From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V2 #228 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Sunday, June 30 2002 Volume 02 : Number 228 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] A momentary lapse of lurking [OptionsR@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] convincing arguments(?) - plus (no, really) a contest! [D] [loud-fans] FRTR [Boyof100lists@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] FRTR ["John Sharples" ] Re: [loud-fans] FRTR ["Andrew Hamlin" ] [loud-fans] I'm So Lucky [Tim_Walters@digidesign.com] Re: [loud-fans] convincing arguments - plus, a contest! [Jeffrey with 2 F] Re: [loud-fans] convincing arguments(?) - plus (no, really) a contest! [] Re: [loud-fans] FRTR [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: [loud-fans] FRTR [Sue Trowbridge ] Re: [loud-fans] FRTR [jenny grover ] Re: [loud-fans] FRTR [Tim_Walters@digidesign.com] [loud-fans] Aimee Mann in Performing Songwriter magazine [Boyof100lists@a] Re: [loud-fans] Aimee Mann in Performing Songwriter magazine [AWeiss4338@] Re: [loud-fans] A momentary lapse of lurking [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey <] [loud-fans] "Groundhog meat" should read "Ground hog meat" [OptionsR@aol.] [loud-fans] Being sucked in again... [OptionsR@aol.com] [loud-fans] a few good words (ns) [Dana Paoli ] Re: [loud-fans] "Groundhog meat" should read "Ground hog meat" [Boyof100l] Re: [loud-fans] A momentary lapse of lurking [Michael Mitton ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 04:02:06 EDT From: OptionsR@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] A momentary lapse of lurking 'Evening, all... I've accumulated enough list-related thoughts to go ahead and delurk for a moment. So here goes, in no logical order: 1. I came across a couple of familiar names among the contributors to the really swell UK mag Mojo sort of recently. I finally decided to catch an episode of "Gilmore Girls" after reading Stewart Mason's piece about it, and now I'm hooked. Of course, since the character of Lorelei reminds me more than slightly of someone I know and crave, and I've had what you could euphemistically consider a "thing " for Lauren Graham ever since her brief appearances on "News Radio" a few years ago (which reminds me - anyone else see The Kids In The Hall on their last reunion tour a month or so ago...did they appear at every show as if they were seconds from punching each other out, or was that something they did especially for the Phoenix crowd?), I was sure to get to it sooner or later anyway. But thanks to Stewart, it was sooner. Also, I dug J.R. Taylor's piece on Muhammad Ali (or, more specifically, his album) a couple issues later. It did pique my interest enough to check out a special on Ali that was on PBS a few weeks ago. Normally, I find boxing as interesting as, say, listening to The White Stripes (hint: I don't mean that as a compliment), but after learning a bit more about Ali, he really comes off as a pretty stand-up sort of guy, a positive-minded person and not the Sixties equivalent of an uberfreak like Mike Tyson (I laughed when Lennox Lewis pummelled that mutant' s ass), as I originally was inclined to believe. So, to Stewart and J.R., thanks for the minor enlightment (insert Catholic priest joke here). 2. What the hell is happening? Guided By Voices and Sonic Youth make their first albums since the early Nineties that I'd actually consider spending money on (maybe not even waiting for them to turn up used first!), and David Bowie and Bryan Ferry make their first albums in literally decades that I could stay awake though from start to finish (not that they're great, but they're both better than I expected). Not to mention the first Sex Pistols compilation that look like it took more than twenty minutes to prepare (I mean the box set, though I love that cover shot on "Jubilee"), "The Velvet Underground & Nico" being reissued in MONO (not as much of a revelation as I'd been led to believe, but different enough to my ears to make it a worthwhile purchase), Love's "Da Capo" getting a much-needed remastering (it also gets the stereo/mono treatment too), and even...."The Moray Eels Eat The Holy Modal Rounders", finally on CD! Hearing Sam Shepard (yeah, THAT Sam Shepard) forget the words to the Pledge of Allegiance is worth the purchase price alone, plus you also get some prime Stampfel/Weber dementia. Wow, I'm almost smiling! News flash: Agoraphobic Nosebleed's "Frozen Corpse Stuffed With Dope" is now finally out too. Oh, that's right...no one else on this list owns anything on Relapse. 3. So am I going to have to buy the new LF live album online or is there some kind of distribution deal set up with someone? 4. Politics: Hey, why not call them "potentially fatal injury bombers"? That way, all your bases are covered, and nobody's feelings get hurt even if the explosion fails to kill everyone. Remember, political correctness is more important than factual accuracy when reporting. After all, why report bad news if it's just going to make someone upset? 5. "Y Tu Mama, Tambien" is a friggin' riot of a movie. If you haven't seen it, you should. 6. Bruce Campbell. He's the only one who could save the "Star Wars" franchise at this point. Have him be the guy that kills off Jar-Jar Binks. Are you with me on this one, people? 7. Sad news about John Entwistle. "Success Story" was one of my all-time favorite Who numbers (definitely my favorte post-"Quadrophenia" Who tune), and his playing did more to keep them from being pigeonholed as a gimmick band than people are willing to give credit for. Then there's Dee Dee Ramone's passing, too (about as much of a surprise as hearing that the new Breeders album sucks)...morbid as it is to say, if anyone's running a "dead pool", I think Lemmy'll be the next star bassist to check out of the Hard Rock Hotel. He's almost as old as Entwistle, and he's in only slightly better shape than Dee Dee (he's made it this far by avoiding heroin entirely, otherwise...he's hardly Christian Bale, is he?). I hate to say that since Motorhead were pretty much my Favorite Band In The Universe from about 1980 until they moved to L.A. But, c'est la mort, I guess. 8. I forget what 8 was for. 9. "Ghost World": Yes, Mark Staples, I'd say it's a good 'un. Worth it if only to see Steve Buscemi play a somewhat humane character in a movie he didn't direct himself. But yet there is so much more than that, too. 10. Paul Cook? Since when did he play bass? Or did you mean Glen Matlock? 11. I frequently check the online version of The Chicago Reader's convert listings to remind myself of how stupid I was to return to this smoldering dungheap (you folks can call it Maricopa County, Arizona). I believe it wasn't long ago that over four consecutive nights were gigs from The Hellacopters, Robyn Hitchcock, Dan Hicks, and Super Furry Animals. Grrrrrrr. I wound up having to drive to Tucson to catch GBV a couple weeks ago. I would have like them more if their set hadn't gone on for something like four-and-a-half days. That's what it seemed like to me. Editing and restraint have never been high on Robert Pollard's list of priorities, apparently. Opening band My Morning Jacket rocked a lot more than they did on that earlier album of theirs on Darla I used to have. No complaints there. 12. I thought Steve Wynn's "Here Come The Miracles" was the best album of last year, with Lucinda Williams' "Essence" and the Tenacious D album not far behind. If you disagree, you are obviously wrong and I'm not interested in wasting my time discussing it. Not like anyone really cares, but I still hate my job (the software-testing gig flopped big-time, so I'm back in record retail yet again), hate this city, and hate myself in general. Pretty much where I was last time I posted, then. It's back to the shadows for me, bozos. See you on The Funway! Mike Bollman "Of course I've been drinking! I just came from a cocktail party!" - Adam West, in some Seventies movie I can't remember the name of - Sammy Davis Jr. might have been in it too ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 04:28:26 -0400 From: Dave Walker Subject: Re: [loud-fans] convincing arguments(?) - plus (no, really) a contest! On Saturday, June 29, 2002, at 01:40 AM, Andrew Hamlin wrote: > The tour's back on, I see. No word on the bass player though. That seems really weird to me, them touring with anyone else. I mean, Entwistle was in the band for over 35 freaking years! > Flea, Paul Cook, or James William Guerico--cast your vote now! Tony Levin, on Chapman Stick. - -- Dave Walker freeform radio and live, nude fish at: http://www.freeke.org/ffg ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 06:41:25 EDT From: Boyof100lists@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] FRTR Thankyou Sue Trowbridge and Joe Mallon and all involved for the new record. It arrived yesterday before leaving for work. I've played it through several times now, and the sound qualitiy and the seamlessness of the recordings is remakable. A casual listener would not be able to tell that this is from two different shows in different years, though most loud-fans would probably recognize Gil Ray's signature drum style in telling a difference. A guy I work with said, "Who is that? That sounds good." This should definitely ean a heavy rotated place in the loud-fan's collection, to the point where you know all the nuances, like when you know that guy is gonna whistle in the audience in Elton John's "Bennie and the Jets." Vivebon125. Never borrow money from a man with no sense of humor, - -Mark np The Possibilities "Way Out" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 09:17:40 -0400 From: "John Sharples" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] FRTR Mark: >A guy I >work with said, "Who is that? That sounds good." Well, Sue, Joe, there's your first pull quote! AP is reporting Pino Palladino as Entwistle's replacement when the tour resumes at Hollywood Bowl. JS ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 07:58:43 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] FRTR >AP is reporting Pino Palladino as Entwistle's replacement when the tour >resumes at Hollywood Bowl. Ah yes, I'm sure he'll do much better than Paul Cook. -) A pity Dave Alexander can't be here... Okay, you win, it's the Legendary Stardust Cowboy, Andy By RON FOURNIER, AP White House Correspondent WASHINGTON (AP) - President Bush ( news - web sites) says he is briefly transferring the powers of the presidency to Vice President Dick Cheney news - web sites) on Saturday while under sedation for a colon screening. For only the second time since its adoption, the 25th Amendment of the Constitution will be invoked and Cheney will be acting president for "a matter of hours," White House counsel Al Gonzales said after the surprise announcement Friday. The procedure  a colonoscopy  was being conducted as the Camp David, Md., presidential retreat by a team of military doctors overseen by the White House physician, Dr. Richard Tubb. Bush, who turns 56 next week, said Friday that doctors recommended the colonoscopy because benign polyps were found in two previous checks. It is considered a standard preventive procedure for people his age. Before boarding his helicopter for Camp David, the president said he decided to transfer powers to Cheney out of extra caution because the nation is at war against terrorism. Cheney will be "standing by. He realizes he's not going to be president that long," the president said with a chuckle. A colonoscopy is considered the best way to examine the colon and to find and remove polyps before they become cancerous. Colon cancer kills more than 50,000 Americans annually and is the second leading cause of cancer death in the United States, behind lung cancer. The procedure, performed regularly, is thought to reduce the risk of colon cancer by up to 90 percent. More than 2 million are performed annually in this country. The procedure uses a flexible tube containing an optical scope equipped with a surgical cutter that enables the doctor to view the entire length of the colon and remove any polyps discovered. Generally, physicians recommend that people after the age of 50 receive a colonoscopy every three to five years, depending on the patient's personal and family history of colon cancer. For some patients, the procedure is done annually. Tubb said Friday that Bush underwent the same procedure in July 1998 and December 1999  while governor of Texas  and both times two polyps were found. "This is preventive medicine at its finest," the doctor said. "If you're over 50 you ought to make it part of your practice as well." Gonzales, the White House counsel, said Section 3 of the 25th Amendment  enacted in 1967, four years after President Kennedy's assassination  was invoked one other time: when President Reagan underwent surgery for colon cancer July 13, 1985. White House spokesman Ari Fleischer ( news - web sites) said the administration would announce that the powers of the presidency were transferred only after Bush recovered from sedation and took back control. Bush disclosed plans for the examination in good spirits Friday, joking with reporters about the uncomfortable procedure and ending the exchange, "I'm glad to be able to share that with you." He said there were "no signs, no symptoms" of trouble and he expected to exercise soon after the exam. Tubb, an Air Force colonel, said a sedative called propofol would be administered to Bush through an intravenous line. It takes effect in a minute or less and wears off quickly. Tubb was being joined by a military medical team led by endoscopist James Butler, a Navy captain and chief of gastroenterology at the National Naval Medical Center in Bethesda, Md. The level of sedation  including whether Bush is fully unconscious  was being decided depending on the president's comfort level, Tubb said. Bush said the test is routine but the times are not, the reason he will be transferring power. "I'm the first president to have done so under this type of procedure and/or physical examination. I did so because we're at war," Bush said. Cheney will be in Washington. [--from http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&ncid=716&e=2&u=/ap/20020 629/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_medical_14 ] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 08:18:44 -0700 From: Tim_Walters@digidesign.com Subject: [loud-fans] I'm So Lucky I was playing ping-pong yesterday, and instead of making a clean serve, I caught the ball on the edge of the table. It popped up very high, almost to the ceiling. My opponent and I had plenty of time to laugh about it while he waited for the meatball. As it turned out, though, the ball dinked off *his* edge of the table for an unhittable ace. And if that doesn't convince you that I'm tight with Lady Luck, consider this: I pledge, under God, that the 11:22 thing is just a coincidence, at least on FRTR. In fact, this is the first I've heard of it, or even associated the line "Elm Street crawlers" with the Kennedy assassination. I hope I'm not ruining a good story by revealing this, but I think it's even more impressive as coincidence than as conspiracy. Time for that weekend in Vegas, I guess. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 13:40:12 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] convincing arguments - plus, a contest! On Fri, 28 Jun 2002, Matthew Weber wrote: > FRTR kicks ass, by the way. Knowing that I'm one of those tipsy > louts in the background yelling "whooooooo!" after the songs recorded > at the BotH adds an extra dimension for me. :) Yes, ass it kicks, Yoda. Didn't make the CD, but...that MP3 of "Sexy Sadie" on the LF site? The tipsy lout ha-ha'ing a request for "Revolution No. 9" after someone mentions a Beatles cover? That would be me... - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::Never drive a car when you're dead:: __Tom Waits__ np: purring lapcat ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 13:44:44 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] convincing arguments(?) - plus (no, really) a contest! On Fri, 28 Jun 2002, Andrew Hamlin wrote: > The tour's back on, I see. No word on the bass player though. According to someone over on Fegmaniax, that would be Pino Palladino - who, I believe, played some of those farty electric fretless lines on one of the lamer Gary Numan albums of the eighties. I can't imagine that sound fitting in with The 'Oo... - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::No man is an island. ::But if you take a bunch of dead guys and tie 'em together, ::they make a pretty good raft. __Max Cannon__ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 13:49:36 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] FRTR On Sat, 29 Jun 2002 Boyof100lists@aol.com wrote: > Thankyou Sue Trowbridge and Joe Mallon and all involved for the new record. > It arrived yesterday before leaving for work. Wow, you're harsh. Usually, I let my new records hang around the house a bit getting comfortable before sending them off to work. Some of my *favorite* records (wink, wink) have never worked a day in their lives - except lying flat, if you know what I mean. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::I feel that all movies should have things that happen in them:: __TV's Frank__ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 15:05:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Sue Trowbridge Subject: Re: [loud-fans] FRTR On Sat, 29 Jun 2002 Boyof100lists@aol.com wrote: > Thankyou Sue Trowbridge and Joe Mallon and all involved for the new record. Glad you're enjoying it -- but I wanted to make sure everyone who thanks *us* also thanks Tim Walters, who is the real hero of this CD. He mixed a good portion of it, he mastered it, he even did the cover layout (from Scott's design ideas). AND he did the T-shirt graphics. Yay Tim! And even though he's not on the list, Steve Vernon really got the ball rolling by providing us with a recording of the Hotel Utah show. I think this is a real "by the fans, for the fans" project. - --Sue ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 16:01:32 -0400 From: jenny grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] FRTR Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > > On Sat, 29 Jun 2002 Boyof100lists@aol.com wrote: > > > Thankyou Sue Trowbridge and Joe Mallon and all involved for the new record. > > It arrived yesterday before leaving for work. > > Wow, you're harsh. Usually, I let my new records hang around the house a > bit getting comfortable before sending them off to work. I guess I'm harsh, too. When I got my FRTR I made it skip lunch and whisked it off in the car for a full afternoon of running errands and shopping. Poor thing had to sit in a hot car for long periods of time, and I didn't even crack a window for it. I guess the SPCCD could get me on that one. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 18:00:03 -0700 From: Tim_Walters@digidesign.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] FRTR Aw, shucks, ma'am. 'Tweren't nothin'. That varmint was more skeert o' you than you was o' him anyhow. Seriously, it was a pleasure and a privilege. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 22:17:36 EDT From: Boyof100lists@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] Aimee Mann in Performing Songwriter magazine If anyone's interested, (and if this hasn't been brought up before) the cover story in June's edition of Performing Songwriter magazine is an interview with Aimee Mann, and it's a good 'un: "I had to get to the point where I would rather have sold records out of the back of a van than stay on a major label. Or sell records on the Internet, which is pretty close to selling records out of the back of a van (laughs)." The mag is worth buying just for the cover alone, which is a striking picture of Aimee. She still has those amazing eyes that give Judy Collins a run for her money. - -Mark Staples np The Blue Aeroplanes "Beatsongs" (suddenly, it's 1991) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 23:59:14 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Aimee Mann in Performing Songwriter magazine In a message dated 6/29/2002 10:18:04 PM Eastern Standard Time, Boyof100lists@aol.com writes: > If anyone's interested, (and if this hasn't been brought up before) the > cover > story in June's edition of Performing Songwriter magazine is an interview > with Aimee Mann, and it's a good 'un: > > "I had to get to the point where I would rather have sold records out of > the > back of a van than stay on a major label. Or sell records on the Internet, > which is pretty close to selling records out of the back of a van (laughs)." > > The mag is worth buying just for the cover alone, which is a striking > picture > of Aimee. She still has those amazing eyes that give Judy Collins a run > for > her money. > And i second this. It's a great interview, and i like how they get into what it takes to self release an album, and what they did with Bachelor #2. There is also an interview with Michael hausman, Aimee's manager, about United Musicans, the co-op label he and Aimee run, and some more info on Aimee's new album. Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 22:59:23 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] A momentary lapse of lurking On Sat, 29 Jun 2002 OptionsR@aol.com wrote: > now I'm hooked. Of course, since the character of Lorelei reminds me more > than slightly of someone I know and crave, and I've had what you could > euphemistically consider a "thing " for Lauren Graham ever since her brief > appearances on "News Radio" a few years ago I'm shocked - shocked - that someone might have a "thing" for Lauren Graham. Damn. Not much good at that irony thing all the kids are so het up about, am I. > 4. Politics: Hey, why not call them "potentially fatal injury bombers"? That > way, all your bases are covered, and nobody's feelings get hurt even if the > explosion fails to kill everyone. Remember, political correctness is more > important than factual accuracy when reporting. After all, why report bad > news if it's just going to make someone upset? Actually, what they should do is jerk off on the bombs first, and call themselves "potentially fetal injury bombers," cuz with the vanishingly small, Tom Waitsian chance that someone might thereby be impregnated, anti-choice folks would be gored on the horns of a truly ugly dilemma, doncha think. Okay, that was pretty sick even for me. > 8. I forget what 8 was for. It's for the reissue of the Violent Femmes first album, with a buntload of bonus tracks, that's pretty much essential purchasing for every sentient human. > 9. "Ghost World": Yes, Mark Staples, I'd say it's a good 'un. Worth it if > only to see Steve Buscemi play a somewhat humane character in a movie he > didn't direct himself. But yet there is so much more than that, too. Yes, mad props for _Ghost World_. Speaking of movies, I've got a question for some of you movie buffs on the list (is West still here?). When did film credits start becoming ten-minute productions? I've just rented a bunch of movies from the seventies (last one: _The Conversation_, with a creepy-looking young Harrison Ford in a minor role, and Gene Hackman with a mustache and glasses that made him look like he's wearing a disguise full-time), and they seemed content to credit actors, director, etc. - none of this "Burt Sprendleheap - Underassistant Croissant-Butterer" crap. I seem to recall that the first showings of _Apocalypse Now_ - at Coppola's insistence - had no end credits at all, with the info intended to be distributed in a sort of libretto at the theaters. Now, of course, you've got to have your dumbass rap-rock-kidpop crossover hit cover of a lame seventies song, which has nothing to do with the movie, pummeling you over the head twice as loud as anything in the movie as you, foolishly persistent in your "the credits are part of the movie, and I'm not leaving till I see the little logo thingy at the very end, and the bit about everyone being fictitious" attitude, scan the credits for amusing names to say aloud to the people you're with to demonstrate how clever you are. "Hey look - 'Henk Dikman'! 'Felicia Head'!" - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::glibby glop gloopy nibby nobby noopy la la la la lo:: ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 00:12:23 EDT From: OptionsR@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] "Groundhog meat" should read "Ground hog meat" Re: my de-lurk post In part 11, "convert" should have been "concert". Near as I can tell, The Chicago Reader does not have convert listings. But wouldn't it be great if they did? Also, in the cool-new-releases department, there's a new Wire EP out called "Read & Burn". I think US distribution is through Revolver if that helps you find it any easier. The sleeve credits say it was mixed by Colin Newman in London, but the lack of any producer/engineer credits leads me to believe it's the recordings they made with Steve Albini in Chicago a couple years back. Well, that and the really obvious drum sound. Musically, they sound like they're getting back into the "beat-combo" mode in a huge way, and it does rock righteously. I see they're touring again this fall, and they're avoiding playing Arizona again. Considering how strong they sound on this new EP, I may have to fly back out to Chicago again (if they get The Fucking Champs to open for them, I'll skateboard my way there if I have to). Re: Dana - Well, I certainly haven't heard anyone say many good words about it yet, not even here - and Loudfans like everything (tee hee). New thread idea: what is the worst album you have ever bought (as in not a promo, not a gift...something you actually forked over your hard-earned cash for)? Back to Chicago again for a moment...I see from the Reader listings that Arthur Lee is out of jail and touring with Baby Lemonade - oops, I mean Love again. Sure enough, no Arizona gigs. So what's our consolation prize? Sky Saxon and The Seeds. Oh, neato. It's all in the art of stopping, Mike Bollman ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 00:55:56 EDT From: OptionsR@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] Being sucked in again... In a message dated 06/29/2002 8:59:58 PM US Mountain Standard Time, jenor@csd.uwm.edu writes: > Speaking of movies, I've got a question for some of you movie buffs on the > list (is West still here?). When did film credits start becoming > ten-minute productions? Good question. Maybe it was another one of the ways "Star Wars" changed the biz, and it's all just sprawling from there. Then again, one sholdn't underestimate the enormous influence of Hal Needham's "Cannonball Run" with its "outtakes and bloopers" sidebar (back to "Ghost World" for a moment, there's a different take of the scene where Steve Buscemi loses his temper in the convenience store that appears right after the end credits finish - it cheered me up after that ending). You know, short credit sequences seem to help leave a longer lasting impression of the ending of the film. I'd guess it's because there's less opportunity to collect your thoughts, so you think about the movie all the way back home as opposed to forgetting what it was about even before you get out to your car. The conclusions to films like "Five Easy Pieces" and "Two-Lane Blacktop" would have felt diluted if they were followed by a ten- minute credit crawl. When I worked at a movie theatre ages ago, we once had a Werner Herzog film called "Where The Green Ants Dream" that had no end credits - it just stopped. Maybe it was just the print we had, but I've never seen it on video so I can't verify if that effect was intentional. If a film-maker insists on doing an extended end-credit sequence, the least the filmmaker could do is add some Zucker Brothers-style jokes hidden throughout to break the tedium. Crediting bit-part players by their lines of dialogue makes perfect sense to me. I have seen the movie "Skidoo", in which features end credits are sung (by Harry Nilsson, no less). Somehow I doubt this practice would catch on today, though. Burt Sprundleheap is the best there is, and don't you forget it! Mike Bollman "Stick around, this should be fun." "Not with Claude Akins in it." -Timothy Van Patten in "Master Ninja", and Crow T. Robot's reply ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 01:00:29 -0400 From: Dana Paoli Subject: [loud-fans] a few good words (ns) Re: The Breeders, Mike said: Well, I certainly haven't heard anyone say many good words about it yet, not even here - and Loudfans like everything (tee hee). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Here's a pretty good review that gets many of the plusses and minuses right, from pitchfork: http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/record-reviews/b/breeders/title-tk.shtml Here's another thumbs up: http://www.2-4-7-music.com/newsitems/may02/breeders.asp Here's another: http://www.bbc.co.uk/manchester/music/reviews/albums/2002/05/27/title_tk. shtml Here's another: http://www.illinimedia.com/buzz/2002/06/27/music/stories/cd01.shtml You get the idea: Title TK is flawed but good. The most accurate part of the following review from Allmusic may be the part about "take it or leave it." "For most of the '90s, the Breeders seemed resigned to being just a part of alternative rock's mythology: a lightning-in-a-bottle success story that helped define the era's sound and spawned a classic single before disappearing into substance abuse and a severe case of writer's block. By the end of the decade, hearing new material from Kim Deal and company seemed about as likely as a new My Bloody Valentine album, so the fact that Title TK, their long-awaited return, exists at all seems more than a little miraculous. In a weird way, the long, long wait for them to resurface works in their favor  at this point, it's welcome to hear anything from them. After a nine-year (!) wait, a new Breeders album is just a nice addition to what's going on in indie-rock instead of its salvation. From its very name, Title TK (journalistic shorthand for "title to come") reflects this: It's a surprisingly low-key, self-effacing return that doesn't feel like an attempt at reclaiming Last Splash's glory. Instead, it blends the stripped-down sounds of Pod and the Amps' Pacer into a collection of strangely intimate, feminine garage rock. Steve Albini's quick- and cheap-sounding production throws a spotlight on the weathered, offhand quality of Kim Deal's voice  which is more sandpaper than sugar nowadays  as well as every quirk in the band's playing. Even revved-up guitar rushes like "Little Fury" and "Huffer" have a little vulnerability lurking around the edges, and on the sweet "Too Alive," it sounds like you're in the garage with the band. There's a fascinating duality to Title TK, from the way that nearly every song mixes and blends Kim and Kelley's not-quite-identical vocals to the way it switches between sweet, playfully spiky songs like "Son of Three" and "Forced to Drive" and dark, mysterious tracks. With its brooding, druggy allure, "The She" recalls Jefferson Airplane's "White Rabbit," and "Put On a Side" and the aptly named "Sinister Foxx" have a sexy menace that the Breeders haven't explored since Pod. "Off You," Title TK's first single, is about as far from "Cannonball" as the band can get, a dreamy, breathy ballad that sounds intimate but masks its feelings in beautifully cryptic imagery. Very much a take-it-or-leave-it work, Title TK doesn't even try to live up to fans' inflated expectations of what a Breeders album should be  though the band may not have spent the entire nine years they were gone crafting this album, it feels like the only album they could make after such a long wait. Title TK isn't always a flattering portrait of the Breeders, but it is an admirably honest one."  Heather Phares There are also a bunch of good-to-great reviews at Amazon.com, but you can't really trust the reviews at that site. I can see where people (and especially the fans whom the Breeders picked up w/Last Splash) might be unimpressed, but I think that that's mainly based on its failure to conform to their expectations, as noted above. Also, in most of the negative reviews, there seems to be some sort of reference to the idea that after so many years the results should have been better, which is a pretty odd reason to criticize a record. Regardless of its origin, it's here now. I dig it, and I hope that other folks who might end up liking it won't get scared away. - --dana ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 01:58:52 EDT From: Boyof100lists@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] "Groundhog meat" should read "Ground hog meat" In a message dated 6/30/02 12:13:03 AM Eastern Daylight Time, OptionsR@aol.com writes: > New thread idea: what is the worst album you have ever bought (as in not a > promo, not a gift...something you actually forked over your hard-earned > cash > for)? > > I bought The Raunch Hands' "El Rauncho Grande" in 1987 I believe it was, as a cutout, for a couple of bucks. I don't know, I thought it was just pretty bad. It seemed like the band was having a lot of fun at the listeners' expense. Maybe with 15 years on me I'd like it better now. They were on Relativity, so that has to mean something. But what do I know? I paid real money to see Animotion in 12th grade, performing at the world renowned Spartanburg Memorial Auditorium. - -Mark Staples np The Mysteries of Life "Distant Relative" "Jason tries to be warm and out-going whenever his fans are concerned. Fans are fans simply because they look up to the person they like. If you're an asshole this relationship is doomed from the git-go. Once after a show at the High Hat (R.I.P.), Jason totally blew off a girl who wanted to rave to him about the freaky keyboard stylings on 'Coming in Waves.' Turned out that girl later became Scarlett Johansen." (from the liner notes of the Possibilities' "Way Out" lp, a great Athens, GA (if that means anything) band on Parasol records. Jason Gonzalez is the keyboardist and vocalist. A friend of mine's roommate, the main guy in the Athens band Drive by Truckers, describes them as "what the Beach Boys would sound like had they grown up playing in a Ramones cover band in S. Georgia") ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 02:34:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Mitton Subject: Re: [loud-fans] A momentary lapse of lurking On Sat, 29 Jun 2002, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > Speaking of movies, I've got a question for some of you movie buffs on the > list (is West still here?). When did film credits start becoming > ten-minute productions? I've just rented a bunch of movies from the > that the first showings of _Apocalypse Now_ - at Coppola's insistence - > had no end credits at all, with the info intended to be distributed in a > sort of libretto at the theaters. Now, of course, you've got to have your Hmm, *I* seem to recall, and I know not from where, that the first movie to credit every last assistant driver was "Apocalypse Now." The story I heard is that since they had such budget problems on the film, people didn't get paid what they were supposed to have been paid, so Coppola put everyone in the credits to make them feel better. The tradition stuck from there. But like I said, I don't know where heard this story, and don't know if it's true. - --Michael ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 02:39:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Mitton Subject: [loud-fans] Flaming Lips I know there are some Flaming Lips fans on list, so I thought I'd mention that at the moment, you can stream their new album on their website: http://www.flaminglips.com Haven't listened yet, myself, - --Michael ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V2 #228 *******************************