From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V4 #254 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Thursday, September 16 2004 Volume 04 : Number 254 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box ["Aaron Milenski" ] Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box [Wes_Vokes@eFunds.Com] [loud-fans] Sucking in the Seventies ["Rex.Broome" ] Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box ["Bradley Skaught" ] Re: [loud-fans] tears for Jobriath, anyone? [JRT456@aol.com] [loud-fans] Johnny Ramone RIP ["Vallor" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 09:17:06 -0400 From: "Aaron Milenski" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box >Speaking of the Kinks (and the Stones, and the Beach Boys, and the Who), >did ALL 60s bands had to start their decline at the same time, and were >there any exceptions? I can't think of one single major artist that >made it through the 70s unscathed. Richard Thompson. He's the only exception I can think of. _________________________________________________________________ Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 10:42:02 EDT From: DOUDIE@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] tears, anyone? In a message dated 9/15/04 1:59:15 AM, AWeiss4338@aol.com writes: > Well the title song does sound a little like their previous work, but Call > me > Mellow is psych jangle pop. Totally unlike them. > It sounds remarkably like There She Goes by the La's. It doesn't sound like a ripoff but it has the same shimmery guitar chorus, and it sounds like you've heard it 100 times the first time you hear it the way the La's song does. I'm hosting a night of poetry (mine)/music on Monday Night at the Gerswhin Hotel on Monday Night. Any NYers who are interested hit me up for details. One of the acts jaymay will be on your radar within the year. steven matrick ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 10:49:14 -0400 From: Dan Schmidt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box Aaron Milenski wrote: >> Speaking of the Kinks (and the Stones, and the Beach Boys, and the Who), >> did ALL 60s bands had to start their decline at the same time, and were >> there any exceptions? I can't think of one single major artist that >> made it through the 70s unscathed. > > > Richard Thompson. He's the only exception I can think of. How about Paul Simon? Dan ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 10:10:40 -0500 From: Wes_Vokes@eFunds.Com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box Bowie came through the seventies swinging.... Roxy Music? Pink Floyd? (OK, that's a stretch!) Dan Schmidt To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sent by: cc: (bcc: Wes Vokes/MKE/eFunds) owner-loud-fans@s Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box moe.org 09/15/04 09:49 AM Aaron Milenski wrote: >> Speaking of the Kinks (and the Stones, and the Beach Boys, and the Who), >> did ALL 60s bands had to start their decline at the same time, and were >> there any exceptions? I can't think of one single major artist that >> made it through the 70s unscathed. > > > Richard Thompson. He's the only exception I can think of. How about Paul Simon? Dan ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 09:20:52 -0700 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: [loud-fans] Sucking in the Seventies Lefty: >>"I'm Not Like Everybody Else" >>I had never heard that song until last TV season. It was in the closing of >>SOME WB (I think) show. "One Tree Hill" or "Gilmore Girls" perhaps. >> It IS a great song. (Not on a "regular" studio album, right?) I first heard it in a cover version by Camper Van Beethoven in the late '80's, whenever Camper Vantiquities came out in its first (of many) iterations. Steve H: >>Speaking of the Kinks (and the Stones, and the Beach Boys, and the Who), >>did ALL 60s bands had to start their decline at the same time, and were >>there any exceptions? I can't think of one single major artist that >>made it through the 70s unscathed. Neil Young. Bob Dylan. Yeah, solo artists, not bands, but still. You can throw in Lennon and a few others, too, and maybe step mildly outside the rock idiom to encompass folks like Marvin Gaye. YMM&CWV. Why did they all start to suck? I dunno. It sure would interesting to have some shitty Beatles records to bitch about, though! The simple answer might be the punk rock one: they all got rich. And grew superinflated egos. Most got lazy, and in a lot of cases the excessive lifestyles caught up with them one way or another. Anyhow. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 11:26:11 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box Points well taken about EXILE not being represented on the Stones compilations, so, yeah, I'll move it to the must buy. However, HOT ROCKS has songs from STICKY FINGERS ("Wild Horses" and "Brown Sugar"), so you can see where I was thinking "HOT ROCKS isn't strictly London Records." How the heck did those songs end up on HOT ROCKS anyway? I know the whole label change deal was complicated, so was this a technicality (i.e., those songs being issued on London somewhere in the world), a settlement deal ("we'll let you go if we can use those two songs on a compilation"), or what? One thing I will never ever miss about the vinyl era: pops and end-of-side compression. "You Can't Always Get What You Want" ended both LET IT BLEED and HOT ROCKS, and my copies of each featured a big ol' repeating POP! on the choral intro and fuzzy sound galore as the track wound to its conclusion. Wes: >Bowie came through the seventies swinging.... >Roxy Music? >Pink Floyd? (OK, that's a stretch!) I think the question has to do with the '70s performance of artists prominent in the '60s, which makes Bowie's inclusion specious ("Space Oddity" sneaks in under the wire, unless you want to count the pre-"Oddity" stuff) and rules out Roxy Music. But yeah, Bowie and Roxy had a spectacular '70s. Aaron mentions RT as the '60s exception, but I'm stuck for anyone else, and in fact, by 1975 it seems like a near-complete wash on the SixtiesFolks -- they're all either dead or bloated (often physically as well as artistically). later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 12:41:14 -0400 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Sucking in the Seventies > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-loud-fans@smoe.org [mailto:owner-loud-fans@smoe.org] On Behalf > Of Rex.Broome > Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2004 12:21 PM > To: loud-fans@smoe.org > Subject: [loud-fans] Sucking in the Seventies > > > Steve H: > >>Speaking of the Kinks (and the Stones, and the Beach Boys, and the Who), > >>did ALL 60s bands had to start their decline at the same time, and were > >>there any exceptions? I can't think of one single major artist that > >>made it through the 70s unscathed. > > Neil Young. Bob Dylan. Yeah, solo artists, not bands, but still. You > can throw in Lennon and a few others, too, and maybe step mildly outside > the rock idiom to encompass folks like Marvin Gaye. YMM&CWV. > > Why did they all start to suck? I dunno. It sure would interesting to > have some shitty Beatles records to bitch about, though! > > The simple answer might be the punk rock one: they all got rich. And > grew superinflated egos. Most got lazy, and in a lot of cases the > excessive lifestyles caught up with them one way or another. Anyhow. For a band I think an argument could be made for NRBQ being good through the 70's though they barely clock into the 60's by a year or two and have never been "big". Larry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 12:51:20 EDT From: LkDylaninthmvies@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box In a message dated 9/15/04 12:26:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, outdoorminer@mindspring.com writes: > Aaron mentions RT as the '60s exception, but I'm stuck for anyone else, and > in fact, by 1975 it seems like a near-complete wash on the SixtiesFolks -- > they're all either dead or bloated (often physically as well as artistically). > Just in time for Joey Ramone to start ordering pizzas from CBGBs and John Lydon to make his I HATE PINK FLOYD t-shirt. "Bloated." What a great word. I love it! - --Mark S. "Who dies in their own vomit these days??" "NO ONE!!" (classic ABFAB) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 09:36:00 -0700 From: "Douglas Stanley" Subject: [loud-fans] Kinks Kollections While I'm not going to contend that the Kinks career could ever be summed up on a 2-disc set, I have one that I don't think was mentioned. It's called "To the Bone". Here's the Amazon capsule review: Editorial Reviews Amazon.com This two-disc set is a live retrospective featuring 26 mostly (though not entirely) acoustic renditions of Kinks classics and obscurities, and possesses a poignancy and generosity of spirit that raises it several notches above standard Unplugged-style fare. The band's gracefully low-key reinterpretations of relative obscurities like "Picture Book," "Days," "Do You Remember Walter," and "Death of A Clown" are enough to blow a decade and a half's worth of arena-rock dust off the band's reputation. The group's updating of their early punk anthem "I'm Not Like Everybody Else" carries new levels of resonance that the band could scarcely have dreamed of in 1964. The two new studio recordings are a bit slight, but they sport an unfussed sweetness that's hard to argue with. --Scott Schinder It's got "Come Dancing", "I'm Not Like Everybody Else", and their thus-far overlooked '80's hit "Gallon of Gas" (how could you forget that classic). Doug S. - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2004 18:50:16 -0700 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box COME DANCING only has songs from the Arista era (after 1977), but there's a compilation of early 70s Kinks' songs called CELLULOID HEROES, which was out of print for a long time, but was reissued on Koch in a "bonus" edition (available on emusic http://www.emusic.com/cd/10750/10750922.html along with the spotty 70s albums that all the songs came from). > Dude, has there ever been a career-spanning > Kinks box (or is cross-licensing too great an issue)? None that I've ever seen, but you could make a pretty good one (without too much overlap) by combining Rhino's GREATEST HITS VOLUME 1 (1964-1967), THE KINK KRONIKLES (1966-1970), CELLULOID HEROES (1971-1977), and COME DANCING (1977-1984). Only a few songs are duplicated, and owning multiple copies of "Sunny Afternoon" and "Waterloo Sunset" et.al. isn't the worst thing in the world! - --------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 09:06:02 -0700 From: "Bradley Skaught" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box > Bowie came through the seventies swinging.... > Roxy Music? Neither Bowie nor Roxy were major artists in the 60's, though. Richard Thompson seems iffy to me, too. I took the intial question to be which artists on the stature of Beatles/Stones/Byrds/Kinks/etc. survived the 70's. Paul Simon and Pink Floyd are good ones (and both made it al the way through at least part of the 80's with Final Cut and Graceland both being worthy albums, in my opinion.) My recent critical re-evaluation of his 70's work makes me think that Dylan managed to hang on, but maybe just barely. B - --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.752 / Virus Database: 503 - Release Date: 9/3/2004 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 13:50:53 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box At 09:06 AM 9/15/2004 -0700, Bradley Skaught wrote: >I took the intial question to be which >artists on the stature of Beatles/Stones/Byrds/Kinks/etc. survived the 70's. I was about to include Led Zep as an exception, but again, it's borderline: two 1969 albums, albeit big sellers, and the prime of their career in the '70s... later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 16:58:24 -0400 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Sucking in the Seventies Rex.Broome wrote: >Lefty: > > >>>"I'm Not Like Everybody Else" >>>I had never heard that song until last TV season. It was in the closing of >>>SOME WB (I think) show. "One Tree Hill" or "Gilmore Girls" perhaps. >>>It IS a great song. (Not on a "regular" studio album, right?) >>> >>> > >I first heard it in a cover version by Camper Van Beethoven in the late '80's, whenever Camper Vantiquities came out in its first (of many) iterations. > > I first heard it (that I recall) in the mid-80's covered by the Nomads. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 21:11:44 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Sucking in the Seventies In a message dated 9/15/04 5:27:22 PM, sleeveless@zoominternet.net writes of "I'm Not Like Everybody Else": > I first heard it (that I recall) in the mid-80's covered by the Nomads. > And, as an earlier Lister was probably trying to recall, many people recently heard it for the first time about six months ago as the closing song over an episode of "The Sopranos." ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 22:03:50 -0500 From: "Fortissimo" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 23:13:11 -0700, "Bradley Skaught" said: > > Unlike the The Great Punk Divide of several years later >(which seemed to > > instantaneously render scads of bands nearly obsolete), >there doesn't > > seem to be a huge, pointable-at event in that >era...anyone? > > I recently read a special edition magazine that collected NME articles > about > "the glam rock era", and I was fascinated to read how the journalists of > the > time were very concerned that an era of great bands had just passed and > now > these Roxy Music/Bowie/T.Rex/etc. types were stepping in. Interesting idea. Although I think glam was always way bigger in the UK than in the states... (long live Fall-related subject lines!) - ------------------------------- ...Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: crumple zones:: :: harmful or fatal if swallowed :: :: small-craft warning :: ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 22:05:58 -0500 From: "Fortissimo" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 10:10:40 -0500, Wes_Vokes@eFunds.Com said: > Bowie came through the seventies swinging.... > Roxy Music? > Pink Floyd? (OK, that's a stretch!) Bowie, yeah. And in fact, I'd agree with Floyd - at least through the late seventies - even though effectively, they were a different band after Barrett left. But I think the question had to do with '60s bands weathering the '70s...and so Roxy, releasing their first album in '72 (right?) doesn't count. - ------------------------------- ...Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: crumple zones:: :: harmful or fatal if swallowed :: :: small-craft warning :: ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 22:15:26 -0500 From: "Fortissimo" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Open the goddamn box On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 11:26:11 -0500, "Miles Goosens" said: > Wes: > >Bowie came through the seventies swinging.... > >Roxy Music? > >Pink Floyd? (OK, that's a stretch!) > > I think the question has to do with the '70s performance of artists > prominent in the '60s great minds think alike, etc.... > which makes Bowie's inclusion specious ("Space > Oddity" sneaks in under the wire, unless you want to count the > pre-"Oddity" stuff) I would. It's part of his career, first of all (going back to, what, '66 or '65...Bradley is I think our resident Bowie expert), but more importantly *some* of that stuff is really good. I'm thinking of "Can't Stop Thinking About Me" in particular and a few other tracks on that Decca compilation. Certainly, his Lower Third and Mannish Boys stuff is no worse as Brit faux R&B than early Who/Stones stuff. The more distinctive '60s stuff is not as good as his peak stuff, no - but intriguing, quirky, well-written, and to me at least (who, granted, is a bit of a '60s freak) stands up in non-time capsule ways. This is probably when Bradley makes his pitch for Bowie as one of *the* preeminent songwriters and performers of the rock era - a position about which, the more I think about, the more I'm inclined to agree. (NB: if certain other "immortals" can get away with scads of truly lame material - - yes, Mr. Zimmerman, Mr. V. Morrison, and Mr. Wilson, I'm looking at you - then so can the former Mr. Jones in the early '80s...and w/the exception of parts of _Tonight_ (but other parts are great) and _Never Let Me Down_, there's almost always been good stuff even amongst the dross.) - ------------------------------- ...Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: Solipsism is its own reward :: :: --Crow T. Robot ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 22:23:36 -0500 From: "Fortissimo" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] tears, anyone? On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 00:57:14 EDT, JRT456@aol.com said: > The weirdest thing about EVERYBODY... is that it's the album that THE > SEEDS > OF LOVE should've been, right down to the artwork...Still, this could turn out to be an embarrassing > addition > to the year's favorite albums. By curious coincidence, _StSoL_ was playing in my car today. I dunno...some songs are really good, others marred by vapid soul-chick b-vox (that's a personal annoyance of mine when it's not James Brown or somebody), and (sorry Miles) the occasional outbreak of bad '80s synths and drums (but not enough to ruin them) - but still, a pretty impressive record overall. Despite being, yes, embarrassing in some ways. I think the name, mostly. Although I think I still like their big hit singles better. > In other uncool news: Looks like Morrissey has stepped in to save the > reissue > of Jobriath's LONELY PLANET from being a mere Rhino Handmade edition, and > the > record will now come out via his Attack imprint. I actually remembering reading a review of Jobriath (the first album - and is this it?) when it came out - and I remember very few reviews from that era (I was like 12). I heard a track about a year ago - sounded pretty cool. Can't recall which one, though - sorta glammy, but a bit Anthony Newley-esque (part of glam, to be sure - just emphasize it a bit). Insofar as that description is viable, does it sound like I'd like _Lonely Planet_? - ------------------------------- ...Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: crumple zones:: :: harmful or fatal if swallowed :: :: small-craft warning :: ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 23:49:40 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] tears for Jobriath, anyone? In a message dated 9/15/04 11:25:10 PM, tonerbomb@warpmail.net writes: > Can't recall which one, though - sorta glammy, but a bit > Anthony Newley-esque (part of glam, to be sure - just emphasize it a > bit). Insofar as that description is viable, does it sound like I'd like > _Lonely Planet_? > I could have phrased my Jobriath mention a lot better. It's a compilation culled from his two Elektra albums, under the title of LONELY PLANET BOY. (I originally thought that title was pretty awful, and maybe somebody had figured out that it sounds too much like a T. Rex tribute. Instead, the title is just shortened on the copy I have, which is also still credited to Rhino Handmade.) Jobriath is very much a pop-cabaret creation, and I'm sure a lot of glam fans were turned off by the contrast between image and content...although Elektra always tried to disassociate Jobriath from '70s Bowie. Still, I think fans of Bowie's Deram years will be pretty happy with this comp. In that same spirit, Hip-O Select has reissued Genya Ravan's two 20th Century Fox albums, including URBAN DESIRE, which was disastrously packaged as punky when it's really a weird mix of heartland rock and oldie fixations. Also look for Genya's autobiography "Lollipop Lounge" at the end of the month. Which reminds me that I need to find out the status of that Jobriath documentary originally prepared in association with the Rhino Handmade release. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2004 22:41:46 -0700 From: "Vallor" Subject: [loud-fans] Johnny Ramone RIP Ramones Guitarist Dies of Cancer in Los Angeles LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Johnny Ramone, the lead guitarist with influential U.S. punk rock band the Ramones, died on Wednesday after a five-year battle with prostate cancer, a long-time associate told Reuters. Ramone, 55, who was born John Cummings, died in his sleep at his Los Angeles home about 3 p.m. EDT, said Arturo Vega, the Ramones' creative director. At his bedside were his wife, Linda, as well as rock stars such as Pearl Jam singer Eddie Vedder, Red Hot Chili Peppers guitarist John Frusciante and hard-rocker Rob Zombie, Vega said. They had participated in a Los Angeles concert last weekend celebrating the Ramones' 30th anniversary. Ramone was too sick to attend, and instead spoke to the fans by phone. Ramone will be cremated in a private ceremony on Thursday, and plans are being made for a public memorial, including the unveiling of a statue, at some stage, Vega said. The Ramones, famed for playing their high-energy, unpolished songs at breakneck speed, rose to fame in New York City in the early 1970s, paving the way for such British punk rock icons the Sex Pistols and the Clash. The band made its mark with nihilistic tunes like "Blitzkrieg Bop," "I Wanna Be Sedated" and "Now I Wanna Sniff Some Glue," but it never achieved the commercial success of groups that followed in its wake. Ramones singer Joey Ramone -- born Douglas Hyman -- died in 2001 of lymphatic cancer, while bassist Dee Dee Ramone, who was born Douglas Colvin, died from a drug overdose the following year. ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V4 #254 *******************************