From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V5 #14 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Saturday, January 15 2005 Volume 05 : Number 014 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] End of Analog? [dmw ] Re: [loud-fans] End of Analog? [LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com] [loud-fans] Truly dicey and uninformed Top 15 [Rex Broome ] Re: [loud-fans] End of Analog? ["Tim Walters" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] End of Analog? there's been lots of discussion about this on industry fora, and i think the consensus is "the end of analog" is a crock. there certainly are a lot of big records being recorded without tape these days, but journalists outside the industry tend to underestimate the amount of work still being done to 2". my bet is somebody buys quantegy and runs it as a boutique operation. on the other hand, if the tape crunch continues and prices stay high... i know what's happening to the feckless beast 2" masters! On Thu, 13 Jan 2005, R. Kevin Doyle wrote: > Well, this just hurts: > > http://online.wsj.com/article_email/0,,SB110549481930523670-H9jgYNmlaN4nJyrZ > nmHa6eJm4,00.html > the pathetic caverns: a zine - opinionated and eclectic reviews a studio - specializing in indie/rock/mobile/live/demo recording http://www.pathetic-caverns.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 14:14:26 EST From: LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] End of Analog? In a message dated 1/14/05 7:41:39 AM Eastern Standard Time, d0mw@mwmw.com writes: > on the other hand, if the tape crunch continues and prices stay > high... i know what's happening to the feckless beast 2" masters! > There was a mention in that article about China making tape, but it wasn't of consistently high quality. I'd like more information. WHEN and how often was this tape quality checked, and by whom, for what purpose? I have a hard time believing that, especially with the overall quality of Chinese goods now. I think the right Chinese supplier could make it quite affordably and of extremely high quality. And, though I understand a concern about sweatshops, I wonder how much of the truth about that is being distorted through a culturally different lens, - --Mark ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 15:34:47 -0800 From: Rex Broome Subject: [loud-fans] Truly dicey and uninformed Top 15 Well, owing to the way I spent most of 2004 and the way I'm starting this year (without much access to my own music collection, and less cash), I'm even more poorly informed about what came out than usual, and spent less time with even my favorite records of the year than I usually would have. Neverthegoddamnless, here's what I think will be my favorite records of the year when/if the dust has cleared. 1) John Cale, Hobo Sapiens 2) Tanya Donelly, Whiskey Tango Ghosts 3) 50 Foot Wave, S/T (and ancillary releases) 4) The Church, Forget Yourself 5) Mission of Burma, ONoffOn 6) Brian Wilson presents Smile 7) Interpol, Antics 8) Neko Case, The Tigers Have Spoken 9) Sonic Youth, Sonic Nurse 10) Robyn Hitchcock, Spooked 11) A.C. Newman, The Slow Wonder 12) Nick Cave, Lyre of Orpheus/Abbatoir Blues 13) The Finn Brothers, Everyone Is Here 14) Camper Van Beethoven, New Roman Times 15) Wilco, A Ghost Is Born If I thought it would make much difference, I would highly rand the US version of The Real New Fall L.P., which came out this year but I suppose is properly, mostly, a 2003 release. If the 50 Foot Wave release (which is a six-track EP, but bolstered by a few live web-only releases) is to be discounted, the queue for the empty spot would include Califone, the Sadies, TV on the Radio, Bjork, and, perhaps somewhat grudgingly, Franz Ferdinand. Weird list. Nobody's more surprised than me. Special honorable mention for unprecedented unlistenabiltity to REM, Around the Sun. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 19:52:14 -0500 (EST) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] End of Analog? On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com wrote: > There was a mention in that article about China making tape, but it wasn't of > consistently high quality. I'd like more information. WHEN and how often > was this tape quality checked, and by whom, for what purpose? I have a hard > time believing that, especially with the overall quality of Chinese goods now. I > think the right Chinese supplier could make it quite affordably and of > extremely high quality. well, you check the quality of a reel of tape pretty much every time you spool one up and use it. you calibrate a professional tape deck essentialy by putting a signal on the tape and seeing exactly how the signal you get back differs from the signal you put on it. so the quality is checked by every engineer anywhere who's worked with the tape, and it's checked pretty often, and the only purpose is to check how well the tape holds audio data (which is very different from how tape holds computer backup data). what this translates to, basically, is how evenly/densely the magnetic particles are distributed on the tape, and how much they do or don't tend to flake off. professional audio people are notoriously snobby -- one of the reasons quantegy was the last to go is that well before it was the only game in town, it was the choice of virtually all the serious professional snobs. some of those snobs were just following the herd, but some of those snobs could HEAR the difference between different brands of tape stock, and many more of them could see which tape stock held up better after a few years. when you talk about the quality of goods, you need to take into account the complexity of those goods, and the complexity of the manufacturing process itself, and the tolerance for error in both the process and in the product. vaccuum tubes are an interesting case -- china and the former SSRs are virtually the world's only producers of vaccuum tubes now, and while their quality control is probably sufficient for general electronic use, for audio use it's pretty poor, because the tolerances are so much tighter -- a tube can "work" but still sound "bad," and the chinese and russian facilities don't consistently produce tubes that sound "good" even if they consistently "work" -- companies like sovtek and the sound room import huge batches of audio electronics, test them, throw 1/3 to 1/2 away (source: personal interview) and mark up the rest for sale in the US. modern printed circuit board electronics are a whole different story -- there's all kinds of manufacturing equipment out there, and lots of people know how to use it, and much of the production can be done without clean rooms (or with limited clean room facilities). so in a lot of product areas, china can offer comparable quality electronic goods at a lower cost due to the labor differential. making audio tape (and tubes) is a different story -- you need equipment that is now specialized, rare, and tricky to maintain. you also have to keep much of the production line completely dust-free, which is very difficult/expensive and you need workers with specialized and unusual training. so while i've never heard any chinese 2" tape, i don't find it at all hard to believe that the quality is spotty at best. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 17:34:08 -0800 (PST) From: "Tim Walters" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] End of Analog? dmw wrote: > on the other hand, if the tape crunch continues and prices stay > high... i know what's happening to the feckless beast 2" masters! I have some 2" reels from a now-withdrawn album that I'd be thrilled to get rid of for $150 each. Unfortunately, we made the tactical error of inserting leader between songs. - -- THE DOUBTFUL PALACE Free exquisite music http://www.doubtfulpalace.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 09:47:40 -0500 From: Cardinal007 Subject: [loud-fans] Shameless -- Crowd Scene and Sharples in DC! For any Washington, DC area listers -- tonight, at the Galaxy Hut [on Wilson Boulevard in Arlington, VA], the former lister and general titmouse John Sharples, and the oft-lurking but never distant Grahame Davies and his The Crowd Scene will be making beautiful music. And Sharples will probably shill his fine "I Can Explain Everything" cd . As I am now. My understanding is that sometime around 9:00, the Crowd Scene will present their amazing melodic, trenchant rock. Sharples and his Brooklyn-based band will then follow with an eclectic, insouciant brand of rock that grew well on the Northern Slopes during the last vintage. After that, it's probably drugs and blowjobs for everybody... PS Robert Mitchum: " 'Trenchant'? Trenchant my ass!" ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V5 #14 ******************************