From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V4 #16 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Tuesday, January 20 2004 Volume 04 : Number 016 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] best music of 2003 ["Brian Block" ] [loud-fans] e-music [dmw ] Re: [loud-fans] e-music [Aaron Mandel ] nevehmind Re: [loud-fans] e-music [dmw ] Re: nevehmind Re: [loud-fans] e-music [wsilvers@earthlink.net] [loud-fans] emusic oh well [Aaron Mandel ] [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts ["Rex.Broome" ] Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts [Aaron Mandel Subject: [loud-fans] best music of 2003 I have quite a few favorite 2003 albums, but a long naked list of them wouldn't be any too interesting. I submit, therefore, what I hope is a snappy-but-useful compromise: the list I sent Aaron, plus improvised category awards. 1. Dresden Dolls - Dresden Dolls 2. Radiohead - Hail to the Thief 3. Martin Tielli - Operation Infinite Joy 4. New Pornographers - the Electric Version 5. Do as Infinity - True Song 6. Kitty Brazelton / Dafna Naphtali - What is it Like to be a Bat? 7. Rachael Sage - Public Record 8. GrooveLily - Are We There Yet? 9. Dar Williams - the Beauty of the Rain 10. Tris McCall - Shootout at the Sugar Factory 11. Mull Historical Society - Us 12. Ted Leo / Pharmacists - Hearts of Oak 13. King Missile - the Psychopathology of Everyday Life 14. Dan Bern - Fleeting Days 15. Fountains of Wayne - Welcome Interstate Managers BEST LYRICS (tie) Dresden Dolls - Dresden Dolls (tie) Weakerthans - Reconstruction Site BEST PIANO-PERCUSSION CABARET DUO ALBUM Dresden Dolls - Dresden Dolls BEST SONIC DETAIL WORK (tie) Radiohead - Hail to the Thief (tie) Martin Tielli - Operation Infinite Joy BEST INSTRUMENTAL INTERPLAY GrooveLily - Are We There Yet? BEST SUGAR RUSH (tie) New Pornographers - the Electric Version (tie) Do as Infinity - True Song BEST ALBUM WHERE I PREFER DAN BEJAR'S VOCALS TO NEKO CASE'S, DAMMIT New Pornographers - Electric Version BEST JOYOUS AND POPPY AVANT-GARDE ALBUM Kitty Brazelton / Dafna Naphtali - What is it Like to be a Bat? BEST PLEASANTLY RIDICULOUS AVANT-GARDE ALBUM King Missile - the Psychopathology of Everyday Life BEST MOOD-NEUTRAL AVANT-GARDE ALBUM Volapuk - Where is Tamashii? BEST HIP-HOP-CENTERED AVANT-GARDE ALBUM Aesop Rock - Bazooka Tooth BEST HARROWINGLY PERSONAL AVANT-GARDE ALBUM Xiu Xiu - a Promise BEST HARROWINGLY PERSONAL ROCK ALBUM Rainer Maria - Long Knives Drawn BEST NO-FRILLS ROCK ALBUM (tie) Helicopter Helicopter - Wild Dogs with X-Ray Eyes (tie) White Stripes - Elephant WAIT, WHO SAID SCOTT-MILLERY VOCAL LINES WERE A FRILL? Ted Leo / Pharmacists - Hearts of Oak PRETTIEST ALBUM (SPARKLING) Rachael Sage - Public Record PRETTIEST ALBUM (CALMING) the Buttless Chaps - Love This Time PRETTIEST ALBUM (LAVISH EXCESS) Mull Historical Society - Us BEST FOLK ALBUM Dar Williams - the Beauty of the Rain BEST COUNTRY ALBUM Amy Rigby - Til the Wheels Fall Off BEST ALBUM THAT REMINDS ME I'M NOT SURE WHERE FOLK ENDS AND COUNTRY BEGINS Dan Bern - Fleeting Days BEST ALBUM WHOSE ADULT MALE SINGER DOESN'T SOUND LIKE HE'S HIT PUBERTY Atom and his Package - Attention Blah Blah Blah BEST ALBUM WHOSE ADULT MALE SINGER HAS CLEARLY HIT PUBERTY, BUT WITHOUT IT SEEMING TO INVOLVE MUCH TESTOSTERONE (tie) Radiohead - Hail to the Thief (tie) Martin Tielli - Operation Infinite Joy BEST ALBUM WHOSE ADULT MALE SINGER STILL BELIEVES IN THE POWER OF PROGRESSIVE ROCK FROM 1972 (BUT ONLY THE POST-2000 REMASTERS) Mars Volta - DeLoused in the Comatorium BEST HEAVY METAL ALBUM Tourniquet - Where Moth and Rust Destroy BEST CARNIVAL-METAL ALBUM Dog Fashion Disco - Committed to a Brighter Future BEST GOOFY 4-TRACK POP ALBUM Logan Whitehurst - Goodbye My 4-Track BEST ALBUM BY A 56-YEAR-OLD Ian Anderson - Rupi's Dance BEST ALBUM BY AN ARTIST WHOSE BOSTON SHOWS I KEEP BEING OUT OF TOWN FOR Dresden Dolls - Dresden Dolls BEST ALBUM Dresden Dolls - Dresden Dolls Thank you, and goodnight, - Brian _________________________________________________________________ Learn how to choose, serve, and enjoy wine at Wine @ MSN. http://wine.msn.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 09:15:15 -0500 (EST) From: dmw Subject: [loud-fans] e-music because the largest concentration of people i know who didn't bail is here - -- emusic downloader quit working -- fails w/ micrsoft c++ runtime error - abnormal termination (no stack info) did not install/uninstall any software prior to encountering error deinstalled/reinstalled player -- no change manually cleared emusic entries from registry (including old emusic dl v1 entries), re-installed -- no change approx 1 week before emusic.exe quit working i did uninstall the trial version of ez trust anti virus, and since emusic.exe i've installed avg anti-virus 7.0 i'm running win98se and zone alarm personal firewall f*n emusic tech support is not responding to my issue. anybody got any bright ideas? thanks. - ------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 09:23:02 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] e-music On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, dmw wrote: > emusic downloader quit working -- fails w/ micrsoft c++ runtime error - > abnormal termination (no stack info) Did your reinstall include clicking on the emusic link that said "click here to fix the C++ runtime error"? I'm not being a pain; I rarely visit the front page and could have gone quite a while without seeing that update. Wouldn't surprise me if it didn't work, though. a ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 09:43:03 -0500 (EST) From: dmw Subject: nevehmind Re: [loud-fans] e-music On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, Aaron Mandel wrote: > On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, dmw wrote: > > > emusic downloader quit working -- fails w/ micrsoft c++ runtime error - > > abnormal termination (no stack info) > > Did your reinstall include clicking on the emusic link that said "click > here to fix the C++ runtime error"? > > I'm not being a pain; I rarely visit the front page and could have gone > quite a while without seeing that update. Wouldn't surprise me if it > didn't work, though. ok, thanks aaron. after i posted i checked the emusic message boards and learned that my problem was not unique. tech support's response in the forum was actually coherent and reasonable. fyi, just in case anyone has been similarly perplexed, the update worked for me w/mozilla despite some comments in the message boards that it only worked w/IE -- i'm guessing that could be a side effect of the thoroughness of my de-install. once again, despite the fact that there are a ton of things i admire enormously about emusic, their customer relations mgmt in this little crisis was utterly appalling. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 09:01:38 -0600 (GMT-06:00) From: wsilvers@earthlink.net Subject: Re: nevehmind Re: [loud-fans] e-music OK, I'm at work, not home, so haven't looked into this in any sort of depth but got the exact same problem last night when trying to download something for the first time this year (I use Mozilla to access the site-- the downloads go smoother than with IE). I've got till Sunday to figure it all out (with 65 unspent d/l in my bank), but the quick/dirty answer is to click up a link at the site? cluelessly yours, b.s. - -----Original Message----- From: dmw Sent: Jan 20, 2004 8:43 AM To: Aaron Mandel Cc: "ideology ... exclusively at hecht's!" Subject: nevehmind Re: [loud-fans] e-music On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, Aaron Mandel wrote: > On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, dmw wrote: > > > emusic downloader quit working -- fails w/ micrsoft c++ runtime error - > > abnormal termination (no stack info) > > Did your reinstall include clicking on the emusic link that said "click > here to fix the C++ runtime error"? > > I'm not being a pain; I rarely visit the front page and could have gone > quite a while without seeing that update. Wouldn't surprise me if it > didn't work, though. ok, thanks aaron. after i posted i checked the emusic message boards and learned that my problem was not unique. tech support's response in the forum was actually coherent and reasonable. fyi, just in case anyone has been similarly perplexed, the update worked for me w/mozilla despite some comments in the message boards that it only worked w/IE -- i'm guessing that could be a side effect of the thoroughness of my de-install. once again, despite the fact that there are a ton of things i admire enormously about emusic, their customer relations mgmt in this little crisis was utterly appalling. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 12:23:18 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: [loud-fans] emusic oh well The download limits at eMusic have had the somewhat perverse effect of sending me to other file-downloading sources (band websites, when possible, but not exclusively) to hear a band before I download their album from eMusic. Except that if I like them enough based on samples, I may go buy the real disc. So despite the fact that I'm grudgingly giving eMusic a chance to prove its worth to me under the new system, most of the sales their artists have made to me since the limits began have had nothing, really, to do with eMusic. One that I wish I'd downloaded instead of buying, though, is the Call & Response record... "Rollerskate" is a great song, albeit a fluffy one, but the rest of the record just doesn't justify having the plastic taking up space. Consider that a recommendation for "Rollerskate", anyway. The samples at The Palaxy Tracks' website tempt me -- not sure how much, though. Anyone heard the record and have an opinion? a ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 10:07:36 -0800 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts >>2. "Nothing from this year?" thinks I ... "That's great!" I thought, >>"because much of music from recent coupla years, IMO, sucked greasy cheese >>balls." In all honesty I cannot think of a single album from 2003 that I >>even marginally liked. I hearby return my Loud-Fogey card and hang my head in shame. The thing that weirded me out about the "done-been-voted-for" list more than the anachronisms (which I would've thought were prolly mostly reissues or late 2002 pickups if it hadn't been clarified) was the profusion of EP's. The only time I ever even considered including EP's on a year-end list was for Wire's Read & Burns which kind of constituted one album together in my mind (albeit an album quite similar to the one I voted for as "new" this year, which I admit as my own Contribution to the Chronological Confusion). I guess you could say that, if the EP beats the related album in the voter's mind, it's a better representative choice for that artist that year... but I'm gonna guess that the EP's are mostly on lists together with the LP's in most cases. Lots of stuff I've never heard (of)... it'll be interesting to see which of that stuff places and which were highly personal choices... >>The Church - Forget Yourself There was a new Church album last year? And somebody liked it? Jeez, ya learn something new every day... >>The Fall - The Real New Fall LP Formerly 'Country on the Click' And did this ever actually come out, I wonder? >>The Thrills - So Much For the City I've heard several songs from this and they perked up my ears enough to listen for the back-announce, but... why do I instinctively not trust it? Is it the venues hyping it, or just the Brits-Do-SoCal thing? Or is that just much-deserve payback for Black Rebel Motorcycle Club? - -Rex, who must admit his own SoCal band sounds a wee bit British, but more because of the other guys than himself PS just got an assignment here at work to see if I can find any records mentioning "Skottie Miller". Tempted to refuse on principle. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 09:01:24 -0800 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: Re: [loud-fans] e-music Aaron Mandel wrote: > > On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, dmw wrote: > > > emusic downloader quit working -- fails w/ micrsoft c++ runtime error - > > abnormal termination (no stack info) > > Did your reinstall include clicking on the emusic link that said "click > here to fix the C++ runtime error"? > > I'm not being a pain; I rarely visit the front page and could have gone > quite a while without seeing that update. Wouldn't surprise me if it > didn't work, though. I got the DLM C++ runtime error over the weekend, and resolved it by downloading the latest Download Manager (2.01). The message on the front page wasn't there a couple of days ago, but it tells you to do the same thing. Has anyone tried Rhapsody (aka listen.com)? I'm starting to wonder if $9.95/month for unlimited streaming access from major labels is a better deal than Emusic's limited download access from minor labels. I was going to check the service out on my own but the free preview requires a credit card to activate (even AOL doesn't do *that* anymore!).. - -Steve ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 13:17:34 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, Rex.Broome wrote: > >>The Fall - The Real New Fall LP Formerly 'Country on the Click' > > And did this ever actually come out, I wonder? It did as an import, though I must be 180 degrees opposite whoever's voted for it so far -- I thought it was dreck. The accompanying EP did it for me, though ("(We Wish You) A Protein Christmas"). Rumor has it the Fall Peel Sessions box set is finally coming out this year. I guess I should be happy there are only two prior releases in my collection that will obviate... a ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 11:18:30 -0700 From: "Roger Winston" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts Rex.Broome on 1/20/2004 11:07:36 AM wrote: > >>The Church - Forget Yourself > > There was a new Church album last year? Technically no - FORGET YOURSELF is due out today. Someone must've gotten an advance copy. Is it legal to vote for it in the 2003 poll? I'm wondering, because the new Firewater and Poster Children discs weren't officially released till 2004, yet were easy to acquire in 2003 anyway. > And somebody liked it? Jeez, ya learn something new every day... The last new non-covers non-remix Church album (AFTER EVERYTHING NOW THIS), while not exactly a return to form, was somewhat more listenable than most of what they have put out in the last decade. Was that a ringing endorsement? Latre. --Rog (who actually thought 2003 was a good year for new music) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 12:44:15 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts Rex: >>>2. "Nothing from this year?" thinks I ... "That's great!" I thought, >>>"because much of music from recent coupla years, IMO, sucked greasy cheese >>>balls." In all honesty I cannot think of a single album from 2003 that I >>>even marginally liked. > >I hearby return my Loud-Fogey card and hang my head in shame. Me too. No way I can compete with that, especially considering that I truly love the top 13 albums on my 2003 list. Thanks to Paul for his post, which brought home a sad truth to Rex and me: we are but amateur fogeys. Aaron M./Rex/Aaron M.: >> >>The Fall - The Real New Fall LP Formerly 'Country on the Click' >> >> And did this ever actually come out, I wonder? > >It did as an import, though I must be 180 degrees opposite whoever's voted >for it so far -- I thought it was dreck. At least one vote came from me, and I'm guessing that if it has at least two votes, Jeffrey would be another one. I really, really liked it, and IMO that means three of the last four mainline Fall albums have been at least very good to my ears: THE MARSHALL SUITE, THE UNUTTERABLE, and TRNFLFCotCthingy all "did it" for me, with ARE YOU MISSING WINNER? being the only disappointment of the bunch. I should add that I don't think hearing the earlier mixes of the album would make you think "what might have been!" If you compare the unreleased COUNTRY ON THE CLICK that was ready to go in mid-2003 with the final, official version, there's a couple of track substitutions and a different running order, but the two albums don't sound significantly different to me. Chances are that if you like one, you'll like the other, and if you dislike one, you'll still dislike the other. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 13:45:06 -0500 (EST) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, Rex.Broome wrote: > Lots of stuff I've never heard (of)... it'll be interesting to see which of that stuff places and which were highly personal choices... i'm vaguely toying with the idea of voting exclusively for stuff that no one else has voted so far, not so much because i don't think many of the consensus picks (e.g., ted ldeo, old kit bag) are swell, but because i'm a singularly perverse guy, and because there's more than enough stuff i liked substantially to do it., even if i don't really think it's the "best." if i were going to vote that way right now: deathray davies, the beatings, black lipstick, helicopter helicopter, various artists, centro-matic, consonant, loose fur, grand unified theory, television (not the reish), band of blacky ranchette, denali, calla, my favorite, strike anywhere. 'n' i've got several in reserve if anybody wants to play spoiler to my spoiler strategy, or if i missed something that's already got some votes. - -- d. np outkast "the love below" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 13:13:56 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts At 01:45 PM 1/20/2004 -0500, dmw wrote: >i'm vaguely toying with the idea of voting exclusively for stuff that no >one else has voted so far, not so much because i don't think many of the >consensus picks (e.g., ted ldeo, old kit bag) are swell, but because i'm a >singularly perverse guy, and because there's more than enough stuff i >liked substantially to do it., even if i don't really think it's the >"best." Which is why, in principal, that I'm opposed to posting updates on these sorts of polls. Instead of getting a true read for what people liked, some of the post-update votes are going to be about other things, be they doug's benevolent mission of getting representation for overlooked (so far) stuff, or snarky stuff like trying to move something up or down the standings. Since Aaron only gave us a list of albums rather than standings, it at least avoided the latter problem. And to be fair to Aaron, he was helpfully responding to Rog's request. >deathray davies, the beatings, black lipstick, helicopter helicopter, >various artists, centro-matic, consonant, loose fur, grand unified theory, >television (not the reish), band of blacky ranchette, denali, calla, my >favorite, strike anywhere. I liked Loose Fur, but it wasn't high enough on my list to get a vote in the Loud-Poll, which only goes to what, 15? Television, if we're talking about the Rhino Handmade live one, gets disqualified because of my "no live albums unless the songs are 100% unreleased" rule. Bought Centro-matic's SOUTH SAN GABRIEL SONGS/MUSIC last year (and I still don't know if it's meant to be a Centro-matic album or a South San Gabriel album, but it's definitely got the Centro-matic name on the front cover and spine), and decided that I really don't like quavery, floaty high-pitched male vocals, but if you'd like to hear an alt-countryish Flaming Lips or Archers of Loaf, it could be just the thing for which you've been searching. Didn't buy the Consonant album because I didn't like the first one that well (in fact, it recently was part of a gratifying 76-disc purge), but I have been very surprised to see so little said here about the new one, especially given the attention lavished on the first by Loud-Listers. I mean, even if it really bites in most Loud-Fans' opinions, I'd still expect a flood of "boy, I really was looking forward to that new Consonant record, but golly ned, it sure does blow" exclamations, but instead, silence. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 14:38:42 -0500 (EST) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, Miles Goosens wrote: > I liked Loose Fur, but it wasn't high enough on my list to get a vote in > the Loud-Poll, which only goes to what, 15? i'd have to find my copy (lost since the move) to see if it really legitimately could lay claim to top 15 status. i only heard it two or three times, maybe, but it made a very favorable impression. > Television, if we're > talking about the Rhino Handmade live one, gets disqualified because of > my "no live albums unless the songs are 100% unreleased" rule. i ain't got no such rule. this is such a hude trade-up on "the blow-up" it's not funny. > Bought Centro-matic's SOUTH SAN GABRIEL SONGS/MUSIC last year (and I > still don't know if it's meant to be a Centro-matic album or a South San > Gabriel album, but it's definitely got the Centro-matic name on the > front cover and spine), and decided that I really don't like quavery, > floaty high-pitched male vocals, but if you'd like to hear an > alt-countryish Flaming Lips or Archers of Loaf, it could be just the > thing for which you've been searching. the centromatic record i have didn't strike me as very alt-country, or notably whingy or floaty. sorta standard issue indie-pop rock, mor archers than lips, and while i didn't think it was amazing, just pleasant and pretty good, i'm quite surprised that neither it nor the more rocking fireside got much play hereabouts, because both are squarely in the center of my "kind of stuff i think loudfans like" grap[h. > Didn't buy the Consonant album because I didn't like the first one that well (in fact, it recently was part of a gratifying 76-disc purge), but I have been very surprised to see so little said here about the new one, especially given the attention lavished on the first by Loud-Listers. I mean, even if it really bites in most Loud-Fans' opinions, I'd still expect a flood of "boy, I really was looking forward to that new Consonant record, but golly ned, it sure does blow" exclamations, but instead, silence. woops. i did NOT mean consonant -- i meant "the constantines." dang, hope i don't do that anywhere that counts. - -- d., who can't bleeve he left "beauty pill" off the list. np consonant _love and affliction_ ...just to make sure. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 15:02:50 -0500 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: nevehmind Re: [loud-fans] e-music dmw wrote: >once again, despite the fact that there are a ton of things i admire >enormously about emusic, their customer relations mgmt in this little >crisis was utterly appalling. > > That's because their customer relations mgmt is utterly appalling in general! It's been three months since I got my first mysterious warning letter from them, over two months since they cut me off for no reason and told me I had to write a letter to their offices to get the situation fixed, and I have never heard a word back in any form in regards to my letter, and my account has not been reinstated. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 14:56:27 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] man, the list is quiet On Mon, 19 Jan 2004, Fortissimo wrote: > You're right on all three counts What, that there's bad rap which does the things Paul complains about, or that that's a valid indictment of rap as a whole? Criticizing "rap" because of what's on the charts is like criticizing "rock" because of... what's on the charts. You wouldn't give any creedence to someone who said "I can't stand what passes for rock these days -- it's all from Sweden or New York or something and I hate the distorted vocals. Singing over an electric guitar's been done before anyway; I haven't liked rock since Pat Boone's first record," would you? The latter half of the comment undermines what plausibility the first half might have had. I know we've had this thread before, so I probably shouldn't even bother, but I get really sick of people pulling out this "Emperor's New Clothes" line on genres they don't understand, as if they were saying something new or interesting. Sorry, that's more directed at Paul than at Jeff. a ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 15:19:27 -0500 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts dmw wrote: >i'm vaguely toying with the idea of voting exclusively for stuff that no >one else has voted so far, not so much because i don't think many of the >consensus picks (e.g., ted ldeo, old kit bag) are swell, but because i'm a >singularly perverse guy, and because there's more than enough stuff i >liked substantially to do it., even if i don't really think it's the >"best." if i were going to vote that way right now: > >deathray davies, the beatings, black lipstick, helicopter helicopter, >various artists, centro-matic, consonant, loose fur, grand unified theory, >television (not the reish), band of blacky ranchette, denali, calla, my >favorite, strike anywhere. > >'n' i've got several in reserve if anybody wants to play spoiler to my >spoiler strategy, or if i missed something that's already got some votes. > > > I already voted for Consonant. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 15:22:30 -0500 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts Miles Goosens wrote: >Didn't buy the Consonant album because I didn't like the first one that well (in fact, it recently was part of a gratifying 76-disc purge), but I have been very surprised to see so little said here about the new one, especially given the attention lavished on the first by Loud-Listers. I mean, even if it really bites in most Loud-Fans' opinions, I'd still expect a flood of "boy, I really was looking forward to that new Consonant record, but golly ned, it sure does blow" exclamations, but instead, silence. > > > I generally just review stuff on Tone and Groove, unless someone asks or a discussion is going on. I like it. I gave it a good review. I think it has more Burma-esque moments on it than the first one. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 12:39:26 -0800 (PST) From: zoom@muppetlabs.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts > Which is why, in principal, that I'm opposed to posting updates on these > sorts of polls. Instead of getting a true read for what people liked, > some of the post-update votes are going to be about other things, be they > doug's benevolent mission of getting representation for overlooked (so > far) stuff, or snarky stuff like trying to move something up or down the > standings. Since Aaron only gave us a list of albums rather than > standings, it at least avoided the latter problem. And to be fair to > Aaron, he was helpfully responding to Rog's request. I did post a link to Ice magazine's archives, several weeks ago. Anybody find that useful? Rog gets points for obscure 80's music, loses points for not remembering what records he bought this year. And for not wearing clothes. And while I realize that y'all *probably* just huddled muttering "Let's get Hamlin to post his Top Ten with that old 'resolved: new music sucks' trick" and Paul just happened to hoist the short straw...it worked. My 2003 Top Ten as of a few weeks ago looks something like this: 1. Kinski--AIRS ABOVE YOUR STATION 2. Richard Youngs--AIRS OF THE EAR 3. Erasure--OTHER PEOPLE'S SONGS 4. Fleetwood Mac--SAY YOU WILL 5. John Mellencamp--TROUBLE NO MORE 6. Venus Hum--BIG BEAUTIFUL SKY 7. White Stripes--ELEPHANT 8. Reverend Charlie Jackson--GOD'S GOT IT 9. Kathleen Edwards--FAILER 10. Boy--BOY bubbling under: Willie Nelson--CRAZY: THE DEMO SESSIONS; Ween, QUEBEC; Fountains of Wayne, WELCOME INTERSTATE MANAGERS I might switch a few things around before casting a ballot for Aaron. Worth noting that the Reverend Charlie Jackson album, while a new CD, collects 45s recorded in the 1970's. Meaning I guess I gotta quit caterwauling about Clash and New Pornographers release dates. Fogey commentary on the above eagerly anticipated. 'Specially since I've been waiting for Miles' commentary almost four months now. What else...Aaron covered the "resolved: rap music sucks" bit better than I could, with a heart closer to hiphop than mine's been for some time. Still wondering what a "hude trade-up" is, though, Andy 9) Arthur Moore, Security Service Individually Watermarked (Maverick) A letter accompanying this pre-release CD stated that for security reasons the object in question could not itself carry the information that 1) Arthur Moore was in fact Alanis Morissette, 2) Security Service was really an album titled So Called Chaos, 3) "By accepting this CD" one was agreeing not to copy it, play it in a computer, put it on the internet, lend it to anyone, or play it for anyone, and 4) that any such use of the object in question could somehow be traced. So I can't tell you anything about it. Or wouldn't be able to even if I had listened to it, which I was much too scared to do. - --Greil Marcus, from http://citypages.com/databank/25/1206/article11818.asp ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 14:58:24 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts At 12:39 PM 1/20/2004 -0800, zoom@muppetlabs.com wrote: >Rog gets points for obscure 80's music, loses points for not remembering >what records he bought this year. And for not wearing clothes. Speaking of the latter, did Sam Rockwell have something in his contract for CONFESSIONS OF A DANGEROUS MIND (just watched on DVD this weekend w/visiting sibs) that said "you will show my naked backside for no less than 20 minutes of screen time" or something? It seemed like a lot of those shots were really, really lingering, beyond necessity. The movie was O.K. but not exactly revelatory -- maybe worth a rental but I'm glad I didn't spring for an $9 evening ticket or a $6 matinee to see it. >Worth noting that the Reverend Charlie Jackson album, while a new CD, >collects 45s recorded in the 1970's. Meaning I guess I gotta quit >caterwauling about Clash and New Pornographers release dates. > >Fogey commentary on the above eagerly anticipated. 'Specially since I've >been waiting for Miles' commentary almost four months now. About... Charlie Jackson or Clash and New Pornographers release dates? Never heard the former; think that quibbling about LONDON CALLING and MASS ROMANTIC's release dates is silly. Or what? >Still wondering what a "hude trade-up" is, though, When you swap your timeshare in Oldenberg or Weser for one there. Google's translation service tells me that it's "ideal for your recovery seed vacation." later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 16:06:49 -0500 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts At 12:39 PM 1/20/2004 -0800, zoom@muppetlabs.com wrote: >9) Arthur Moore, Security Service Individually Watermarked (Maverick) A >letter accompanying this pre-release CD stated that for security reasons >the object in question could not itself carry the information that 1) >Arthur Moore was in fact Alanis Morissette, 2) Security Service was really >an album titled So Called Chaos, 3) "By accepting this CD" one was >agreeing not to copy it, play it in a computer, put it on the internet, >lend it to anyone, or play it for anyone, and 4) that any such use of the >object in question could somehow be traced. So I can't tell you anything >about it. Or wouldn't be able to even if I had listened to it, which I was >much too scared to do. > >--Greil Marcus, from http://citypages.com/databank/25/1206/article11818.asp Frankly, I'm with ol' Greil on this one. Every time I get a copy-protected CD from a label or publicity firm, especially these new ones that literally can't be played in a computer, the disc goes in the trash unheard and unreviewed. When I mentioned this to one of my promo contacts, her rather whiny and uncomprehending response was "Well, don't you have another CD player?" Well, yes. All told, there are about 8 CD players in this house. But that's not the point, is it? The point is that I don't appreciate being made to feel like a criminal when I have no intention of making their precious CDs available on any kind of illicit file-sharing network. I could just as easily move the jambox from the bedroom to my office and put it on my desk to listen while I write (where a $2 cord from Radio Shack allows me to make as many file copies of the CD as my hard drive can hold, which is what I do when I want to transfer something from a copy-protected CD onto my iPod), or I suppose I could break down and actually buy a new multi-disc changer to replace the mostly-dead and decade-old one in my rack system across the room. But given that for some reason the CDs I get like this are the ones I'm most likely to throw out anyway, this is just quicker. S ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 14:27:59 -0700 From: "Roger Winston" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts zoom@muppetlabs.com on 1/20/2004 1:39:26 PM wrote: > Rog gets points for obscure 80's music, loses points for not remembering > what records he bought this year. And for not wearing clothes. Just be thankful I didn't tell you about the Stewart Mason dream I had last night. (Damn you, Anton Barbeau!) Latre. --Rog ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 14:33:07 -0800 From: dc Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts on 1/20/04 10:18 AM, Roger Winston at rwinston@tde.com wrote: >>>> The Church - Forget Yourself >> >> There was a new Church album last year? > > Technically no - FORGET YOURSELF is due out today. Someone must've gotten an > advance copy. actually, the new album was released in Australia this past fall. the USA release -- with a three-song bonus disc in the first 7,500 copies -- is now slated for Feb. 4, with the tour in march. also, more unreleased material is promised via iTunes. doug c vicinity of seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 16:17:06 -0800 (PST) From: zoom@muppetlabs.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Outfogeyed by Genre-Conscious Extroverts > Speaking of the latter, did Sam Rockwell have something in his contract > for CONFESSIONS OF A DANGEROUS MIND (just watched on DVD this weekend > w/visiting sibs) that said "you will show my naked backside for no less > than 20 minutes of screen time" or something? Don't tell Miles about SOLARIS. Or, heaven absolutely forbid, THE SAME RIVER TWICE. >>Fogey commentary on the above eagerly anticipated. 'Specially since I've >>been waiting for Miles' commentary almost four months now. > > About... Charlie Jackson or Clash and New Pornographers release dates? > Never heard the former; think that quibbling about LONDON CALLING and MASS > ROMANTIC's release dates is silly. Or what? I crammed those thoughts together thoughtlessly. Last September, semi-resplendent in your fogeydom, you asked for recommendations on new albums. So I posted an earlier version of my Top Ten list. Awaiting your responses to those titles, or my more recent list, whichever. Silly? Well, the Clash bit could be resolved by the "where do I live?" standard. The New Pornographers can't make that claim. I'm pretty sure. Not to mention that 1980 is actually the last year of the seve--oh, you get my point. > When you swap your timeshare in Oldenberg or Weser for one there. > Google's translation service tells me that it's "ideal for your recovery > seed vacation." Claes Oldenburg made a huge soft condo? Andy Brain Sandwiches Still on Menu in Ind. Fri Jan 16, 3:15 AM ET Add U.S. National - AP to My Yahoo! By KIMBERLY HEFLING, Associated Press Writer EVANSVILLE, Ind. - Fear of mad cow disease hasn't kept Cecelia Coan from eating her beloved deep-fried cow-brain sandwiches. She's more concerned about cholesterol than suffering the brain-wasting disease found in a cow in Washington state last month. "I think I'll have hardening of the arteries before I have mad cow disease," said Coan, picking up a brain sandwich to go during her lunch hour this week. "This is better than snail, better than sushi, better than a lot of different delicacies." The brains, coated with egg, seasoning and flour, puff up when cooked. They are served hot, heaping outside the bun. The sandwiches trace their heritage to a time when immigrants to southern Indiana wasted little after arriving from Germany and Holland. Some families have their own recipes passed down through generations. Their time-honored delicacy now carries new dangers after a single cow was diagnosed with mad cow disease, or bovine spongiform encephalopathy, at a dairy farm in south-central Washington state. The case, announced Dec. 23, was the first in the United States. Since then, there's been little evidence of consumers turning away from beef, although humans risk developing a brain-wasting illness, variant Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease (news - web sites), if they eat contaminated beef products. Mad cow disease won't scare this crowd, said Coan, 40, a bank teller who likes her brain sandwich served with mustard and pickled onions. "You're going to die anyway. Either die happy or you die miserable. That's the German attitude, isn't it?" Coan said. The delicacy is served at German-heritage restaurants such as the Hilltop Inn, a former stagecoach stop in this Ohio River city that opened in 1837. The sandwiches are also popular at events such as Evansville's fall festival, where vendors typically sell out early. The sandwiches could become harder to find after the U.S. Department of Agriculture (news - web sites) banned the selling of brains of cattle older than 30 months. The 30-month cutoff is used because the incubation period for cattle to develop the disease ranges from months to many years, said Denise Derrer, spokeswoman for the Indiana State Board of Animal Health. Some meat suppliers have stopped selling the cow brains completely. Since they opened in 1916, butchers at Dewig Brothers Meats in Haubstadt, Ind., north of Evansville, saved the brains to sell for $1.50 to $2 a pound. The decision to halt such sales means customers will have to switch to pork brains, which are smaller and more difficult to cook, owner Tom Dewig said. Consumers, however, are not likely to taste the difference. "The taste is really carried in the batter," Dewig said. Brain-based dishes are not limited to Indiana. Across the Ohio River in Kentucky, squirrel brain served with fried eggs was once considered a rural delicacy. The popularity declined, however, after researchers found a possible link between eating squirrel brains and contracting mad cow. In California, cow brains are commonly sold as taco filling and called by their Spanish name, "sesos." In some Texas border towns, barbacoa, made from the cow's head and brain, is served during the holidays. It will take more than one case of mad cow disease, however, to keep Nick Morrow, a 45-year-old Indiana pipe-fitter, from eating the brain sandwiches he's enjoyed since childhood. Morrow talked friend Scott Moore into eating at the Hilltop Inn just so he could have one. Mad cow disease was far from his mind. "Well, I haven't won the lottery yet, so I don't figure I'll get that," Moore said as a hot brain sandwich sat on a plate before him. ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V4 #16 ******************************