From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V3 #338 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Thursday, November 20 2003 Volume 03 : Number 338 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] two queries [dmw ] Re: [loud-fans] Re: Like, oh my God! [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] [loud-fans] Weller, not necessarily better ["Rex.Broome" ] Re: [loud-fans] Godstuff [Chris Murtland ] Re: [loud-fans] Godstuff [Chris Murtland ] Re: [loud-fans] two queries [Steve Holtebeck ] Re: [loud-fans] two queries [John Cooper ] Re: [loud-fans] two queries [Dan Sallitt ] Re: [loud-fans] two queries [Miles Goosens ] Re: [loud-fans] two queries [John Cooper ] Re: [loud-fans] two queries [Steve Holtebeck ] Re: [loud-fans] two queries [Miles Goosens ] Re: [loud-fans] Godstuff [Jenny Grover ] Re: [loud-fans] Linux Music Player [Dave Walker ] Re: [loud-fans] Godstuff [Michael Bowen ] Re: [loud-fans] Linux Music Player ["Paul King" ] Re: [loud-fans] Questions for the Very Old Among Us [Gil Ray Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries On Tue, 18 Nov 2003, glenn mcdonald wrote: > > I came across the TREBLE IN TROUBLE EP for a good price > > There's no such thing as a "good" price for this or the first album, in > my opinion. Forget you ever heard it, and start over with _The Tyranny > of Distance_ or _Hearts of Oak_. I think that's a little strong, but I'm basically in agreement anyway. I think I've only listened to the green & yellow one once or twice. Oddly, I'd feel better about recommending Leo's work with Chisel over those first two solo efforts. The new EP, "Tell Balgeary, Balgury is Dead" or something like that, might be a good thing to try, as it has versions of songs from both Tyranny and Hearts. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 07:50:11 -0600 From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Like, oh my God! And then there's the chorus to Pavement's "Shady Lane": Oh my God oh my God oh my God oh my God Oh my God oh his God oh her God oh your God It's everybody's God, it's everybody's God It's everybody's God, it's everybody's God... ..Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: You can't imagine how hard it is to mail-order fifty red :: Maglites when you're a duck with no numeric street address :: --glenn mcdonald ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 11:19:48 -0800 (PST) From: Phil Fleming Subject: [loud-fans] oh my God... a painfully mainstream choice! Madonna - Like A Prayer Extreme - There Is No God Face To Face - The Devil You Know (God Is A Man) Flaming Lips - God Walks Among Us Now Shine On Sweet Jesus Phil F. NP: (in my head) The Fixx - "Are We Ourselves?" - --- Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > I'm putting together a mix CD featuring songs about > God - any god: pro or con, > blissfully devout or fumingly atheistic, doesn't > matter. I'm especially > interested in songs speaking from God's POV or > directly to God. > > There are, of course, a couple of exceedingly > obvious choices - but I suspect > there are many more I haven't thought of. Ideas? > > ..Jeff > > J e f f r e y N o r m a n > The Architectural Dance Society > http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ > :: "In two thousand years, they'll still be looking > for Elvis - > :: this is nothing new," said the priest. > > np: Jenny Toomey _Antidote_ - did we all rave about > this when it came out and I > missed it? Cuz we should have. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 11:42:45 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Mitton Subject: [loud-fans] Linux Music Player I'm in the process of converting from Windows to Linux for my home computer. One thing I'm not sure about yet is how good the music players/libraries are for Linux. I've tried one that came bundled with Red Hat, and I think it would have a hard time if I tried to dump several thousand files into its library. Are there any Linux users here with a music player to recommend? (For reference, in Windows I think Media Jukebox is far and away the best.) - --Michael ===== www.openoffice.org A free, full-featured office suite that replaces Microsoft Office, but is compatible with Office documents. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 11:48:11 -0800 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: [loud-fans] Weller, not necessarily better Jeffrey: >>Uh, didn't Killdozer cover "Kumbayah"? Guadalcanal Diary certainly did. Think it shows up on a Victoria Williams record, too. >>>>...damn, spacing on who it's by... Miles: >>The immortal Leather Nun, of course! Who were Swedish, obnoxious, and had a singer named Alquvist before the Hives were even born, for what it's worth. I love "Pink House" even though I also kinda like Mellencamp from about that same period. Now, "FFA", there's an interesting song that has less to do with the Future Farmers of American than you might think. >> I just remember several people insisting that I was completely wrong >>and that Weller sings exactly the same way now, which *amazed* me -- I >>mean, even when the Jam tackled R&B/Motown in covers ("Heatwave") or >>inspired-by originals ("Beat Surrender"), he still sounded like Paul Weller, >>but since he hung out his solo artist shingle, his voice has been 100% ersatz >>soul, like Rick Astley singing better material... Totally. I mean, you can tell it's the same guy, kind of. It's markedly different, though. Like Terry Hall then and now. >>Disc 1 of THE UPRIGHT CITIZENS BRIGADE: THE COMPLETE FIRST >>SEASON. Laughed ourselves to death, and "The Little Donny Foundation" is >>still waiting for us on Disc 2. I remember it as hit and miss, but damn, that Little Donny thing was funny. Most of their best stuff seemed to be borderline disturbing riffs on kids... there was also the one with the kid who could only say "shut up"... really well calibrated to keep reaching funny/uncomfortable peaks. Good stuff. I've probably forgotten a lot of the best bits. It was paired up with South Park in the early years, right? - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 13:51:35 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries At 08:32 AM 11/19/2003 -0500, dmw wrote: >On Tue, 18 Nov 2003, glenn mcdonald wrote: > >> > I came across the TREBLE IN TROUBLE EP for a good price >> >> There's no such thing as a "good" price for this or the first album, in >> my opinion. Forget you ever heard it, and start over with _The Tyranny >> of Distance_ or _Hearts of Oak_. > >I think that's a little strong, but I'm basically in agreement anyway. I >think I've only listened to the green & yellow one once or twice. > >The new EP, "Tell Balgeary, Balgury is Dead" or something like that, might >be a good thing to try, as it has versions of songs from both Tyranny and >Hearts. Duly noted. Thanks to glenn and doug for the advice! Next shopping adventure is probably something like Dec. 5th, so I'll take another shot at Leo then. Glad to know that the TREBLE EP might not be representative. later, Miles last played: still driving the rental car, so it's back to the cassette days before I got the current "real" car... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 17:35:27 -0500 From: Chris Murtland Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Godstuff A few more Flaming Lips entries: Jesus Smokin' Heroin Pilot at the Queer Can of God Plastic Jesus I was "Jesus Las Vegas" for Halloween one year. Unfortunately, I don't think anyone has redone "Viva Las Vegas" like that yet... murt ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 17:45:04 -0500 From: Chris Murtland Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Godstuff Oh, and I wouldn't know, but apparently heroin makes you "feel like Jesus' son" (according to Lou Reed). Maybe a companion volume can be about Jesus and smack? murt ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 14:44:34 -0800 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries dmw wrote: > On Tue, 18 Nov 2003, glenn mcdonald wrote: > > > > I came across the TREBLE IN TROUBLE EP for a good price > > > > There's no such thing as a "good" price for this or the first album, in > > my opinion. Forget you ever heard it, and start over with _The Tyranny > > of Distance_ or _Hearts of Oak_. > > I think that's a little strong, but I'm basically in agreement anyway. I > think I've only listened to the green & yellow one once or twice. Isn't TREBLE IN TREBLE the ep? That's the only Ted Leo I haven't heard yet, but I liked a couple of the songs when I heard them live ("Come Baby Come" I remembered). The Tej Leo Rx/PHARMACISTS album is pretty unlistenable though. I downloaded it for "free" from Emusic, way back when that service was unlimited, and still felt ripped off! > Oddly, I'd feel better about recommending Leo's work with Chisel over > those first two solo efforts. I'm really liking the final Chisel album SET YOU FREE, but it doesn't sound much like the two most recent Pharmacists albums. > The new EP, "Tell Balgeary, Balgury is Dead" or something like that, > might be a good thing to try, as it has versions of songs from both > Tyranny and Hearts. I don't think the ep has anything from TYRANNY (in fact I know it doesn't because I just played it earlier today!), but it has live-in-studio solo performances of a couple songs from HEARTS OF OAK ("The High Party" and "The Sword In The Stone") as well as the album version of the title track, a couple of new songs, and some cool covers - -- "Six Months In A Leaky Boat" by Split Enz, "Ghosts" by The Jam (aka Paul Weller When He Was Good), and "Dirty Old Town" by Ewan MacColl. Well worth 8 bucks. Speaking of Pauls in decline, Emusic now has the new Paul Westerberg album COME FEEL ME TREMBLE, for anyone still there who still cares. - -Steve ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 14:50:42 -0800 From: John Cooper Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries Maybe you didn't hear the Grandpaboy disc? STEREO didn't grab me, but MONO is a lot of fun. > From: Steve Holtebeck > Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 14:44:34 -0800 > To: quercian rosicrucian psychobabble > Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries > > Speaking of Pauls in decline, Emusic now has the new Paul Westerberg > album COME FEEL ME TREMBLE, for anyone still there who still cares. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 18:01:48 -0500 From: Dan Sallitt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries >>Speaking of Pauls in decline, Emusic now has the new Paul Westerberg >>album COME FEEL ME TREMBLE, for anyone still there who still cares. > Maybe you didn't hear the Grandpaboy disc? STEREO didn't grab me, but MONO > is a lot of fun. I actually liked STEREO a bit more, but I enjoyed them both. The trick may be getting your expectations in the right range. But "Only Lie Worth Telling" and "Let the Bad Times Roll" are nice, and "Mr. Rabbit" is even a little Mats-reminiscent. And MONO starts with a few nice songs, "High Time" and "I'll Do Anything." - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 17:00:18 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries At 02:50 PM 11/19/2003 -0800, John Cooper wrote: >Maybe you didn't hear the Grandpaboy disc? STEREO didn't grab me, but MONO >is a lot of fun. Ack! Perhaps the saddest thing I can say about Westerberg's solo career is this: all that buzz about the godawful mess that is MONO being his best stuff since the 'Mats was... an absolutely correct statement. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 15:21:14 -0800 From: John Cooper Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries > From: Miles Goosens > > At 02:50 PM 11/19/2003 -0800, John Cooper wrote: >> Maybe you didn't hear the Grandpaboy disc? STEREO didn't grab me, but MONO >> is a lot of fun. > > Ack! Perhaps the saddest thing I can say about Westerberg's solo career is > this: all that buzz about the godawful mess that is MONO being his best stuff > since the 'Mats was... an absolutely correct statement. Yeah, I guess it's a godawful mess compared to the pristine, orderly, and hi-fidelity body of work the Replacements put out. Huh. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 15:32:20 -0800 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries John Cooper wrote: > Maybe you didn't hear the Grandpaboy disc? STEREO didn't grab me, but > MONO is a lot of fun. I liked both STEREO and MONO, but after a listen and a half, COME FEEL ME TREMBLE is a lot of no fun. I was talking about the decline between the last album and this one, not the overall artistic decline. Miles: > Perhaps the saddest thing I can say about Westerberg's solo career is > this: all that buzz about the godawful mess that is MONO being his > best stuff since the 'Mats was... an absolutely correct statement. No it isn't. And "Answering Machine" isn't a throwaway track either! - -Steve ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 17:44:14 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] two queries The JDC, then me: >> Ack! Perhaps the saddest thing I can say about Westerberg's solo career is >> this: all that buzz about the godawful mess that is MONO being his best >stuff >> since the 'Mats was... an absolutely correct statement. > >Yeah, I guess it's a godawful mess compared to the pristine, orderly, and >hi-fidelity body of work the Replacements put out. Huh. I've already spent far too much of the list's time poking holes in the Myth of the 'Mats, to the point where you might not know that I liked the Replacements quite a bit. But IMO the Replacements albums that worked the best (most of HOOTENANNY, LET IT BE, and especially PLEASED TO MEET ME) were the ones that hitched the raw energy to the most coherent and consistent sets of tunes. MONO seems to equate "sloppy" with "good," just as Steve Albini's post-SURFER ROSA production work equates "sounds like crap" with "good" -- both of them mistaking a superficial characteristic of a lot of fine records as a guarantor of quality. Steve Holtebeck, remembering those earlier threads: >And "Answering Machine" isn't a throwaway track either! I've already said that I changed my mind about that. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 19:16:36 -0500 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Godstuff Chris Murtland wrote: >Oh, and I wouldn't know, but apparently heroin makes you "feel like >Jesus' son" (according to Lou Reed). > >Maybe a companion volume can be about Jesus and smack? > > Which reminds me, did anyone mention "Jesus and Tequila" by the Minutemen? Jen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 19:15:07 -0500 From: Dave Walker Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Linux Music Player On Nov 19, 2003, at 2:42 PM, Michael Mitton wrote: > Are there any Linux users here with a music player to recommend? > (For reference, in Windows I think Media Jukebox is far and away the > best.) Though I haven't personally used it, a friend whose judgement I trust recommends Madman ( http://madman.sourceforge.net/ ), which works as a frontend to XMMS. It's modeled after iTunes. -d.w. [demime 0.97c-p1 removed an attachment of type application/pkcs7-signature which had a name of smime.p7s] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 19:54:59 -0500 From: Michael Bowen Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Godstuff "God Loves A Drunk" - Richard Thompson "God Isn't Real" - Robbie Fulks ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 22:00:31 -0500 From: "Paul King" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Linux Music Player Freeamp (a WinAmp clone): http://shareware.about.com/library/linux/multimedia/bl_freeamp_linux_multimedia .htm There are several other possible links over Google. Use "freeamp linux" (no quotes) as the search string. Paul > I'm in the process of converting from Windows to Linux for my home > computer. One thing I'm not sure about yet is how good the music > players/libraries are for Linux. I've tried one that came bundled > with Red Hat, and I think it would have a hard time if I tried to > dump several thousand files into its library. > > Are there any Linux users here with a music player to recommend? > (For reference, in Windows I think Media Jukebox is far and away the > best.) > > --Michael > > ===== > www.openoffice.org > A free, full-featured office suite that replaces Microsoft Office, but is > compatible with Office documents. ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 19:11:28 -0800 (PST) From: Gil Ray Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Questions for the Very Old Among Us LOL! Funny, I just recently got one of the new re-issues (surrealistic Pillow)and that disc is gonna persuade me to get more. On a not so funny note, Spencer Dryden (their more noted drummer and also ex-City Hall Records Employee), just lost his house and everything in it due to a fire. He's a truly amazing guy with some of the best stories I have ever heard. His health is bad and now this...bummer, man. On a really bizarre note, remember a couple of weeks ago when I had 3 signs that the end is near (3 different bugs falling out of boxes etc. at work)? Well, in the last week we lost an ex-employee to death, a current employee to suicide (yet another tiny footnote in the San Fransico music scene-his name was Lance Dickerson and he played with tons of folk, most notable was Commander Cody), one of our oldest labels owner died (Bernie Brightman who was basically responsible for being one of the first to cash in on the sex,drugs = sales,Reefer Songs and Copulating Blues sorta stuff). 2 other artists that play heavily in our sales, Don Gibson (my very favorite C&W writer ever) and Speedy West (more or less invented the pedal steel guitar)died yesterday. I think my workplace should print up some t-shirts that say: "The Music Industry Isn't Dying - WE ARE!: Catchy eh? Gil - --- Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey < artisitjenor@uwm.edu> wrote: > It's okay, people other than Gil can read this too. > > I'd mentioned the song "Son of Jesus" by Jefferson > Airplane the other day - and > does anyone know if, anywhere, there's a > non-bowdlerized version? Every version > I've been able to find (including my copy, a > '70s-vintage LP) features a number > of edits: the initial consonant of "bastard" > swallowed a couple of times, an > obvious overdub creating the nonsensical line "so > you think young Jesus Christ > / > Never [smiled] a lady"; and the word "bastard" run > in reverse in its last > occurance just before the outchorus (that last being > a particularly sloppy > edit). > > It's obviously the religious content that scared off > RCA; the year before "up > against the wall motherfucker" presented no problems > (except in the lyric > sheet, > where the word "fred" was, rather amusingly, > substituted). > > ..Jeff > > J e f f r e y N o r m a n > The Architectural Dance Society > http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ > :: Solipsism is its own reward :: > > np: swap CD from Stef's (The Rival List) - actually, > the dear23 (Posies) list > swap: right now, Jay Bennett & Edward Burch > :: --Crow T. Robot __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 22:10:46 -0600 From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Questions for the Very Old Among Us Quoting Gil Ray : > LOL! Funny, I just recently got one of the new > re-issues (surrealistic Pillow)and that disc is gonna > persuade me to get more. I'd rank that one, Baxter's, and Volunteers as top-shelf. Crown and Takes Off are generally regarded as slightly lesser (I'd agree, esp. as Takes Off lacks Grace Slick, still one of the best female rock singers ever), while Bark and Long John Silver are generally regarded as crap. They're not - they're not in the same league as their best stuff, but there are a couple of good songs at least on each, esp. on LJS. Dunno about the live stuff; and was the stuff on that compilation deal w/the neon-green pterodactyl ever reissued? Jeff, who isn't really 58 with long gray ponytail and beard - but he got into JA at about age 12 or so and diligently collected...so much so that he actually owns LPs of Sunfighter, Blows Against the Empire, and Baron Von Tollbooth. Not Manhole though. Less said about any band with "Starship" in its name the better. Ceci n'est pas une .sig np: Abunai! _The Mystic River Sound_ ps for Aaron Mandel: good lord, I hope those aren't the *same* green shoes! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 00:51:11 -0500 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Questions for the Very Old Among Us At 10:10 PM 11/19/2003 -0600, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >I'd rank that one, Baxter's, and Volunteers as top-shelf. Crown and Takes Off >are generally regarded as slightly lesser (I'd agree, esp. as Takes Off lacks >Grace Slick, still one of the best female rock singers ever), while Bark and >Long John Silver are generally regarded as crap. I feel the urge to stick up for TAKES OFF, which I think is terribly underrated by JA fans for much the same reason that Stones fans tend to underrate SATANIC MAJESTIES: it doesn't sound like the stuff that made them famous. It's a fair cop, but that doesn't take into account that for what it is -- a straightforward 1966 folk-rock album -- it's really good, with very little filler and some fine songs. S ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 23:57:14 -0600 From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Questions for the Very Old Among Us Quoting Stewart Mason : > At 10:10 PM 11/19/2003 -0600, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > >I'd rank that one, Baxter's, and Volunteers as top-shelf. Crown and Takes > Off > >are generally regarded as slightly lesser (I'd agree, esp. as Takes Off > lacks > >Grace Slick, still one of the best female rock singers ever), while Bark > and > >Long John Silver are generally regarded as crap. > > I feel the urge to stick up for TAKES OFF, which I think is terribly > underrated by JA fans for much the same reason that Stones fans tend to > underrate SATANIC MAJESTIES: it doesn't sound like the stuff that made them > famous. It's a fair cop, but that doesn't take into account that for what > it is -- a straightforward 1966 folk-rock album -- it's really good, with > very little filler and some fine songs. I rather like most of _Satanic Majesties'..._ too. _Takes Off_ is a fine record - - just (as I said) not in the band's uppermost tier. ..Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: "In two thousand years, they'll still be looking for Elvis - :: this is nothing new," said the priest. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 01:02:39 -0500 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Questions for the Very Old Among Us At 11:57 PM 11/19/2003 -0600, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >I rather like most of _Satanic Majesties'..._ too. _Takes Off_ is a fine record >- just (as I said) not in the band's uppermost tier. That's cool. I would put it second behind AFTER BATHING AT BAXTER'S, myself. SURREALISTIC PILLOW has a couple of real dogs on it, whereas the weird shit on BAXTER'S is just so random and bizarre that it kind of becomes perversely fascinating. And frankly, not much after that interests me. Except I've always kinda liked "Miracles" for some reason. S ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 01:42:24 -0600 From: steve Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Questions for the Very Old Among Us On Nov 19, 2003, at 10:10 PM, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > and was the stuff on that compilation deal > w/the neon-green pterodactyl ever reissued? That would be Early Flight, out-of-print in the US, but not in Japan. As I've said before, I think Baxter's is horribly underrated when the best of lists are made. But I guess there must be *some* interest, as RCA has released most of the albums for the 3rd time on CD. - - Steve __________ Yokohama Kaidashi Kikou - http://ykk.misago.org/ ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V3 #338 *******************************