From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V3 #175 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Wednesday, June 18 2003 Volume 03 : Number 175 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] a list. [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] [loud-fans] treatment of cold advice [Gil Ray ] Re: [loud-fans] a list. [dana-boy@juno.com] [loud-fans] another link, for bibliophiles ["me" ] Re: [loud-fans] a list. [Stewart Mason ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:54:34 -0500 From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. Quoting Jenny Grover : > Aaron Mandel wrote: > > >On the third hand, if he got his facts wrong maybe it means he just > came > >to it blind expecting a Mission Of Burma album and was disappointed, > end of story. > > That's a common bad habit, among both critics and fans. They tend to > bring too many expectations into listening to a side project. A side > project should be taken at face value, for purposes of critique, and not > judged on the basis of what the members did in another band. If it's > good for what it is, that's good. If it's crap, it's crap. But that > opinion should be arrived at irrespective of who the band members are or > what they have done in other bands. Minor note: the article's not talking about "side projects," which to me designate works by members of bands put out while the band still exists, but successor acts. Anyway, I agree about 85% with your point. The 15% comes from this: what a musician has done is part of who they are. Let's put it this way: a first release comes out, and 50% of its tracks are quite good, 30% are interesting but somewhat failing experiments, and 20% just don't work. As someone's first album, that's doing pretty well, and you sorta hope that that 20% will be weeded out, the 30% improved, and the 50% built upon for future releases. But if Joe Veteran starts a new act and its first recording has a similar percentage, it's reasonable to say, "you think he would have learned by now that that stuff just doesn't work" regarding the 20%, and have less tolerance for the 30% that sorta works. I dunno - some other day I'd probably completely disagree w/what I just wrote. An interesting sidebar might have explored the situation of recordings by artists who were once in other bands, but whose current project is extremely distant musically from that former band's material. I was just thinking of an example the other day - you know, "you'd never guess from this insectoid IDM that the guy used to be a heavy metal vocalist" - but now I can't think who I was thinking of. One more note on the Pitchfork article: I need to designate a special bazooka for idiots who haul out the tired (and misogynist) "Yoko broke up the Beatles" canard. Why anyone would expect a group of men in their thirties to relate together the same way they did as a bunch of teens is beyond me - the Beatles would have broken up (*did* break up - if Ringo leaving, then returning, counts) by that time regardless of Yoko. Oh - and the first Brix-period Fall includes several of my favorite records by that band. So there. ..Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html :: "am I being self-referential?" np: The Yoko Bazooka - my new noisepop act (I'm also in a postrock metal band called Stop! My Ass Is on Fire! - the Fegmaniax among us will know about that one already) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 20:18:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Gil Ray Subject: [loud-fans] treatment of cold advice As bad as I treat this old body of mine, I hardly ever get sick. Don't know why, just don't, so when this cold or flu or monkey-sars got me, it got me good.My wife and I like to treat stuff like this in it's earliest stages with echinacea. We get the liquid stuff and put a dropper or 2 down the old gullet. Never do this if there is mold forming around the top of the dropper. Cured my ticks, tho... Gil __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:25:23 -0400 From: dana-boy@juno.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. > I really dislike "pretentious" in critic-speak as well - thanks for > pointing > this out. Just the other day, I was reading an annoying article in > _Magnet_ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You really need to see it in the flesh to grasp the full horror, but my current pick for most amusingly bad writing in a glossy music magazine would be Ghetto Blaster (published from the upper west side of nyc, but hey dude, it gets rough in some parts of the upper west side, so don't think we're pussies). Unfortunately, their website only provides a taster, but it's worth checking out (for some reason it's very slow to load on my computer): http://www.ghettoblastermagazine.com/mainpage.htm In summarizing, let me just finish by saying that once in a while there comes along a magazine that combines rock hard attitude, and Ghetto Blaster is that 'zine. Oh, fuck it, I don't know what I'm saying. Just buy it and check it out for yourselves. - --dana (a sample from the website, though hardly Mr. Ugarte's best) PILOT TO GUNNER - GAMES AT HIGH SPEEDS Originally released on Gern Blandsten, Pilot To Gunner comes to you from...Jersey? Yeah, it is surprising. The story of 'local band does good' can be summed up with Pilot To Gunner's debut Games At High Speeds, an album chock full o' goodness. The quartet making up Pilot To Gunner (S.B. Padden, P. Hegarty, K.L. Herrmann and M. McLoughlin) are on a hyped up sugar rush throughout these post-punk driven songs. Given they've been honing their skill playing week after week in local bars but they've also released a slew of singles to help their sound progress. Critics may inadvertently pan the group based on a simple comparison: Braid anyone? Early Afghan Whigs guitar-like assaults? Ok so stylistically maybe there are a few similarities but can talent be duplicated? No, nor can it be duplicated. Nothing gets buried in the mix; guitars are as crisp as a fresh bag of Ruffles, the rhythm section is tightly wound along with vocals that keep the momentum's stride with harmonies and melodies throughout Games At High Speeds. Pilot To Gunner has a firm grasp and knowledge of timing, structure, dynamics and...and...hell, just give them their props for being able to produce one captivating album from beginning to end. (Arena Rock Recording Co.) - Eddie Ugarte ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 20:44:29 -0700 From: "me" Subject: [loud-fans] another link, for bibliophiles and since i'm just full o' links today: The Power of the Press (printing press) http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/chronicle/archive/2003/04/20/CM2993 64.DTL&type=news fascinating article. and i missed getting to meet Jim Dine. grr. oh well. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 22:38:01 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. Red Noise (Be Bop Deluxe) Though I do actually like the Red Noise album... At Tuesday 6/17/2003 09:38 PM -0500, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >Speaking of the latter...every reviewer has been unable to avoid mentioning >the song on Phair's new one entitled "H.W.C.," which of course stands for >"h*t wh*te c*m." I was unaware the substance generally was available in any >other color. Holy Crap!! I guess I need to see a doctor ASAP... >np: comp of various online things...right now, the Wrens covering Duran >Duran's "Seventh Stranger" Wow...memories. I had totally forgotten that the Wrens played on that DD tribute album. Hmmm, that was the one with the Deftones cover of The Chauffeur that I really liked, even though I normally can't stand the Deftones. Hey, I finally subscribed to eMusic. Although right after I signed up, I was no longer able to access the website (just like what happened to me this weekend while I was browsing the site), until I rebooted my PC twice. Very annoying. I'm currently downloading the first Firewater album... we'll see if that works... Latre. --Rog ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 01:09:45 -0400 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] a list. At 09:38 PM 6/17/2003 -0500, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >> --- glenn mcdonald wrote: >> > A few more I'd have listed: >> > >> > The Style Council (The Jam) > >Definitely! I feel I must step up for the Style Council. The first EP, INTRODUCING, is as fine as anything the Jam had done in the preceding couple of years. (I always thought it was hysterical that Weller broke up the Jam with pompous pronouncements about how he had to explore new and uncharted territory...and promptly released "Speak Like A Child" and "Long Hot Summer," the logical successors to "Beat Surrender" and "The Bitterest Pill.") Most of CAFE BLEU/MY EVER CHANGING MOODS is quite swell, as are surprisingly large chunks of OUR FAVORITE SHOP/INTERNATIONALISTS (an album I relatively recently reappraised after over a decade and a half of considering it a huge disappointment), and "Have You Ever Had It Blue" is one of his finest singles ever. It was after that (mid-'86, I guess) that everything went to shit and stayed there. Including his piss-poor solo career. >> Fugazi over Minor Threat, maybe? > >Also agreed. Someone just the other day, and I can't remember where, was >arguing that Bob Mould's post-Huskers work, both solo and w/Sugar, was >better than his Huskers stuff. I'm sure there will be arguments there... I think WORKBOOK stands up extremely well compared to Huskers, but I would argue a slow decline thereafter. >> Three O'Clock over the Salvation Army? > >For some reason, I'd thought that "Salvation Army" was the same band, >essentially, with a name change forced by the pre-existing "Army." I'm pretty sure there was a personnel change involved as well -- I think Danny Benair only joined up after the name change. >Quoting dana-boy@juno.com: > >> I wouldn't go too crazy arguing that this is more than a personal >> preference, but I'd take Damon and Naomi's "More Sad Hits" and Luna's >> "Penthouse" over anything by Galaxie 500. > >Although I like Galaxie 500, I definitely like D&N better, and a lot of >Luna's stuff is at least as good. Actually, I think I like them all about equally, though Luna's LUNAPARK is still probably my favorite album involving any of them. >Quoting "Pete O." : > >> ... and don't forget >> >> Loud Family (Game Theory) > >I don't know if you're serious or trolling, but...whaddaya think? I'd argue >that overall LF was better than GT. They lack the relatively weak first >album, and personally I'd put IBC up against LN. Scott's singing was better >in LF than in GT, and by and large the rest of the band was better in LF >than in GT. Hm. I think there's no question that LF were musically stronger, yes, but I'm not sure how much that matters to me. Mentally putting the respective band's best albums up against each other (for me, that's LOLITA NATION and DAYS FOR DAYS), it's close but LN has the edge, and my favorite lengthy stretch of Himself's career remains DISTORTION through TWO STEPS, so I think I have to go with Game Theory being a better band than the Loud Family. 'Course, this is akin to saying that raspberry-filled doughnuts are better than Boston creme: it's a matter of mood, taste, and very slight percentages. S NP: "Click Your Fingers Applauding the Play" -- Roky Erickson and the Aliens ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V3 #175 *******************************