From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V2 #35 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Thursday, January 24 2002 Volume 02 : Number 035 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] Introduction [Dan Sallitt ] Re: [loud-fans] Halstead and Merritt ["John Swartzentruber" ] Re: [loud-fans] Handedness [jenny grover ] Re: [loud-fans] Handedness ["Aaron Milenski" ] [loud-fans] Re: Introduction [mbowen@frontiernet.net] Re: [loud-fans] Halstead and Merritt [jenny grover ] Re: [loud-fans] Handedness [Miles Goosens ] Re: [loud-fans] Swap Review: Round & Round (half-hijacked to handedness) ["Andrew Hamlin" ] Re: [loud-fans] Re: Introduction ["Andrew Hamlin" ] Re: Fwd: RE: [loud-fans] Introduction ["Dennis McGreevy" ] Re: [loud-fans] Re: Introduction ["Dennis McGreevy" ] [loud-fans] Connecting two current threads ... [Michael Zwirn Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Introduction > Okay, I can see why free jazz would leave you cold, then, but jazz is at > least as stylistically varied as rock and roll. What kind of jazz is it > that doesn't connect with you? I can think of tons of jazz artists whose > music is incredibly melodic. Duke Ellington wrote some of the most amazing > melodies of the 20th century. Then there's someone like Chet Baker, who > some people derided when he appeared in the '50s because he played too > pretty, or Stan Getz's bossa nova period, which is some of the most purely > melodic music of its era. For me, the problem isn't the lack of melody, but the fact that the melodies seem to be built out of idioms that are kind of alien to me. I've actually had a little better luck with later jazz than earlier, mostly because liking rock 'n' roll has introduced me to the idea of cacophany. The most exciting jazz I've heard was some free-form wailing by John Sinclair's Blues Scholars at Jazz Fest 1996; it was probably derivative of something, but damned if I can find out what. Someone once told me that Mingus's music was the rock 'n' roll of jazz, and I've actually enjoyed some of what I've heard ("Hog Callin' Blues" is pretty cool). It hasn't led to a general breakthrough yet, though. I'd be interested in hearing some comparisons between jazz sounds and rock 'n' roll sounds. For instance, you hear people say that Richard Thompson's or Roger McGuinn's soloing is influenced by Coltrane - I'd enjoy hearing about specific albums that show that influence. - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 15:50:26 -0500 From: "John Swartzentruber" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Halstead and Merritt On Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:41:28 -0600, Dennis McGreevy wrote: >You're all missing the point, which is *really* that for all its soph-something, >the sentence lacks subject verb agreement. which makes me want to vomit. >P.S. I really should have mentioned this in my introduction, but it sorta >slipped my mind at the time: I'm not Dennis Sacks. Haven't seen an intro from >him, but regardless, he's his own Dennis. So who's Dennis Stacks? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 15:59:56 EST From: LeftyZ@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] another movie opinion Haven't seen this one mentioned......anyone else seen "Amelie"? This is a delightful movie. Funny, silly, cute.....one of my favorites of the last six months. The only other thing I've seen among the holiday releases that was worth the film it was printed on was "Ocean's Eleven." Doesn't try to be anything but fun....and it works. Very disappointed with "A Beautiful Mind," "In the Bedroom" and especially "The Royal Tenenbaum's" (after seeing this on a lot of top ten lists, I keep telling myself I musta missed something). Any comments on "Lantana," "Gosford Park," "Shipping News" or "Vanilla Sky"? Left (who is right-handed 'cept for playin' pool) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 13:29:37 -0800 (PST) From: Mike Curley Subject: Fwd: RE: [loud-fans] Introduction In response to Ian and Jeff: Jeff says: > > >But sampling the cassette to remember exactly > *which* excerpts I used, > >I still could barely stand to listen to ELP for > more than a few > >minutes... Other proggers fare better, notably Yes > (particularly the > >non-keyboard-dominated instrumental passages) and > Genesis. Like Jeffrey, I have been exploring my deep dark past as a progressive music geek back in high school. I wasn't surprised to find out that I still like Genesis (at least the Peter Gabriel era, and even the first two Phil Collins ones), but I was surprised about how much I liked Yes. I especially like the Yes Album and Relayer. The classic criticism is that Yes is the stereotypical overblown rock dinosaur that was thankfully blown away by punk rock. I bought into it at the time, but now that punk itself is a commercialized commodity, I have no problem reconciling my interests in both types of music. Then Ian says > Curiously I can listen to early ELP but have more > trouble with Genesis > these days. I was a huge Gabriel-era Genesis fan - > first gig I saw was > Genesis on the Foxtrot tour - but among the gems on > Nursery Cryme, > Foxtrot, Selling and Lamb there appears to be an > awful lot of filler. How about Trespass -- very low filler to content ratio. And then Ian says: > And I absolutely hate The Battle of Epping Forest, > all that cod Cockney > accent stuff - and I live about 200 yards from > Epping Forest! Yep. Epping Forest almost ruins an otherwise tremendous album. A prime example of why they developed CD players to be programmable. OK..back to work. Mike Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 16:44:17 -0500 From: jenny grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Handedness jsharple@bls.brooklaw.edu wrote: > > I think lefty throwers are discouraged from a young age from catching > because of the belief that they would be at a disadvantage trying to throw > out base-stealers: there are more righty batters than lefty (especially at > younger ages), which might interfere with the throw to second, and it's > very difficult to make the quick throw to third. That is the explanation I've most often heard as well. It should be noted that there have been a very few left-handed catchers in the majors. I recall seeing one within the last few years, though his name and team now escape me, but I remember the sportscasters making a big deal of it. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 16:48:40 -0500 From: "Aaron Milenski" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Handedness >I think lefty throwers are discouraged from a young age from catching >because of the belief that they would be at a disadvantage trying to throw >out base-stealers: there are more righty batters than lefty (especially at >younger ages), which might interfere with the throw to second, and it's >very difficult to make the quick throw to third. I know this is the reason, but I still don't think it's a good one. I think the key to this is "discouraged from a young age." In the major leagues, righty hitters don't outnumber lefty hitters enough, nor is the quick throw to third a common enough occurance to explain why there are NO lefty catchers. I think it's just another baseball tradition that continues because nobody questions it. Turning this into something on-topic: Did Scott actually play a lot of baseball in his younger days? _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 21:48:58 GMT From: mbowen@frontiernet.net Subject: [loud-fans] Re: Introduction Dan Sallitt writes: >For instance, you hear people say that Richard > Thompson's or Roger McGuinn's soloing is influenced by Coltrane - I'd > enjoy hearing about specific albums that show that influence. I don't know about RT, but the riff and solo on "Eight Miles High" is reminiscent of Coltrane's playing on "A Love Supreme". MB ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 16:55:15 -0500 From: jenny grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Halstead and Merritt Aaron Mandel wrote: > > ""Eban & Charley" serves as further proof that Merritt's prolific > investigations within the limited template of the pop song continues to > produce unforeseen and compelling results." > > That's actually fewer words than you used to dis it above. But there does appear to be a lack of subject/verb agreement here. "Investigations" is plural and "continues" is singular. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 13:59:17 -0800 (PST) From: Robert Toren Subject: [loud-fans] Can't see my pinkie i have a big blind spot in my right eye_ if a hold my spread fingers at arm's length (palm out), close my left eye, and focus on my thumb, i can't see my pinkie_ just... void! several people have sneered that *everyone* has a blind spot, but they can't find theirs! so, what's the scoop? the R formerly known as PR ===== blah blah blah Mr. Sensitive Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 16:13:15 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Handedness At 04:44 PM 1/24/2002 -0500, jenny grover wrote: >jsharple@bls.brooklaw.edu wrote: >> >> I think lefty throwers are discouraged from a young age from catching >> because of the belief that they would be at a disadvantage trying to throw >> out base-stealers: there are more righty batters than lefty (especially at >> younger ages), which might interfere with the throw to second, and it's >> very difficult to make the quick throw to third. > >That is the explanation I've most often heard as well. It should be >noted that there have been a very few left-handed catchers in the >majors. I recall seeing one within the last few years, though his name >and team now escape me, but I remember the sportscasters making a big >deal of it. I don't think there have been too many, and I can't think of one since Benny DiStefano in 1989. White Sox 1B glove guy Mike Squires did some emergency catching in the '80s, Dale Long did the same for the Cubs in the '50s, um... darn my family for not getting me THE NEW BILL JAMES HISTORICAL BASEBALL ABSTRACT for Christmas! Jack Clements in the 19th century is the only one I can think of who was a regular. I suspect quite a few lefty throwers (Babe Ruth among them) caught at some point *before* they got to the major leagues. Of course, there are plenty of catchers who have *batted* lefty, but thrown righty, but that's not really what we're talking about. Glen Sarvady, can you tell I'm in full-blown SOM mode? :-) later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:15:52 -0800 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Swap Review: Round & Round (half-hijacked to handedness) >The Orgone Box, "Judy over the Rainbow" - (Great >pairing with previous song. Sunny 60's Brit-pop.) Would have been my Song Of The Year 2001 if someone hadn't pointed out it was actually from 1996(?). I find its melodic sunniness, though, largely undercut through its lyrical evocation of "Resolved: Self-Destruction, In A Self-Decided Style, Is A Legitimate Lifestyle Choice Entitled To Respect From Others Who May Not Agree." >Little Feat, "Dixie Chicken" (Don't care for southern >rock.) Not to bust Jon's chops at all, but, a band formed in Los Angeles, by two alumnae of The Mothers (of Invention), is "southern rock"...how? >Half-Man, Half-Biscuit, "Dickie Davis Eyes" (Another >good drinking song. ) Ah, wish I had that one in my arsenal! John Bartlett, you are out there still? You play five-a-side, still? I notice you haven't penned an "Introduction" yet... Handedness: Technically right-handed, but do okay, so-so, as a lefty. For this I "blame" years of saxophone playing, which accentuates the left hand. Can't help but notice, though, that I have to hold the butt end of a pool cue stick with my left hand--the other way just "doesn't feel right," and certainly doesn't produce results. I produced no results through the "feel right" way either, come to think of it; the big reason, though not the only one, why I gave up shooting pool. Have similar problems wielding a (house-)painting brush and shooting a gun. Gave those up too. Can handle a left-handed mouse at my left-handed friend's house without thinking about it. Shift the razor hand-to-hand when shaving (not like I ever do that anymore) to better address the respective sides of the face. Oh, here's a wrinkle I haven't seen discussed before: I have no natural sense of left and right, can't tell one direction from the other without thinking about it, and am frequently wrong even if I do think. A problem I share/d with Samuel R. Delany and the late Dr. Alan Turing, so at least I'm in good company. The latter used to mark his hands with "L" and "R," as a child. The former apparently marks one hand with an ink spot, or a speck of dirt...maybe a ring... Which reminds me, I'm deeply worried that my beloved Steve Holtebeck lives within some sort of refracted-mirror-construct universe: "Pedantically speaking, when you bat 'right-handed', you're actually standing on the left side of the plate from your perspective, but the left side from the pitcher's perspective." Can anyone help? Finally, a side-dominance-diagnostic I haven't seen mentioned before. Casually place your hands in front of you and interlace your fingers in the classic "ready for teacher" configuration. Which thumb is on top? Still waiting for Brian Jones to put it on the glass, Andy "I knew there would be lots of people in China; that was okay. What shocked me was the depths to which Mao and his people had stripped away everything that makes a human being human  and how that's carried now into the younger generations, stripped them of their sense of beauty, of the sort of spiritual raison d'etre that people need. Everywhere, I felt a barrenness. And it's not the people's fault. It's not that they don't have a persona, a bodhicitta inside them, but perhaps their vocabulary for expressing it or even accessing it had been stripped away. They just seemed lost. That was really shocking." - --Gretel Ehrlich, from http://www.powells.com/authors/ehrlich.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:27:13 -0800 (PST) From: Jon Gabriel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Swap Review: Round & Round (half-hijacked to handedness) - --- Andrew Hamlin wrote: > >Little Feat, "Dixie Chicken" (Don't care for > southern > >rock.) > > Not to bust Jon's chops at all, but, a band formed > in Los Angeles, by two alumnae of The Mothers (of > Invention), is "southern rock"...how? It says "Dixie" in the song title, ergo, it must be Southern Rock. Q.E.D. I don't know anything about Little Feat, so I made an assumption. This song had a southern flair even if the band was short one Van Zandt brother. Handedness: As a wee boy, I was somewhat ambidextrous. After breaking my left arm as a six-year-old, then re-breaking it twice more while still in the full-arm cast (this was the pre-Ritalin era), I was completely right-handed. Shocking, yet true! ===== 777777777777777777777777777777 JON GABRIEL mesa, arizona usa inkling communication + design 777777777777777777777777777777 Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:34:30 -0800 (PST) From: Jon Gabriel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Swap Review: Round & Round - --- Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > On Wed, 23 Jan 2002, Jon Gabriel wrote: > >> XTC, "Stupidly Happy" - (God's favorite atheists >> play what sounds like an earlier track in their >> repetoire.) > > But it isn't, you know. Someone else can argue about > the accuracy of "atheists." Sorry, i just assumed they were due to "Dear God" -- I don't know enough about XTC to consign their souls to heaven, hell, reincarnation or non-existence. I just wanted to use the phrase "God's favorite atheists." At least they aren't secret Freemasons like Quercio! > > The Paranoids, "Real by Reel" (Zappa joins > > Skynyrd?) > > (The Zappa part I get...but Skynyrd?!?) The intro to this song sounds like a Southern-rock jam session to me. Perhaps that part was actually the ending of the previous song by that legendary Southern Rock band Little Feat. :-) I'm not a music trivia buff but I play one on the Internet, Jon ===== 777777777777777777777777777777 JON GABRIEL mesa, arizona usa inkling communication + design 777777777777777777777777777777 Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:42:05 -0500 (EST) From: Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Swap Review: Round & Round (half-hijacked to handedness) On Thu, 24 Jan 2002, Jon Gabriel wrote: > > Not to bust Jon's chops at all, but, a band formed > > in Los Angeles, by two alumnae of The Mothers (of > > Invention), is "southern rock"...how? > > It says "Dixie" in the song title, ergo, it must be > Southern Rock. Q.E.D. Saying Little Feat is southern rock is a little like saying the Beatles were a Merseybeat group. It's certainly not wrong (they had a big southern rock following, and at least one member from New Orleans), but there was a lot more to their sound than just that. It does strike me as a little short-sighted to dismiss them out of hand as "southern rock." THey were a wonderful band (even had some great moments after George died) and Lowell George was a fantastic songwriter. Elvis Costello is a big fan! Going, going... JS ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:53:36 -0500 From: timv@triad.rr.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: One Nil On 23 Jan 2002, at 23:12, steve wrote: > The amelodic averse bunch on the Audities (power pop) list ranked One > Nil at 25 for 2001. Not too bad for an import album, I guess. As > always, ymmv. Yep. I don't think that "power pop" would be one of the first hundred or so descriptive terms that I would choose for _One Nil_, but that's not to say that one taste excludes the other. I might guess that the CD got a certain number of sympathy votes because it wasn't released in the US--rooting for the underdog, embracing obscurity, etc. Of course I'm nothing but the picture of objectivity myself. ;-) > The 7WC lineup is Neil, Tim, Liam's band, Johnny Marr, Eddie Vedder, Ed > O'Brien, Philip Selway, Sebastian Steinberg, and Lisa Germano. Good fun > if you want to hear Neil do There Is A Light That Never Goes Out or > Eddie prove that he is indeed a Split Enz fan, in addition to the > various solo turns and Neil/Tim songs. So he did the _801 Live_ thing too! I hadn't heard anything about this. Thanks for mentioning it. It sounds like quite a lineup. > Just to keep things simple, the Nettwerk version of One Nil will be > called One All. I thought it was a mistake even then when Warner Brothers remixed Marshall Crenshaw's allegedly over-produced _Field Day_. I'm getting the same kind of feeling about this one, but it's good to know about it. Best wishes, Tim Victor timv@triad.rr.com ps: Someone emailed me off list and corrected the statement I made that Neil Finn is about the age of Eno and Bowie. Actually he was born in 1958 so he's at least a decade younger than them, and six years younger than his brother Tim. Apparently he was pretty young when Split Enz got started. Apologies for the misinformation, and thanks for the correction! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:53:36 -0500 From: timv@triad.rr.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Handedness On 24 Jan 2002, at 12:02, Aaron Milenski wrote: > As to the guitar, yes, when you play right-handed your left hand does > most > of the fine motor-type work, but your right hand definitely is the one > that > uses the most strength. That's particularly true of acoustic guitar, where the volume you can project depends on how hard you can whack the strings. At least up to my day, most players started out with an acoustic guitar. I wonder if that's still true. The same strum-right/stop-left pattern seems to apply to stringed instruments in general, including violins, cellos, etc. For the same reason I suppose. Banjo as well, where--thanks to Earl Scruggs-- technique depends on doing some really amazing stuff with the fingers of the right hand. Some of it might be the drive-on-which-side-of-the-road problem, I'd guess. As long as the difference in function between the two choices isn't too big, there's an advantage in adopting the most popular way--especially if the equipment is fairly expensive and has to be built differently (guitars, golf clubs; not baseball bats or tennis rackets.) And it's easier to learn from a teacher if you both do it the same way. > Nonetheless, in order to be good at their > instruments musicians (include drummers and keyboardists here too) have > to > be more ambidextrous than other people in order to be good at their > craft. I've heard of several guitar players who are naturally left-handed but play conventionally, and who've said that they thought it was an advantage to have that strength and dexterity (if you'll excuse the word) in their fretting fingers. Mark Knopfler is the first who comes to mind. Best wishes, Tim Victor timv@triad.rr.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:54:30 -0800 (PST) From: "Joseph M. Mallon" Subject: [loud-fans] The ARPs & Moogs are out tonight On Thu, 24 Jan 2002 LeftyZ@aol.com wrote: > Haven't seen this one mentioned......anyone else seen "Amelie"? > This is a delightful movie. Funny, silly, cute.....one of my favorites of > the last six months. Very cute and right on the border of sweet & too-sweet. Audrey Tautou has the biggest irises I've ever seen! > Any comments on "Lantana," "Gosford Park," "Shipping News" or "Vanilla Sky"? GOSFORD PARK is also very enjoyable - social commentary/character study, with a pointless mystery as a McGuffin. I especially liked Stephen Fry's detective. Re: old prog: Seems that's about all I've been listening to in 2001. Loads of old Genesis, Rush, and especially Yes. Genesis: I think that the first two Collins albums and DUKE are outstanding. I agree about "Epping Forest", and the other songs on SELLING ENGLAND do go on, but "The Cinema Show" has great keyboard & drum parts. I don't think Gabriel's Genesis put out a really solid-all-the-way-through album, except maybe LIVE. Yes: I really like RELAYER (esp. "Gates of Delirium", which is also really good live) and CLOSE TO THE EDGE, and even parts of TALES FROM TOPOGRAPHIC OCEANS, although I think Jon Anderson is right when he says that it would make a really great 50 min. album w/ 4 much shorter songs. To me, Yes were like The Doors: a set of musicians playing together, rather than a band. Only on "Gates" and CTTE did they escape that playing style of "my solo, now your solo, now together, now my solo". Right-handed, but using a left-handed mouse at work, J. Mallon ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:03:22 -0600 From: "Dennis McGreevy" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Halstead, Merritt, Dewey, Cheatem & Howe me, then Mr. Swartzentruber: >I'm not Dennis Sacks. So who's Dennis Stacks? <><><><><><><><><><><> [Removes mask, laughs nefariously] Not me, man. He's the list owner. - --Dennis (McGreevy) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:56:03 -0800 (PST) From: "Joseph M. Mallon" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: One Nil On 23 Jan 2002, at 23:12, steve wrote: > > The amelodic averse bunch on the Audities (power pop) list ranked One > > Nil at 25 for 2001. Not too bad for an import album, I guess. As > > always, ymmv. Does anyone have the Top ?? List from Audities? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:48:14 -0800 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Introduction >I don't know about RT, but the riff and solo on "Eight Miles High" is >reminiscent of Coltrane's playing on "A Love Supreme". As McGuinn's admitted several times over the years, the intro lick for "Eight Miles High," at least, is lifted almost note-for-note from a Coltrane piece called "India." Time to call those signs in the street back from coffee break, Andy "In the American mind, refinement, virtue, civilization, Christianity itself, are seen as feminine, and therefore women are often portrayed as possessing some kind of deeper wisdom, while the men, for all their apparent self-assurance, are fundamentally childish. But the West, lacking the graces of civilization, is the place 'where men are men'; in Western movies, men have the deeper wisdom and the women are children." - --Robert Warshow, from "Movie Chronicle: The Westerner" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:09:28 -0600 From: "Dennis McGreevy" Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [loud-fans] Introduction Mike Curley sez: Like Jeffrey, I have been exploring my deep dark past as a progressive music geek back in high school. I wasn't surprised to find out that I still like Genesis (at least the Peter Gabriel era, and even the first two Phil Collins ones), but I was surprised about how much I liked Yes. I especially like the Yes Album and Relayer. The classic criticism is that Yes is the stereotypical overblown rock dinosaur that was thankfully blown away by punk rock. <><><><><><><><><><><><><> Nah, punk happened because of the Eagles. There was this brief period when a bunch of people in LA did so many bad drugs that they though "Peaceful Easy Feeling" was rock & roll, and expected to have this generally accepted. oh, and the untimely death of James Taylor, - --Dennis ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:00:42 -0600 From: Bill Silvers Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: One Nil Joe Mallon asked: >Does anyone have the Top ?? List from Audities? I'd copied and pasted it to baffle folks elsewhere, so it was near at hand. >AUDITIES 2001 Top 20 Poll Results > >The fifth annual poll had the largest participation ever - 179 votes. And it >was the closest ever, as the top 2 records are separated by only two points. >One was the comeback effort of a band that many rock critics sneered at in >the beginning, but have proven to be very influential on modern pop-punk and >power pop. The other was the solo debut of the leader of one of the more >successful pop oriented groups of the '90s. When you look at the top 20 >(actually 21, thanks to a tie at # 20), you can see what a terrific year it >was for music. This becomes even more evident when you look at the next 29 >discs that comprise the 50 faves of the list. > >1. Weezer - WEEZER (a/k/a THE GREEN ALBUM) - 790 points >2. Ben Folds - ROCKIN' THE SUBURBS - 785 pts. >3. Splitsville - THE COMPLETE PET SOUL - 730 pts. >4. Pernice Brothers - THE WORLD WON'T END - 647 pts. >5. Cliff Hillis -- BE SEEING YOU -- 611 pts. >6. The Orgone Box - THE ORGONE BOX - 591 pts. >7. The Rosenbergs -- MISSION: YOU 544 pts. >8. Swag - CATCH-ALL 480 pts. >9. The Nines - PROPERTIES OF SOUND 477 pts. >10. Cotton Mather - THE BIG PICTURE 472 pts. >11. Lolas - SILVER DOLLAR SUNDAY-- 434 pts. >12. The Mockers - LIVING IN THE HOLLAND TUNNEL -- 428 pts. >13. Linus Of Hollywood -- LET YOURSELF BE HAPPY -- 425 pts. >14. Jon Brion - MEANINGLESS >Guided By Voices - ISOLATION DRILLS - 421 pts. >16. The Tories -- THE UPSIDE OF DOWN -- 415 pts. >17. Receiver - INSPIRATION OVERLOAD 394 pts. >18. Old 97s - SATELLITE RIDES 378 pts. >19. Electric Light Orchestra - ZOOM 373 pts. >20. Bob Dylan - LOVE AND THEFT >Ryan Adams - GOLD 366 pts. > >Here's the next 29, listed solely by artist (the Falkner is for NECESSITY: >THE FOUR TRACK YEARS) >22. Sugarbomb - 348 pts. >23. The Strokes - 342 pts. >24. Chewy Marble - 331 pts. >25. Neil Finn - 311 pts. >26. Cockeyed Ghost - 306 pts. >27. Rufus Wainwright - 266 pts. >28. David Mead - 265 pts. >29. The Elms - 256 pts. >30. Cosmic Rough Riders - 249 pts. >31. Ken Stringfellow - 244 pts. >32. R.E.M. >The Soundtrack Of Our Lives - 234 pts. >34. You Am I - 232 pts. >35. Sloan - 227 pts >36. The Minus 5 - 226 pts. >37. Adam Schmitt - 217 pts. >38. Paul McCartney - 214 pts. >39. Jim Boggia - 211 pts. >40. Jason Falkner - 201 pts. >41. Orange Peels - 196 pts. >42. Bigger Lovers >Mannix - 193 pts. >44. Sparkle * Jets U.K. - 185 pts. >45. Whiskeytown - 183 pts. >46. The Grip Weeds - 180 pts. >47. Pete Yorn - 179 pts. >48. Nick Lowe - 178 pts. >49. Moods For Moderns - 177 pts. >50. Beulah - 170 pts. "They're OK," he said. "I'm just lucky to have one." - -Tony Muser, on the Royals new uniforms ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:12:39 -0600 From: "Dennis McGreevy" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Introduction Dan Sallitt, then Mike Bowen: >For instance, you hear people say that Richard > Thompson's or Roger McGuinn's soloing is influenced by Coltrane - I'd > enjoy hearing about specific albums that show that influence. I don't know about RT, but the riff and solo on "Eight Miles High" is reminiscent of Coltrane's playing on "A Love Supreme". <><><><><><><><> McGuinn has somewhere that I've read stated that this was a deliberate lift. - --D ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 15:08:23 -0800 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: [loud-fans] Re: Mirror Refracted Handedness Andrew Hamlin wrote: > >The Orgone Box, "Judy over the Rainbow" - (Great > >pairing with previous song. Sunny 60's Brit-pop.) > > Would have been my Song Of The Year 2001 if someone hadn't pointed out it > was actually from 1996(?). It's an old song, but I think the version that came out in 1996 (by Rick Corcoran's former band Orange) is different than the version on the Orgone Box cd that came out in 2001, even though most of the material was recorded (and possibly released) before that. > Which reminds me, I'm deeply worried that my beloved Steve Holtebeck lives > within some sort of refracted-mirror-construct universe: > "Pedantically speaking, when you bat 'right-handed', you're actually > standing on the left side of the plate from your perspective, but the > left side from the pitcher's perspective." > Can anyone help? "refracted mirror-construct universe" sounds like an Orgone Box song! I got my lefts and rights mixed up there. You're on the left-side from your perspective, but the RIGHT side from the pitcher's perspective. The right fielder is also on the far left side of the diamond, from his/her perspective -- "But I *am* in right field! This is my right hand!" One reason there aren't more left-handed catchers, because right-handed batters get in the way of your left hand throwing the ball back to the pitcher (forget base stealers!). Also, there's a bigger possibility for passed balls because right-handed breaking balls go away from your body. The biggest reason there aren't more left-handed catchers though, is that there aren't that many left-handed catchers mitts! Steve ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:19:35 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Learned hands At 10:31 AM 1/24/2002 -0800, John Cooper wrote: >quite clearly. In fact, since yesterday morning, I've been >"listening" to Garth Brooks' jingle for Dr. Pepper ("Be you--be what >you do"), a state to which tinnitus is preferable. And what the f*ck is up with that demented percussion guy in the foreground of the commercial (and apparently, in the actual video of the song too, since I happened upon it in Target's electronics section last weekend) who looks like Garth from Wayne's World except he's forty years older and wearing a convict's jumper. I mean, was sentencing for WAYNE'S WORLD II that harsh? It wasn't close to the first movie, but two score years in prison and appearing in a Garth Brooks commercial/video as part of your work release program seems a little extreme. later, Miles =========================================================== "Looking out over the [Central Park] crowd... Garth Brooks' eyes got that crazed, fixated gleam they get from time to time. But this time his eyes had taken on a maniacal glint that suggested Goebbels staring out at a Nuremberg rally." -- John Bridges, the Nashville SCENE, Aug. 14, 1997 Miles Goosens outdoorminer@mindspring.com =========================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 18:18:55 -0500 From: David A Seldin Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Introduction Strangely, I thought of listing "Write with my left hand, do everything else with my right" as my Misc. entry, but thought it too ephemeral to bother mentioning... My parents tell me that when I was learning to write, I would use my left hand until I got to the middle of the page, and then switch to my right for the right-hand side. When my mom told me I needed to choose, I went (to her disappointment) with my left. My brother's a strict lefty, though. David On Wed, 23 Jan 2002 23:41:36 -0500 Janet Ingraham Dwyer writes: > At 09:35 PM 01/23/2002 -0600, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > >On Wed, 23 Jan 2002, Brendan Curry wrote: > > > >> Left/Right Handed: Write with my left. Throw baseballs/footballs/darts with > >> my right. > > > >Wait: you can toss a football in the air, throw a baseball and hit the > >football, then toss a dart at the deflected football? > > Of course he can, can't you? > > This bit of Brendan's bio piqued my interest too, actually. I write and > use eating utensils left-handed(ly?), but I cut with scissors, throw > (baseballs and darts - footballs are beyond me entirely), shoot > basketballs, and use a mouse right-handed(ly?). It's not ambidextrousness, > at least not as I understand that phenomenon, since I'm clumsy-to-incapable > when attempting any of those actions with the opposite hand. This is the > first I've ever heard someone else claim similar handedness. > > I'm suddenly wondering if mixed-up handedness is an indicator of > loud-fanness. (I'm not sure "indicator" is the proper term; I mean an > attribute that suggests a predisposition to another attribute). Sure, this > is a goof, but the diversity discussion is genuinely interesting. What > sorts of attributes do all or most of us have in common? (you can leave out > inordinate kindness to Janet; I already noted that one many times) Discuss. > > janet > ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 15:21:05 -0800 From: Michael Zwirn Subject: [loud-fans] Connecting two current threads ... I liked Garth Brooks' cover of Little Feat's "Dixie Chicken". n.p. on shuffle Continental Drifters, Better Day Buffalo Tom, A Sides Sam Phillips, Fan Dance Oh Susannah, Johnstown Neko Case and Her Boyfriends, Furnace Room Lullabye Michael - -- "I don't know how to speak to you I don't know how to trust you I don't know how to live for you I don't know how to love you" Milla ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:40:30 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Mirror Refracted Handedness On Thu, 24 Jan 2002, Steve Holtebeck wrote: > The biggest reason there aren't more left-handed catchers though, is > that there aren't that many left-handed catchers mitts! Could well be - my uncle once gave me an old catcher's mitt and, since I was one of the few kids who owned a catcher's mitt, I ended up learning to play catcher for a while. I wasn't very good at it - I'm not an effective squatter. - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::I suspect that the first dictator of this country will be called "Coach":: __William Gass__ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:53:46 -0600 From: "Dennis McGreevy" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Mirror Refracted Handedness Jeff sez: my uncle once gave me an old catcher's mitt and, since I was one of the few kids who owned a catcher's mitt, I ended up learning to play catcher for a while. I wasn't very good at it - I'm not an effective squatter. <><><><><><><><><> Jeff moves into places with no intention of paying, and either ends up buying the joint, or simply fails somehow to *occupy* it. - --D ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 15:49:25 -0800 (PST) From: Jon Gabriel Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Swap Review: Round & Round (half-hijacked to handedness) - --- jsharple@bls.brooklaw.edu wrote: > Saying Little Feat is southern rock is a little like > saying the Beatles were a Merseybeat group. The Beatles were a Merseybeat group! What's a Mersey? Jon ===== 777777777777777777777777777777 JON GABRIEL mesa, arizona usa inkling communication + design 777777777777777777777777777777 Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 19:09:31 -0500 From: jenny grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Swap Review: Round & Round (half-hijacked tohandedness) Andrew Hamlin wrote: > > Oh, here's a wrinkle I haven't seen discussed before: I have no natural > sense of left and right, can't tell one direction from the other without > thinking about it, and am frequently wrong even if I do think. I think I mentioned briefly in my handedness post that I've always had this problem. Because I was raised that righties customarily wear watches on their left wrist, and I was primarily a rightie, it finally became natural for me to put my watch on my left wrist without thinking about it, and I have therefore come to use my watch as an indicator. Another helpful hint a friend gave me is that if you hold your hands facing forward, with fingers together and thumbs extended to the side, your left hand forms an L in the proper English alphabet orientation. But when I took my driver's test in high school, I wore a huge copper bracelet on my right wrist to remind me that that was right. Prior to that, my mom discovered to her dismay that when told to turn either left or right, I had learned that the turn signal was pushed up for right and down for left, and then I would look at the dashboard to see which direction the lighted indicator arrow pointed! > "Pedantically speaking, when you bat 'right-handed', you're actually > standing on the left side of the plate from your perspective, but the > left side from the pitcher's perspective." > > Can anyone help? Left side of the plate from batter's perspective, right side of the plate from pitcher's perspective. I think he just mistyped. > Finally, a side-dominance-diagnostic I haven't seen mentioned before. > Casually place your hands in front of you and interlace your fingers in the > classic "ready for teacher" configuration. Which thumb is on top? Left thumb on top. When crossing my arms, left arm on top, though I think I did it the other way prior to shoulder surgery. When crossing my legs, right leg on top, but when sitting Indian style, left leg on top. I also put my left sock or shoe on first. Jen ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V2 #35 ******************************