From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V2 #270 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Friday, August 9 2002 Volume 02 : Number 270 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll [] [loud-fans] lacunae (ns) [dana-boy@juno.com] Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll ["Aaron Milenski" ] RE: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll ["Larry Tucker" ] RE: RE: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll ["Larry Tucker" ] Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll [zkk46@ttacs.ttu.edu] Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll ["glenn mcdonald" ] Re: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll [] RE: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll ["Larry Tucker" ] RE: [loud-fans] Please wait during the silence ["Keegstra, Russell" ] Re: [loud-fans] Bruce [AWeiss4338@aol.com] Re:RE: [loud-fans] Please wait during the silence [dana-boy@juno.com] [loud-fans] Sight and Sound Movie Poll [Michael Mitton ] Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll [jenny grover ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 10:18:56 +0000 From: Subject: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll Hey, cool - arguing about polls - I've missed this! What I find so interesting is that the list is so charmingly passe. Kurt Cobain and Tom Morello are just about the only nods to anything which has happened in the last decade, which I think is really odd given I'd assumed that most of the readership of these magazines would be in the 17-25 age bracket. I mean, nothing against Vai, Satriani etc as players, but aren't they, like, so 1991? Clapton and Gilmour - I dunno, to me there's something about their 'tastefulness' which is anything but - that sustain, that overdone vibrato - it always makes me think of those sub-sub-Gielgud English classical actors who can't even say the word 'Oh' without making it come out as 'EEEOOOAAAOOOWWW' or suchlike. I do have a soft spot for Slash, because he reintroduced an element of slop into hard-rock guitar playing, which had become very clinical during the '80s. I'm thinking in particular of the chaos at the end of 'Paradise City' where his playing sounds like 'Crossroads'-era Clapton falling down a flight of stairs (despite what I said in the previous paragraph, please don't read this as anything other than a half-assed simile). Of course, the list of those who are missing IMO is ten times longer than the 'official' rankings, and really, this poll should be entitled 'the greatest hard rock guitarists of all time', since no other genre of music is properly represented. Even given this limited remit I'd have thought that Rick Nielsen, Billy Gibbons, and, hell, why not, Earl Slick should have had a look in... and wasn't the inclusion of Tracy Chapman one of the most sweetly gauche attempts at political correctness you've ever seen? peace & love phil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 13:09:39 GMT From: dana-boy@juno.com Subject: [loud-fans] lacunae (ns) I was doing a search on US Maple/the Knitting Factory, trying to get some info about their Sept. show, and I stumbled across a kind of a neat page which seems to be run by the guy who does the Dark Beloved Cloud record label, which has existed on the edges of my consciousness for years, mostly due to ads in chickfactor. I didn't get a chance to go through all the entries, but it seems to be a sort of ongoing indie-rock diary by an NYC guy, and a few of the entries were pretty interesting. The website is www.lacunae.com (you'll have to follow links to get to the diary section). The story that caught my eye (from late last year) was: We had lunch today with Natalie LeBrecht, who records and plays music under the name Greenpot Bluepot (if there were a weblink to buy her records, I'd put one here, but there isn't; anyway, her LP is called Daymares and Nightdreams, and it's on Global Buddy Records, and you should find a copy). Natalie told us a story about a show she played back in June that turned very strange. It's a really long story, but a great one. (And I may have the details slightly garbled, but I think they can withstand a little garbling, honestly.) This was at the Knitting Factory, where she was opening for U.S. Maple. She'd played a few of her (great, weird, unnerving, keyboard-and-voice) songs; then she stopped and said she'd had a terrible dream, and wanted to tell the audience about it. She riffed on some mothers-digging-through-rubble imagery from a Godspeed You Black Emperor! record for a while, then talked about how she imagined herself dressed completely in black, covered in black head to toe, knowing that people would stone her if she let an inch of skin show--and then said but this wasn't a nightmare, this was real life for women living under the Taliban [remember, this was in June!], and talked about that for a while. She said that she wanted to sing a song about it, and started singing an a cappella version of Dog Faced Hermans' "Keep Your Laws/Off My Body." After she'd been singing it for a minute or so, a guy in the audience started laughing--and he kept laughing, loudly, like he wanted to be laughing. She stopped in the middle of the song, singled him out, and asked him what he was laughing about. He said "look, whatever..." She said no, you've been obnoxious enough to start laughing when I'm trying to do something serious here, come up here and explain why. He said "listen, I'm just gonna go downstairs and wait for U.S. Maple." No, she said, you're not, you can come up here and tell us your side of things. He started walking out, and she started yelling "CHICKEN! CHIIICKEEEEN!" and flapping her arms and making ba-gawk noises. Finally, he stormed back up to the stage, went up to her microphone (which was considerably shorter than he was, so he had to lean over), and started to explain that he'd thought she'd pulled a really annoying, self-aggrandizing move. She cut him off, said "Thanks very much," shooed him off the stage, and started to introduce her next song. Wait just a minute, somebody in the audience said, you pull the junior-high chicken-dare thing and then you cut him off after like two sentences? What's with that? So she said fair enough, come on back, and he came back on stage and took off his jacket--to reveal a T-shirt with a bunch of weird stuff taped to it--packets of meat and ketchup and stuff. So, what?, she said, were you planning to get up on stage when U.S. Maple was on with that outfit? "Well, actually," he said, "I was, "but your thing was so egregious I figured I had to do it now. You're using your position as the performer and the object of attention to try to glorify yourself--your routine is supposed to make you look all sensitive and thoughtful, but really it's just a cheap power play; if you were actually concerned, you'd be donating your proceeds from the performance to a charity that can help Afghan women, but really you just want to score cool points." He went on in this vein for a while. "Actually," Natalie said, "I have to thank you, because I had a plant in the audience tonight--Eric, can you step forward, please?" Her friend Eric came up to the stage looking a little confused: "whaddaya want me to do?" Natalie went on: "I told Eric I was going to pay him thirty bucks to jump up on stage during my set, cut me off, and critique my performance as self-aggrandizing cheap politics. But now you've done it for me, for free! I don't have to pay him any more--now I can take a taxi home after the show instead of having to cart my keyboard myself! Thanks very much!" She hugged the guy on stage (he didn't hug back), then pushed him off toward the stairs. Then she started to play another song, but he came back up and grabbed the microphone again. "Oh, yeah, that's really clever," the guy on stage started sneering, "the whole thin-line-between-art-and-life thing, nobody's ever done that before, that's so performance art, so clever..." As he went on, she hit a button and started a loop of some truck-driver music from a junior high driver's-ed class, and started doing a little dance to it, and taking off some of her outfit. This set him off some more: "oh, look at me, I'm a cute girl, I don't need to participate in an argument 'cause I've got boobs!" She adjusted the sparkly tutu she was wearing, grabbed the other microphone and said something along the lines of "oh, look at me, I'm a paranoid frat boy, I can't stand to see a woman actually speaking for herself, I have to be an asshole about it..." This turned into a big gender-war fight for a few minutes, while the driver's-ed-music loop was still going; as he ranted, Natalie danced off to the side, put on a fake mustache and a wig, and came back over to him and started making funny faces at him. "Oh, what's with this Andy Kaufman bullshit?" he said. "You think you're so cool, just because you can act weird." Etc. Whereupon he stripped off his T-shirt to reveal... another T-shirt under it, with a big picture of Natalie wearing a sparkly tutu, a fake mustache and a wig, and making a funny face. Natalie attacks, and the two of them start rolling around on the floor, yelling at each other. Meanwhile, her (tall, gangly) friend Eric got up on stage, grabbed the microphone, announced "Pocket dance!," stuck his hands in his pockets, and started doing a goofy dance to the driver's-ed-music loop. The sound-guy, at this point, had had it. He announced over the P.A.: "Natalie, you've been making an ass of yourself way too long. Get off the stage. People came here to see U.S. Maple, and you're already ten minutes over. I'm turning you off." Natalie got up, went over to the mic, and started making an announcement--but of course it was turned off. So she started yelling at the soundman and demanding he turn her sound back on. At this point, the guitarist from U.S. Maple got up on stage and said "Natalie, you really have to get off now." No! she said. He tried to gently impel her off, but she wasn't budging. So he grabbed her and dragged her off the stage, as she yelled "You've RUINED it! You've RUINED my big chance! Now I'm NEVER going to get signed to Matador Records!..." And that was the end of her set. The guy who'd interrupted her in the first place, by the way, is the guy from Global Buddy, who was visiting from Iowa; they'd planned it all out in advance, of course. Natalie says she's probably never going to do a performance like that again, so she figured she might as well go all the way with that one. Natalie is pretty brilliant, I think. Boy, do I wish I'd gone to see that show. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 09:13:46 -0400 From: "Aaron Milenski" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll >Hey, cool - arguing about polls - I've missed this! Me too! >What I find so interesting is that the list is so charmingly passe. Kurt >Cobain and Tom Morello are just about the only nods to anything which has >happened in the last decade, which I think is really odd given I'd assumed >that most of the readership of these magazines would be in the 17-25 age >bracket. I mean, nothing against Vai, Satriani etc as players, but aren't >they, like, so 1991? > I'm surprised too--I'd expect someone like Eric Johnson to be way up near the top. Putting Kurt Cobain on the list is like putting Johnny Ramone or Johnny Thunders or Steve Jones on it. He's not a great, or even particularly good, guitarist, but in a way he belongs there because his simple style was so influential. >Clapton and Gilmour - I dunno, to me there's something about their >'tastefulness' which is anything but - that sustain, that overdone vibrato >- it always makes me think of those sub-sub-Gielgud English classical >actors who can't even say the word 'Oh' without making it come out as >'EEEOOOAAAOOOWWW' or suchlike. > I used to think of Clapton as the most overrated guitarist in history, but lately I've paid closer attention to Cream's music and the BLUESBREAKERS album in particular, and I think he truly is an amazingly tasteful guitarist. His best work isn't even remotely his most complex. The solo from "Badge" is so utterly perfect (as is the rest of the song) that it completely blows me away every time I hear it. It's just exactly the right thing at the right time, and simple as it sounds I bet no one else could duplicate it in a way that works as well. A good example of this is his almost-as-good solo from "I Feel Free." A pretty great guitarist, Ted Nugent, took a shot at it on the first Amboy Dukes album, and it just had no impact at all. >and wasn't the inclusion of Tracy Chapman one of the most sweetly gauche >attempts at political correctness you've ever seen? > Yeah, that was supremely silly. Now if anyone had heard April Lawton of Ramatam, they'd know there actually is a woman who could have made the list if she'd ever become well-known. Aaron, wondering where Richard Thompson and Tom Verlaine ranked. _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 13:27:35 +0000 From: Subject: Re: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll > Aaron, wondering where Richard Thompson and Tom Verlaine > ranked. Unfortunately, a websearch only turned up several sites listing the top 20 - for the top 100 I guess you'd have to buy the mag. 'Musician' ran a similar piece a few years ago which was much more comprehensive, not to say provocative (Cheetah Chrome but not Johnny Thunders) - I must dig that out some time. Meanwhile, on a related kick, here are the results of the Sight and Sound critics' poll for the greatest movies ever: 1. Citizen Kane (Welles) 1941 2. Vertigo (Hitchcock) 1958 3. La Regle du Jeu (Renoir) 1939 4. The Godfather I and II (Coppola) 1972, 1974 5. Tokyo Story (Ozu) 1953 6. 2001: A Space Odyssey (Kubrick) 1968 7. Sunrise (Murnau) 1927 8. Battleship Potemkin (Eisenstein) 1925 9. 8 1/2 (Fellini) 1963 10. Singin' in the Rain (Kelly, Donen) 1951 Not sayin' nuthin' about this yet, just thought I'd throw it out to the list - peace & love phil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 09:53:47 -0400 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll |-----Original Message----- |From: Aaron Milenski [mailto:amilenski@hotmail.com] |Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 9:14 AM |To: loud-fans@smoe.org |Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll | | |I used to think of Clapton as the most overrated guitarist in |history, but |lately I've paid closer attention to Cream's music and the |BLUESBREAKERS |album in particular, and I think he truly is an amazingly tasteful |guitarist. His best work isn't even remotely his most |complex. The solo |from "Badge" is so utterly perfect (as is the rest of the |song) that it |completely blows me away every time I hear it. It's just |exactly the right |thing at the right time, and simple as it sounds I bet no one |else could |duplicate it in a way that works as well. A good example of |this is his |almost-as-good solo from "I Feel Free." I was once a huge fan of Clapton though he really sort of lost me after his drug rehab return in '74, but his stuff prior is almost perfection. "Badge" is one of those songs that I surely have heard 500 times or more and still sounds good to me. I remember the first time I heard that song and thinking how can a lead be so simple yet so totally grab you. Most of the album the Derek and the Dominioes album LAYLA still holds up for me as well, though that title track I think I've heard enough for one lifetime, but "Bell Bottom Blues" has got to be one of the sweetest melodic yet painful love songs he's ever written or played. - -larry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 14:01:18 +0000 From: Subject: Re: RE: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll I would hasten to add that I'm not especially anti-Clapton - it's just that my personal tastes in blues-based playing tend towards either the more purist, biting sounds of Clapton's biggest influences (which is an ironic kinda purism when you consider why Clapton left the Yardbirds) or, paradoxically, to the more outre, space-age sounds of Jeff Beck and Hendrix. Clapton seems to me to fall between those two extremes, but if there's a gap there, I could hardly begrudge anybody for filling it. And, golly, yes, I'd forgotten how much 'Badge' can still get to me... although not as much as Let's Active's 'Badger' (cue 'Sierra Madre' gag from Weird Al's 'UHF') - piece and love phil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 10:06:52 -0400 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: RE: RE: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll |-----Original Message----- |From: phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com [mailto:phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com] |Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 10:01 AM |To: loud-fans@smoe.org |Subject: Re: RE: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll | | |I would hasten to add that I'm not especially anti-Clapton - |it's just that my personal tastes in blues-based playing tend |towards either the more purist, biting sounds of Clapton's |biggest influences (which is an ironic kinda purism when you |consider why Clapton left the Yardbirds) or, paradoxically, to |the more outre, space-age sounds of Jeff Beck and Hendrix. |Clapton seems to me to fall between those two extremes, but if |there's a gap there, I could hardly begrudge anybody for |filling it. And, golly, yes, I'd forgotten how much 'Badge' |can still get to me... although not as much as Let's Active's |'Badger' (cue 'Sierra Madre' gag from Weird Al's 'UHF') - | |piece and love | |phil |-----Original Message----- |From: phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com [mailto:phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com] |Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 10:01 AM |To: loud-fans@smoe.org |Subject: Re: RE: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll | | |I would hasten to add that I'm not especially anti-Clapton - |it's just that my personal tastes in blues-based playing tend |towards either the more purist, biting sounds of Clapton's |biggest influences (which is an ironic kinda purism when you |consider why Clapton left the Yardbirds) or, paradoxically, to |the more outre, space-age sounds of Jeff Beck and Hendrix. |Clapton seems to me to fall between those two extremes, but if |there's a gap there, I could hardly begrudge anybody for |filling it. And, golly, yes, I'd forgotten how much 'Badge' |can still get to me... although not as much as Let's Active's |'Badger' (cue 'Sierra Madre' gag from Weird Al's 'UHF') - | |piece and love | |phil The venerable Bobby Sutliff does a truly fine cover of "Badger" for a future Let's Active tribute album a friend of mine in Winston-Salem is working on. Michael, you lurking? - -Larry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 10:12:35 EDT From: Boyof100lists@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] Scott and Aimee sittin' in a tree... How long will it be before we see this release available to buy? Will it be at her site only? Anyone with info please spill. I'm breathless with anticip....ation. - -Mark Staples np The Church "Of Skins and Heart" ("Is this where you live?") Frank Zappa came to be interviewed for our TV show and I think that after that interview I hated Zappa even more than when it started. I remember when he was so mean to us when the Mothers of Invention played with the Velvet Underground---I think both at the Trip, In L.A., and at the Fillmore in San Francisco. I hated him then and I still don't like him. And he was awfully strange about Moon. I said how great she was, and he said, "Listen, I created her. I invented her." Like, "She's nothing, it's all me." And I mean, if it were MY daughter I would be saying, "Gee, she's so smart," but he's taking all the credit. It was peculiar. (from _The Andy Warhol Diaries_ June 16, 1983) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 09:28:43 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll On Fri, 9 Aug 2002 phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com wrote: > and wasn't the inclusion of Tracy Chapman one of the most sweetly gauche > attempts at political correctness you've ever seen? Well, only if the readership of _Total Guitar_ collectively got together and said, "hmmm...there are no women in these results - let's throw one in." It's a *poll* - so the "gauche" inclusion of only one woman comes down to ignorance - not "political correctness," whatever the fuck that is. Bonnie Raitt, Elizabeth Cotten, Joni Mitchell, Kristin Hersh, Poison Ivy... - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::I feel that all movies should have things that happen in them:: __TV's Frank__ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 14:35:59 +0000 From: Subject: Re: [loud-fans] guitarist poll Jeff wrote: > Well, only if the readership of _Total Guitar_ collectively got together > and said, "hmmm...there are no women in these results - let's throw one > in." I thought one of the reports said there was some panel of 'experts' involved as well - presumably to ensure that the poll side of it didn't go too crazy and make Noel Gallagher the greatest guitarist of all time - but maybe I read that wrong. Nevertheless, yeah, Emily Remler as well... peace & love phil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 10:08:17 -0500 From: zkk46@ttacs.ttu.edu Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll Quoting phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com: > Hey, cool - arguing about polls - I've missed this! > What I find so interesting is that the list is so charmingly passe. Kurt Cobain and Tom Morello are just about the only nods to anything which has happened in the last decade, which I think is really odd given I'd assumed that most of the readership of these magazines would be in the 17-25 age bracket. I mean, nothing against Vai, Satriani etc as players, but aren't they, like, so 1991? > I wish, but really, they are super popular today among the a-solo-is-a-scale-played-really-fast crowd. I haven't yet met a local guitar guy who doesn't idolize these 2 guys. > Clapton and Gilmour - I dunno, to me there's something about their > 'tastefulness' which is anything but - that sustain, that overdone vibrato > - it always makes me think of those sub-sub-Gielgud English classical > actors who can't even say the word 'Oh' without making it come out as > 'EEEOOOAAAOOOWWW' or suchlike. > Clapton and Hendrix are 2 guys I just don't get. The only bit of Clapton I can handle is the outro of Layla, which I think wasn't even Clapton. I guess I'm too young to remember/understand the impact of Hendrix. The smashing instrument thing doesn't do much for me, or the Star Spangled Banner, or McCartney's "He played Sgt Pepper's 2 days after it was released." I'm not impressed. He did do the definitive version of "All Along the Watchtower", but most of his original songs don't really strike me as particulary inventive guitar playing. 3 chords, basic rhythm, solo at 12th fret, just like everybody else. > I do have a soft spot for Slash, because he reintroduced an element of slop into hard-rock guitar playing, which had become very clinical during the '80s. I'm thinking in particular of the chaos at the > end of 'Paradise City' where his playing sounds > >like 'Crossroads'-era Clapton falling down a flight of I kinda like Slash too, because his playing pretty much killed the copy-Van Halen style that was so prevalent during those days. I still really don't see a huge musical difference between "grunge" of the early '90's and GNR - maybe production budgets, but that's about it. Lyrics o'course are another story. > Slick should have had a look in... and wasn't the inclusion of Tracy Chapman one of the most sweetly gauche attempts at political correctness > you've ever seen? > Her inclusion in the list, no, but the fact that the lack of women gets as many lines in the article? Yes. This is the kind of list you'd expect from people who don't play guitar, and the tiny number of women in hard rock (which I agree this list represents) and the tiny readership of women and guitar magazines ensures that very few women would make the list. What is the point the author is trying to make? what number is kevin shields? Andrew np: Use Your Illusion II ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 11:14:09 -0400 From: "glenn mcdonald" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll Tracy Champman? Was that a misprint of "Patty Larkin"? And Elizabeth Elmore. But I'm not exactly a guitar-players'-guitar-players fan... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 15:33:10 +0000 From: Subject: Re: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll Andrew wrote: > Clapton and Hendrix are 2 guys I just don't get. The > only bit of Clapton I can handle is the outro of Layla, > which I think wasn't even Clapton. Yeah - Duane Allman, I think (?) > I guess I'm too young to remember/understand the > impact of Hendrix. The smashing instrument thing > doesn't do much for me, or the Star Spangled Banner, or > McCartney's "He played Sgt Pepper's 2 days after it was > released." I'm not impressed. He did do the definitive > version of "All Along the Watchtower", but most of his > original songs don't really strike me as particulary > inventive guitar playing. 3 chords, basic rhythm, solo > at 12th fret, just like everybody else. Umm, I don't know. I think Hendrix' reputation suffers a bit from the glut of material that's out there, and when he wasn't having an inspired time of things he could revert to blues-rock type, but even then there's an edge-of-disaster abandon which few of his peers could match. As for his rhythm playing, I think it's just about the most underrated aspect of his art, and far more inventive than people give him credit for. I can hear scraps of it in everybody from Beefheart to Gang of Four to Prince, but perhaps I'm exaggerating. Hendrix wasn't yet a great songwriter by the time he died (although he'd written a handful of great songs) but I think he had the potential to do a lot more... or maybe he'd have become one of those frustrating characters like Jeff Beck, who's so wonderful at what he does but has never found an interesting enough context in which to do it. (It's kinda like the way I feel about John Woo, I guess, in that I think he's a great director who seems utterly incapable of making a great movie.) just one effete limey muso thesp's opinion - peace & love phil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 11:50:07 -0400 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: RE: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll |-----Original Message----- |From: phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com [mailto:phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com] |Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 11:33 AM |To: loud-fans@smoe.org |Subject: Re: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll | | |Andrew wrote: | |> Clapton and Hendrix are 2 guys I just don't get. The |> only bit of Clapton I can handle is the outro of Layla, |> which I think wasn't even Clapton. | |Yeah - Duane Allman, I think (?) Yes, that's who it was. I do think it is his presence on the album LAYLA helped pushed Clapton's playing to another level. To chime in on the Hendrix thing. He was truly capable of brilliance and was probably on of the most innovative rock guitarists ever. In his time he was so much a head of everyone elese there were hardly and comparisons. I listened to him for entirely different reasons than Clapton. For sheer power and that ragged on the edge who knows where this is going, defintely Hendrix. For Clapton I appreciated his fluidity, economy where needed and overall smoothness. Alas he became all smooth with no substance. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 09:31:36 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Please wait during the silence >Bryan Ferry, Frantic - wide stylistic variety, and is this >the first time we've had a direct link between Brian Eno and >Robin Trower? Could well be! This one sounded intriguing out of the wrap, and it's grown on me since. Ferry says he spent seven years working on it; I did note, before reading, how "Goodnight Irene" features the great Cajun accordionist Eddie LeJeune, who died early last year. A solid fixture in my Top Ten 2002, now. And hearing "Goddess Of Love" in the pizza restaurant just made the year a little weirder. Anybody know which Dave Stewart co-wrote about half of Ferry's originals? Waiting to see what people think of the new Bruce (or even the new old Pixies), Andy In June, after the British musical group the Planets introduced a 60-second piece of complete silence on its latest album, representatives of the estate of composer John Cage, who once wrote "4'33"" (273 seconds of silence), threatened to sue the group for ripping Cage off (but failed, said the group, to specify which 60 of the 273 seconds it thought had been pilfered). Said Mike Batt of the Planets: "Mine is a much better silent piece. I (am) able to say in one minute what (took Cage) four minutes and 33 seconds." [--as reported by the Independent, London, June 21, 2002] (courtesy Edward Martin III) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 11:58:30 -0500 From: "Keegstra, Russell" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Please wait during the silence That Hamlin guy: >Anybody know which Dave Stewart co-wrote about half of Ferry's originals? I'm pretty sure I saw something somewhere that said it was indeed the Eurythmics' Dave Stewart. Happy Leonids! Soon, the Giants were appearing on bills with performers ranging from Ann Magnuson and Steve Buscemi to a young man with no arms who walked onstage in a dress and stripped naked as another man counted bacward from a hundred in German. ...from a piece on They Might Be Giants in the current New Yorker ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 13:08:00 -0400 From: Dan Sallitt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Please wait during the silence > Happy Leonids! Before the Leonids, we get the Perseids, which happen early next week. The peak is Monday the 12th at 6 pm EDT, 3 pm PDT, 10 pm GMT. So the best day to watch is probably Monday night to Tuesday morning, though missing the peak by a day usually works out okay. The official rates for this shower are something like 60-120 meteors per hour - I'm happy to see half than many. As for the Leonids, this is the last year in our lifetimes that they are expected to be a supershower. The storm will only last a few hours - it all happens on the morning of Tuesday, November 19 near 2:30 am PST, 5:30 am EST. (Which means observers in the western US are favored over those in the the eastern US, and the UK won't see this one.) Estimates range from 10000 to 30000 an hour! The full moon will hurt observation, but even so, this is probably the most meteor activity that any of us will ever see. - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 13:11:57 -0400 From: Stewart Mason Subject: RE: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll At 11:50 AM 8/9/2002 -0400, Larry Tucker wrote: >|> Clapton and Hendrix are 2 guys I just don't get. The >|> only bit of Clapton I can handle is the outro of Layla, >|> which I think wasn't even Clapton. >| >|Yeah - Duane Allman, I think (?) I'm sitting here replaying the song in my head, and honestly, I don't think I've ever even noticed a guitar on the outro to "Layla"! I've always focused on Jim Gordon's piano part, the only element of that song I've ever particularly liked. S NP: "You've Got To Take It (If You Want It)" -- The Main Ingredient (Cuba Gooding should get much more acclaim than he does -- he was easily one of the finest soul singers of his generation) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 12:31:34 -0500 From: "Keegstra, Russell" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Please wait during the silence Dan gently corrects: >> Happy Leonids! >Before the Leonids, we get the Perseids, which happen early next week. Oops, dopey me. Something got mistranslated between brain and hand. ...but, what he said about the Leonids. Make an effort to see. Russ np: Dream Theater, Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence - this is working it's way back up into my top of 2002 list. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 10:43:48 -0700 (PDT) From: "Joseph M. Mallon" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bruce On Fri, 9 Aug 2002, Carolyn Dorsey wrote: > I live near the Meadowlands in Jersey where Bruce Springsteen just had a big > show last night. I've heard bits of his new record on the classic rock > station and like it. I saw him on Letterman a few nights ago and he sounded > good. Their onstage enthusiasm seems a little too stagey for me but I still > liked hearing him. A few summers ago a friend of mine gave me tickets to > see Bruce on his last tour. When I got there the parking lot was packed > with tailgate parties in the backs of late model SUV after SUV. I'm from > Michigan originally and Bruce was pretty popular there in the seventies but > the Jersey fans idolize him. You have no idea. I grew up around Philly. The man could do no wrong. I started college in PA in '84, ca. BORN IN THE USA. "Jersey Girl" was played non-stop on the jukebox in the student center. BITU t-shirts everywhere. "Dancing In The Dark" at every dance. Omnipresent seems too mild a word. np: YANKEE HOTL FOXTROT - very much a comer, looking good for year-end Top 5 status, and maybe the weirdest record to debut in the Billboard 15 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 12:54:17 -0500 From: "Keegstra, Russell" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Please wait during the silence Mea culpa: >np: Dream Theater, Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence - this is working >it's way back up into my top of 2002 list. No, officer, I really was paying attention during the apostrophe demonstrations. I don't know how that happened. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 13:54:26 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Scott and Aimee sittin' in a tree... In a message dated 8/9/02 10:12:52 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Boyof100lists@aol.com writes: > How long will it be before we see this release available to buy? Will it be > at her site only? Anyone with info please spill. I'm breathless with > anticip....ation. > > Not for awhile, with her next album Lost In Space coming out. To take a wild guess, sometime next year. That solo album is excelent too. Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 13:53:27 -0400 From: Dan Sallitt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bruce > > I live near the Meadowlands in Jersey where Bruce Springsteen just had a big > > show last night. I've heard bits of his new record on the classic rock > > station and like it. I saw him on Letterman a few nights ago and he sounded > > good. Their onstage enthusiasm seems a little too stagey for me but I still > > liked hearing him. A few summers ago a friend of mine gave me tickets to > > see Bruce on his last tour. When I got there the parking lot was packed > > with tailgate parties in the backs of late model SUV after SUV. I'm from > > Michigan originally and Bruce was pretty popular there in the seventies but > > the Jersey fans idolize him. > > You have no idea. I grew up around Philly. The man could do no wrong. I > started college in PA in '84, ca. BORN IN THE USA. "Jersey Girl" was > played non-stop on the jukebox in the student center. BITU t-shirts > everywhere. "Dancing In The Dark" at every dance. Omnipresent seems too > mild a word. I was amazed by how much his New Jersey fans loved him when I saw him at the Meadowlands a year or two ago. From the nosebleed seats where I was, you simply couldn't hear the band for the audience singing along en masse. Has this guy considered state politics? - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 14:13:53 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Bruce In a message dated 8/9/02 1:57:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, sallitt@post.harvard.edu writes: > I was amazed by how much his New Jersey fans loved him when I saw him at > the Meadowlands a year or two ago. From the nosebleed seats where I > was, you simply couldn't hear the band for the audience singing along en > masse. Has this guy considered state politics? - Dan > His fans have wanted him to run for governor and senator and he's always said no. Kind of a shame, I think he might be good. I can take or leave him musically but I didn't grow up at the Jersey shore, maybe if I had I'd see him differently. And Asbury Park went crazy the day he had his rehearsal, the one the Today show covered. Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 18:33:15 GMT From: dana-boy@juno.com Subject: Re:RE: [loud-fans] Please wait during the silence >np: Dream Theater, Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence - this is working >it's way back up into my top of 2002 list. No, officer, I really was paying attention during the apostrophe demonstrations. I don't know how that happened. >>>>>>>>>> I read that as "this is working [pause] it is way back up into my top of 2002 list," and I'm moved by the emotion conveyed by the breathless conversational tone. I say we rationalize all of our mistakes from now on, and to hell with the fuzz!! I'm willing to contribute a really great theory about why it's ok to say "repeat it again" and another to justify "very unique." - --dana np: Cinerama/Torina, and I'm relieved that the Manifesto website has finally fixed the release date of the new Lily's album so I can stop fretting about why it isn't out yet. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 15:17:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Mitton Subject: [loud-fans] Sight and Sound Movie Poll On Fri, 9 Aug 2002 phil.gerrard@ntlworld.com wrote: > Meanwhile, on a related kick, here are the results of the Sight and Sound critics' poll for the greatest movies ever: Some folks here may be interested in the full poll results. You can see all the films voted for as well as browse the ballots of each person who voted. Aren't you just dying to know what Bertolucci thinks is the best film ever? http://www.bfi.org.uk/sightandsound/topten/poll/index.html - --Michael, who was pretty damn happy to read that glenn has a Lance Armstrong watch ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 20:15:21 -0400 From: jenny grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll Larry Tucker wrote: > > "Badge" is one of those songs that I surely have heard 500 times or more > and still sounds good to me. I remember the first time I heard that song > and thinking how can a lead be so simple yet so totally grab you. I thought George Harrison played lead on that song. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 20:26:21 -0400 From: jenny grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: guitarist poll Stewart Mason wrote: > > I'm sitting here replaying the song in my head, and honestly, I don't think > I've ever even noticed a guitar on the outro to "Layla"! I've always > focused on Jim Gordon's piano part, the only element of that song I've ever > particularly liked. Gee, I always thought the outro to Layla lasted way too long and got kinda boring. I always much preferred the first half of the song. Jen ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V2 #270 *******************************