phone booth We'd love to find a better plan And we're gonna try but we don't know if anyone can (chorus:) 'Cause no one wants to buy until we cut off all production No one wants to try until they can't escape the suction No one blinks an eye until the total mass destruction comes There's a groundswell come out of Brownsville thinks it's the word on high There's a strip mall southeast of St. Paul thinks it's Palais Versaille There are rock bands all doing handstands Think they're the thrill to end all thrills And the fanzines rave but I can't see it paying no bills (chorus) - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 08:40:03 -0700 From: "Daniel Vallor" Subject: [loud-fans] Re: first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" > I'm thinking only Scott Miller would find the pathos in a song like "Rocks > Off" and use it to explore philosophical ideas about engagement in the > world, aging, the gap between appearance and reality, etc. But then Jagger's > a better lyricist than most people credit him for - really, "Rocks Off" is a > lot more than just another obnoxious song about fucking*: there is pathos in > the notion that the narrator can only get off when he's asleep and dreaming > (as opposed to being wide awake with an actual other person in bed with > him). I read a Vanity Fair article a few years back which was Lisa Robinson's notes on being the publicist for the Stones on an early 70's US tour. She mentions that she had to agree to wait 30 years before publishing anything on the tour and once the 30 years were up she just dug out her notes and diaries. Anyhow, she makes a remark about how she Jagger seems to keep everything together and comments on his lyrics to 6th Stone Ian Stewart. Stewart kind of balks and tells her something along the lines of it's Keith who writes the songs and Mick who makes the image. Since Keith was pretty notoriously addicted to heroin at the time of Exile, it seems to me this lyric (Rock's Off) may be a assessment of the sexual dysfunction of a drug addict. - - D ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 15:02:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" On Tue, 20 Jun 2006, 2fs wrote: > Don't watch my mouth move > that was my devil's mask pretending > that I was driving age > and women rage > as the fling was ending I don't have an alternate reading for this, but doesn't seem quite grammatically coherent to me. > One dog is [fog? fawn?] "flawed", I think. > two dogs are perfect dogs > faux pas is raw/wrong[?] I was thinking Two dogs are perfect Dog's faux pas is [?] as a pun on 'paw'. Hard to know without getting that last word. a ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 15:12:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: [loud-fans] "Mavis of Maybelline Towers" Twice through. Are my ears that bad, or is Scott murmuring more than usual in this song? ... ?cliche? All .. says is we've got it made .. Emily The hard truth turns out to be just what we need There was trouble that I kept from being yours But if two of us .. At least one should enjoy the ride Mavis of Maybelline Towers over the skies Mavis of make-believe hours, slow lullabyes Showed us that almost-unnoticed .. through new eyes Maybe I came To guess what you feel and preach more of the same Next all .. Down from the pulpit and out of control There's .. flying into .. They're searching us for fruit that would displace the native life [chorus] You ask me when it disappeared, but I don't understand It's holding steady It's holding steady You say you think it might get weird, but I don't understand It's weird already It's weird already It's weird already It's weird already [chorus] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 14:22:15 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" On 6/21/06, Aaron Mandel wrote: > > On Tue, 20 Jun 2006, 2fs wrote: > > > Don't watch my mouth move > > that was my devil's mask pretending > > that I was driving age > > and women rage > > as the fling was ending > > I don't have an alternate reading for this, but doesn't seem quite > grammatically coherent to me. Really? I get the first line as one phrase, with the rest an elaboration: "that [his mouth moving] was my devil's mask pretending that I was driving age [I think this is a pun of sorts: not only "age 16" but "being in control of aging, rather than aging controlling him"?] and [also pretending that] women rage[d?] as the fling was ending." Meaning something like "I imagined I could do this forever (as if I was an energetic teenager), and that I was such a great lover the women couldn't bear it when I left them." > One dog is [fog? fawn?] > > "flawed", I think. Makes sense, esp. w/"perfect" by contrast in the next line. I'll give it a listen later. > two dogs are perfect dogs > > faux pas is raw/wrong[?] > > I was thinking > > Two dogs are perfect > Dog's faux pas is [?] > > as a pun on 'paw'. Or even (as in my brain-fever misreading) "forepaw"... Hard to know without getting that last word. Yeah..."wrong" makes some sort of sense - but seems redundant (as opposed to, what, "the *right* faux pas"? which would be a more interesting line) and therefore more empty than Scott's lyrics usually are. He rarely fills out a line with vacant syllables - he'll almost always add or modify or clarify in some way. "Raw" might work there, I suppose - Two dogs are perfect - dog's faux pas is raw - - presenting the line break consistently with earlier phrases and leaving the enjambment. All of that kind of hangs together...but it seems a bit stretched. That, though, is where weakness shows in Scott's lyrics when they're weak - that sense of much effort expended to align all the streams of meaning in a highly compressed manner. I suspect that if those words seem to be what he's singing, they're probably correct. (Incidentally, I asked Sue and Joe whether lyrics were eventually going to appear for this CD at the LF site - no word yet, understandable since fulfilling the initial batch of orders is loads of work I'm sure!) - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 16:42:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" On Wed, 21 Jun 2006, 2fs wrote: >>> Don't watch my mouth move >>> that was my devil's mask pretending >>> that I was driving age >>> and women rage >>> as the fling was ending >> >> I don't have an alternate reading for this, but doesn't seem quite >> grammatically coherent to me. > > "that [his mouth moving] was my devil's mask pretending that I was driving > age [I think this is a pun of sorts: not only "age 16" but "being in control > of aging, rather than aging controlling him"?] and [also pretending that] > women rage[d?] as the fling was ending." If there's a 'd' on the end of 'rage' it seems a little better to me, but there's still something odd about it. The narrator wouldn't be pretending that the fling-ending was happening while he was talking. It has to be even farther back in the past: "and women had raged". > (Incidentally, I asked Sue and Joe whether lyrics were eventually going > to appear for this CD at the LF site - no word yet, understandable since > fulfilling the initial batch of orders is loads of work I'm sure!) Well, and the CD's not even officially out yet, is it? So yeah, maybe chilling out would be the right choice. a ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 15:56:41 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" On 6/21/06, Aaron Mandel wrote: > > On Wed, 21 Jun 2006, 2fs wrote: > > >>> Don't watch my mouth move > >>> that was my devil's mask pretending > >>> that I was driving age > >>> and women rage > >>> as the fling was ending > >> > >> I don't have an alternate reading for this, but doesn't seem quite > >> grammatically coherent to me. > > > > "that [his mouth moving] was my devil's mask pretending that I was > driving > > age [I think this is a pun of sorts: not only "age 16" but "being in > control > > of aging, rather than aging controlling him"?] and [also pretending > that] > > women rage[d?] as the fling was ending." > > If there's a 'd' on the end of 'rage' it seems a little better to me, but > there's still something odd about it. The narrator wouldn't be pretending > that the fling-ending was happening while he was talking. It has to be > even farther back in the past: "and women had raged". And "had been driving age." Good luck making that scan! ("That I'd been driving age/and women'd raged/as the fling was ending"?) I think you're right, technically - but perhaps this is one of Scott's less grammatically-conscientious narrators (see: "paying no bills" in "Total Mass Destruction")... What he's singing is pretty clear - I think he just fudged the verb tense on this one a bit. (Incidentally, I asked Sue and Joe whether lyrics were eventually going > > to appear for this CD at the LF site - no word yet, understandable since > > fulfilling the initial batch of orders is loads of work I'm sure!) > > Well, and the CD's not even officially out yet, is it? So yeah, maybe > chilling out would be the right choice. Well yeah - but it's kinda fun to puzzle this stuff out anyway. - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 21:03:25 -0400 From: "Paul King" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] first pass at lyrics: "Song About 'Rocks Off'" On 20 Jun 2006 at 23:08, 2fs spaketh these wourdes: Song about "Rocks Off" -- comments/suggestions > I don't like mind games > Ah, but it was good when mine were working > My demolicious[?] life ^^^^^^^^^^^^ that's the way I hear it also > when all the time > saner thoughts were lurking > Don't watch my mouth move > that was my devil's mask pretending > that I was driving age > and women rage > as the fling was ending > > One dog is [fog? fawn?] ^^^^^^^^^^^ *flawed* (it fits with the next line) > two dogs are perfect dogs > faux pas is raw/wrong[?] ^^^^^^^^^ sounds like *raw* (but makes almost no sense) > so pirouette not over this fond lake swan > I wonder if I'd look older > in new clothes? > > Maybe it's "back off" > Maybe it's "come a little closer" > Of course the mademoiselle > hides it well > Ask someone who knows her > > Twelve-year bender > I stayed respectable > Hey, big spender > They showed me pictures > All I remember > from before being too old was being too young > > Maybe it's "goodbye" > Maybe it's "Arrivederci Roma" > The [?] in black ^^^^^^^ *Maybe a man* > who has your back > hands you your diploma > > Please go > Your handshake is all the holding I know > And all I need today > > ----------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 20:50:50 -0400 From: "Paul King" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] "Mavis of Maybelline Towers" Here is a revision #2 - after *several* listens, and replaying several snippets over and over. I still don't get the last part of the second chorus: There's .. flying into .. The rest of Aaron's ellipses I was able to get by altering the equalisation to Scott's voice and cranking up the volume on Winamp. It is as if he is deliberately trying to obfuscate that line, since in the next line he suddenly is able to spit the marbles out of his mouth. Words are, relatively speaking, clear as a bell. I cannot say it was an attempt to backmask - - - a playback in Adobe Audition in reverse mode disproved that. The closest I can get is Their truck is flying into our lane but it doesn't connect with the next line, and also, trucks don't fly :-) So, here is what I was able to fill in for most of Aaron's ellipses: Mavis of Maybelline Towers (Miller) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ There in the shade All this our Sun says is "We've got it made" There, Emily The hard truth turns out to be just what we need There's trouble that I kept from being yours But if two of us are bored At least one should enjoy the ride [CHORUS] Mavis of Maybelline Towers over the skies Mavis of make-believe hours, slow lullabyes Showed us that almost-unnoticed Down through new eyes Maybe I came To guess what you feel and preach more of the same Next on a roll Down from the pulpit and out of control They're .. flying into our .. They're searching us for fruit that would displace the native life [chorus] You ask me when it disappeared, but I don't understand It's holding steady It's holding steady You say you think it might get weird, but I don't understand It's weird already It's weird already It's weird already It's weird already [chorus] On 21 Jun 2006 at 15:12, Aaron Mandel spaketh these wourdes: > Twice through. Are my ears that bad, or is Scott murmuring more than usual > in this song? > > ... ?cliche? > All .. says is we've got it made > .. Emily > The hard truth turns out to be just what we need > > There was trouble that I kept from being yours > But if two of us .. > At least one should enjoy the ride > > Mavis of Maybelline Towers over the skies > Mavis of make-believe hours, slow lullabyes > Showed us that almost-unnoticed > .. through new eyes > > Maybe I came > To guess what you feel and preach more of the same > Next all .. > Down from the pulpit and out of control > > There's .. flying into .. > They're searching us for fruit that would displace the native life > > [chorus] > > You ask me when it disappeared, but I don't understand > It's holding steady > It's holding steady > You say you think it might get weird, but I don't understand > It's weird already > It's weird already > It's weird already > It's weird already > > [chorus] > > > __________ NOD32 1.1613 (20060621) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 23:02:22 -0400 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] "Mavis of Maybelline Towers" Paul King wrote: > and also, trucks don't fly :-) > > Oh, come on. Surely you've heard, or even said, that a speeding terrestrial vehicle was "flying" down the road. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 22:27:34 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: [loud-fans] "Song About 'Rocks Off'" revised version Thanks to all for additional input. Still not sure about that dogs bit... Song About "Rocks Off" (Scott Miller) ("dust beneath the eagle's wings") "Please stay" passes easily for nothing to say when there's someplace to go. Okay - those are my friends waving wildly - don't mind them; I told them so. I don't like mind games, ah, but it was good when mine were working - my demolicious life when all the time saner thoughts were lurking Don't watch my mouth move - that was my devil's mask pretending that I was driving age and women rage as the fling was ending. One dog is flawed, two dogs are perfect - dog's faux pas* is raw, so pirouette not over this fond lake swan. I wonder if I'd look older in new clothes? Maybe it's "back off," Maybe it's "come a little closer." Of course the mademoiselle hides it well - Ask someone who knows her. Twelve-year bender I stayed respectable. Hey, big spender They showed me pictures. All I remember from before being too old was being too young. Maybe it's "goodbye," Maybe it's "Arrivederci Roma." Maybe a man in black who has your back hands you your diploma. Please go - Your handshake is all the holding I know and all I need today. * I think we can read this as a pun on "paw" at least and probably "forepaw" - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 22:09:23 -0700 From: "Steve Holtebeck" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] "Mavis of Maybelline Towers" On Wed, 21 Jun 2006 17:50:50 -0700, Paul King wrote: > Here is a revision #2 - after *several* listens, and replaying several > snippets > over and over. > > I still don't get the last part of the second chorus: > There's .. flying into .. Then shucking flying into Hanalei (maybe not official, but that's what I hear!).. - -Steve ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 22:14:45 -0700 (PDT) From: "Joseph M. Mallon" Subject: [loud-fans] Words 'n' such Just guesses - nothing official. On Wed, 21 Jun 2006, Paul King wrote: > Mavis of Maybelline Towers (Miller) > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > There in the shade > All this our Sun says is "We've got it made" > There, Emily Here, Emily > The hard truth turns out to be just what we need > > There's trouble that I kept from being yours > But if two of us are bored With two on board > At least one should enjoy the ride > > [CHORUS] > Mavis of Maybelline Towers over the skies > Mavis of make-believe hours, slow lullabyes > Showed us that almost-unnoticed > Down through new eyes Known through new eyes > Maybe I came > To guess what you feel and preach more of the same > Next on a roll > Down from the pulpit and out of control > > They're .. flying into our .. They're checking, flying into Hana Lai (Hawaiian location of some sort) > They're searching us for fruit that would displace the native life > > [chorus] > > You ask me when it disappeared, but I don't understand > It's holding steady > It's holding steady > You say you think it might get weird, but I don't understand > It's weird already > It's weird already > It's weird already > It's weird already > > [chorus] Song About "Rocks Off" ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Please stay Passes easily for nothing to say When there's some place to go Okay Those are my friends Waving wildly Don't mind them I told them so I don't like mind games Ah, but it was good when mine were working My demolitious line Worked all the time Saying thoughts were lurking Don't watch my mouth move That was my devil's mask pretending That I was driving age And well in range (aka camera range) As the frame was ending One dog is flawed Two dogs are perfect dogs Faux pas is raw So pirouette not over This frog-legged swan I wonder if I'd look older in new clothes Maybe it's "Back off" Maybe it's "Come a little closer" 'Cause the mademoiselle hides it well Ask someone who knows her Twelve-year bender I spent respectable Hey, big spender They showed me pictures All I remember from Pitfall Being too young was being too old Maybe it's "Goodbye" Maybe it's "Arrevederci, Roma" Maybe a man in black Has your back And hands you your diploma Please go Your handshake is all the holding I know And all I need today Joe Mallon jmmallon@joescafe.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 22:48:27 -0700 From: "rslloyd" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] "Mavis of Maybelline Towers" This seems really close to me. Below are a couple of possible alternatives [in brackets]. I can't make sense of the beginning of the "flying into" line (I imagine I hear things like "Ben Schuchat" or "then chuck it"), but I always hear "Hanalei" at the end, maybe because I've been to such a place (northeastern part of Kauai) and it makes some sense with the following line. Bob > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-loud-fans@smoe.org [mailto:owner-loud-fans@smoe.org] On Behalf > Of Paul King > Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2006 5:51 PM > To: loud-fans@smoe.org > Subject: Re: [loud-fans] "Mavis of Maybelline Towers" > > Here is a revision #2 - after *several* listens, and replaying several > snippets > over and over. > > I still don't get the last part of the second chorus: > There's .. flying into .. > > The rest of Aaron's ellipses I was able to get by altering the > equalisation to > Scott's voice and cranking up the volume on Winamp. > > It is as if he is deliberately trying to obfuscate that line, since in the > next > line he suddenly is able to spit the marbles out of his mouth. Words are, > relatively speaking, clear as a bell. I cannot say it was an attempt to > backmask - > - a playback in Adobe Audition in reverse mode disproved that. > > The closest I can get is > Their truck is flying into our lane > > but it doesn't connect with the next line, and also, trucks don't fly :-) > > So, here is what I was able to fill in for most of Aaron's ellipses: > > Mavis of Maybelline Towers (Miller) > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > There [Here] in the shade > All this our [hot] Sun says is "We've got it made" > There, [Here] Emily > The hard truth turns out to be just what we need > > There's trouble that I [I've] kept from being yours > But if two of us are bored [With two of us on board] > At least one should enjoy the ride > > [CHORUS] > Mavis of Maybelline Towers [towers] over the skies > Mavis of make-believe hours, slow lullabyes > Showed us that almost-unnoticed > Down [Known] through new eyes > > Maybe I came > To guess what you feel and preach more of the same > Next on a roll > Down from the pulpit and out of control > > They're .. flying into our [Hanalei] .. > They're searching us for fruit that would displace the native life > > [chorus] > > You ask me when it disappeared, but I don't understand > It's holding steady > It's holding steady > You say you think it might get weird, but I don't understand > It's weird already > It's weird already > It's weird already > It's weird already > > [chorus] > > > On 21 Jun 2006 at 15:12, Aaron Mandel spaketh these wourdes: > > > Twice through. Are my ears that bad, or is Scott murmuring more than > usual > > in this song? > > > > ... ?cliche? > > All .. says is we've got it made > > .. Emily > > The hard truth turns out to be just what we need > > > > There was trouble that I kept from being yours > > But if two of us .. > > At least one should enjoy the ride > > > > Mavis of Maybelline Towers over the skies > > Mavis of make-believe hours, slow lullabyes > > Showed us that almost-unnoticed > > .. through new eyes > > > > Maybe I came > > To guess what you feel and preach more of the same > > Next all .. > > Down from the pulpit and out of control > > > > There's .. flying into .. > > They're searching us for fruit that would displace the native life > > > > [chorus] > > > > You ask me when it disappeared, but I don't understand > > It's holding steady > > It's holding steady > > You say you think it might get weird, but I don't understand > > It's weird already > > It's weird already > > It's weird already > > It's weird already > > > > [chorus] > > > > > > __________ NOD32 1.1613 (20060621) Information __________ > > > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > > http://www.eset.com ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V6 #117 *******************************