From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V6 #37 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Saturday, February 11 2006 Volume 06 : Number 037 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] Sallitt On Film [zoom@muppetlabs.com] Re: [loud-fans] Sallitt On Film [JRT456@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos [2fs ] Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos [Dennis ] Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos [zoom@muppetlabs.com] Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos [2fs ] [loud-fans] Re: David Lynch's Birthday Swap [2fs ] Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos [2fs ] Re: [loud-fans] Re: David Lynch's Birthday Swap [2fs Sorry to leave you hanging, Andy, especially after your nice plug for > ALL THE SHIPS AT SEA. Most of my email time these days is from an email > account that loud-fans doesn't know about, so my posts bounce. I guess > I should attend to that problem. I wish to announce to the general public that Dan Sallitt, after God knows how many years of trying, finally, recently(?) got his props from IMDb. Sort of. They list one of his two movies. Maybe someday they'll get around to the longer one. > I didn't see any of your top ten except for NOBODY KNOWS and THE HOLY > GIRL. "Well, get on it then!" Okay, get on 3-IRON, TRAVELERS AND MAGICIANS, and BROTHERS. And BUFFALO BOY, when it comes out in March on DVD. And YASMIN, if you've got an all-code DVD player, and I'm sure you do. Your take on NOBODY KNOWS? LETTER FROM AN UNKNOWN WOMAN, EARTH AND ASHES, and BOATS OUT OF WATERMELON RINDS, have, alas, no DVD release or North American distributor, that I can discover. Three beautifully-photographed opuses, and folks can't even watch, legitimately, on their TVs at home. The first two ultimately wrench through accumulations of emotion. BOATS doesn't hurt quite so much, featuring a band of boys trying to build a working movie theater, only to stumble but not quite fall over, among other things, the need for a working projector. A tip of the heart to the film lover, optimistic and energetic in all the places GOODBYE DRAGON INN, another cineaste tribute, waxed melancholy and eerie. Managed to misspell two of my Top Ten...shame...shame... >Martel is certainly interesting, but somehow I always feel as if > I need to take a shower after seeing her movies.... Well, the two girls do end up in the pool together. And no, considering HOLY GIRL's muted, enigmatic use of structure, I don't consider that a spoiler. But seriously, is this take a shower in a TOOLBOX MURDERS grindhouse marathon sense, or something else? I've never seen anything else by her. > If you count movies that had world premieres in 2005, my list would be: > > 1. THE FORESAKEN LAND (Vimukthi Jayasundara, Sri Lanka/France) > 2. THE DEATH OF MR. LAZARESCU (Cristi Puiu, Romania) > 3. FORTY SHADES OF BLUE (Ira Sachs, USA) > 4. THE CHILD (Dardennes Bros., Belgium/France) > 5. A TALE OF CINEMA (Hong Sang-Soo, South Korea) > 6. THE WAYWARD CLOUD (Tsai Ming-Liang, Taiwan) > 7. C.R.A.Z.Y. (Jean-Marc Vallee, Canada) > 8. SA-KWA (Yi-kwan Kang, South Korea) > 9. BACKSTAGE (Emmanuelle Bercot, France) > 10. YOU BET YOUR LIFE (Antonin Svoboda, Austria) My God, the view from Manhattan (well, I'm assuming you live in Manhattan; hard to get to these on the Staten Island ferry). I'd heard of exactly one, THE WAYWARD CLOUD. Naturally, I'll see anything by Tsai Ming-Liang, though so far CLOUD's only on Asian DVD. So, the endless BROWN BUNNY comparisons: apt, lazy, or otherwise? Care to give capsule descriptions on the above? > 7. PALINDROMES (Todd Solondz, USA) Any perspective on Solondz you can give me so I'll like his movies better? I've tried, but I can't think of him in any function other than freak show ringmaster, which makes him Herzog without the gusto and the dry wit, or Tod Browning without the dark imagination, or Harmony Korine without the powerful, because simple, vision that freaks see themselves as normal people. > 8. JUNEBUG (Phil Morrison) > 9. FUNNY HA HA (Andrew Bujalski) > 10. ME AND YOU AND EVERYONE WE KNOW (Miranda July) Again, any perspectives you can give, I'd appreciate. I saw the first as a bloodless, predictable excursion around an intriguing premise (except for the impromptu gospel song, which opens a shaft of light on the husband's past in precisely a way the rest doesn't); the second as a competent but plodding slice-of-life; and the third as a bracing, insistent cojoining of quirky with cutesy then both with gross (except for the part where the little kid "talks" to his new friend over the computer using mostly cut'n'paste--he's a little too close to how ELIZA works, and for a moment I'm wondering if we all need to take the Turing Test). Bujalski has a new film, MUTUAL APPRECIATION, which he's selling, cheerfully sans frills, here: http://www.mutualappreciation.com/ Of course, I could just be a plodder. I love the story where Ray Carney, John Cassavetes' Boswell, screwed up his courage and admitted to the filmmaker that it took him three tries to sit through FACES all the way through. It just set him uneasily jangling the first two times. Cassavetes laughed and said, he'd had the exact same reaction years earlier. To Monty Clift's performance in A PLACE IN THE SUN. So I've got ONIBABA, NOTORIOUS, and disc two of "Fafner" to go before I get to SHOAH, Andy Having now seen Terrence Malicks The New World for a third time (in three different movie theatres, in as many weeks) I still dont feel adequately prepared to talk about it, or about the obsession this movie has become for me, or about the pleasantly intense sensation of sacredness that swims through me on beholding or contemplating. I suppose thats another way of saying that it moves me to tears. Matt Zoller Seitz, as those of you in the blogoshere already know, has hailed the movie as a generation defining event. I dont know if thats exactly true; for myself, The New World separates the wheat from chaff. The critics who are either impervious to or openly contemptuous of the movie strike me as being a good deal worse than mere idiots  they are monsters who are indifferent to art, to poetry, to life, to the air we breathe, to the trees in the forests, to the pleasure of all that, and perhaps even to sunlight. They are victims of television. They cannot read books, and whats more, this film, with its elliptical editing that expects us to think and to fill-in for ourselves, shows that a majority of reviewers can no longer muster the competence even to read a movie, if a film doesnt spell itself out on a press kit platter. - --N.P. Thompson, from http://moviesintofilm.com/malick.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 08:30:29 EST From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Sallitt On Film In a message dated 2/10/06 4:14:18 AM, zoom@muppetlabs.com writes: > But seriously, is this take a shower in a TOOLBOX MURDERS grindhouse > marathon sense, or something else? I've never seen anything else by her. > Forget Marciee Drake's clothed shower in THE TOOLBOX MURDERS. What really matters is the bathing scene set to the best Lee Hazlewood knock-off ever. Terrence Malick doesn't manage anything to equal its beauty in THE NEW WORLD, either. If he'd tried, the camera still would've kept cutting over to show us more birds in flight. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 09:06:58 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos On 2/10/06, zoom@muppetlabs.com wrote: > >"We can daa-aance! We can daa-aaance!! We can dance dance! Dance! > >DANCE! DANCE!! DANCE!!! DAA-AAAANNNCE!!!! OOH-WHOA-OO-WHOA-OHHHH!!!" > > Is this the part where I bring up the goddamn hit single around that same > time with dangerously near the same hook, about which nobody hauls the > Hooters' trash; and then the much-revered-on-this list singer/songwriter > who penned and sang, and I quote, "You do/you do/you do/you really do"? > > Why yes. It would seem so. I'm among the nobody not hauling the Hooters' trash simply because I don't remember the song in question. ("The Hooters"? I shall have to go off on a rant about dumbass bandnames...and I'm aware the band is not named after the same thing the restaurant chain is.) I'm not sure which song you're referring to with the "you do" bit...but it seems as if you think I'm condemning the repetition in "Mammoth Gardens." Let's back up a bit: Stewart said that the demo version of the song worked better for him because the more-live feel helped it, even though generally he preferred her work as backing singer to her lead vocals; someone else said they didn't mind Thayer's singing all that much and that they thought she was trying to do a Belinda Carlisle; I disagreed that she sounded like Carlisle and attempted to graphically replicate the strident (someone else's word, which I agreed with) character of Thayer's vocal approach on "Mammoth Gardens." It's the sound of it that I don't like. Lest we imagine I think it's open season on Donnette Thayer, I think she was a fine musician, excellent backing singer, and pretty good songwriter. I've read interviews with her and looked over her website, and it's also clear she's a very brilliant and fascinating person. But I don't like the way she sings "Mammoth Gardens." (Actually I like her singing on the Hex project - at least the one album I have - far better.) Which sister acts? (Uh, not "Sister Act" w/Whoopi Goldberg...) - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 11:08:31 -0700 From: Dennis Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos I am always amazed at how fully formed any of the game theory or loud family demos are. Is that pretty common, or is it unusual? When I was talking to Anton about his experience with the new CD, I asked him if working closely with Scott gave him insight into how Scott's mind works, etc. Short answer: no. Dennis ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 13:22:32 -0800 (PST) From: zoom@muppetlabs.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos > I'm among the nobody not hauling the Hooters' trash simply because I > don't remember the song in question. ("The Hooters"? I shall have to > go off on a rant about dumbass bandnames...and I'm aware the band is > not named after the same thing the restaurant chain is.) The restaurant chain's named after the sound an owl makes. Isn't it? I am slightly more surprised that Jeffrey doesn't recall one of the more ubiquitous hits of the mid-80's than I was to find him in the dark on "All Your Base Are Belong To Us." To wit: And We Danced The Hooters (R. Hyman / E. Bazilian) She was a bebop baby on a hard day's night She was hanging on Johnny, he was holding on tight Well I could feel her coming from a mile away There was no use talking, there was nothing to say When the band began to play and play And we danced Like a wave on the ocean, romanced We were liars in love and we danced Swept away for a moment by chance And we danced and danced and danced I'm with my bebop baby at the union hall She could dance all night and shake the paint off the walls When I saw her smile across the crowded room Well I knew we'd have to leave the party soon As the band began to play out of tune And we danced... The endless beat She's walking my way Hear the music fade when she says Are we getting too close? Do we dare to get closer? The room is spinning and she whispers my name And we danced and danced danced *and danced and danced and danced and danced and danced and danced*... And we danced and danced danced *and danced and danced and danced and danced and danced and danced*... However, you affirm and clarify that it isn't the repetition that bothers you, it's the tone, so I acknowledge that. I sometimes prefer Red Rockers' "Blood From A Stone" to the original. Funny, though, how the Hooters coyly left the final verses, with odd naughty word, off the inner-sleeve lyric sheet. I'm impressed, I must say, at Hyman and Bazilian two decades plus of hitmaking for themselves and several other, sometimes even bigger, names, without anyone becoming notably offended by their (mostly non-strident, but certainly non-hidden) Christianity. Mammoth Gardens (I'm assuming it's the one Donnette wrote about) came back alive awhile back, under a new name and newer management: http://www.gdtstoo.com/GDTSTOODenverFillmorehisto.html > Lest we imagine I think it's open season on Donnette Thayer, I think > she was a fine musician, excellent backing singer, and pretty good > songwriter. I've read interviews with her and looked over her website, > and it's also clear she's a very brilliant and fascinating person. I found it hard to stomach how she walked out on Scott for a fellow who just *happened* to have a lot more money, a higher profile, a fatter contract, major league writeups, and, probably, far more comfortable road accomodations. But that was a long time ago, and all directly involved parties seemed to have moved on. I imagine I should do the same. > Which sister acts? (Uh, not "Sister Act" w/Whoopi Goldberg...) Meg. http://imdb.com/name/nm0857217/ We still don't know about Abbott Henderson Thayer, though, eh? You wanna talk about dumbass band names, you better start with those Beatles, Andy "Crater Lake" By Louise Gl|ck There was a war between good and evil. We decided to call the body good. That made death evil. It turned the soul against death completely. Like a foot soldier wanting to serve a great warrior, the soul wanted to side with the body. It turned against the dark, against the forms of death it recognized. Where does the voice come from that says suppose the war is evil, that says suppose the body did this to us, made us afraid of love - --from http://www.slate.com/id/2120967/?nav=fo ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 15:59:08 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos On 2/10/06, zoom@muppetlabs.com wrote: > > I'm among the nobody not hauling the Hooters' trash simply because I > > don't remember the song in question. ("The Hooters"? I shall have to > > go off on a rant about dumbass bandnames...and I'm aware the band is > > not named after the same thing the restaurant chain is.) > > The restaurant chain's named after the sound an owl makes. Isn't it? I'm sure it is. > I am slightly more surprised that Jeffrey doesn't recall one of the more > ubiquitous hits of the mid-80's than I was to find him in the dark on "All > Your Base Are Belong To Us." Well, that one more or less came from the world of videogames or whatever, no? Which I've never had anything to do with, going back to its grandparent's popularity in my youth, the thing Pete Townshend had his deaf dumb and blind boy working with amazing facility. I didn't own a TV for a number of years in the '80s (unless you count a 5" job attached to an old box we used primarily as a radio, whose TV screen had three ghosts, about 1/2" apart on that 5" screen: you couldn't watch TV but you could see fascinating art experiments evolve accidentally), and I didn't listen to commercial radio either. Plus, I lived in Madison with no car: my social world was entirely amongst neo-Bohemian post-hippie types during those days, and I mostly lived between libraries and B-Side Records on State Street. I remember reading about the Hooters (and thinking "dumbass name"), and I'm sure I heard the song - but truly, even rereading the lyrics, the song doesn't come back to me. > > Lest we imagine I think it's open season on Donnette Thayer, I think > > she was a fine musician, excellent backing singer, and pretty good > > songwriter. I've read interviews with her and looked over her website, > > and it's also clear she's a very brilliant and fascinating person. > > Which sister acts? (Uh, not "Sister Act" w/Whoopi Goldberg...) > > Meg. > > http://imdb.com/name/nm0857217/ Have never heard of - less surprsing, though, I suppose. > You wanna talk about dumbass band names, you better start with those Beatles, Yep...although they get a minor dispensation for being pre- the era of names that weren't either dully functional or every bit as goofy (Marsh & the Mellows, Red Nichols & his Five Pennies, Osiris and his Missing Organ). - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 17:32:55 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: [loud-fans] Re: David Lynch's Birthday Swap On 2/1/06, 2fs wrote: > George Mastalir kindly sent me a (second) CD for the latest go-round > of our swap (he'd earlier sent me a copy of his Xmas mix), which he > titled after the rather random title I'd given the swap itself (based > on its notice having been sent out on 1/20 - Lynch's birthday, > according to some online source or other). > > I'm going to say a few words about it as it plays for the first time, > without benefit of Google or clergy: > Alright, I'm going to take a break: rest of the tracks later. It is, indeed, later. Unfortunately, the disc's later tracks increasingly developed audible flaws, rendering the last ones unplayable. George heroically stepped in and sent me another copy, which I am about to listen to and continue the review. 13. Slapp Happy "Blue Flower": A version of this was a minor hit in a remake by Mazzy Star in the late '80s or early '90s, no? Anyway, this is more or less the original. I like the slapback-echoed high-register piano rhythm part. It has that sort of busy but low-in-the-mix drum part I associate with the early '70s for whatever reason, and the bass player gets busy during the chorus leadout as well. Somehow I never noticed before that the guitar riff isn't a million miles away from "Pale Blue Eyes"... 14. The Trypes "A Plan Revised": Somehow this is reminding me of what might have happened had R.E.M. and the Blackgirls been thrown together in a timewarp and recorded as The Association in the mid-sixties. That's actually a pretty good thing. But why does it fade so quickly, in mid-verse? 15. The Hold Steady "You Gotta Dance (With Who You Came With)": Between the beat (rather "Boys Are Back in Town") and Craig Finn's gritty speak-singing, I'm thinking of Thin Lizzy of all people. That and Jim Carroll if he'd taken sandpaper to his throat. 16. The Low and Sweet Orchestra "Miss Her Anyway": Another of those rural/semi-country big-band approaches kinda like Lambchop awhile back. The composition's a little more straightforward and the song's pretty uptempo, even though melancholy. Interesting stuff. 17. Robert Pollard "U.S. Mustard Company": I know, you're thinking, man, what a typically Pollard-esque title. In fact it's a Springsteen-like track about his father, who actually did work for the U.S. Mustard Company, until Reagan broke the union, the company got bought out by Archer Daniels Midland, and Pollard's laidoff dad, in an alcoholic haze, became paralyzed driving his Ford pickup truck over an embankment. Okay, that isn't true. Back to reality: I like this album a lot. It doesn't seem to full of songs that were written between shitting and wiping, like too many of his solo albums. Nice keyboard background on this one, which actually does feature a sorta R.E.M.-ish arpeggiated guitar part. 18. Tim Fite "No Good Here": Nice segue: similar guitar sound, although strummed; compatible keyboard lick; same key, but uptempo. There's a weird moment between the first two verses where there's dead silence, then a crunch geetar comes in for like two bars, dead silence, back to the verse instrumentation. Captain Crunch returns as a lead-in to the bridge later, the bridge on which Fite suddenly turns into sort of a southern rapper. 19. Colin Meloy "Charlie": One of those old-tyme folksong type things, in this case including banjo. One of those nonsense lyric "choruses" that threaten to turn into Dick Van Dyke in _The Sound of Music_. I really should know who's doing the female vocals...but I just can't place her voice. I know when someone tells me, I'll go, oh crap how could I not have recognized her voice? 20. Girls Aloud "Love Machine": Great beat here - subtle handclaps back in the mix too, I think. Unfortunately the chorus doesn't quite live up to it - it borrows the melody from the verse of Jackie DeShannon's "Put a Little Love in Your Heart," and I keep wanting to hear that song instead. Not because it's better, just because that's where the melody comes from. Still a pretty fun song, though - just a bad decision to borrow the melody. 21. The Kingsbury Manx "Zero G": I like this album...but it's taking a while to sort of sink in, primarily because a lot of tracks are like this one: slow, contemplative (and just now I realized something about it reminds me of "Heroin": apparently the Velvet Underground is this mix's secret subtext), and very craftfully done. That means I first appreciate it, and only later actually get into it (assuming that happens, and it instead doesn't drift off to "really smart and well-done but boring" land). I'm not sure on this song about the vocal chorus that comes in about halfway through - although I've gotta admit that if I wasn't sure about the sound itself, the ffect (combined with the big drums that enter simultaneously) does work in the slow-building context of the song. Anyway, cuts back to just the voices and the organ, stops dead. In some ways an effective end to the disc; in other ways, less so... Regardless, overall a nice and varied selection of songs. Thanks again, George! - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 16:47:42 -0700 From: "Roger Winston" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: David Lynch's Birthday Swap 2fs on 2/10/2006 4:32:55 PM wrote: > - although I've gotta admit > that if I wasn't sure about the sound itself, the ffect (combined with > the big drums that enter simultaneously) does work in the > slow-building context of the song. Is "ffect" shorthand for "the 2fs ect"? And is it anything like pedantic turbogeekery? Latre. --Rog - -- FlasshePoint, yet another blog among millions: http://www.flasshe.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 20:59:32 -0500 From: "Paul King" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos On 10 Feb 2006 at 9:06, 2fs (2fs ) spaketh these wourdes: > > But I don't like the way she sings "Mammoth Gardens." (Actually I like > her singing on the Hex project - at least the one album I have - far > better.) > I have the "Hex" album, and think it is fine also, and was disappointed that it didn't continue. (Was there two albums or only one?) Paul King ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 22:23:38 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Game Theory Demos On 2/10/06, Paul King wrote: > > I have the "Hex" album, and think it is fine also, and was disappointed that it > didn't continue. (Was there two albums or only one?) Apparently there were two: a self-titled album and _Vast Halos_ (which is the one I have, although I haven't listened to it for years. May have to dig it out...). - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 22:18:17 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: David Lynch's Birthday Swap On 2/10/06, Roger Winston wrote: > 2fs on 2/10/2006 4:32:55 PM wrote: > > > - although I've gotta admit > > that if I wasn't sure about the sound itself, the ffect (combined with > > the big drums that enter simultaneously) does work in the > > slow-building context of the song. > > Is "ffect" shorthand for "the 2fs ect"? And is it anything like pedantic turbogeekery? No. It's Welsh. It means "a shrubbery sculpted to resemble Michael Caine." And yes, it is. ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V6 #37 ******************************