From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V5 #69 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Wednesday, March 16 2005 Volume 05 : Number 069 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] update! [LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] The Streets [Aaron Mandel ] RE: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room ["Larry Tucker" ] Re: [loud-fans] update! [zoom@muppetlabs.com] [loud-fans] Springsteenia [Holly Kruse ] Re: [loud-fans] update! [Rex Broome ] Re: [loud-fans] The Streets [LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] The Streets [Rex Broome ] Re: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room [LeftyZ@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room ["Richard Blatherwick" ] Re: [loud-fans] The Streets [dmw ] Re: [loud-fans] The Streets [Jeff ] Re: [loud-fans] The Streets ["Bradley Skaught" ] RE: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room [Gil Ray ] Re: [loud-fans] update! [Gil Ray ] Re: [loud-fans] The Streets ["Stewart Mason" ] Re: [loud-fans] The Streets [Jeff ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 03:04:05 EST From: LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] update! In a message dated 3/14/05 11:11:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, ggilray@yahoo.com writes: I'm very aware that I'm a bald, middle aged white guy Gil, there is absolutely nothing wrong with being bald or middle aged. You are who you are, and you look just fine. You don't look like Art Garfunkel anymore like you did on the cover of Big Shot Chronicles, but that's okay. I think you look better older. You have a distinct look, and it's very memorable. I also dig the frames of your glasses you had on at the LF gig in Athens in '00. I'd choose those very same frames for myself. You dress cool too (I still coveteth your BSC sweater). What if Jean-Luc had hair? Would you want him running your intergalactic space ship? Would you want to put your life in the hands of a middle aged man with a French coiff? Plus, you're a fantastic drummer. I played those GT records a lot when I was young with my drum sticks and practice pads trying to emulate your style, which is very distinctive. I'd know it anywhere. I have probably about two thousand records, and I can only say that about about a handful of drummers from all those records. Albeit, you're no Chris (the first one, of course) from the Partridge Family, but one can only try to reach such lofty peaks, - --Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:19:28 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Streets On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com wrote: > I'll listen to 'em (him) next time I'm at the record store, but it > doesn't sound like my thing...I'm imagining a British Beastie Boy. Huh? No, not really at all-- the Beasties have had an unchanging early-80s rap flow since they started. I hate it, obviously a lot of people don't, but they rap like rappers. Mike Skinner of the Streets sounds more like the guy who did the verses in Blur's "Parklife". > My exposure to this genre began and ended with my purcase of "Rapper's > Delight" in 7th grade. ("Rapture" by Blondie doesn't count) Your loss! I'm pretty sure anything with Dose One in it even fulfills your criterion of testosterone-less sociopathy. a ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:42:37 -0500 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-loud-fans@smoe.org [mailto:owner-loud-fans@smoe.org] On Behalf > Of Richard Blatherwick > Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 5:14 PM > To: loud-fans@smoe.org > Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room > > From: "Gil Ray" > >I saw a pretty great show Thursday night, just a few > > blocks from our house, here in Albany. Steve Wynn and > > his band played a blistering set and I highly > > recommend seeing them if they show up at a town near > > you! > > It's kinda odd that I've never seen him through all > > these years, but they really do rock, and the band is > > awesome. Russ Toleman told me that he's had this > > line-up for several years, and seeing that they play > > all the time (I'm pretty sure that's how the still > > earn a living!-though mostly in Europe, they hit a > > groove that reminds me of the tightness Game Theory > > could hit about mid-way through a tour). > > I've had the good fortune to see Steve & the Miracle 3 a few times in > recent years in different UK venues. The main change in line-up that > occurred about 4 years ago was that Jason Victor took over from Chris > Brokaw > on guitar just before Here Come the Miracles, the album that boosted > Steve's > profile a fair bit. Brokaw wanted soem time to finish off his Red Cities > album. > The band can really get everyone in the room on their feet and I'd happily > travel miles to see them again. > In addition to this, if you ever get the opportunity have a chat with > Steve > as he's a really good bloke to spend some time chewing the fat with - > lots > of tales from his life on the road and he's happy to discuss reasons for > certain things being in the set and others not. He also does requests from > time to time if you chat with him before shows! (like that would work any > other way round!!) > > Richard Richard, couldn't agree more with you on every point. Steve is incredibly friendly and open to conversation at shows. With the last three albums I think Wynn as at the top of his career and the Miracle 3 is the best band he's ever had. His girlfriend Linda Pitmon is one of the best drummers around and guitarist Jason Victor is nothing short of amazing. Do indeed catch one of their shows if you ever get the chance. Larry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:34:10 -0500 From: Dave Walker Subject: [loud-fans] Amon Tobin OK, so I don't post to this list for months at a time, and when I do it's to plug an off-genre record that probably only a handful will be interested in, but hey... anyway, Amon Tobin's "Splinter Cell 3" soundtrack is pretty fantastic stuff, all around. His material's always been pretty cinematic, so in that sense it's not too different from his earlier material, but it really does _sound_ fantastic, all dense and dark texture and the sort of thing that could get Jack Thompson playing videogames. -d.w. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 08:52:52 -0800 (PST) From: zoom@muppetlabs.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] update! > I'm very aware that I'm a bald, middle aged white > guy, and I've no business singin' the blues. I did my > best to conjure up Jack Bruce singin' the blues, but I > felt that that was not enough, so I had to pour on > great big slabs of irony . Always consult Jack Bruce singing "The Animal Speaks," Gil. Should you need additional white blues inspiration, that is. Or Van Morrison. Or Eddie Hinton. Or Alex Chilton. So Kathleen Edwards released a second album and nobody bought it? Andy Book: Nazis Tested Crude Nuclear Device Mon Mar 14, 3:39 PM ET World - AP By TONY CZUCZKA, Associated Press Writer BERLIN - Nazi scientists trying to build an atomic bomb set off a test explosion two months before the end of World War II, killing hundreds of people in eastern Germany, a German researcher claims in a book published Monday. AP Photo Related Links  How Close Was Hitler to the A-Bomb? (Der Spiegel) "Hitler's Bomb" theorizes that the March 1945 device didn't achieve fission, but did scatter telltale radioactive particles at the Ohrdruf test site. It also claims that Nazi Germany briefly had a working nuclear reactor, something historians generally dispute. Author Rainer Karlsch, an economic historian, offers no first-hand proof, saying his account is an interpretation of available evidence and he hopes it will spur more research. He said soil samples from the Ohrdruf site he had analyzed for his book turned up above-average levels of radioactive isotopes such as cesium 137 and cobalt 60, though he quotes the testers as saying the site poses no radiation hazard. However, access to what he believes was ground zero was barred because of old munitions at the site, which served as a Soviet military training area in East Germany after the war. A U.S. mission that arrived in Germany with American troops in 1945 to investigate the German atomic bomb program concluded that the Germans were nowhere near making a nuclear weapon. Karlsch doesn't claim they were near. But based on witness accounts recorded after the war, postwar Allied aerial photos and Soviet military intelligence reports, he argues that a test blast happened March 3, 1945, at Ohrdruf  then being run as a Nazi concentration camp. He says there probably were several previous tests. "Hitler's bomb  a tactical nuclear weapon with a potential for destruction far below that of the two American atomic bombs  was tested successfully several times shortly before the end of the war," the book says. Gerald Holton, a professor of physics and the history of science at Harvard University, said the main scientists in the Nazi atomic bomb program never mentioned a test blast or having built a working nuclear reactor. British intelligence bugged the scientists  including a key planner, Walther Gerlach  while they were interned at Farm Hall manor in England after the war. Any claims of a Nazi test blast "would have to have a lot of documentary evidence behind it," Holton said. "It also would have to be checked against the remarks that Gerlach made during his period at Farm Hall ... where none of that sort of planning was discussed by him or anyone else." Karlsch says scientists around Gerlach had "a certain amount" of enriched uranium from an as yet unknown source. The German device probably was a 2-ton cylinder containing enriched uranium, he writes. The amount of uranium was small, meaning the conventional explosives used to trigger the device did not set off a vastly more destructive nuclear chain reaction, Karlsch said. That would mesh with an account Karlsch said he found in Soviet military archives, apparently based on information from a German informant, that said the blast felled trees within a radius of about 500 to 600 yards. Witnesses reported a bright flash of light and a column of smoke over the area that day, and residents said they had nausea and nosebleeds for days afterward, Karlsch says. One witness said he helped burn heaps of corpses inside the military area the next day. They were hairless and some had blisters and "raw, red flesh." Karlsch concludes that the blast killed several hundred prisoners of war and inmates forced to work at the site. Two months later, on May 8, 1945, Nazi Germany surrendered after the Soviets captured Berlin. The book also seeks to turn attention from famous physicists like Werner Heisenberg and Carl Friedrich von Weizsaecker  who historians believe were often ambivalent about building a nuclear bomb for Hitler  to lesser-known but fiercely ambitious scientists and Nazi officials who Karlsch theorizes were directly involved in the testing program. Physicist Jeremy Bernstein, who edited the Farm Hall transcripts for the book "Hitler's Uranium Club: The Secret Recordings at Farm Hall," said a key question was where the enriched uranium could have come from. "To enrich uranium, you need an plant the size of Oak Ridge, and the Germans never had one," he said, referring to the sprawling U.S. facility that produced enriched uranium for the Hiroshima bomb. Russian officials were unaware of any such test by the Germans, said Nikolai Shingaryov, a spokesman for Russia's Federal Nuclear Agency. "Of course we don't know everything, but we don't have data about this," he said. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 10:31:48 -0600 From: Holly Kruse Subject: [loud-fans] Springsteenia If any of you are feeling academically inspired in a Springsteenian kind of way, this may be of interest. Or not. I am just the messenger! Holly holly-kruse@utulsa.edu - -------------- Date: Mon 3/14/05 From: Mark Bernhard mvb8@outreach.psu.edu Glory Days: A Bruce Springsteen Symposium September 9-10, 2005 West Long Branch, New Jersey Call for Proposals Proposals are now being accepted for papers for this first-of-its-kind conference for educators, journalists, historians, musicologists, and anyone interested in the life, work, and influence of Bruce Springsteen. Papers will be considered on, but will not be limited to, the following topics: Springsteen and American Folklore Springsteen and Critical Theory Springsteen and Dylan's American Dreamscapes Springsteen and Musicianship Springsteen and Politics of Culture Springsteen and Musical Legacy Springsteen and Musical Contemporaries Springsteen and Rock-n-Roll Iconography The conference, organized by Penn State University, will be held at Monmouth University in New Jersey and will include various live acts, as well as keynote addresses by rock critics and figures from the music industry. For more information about this program and to submit proposals, please visit the Web site: http://www.outreach.psu.edu/pst/Springsteen For information about any of Penn State's other upcoming outreach programs, visit our Web site: http://www.outreach.psu.edu This publication is available in alternative media on request. Penn State is committed to affirmative action, equal opportunity, and the diversity of its workforce. This posting was submitted to your listserv administrator by Penn State. Your listserv administrator approved and sent you this notice. This e-mail was submitted only once. If you have concerns, please e-mail posting@outreach.psu.edu. To be removed from any future mailing, reply to this e-mail with the word REMOVE in the body. Internet Research Associate Outreach Office of Marketing The Pennsylvania State University 2505 Green Tech Drive, Suites E, F, G State College PA 16803-2301 Phone: 814-865-7600 Fax: 814-865-3343 E-mail: posting@outreach.psu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 08:58:53 -0800 From: Rex Broome Subject: Re: [loud-fans] update! > So Kathleen Edwards released a second album and nobody bought it? I probably will. Her first album was a real sleeper for me. Some wince-inducing moments overcome by an overall something that became oddly compelling on repeat listens. Dunno. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 12:19:14 EST From: LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Streets In a message dated 3/15/05 9:19:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, aaron@eecs.harvard.edu writes: Mike Skinner of the Streets sounds more like the guy who did the verses in Blur's "Parklife". Oy! That sounds pretty good after all. > My exposure to this genre began and ended with my purcase of "Rapper's > Delight" in 7th grade. ("Rapture" by Blondie doesn't count) Your loss! I'm pretty sure anything with Dose One in it even fulfills your criterion of testosterone-less sociopathy. LOL! I should be more specific. Testosterone is a good thing, as long as it's with some taste (i.e. Ramones, Jesus and Mary Chain, Scott when he's rocking out, Nirvana even). I think I was just bitchy from having to listen to "House of Hair" at work against my will. Living and growing up in the South, I equate Hair Metal to mullets, sagging trailers, primered muscle cars, wife beater tees, working in a mill, and crystal meth. Hair Metal was a rock genre of choice of "New Wave faggot" hating guys in my high school who had Confederate flags on their notebooks, drawn beautifully by the carefully traced Metallica logo. You could easily find their fave tapes of this genre in their tape cases, located by their tape decks, just below their feathered roach clips attatched to their rear view mirrors. I try to get all these lovely associations out of my head and be more objective, but I think it still sucks. - --Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:30:34 -0800 From: Rex Broome Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Streets Mark re: hair metal > I try to get all these lovely associations out of my head and be more > objective, but I think it still sucks. I hear all of that. Let the associations go, as, luckily for you, the genre does actually, intrinsically, emprically, fundamentally, measurably and undeniably suck actual, real, incontrovertible, physical donkey dicks attached to verifiable, unquestionable and very real donkeys indeed. Makes things easier for us New Wave faggots, that's for sure. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 13:27:51 EST From: LeftyZ@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room In a message dated 3/15/05 6:47:51 AM, ltucker@townofchapelhill.org writes: > Richard, couldn't agree more with you on every point. Steve is > incredibly friendly and open to conversation at shows. With the last > three albums I think Wynn as at the top of his career and the Miracle 3 > is the best band he's ever had. His girlfriend Linda Pitmon is one of > the best drummers around and guitarist Jason Victor is nothing short of > amazing. Do indeed catch one of their shows if you ever get the chance. > And the current interation is called "Steve and the Miracle 3"? Left ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 21:12:37 +0200 From: "Richard Blatherwick" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room > And the current interation is called "Steve and the Miracle 3"? > > Left With the 'Wynn' in it at the appropriate place. ltucker@townofchapelhill.org writes: > > >> Richard, couldn't agree more with you on every point. Steve is >> incredibly friendly and open to conversation at shows. With the last >> three albums I think Wynn as at the top of his career and the Miracle 3 >> is the best band he's ever had. His girlfriend Linda Pitmon is one of >> the best drummers around and guitarist Jason Victor is nothing short of >> amazing. Do indeed catch one of their shows if you ever get the chance. >> I too love watching Linda hammer away at her kit on tracks such as Crawling Misanthropic Blues. She also plays the older stuff great too, preserving the groove that is fundamental to tracks like Halloween, which they always open with these days... at least they have the last few times I've seen them. On the Jason Victor front, when I saw them at the Borderline in London there were quite a few 'faces' in the audience from a variety of bands, one of whom was Marty Willson-Piper who I watched for a couple of says taking great interest in what Mr. Victor was playing. Guess that even when you're an excellent player it never hurts to look for other ideas. Richard ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 12:22:54 -0800 (GMT-08:00) From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room From: Richard Blatherwick > I too love watching Linda hammer away at her kit on tracks such as Crawling > Misanthropic Blues. She also plays the older stuff great too, preserving the > groove that is fundamental to tracks like Halloween, which they always open > with these days... at least they have the last few times I've seen them. They opened with "Still Holding On To You" at the Ivy Room last week, which I didn't recognize until midway through the second verse. I haven't listened to MEDICINE SHOW in awhile, so it was like "wait, I know this song! What is it?". Steve Wynn has written a lot of songs in the key of E-minor. Anyway, everything that Richard and Larry have said rings true. Steve and the Miracle 3 usually only make it out to the SF Bay Area about once a year, so it's always imperative to check them out. At their last SF show at the Parkside, they encored with "Hey Ya!", which I thought was fairly inspired choice (and this was mid-2003 when that song was fairly ubiquitous). This was Steve's first show in the East Bay in 16 years (since the Dream Syndicate I think) and was pretty well attended for a weeknight. I think there are lots of people who hang out every night at the Ivy Room no matter who's playing! - -Steve ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 16:45:14 -0600 From: Jeff Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Springsteenia On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 10:31:48 -0600, Holly Kruse wrote: > If any of you are feeling academically inspired in a Springsteenian kind of > way, this may be of interest. Or not. I am just the messenger! No paper here - but I'm curious as to whether anyone's written about the change in Springsteen's image in his first decade or so in the business - from very urban to a sort of mythic, rural, near-"Western" Americana thing. Even the album titles tell the story: Greetings from Asbury Park, N.J. The Wild, The Innocent, and the E Street Shuffle - --names specific cities and streets Born to Run - --gotta go... Darkness at the Edge of Town - --at the edge, obviously The River - --another "border" Nebraska - --open, midwestern, rural Born in the USA - --and now the whole country is his canvas And the photos: in the beginning, he was this skinny, scraggly, dirty-looking bearded guy posed on the stoop of an urban building with his multi-ethnic band. By the time of Nebraska, he was rural Henry Fonda with an acoustic guitar. (CFP below for those interested) > > Date: Mon 3/14/05 > From: Mark Bernhard mvb8@outreach.psu.edu > > Glory Days: A Bruce Springsteen Symposium > September 9-10, 2005 > West Long Branch, New Jersey > > Call for Proposals > Proposals are now being accepted for papers for this first-of-its-kind > conference for educators, journalists, historians, musicologists, and anyone > interested in the life, work, and influence of Bruce Springsteen. Papers > will be considered on, but will not be limited to, the following topics: > Springsteen and American Folklore > Springsteen and Critical Theory > Springsteen and Dylan's American Dreamscapes > Springsteen and Musicianship > Springsteen and Politics of Culture > Springsteen and Musical Legacy > Springsteen and Musical Contemporaries > Springsteen and Rock-n-Roll Iconography > The conference, organized by Penn State University, will be held at Monmouth > University in New Jersey and will include various live acts, as well as > keynote addresses by rock critics and figures from the music industry. > For more information about this program and to submit proposals, please > visit the Web site: > http://www.outreach.psu.edu/pst/Springsteen > > For information about any of Penn State's other upcoming outreach programs, > visit our Web site: http://www.outreach.psu.edu > > This publication is available in alternative media on request. Penn State is > committed to affirmative action, equal opportunity, and the diversity of its > workforce. > > This posting was submitted to your listserv administrator by Penn State. > Your listserv administrator approved and sent you this notice. This e-mail > was submitted only once. If you have concerns, please e-mail > posting@outreach.psu.edu. To be removed from any future mailing, reply to > this e-mail with the word REMOVE in the body. > > Internet Research Associate > Outreach Office of Marketing > The Pennsylvania State University > 2505 Green Tech Drive, Suites E, F, G > State College PA 16803-2301 > Phone: 814-865-7600 > Fax: 814-865-3343 > E-mail: posting@outreach.psu.edu > - -- ...Jeff The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 20:58:21 -0500 (EST) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Streets On Tue, 15 Mar 2005, Rex Broome wrote: > I hear all of that. Let the associations go, as, luckily for you, the > genre does actually, intrinsically, emprically, fundamentally, > measurably and undeniably suck actual, real, incontrovertible, > physical donkey dicks attached to verifiable, unquestionable and very > real donkeys indeed. Dude! Metallica RAWKS! or, to put it another way, I don't think there's any genre that entirely actually, intrinsically, etc. (For purposes of this discussion a genres may not defined only by lyrical content; there's plenty of lyric content I find too offensive to for me to listen to the artist, but I'm not going to buy that "White Power" (for example) is a genre in and of itself.) the pathetic caverns: a zine - opinionated and eclectic reviews a studio - specializing in indie/rock/mobile/live/demo recording http://www.pathetic-caverns.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 21:23:49 -0600 From: Jeff Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Streets On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 20:58:21 -0500 (EST), dmw wrote: > On Tue, 15 Mar 2005, Rex Broome wrote: > > > I hear all of that. Let the associations go, as, luckily for you, the > > genre does actually, intrinsically, emprically, fundamentally, > > measurably and undeniably suck actual, real, incontrovertible, > > physical donkey dicks attached to verifiable, unquestionable and very > > real donkeys indeed. > > Dude! Metallica RAWKS! Ummm...* > or, to put it another way, I don't think there's any genre that > entirely actually, intrinsically, etc. Perhaps not objectively...but (as my repeated attempts to Stop Worrying And Learn To Love The Metal attest - all have failed) it's certainly possible for one to categorically dislike a genre - simply because the traits that *define* the genre are undigestable for that person. That is: it seems as if nearly every post-eighties metal band various people have attempted to tell me Don't Suck features the goddamned Cookie Monster on vocals, which I cannot abide. More specifically: it's stupid, because no one is that angry/tortured/possessed all the time, and it's not scary, it's funny - - but it's not funny enough to actually listen to. Vocal subgenre #2 is the quasi-operatic shit - which, when as usually combined with overreaching lyrics, results in (again) unintentional but not amusing humor. Okay, so what about instrumental metal? And here we run into a matter of taste on my part: I find myself wanting to take a breath from all the virtuosity...but when the bands do, they often go completely lame, or saccharine, or just reveal more stupidity than I can handle. And there's something about the more proggish end of metal: I think they're often influenced, structurally, by 19c classical - which is my least favorite era of classical (it is, of course, most people's most favorite), and it just seems as if there's a disjunction between the form, which demands to be filled with Much To Say, and its executioners (take that in either sense), who are not so filled - almost always lyrically, and most often musically as well. Part of it, too, is just Pavlovian response: I hear obvious metal signifiers, and suddenly I'm surrounded by mulleted heshers saying "dude" way too much (a verbal limitation that is less than one, except with irony, in which case it's exactly one). I know...that's like envisioning Billy Bob Sisterbonker when you hear country: a terrible stereotype, etc. And I know a couple-three very intelligent, thoughtful folks who like metal (some of whom are present company) - so I know the stereotype isn't actually correct. Ultimately, I just give up and realize: hey, there's already more music that I do like than I have time to listen to. * never did for me. Even they sound ultimately ridiculous with unearned intensity, although I recognize they're less silly in many ways than other metal bands. - -- ...Jeff The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 19:42:00 -0800 From: "Bradley Skaught" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Streets I only just recently overcame a lifetime of anti-Reggae prejudice (even though I still find Rastafari a completely ridiculous religion), but I agree with Jeff in general about not being able to overcome the fundamental signifying elements of a genre--and thus having any similarity to that genre trigger a negative response. It might be something one can overcome, but I wonder if the work involved is worth it? A good friend of mine absolutely hates anything that sounds like mexican music--I tried to get him to listen to Steve Jordan, since his work does a lot of what this friend really loves in music, but he just couldn't do it. As far as Metallica goes, i've always been frustrated that they were touted as "the smart metal band"*, when I don't really consider some tricky time changes satisfying evidence of "smart". When they did that big show with the SF Symphony I found it all really embarassing--there are metal bands who have a degree of harmonic sophistication that would really go well with a symphony orchestra, but Metallica are pretty one dimensional in that department. And don't even get me started on the lyrics! *I suppose I can add this to my pile along with "Jim Morrison is the great poet of rock" B - -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.7.2 - Release Date: 3/11/2005 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 19:54:25 -0800 (PST) From: Gil Ray Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Oldies night at the Ivy Room - --- Larry Tucker wrote: His girlfriend Linda > Pitmon is one of > the best drummers around and guitarist Jason Victor > is nothing short of > amazing. I agree 100%. Both of them are amazing! Gil __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 19:59:38 -0800 (PST) From: Gil Ray Subject: Re: [loud-fans] update! Mark, you're a sweetheart. Thank you! Gil (but someday I sssooooooo want to buy a really bad toupee and wear it 1 day a month, all day long!) - --- LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 3/14/05 11:11:13 PM Eastern > Standard Time, > ggilray@yahoo.com writes: > > I'm very aware that I'm a bald, middle aged white > guy > > > Gil, there is absolutely nothing wrong with being > bald or middle aged. You > are who you are, and you look just fine. You don't > look like Art Garfunkel > anymore like you did on the cover of Big Shot > Chronicles, but that's okay. I > think you look better older. You have a distinct > look, and it's very > memorable. I also dig the frames of your glasses > you had on at the LF gig in Athens > in '00. I'd choose those very same frames for > myself. You dress cool too > (I still coveteth your BSC sweater). > > What if Jean-Luc had hair? Would you want him > running your intergalactic > space ship? Would you want to put your life in the > hands of a middle aged man > with a French coiff? > > Plus, you're a fantastic drummer. I played those GT > records a lot when I > was young with my drum sticks and practice pads > trying to emulate your style, > which is very distinctive. I'd know it anywhere. > I have probably about two > thousand records, and I can only say that about > about a handful of drummers > from all those records. > > Albeit, you're no Chris (the first one, of course) > from the Partridge > Family, but one can only try to reach such lofty > peaks, > --Mark Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 23:41:13 -0500 From: "Stewart Mason" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Streets - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bradley Skaught" >I only just recently overcame a lifetime of anti-Reggae prejudice >(even > though I still find Rastafari a completely ridiculous religion), but > I agree > with Jeff in general about not being able to overcome the > fundamental > signifying elements of a genre--and thus having any similarity to > that genre > trigger a negative response. It might be something one can overcome, > but I > wonder if the work involved is worth it? Well, you can look at this the other way too, by deciding that the music itself can be divorced from either the "fundamental signifying elements" (assuming that you mean what I *think* you mean, which is the stuff like the red green and gold knit caps and the spliffs, but not the actual musical elements of reggae) or one's lame high-school prejudices against a type of music's supposed core audience. I mean, I thought a fairly large majority of the Cure and/or Siouxsie and the Banshees fans I knew in high school and college were total douchebags, but I still liked the bands themselves, and it's not like I had to personally associate with anyone wearing dyed-black hair and a week's allowance's worth of kohl just to listen to the music. S NP: "I Do Dream You" -- Jennifer Gentle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 23:05:06 -0600 From: Jeff Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Streets On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 23:41:13 -0500, Stewart Mason wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bradley Skaught" > >I only just recently overcame a lifetime of anti-Reggae prejudice > >(even > > though I still find Rastafari a completely ridiculous religion), but > > I agree > > with Jeff in general about not being able to overcome the > > fundamental > > signifying elements of a genre > > Well, you can look at this the other way too, by deciding that the > music itself can be divorced from either the "fundamental signifying > elements" (assuming that you mean what I *think* you mean, which is > the stuff like the red green and gold knit caps and the spliffs, but > not the actual musical elements of reggae) or one's lame high-school > prejudices against a type of music's supposed core audience. I mean, > I thought a fairly large majority of the Cure and/or Siouxsie and the > Banshees fans I knew in high school and college were total douchebags, > but I still liked the bands themselves, and it's not like I had to > personally associate with anyone wearing dyed-black hair and a week's > allowance's worth of kohl just to listen to the music. I can't speak for Bradley - but what I mostly meant by "fundamental signifying elements" were the *musical* elements - even though, often, those musical elements themselves tend to have negative, extra-musical associations. 'Zat make sense? Sorta like this: let's say that perma-stoned white fratboy Rastas are annoying. That that tends to be the core fanbase for reggae in the US shouldn't in itself prejudice one against reggae...but if you just can't stand the feel of the beat, say, *that* would be a legit reason to say, nope, I just don't like the genre. (I'm talking about classic reggae here - what I've heard of more recent stuff indicates that even the beat has evolved.) I do sometimes think - as Lorelai Gilmore remarked a week or so back - that there's only one reggae song... - -- Buck Foxworth ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V5 #69 ******************************