From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V4 #277 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Monday, October 11 2004 Volume 04 : Number 277 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] musical Frankenstein's monster... [2fs Subject: [loud-fans] musical Frankenstein's monster... So as I was waiting for my computer to boot, I was idly diddling the melody to the Beach Boys' "Girl Don't Tell Me" on the keyboard next to the desk. Without really thinking about, I realized that alla sudden what I was playing was the last part of the verse of Elvis Costello's "Girls Talk." Ah-ha! Yep - the chord sequence and melodic shape for the first part of the verse of each song are very similar. Never thought of that one before... - -- ++Jeff++ The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 17:58:55 -0700 From: Michael Mitton Subject: Re: [loud-fans] musical Frankenstein's monster... This is only tangentially related to Jeff's post, but it's something I've wondered for a long time: How close can song A be to song B before song A infringes on the copyright of song B? For example, on The Daily Show, for the segment with Mr. Black, whatever it's called, they play a guitar riff which most definitely wants to make you think that it's "Back in Black", but of course it isn't. I don't know how one would draft objective rules around this kind of thing, but, uh, are there any rules? Or is it just, "If someone complains, we'll listen to the songs side by side and decide. If no one complains, then no harm no foul." I often care about trivial things, mm > Ah-ha! Yep - the chord sequence and melodic shape for the first part > of the verse of each song are very similar. Never thought of that one > before... ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:07:24 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: [loud-fans] musical Frankenstein's monster... On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 17:58:55 -0700, Michael Mitton wrote: > This is only tangentially related to Jeff's post, but it's something > I've wondered for a long time: How close can song A be to song B > before song A infringes on the copyright of song B? For example, on > The Daily Show, for the segment with Mr. Black, whatever it's called, > they play a guitar riff which most definitely wants to make you think > that it's "Back in Black", but of course it isn't. > > I don't know how one would draft objective rules around this kind of > thing, but, uh, are there any rules? Or is it just, "If someone > complains, we'll listen to the songs side by side and decide. If no > one complains, then no harm no foul." I'm pretty sure you're right - it only matters if someone challenges it, and then the legal system (or the two parties settling out of court) decides. But I'm not a lawyer. At any rate, it's certainly not that anyone is monitoring every song every written for copyright infringement. It's also very difficult to specify in advance what characterisitcs of a song make it distinctive and itself. I mean, some people really think the riff from "Smells Like Teen Spirit" is *the same as* the riff from "More Than a Feeling." They're rhythmically similar - and there's a certain cousin-like resemblance harmonically - but I've heard people insist they're the same and argue that Cobain ripped off the Boston song. To my ears, they're distinct enough as to be not even close to infringing. (And both borrow from "Louie Louie" by way of "Wild Thing" at least in terms of rhythm.) - -- ++Jeff++ The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 02:08:41 EDT From: LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] musical Frankenstein's monster... In a message dated 10/10/04 11:25:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jeffreyw2fs@gmail.com writes: > some people really > think the riff from "Smells Like Teen Spirit" is *the same as* the > riff from "More Than a Feeling." I heard a Vandals song today on AOL radio that has a bass part very similar to "Come As You Are." Maybe Novoselic is a Vandals fan, and he soaked it in years before, dripping it out unconsciously years later. When Scott (the son of Dr. Evil, not the pop genius) appears in the first Austin Powers movie, a blatant rip-off of "Smells Like Teen Spirit" plays. That had to have been intentional, but the notes are rearranged *just* enough. Get away from me you lazy-eyed bastard, - --Mark S. who discovered his B-52's debut CD purchased in 1987 has disc rot. So far, all my rotting discs are WEA titles ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V4 #277 *******************************