From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V2 #313 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Wednesday, September 4 2002 Volume 02 : Number 313 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] new Statuesque [Steve Holtebeck ] Re: [loud-fans] Road Trip Suggestions [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: [loud-fans] new Statuesque [Roger Winston ] Re: [loud-fans] Bumbershoot report [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: [loud-fans] spoon [Boyof100lists@aol.com] [loud-fans] Furrier Psychedelics [Boyof100lists@aol.com] [loud-fans] Re: Iconography [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] [loud-fans] Future DVDs for Jeff (NS) [steve ] Re: [loud-fans] Mope Rock [was Bumbershoot report] ["Miles Goosens"] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 15:48:11 -0700 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: [loud-fans] new Statuesque Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > cue everything I've ever said or written about _Reveal_. (It needs two - > it has one. Bradley (and others) will disagree, but...) Speaking of Bradley, he's been bugging me to tell everyone that there's a new Statuesque album available for purchase, and a few midtempo mp3s available for download at. http://www.statuesque.org.uk/MUSIC.htm Stephen Manning has at least three fans here, but he deserves more. Steve ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 18:51:50 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Road Trip Suggestions On Tue, 3 Sep 2002, Michael Bowen wrote: > At 11:48 AM 9/3/2002 -0500, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote (referring to > the Hopper painting): > > >_Night-Hawks at the Diner_ > > The actual title of the painting, as I found out to my chagrin, is merely > "Night Hawks" (not sure about the hyphen). I lost $2000 on _Jeopardy!_ > calling it what you did. Tom Waits, you owe me. And here I thought I was being all picky in "remembering" the hyphen... Maybe I was thinking of _Moby-Dick_... (Which, as a drum solo, is longer than the book...) - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::[clever or pithy quote]:: __[source of quote]__ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 18:55:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] new Statuesque On Tue, 3 Sep 2002, Steve Holtebeck wrote: > Speaking of Bradley, he's been bugging me to tell everyone that > there's a new Statuesque album available for purchase, and a few > midtempo mp3s available for download at. > > http://www.statuesque.org.uk/MUSIC.htm > > Stephen Manning has at least three fans here, but he deserves more. I have only the EP with "Ton of Feathers, Ton of Steel" on it, but that song alone has made me a fan. Add me to your list (if I'm not on it already!). Silly question, based on random thoughts after reading an interview the other day: how many of us here have had songs written about, to, or for us? How did/do you feel about that, if so? Jeff Ceci n'est pas une .sig ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 20:11:07 -0400 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] new Statuesque At 06:55 PM 9/3/2002 -0500, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >Silly question, based on random thoughts after reading an interview the >other day: how many of us here have had songs written about, to, or for >us? How did/do you feel about that, if so? As Sue mentioned on-list a few months ago, Anton Barbeau has written a song called "Stewart Mason." My reaction could probably be summed up as "Erm...well...okay...um..." S ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 18:20:05 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] new Statuesque At Tuesday 9/3/2002 06:55 PM -0500, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >Silly question, based on random thoughts after reading an interview the >other day: how many of us here have had songs written about, to, or for >us? How did/do you feel about that, if so? Didn't Michele Woodard once say that Semisonic's "Singing In Your Sleep" was written about her? Or at least about a mix tape she made, that featured some Scott Songs. *Sniff* No one's ever written a song about me. That I know of. But I have some suspicions. Latre. --Rog P.S. LASIK update: After two weeks of wearing an extended wear contact lens in my right eye, the eye (sans contact) is now where it should've been right after the surgery. I'm not exactly sure why that helped (something to do with the lens triggering a particular immune response), but it sure did. Now I can read without reading glasses. Distance vision is still a bit blurry in the right eye (not nearly as much as immediate post-surgery), but the doc says that will go away in a day or two as the eye adjusts to not having the contact. I could definitely live with it like this, and it's only supposed to get better. I'm very happy today. But ask me again in a few months... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 20:35:18 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bumbershoot report On Tue, 3 Sep 2002 Wes_Vokes@eFunds.Com wrote: > And Jeff, you are wrong about Reveal! Although, if they would have put > "Lotus" on Reveal instead of UP... hmmmm, I might never have to listen to > UP again... Weird...I just listened to _Up_ again the other day - and I still think it's quite a fine record, with only a couple of lesser tracks. And "Lotus" is sort of middling in my world... But _Reveal_, even when I resequence it to avoid the deadly string of four or five slow songs in a row *in the same key* (or nearly), still only occasionally glimmers to life for me. And Miles, I won't even *mention* _New Adventures in Hi-Fi_ - oh wait, I just did. It has grown on me some since its release...but it still strikes me as longwinded, with most tracks at least a minute or two too long. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::[clever or pithy quote]:: __[source of quote]__ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 18:53:15 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: [loud-fans] Iconography >Oh, and yeah, what *is* it that somehow Monroe, Dean, and Bogart are so >overused (and sometimes Elvis)? I mean, okay, they've all become iconic - >but there are other iconic entertainers from roughly the same era who are >still popular - but not at that level. (This is where I make my >semi-annual rant about hunting down and killing whoever vandalized >_Night-Hawks at the Diner_ by absurdly putting Bogie et al. in it - worse >yet if it has tacky real neon attached. Feh.) Oh, I always chuckle and sigh at that remade "Nighthawks," especially at Elvis, if I recall correctly, scooping out ice cream. "Midnight At The Lost And Found," indeed! But you wax a tad illucid, Mr. Norman; surely even the revamped painting doesn't come with "tacky, real neon attached"? Or at least, not the posters I've seen... Seriously though, does anyone have any ideas on what makes an icon? Time, obviously. Living fast and dying young make practical prerequisites. But why does time anoint certain beautiful corpses and not others? James Dean is alive and well almost fifty years after he died of a broken neck. River Phoenix, who also lived fast, died young, looked beautiful, and departed us with most of his talent undeveloped, seems likely to be completely forgotten in a few more years. I have an easy enough answer to Jeffrey's question at the top: restaurateurs use Marilyn, James Dean, and Bogart (and Elvis, and maybe Frankie), because they've got surefire recognition and therefore, hopefully-surefire selling power. Not that they're the only ones, naturally. Recall Reverend Billy C. Wirtz's black-velvet poster, and it has to be real, "of Jesus, Elvis, and John Wayne walking together through eternity, watched over by Hank Sr." On a related note, who's an icon from the last fifteen years or so? Princess Diana, I think it's safe to say. Beyond that I'm fairly stumped. Selena, perhaps, though she was almost completely unknown to English-speakers. Aaliyah? Hey, if you've got 1606 notes to your memory at findagrave.com (Elvis has 821, Jimmy Dean has 278, John Wayne has 334, Hank Sr. has 75, Marilyn has 788, Bogie has 127, River Phoenix has 235, and Jesus has 146), I'm inclined to say you've got it going on. But time yet sits, hesitating with its eraser, Andy Search for "jesus elvis and john wayne" in your local yellow pages [--from www.altavista.com ] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 22:43:37 EDT From: Boyof100lists@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] spoon I got a promo poster of the latest Spoon record as part of a care package when I DJd if anyone wants it. - -Mark S. np: The Bigger Lovers "Honey in the Hive" (buy this now, thank me later) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 22:56:30 EDT From: Boyof100lists@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] Furrier Psychedelics If anyone else cares, I noticed some early Furs reissues today, with restored artwork, remastered (in this case I'm thinking it would be a drastic improvement) with extra tracks, for about 12 dollars each. Having actual artwork (the notoriously bad packaging of Columbia products in the eighties is old news, I know) would make it worth the buy. I'm in love with your blue cars, - -Mark S. "Listening to an album that you taped from someone and not buying your own is like ****ing your sister. It's just not the same." (what an indie record store owner said to me in 1987) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 22:10:49 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [loud-fans] Re: Iconography On Tue, 3 Sep 2002, Andrew Hamlin wrote: > But you wax a tad illucid, Mr. Norman; surely even the revamped painting > doesn't come with "tacky, real neon attached"? Or at least, not the posters > I've seen... No, I have seen versions of the iconicized image, at bars or restaurants, with cutesy little small neon lights where they'd be in the image. I'm guessing you can probably buy these yourself - if you're so tasteless, or kitsch-enamored (or both...). Re Andy's speculation about who's a current or future icon: I think one thing about Dean, Monroe, Elvis, Bogie is they more or less stand for something. So I'm not sure: what does Diana stand for? Being wealthy and marrying a prince? Actually, I'm going to vote for Bob Marley on that count... I'd like to vote for Frank Zappa, but that's not too likely, now is it... - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::a squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous...got me? __Captain Beefheart__ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 23:48:58 -0400 (EDT) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bumbershoot report On Tue, 3 Sep 2002 Wes_Vokes@eFunds.Com wrote: > I don't disaggree with anything anyone is saying, really... I just think it > is weird that I have never heard the comment (well, from anyone whose > comments re: music I take seriously) "That CD has way too many fast > songs!".... not that anyone needs to take my comments re: music seriously, but i've certainly levelled what is essentially the same charge at any number of records -- tempo is certainly a major part of what makes a record "undifferentiated" or "samey," which i complain about frequently. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 23:15:58 -0500 From: steve Subject: [loud-fans] Future DVDs for Jeff (NS) The Fellowship meets Jack - http://malakim.net/clutter/rddisc.htm - - Steve __________ One of the president's close acquaintances outside the White House said Mr. Bush clearly feels he has encountered his reason for being, a conviction informed and shaped by the president's own strain of Christianity. "I think, in his frame, this is what God has asked him to do," the acquaintance said. - Frank Bruni, NYT, on Bush's new war ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 00:22:04 -0400 From: "Miles Goosens" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Mope Rock [was Bumbershoot report] On Tue, 3 Sep 2002 15:21:40 -0700 Tim_Walters@digidesign.com wrote: > >Nick Drake's most famous album, PINK MOON, > *is* > >dominated by midtempo numbers. > > I don't have it handy to check, but my mental > ear is telling me that there's a > variety of tempos, including at least some > ("Pink Moon", "Know", "Parasite") > that are well over 120. Oy, sometimes I feel like I'm still in graduate school, what with this list! :-) OK, *precisely* speaking, some of the tempos are fast. But do they *feel* fast? The overall feel of PINK MOON is one that pretty much runs the gamut from moody contemplation to moody resignation. I'm perhaps being deliberately imprecise, but when I say *feel,* that includes the lyrics, the intonation of the lyrics, the instrumentation (pretty much Nick Drake and his guitar), etc. It might even involve keys and chord progressions, but I lack the minimal musicianly skills to discuss those in any meaningful way. Maybe "midtempo" wasn't the right term to use, but PINK MOON doesn't have a lot of sonic variety, and I can't imagine it being described as peppy, joyous, uplifting, Ramones-like (aside from track lengths), etc. It has a definite overall feel, and if "dark," "downcast" (OK, a couple of tracks in particular have rays of hope, but even within the songs themselves, they're only a break in the clouds), etc., aren't part of that feel, you've got a different copy than I do. To take your point, maybe one of the reasons I like PINK MOON besides its brevity is that it mixes things up more than I'm consciously thinking. I do think that 28 minutes of it goes further than 60 minutes would. And I'll second, third, and fifty-eleventh Jeffrey's REVEAL comments. Oh, another moody album, albeit with some variety, but an album I love: Beck's MUTATIONS, which sans silence and hidden track clocks in around 40 minutes. Since my complaints about one of its fellow 1998 releases, R.E.M.'s UP, were centered around samey-ness of tempo and feel, people often asked me what the difference was between it and the similarly gloomy MUTATIONS. My standard answer: "Around 20 minutes." later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 23:33:14 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [loud-fans] Wrenaissance! I know that this list harbors a handful of Wrens fans...so you'll be pleased to know that... there is actually a new Wrens release, with an actual release date, and the recording actually exists! (I know this because I received a promo copy last week.) It's a split EP w/a band (of sorts) called the Five Mod Four, and it's on No Karma Records (www.nokarma.com), and it has a scheduled October 1 release date. There are three Wrens songs on it - "Was There Ever," recorded in 1998, "Bus Dance" from 1991, and "45'er," brand new in 2002. It sounds like the Wrens. That's all you need to know. (Okay..."Was There Ever" is sorta noisy and sorta medium, "Bus Dance" is noisy and frenetic, and "45'er" is weird, moody, and melancholic (part of it is another in an ongoing series of the Wrens' putting two songs on top of one another). More info at www.wrens.com (not coincidentally run by one of the founders of No Karma - who not coincidentally is the sole constant member of the other band on the split EP), which is quite a fun and maze-like site. Even better, if rumor is to be believed, an actual full-length CD is completed. No more rejiggering, no more overdubbing and erasing, no more adding an extra track of vacuum cleaner noise. The only thing it needs is a record label. The Wrens site has a couple of MP3s from the new one. Oh: the Five Mod Four stuff is good enough - but you're probably buying this for the Wrens stuff (and Michael of 5M4 surely knows this!) - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::part of your circuit of incompetence:: ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V2 #313 *******************************