From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V2 #169 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Saturday, May 11 2002 Volume 02 : Number 169 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] apropos of nothing much [dmw ] [loud-fans] freeway hacking [Dave Walker ] Re: Re: [loud-fans] Obligatory Movie Update ["jer fairall" ] Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh ["John Sharples" ] Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh ["John Sharples" ] [loud-fans] every great swap deserves a rave review [Steve Holtebeck ] Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh ["Grahame Davies" ] Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies [AWeiss4338@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies ["John Sharples" ] Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh [Michael Zwirn ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 10:16:04 -0400 (EDT) From: dmw Subject: [loud-fans] apropos of nothing much the picture at www.google.com today is my favorite google logo ever, so far. - -- d. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 10:21:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Dave Walker Subject: [loud-fans] freeway hacking Cool story: http://latimes.com/news/local/la-050902artist.story -d.w. np: Md - Gaps ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 11:30:58 -0400 From: "jer fairall" Subject: Re: Re: [loud-fans] Obligatory Movie Update I thought _Unbreakable_ and _X-Men_ were both vastly superior as movies about people discovering their own powers. Oh, I'll certainly agree that UNBREAKABLE was a far better movie, but I went to SPIDER-MAN expecting a comic book and, as with Warren Beatty's version of DICK TRACY (which I seem to be nearly alone in loving), I thought it worked quite well on comic book terms. And as for the costumes, at least the Spider-Man suit was kept as it was originally and nothing like that stupid S&M leather-daddy outfit that George Clooney had in the last BATMAN. Jer np: Mates of State, OUR CONSTANT CONCERN http://www.care2.com - Get your Free e-mail account that helps save Wildlife! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 11:58:49 -0400 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh Oh man what a show last night! First the debut of the Crackpots, Mitch Easter's new band. The band is essentially the same as the Shalini band, it's just fronted by Mitch under a different banner. Eric and Shalini were just a bit nervous before the show with all the new songs and as Shalini put it, "they all have arrangements", so everyone had to learn their part. Shalini said the band had been doing a *lot* of practicing to get these songs down. Mitch looked resplendent in a knee length black Nehru jacket. The rest of the band were also all in black. It was a 10 song set with 7 being brand new to me and one a first time live. The first time live, was the song from the HIT THE HAY compilation called "Love Slaves to Paradise Lost". Two carry-overs from past Shalini shows were "You and Me" and "Sudden Crown Drop". I don't know anything about guitars but I would note that a few of the songs were on a 12 string electric (not a Rickenbacker). The songs generally sounded like a matured Let's Active, which I suppose is not too surprising, focusing on ballads. Absent was the full speed ahead sound AC/DC influenced sound of the recent Shalini shows. The Easter renaissance has begun! Next up were The Long Winters, a four piece including keyboards that hail from Seattle. They also later doubled as Ken Stringfellow's backing band. From the strength of their show I picked up their CD. The MP3s available from their website are a good indicator of their general sound. http://www.barsuk.com/web.cgi?lw&lwnews They're worth checking out and show a lot of promise as a new band. Ken did a couple of songs with them on backing vocals and then the band took a break before returning for Stringfellow's set. By the time Stringfellow took the stage it was approaching 1:00 and the crowd had surprisingly waned a bit to barely 30 people. Stringfellow jokingly asked if by joining the end of TLW's set had he run everyone off. He opened with a beautiful cover of "I'd Have You Any Time" from George Harrison's ALL THINGS MUST PASS, starting out stark and sweet and then thrashing on his silver glittered Danelectro as the crescendo comes. After asking the few remaining people to crowd the stage he proceeded to put on an intensely intimate performance for the next hour covering a variety of Posies songs and most of TOUCHED. I've never managed to catch any of the Posies show's so I have no point of reference but this was one really intense angst filled performance. It was exhausting just to watch his hour+ set. For the record Ken's hair was jet black and to the dismay of many a Mitch/Ken performance didn't materialize. - -LT ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 09:12:40 -0700 From: Michael Zwirn Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh On 5/10/02 8:58 AM, Larry Tucker wrote: > Next up were The Long Winters, a four piece including keyboards that > hail from Seattle. They also later doubled as Ken Stringfellow's backing > band. From the strength of their show I picked up their CD. The MP3s > available from their website are a good indicator of their general > sound. > http://www.barsuk.com/web.cgi?lw&lwnews > They're worth checking out and show a lot of promise as a new band. Ken > did a couple of songs with them on backing vocals and then the band took > a break before returning for Stringfellow's set. Julianne, Michael Mitton and I were really impressed by these guys when they opened for the Pernice Brothers. I didn't know their CD had been released yet. Michael - -- "When I do the fan dance I'm all the red in China I'm dialing life up on my telescope Fringe and mathematics" Sam Phillips ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 12:19:33 -0400 From: "John Sharples" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh Larry: He opened with a beautiful cover of "I'd Have You Any Time" from >George Harrison's ALL THINGS MUST PASS, starting out stark and sweet and >then thrashing on his silver glittered Danelectro as the crescendo >comes. Therein is my eternal complaint with the Posies, especially live. Nice songwriters, great taste in covers, good musicians - but as soon as you're enjoying them they suddenly start this asinine thrashing that sounds like shit. It comes across entirely unconvincing, like self-conscious pop wusses puffing themselves up to a higher weightclass. I always suspected it's because they came up in Seattle clubs at a time when thrash was a prerequisite, and it was something they had to do to avoid getting beaten up in the parking lot after. Anyway, they should just knock it off and be the powerpop weenies they really are. Chilton doesn't let them get away with that crap. JS ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 13:29:23 -0400 From: "Aaron Milenski" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh >Larry: > >He opened with a beautiful cover of "I'd Have You Any Time" from > >George Harrison's ALL THINGS MUST PASS, starting out stark and sweet and > >then thrashing on his silver glittered Danelectro as the crescendo > >comes. > John: >Therein is my eternal complaint with the Posies, especially live. Nice >songwriters, great taste in covers, good musicians - but as soon as you're >enjoying them they suddenly start this asinine thrashing that sounds like >shit. It comes across entirely unconvincing, like self-conscious pop >wusses >puffing themselves up to a higher weightclass. I always suspected it's >because they came up in Seattle clubs at a time when thrash was a >prerequisite, and it was something they had to do to avoid getting beaten >up >in the parking lot after. Anyway, they should just knock it off and be the >powerpop weenies they really are. Chilton doesn't let them get away with >that crap. I totally agree with John. The Posies were one of the worst live bands I ever saw because they were more interested in breaking strings, posing like rock stars and going into those stupid arena-rock extended endings than they were in playing or singing. It was awful. _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 13:32:11 +0000 From: Chris Burns Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh Seems like a good time to bring up The Posies performance with The Pernice Brothers at the Bowery Ballroom last summer. Jon and Ken got so drunk, it was painful to watch much less listen. It was shots of tequila all night, and by the end of the evening, they could barely hold on to their instruments. In fact, I think Ken threw or let go of his guitar into the crowd. I like to see the fellas have a good time, but this was awful. John Sharples wrote: > Larry: > > He opened with a beautiful cover of "I'd Have You Any Time" from > >George Harrison's ALL THINGS MUST PASS, starting out stark and sweet and > >then thrashing on his silver glittered Danelectro as the crescendo > >comes. > > Therein is my eternal complaint with the Posies, especially live. Nice > songwriters, great taste in covers, good musicians - but as soon as you're > enjoying them they suddenly start this asinine thrashing that sounds like > shit. It comes across entirely unconvincing, like self-conscious pop wusses > puffing themselves up to a higher weightclass. I always suspected it's > because they came up in Seattle clubs at a time when thrash was a > prerequisite, and it was something they had to do to avoid getting beaten up > in the parking lot after. Anyway, they should just knock it off and be the > powerpop weenies they really are. Chilton doesn't let them get away with > that crap. > > JS - -- Chris Burns Gravity Hill Media, Inc. Advertising Copywriting Services PO Box 408 Keyport, NJ 07735 732-739-1271 fax 732-264-9474 cburns@gravityhillmedia.com www.gravityhillmedia.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 13:57:23 -0400 From: "John Sharples" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh Chris: >Seems like a good time to bring up The Posies performance with The Pernice >Brothers at the Bowery Ballroom last summer. Jon and Ken got so drunk, it was >painful to watch much less listen. It was shots of tequila all night, and by >the end of the evening, they could barely hold on to their instruments. In fact, >I think Ken threw or let go of his guitar into the crowd. I like to see the >fellas have a good time, but this was awful. C'mon guys, it ain't '86 and you're not the Replacements, give it up. Yep, same as when I saw them at Tramps in '96. The thing I really resented about it is, in an effort to stay with Ken and Jon's plane of reference, I kept up with them drink for drink. Not only was the bar tab a fortune but then I passed out on the 3 train and ended up having to take a car service home from the Bronx. But like I said I've seen them a couple of times in Big Star and they are really wonderful when they're keeping their shit together. It's not just the drinking, though - I think what could have been their best album, FROSTING ON THE BEATER, is ruined by the way over-distorted (but not in that deep, warm pleasing way - rather, brittle and cheap) guitar sounds, that sounded so awkwardly mismatched to the material. I think they need to drop the rock-star trip. JS ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 13:57:10 -0400 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh |-----Original Message----- |From: Aaron Milenski [mailto:amilenski@hotmail.com] |Sent: Friday, May 10, 2002 1:29 PM |To: loud-fans@smoe.org |Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh | | |>Larry: |> |>He opened with a beautiful cover of "I'd Have You Any Time" from |> >George Harrison's ALL THINGS MUST PASS, starting out stark |and sweet |> >and then thrashing on his silver glittered Danelectro as the |> >crescendo comes. |> | |John: | |>Therein is my eternal complaint with the Posies, especially |live. Nice |>songwriters, great taste in covers, good musicians - but as soon as |>you're enjoying them they suddenly start this asinine thrashing that |>sounds like shit. It comes across entirely unconvincing, like |>self-conscious pop wusses puffing themselves up to a higher |>weightclass. I always suspected it's because they came up in Seattle |>clubs at a time when thrash was a prerequisite, and it was something |>they had to do to avoid getting beaten up |>in the parking lot after. Anyway, they should just knock it |off and be the |>powerpop weenies they really are. Chilton doesn't let them |get away with |>that crap. | |I totally agree with John. The Posies were one of the worst |live bands I |ever saw because they were more interested in breaking |strings, posing like |rock stars and going into those stupid arena-rock extended |endings than they |were in playing or singing. It was awful. Point taken from all, but it defense of this particular show it was well balanced, not done to excess and added tension at appropriate points in the song. I can only recall a couple of songs where the guitar thrashing became over the top. And on this night Ken was not drunk and a delight to talk to after the show and altogether quite personable. - -LT ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 13:04:47 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies Sharples wrote: >Came around on Aimee Mann and Jojo, Miles? Aimee Mann, mostly yes. Jon Brion's production on I'M WITH STUPID helped a lot, and once I started listening, I went back to WHATEVER and the Til Tuesday stuff. I'd still like to run all her pre-I'M WITH STUPID work through the deglossing machine, and I still think she'd sound even better with punchier, nosier production. Richman gets a pass based on THE MODERN LOVERS. But his other stuff still doesn't appeal to me. >Guess mine are equally established: Merritt, Cotton Mather, post-IRS REM. After UP and REVEAL, I'm not as inclined to argue the latter, since those two put the mediocre post-IRS albums in a clear majority. Maybe it's a plot to make GREEN sound like a five-star album. Nevertheless, I still rank OUT OF TIME and NEW ADVENTURES IN HI-FI with their best, and MONSTER not far behind. John again, soon echoed by the once (and future?) Pudman: >Therein is my eternal complaint with the Posies, especially live. Nice >songwriters, great taste in covers, good musicians - but as soon as you're >enjoying them they suddenly start this asinine thrashing that sounds like >shit. It comes across entirely unconvincing, like self-conscious pop wusses >puffing themselves up to a higher weightclass. I always suspected it's >because they came up in Seattle clubs at a time when thrash was a >prerequisite, and it was something they had to do to avoid getting beaten up >in the parking lot after. Anyway, they should just knock it off and be the >powerpop weenies they really are. Chilton doesn't let them get away with >that crap. Me, I like the contrast between sweet pop harmonies and noisy guitars, which probably explains why I'm on the fence with the Posies through DEAR 23, but I become a big fan starting with FROSTING ON THE BEATER -- "Coming Right Along" and "Definite Door" give me some barbed wire with the sugar (to paraphrase something Paula Carino once said to me). I've only seen Jon and Ken live twice, at Monsters of Pop 2000 in their acoustic guise, and last summer as part of Big Star, so I can't really comment on how the full-band Posies came across. But both gigs were splendid. At the Ken and Jon show, they did drink a lot, making me wonder who was consuming more alcohol per volume between them and Bob Pollard (high-alcohol liquor vs. infinite beer), but the boys stayed spot-on from a performance standpoint. In fact, they played so well that it sparked me to get all the Posies stuff that I hadn't bought up to that point. And yeah, what I dug the most was stuff like "Coming Right Along," where the harmonies met the dark, nosiy thrashing. Didn't seem contrived to me at all... later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 15:37:37 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh On Fri, 10 May 2002, John Sharples wrote: > But like I said I've seen them a couple of times in Big Star and they are > really wonderful when they're keeping their shit together. It's not just > the drinking, though - I think what could have been their best album, > FROSTING ON THE BEATER, is ruined by the way over-distorted (but not in that > deep, warm pleasing way - rather, brittle and cheap) guitar sounds, that > sounded so awkwardly mismatched to the material. > > I think they need to drop the rock-star trip. I pretty much agree...except about FOTB. I can't speak to the sounds professionally, but at least some of the distortion on that album - say, the low-end guitar parts on "How She Lied by Living" - sound just fine to these ears. I wonder if people would feel anhy different if FOTB had been their first release instead of their third - if that album had established their sound, instead of the cleaner, less forceful sound of _Dear 23_ and _Failure_? (Oh - and if they'd been called something other than "The Posies") I think, too, there's something about folks of Jon and Ken's age re rock-starism that reads very different to people of John and my age (i.e., old farts). I still tend to think of rock as pre- and post-punk rock; and the whole anti-star ideology that came along with punk highly colors my tolerance (or lack thereof) for boogieing, rockin' all night long, and assorted other cliches. I think for people younger than me, that stuff has this nostalgic glow, but not the weight of having been actual practice for much of their lives, inescapable and tedious. The other thing is, I don't think it's ironic. I think those guys really do like a lot of that stuff - when Jon Auer plays the stupid widdly two-handed Eddie Van Halen thing that introduced that band's version of "You Really Got Me" (it's got a title, one of those classic guitar-wank notions that appears in the dictionary next to the entry for "suggesting pseudo-profundity"), I think he really digs it, he's not just taking the piss out of it. As for the getting drunk alla time...that's its own problem, isn't it. - --Jeff Jeffrey Norman, Posemodernist University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee Dept. of Mumblish & Competitive Obliterature http://www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 16:48:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Mitton Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh On Fri, 10 May 2002, Larry Tucker wrote: > Point taken from all, but it defense of this particular show it was well > balanced, not done to excess and added tension at appropriate points in > the song. I can only recall a couple of songs where the guitar thrashing > became over the top. And on this night Ken was not drunk and a delight > to talk to after the show and altogether quite personable. I've never seen the Posies, but I saw the Minus 5 with Ken in the lineup. While there wasn't excessive drinking, the show definitely suffered from over the top attempts to break strings (or however you want to characterize it), Ken included. It also suffered from long pauses while the bandmembers talked--if they made some attempt to talk to the audience, that would be fine, but they just talked to themselves and forced us to listent. But I also saw Stringfellow live solo and thought it was fantastic. I'd never quite appreciated how wonderfully expressive his voice is. I could have sat there and listened to him for hours. As Michael Zwirn mentioned, we saw The Long Winters a while back. I think it was like their second show, and we were amazed at how well everything had come together for them. If the CD is out now, sounds like I need to get on it.... - --Michael NP Goo Goo Dolls GUTTERFLOWER ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 15:58:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies On Fri, 10 May 2002, Miles Goosens wrote: > Sharples wrote: > >Came around on Aimee Mann and Jojo, Miles? > > Aimee Mann, mostly yes. Jon Brion's production on I'M WITH STUPID helped a > lot, and once I started listening, I went back to WHATEVER and the Til > Tuesday stuff. I'd still like to run all her pre-I'M WITH STUPID work > through the deglossing machine, and I still think she'd sound even better > with punchier, nosier production. I still haven't checked out the 'Til Tuesday stuff, and several tracks on _Whatever_ don't work that well for me - but I love _I'm with Stupid_ and _Bachelor #2_. I sort of like that strange, boxy, Brion/Froom/Burnett school of production - so it doesn't botehr me. > After UP and REVEAL, I'm not as inclined to argue the latter, since those > two put the mediocre post-IRS albums in a clear majority. Maybe it's a > plot to make GREEN sound like a five-star album. Nevertheless, I still > rank OUT OF TIME and NEW ADVENTURES IN HI-FI with their best, and MONSTER > not far behind. I like _Up_ better than Miles does (and _NAIHF_ less), but _Reveal_, though it's improved in my eyes somewhat since I reviewed it, still seems very poorly paced and overlong (partially as a result of that). Apparently, too, they had to be persuaded to put "Imitation of Life" on the CD - a real breath of fresh air on that album's sequencing. I dunno - I really wish they'd lay off the slow, brooding numbers and do a few more lively songs - inaccountably, I missed "The Great Beyond" for a few years and only recnetly discovered it and will now argue it's one of their most wonderful tracks - but uh...did I have a point? I think it was that I haven't given up completely on the guys. Hey Sharples - so do you have any opinon on the new EC yet? I'm really curious what you think... I love it - and Rose is very sold, refusing to let it out of the car stereo for the last week... - --Jeff Jeffrey Norman, Posemodernist University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee Dept. of Mumblish & Competitive Obliterature http://www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 16:23:55 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies At 03:58 PM 5/10/2002 -0500, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >On Fri, 10 May 2002, Miles Goosens wrote: > >> Sharples wrote: >> >Came around on Aimee Mann and Jojo, Miles? >> >> Aimee Mann, mostly yes. Jon Brion's production on I'M WITH STUPID helped a >> lot, and once I started listening, I went back to WHATEVER and the Til >> Tuesday stuff. I'd still like to run all her pre-I'M WITH STUPID work >> through the deglossing machine, and I still think she'd sound even better >> with punchier, nosier production. > >I still haven't checked out the 'Til Tuesday stuff, and several tracks on >_Whatever_ don't work that well for me - but I love _I'm with Stupid_ and >_Bachelor #2_. I sort of like that strange, boxy, Brion/Froom/Burnett >school of production - so it doesn't botehr me. Oh, let me be 100% clear about this before Sharples starts chasing me with a claw hammer in hand. I really like Jon Brion's production work, I like what he did with Ms. Mann almost as much as I like what he did on Robyn Hitchcock's JEWELS FOR SOPHIA, listening to all of Brion-produced I'M WITH STUPID was the key for me to say "I like this well enough to buy all her other stuff" so you gotta know that Brion worked like a mofo to my ears, and I too like the "strange, boxy, Brion/Froom/Burnett school of production." When I say "she'd sound even better with punchier, noisier production," I mean (1) I'd love to retroactively apply it to past works, and (2) I'm not bothered by present production (on I'M WITH STUPID, if that can still count as present, and BACHELOR #2) at all, quite the opposite, but I'd like to up the dissonance and fuzz factors further to see what would happen. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 18:03:01 -0400 From: "John Sharples" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies F2: >I still haven't checked out the 'Til Tuesday stuff I'm still convinced their third and last, EVERYTHING'S DIFFERENT NOW, is a solid classic and is more similar to her solo records than the first two 'til tuesday records. Just ignore all the synths and programming if that's not your thing. The first two records have their scattered specially their title tracks. >Hey Sharples - so do you have any opinon on the new EC yet? I'm really >curious what you think... I love it - and Rose is very sold, refusing to >let it out of the car stereo for the last week... Haven't checked it out yet. I'm in still in final exams, which means I'm too busy posting to loud-fans and buying guitars on eBay to listen to new CDs. JS ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 18:43:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies On Fri, 10 May 2002, John Sharples wrote: > I'm still convinced their third and last, EVERYTHING'S DIFFERENT NOW, is > a solid classic and is more similar to her solo records than the first > two 'til tuesday records. Agreed, and it tends to turn up in "Nice Price" bins. Welcome Home has a few tracks I like but isn't indisposable, and I still haven't warmed to a single track on Voices Carry. a ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 15:50:46 -0700 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: [loud-fans] every great swap deserves a rave review Here's a long overdue review of a tape Betsy sent me back in December, a fabulous mix that's been ruling my world for the past five months, so I thought I should review it. Here are some of the highest highlights in 90 minutes of highlights... Sloan - If It Feels Good Do It, I Love a Long Goodbye, Are You Giving Me Back My Love?, It's in Your Eyes, Waterfalls That's right, *five* Sloan songs scattered throughout the tape! All but one of them are from their latest album PRETTY TOGETHER, which I still haven't picked up yet, but will soon, especially now that it's available at a cheap domestic price. "Waterfalls" is a cover, not of the TLC song, but of the Paul McCartney song, and it's one of the ace tracks on the recent okay but less than great Macca tribute. Belle & Sebastian - Jonathan David, Legal Man Speaking of bands that appear most frequently on loud-swaps, I can't remember the last time I received a swap tape or CD from loud-fans without a Belle & Sebastian song. I know I've received "Lazy Line Painter Jane" on at least four different mixes in the past few year. I'm definitely in favor of listening to B&S songs without having to buy them, because I find most of them pleasant but a bit..derivative. I enjoy them while they're playing but then afterwards I feel an overwhelming need to play "She's Not There" or "She May Call You Up Tonight" or whatever other song they're ripping off in order to hear the real thing. The Wondermints - Arnaldo Said Another band that isn't terribly original, but I love the Wondermints. Right after the release of this album (BALI), they were recruited as Brian Wilson's backup band, something they were probably destined to do. This song is about Arnaldo Baptista of Os Mutantes, who I hadn't heard of when I first heard the song, but have heard of now. The Feelies - White Light/White Heat I didn't know the Feelies covered "WL/WH".. and such a great version too! Luna - That's What You Always Say A cover of my favorite Dream Syndicate song, and another recording that I didn't know about before. It's from a 1993 ep that I'd like to find if anyone knows where to find one. Olivia Tremor Control - The Opera House I'm a little surprised that so many loud-fans seem to not like the OTC "soundscapes" on their albums. "The Opera House" (the first song on DUSK AT CUBIST CASTLE, one of the pop songs) is a great song, but it sounds a bit lonely without its OTC nonpop nonsong friends following it. Mitch Easter & Angie Carlson - Kizza Me Given the personal history involved, it's a little unnerving now to hear Mitch and Angie singing a duet of "Kizza Me", but still a great version of that song. Velvet Crush - Everything Flows, Elevator Operator Two of the cover songs recently assembled as part of the Velvet Crush Singles Odyssey. "Elevator Operator" is a Gene Clark song and "Everything Flows" is a Teenage Fanclub song. This band has great taste in cover songs.. there's also a cover of "She Cracked" on Singles Odyssey. The Windbreakers - Off & On Oh-Ok - Lilting Miracle Legion - All For The Best The dB's - Soul Kiss It's always great to hear songs on mix tapes recorded from vinyl. I don't believe the Windbreakers and Oh-Ok songs have ever seen the light of day on CD. Teenage Fanclub - The Sun Shines From You Pavement - Stub Your Toe Young Fresh Fellows - Good Times Rock n' Roll Beulah - Gravity's Bringing Us Down The Flashing Lights - High School Aimee Mann - Baby Blue Apples In Stereo - Everybody Let Up I'm running out of descriptive superlatives, but these are all songs I know, love and can't live without. This is a great mix, that has found permanent residence in my Walkman ever since I received it. Many thanks to Betsy. BTW, I haven't received any loud-swap offerings this year for either February or April. I mostly joined the loud-fans swap to inflict my own musical taste on others, but if any of my past or future 2002 swap partners want to send me anything, I'm up for receiving it. Steve ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 22:03:20 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] Oh-Ok on CD As per that recent reference: The fine Collector's Choice label is putting out the complete Oh-OK on CD...eventually. I found it on the Collector's Choice website a few weeks ago, but now it isn't showing up on a search. In less likely events, Gary Wilson just got a proper reissue, and an upcoming major NYC showcase to promote it. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 23:02:27 -0400 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh From: Michael Mitton [mailto:mlmitton@phoenix.Princeton.EDU] But I also saw Stringfellow live solo and thought it was fantastic. I'd never quite appreciated how wonderfully expressive his voice is. I could have sat there and listened to him for hours. ^^^^^^ Absolutely the case this night. Very expressive voice, bright eyes and quick wit. Talked *to* the audience and sang right in your face. Nearly half his set was spent sans guitar and mike stand...just crooning, or screaming, into the microphone. And after the show I was surprised at just how personable and un-rock-star he was. He's gained marks in my book - -LT ^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 23:20:39 -0400 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies At 06:43 PM 5/10/2002 -0400, Aaron Mandel wrote: >On Fri, 10 May 2002, John Sharples wrote: > >> I'm still convinced their third and last, EVERYTHING'S DIFFERENT NOW, is >> a solid classic and is more similar to her solo records than the first >> two 'til tuesday records. > >Agreed, and it tends to turn up in "Nice Price" bins. Welcome Home has a >few tracks I like but isn't indisposable, and I still haven't warmed to a >single track on Voices Carry. WELCOME HOME is the album that turned me into an Aimee Mann fan, and I still rank "Coming Up Close," "Will She Just Fall Down" (which I still maintain was deliberately written in the style of her then-sweetie Jules Shear) and "No One Is Watching You Now" among her all-time best work. In fact, until "Ghost World," I ranked the last as my favorite of hers ever. S ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 23:14:53 -0400 From: "Grahame Davies" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh I've seen The Posies a number of times, plus Big Star a couple of times, plus Ken and Jon acoustic-style a couple of times. I enjoyed them -- until last time. The last time they came through they played at the Black Cat in DC, just the two of them. Their very lengthy "encore" -- I believe it was at least as long as their set -- was spent doing shots of tequila and playing just the chorus or hook of as many dumbass seventies metal songs as they could think of. This is fun if everybody is in the same frame of mind, but clearly the audience would have been much happier with a couple more good Posies songs and goodnight, instead of the self-indulgence. The really strange thing to me was that it felt like, for want of a better description, planned spontanaeity; and reading the stories on the list today it seems like it might have been. Odd. - -- Grahame ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 May 2002 00:37:25 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies In a message dated 5/10/2002 11:21:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, flamingo@theworld.com writes: > I'm still convinced their third and last, EVERYTHING'S DIFFERENT NOW, is > >> a solid classic and is more similar to her solo records than the first > >> two 'til tuesday records. > > > >Agreed, and it tends to turn up in "Nice Price" bins. Welcome Home has a > >few tracks I like but isn't indisposable, and I still haven't warmed to a > >single track on Voices Carry. > I agree too, and one of the reasons it seems so much like a solo album is that most of the band had left by then, except for Michael Hausman, who turned into her manager. They got mad at the fact she was getting so much songwriting time, and left. I also agree about Welcome Home, which really was the turning point for Aimee, and Will She Just Fall Down and Coming Up Close being the biggest signposts for that, and also stand with her best work. I have a tape of very early Til Tuesday, before they got signed to Epic, and there are songs on there which would have made VC a lot better, and may have made people take her a lot more serously than they did at the time. Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 May 2002 00:53:39 -0400 From: "John Sharples" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Peeves and Posies Stewart: >WELCOME HOME is the album that turned me into an Aimee Mann fan Me, too, although I could not admit it to anyone at the time. The time was 1986, and if you were in a struggling, Boston garage band in the mid-80s you made it your business to loathe 'til tuesday and Aimee Mann in particular for a host of reasons which all boiled down to sour grapes: she seemed light on talent, yet to have every break provided, usually by (ahem) powerful men, and they represented the proud, gritty Boston music scene to the world with mushy synths, lightweight pop and trendy MTV looks. We hated her. I didn't think she could sing or write well. Nobody who was there can forget thrashers Gang Green cinching their WBCN Battle of the Bands victory the year after 'TT won it by closing with their scathing "Voices Scary" and then taking a sledgehammer to a synthesizer. and I >still rank "Coming Up Close," Yeah, that was the song. I heard that and thought, privately, "oh, no - that's an amazing song, I have to admit it. But only to myself. No one else can ever know, or I'll be stripped of my Moving Targets t-shirts and deported to Providence." So I stayed closeted about my love for that song until 1988, when EDN was released and I heard "(Thought You Were) Lucky" on - I can still remember the day and where I was - Ken Shelton's show on BCN. It came on and I had to stop what I was doing and sit down. When it coalesced into its astonishing climax "oh life could be fucking great" I had to lie down. After that I just had to give it up, out myself, and admit she was a genius. Suddenly I realized I had secretly loved "Voices Carry" and "Over Your Shoulder" all this time, too. But I still think the third album represents a quantum leap in her abilities. 'TT trivia: though it's widely assumed they broke up in 1988, I actually saw a show billed as 'til tuesday at the Paradise in Boston in 1992, just before WHATEVER was released! Though I didn't know it then, Jon Brion was on lead guitar. The AMG review of VOICES CARRY is one of the most unusually fascinating I have ever read. JS ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 23:59:44 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [loud-fans] swap tracks We were sort of talking about most popular songs on swaps - and, curious, I went and looked at the tapes/CDs I'd sent out over the past few years (most of which, btw, are archived at artofthemix.org). I'd had this vague idea that I kept putting the same songs on mixes - but in fact, while many songs appeared twice, only two songs appeared more than that, three times: "Heavens" by Pinetop Seven (and it may be that strictly speaking this doesn't belong here: I have two versions of the song, and I might have used both), and (surprisingly) "You Just May Be the One" by Peter Holsapple (from a Monkees trib CD). Also: two other songs appeared three times, although in different versions: Madonna's "Angel" (! - - as covered by Long Fin Killie (twice) and by Drop Nineteens) and...uh, "The Star-Spangled Banner" (Posies, Hendrix, Red House Painters). Which artists appear most often? If you just take bands themselves, it's The Fall and (surprise) The Residents, with 8 appearances. (The Residents show up because I did two tapes of covers - they do a lot, and they seldom sound anything like the original, a major criterion of those tapes - and because for some reason, they have several songs about cowboys and/or holidays...and I did a dual-theme tape on those a couple years back. Janet knows why...) However, the real champion, by a large margin, is Wire and its members, who've contributed a total of 12 tracks. Wire proper has 7, Colin Newman 3, and Colin Newman & Malka Spigel 2 (the same song: a semi-live version of "Outdoor Miner"). Runners-up: Elvis Costello (all permutations) and Ivory Library (Madison band), 7 each; The Rock*a*Teens, The Wrens, Ultra Vivid Scene, and Tuxedomoon, 6 each. XTC would have 6 if you count a Dukes of Stratosphear track (I would). (Also: Tim Buckley as a name shows up 8 times: the dead one once, and the Blow Pops one 7 times, 4 with the Blow Pops and 3 with Wobble Test.) (Total number of tracks: 783) - --Jeff Jeffrey Norman, Posemodernist University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee Dept. of Mumblish & Competitive Obliterature http://www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 22:16:59 -0700 From: Michael Zwirn Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Heaven in Raleigh On 5/10/02 8:02 PM, Larry Tucker wrote: > From: Michael Mitton [mailto:mlmitton@phoenix.Princeton.EDU] > > But I also saw Stringfellow live solo and thought it was fantastic. I'd > never quite appreciated how wonderfully expressive his voice is. I could > have sat there and listened to him for hours. > > ^^^^^^ > Absolutely the case this night. Very expressive voice, bright eyes and quick > wit. Talked *to* the audience and sang right in your face. Nearly half his set > was spent sans guitar and mike stand...just crooning, or screaming, into the > microphone. > > And after the show I was surprised at just how personable and un-rock-star he > was. He's gained marks in my book Stringfellow solo (I say, having never been a big Posies fan) was a remarkably lovely, melodic and indeed well-sung performance. He opened for Freedy Johnston and - had I known his material as well as I know Freedy's - might have outperformed him. After the show he proved friendly, thoughtful and a pleasant conversationalist. I suppose I should probably go buy his records now. last played: Los Lobos "Johnny 99" from the Springsteen tribute last seen: HOLLYWOOD ENDING, which I thought was good, not great. Tia Leoni is surprisingly effective. Michael - -- "And if our leg's in a cast, we'll walk slow Go such as we go, use shortcuts we know" Loud Family ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V2 #169 *******************************