From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V2 #248 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Friday, July 19 2002 Volume 02 : Number 248 Today's Subjects: ----------------- RE: [loud-fans] Storytelling ["Ian Runeckles & Angela Bennett" ] RE: [loud-fans] more movie talk ["Andrew Hamlin" ] Re: [loud-fans] Storytelling [Boyof100lists@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] half-year ["Andrew Hamlin" ] [loud-fans] [Fwd: Mission of Burma update!] [jenny grover ] [loud-fans] computer challenged...won't you help? [Boyof100lists@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] computer challenged...won't you help? [Roger Winston Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Storytelling Michael says: > I've just spent a couple of evenings with the "Gosford Park" > DVD, and I'm amazed at what a fantastic script it was. There > are 20 different plots, and they all really are there, even > if it takes several viewings before you catch everything. Julian Fellowes, who wrote the GP script, has been appearing in a documentary series on a real-life country house on TV here - it's fascinating stuff about people who had "useless" lives, as one interviewee put it. The archive footage which was shot by the "lord of the manor" is wonderful - he got into cine filming, took the camera around the world with him in the 20s on his 6 months honeymoon (he and his wife took 40 trunks of possessions with them!), there is footage of them meeting the Hollywood set of the time, Pickford, Fairbanks, Chaplin, Louise Brooks (aaah!), then travelling on through the exotic east - a lost world now. Anyway, returning to GP, the attention to detail which Altman and Fellowes have is one of the great things about this film - how the servants were referred to by their master's or mistresses names, the seating arrangements at dinner etc. And Maggie Smith's lines are just terrific. Ian ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:02:28 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Storytelling GOSFORD PARK I simply found tedious, though it's entirely possible I only tuned in to one or two of the 20-odd plots. I'm fond of Altman on general principle though a fair number of his films don't work. I recall LOVELY & AMAZING discussed here in terms of "I hate these people!" (alleged director's perspective). Given that LOVELY & AMAZING is my new best film of 2002 (so far), let me propose a spectrum: Nicole Holofcener genuinely likes her characters in spite of their substantial flaws. Neil LaBute likes his characters, but analyzes them harshly in terms of their relationship to evil (simplistic, since one rarely in real life encounters LaBute's manifestations of absolute evil, but perhaps it's better to look at these situations allegorically). Todd Soldonz doesn't seem to look at his characters beyond their bugginess, and what kind of a fight he can get if he puts them in a jar, screws on the lid, and shakes. Then you've got Soldonz's oeuvre vs. AMERICAN BEAUTY and vice-a versa, Andy Q: Are there any pieces that you did for Creem that you're particularly fond of that you can remember? A: Well, yeah, that's an easy one. My favourite was an article was about Loverboy--that would have been 83' or '84. Q: A Canadian band. A: Yeah, yeah, a Canadian band. It was one where, when I was testing my tape recorder in the office, I was going like, "Testing, testing, testes...", and then I said "HOG BALLS" and that all went on the tape. Okay, and on the interview when it was time to turn the tape on, instead of pressing record, I pressed play and heard my voice go "HOG BALLS!" Now, I don't think anybody noticed besides me, but it was unnerving. In the article I lied and said it was real loud. I shouldn't have done that; it's just that it wasn't funny without it. And "The Secret History Of Queen"--that was one where I was able to write all kinds of crazy stuff, just crazy, crazy nonsense. That's one I always remember. And the things I wrote about junk food I was real fond of, those came out pretty good, there's two of those. After that, I don't know, maybe one other thing called "I Call On Hoot 'n' Annie" about a local hippie party... [--Rick Johnson, former senior writer for "Creem," from an interview by Andrew Lapointe at http://www.rockcritics.com/Rick_Johnson_Interview_July2002.html ] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:02:59 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] more movie talk first me, then glenn: >>I highly encourage all to see THE DANGEROUS LIVES OF ALTAR BOYS >I second this, or at least one-and-a-halfth it. The missing half is because I couldn't totally shake the idea that it's Jody Foster's _Donnie Darko_, and it just isn't in the same league. I've thought about this, and thought of one important difference, upon which I'll expound after some (spoiler space) . . . . . . . . . Donnie Darko, presented with a puzzle, eventually solves it, overcoming his own disbelief and (admittedly not very strong) sense of self-preservation. He knows, finally, that he can save lives through sacrificing his own, and he makes that supreme sacrifice. ALTAR BOYS' Tim Sullivan (Kieran Culkin, even more amazing than in THE MIGHTY), is what you might call a more common type: brash, blazingly intelligent, a natural leader, but youth-callowed enough to treat his closest friends as pawns (think RUSHMORE's Max). So when his scheme turns on him, it's sad, but it's his own hubris, not to mention his own willingness to put others at risk, that brought him to that place. Jena Malone is in "The Badge"?!? Andy "Errors in geography: They were not dumped into a ditch beside the New Jersey Turnpike. Due to the position of the drawbridge in the background and the size of the road, they are on Rt. 1/9 right near the Exit 15E interchange of the Turnpike. At 15E the Turnpike is dual elevated roadway with 12 lanes." - --from the "goofs" section for BEING JOHN MALKOVICH at the Internet Movie Database ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:41:05 EDT From: Boyof100lists@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Storytelling In a message dated 7/18/02 11:02:42 AM Eastern Daylight Time, zoom@muppetlabs.com writes: > Todd Soldonz doesn't seem to look at his > characters beyond their bugginess, and what kind of a fight he can get if > he > puts them in a jar, screws on the lid, and shakes. > > I see where you're coming from, but I'm not sure if I agree with this, Andy, at least not completely. To his credit, Solondz at least gives us some depth of character to see how they came to be so buggy (but not with all of them). It's painfully obvious he must've been the guy everyone picked on in school, for Solondz certainly understands the anguish of persecution (first film). He's good at showing the sad state of humanity, yet I wonder at times if he has compassion for his characters, or if he hates them. I think it's a little bit of both. Just when you feel sorry for the obese girl in "Happiness," thinking, aw, she's so sweet and mistreated, you discover she's a psychotic murderer, then you have to completely reevaluate her, and take her off her angelic pedestal. I think it's this kind of curveball he throws at his audience that I like about Solondz the best. Solondz big theme to me is: "We all suck. Let's laugh about it, and dance among the ruins." - -Mark Staples np Marshmallow Coast "Ride the Lightning" a fave teen movie moment: "Is this in 3-D?" "No, but your face is." (Nicolas Cage in "Valley Girl") ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:48:39 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] half-year Not shaping up as an amazing music year, for me anyway, and only the first two below I find consistently electrifying, but I'd have to choose from: Pere Ubu, ST. ARKANSAS Richard Youngs, MAY David Bowie, HEATHEN Bryan Ferry, FRANTIC Norah Jones, COME AWAY WITH ME Cassandra Wilson, BELLY OF THE SUN Warren Zevon, MY RIDE'S HERE The Extra Glenns, MARTIAL ARTS WEEKEND discovery from 2001: the Yeah Yeah Yeahs Have high hopes for: Anna Waronker, ANNA; Rush, VAPOR TRAILS; DJ Shadow, PRIVATE PRESS O what I'd give to own the Braillettes, Andy "The big whitehead's blatant manipulation of the studio herd is as patronizing as it is boring. On one recent show (hot topic: should agrisexuals be allowed near the winter wheat?), [Donahue] asked his victim, 'Why is it alright for pigs to sleep with their parents, and not humans?'" - --Rick Johnson, from his review of DONAHUE: MY STORY, "Creem" magazine, 1980 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:56:48 -0400 From: jenny grover Subject: [loud-fans] [Fwd: Mission of Burma update!] Rebecca Berman wrote: > > We are less than a week away from the West Coast dates and the opening acts > have been announced. Silkworm will play all three dates and Mike Watt and > the Secondmen will play Los Angeles and San Francisco. There are tickets > left everywhere but they are moving fast especially at The Fillmore. Go here > to link to buy tickets. > > Seattle: http://www.emplive.com/visit/calendar/index.asp?m=7&y=2002&d=24 > > San Francisco: > http://ticketing.ticketmaster.com/cgi/purchasePage.asp?event_id=1C0034B7D240 > 75F8&event_code=EFL0726&actname=MISSION_OF_BURMA&majorcatid=10001&minorcatid > =1%20 > > Los Angeles: > http://ticketing.ticketmaster.com/cgi/purchasePage.asp?event_id=90034C5DA7FC > 2FA&event_code=EEL0727&actname=MISSION_OF_BURMA&majorcatid=10001&minorcatid= > 1%20%0D > > The band has been rehearsing and you can expect the usual Inexplicability > that the other 2002 dates have offered. We will have updated shirts with the > West Coast dates. The band is expected to do a KUSF interview on Friday the > 26th, www.kusf.org. We will keep you posted on additional media exposure. > See you in the pit. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:34:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [loud-fans] The sound of silence (c) J Cage (fwd) apologies to the handful of you who might already have seen this... - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:29:26 +0100 From: rob@ Subject: The sound of silence (c) J Cage http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/entertainment/music/newsid_2133000/2133426.stm In case that doesn't wrap well - here's the shorter link: http://makeashorterlink.com/?X5CF26A41 Rob ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:54:39 -0400 From: Dana Paoli Subject: [loud-fans] Stooges question + (ns) I spent a lot of time trying to figure this out tonight, but failed, and was hoping that someone else could help. I have (somewhere, probably in storage) a vinyl lp called "Kill City" (I think. Now I'm wondering if it's called "I Got A Right") that has a somewhat different track listing than the "Kill City" CD that I see around. The lp was almost surely on Bomp, probably from the early '80s. I'm almost certain that it wasn't the same as the demos CD that's currently available...the cover looked a lot like the "I Got A Right" CD that's listed at allumusic, but that CD seems to consist of multiple versions of the "I Got A Right" single. On the back of my album there was an essay about the record's conception (sneaking Iggy out of lock-up...). I'd really like to find a CD version of the album I had. Anyone have any idea what this was, *or* a link to a complete Iggy Pop discography that has photos of the album covers as well as track listings. I'm wondering if the vinyl release of "Kill City" had a different track listing than the CD reissue, or what. Also, I have an extra lp mailer that I received something in, and rather than throw it away, I'd be happy to use it to send one of my extra records to a deserving home. Nothing extraordinary jumps out at me, but I have unneeded copies of: The Millenium "Begin" Pop Romantique (indie-folk, including apples and mag fields cover french pop) Laibach "Sympathy For the Devil" Game Theory "Real Nighttime" The Donner Party's first album If any one person wants one or two of these they're yours. - --dana ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 00:50:06 EDT From: Boyof100lists@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] computer challenged...won't you help? I let a friend at work borrow a Game Theory CD to burn (well, a CD-R of a CD...I'm not THAT free with them these days...entropy and all). Anyway, he told me he got the track listing off the net, off a website...somehow the CD-R I let him borrow was read and a track listing supplied. I figured this was the perfect place to ask, since most Loudfans without a computer are like a feminist without a bicycle or something like that. Alright Lucy, 'splain. - -Mark Staples ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 23:02:13 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] computer challenged...won't you help? At Friday 7/19/2002 12:50 AM -0400, Boyof100lists@aol.com wrote: >I let a friend at work borrow a Game Theory CD to burn (well, a CD-R of a >CD...I'm not THAT free with them these days...entropy and all). Anyway, he >told me he got the track listing off the net, off a website...somehow the >CD-R I let him borrow was read and a track listing supplied. I figured this >was the perfect place to ask, since most Loudfans without a computer are like >a feminist without a bicycle or something like that. > >Alright Lucy, 'splain. That would be the CD Database (CDDB): http://www.gracenote.com/music/FAQs.html/faqset=cddb2 Freaky thing: When I burned a CD-R of the Buffy "Once More With Feeling" MP3s from that website that someone here posted about awhile back, the CDDB actually recognized it. I hear it keys on the track directory, so all CDs with the same number of tracks each of the same length will be recognized as the same CD. Latre. --Rog ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V2 #248 *******************************