From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V2 #155 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Sunday, April 28 2002 Volume 02 : Number 155 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] This is no longer close to the topic of Role Models [Jef] [loud-fans] Thanks to Mr. Norman... ["R. Kevin Doyle" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] This is no longer close to the topic of Role Models On Fri, 26 Apr 2002, Matthew Weber wrote: > In other words, it's very easy for any of us to see that a person who > commits suicide, or makes a suicidal gesture, had other options. In > most cases, they were unable to see that; unless you've been there, > you can't know how depression (not momentary sadness) can clog your > entire world view and make everything look as if it's turned to shit. The Catch-22 is: if your worldview is unblinkered enough to see the negative effect your suicide may have on others, and to imagine that there enough others out there who genuinely care whether you live or die, you probably wouldn't be in that suicidal mindset in the first place. It's fruitless berating a suicide for being "selfish" or anything else (and not just for the obvious reasons): the (eminently logical, from a suicidal p.o.v.) response is, you're all better off without me, and so am I. But enough of this carefree banter. A couple of comments that were brewing all afternoon: Re "Rape Me"--I don't really think it works either, but I ask myself, what if Kathleen Hanna wrote and sang the song? Is it "okay" then? Plus, I thought I'd read somewhere that Cobain's father abused him as a child...rape may be tasteless as a metaphor, but what if it wasn't a metaphor? Aaron thinks Cobain's sometimes a lazy lyricist...well, it's really hard to think of more than a handful of rock lyricists who aren't lazy (at least, I keep noticing lazy writing). Let's see...Scott Miller, Elvis Costello, Stephin Merritt... What do they have in common? That's right - they all get accused of overthinking their material. Can't win... Seriously, between Jen's account of the sort of word salad that became "Teen Spirit," and the general rock'n'roll ethos of spontaneity and amateurism, "lazy lyrics" are pretty far down the list of rock sins. I might also note that I've always read the "mosquito...libido" lines as comment on the effects of some anti-depressants. I mean, everyone's free to have their own opinions about what they like and what they don't - but it's a bit irksome when double standards get applied. Now "Wooly Bully" - there's some thoughtful lyric writing for ya. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::crumple zones:::::harmful or fatal if swallowed:::::small-craft warning:: ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 22:53:52 -1000 From: "R. Kevin Doyle" Subject: [loud-fans] Thanks to Mr. Norman... I just received a terrific mix of Elvis Costello rarities from Jeffrey N., featuring a number of excellent tracks, notably a wonderful duet with Cassandra Wilson on "I Still Have That Other Girl." I offer public thanks and want to take a day or two to ponder the identity of the mystery singer on "Rainy Day Women #12 and 35." I have a feeling I should have gotten it on first listen.... Thanks again. Most successful e-mail I've sent in 2002! R. Kevin Doyle Honolulu, HI ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 09:04:14 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] This is no longer close to the topic In a message dated 4/26/02 10:27:58 PM, sleeveless@citynet.net writes: << Kurt maintained that he had the stomach ailment before he did heroin. Whether or not that's true, I don't know. It certainly could be. >> If you can't trust a heroin addict to tell the truth, who can you trust? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 12:27:46 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] The NY Times steps in to explain it all.... While we're considering Kurt's stomach condition and how it was aggravated over cultural niches, be sure to check out Jon Pareles' amazing article in today's NY Times. "When The Suffering Undoes The Artist" is one of those "is death cool?" pieces, this time inspired by Layne Staley. Highlights include sentences like this one: "Yet for every musician who manages to transmute personal suffering into great performances,like Billie Holiday, there are more who are only human, whose excess or misery undoes their art." That explains why we can now enjoy so much of Holiday hitting her seasoned prime at the age of 45. We're also informed that Pearl Jam didn't start out on a major label...although maybe Jon's thinking of Mother Love Bone...who, come to think of it, were also never on a true indie label. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 13:00:19 -0400 (EDT) From: jsharple@bls.brooklaw.edu Subject: [loud-fans] You educated stupid bastards are unworthy of Earth http://www.timecube.com/ - ------------------------------------------------- BROOKLYN LAW SCHOOL WEBMAIL: info.brooklaw.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 15:23:59 -0700 From: "me" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] You educated stupid bastards are unworthy of Earth "Life is based upon a perfect math or your arm would be too short to wipe your butt. " you got it. - -- "Drag me, drop me, treat me like an object." - -- ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V2 #155 *******************************