From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V5 #186 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Monday, August 1 2005 Volume 05 : Number 186 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] Always fun ["Bradley Skaught" ] Re: [loud-fans] Always fun ["Bradley Skaught" ] Re: [loud-fans] Always fun ["Bradley Skaught" ] Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs [] Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs [Jenny Grover ] [loud-fans] Zep solved ["John F Butland" ] Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs [Roger Winston ] Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs [Jeff ] Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs ["[The Arch-Villain] West" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Always fun > That's the thing that bugs me about Joel. He's >actually a fairly > decent songwriter, adequate vocalist, good piano >player...but every > damned one of his songs sounds like he's writing for >an ad campaign > and impatiently waiting for the checks to start rolling >in. There's a smugness about Joel that I find grating. Every hit song seems like a genre exercise that he's using his considerable skills to knock out as if to say, "see, I can throw this crap together and make hits. I'm better than that, of course, but you people will buy it anyhow." It kind of sneaks into his lyrics, too--it always seems like whatever problems he's up against in the song, he's not the least bit responsible for them. "Piano Man" is a Karaoke dream come true, though--bombastic, sloppily romantic and responds well to alcohol. B ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 09:55:02 -0700 From: "Bradley Skaught" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Always fun > I'm still wondering why Desperado isn't on there. That's a good one. The Eagles are kind of icky to me. I've always been bugged by "Take It Easy"--especially the phrase "loosen my load", which is a horrible thing to sing. I do love their harmonies, though. Speaking of harmonies, has anyone here heard a new British band called The Magic Numbers? Nothing is available stateside yet, but i've read quite a bit about them and they sound intriguing--a kind of retro 60's thing, perhaps, but supposedly they have really strong harmonies. B ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 10:03:33 -0700 From: "Bradley Skaught" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Always fun > Actually, Led Zeppelin with Burton Cummings would > just be "American Woman" That's why I kind of like that choice, because it basically makes Led Zeppelin into The Guess Who! Seriously, though, I tink Cummings can do everything Plant can do but it's somehow more...convincing to me? Dunno... The game has changed a bit over the years. It used to be about the funniest answer (ie Robert Smith), but the intent now is to find someone who can accomplish the kinds of things that Plant accomplished but, in the opinion of the "contestant", better. So it has to be somthing with some range and some power who can handle a blues-y thing and do the folk-y thing. I think Roy Harper would have ruled--they'd have been the best band ever! >I'm > curious, though: is it all of his singing, or just the high >register > of it? It's the whole thing, plus lyrics. But, man, I love Robert Plant in an interview--smart, funny, insightful. He's really a fantastic storyteller and seems very likable. I like that he seems to have good taste in music, too. That was true of the whole band, actually. I love the stories of Jimmy Page playing guitar with Dan Treacy of the Televsion Personalities when Treacy worked for LZ's management company! B ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 12:24:42 -0400 From: Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs Ny definition of a bad song is one that doesn't live up to its aspirations. Songs like "I Think I Love You" aren't bad songs because they don't aim high. Likewise for songs that actually strive to be awful like Rick Dees' "Disco Duck". Then there are the songs like "American Pie" (whoever does it) and Billy Joel's "Piano Man" that - while not awful - are bad songs because they REALLY aim high and miss the mark. > > From: Chris Prew > Date: 2005/07/30 Sat AM 09:48:45 EDT > To: Loud Fans > Subject: [loud-fans] Bad Songs > > I thought the Anti list was simply axe grinding against stuff that was > popular that the authors thought sucked, and stuff that was actually > really good that the authors didn't like (Losin My Religion, ffor > example). > > My list of bad songs would probably contain a Mandy Moore cover of the > Beach Boys "God Only Knows" that plays over the titles of the movie > "Saved" that I saw recently. I actually don't have a particular > problem with Mandy (she _can_ act, actually), but girl, when you are > signing one of the most beautiful and harmonically precise pop songs > ever written, check the Whitney Houston > look-at-all-the-notes-I-can-sing histrionics at the door. She just > murdered it. > > Chris ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 15:04:21 -0400 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs jacklip@charter.net wrote: >Then there are the songs like "American Pie" (whoever does >it) > Don McLean ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 15:34:28 -0300 From: "John F Butland" Subject: [loud-fans] Zep solved If you want Plantless Zep, get yer hands on that Pagey/Black Crowes set. Best, JFB ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 13:26:40 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs At Sunday 7/31/2005 10:24 AM, jacklip@charter.net wrote: >Then there are the songs like "American Pie" (whoever does >it) and Billy Joel's "Piano Man" that - while not awful - >are bad songs because they REALLY aim high and miss the >mark. I can see how people think American Pie is cheesy or misses the mark, but I like it. I think it does hit the mark. I'm not sure what you mean by "aiming high" in this case. I think whatever McLean was aiming for, he hit, but I don't know what his original intentions were. I'm sure that these days he regrets that it's about the only thing he's known for ("Vincent" notwithstanding). I doubt he was trying to make a rock n roll epic for the ages that would overshadow everything else he would ever do, or anything like that. He probably just wanted to do a fun little tribute. I remember when it first came out, I found it very annoying and repetitive, but when I started concentrating on the verses (especially in the full length version) instead of the chorus, I really began to dig it. And then when I found out what the song was about, and looked at the lyrics under that light, it became even more fascinating - like a little game to play. It still holds up for me. Latre. --Rog - -- Distance, Redefined: http://www.reignoffrogs.com/flasshe ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 15:10:54 -0500 From: Jeff Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs On 7/31/05, Roger Winston wrote: > At Sunday 7/31/2005 10:24 AM, jacklip@charter.net wrote: > > >Then there are the songs like "American Pie" (whoever does > >it) and Billy Joel's "Piano Man" that - while not awful - > >are bad songs because they REALLY aim high and miss the > >mark. On a similar note, I'm not sure how "Piano Man" is aiming all that high - it's a song about a bunch of nowhere characters and their nowhere lives, isn't it? Except that the "piano" is really the bicameral legislature, the "beer" is really Chester A. Arthur, and "melody" is the debate over the gold standard, of course. - -- ...Jeff The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:01:39 -0700 From: "[The Arch-Villain] West" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bad Songs On Jul 31, 2005, at 1:10 PM, Jeff wrote: > On 7/31/05, Roger Winston wrote: > > >> At Sunday 7/31/2005 10:24 AM, jacklip@charter.net wrote: >> >> >> >>> Then there are the songs like "American Pie" (whoever does >>> it) and Billy Joel's "Piano Man" that - while not awful - >>> are bad songs because they REALLY aim high and miss the >>> mark. >>> >>> > > On a similar note, I'm not sure how "Piano Man" is aiming all that > high - it's a song about a bunch of nowhere characters and their > nowhere lives, isn't it? > I think I know what the first-quoted writer is talking about, regarding "Pinano Man". Joel seems, to me, to be attempting a sort of musical equivalent of "Winesburg, Ohio" -- that is, a timeless, deeply moving portrayal of a collection of sad, lonely, unhappy people who can't get their crap together -- but in the end it's just a pop ballad and little more. His florid lyrics indicate a tippy-toe reaching for poetic profundity (the guy "making love to his tonic and gin", the "real-estate novelist" -- sheesh), but instead of Sherwood Anderson, it's more like Sherwin Williams. As songs go, though, it's kinda catchy. I have no other expectations from Mr. Joel... "kinda catchy" just about covers it. West ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V5 #186 *******************************