From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V1 #343 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Tuesday, December 18 2001 Volume 01 : Number 343 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] New Joey Ramone [dana-boy@juno.com] Re: [loud-fans] Brian vs. Lou ["Aaron Milenski" ] [loud-fans] Music Licensing [Chris Prew ] [loud-fans] Stuart Adamson RIP [Michael Zwirn ] Re: [loud-fans] This is my research ["Pete O." ] [loud-fans] We're not out on the fringe! ["Brandon J. Carder" ] Re: [loud-fans] This is my research ["richblath" ] RE: [loud-fans] Brian vs. Lou ["Chris Murtland" ] [loud-fans] Vanilla Portable Art ["Chris Murtland" ] [loud-fans] pointlessness [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] [loud-fans] Brian vs. Lou, Would-Be-Goods (ns) [Dana L Paoli ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 09:05:17 -0500 From: dana-boy@juno.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] New Joey Ramone Not Sire, or even Rhino. It's on the Sanctuary label, which is kind of interesting. Anyway, I just picked up an extra copy of The Killjoys "Gimme Five" album ('96 Warner Canada), which is barely passable power-pop except for a fine Game Theory cover. First person to contact me off-list is welcome to it, but have some interesting CD to trade. >>>>>>>>>>>>> I look forward to seeing the list of what was proposed as "interesting." I finished your Kim Fowley CDR over the weekend, and I put International Heroes on as well, just in case you don't have it. Where do I send it -- didn't save your address last time. - --dana ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 09:12:25 -0500 From: "Aaron Milenski" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Brian vs. Lou >There probably isn't any disagreement that "Pet Sounds" and "The Velvet >Underground and Nico" are two pivotal classic albums that helped define the >rock genre. I was thinking that, excluding the Beatles of course, '72 glam >and '77 punk, these records are arguably the most important releases of >rock's first couple of decades. Which album do you think is more >important, >and why, (or do you find them equally important?) and if you had to choose >between the two, only allowed to keep one, which would it be? As to most important, you're leaving out soul/R&B. A lot of people would argue that Marvin Gaye's WHAT'S GOIN' ON is equally, if not more, important. You could also argue to include the first Hendrix or Led Zeppelin as the key roots of hard rock. In any case, this is a kind of strange question. I like PET SOUNDS more than VU&N, but that's only because of the four original VU albums that's by far my least favorite. But if I had to live in a world with just one of the two, there's no question that I'd pick VU&N because it was such a huge influence on a large part of the music I've liked since then, whereas PET SOUNDS, great as it is, didn't necessarily spawn a whole lot of greatness in its wake. _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 09:04:01 -0600 From: Chris Prew Subject: [loud-fans] Music Licensing Dan M: >So please! folks, keep askin' them stupid questions. We'll... keep >answ'rin' them. One post... at a time. That sounds like the door opening for me... Lets say I own a small business, and I decide to throw the muzak system out in the trash and play CDs for my patrons. As I understand it, I need to pay performance rights for any music I play. From browsing the bug-music, bmi, and ascap sites it seems if you sign up with them for performance rights, you can only play their music (music that agency licenses). So to be able to play any music I want, I have to license with all three (are there any more?), which seems outrageously expensive for a small business. Questions: 1. realistically, what are the odds of getting busted by any one of the above agencies? 2. If I DO get caught, what kind of nastiness can they impose on me? (None of their websites seem to touch on that issue not a big surprise) 3. I assume, if I9m licensed, burning CDs for this use is perfectly fine. 4. If you had to pick one agency to play their music only, which you would pick for maximum loud-fans type listening pleasure? (I think Scott is with ASCAP, no?) I appreciate any input....feel free to reply off list on this if you like. Chris Np: Black Box Recorder - England Made me (love the theremin fills on their cover of 3Seasons in the Sun2) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 08:32:31 -0800 From: Michael Zwirn Subject: [loud-fans] Stuart Adamson RIP I trust glenn has already heard this, but I just did: - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ LONDON, England -- Stuart Adamson, lead singer of 1980s pop group Big Country, has been found dead in Hawaii, according to his manager. Ian Grant confirmed the body of the 43-year-old was discovered in a hotel on Sunday. Grant said: "He was a great guy and I know there will be a lot of people will feel the same way." Adamson, who had been living in Nashville, Tennessee, went missing several weeks ago. He had fought a long battle with alcohol and also went missing in November 1999. A statement on the Web site of Grant's record label, Track Records, said: "I cannot believe I am sitting at my desk typing this. "Stuart Adamson was found dead in a hotel room in Hawaii yesterday. "I have no more news other than that at present. I ask the media to leave his family alone in their grief. My heart goes out to his family, Bruce, Mark and Tony." The statement added: "I have just lost one of the finest people I have ever worked with or been lucky enough to know." Big Country split last year and Adamson went on to form another group, The Raphaels. He had lived in Nashville for the past five years and was married. Adamson, born in Manchester, grew up in Crossgates near Dunfermline, Fife, and formed the punk group The Skids in the 1970s. He went on to form Big Country, which had a string of hits during the 1980s as well as eight successful albums. In 1986, he told how he had suffered a nervous breakdown six years before and was on the verge of another due to stress and overwork. When he went missing for the second time in two years earlier this month, his ex-wife Sandra, from Dunfermline, confirmed Adamson was due to appear in court in the U.S. charged with drink driving. She said the case had been deferred until March next year. Grant first met Adamson in 1977 and managed him throughout his career, from his beginnings in The Skids to critical acclaim with Big Country. He said: "He was a man that I had a lot of respect for. "You don't stay with someone in this business for that length of time unless that is the case. "At the moment someone close to me has died and I feel like I am in some kind of void. "He was a great guy and I know there will be a lot of people will feel the same way. Everybody who met Stuart liked him." Speaking before Adamson's death was announced, Richard Jobson, co-founder and vocalist in Skids, said: "My feelings for Stuart are as strong as ever they were. We had great times together. "He was always the rock that made the Skids a credible and imaginative force. He was pasionate and obstinate and an inspiring good friend." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 09:45:26 -0800 (PST) From: "Pete O." Subject: Re: [loud-fans] This is my research - --- "Brandon J. Carder" wrote: > Preparing to spend my christmas bonus at the record store. Anyone have > anything to say about any of the following? (These are ranked in order of > decreasing curiosity to me. Someone care to rearrange them in order of > importance?) > > Pernice Brothers world won't end Can't comment on the others, but I finally got around to listening to this one over the weekend having purchased it months(?) ago. Instant entry into my top 10 for the year. - - Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 11:32:14 -0800 From: "Brandon J. Carder" Subject: [loud-fans] We're not out on the fringe! We're http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1497511951 Cypress House/QED/Lost Coast Press Publishers of Exotic Paper Airplanes by Thay Yang and Tales From the Mountain by Pulitzer Prize nominee, Miguel Torga We don't rent pigs. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 20:39:57 +0000 From: "O Geier" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] We're not out on the fringe! This is funny, I was about to mention how much fun I'm having these days hunting down and reading negative feedback on ebay. It's cute how they try to adequately express how pissed off they are in only 80 characters, and the equally vitriolic responses. Support anti-Spam legislation. Join the fight http://www.cauce.org/ - ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Brandon J. Carder" To: Subject: [loud-fans] We're not out on the fringe! Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 11:32:14 - -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: from [66.89.201.78] by hotmail.com (3.2) with ESMTP id MHotMailBDE7948D003D40042A144259C94EE1FF0; Mon, 17 Dec 2001 11:37:52 -0800 Received: from smoe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1])by smoe.org (8.12.0.Beta16/8.12.0.Beta16) with ESMTP id fBHJaCRj016256;Mon, 17 Dec 2001 14:36:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)by smoe.org (8.12.0.Beta16/8.12.0.Beta16/submit) with SMTP id fBHJa0VC016242;Mon, 17 Dec 2001 14:36:00 -0500 (EST) Received: by smoe.org (bulk_mailer v1.10); Mon, 17 Dec 2001 14:35:50 -0500 Received: from smoe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1])by smoe.org (8.12.0.Beta16/8.12.0.Beta16) with ESMTP id fBHJZmRj016218for ; Mon, 17 Dec 2001 14:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost)by smoe.org (8.12.0.Beta16/8.12.0.Beta16/submit) id fBHJZmSx016217for loud-fans-outgoing; Mon, 17 Dec 2001 14:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx-out.daemonmail.net (mx-out.daemonmail.net [209.75.5.3]) by smoe.org (8.12.0.Beta16/8.12.0.Beta16) with ESMTP id fBHJZcRj016197 for ; Mon, 17 Dec 2001 14:35:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (localhost.daemonmail.net [127.0.0.1]) by mx-out.daemonmail.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA04560 for ; Mon, 17 Dec 2001 11:35:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brandon@cypresshouse.com) Received: from UncleMike (UncleMike [63.193.12.137]) by mail.cypresshouse.com with SMTP id TB10vBE0 Mon, 17 Dec 2001 11:35:35 -0700 (PST) From owner-loud-fans@smoe.org Mon, 17 Dec 2001 11:39:09 -0800 Message-ID: <000a01c18731$88a2c340$0c01a8c0@UncleMike> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 0.97c X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-loud-fans@smoe.org Precedence: bulk We're http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1497511951 Cypress House/QED/Lost Coast Press Publishers of Exotic Paper Airplanes by Thay Yang and Tales From the Mountain by Pulitzer Prize nominee, Miguel Torga We don't rent pigs. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: Click Here ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 15:11:08 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] New Joey Ramone On Mon, 17 Dec 2001 dana-boy@juno.com wrote: > I finished your Kim Fowley CDR over the weekend, and I put International > Heroes on as well, just in case you don't have it. Where do I send it -- > didn't save your address last time. Wow - Dana's offering a Kim Fowley CDR to the whole list! Cool... - -j ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 15:21:50 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: [loud-fans] Owsley (was: glennfactor) (ns) At 02:21 PM 12/14/2001 -0600, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >Oh - and a public shout-out to Miles, thanking him for pointing out the >Owsley CD in the racks at Used Kids when we were in Columbus visiting the >IDs. It's a big hit in this household, and I'm pretty sure any "power-pop" >fan here would like it as well. I'm glad you and Rose ended up liking it! It's just such a winning disc, loaded with catchy tunes and played with huge enthusiasm. And while it's hooky power pop, it's not of the cookie-cutter variety often touted on Audities... Speaking of Owsley, last week we saw him play his first live show in a year and a half. And like that 2000 show, accompanying us were Jeff Downing and Angie Reiner, who are returning to St. Louis and leaving us alone again as Nashville's only Loud-Fans. The show had a strange atmosphere: a high percentage of the concert-goers were friends and family of Owsley, but they seemed more intent on gabbing with each other instead of enjoying the show. We also once again had bad luck with the opening act -- in 2000, the bad luck was that we were forced to endure Gordon (Angie and I both still have those "Gordon Army" stickers to remind us the horror of Gordon!); in 2001, the bad luck had to with the scheduled opener, the always entertaining Ross Rice, not showing because his van caught on fire while en route from Memphis to Nashville. Anyway, Owsley acquitted himself ably, playing a typically short set -- about an hour of original material (including maybe three new songs), and then an extremely faithful fifteen-minute cover of Peter Frampton's "Do You Feel Like We Do?," including the vocoder interlude. The new songs wouldn't have sounded out of place on Owsley's debut, so if you like it, you'll probably like the new ones. No word on contract, label, timetable, etc. I think Owsley just wanted to play live again. NashRock late nite TV alert: this evening's Conan is a repeat from November featuring the mighty Los Straitjackets, i.e., the World's Greatest Mexican-Wrestling-Mask-Wearin' Kick-Ass Surf Instrumental Band, though since the spot promotes SING ALONG WITH LOS STRAIGHTJACKETS, Big Sandy should be providing guest vocals. One more NashRock note: the Last of the Full-Grown Men, the immortal Webb Wilder, has been playing around town with Los Straitjackets' Eddie Angel and Jimmy Lester as a power-pop combo. I can't remember the band name they're using, but I think it's a bird name -- "Bluebirds" (that would be irony-filled in this town), "Blackbirds," "Mockingbirds," something or other. Of course Jimmy was Webb's drummer before there was a Los Straitjackets, but still -- cool! later, Miles NashRock alert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 19:38:30 -0000 From: "richblath" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Vanilla REM - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Hamlin" To: "glenn mcdonald" ; "Michael Mitton" ; Sent: Monday, December 17, 2001 12:00 AM Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Vanilla REM > >My one-word review would be "Pointless". I, too, was pretty disappointed > >in this, especially after liking _Almost Famous_ so much. > > I didn't think ALMOST FAMOUS was all that, and VANILLA SKY isn't on my hot > list, but I do strongly recommend the original VANILLA SKY: Alejandro > Amenabar's OPEN YOUR EYES (ABRE LOS OJOS), from 1997 > Andy Superb film in my opinion too -though I think I'm just agreeing with Andrew on this all over again. Richard ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 19:47:04 -0000 From: "richblath" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] This is my research - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete O." To: Sent: Monday, December 17, 2001 5:45 PM Subject: Re: [loud-fans] This is my research > --- "Brandon J. Carder" wrote: > > Preparing to spend my christmas bonus at the record store. Anyone have > > anything to say about any of the following? (These are ranked in order of > > decreasing curiosity to me. Someone care to rearrange them in order of > > importance?) > > > > Pernice Brothers world won't end > > Can't comment on the others, but I finally got around to listening to this one over the > weekend having purchased it months(?) ago. > > Instant entry into my top 10 for the year. Yeah I meant to give this one a major thumbs up earlier too. Richard ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 16:03:49 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Vanilla REM At 04:00 PM 12/16/2001 -0800, Andrew Hamlin wrote: >I didn't think ALMOST FAMOUS was all that, and VANILLA SKY isn't on my hot >list, but I do strongly recommend the original VANILLA SKY: Alejandro >Amenabar's OPEN YOUR EYES (ABRE LOS OJOS), from 1997. I'm looking forward >to seeing Amenabar's first English-language picture, THE OTHERS, starring, >oddly enough, Tom Cruise's ex. Well, not oddly. Cruise and Nicole Kidman flipped for Amenabar's ABRE LOS OJOS, and not only worked to get Crowe to remake it for the US, but to bankroll Amenabar's future English-language efforts. In fact, Cruise exec produced THE OTHERS. Speaking of Kidman, MOULIN ROUGE comes out on DVD tomorrow. I still straddle the fence on this one -- it's not as innovative and dazzling as Baz Luhrmann obviously thinks it is, but it's darn entertaining most of the time. Plus Kidman is practically edible, and by pausing and slo-mo-ing the DVD, I'll defeat Luhrmann's confuse-o-vision and analyze her costumes like the Zapruder Film. I haven't seen VANILLA SKY yet, but I probably will. I won't enter the JERRY MAGUIRE on-list lists again, but Crowe's never let me down up to this point. Maybe he can exceed my now-lowered expectations. I really liked THE MAN WHO WASN'T THERE, but I'm such a Coens fan that you might want to take my recommendation with a box of Morton Salt. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 19:28:18 -0500 From: "Chris Murtland" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Brian vs. Lou *Shiny shiny, shiny boots of leather* I don't even own Pet Sounds, although it's been on my shopping list for about 12 years, so I guess I am disqualified, but I'd have to pick VU over the Beach Boys any day of the week. Of course, I don't live in California, so maybe I am disqualified. The VU sound, especially those freaky buzzing guitar solos, is perhaps my favorite sound ever (also see The Modern Lovers). I have never owned a pair of sandals, but I've had my share of black leather boots. bleed for me, Rev. Murt |In other words, are you a winter or a summer? Black leather boots or |sandals? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 19:40:05 -0500 From: "Chris Murtland" Subject: [loud-fans] Vanilla Portable Art I thought Vanilla Sky was funny. One point in particular was hilarious, although I was the only one in the theater laughing out loud. This movie seemed to me to be a joke on the audience, but I could have invented that. I am interested in seeing the original, though. I am not particularly well-informed about or interested in film, so please don't rip me to shreds for thinking it was funny as if I've spent a lifetime honing my skills as a film critic. I also thought Almost Famous was hilarious. I was thinking about why films don't affect me much. I enjoy movies enough while I am sitting there, but they don't really have a lasting impact on me, unlike books and music. There are some powerful films, to be sure, but I believe portability is the issue. Books and music can pretty much accompany you anywhere and you can refresh their power at a moment's notice, unlike films or even visual art (unless it's hanging on *your* wall, I guess). Plus, movies require a sizable time commitment, unlike a three-minute pop song. I know it's a drag to talk about art, but I am wondering if anyone else has any feelings about portability as property of effective art. I apologize in advance to any sculptors in the audience (unless you make little figurines). ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 20:00:56 -0800 From: Carolyn Dorsey Subject: [loud-fans] Syd Barrett I recently got this cd called Wouldn't you Miss Me? The Best of Syd Barrett. It's a compilation of songs from a few of his records from the late sixties. It came out earlier this year. I had just one tape someone made for me of just a few songs of his and I hadn't heard alot of these songs before. Some are very beautiful. Sometimes his guitar sounds a little out of tune and sometimes he played a little too fast and out of time but that's partly what makes the songs interesting to me. Carolyn ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 21:19:48 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [loud-fans] pointlessness This is perhaps better intended for Dick Goodbody and "The Starting Line," but... why the hell do cars still have "parking lights"? More specifically, why is there a separate setting allowing you to turn only those lights on - since no one uses them, and why anyone ever thought a separate level of lights was needed for parking is a complete mystery? Okay, uh, the nice lady in the white jacket has crushed my pills into my jello now. - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::In terms of the conjunctures of cultures, [LA is] less like a salad bowl ::and more like a TV dinner with those little aluminium barriers keeping ::all the vegetables in their places. __Catherine Ann Driscoll__ np: Hard Candy Christmas - the Steve Holtebeck '01 Mixmash. Thanks Steve! Oh - and thanks, Larry Tucker, too! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 23:10:24 -0500 From: Dana L Paoli Subject: [loud-fans] Brian vs. Lou, Would-Be-Goods (ns) The VU sound, especially those freaky buzzing guitar solos, is perhaps my favorite sound ever (also see The Modern Lovers). >>>>>>>>>>>>>> A while ago I paid a fair amount for a vinyl mono copy of the first VU album. While there's not a huge advantage to having mono mixes of most of the songs, two are vastly improved. On Heroin, John Cale's viola is *way* more abrasive and present than on the stereo mix. The other song where mono makes a big difference, European Son, has always been my least favorite on the original album. With the mono mix, Lou's guitar is much more front and center, and it's pretty amazing to hear the horrible things that he does to that poor innocent instrument. Other songs from the album are interesting in mono, but not so very different. I mention this in part because, according to the VU website, there's going to be a reissue of the first album on CD early next year with both stereo and mono mixes, as well as other items of interest. I'd love to have a mono White Light/White Heat, but it seems to be harder to come by. I'm assuming that it'll come out at some point, probably right after I drop three figures for a copy on eBay. I thought I'd mention the new Would-Be-Goods singles, as they're flying well under the radar. Stewart could definitely give a better band history than I, but in short they were one of those wacky el label bands consisting of a model and some Monochrome set people, I think. Anyway, after a long dormancy, they/she are back with an ep and a vinyl single on the very poorly distributed Matinee label. The vinyl single is probably for the converted (very good, but for the converted) but the CD ep has one killer song that would probably go over well with folks on this list. The EP is called Emmanuelle Beart and the title track is a pretty amazing tune in the vein of "David Watts" where spokesmodel Jessica Griffin wonders in her Frenchish accent why she can't look like Emmanuelle Beart, over an almost Game Theory sounding, very rocking background. There are "Ooh la la la la's" galore and clever lyrics ("Instead of fish and chips she lives on salads nicoises") and it's probably the most instantly likeable song that I've heard this year. And Gail O'Hara did the photographs, making it even more appropriate to play "Emmanuelle Beart" while sipping champagne and bopping around your bedroom and asking your friends to describe their supercrush. I'll never tell who my supercrush is. - --dana ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 23:28:05 -0500 From: jenny grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Vanilla Portable Art Chris Murtland wrote: > > I know it's a drag to talk about art, but I am wondering if anyone else > has any feelings about portability as property of effective art. I > apologize in advance to any sculptors in the audience (unless you make > little figurines). Dragging art around can be tedious, but I believe portability is irrelevant to the effectiveness of art. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 23:45:29 EST From: Vivebonpop@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] pointlessness In a message dated 12/17/01 10:20:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, jenor@csd.uwm.edu writes: > why the hell do cars still have "parking lights"? More specifically, why > is there a separate setting allowing you to turn only those lights on - > since no one uses them Maybe they ARE kind of pointless, but when I had my '65 beetle, I used to love to turn them on, because the old beetles have those "bubble" type old-fashioned headlights, which create this cool luminescence when the parking lights are on, as the parking lights are in that assembly, in front of the regular headlights, but behind the outer layer of glass. Really looks cool on rainy days. Never mind that the car had a non-collapsible steering column, no seat belts (I added later) and a gas tank positioned right in front of me. It was COOL dammit!! Yours in superficiality (art before safety), Mark "Is this Sebastian?" (my mother, upon my discovery of her looking at my latest Belle and Sebastian CD single's liner sleeve) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 23:57:44 -0500 From: Dan McCarthy Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Music Licensing >Lets say I own a small business, and I decide to throw the muzak system out >in the trash and play CDs for my patrons. As I understand it, I need to pay >performance rights for any music I play. In a vacuum, yes. In the real world, I would say you're probably safe not doing so. Experience working in a CD store backs me up on this: we're constantly playing promos or CDs that we've brought from home, and isn't that rather expected at a CD store? True, we're playing things that we may expect to sell (though 80% of what I play is either out of print or on a small label that my store doesn't normally carry), but in theory the same rules ought to apply to us as we are, technically, engaging in a "public performance" of the music we slap into the CD player. And here's an interesting side-note, vis. corporate punishment of license violators - though the 'rules' state that if, for example, a CD is sold before release date, we're subject to a $250,000 fine... what has happened on the very few occasions that our store has violated this rule has been that the distributor simply stops sending the CDs in early. That ensures that we keep buying their product, and we've got the additional punitive thorn in our side of having to scurry around like madmen trying to get the CD's received and stickered on the day of the release. It's a much more 'efficient' method of punishment. It may, in some way, depend on the sort of small business you're talking about, too, Chris. But that's my random babble on the subject. T'other Dan > From browsing the bug-music, bmi, and ascap sites it seems if you sign up >with them for performance rights, you can only play their music (music that >agency licenses). So to be able to play any music I want, I have to >license with all three (are there any more?), which seems outrageously >expensive for a small business. > >Questions: > >1. realistically, what are the odds of getting busted by any one of the >above agencies? >2. If I DO get caught, what kind of nastiness can they impose on me? (None >of their websites seem to touch on that issue not a big surprise) >3. I assume, if I9m licensed, burning CDs for this use is perfectly fine. >4. If you had to pick one agency to play their music only, which you would >pick for maximum loud-fans type listening pleasure? (I think Scott is with >ASCAP, no?) > > >I appreciate any input....feel free to reply off list on this if you like. > >Chris >Np: Black Box Recorder - England Made me (love the theremin fills on their >cover of 3Seasons in the Sun2) ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V1 #343 *******************************