From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V3 #178 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Thursday, June 19 2003 Volume 03 : Number 178 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] various... [Roger Winston ] Re: [loud-fans] a list. [Dave Walker ] Re: [loud-fans] Black Lipstick? (ns) ["jer fairall" ] Re: [loud-fans] statistics, etc. (ns) ["jer fairall" ] Re: [loud-fans] a list. [Matthew Weber ] Re: [loud-fans] a list. [dmw ] Re: [loud-fans] various... [Jenny Grover ] Re: [loud-fans] various... ["Stefaan Hurts" ] Re: [loud-fans] various... [Jenny Grover ] Re: [loud-fans] various... ["Stefaan Hurts" ] Re: [loud-fans] statistics, etc. (ns) [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: [loud-fans] Black Lipstick? (ns) [Stewart Mason ] Re: [loud-fans] various... ["Joseph M. Mallon" ] Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present [Stewar] Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present [Aaron ] Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present ["Mich] Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present [Bill S] Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present [Miles ] Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present [Chris ] Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present [Miles ] Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present ["Jose] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 07:08:17 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] various... At Thursday 6/19/2003 01:15 AM -0400, Jenny Grover wrote: >I was attracted by the unexpected display of poppy seeds on the bagel's >cover, but had no idea what the actual contents would be like. I did, >however, jump to the conclusion, based on past bagel experience, that it >would be good with butter, and I was right, but butter was a pretty safe >choice. That's not a conclusion I would've jumped to. I have never, in my life, seen anyone put butter on a bagel, poppy seeds or no. >Safer than, say, lox, had it turned out to be a fruit bagel. Okay, yeah, that would be a little weird. What were we talking about again? Latre. --Rog ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 09:38:54 -0400 From: Dave Walker Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. On Thursday, June 19, 2003, at 12:37 AM, G. Andrew Hamlin wrote: > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > --------- > Ford/Wyoming Drive-In, Dearborn > This one is the world's largest drive-in, with NINE screens, rivaled in > number only by a drive-in in Arizona, I believe. Opened in 1950. > Screens 6 > through 9 were added in 1990. Screens 1-5 are open year-round. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > --------- This is our local drive-in. It's huge, all right, but weidrly broken down -- the in-car speakers date from the Eisenhower administration, and the drive-in itself is pockmarked with all these massive potholes that can swallow a car up. The traffic entering the complex on a summer weekend night is a marvel to behold, though. Paul King wrote: >> Journey (Santana) > > Hey, anyone remember that there was a video arcade game based on the > members of > Journey? This guy does: http://www.toastyfrog.com/features/drum_solo/03.shtml Check item 9 towards the bottom of the page. The full feature starts here: http://www.toastyfrog.com/features/drum_solo/01.shtml It's not finished yet, and yes, it's yet another "list", but this one works much better for me than the Pitchforkmedia one for a few reasons. It's obviously written by someone who has genuine affection for the stuff he's slagging, and it's leavened by some positive appraisals, too. (the sidebar) -d.w. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 10:35:39 -0400 From: "jer fairall" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Black Lipstick? (ns) Since I have you to thank for introducing me to this: > The Postal Service - Give Up And since you're right about these: > The New Pornographers - Electric Version > Salteens - Let Go Of Your Bad Days > Ted Leo - Hearts Of Oak I'd really like to know something about these: > Ad Frank - In Girl Trouble > Thermals - More Parts per Million > SM + Jicks - Pig Lib > Beans - Tomorrow Right Now Jer Help the planet each day! It's free and easy: http://www.Care2.com/dailyaction/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 12:47:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Black Lipstick? (ns) On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, jer fairall wrote: > I'd really like to know something about these: > > > Ad Frank - In Girl Trouble Boston songwriter, formerly of Miles Dethmuffen and Permafrost. I've never heard a record with production/accompaniment that really suits Ad's songs (I didn't become fanatical about him until I saw him play live) and this is no exception, but it's *close* -- the Boston-rock-fluffiness of his new band (The Fast Easy Women; all male, though they were in drag the first time I saw them) means he just can't spend too much time on downer songs, and the record moves along pretty briskly. Imagine a guy with a clear (acknowledged) debt to Mark Eitzel and Leonard Cohen but who also loves making fun of himself and a nice catchy chorus. Anyway, his writing just keeps getting better, which is the real reason I like this so much. At http://www.adfrank.com/mp3.html there are three songs from his *previous* record; if you like those, especially the more uptempo "Uhauls & Ryders", then you clearly need some Ad in your life, and this is a fine place to start. Stewart's also a big Ad fan, but I don't know what he thinks of IGT. > > Thermals - More Parts per Million Super lo-fi wimpy rock. Listen to "No Culture Icons" at the subpop.com mp3 page; if you want that to happen to you fifteen times in a row, buy the album. Otherwise, do not. (My first thought when I heard it was that it reminded me of early Destroyer but brasher, except that since I seem to be nearly alone in liking _City Of Daughters_ that may not help.) > > SM + Jicks - Pig Lib Sorry to be opaque; that's Stephen Malkmus's second solo album. I think it's the first good thing he's done in his more "mature" style (i.e. the contenders would be the last Pavement album and his two solo records). Reminds me of recent Built To Spill. (Critical consensus seems to be that that's because both of them are taking cues from 70s rockers whose music I don't really know.) > > Beans - Tomorrow Right Now One of the guys from Anti-Pop Consortium. APC are kind of the Radiohead of hip-hop for me -- they got rave reviews for their innovation while making records that I thought were totally ordinary, and then suddenly, they lunged deeply into electronic noises and started living up to the hype (in my opinion). Except that in the case of APC, they broke up just as they were getting good. Beans and producer Earl Blaize seem to have been the ones most interested in weirdness, and Tomorrow Right Now is an interesting bunch of beats that set off Beans's voice. http://www.sandboxautomatic.com/abstract/warp103.html On the other hand, I know a lot of people here don't especially like hip-hop, and it's probably not a good album to convert anyone, so consider that a qualified recommendation. a ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 12:49:26 -0400 From: Dan Schmidt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] statistics, etc. (ns) dana-boy@juno.com writes: | I've now seen several reviews of the new Fountains of Wayne album | that compare it to Ween and They Might Be Giants. I'm wondering | what the original source for this is, since it seems like an | unlikely comparison unless they *do* sound like Ween and TMBG on the | new one. Or maybe all funny bands sound alike. Judging from the number of people who compare my band to They Might Be Giants or assume that I must be a big Weird Al Yankovic fan, many people do think all funny bands do sound alike. Dan - -- http://www.dfan.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:02:19 -0400 (EDT) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. On Wed, 18 Jun 2003, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > Quoting dana-boy@juno.com: > > > np: Black Dice (Who wants to be in charge of explaining the distinction > > between Black Dice, Black Keys, Black Lipstick, etc. at the end of the > > year? I'm currently busy with my Unrest/Unwound/Unsane duties.) > > You forgot Dischord's Black Eyes... and the massively hyped Black Lips ...so, uh, i'm beginning to think that the context/no-context debate is starting to resmeble the nature/nurture debate. but i still think it's true that a lot of things are NOT context-dependent. assume for the sake or argument that chuck berry invented rock and roll. he did that in a context of blues and country conventions, but the result has demonstrable appeal to people w/o any awareness of the context in which Berry was working. all those people still have ears, and process auditory input with them in ranges roughly from 20hz to 20khz. and to Andy: yes, i really do think that a successful piece of work needs to communicte the parameters under which it is operating in some fashion. but that doesn't rule out the case in which one of the goals of a piece is to obfuscate its own goals -- i think that's pretty common across a broad spectrum of postmodern art. i'm all fulla cold medicine, so if this makes no sense, sorry in advance. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:08:48 -0400 From: "jer fairall" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] statistics, etc. (ns) > I've now seen several reviews of the new > Fountains of Wayne album that compare it to > Ween and They Might Be Giants. My review, sans Ween or TMBG comparisons (though the Beatles, Badfinger, Big Star, Green Day, Semisonic, Ivy, Oasis and Dan Bern are all referenced) is at: http://www.toneandgroove.com (Click "Core Samples" and scroll down) Jer np: New Pornographers, ELECTRIC VERSION (although I'm off to sample those bands that aaron was nice enough to answer my questions about and provide links to in a minute) Help the planet each day! It's free and easy: http://www.Care2.com/dailyaction/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:32:51 -0400 From: "Bill Carter" Subject: [loud-fans] Don Dixon Don Dixon, recently mentioned here, has a starring role in the movie "Camp", which will be released in LA and NY in late July, with wider distribution to follow. His bio from the cast notes: Don Dixon (BERT) Don Dixon has devoted his entire life to popular song. Whether working as a singer, songwriter, musician or producer, he has always tried to capture the essence of the moment. As a solo artist, Dixon has released eight albums, toured all over the US and Europe and written songs recorded by Joe Cocker, Counting Crows, Hootie and the Blowfish, Marti Jones, Ronnie Spector, and Marshall Crenshaw, just to name a few. As producer, he's recorded albums for Kim Carnes, Hootie and the Blowfish, REM,The Smithereens, and Matthew Sweet, among others. As a musician, he has appeared on recordings by Mary Chapin Carpenter and dozens more. Now in his fifties, Dixon continues to write, perform, and produce. The film is a comedy about summer drama camps, and looks like a vastly-improved, 21st century "Fame". (E.g. In "Fame", only one boy at New York High School for the Performing Arts was gay. In "Camp", that sort of gets reversed. Oh, and there's a cameo by Stephen Sondheim.) http://www.ifcfilms.com/0,,CAT0-3127-CAT1-3706-CLR-red-BCLR-CC0000-SHID-19203 - -,00.html A hit at Sundance. Pretty much universal raves on Rotten Tomato. The trailer is sweet and very funny. Regards, Bill Carter ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 10:38:39 -0700 From: Matthew Weber Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. At 01:02 PM 6/19/2003 -0400, dmw wrote: >assume for the sake or argument that chuck berry invented rock and roll. > >he did that in a context of blues and country conventions, but the result >has demonstrable appeal to people w/o any awareness of the context in >which Berry was working. A kid who's 15 years old today might not have any awareness of Berry's context, but he has awareness of a "backward context"--in other words, things which were influenced by Berry and are still heard today. Maybe he hasn't heard Berry, but he's heard the Beatles, or maybe Elvis, and can relate Chuck Berry to that. Concert music is, I think, a bit of a special case, because quite a few people grow up never having heard enough of it for it to become familiar. >all those people still have ears, and process auditory input with them in >ranges roughly from 20hz to 20khz. Yes, but you need to be taught how to hear music, just as you need to be taught how to process the visual information contained in a film or painting. I think McLuhan had some interesting things to say about this (in UNDERSTANDING MEDIA, for example). The fact that the process by which we interpret these media has become invisible and second nature to us doesn't mean it's innate. Matthew Weber Curatorial Assistant Music Library University of California, Berkeley My heart was hot within me, while I was musing the fire burned. The Holy Bible (The Old Testament): _The Book of Psalms_ 39:3 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:55:43 -0400 (EDT) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Matthew Weber wrote: > At 01:02 PM 6/19/2003 -0400, dmw wrote: > > >assume for the sake or argument that chuck berry invented rock and roll. > > > >he did that in a context of blues and country conventions, but the result > >has demonstrable appeal to people w/o any awareness of the context in > >which Berry was working. > > A kid who's 15 years old today might not have any awareness of Berry's > context, but he has awareness of a "backward context"--in other words, > things which were influenced by Berry and are still heard today. Maybe he > hasn't heard Berry, but he's heard the Beatles, or maybe Elvis, and can > relate Chuck Berry to that. Concert music is, I think, a bit of a special > case, because quite a few people grow up never having heard enough of it > for it to become familiar. well, actually, i was thinking of my ex-lead-guitarist's kid, who is about 2 aand was gravitating to the cash's "jackson" and berry's "maybelline" before he could talk. this is why i think the debate goes ad absurdum if pushed too far -- you certainly the tyke has no formal frame of reference for the first stuff he hears and while i have to concede that there is an informal frame of reference, the parameters under which it operates are so arcane (probably having more to do with unconscious approval cues on the part of the parents than anything else) that i really think you might as well just say "he likes it" > Yes, but you need to be taught how to hear music, just as you need to be > taught how to process the visual information contained in a film or > painting. I think McLuhan had some interesting things to say about this > (in UNDERSTANDING MEDIA, for example). The fact that the process by which > we interpret these media has become invisible and second nature to us > doesn't mean it's innate. but ultimately the process still has to START from zero somewhere, doesn't it? if the process for interpreting the first cave painting wasn't innate, who did it arise? i have not read McLuhan, but I think Pinker, Chomsky and Dawkins have some interesting things to say on that subject (although please no one take that as a wholesale endorsement of any of 'em) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:44:21 -0400 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] various... Roger Winston wrote: > That's not a conclusion I would've jumped to. I have never, in my > life, seen anyone put butter on a bagel, poppy seeds or no. Really? Of course, I only do that if I split and toast it in the toaster (which I did yesterday), or warm it in the microwave. Cold, that would be kinda gross, but I almost never eat a bagel cold. I don't have any cream cheese. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:53:56 -0400 From: "Stefaan Hurts" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] various... On Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:44:21 -0400, "Jenny Grover" said: > I don't have any cream cheese. Wait, I thought this was a mailing list, not a grocery list. :) - -- http://www.fastmail.fm - Accessible with your email software or over the web ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:01:38 -0400 From: Jenny Grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] various... Stefaan Hurts wrote: >On Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:44:21 -0400, "Jenny Grover" said: > > >>I don't have any cream cheese. >> >> > >Wait, I thought this was a mailing list, not a grocery list. :) > > You have expectations based on context? Jen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:19:06 -0400 From: "Stefaan Hurts" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] various... On Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:01:38 -0400, "Jenny Grover" said: > You have expectations based on context? Nah, don't wanna come off as pretenshioush. ;) - -- http://www.fastmail.fm - I mean, what is it about a decent email service? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:14:14 -0500 From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] statistics, etc. (ns) Quoting Dan Schmidt : > Judging from the number of people who compare my band to They Might Be > Giants or assume that I must be a big Weird Al Yankovic fan, many > people do think all funny bands do sound alike. And all bands with female singers can only sound like other bands with female singers. And all-female bands can only sound like other all-female bands. ..Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html :: Solipsism is its own reward :: :: --Crow T. Robot ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 16:16:59 -0400 From: "Aaron Milenski" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] statistics, etc. (ns) > > Judging from the number of people who compare my band to They Might Be > > Giants or assume that I must be a big Weird Al Yankovic fan, many > > people do think all funny bands do sound alike. >And all bands with female singers can only sound like other bands with >female singers. And all-female bands can only sound like other all-female >bands. And white basketball players can only be compared to white basketball players. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:18:55 -0700 From: "Michael Zwirn" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] statistics, etc. (ns) > And all bands with female singers can only sound like other bands with > female singers. And all-female bands can only sound like other all-female bands. Except The Organ, from British Columbia. They sound like the Smiths. (ref. my experience watching them open for New Pornographers and Cinerama last week). ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:24:34 -0500 From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. Quoting dmw : > well, actually, i was thinking of my ex-lead-guitarist's kid, who is > about > 2 aand was gravitating to the cash's "jackson" and berry's "maybelline" > before he could talk. > > this is why i think the debate goes ad absurdum if pushed too far Exactly... [this is Matt:] > Yes, but you need to be taught how to hear music, just as you need to > be > > taught how to process the visual information contained in a film or > > painting. I think McLuhan had some interesting things to say about > this > > (in UNDERSTANDING MEDIA, for example). The fact that the process by > which > > we interpret these media has become invisible and second nature to us > > doesn't mean it's innate. > who did it arise? i have not read McLuhan, but I think Pinker, Chomsky > and Dawkins have some interesting things to say on that subject > (although please no one take that as a wholesale endorsement We've moved a long way from "the Pitchfork guy just doesn't get Birdsongs of the Mesozoic": it's probably helpful to return to that point, and note that the idea was that music is an inherently self-referential system, a language of sorts, and the better we know its language (or any particular dialect), the likelier we are to get (if not like, or appreciate) what any particular piece of music is doing. That's not to say (and here's where this actually does tie in to Pinker, et al.) that perhaps some elements of musical appeal are not culturally universal and effectively inbuilt. Rhythm, I suppose, is an obvious contender - and didn't I read that Bartok (him again!) or someone (Kodaly, maybe?) did a study of European folk music and noted that the children's mocking song (nyah nyah nyah-nyah nyah - uh and there's a part in _Le sacre du printemps_ that sounds exactly like it...) was all but universal in rhythm and general pitch relations? So the two-year-old kid, like lots of two-year-olds, likes certain aspects of music. The difference between that, and being able to write a quality review of a Birdsongs CD, is rather vast - rather like that between an infant who responds to the sound of its mother's voice and someone translating Farsi into English at a UN meeting. ..Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html :: I suspect that the first dictator of this country will be called "Coach" :: --William Gass ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 16:28:33 -0400 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Black Lipstick? (ns) At 12:47 PM 6/19/2003 -0400, Aaron Mandel wrote: >On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, jer fairall wrote: > >> I'd really like to know something about these: >> >> > Ad Frank - In Girl Trouble > >Stewart's also a big Ad fan, but I don't know what he thinks of IGT. I actually haven't gotten around to buying this yet! I've put myself on something of a one-man austerity campaign recently, which has dropped my CD purchases to levels not seen in years. I hear very good things, though, and I see no reason why it wouldn't be a good starter purchase. If not that, I recommend MR. FANCYPANTS over his solo debut AD FRANK (aka "My Boyfriend Is Gay," a title that doesn't actually appear on the album); although AD FRANK does have my two favorite solo Ad songs, "You May Already Be A Winner" (and its remix doppelganger "You May Already Be A Whiner") and the absolutely dead-on-perfect "Postpunk At Cambridgeside Mall," it's a really uneven record that's also sequenced very strangely. >> > Thermals - More Parts per Million > >Super lo-fi wimpy rock. Listen to "No Culture Icons" at the subpop.com mp3 >page; if you want that to happen to you fifteen times in a row, buy the >album. Otherwise, do not. (My first thought when I heard it was that it >reminded me of early Destroyer but brasher, except that since I seem to be >nearly alone in liking _City Of Daughters_ that may not help.) What's a good Destroyer record to start with? I like the few songs I've heard, and I like Dan Bejar's contributions to the New Pornographers, but I hear the albums are a varied lot in both style and quality. S ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:37:47 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present I sent this yesterday, but I'm guessing it bounced, so I changed a few words here and there (hence the asterisk in the topic line) to avoid majordomo's safeguards. Aaron Mandel's earlier post has already answered my questions about the stuff I didn't know from his list, but I'll send my original post in its entirety again. Because I'm lazy, that's why! ================ At 04:57 PM 6/18/2003 -0400, Aaron Mandel wrote: >My first-half top n is pretty easy: > >The Postal Service - Give Up >The New Pornographers - Electric Version >Ad Frank - In Girl Trouble >Salteens - Let Go Of Your Bad Days >Ted Leo - Hearts Of Oak >Cat Power - You Are Free >Cursive - The Ugly Organ >Thermals - More Parts per Million >SM + Jicks - Pig Lib >Cobra Verde - Easy Listening >Beans - Tomorrow Right Now I guess my ossification process has been underway for nigh on 15 years now, but this has to be an all-time high: Out of Aaron's ten, I own one (New Pornographers), wouldn't get close to two (Malkmus, Cat Power), have heard a previous thing by one of them (an earlier Salteens courtesy of Mr. Bartlett), recognize the names of two others (the Postal Service, Cobra Verde), and know nothing about the others. My music purchases have been running about 4:1 in favor of 1977-90 vs. anything with a later date. While I've found it very fulfilling to fill in a lot of blanks in my collection, I feel less and less a part of the present, and would like to remedy that if possible. Anyone want to fill in some of these blanks for me, or make further present-minded recommendations? Also, just for the heck of it, here's the top 25 for the week of 6/2 - 6/8 at Grimey's, Nashville's coolest record store. 1. Radiohead - There There CD single 2. Broken Social Scene - You Forgot It In People 3. Yo La Tengo - Summer Sun 4. Gillian Welch - Soul Journey 5. Four Tet - Rounds 6. Eisley - Laughing City 7. Yeah Yeah Yeahs - Fever To Tell 8. The Thorns - The Thorns 9. Flaming Lips - Fight Test EP 10. The White Stripes - Elephant 11. Pinback - Offcell EP 12. Richard Thompson - The Old Kit Bag 13. Richard Thompson - Tracks EP 14. Legendary Shack Shakers - Cockadoodledon't 15. Pernice Brothers - Yours Mine & Ours 16. V/A - Yes New York 17. +/- (Plus/Minus) - Holding Pattern EP 18. Wire - Send 19. Goldfrapp - Black Cherry 20. Lone Official - Lone Official (self released from Nashville) 21. Athlete - Vehicles & Animals (import) 22. My Morning Jacket - At Dawn 23. Josh Rouse - Under Cold Blue Stars 24. Shuggie Otis - Inspiration Information 25. Beulah - The Coast Is Never Clear OK, I don't need any help with 1, 3, 4, 9, 10, 12, 13, 15, 18, 23, or 25. In an off-list message, Glen Sarvady just mentioned Broken Social Scene to me as a must have, but that's the first I've heard of them. Haven't heard the Yeah Yeah Yeahs yet, and am getting a little weary of similarly hyped "fast/retro" bands, but I'm willing to try, I guess. Goldfrapp was recommended to me a couple of years ago by a friend from the Roxy Music list, and the one I bought then didn't grab me, though I hear the new one is less meandering and more song-focused. As for the rest, I'm more clueless than usual. I think I already posted my half-year list, to which I'd add only Glossary's new one, HOW WE HANDLE OUR MIDNIGHTS, but if I didn't, let me know and I'll send again. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:38:08 -0500 From: Chris Prew Subject: Re: [loud-fans] statistics, etc. (ns) On Thursday, June 19, 2003, at 03:18 PM, Michael Zwirn wrote: >> And all bands with female singers can only sound like other bands with >> female singers. And all-female bands can only sound like other >> all-female > bands. > > Except The Organ, from British Columbia. They sound like the Smiths. > > (ref. my experience watching them open for New Pornographers and > Cinerama > last week). > > The Smiths, of course, being the all-male band most likely to be confused with an all-female band. Let's Active had female members, so they don't count. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:41:53 -0700 (PDT) From: "Joseph M. Mallon" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] various... On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Roger Winston wrote: > That's not a conclusion I would've jumped to. I have never, in my life, > seen anyone put butter on a bagel, poppy seeds or no. I, like Jen, put butter on bagels, most times after splitting them and heating them in a microwave. This, in itself, does not make me evil. Joe Mallon jmmallon@joescafe.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 16:43:51 -0400 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present At 03:37 PM 6/19/2003 -0500, Miles Goosens wrote: >Haven't heard the Yeah Yeah Yeahs yet, and am getting a little weary >of similarly hyped "fast/retro" bands, but I'm willing to try, I guess. The Yeah Yeah Yeahs don't really sound like what I think you probably mean by "fast/retro" bands, if by that you mean Strokes/Hives/etc. The PR kit has caused many clueless folks to compare them to Teenage Jesus and the Jerks, which is utterly specious. Charity, who had never heard of the band and was unaware of the hype, nailed them perfectly when we saw them on Conan a few weeks ago: They're Siouxsie and the Banshees (JUJU-era) plus the guitarist from Naked Raygun. S ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 16:56:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Miles Goosens wrote: > I guess my ossification process has been underway for nigh on 15 years > now, but this has to be an all-time high: Out of Aaron's ten, I own one > (New Pornographers), wouldn't get close to two (Malkmus, Cat Power), I'll mention briefly that Cat Power had always grated on my nerves before (though I liked "Metal Heart" off the last proper album) -- had eMusic not exposed me to this one I would never have believed how good it was. But she still sounds essentially the *same*, so I don't know... if Matador still has an mp3 of "He War" on their website (and especially if, like me, you find that musicians you used to find annoying have a way of suddenly becoming compelling), you might check it out. > recognize the names of two others (the Postal Service, Cobra Verde), The Postal Service are the guy from Death Cab For Cutie and the guy from an obscure electronica outfit called Dntel. They don't sound like New Order, not particularly, but they keep reminding me of NO somehow, right down to odd coincidences like having an "I like this song, but what does it have to do with President Kennedy?" song. Cobra Verde are most of Death Of Samantha (or used to be -- maybe they've turned over some personnel; singer John Petkovic is still in front, though) and they bear the same relationship to sleaziness that the New Pornographers do to archness. I've liked CV before, but never gotten really excited about any of their records. This one, though, wow. Take out the two weak tracks and you have something capable of making me curl my upper lip in an uncharacteristicly saucy sneer for half an hour straight while I sing along. > 5. Four Tet - Rounds Intriguing "organic electronica" with lots of sonic variation, but it didn't get past my thing about needing vocals in almost everything I listen to, even if I can't make out the lyrics. He apparently produced half of a song-based album by someone called Dempsey, which I asked a local record store to order for me. Fingers crossed. a ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:01:03 -0700 From: "Michael Zwirn" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present > I'll mention briefly that Cat Power had always grated on my nerves before > (though I liked "Metal Heart" off the last proper album) -- had eMusic not > exposed me to this one I would never have believed how good it was. But > she still sounds essentially the *same*, so I don't know... if Matador > still has an mp3 of "He War" on their website (and especially if, like me, > you find that musicians you used to find annoying have a way of suddenly > becoming compelling), you might check it out. > I thought that was a good single, by the way, and I'm not a Cat Power fan although I liked parts of the covers album. l.p. Michael Penn, March, in advance of the concert tonight ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 16:01:12 -0500 From: Bill Silvers Subject: Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present Miles writes: >Also, just for the heck of it, here's the top 25 for the week of 6/2 - 6/8 >at Grimey's, Nashville's coolest record store. > >1. Radiohead - There There CD single >2. Broken Social Scene - You Forgot It In People >3. Yo La Tengo - Summer Sun >4. Gillian Welch - Soul Journey >5. Four Tet - Rounds >6. Eisley - Laughing City >7. Yeah Yeah Yeahs - Fever To Tell >8. The Thorns - The Thorns >9. Flaming Lips - Fight Test EP >10. The White Stripes - Elephant >11. Pinback - Offcell EP >12. Richard Thompson - The Old Kit Bag >13. Richard Thompson - Tracks EP >14. Legendary Shack Shakers - Cockadoodledon't >15. Pernice Brothers - Yours Mine & Ours >16. V/A - Yes New York >17. +/- (Plus/Minus) - Holding Pattern EP >18. Wire - Send >19. Goldfrapp - Black Cherry >20. Lone Official - Lone Official (self released from Nashville) >21. Athlete - Vehicles & Animals (import) >22. My Morning Jacket - At Dawn >23. Josh Rouse - Under Cold Blue Stars >24. Shuggie Otis - Inspiration Information >25. Beulah - The Coast Is Never Clear > >OK, I don't need any help with 1, 3, 4, 9, 10, 12, 13, 15, 18, 23, or 25. Or #8 either, I'm guessing. I've yet to find anybody who can do better than "damned by faint praise" on the thing, but maybe it's the company I keep. A blurb from a reliable source on #14 (I haven't heard 'em yet): >The Legendary Shack Shakers - Cockadoodledon't (Bloodshot) >This Nashville band debuts with a scorching set of raw roots-rock, >combining feral rock energy with gutbucket blues and rockabilly along with >some bluegrass.-Don Yates Nashville? Maybe you do need to get out more, Miles. I'm pretty sure that I haven't listed my favorites so far this year here, so in no particular order they'd include three "last year" records- Nada Surf LET GO Supergrass LIFE ON OTHER PLANETS The Libertines UP THE BRACKET and so far after just a couple of distracted listens, thumbs way up for The Exploding Hearts GUITAR ROMANTIC. And of course, Fountains of Wayne WELCOME INTERSTATE MANAGERS. I know you raced out to grab that one. I wish I could join in the chorus for the new New Porno disc (The early favorite for loud-list record of the year?). It's an improvement over the debut but still just entirely too busy for its own good, or more likely just my tastes. Yeah, why am I here? Roots-wise- Caitlin Cary I'M STAYING OUT A/The (other) Scott Miller UPSIDE/DOWNSIDE Rhonda Vincent ONE STEP AHEAD Lynn Morris SHAPE OF A TEAR Richard Thompson THE OLD KIT BAG b.s. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 16:10:00 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present At 04:43 PM 6/19/2003 -0400, Stewart Mason wrote: >At 03:37 PM 6/19/2003 -0500, Miles Goosens wrote: >>Haven't heard the Yeah Yeah Yeahs yet, and am getting a little weary >>of similarly hyped "fast/retro" bands, but I'm willing to try, I guess. > >The Yeah Yeah Yeahs don't really sound like what I think you probably mean >by "fast/retro" bands, if by that you mean Strokes/Hives/etc. It is, though I would have thrown Hot Hot Heat's more nuevo wavo stylings into the "fast/retro" camp too. Of course, after the soft pop '90s, even the Sabbath catalog might seem fast by comparison. >The PR kit >has caused many clueless folks to compare them to Teenage Jesus and the >Jerks, which is utterly specious. Charity, who had never heard of the band >and was unaware of the hype, nailed them perfectly when we saw them on >Conan a few weeks ago: They're Siouxsie and the Banshees (JUJU-era) plus >the guitarist from Naked Raygun. That doesn't sound too bad to me, and potentially very enjoyable! Thanks, Stewart (and Charity)... Speaking of specious comparisons, everything I could read about Nadine said "Neil Young" -- not an insult or anything, mind you -- but when I saw them live last night, it was only one element in an original mix of influences, and they sounded a lot more like latter-day Dream Syndicate/latter-day Steve Wynn or SUMMERTEETH. American music for sure, but largely unclassifiable, and I'd think fans of Wilco or Wynn would be right at home. Both Nadine and Glossary were very, very good. Public kudos to Bill Silvers and Tom Krueger for the Nadine recommendations. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 16:14:31 -0500 From: Chris Prew Subject: Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present >> 5. Four Tet - Rounds > > Intriguing "organic electronica" with lots of sonic variation, but it > didn't get past my thing about needing vocals in almost everything I > listen to, even if I can't make out the lyrics. He apparently produced > half of a song-based album by someone called Dempsey, which I asked a > local record store to order for me. Fingers crossed. > Four Tet is one of the guys from Fridge, the UK post rock outfit. Fridge walks the line between guitar-based post rock and electronica pretty closely, and "organic electronica" is an extremely good description of Four Tet. Electronica leaves me pretty cold, but I like Four Tet. Fans of either genre should give either of these acts a chance. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 16:29:55 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present At 04:01 PM 6/19/2003 -0500, Bill Silvers wrote: >Or #8 either, I'm guessing. I've yet to find anybody who can do better than >"damned by faint praise" on the thing, but maybe it's the company I keep. Oh wait, I momentarily forgot who the members of the Thorns are. Haven't heard the album yet, though. >A blurb from a reliable source on #14 (I haven't heard 'em yet): > >>The Legendary Shack Shakers - Cockadoodledon't (Bloodshot) >>This Nashville band debuts with a scorching set of raw roots-rock, >>combining feral rock energy with gutbucket blues and rockabilly along with >>some bluegrass.-Don Yates > >Nashville? Maybe you do need to get out more, Miles. I'm finding that sleep is a pretty good thing to have, especially during the work week. :-) Actually, now that my memory's jarred, I recall Jason Ringenberg having good things to say about the Legendary Shack Shakers. >And of course, Fountains of Wayne WELCOME INTERSTATE MANAGERS. I know you >raced out to grab that one. ...and smash it in two? Go to their show here in a few weeks and throw it at them? Sell it to Andy Hamlin with a slight markup? later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:37:34 -0700 (PDT) From: "Joseph M. Mallon" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] h*lp me remain tenuously connected to the present On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Chris Prew wrote: > Four Tet is one of the guys from Fridge, the UK post rock outfit. > Fridge walks the line between guitar-based post rock and electronica > pretty closely, and "organic electronica" is an extremely good > description of Four Tet. Electronica leaves me pretty cold, but I like > Four Tet. Fans of either genre should give either of these acts a > chance. My favorite use of the word "electronica" was by Our Scott at the last Seattle LF show. Alison's keyboard starting malfunctioning, and Scott told the audience, "Sorry, the electronica seems to be broken." It snapped back into shape, and everything went on as planned. On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Miles Goosens wrote: > At 04:01 PM 6/19/2003 -0500, Bill Silvers wrote: > >Or #8 either, I'm guessing. I've yet to find anybody who can do better than > >"damned by faint praise" on the thing, but maybe it's the company I keep. > > Oh wait, I momentarily forgot who the members of the Thorns are. > Haven't heard the album yet, though. Matthew Sweet, Pete Droge, and Shawn Mullens. If you liked Ambrosia in the late '70s-early 80's ca. "How Much I Feel", The Thorns are your thing. Joe Mallon jmmallon@joescafe.com ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V3 #178 *******************************