From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V1 #339 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Friday, December 14 2001 Volume 01 : Number 339 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] *too* close... [dana-boy@juno.com] Re: [loud-fans] *too* close... ["Joseph M. Mallon" ] Re: [loud-fans] '70s Show? [Stewart Mason ] [loud-fans] The reason That 70s Show sucks this year... (fwd) [Stewart Ma] Re: [loud-fans] The Long Road... [Steve Holtebeck ] Re: [loud-fans] Christmas tunage [Vivebonpop@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Christmas tunage [AWeiss4338@aol.com] [loud-fans] glennfactor (ns) [Dana L Paoli ] [loud-fans] pressure cooked chicken, sad stringy pop covers.... [Vivebonp] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 10:04:03 -0500 From: dana-boy@juno.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] *too* close... Wow, I always make my swap CDR's by: 1. Getting a little drunk (Vodka martini with a tomolive, in general) 2. Throwing on whatever strikes my fancy from moment to moment 3. Mailing it in a plain envelope with a little Post-it on the CD case that says "email me if you want to know the track listing" 4. Losing the track listing, and attempting to reconstruct it from memory I didn't realize that it was such an art form. BTW, in the photo of the liner notes in the Onion article, under "The Eternals" it says: "As cliche as tit sounds." Onion typo? Someone at the Onion being cute? Or intentional? If it's intentional, what is it saying about Josh McCue? That he's sloppy? That he has a breast fetish and makes Freudian slips? That he has an odd sense of humor? He looks a little odd to me. The Kevin Tihista MP3 of the week is a cover of Black Sabbath's "Changes" for all you heavy metal fans: http://kevintihista.com/newindex2.html - --dana np: Linda Smith/"The Space Between the Buildings" On Thu, 13 Dec 2001 00:30:21 -0600 (CST) Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey writes: > Okay, so I've been working on my swap tape. First, coming up with a > ridiculous little subtext/theme, going through a zillion CDs trying > to > find the right tracks, making sure everything'll fit on one tape > (albeit a > 110)...and then trying to put together the j-card: finding (i.e., > stealing > from the web) some art, thinking through the concept, choosing > fonts, > designing & actually placing the elements together...when I pick up > this > week's _Onion_ ('round these parts, they actually *print* the thing) > and > see the article represented online at the URL hereunder: > > http://www.theonion.com/onion3745/area_man_proud.html > > Sheesh. Who's been hangin' 'round my house? (And not just mine, I > think...) > > --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey > > J e f f r e y N o r m a n > The Architectural Dance Society > www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html > ::You think your country needs you, but you know it never will:: > __Elvis Costello__ > ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 11:01:57 -0800 (PST) From: "Joseph M. Mallon" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] *too* close... On Thu, 13 Dec 2001 dana-boy@juno.com wrote: > The Kevin Tihista MP3 of the week is a cover of Black Sabbath's "Changes" > for all you heavy metal fans: "Changes", a piano ballad, is the least metally of all Sabs songs (except maybe "She's Gone"). Bonus: the MP3 was "cooked" (bad line endings). Good version, though. I sent Sue a link to the Onion article w/ the subject line "I am slain". Those of you who got my COVER ART collection know what I mean. Nothing left to do but buy a shirt that says "Area Man". Area fan, J. Mallon ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 13:26:01 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] *too* close... On Thu, 13 Dec 2001 dana-boy@juno.com wrote: > BTW, in the photo of the liner notes in the Onion article, under "The > Eternals" it says: "As cliche as tit sounds." Onion typo? Someone at > the Onion being cute? Or intentional? If it's intentional, what is it > saying about Josh McCue? That he's sloppy? That he has a breast fetish > and makes Freudian slips? That he has an odd sense of humor? He looks a > little odd to me. It's yet more proof that small children are being eaten by witches. - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::When the only tool you have is an interociter, you tend to treat ::everything as if it were a fourth-order nanodimensional sub-quantum ::temporo-spatial anomaly. __Crow T. Maslow__ np: Bonzo Dog Band _Cornology_ disc 3 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 13:34:30 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [loud-fans] new contender in band name sweepstakes Points off for the dorky | thing...but this came from our own mr. pathetic: - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 08:52:50 -0500 (EST) Monday December 17th Black Cat (1811 14th St WDC) $5 Cheap! all ages, music 9ish. Feckless Beast * Sissy|Space|Sex - ------------ Dammit, *I* wanna name my band "Sissy Space Sex"! - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::American people like their politics like Pez - small, sweet, and ::coming out of a funny plastic head. __Dennis Miller__ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 22:36:05 +0000 From: "Brendan Curry" Subject: [loud-fans] The Onion Strikes Again http://www.theonion.com/onion3745/area_man_proud.html _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 23:11:57 +0000 From: "robert toren" Subject: [loud-fans] More fucking GT/LF photos But this is it for a while... I think I've got most everything up. Uploaded a bunch more digitized slides: Mostly Lolita Nation era, live and publicity shots in the Photos > GT/LN era Album. Also created a new Photos Album for Loud Family v.2 (i.e., Kenny, Alison, Gil)containing four posed shots, after gig or in the DfD studio_ I got the Big Shot Chronicles back-cover shot digitized, and will put that up in a coupla weeks as a holiday treat_ Best, Robert yahoo groups - gametheoryphotos _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 18:01:23 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [loud-fans] '70s Show? Because of the bizarre, multi-network Tuesday night pile-up, until recently we weren't watching _That '70s Show_ this season. For Christmas, though, I bought Rose a little TV/VCR combo so she do her aerobics thing in a room other than the one I'm in...so we now are able to watch one show while taping two others. Thus it was that last night, we watched a tape of the first _'70s Show_ of this season. And it pretty much sucked. The jokes seemed forced and unfunny (how *many* times did Fez have to attempt the "balls" joke? We got the point immediately...), the plots disconnected, and the characters thinned down to cardboard stereotypes of themselves (and not having changed a whit since the show's first season: contrast the character development from Season One to Season Three of _Buffy_). So my question is: was this an exception, or has the decline in the show I noticed last season only worsened, and this week's episode was about average in quality? I'm hoping everyone jumps in with "oh God, you're right - that was really lame. But it was by far the worst episode this season." - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::beliefs are ideas going bald:: __Francis Picabia__ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 17:23:16 -0700 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] '70s Show? At 06:01 PM 12/13/01 -0600, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >So my question is: was this an exception, or has the decline in the show I >noticed last season only worsened, and this week's episode was about >average in quality? I'm hoping everyone jumps in with "oh God, you're >right - that was really lame. But it was by far the worst episode this >season." Well, let's put it this way: while I'm recording Gilmore Girls and waiting for Undeclared to start, I'm now either in the kitchen making dinner or watching Dharma and Greg with the sound off waiting for the director's weekly Scene That Focuses On Jenna Elfman's Ass. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 19:25:05 -0700 From: Stewart Mason Subject: [loud-fans] The reason That 70s Show sucks this year... (fwd) ...is apparently that the creator-producer has better things to do with his time, according to this fairly fascinating email exchange between T7S creator Mark Brazill and Undeclared's Judd Apatow. (Allegedly, I guess I should add.) If this is on the level, Brazill is a bitter, bitter little man. S >> Subject: Undelcared vs That 70's Show >> >> Didn't know if you guys saw this but here's a private >> e-mail exchange between Judd Apatow (freaks & geeks, >> undeclared) and Mark Brazill (That 70s Sho, That 80s >> show). Apparently, there's some bad blood. Heh. Topher >> Grace wanted to guest spot on Undeclared -- this made >> Brazill very very angry. >> >> ********* >> Mark, >> >> I am writing you because I left a message but did not >> hear back. I >> understand from Gail Berman that you were upset about >> me not calling you >> to ask if Topher could do our show. Since Fox >> executives were talking to >> Topher about it I thought it was cool with you. Also, >> since I hadn't written >> it yet, I wasn't at the point of asking if it was >> possible to have him do >> it. I would have called your show then. I mentioned >> the names of several >> people who were interested in doing cameos on our show >> to the Variety guy. >> They decided to only mention Topher. Maybe I shouldn't >> have mentioned it. >> I didn't realize it would create a problem. I never >> wished to offend you. >> >> If there is some protocol to people on Fox doing guest >> shots on other Fox >> shows, I didn't know what it was. Regardless, I'm >> sorry that this resulted in >> such a mess. If you are mad at me about this or >> something else from our >> past, please tell me. I only remember us having fun in >> the early nineties and >> it troubles me that it seems like you have a beef with >> me. >> Best regards, >> Judd Apatow >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> --- >> --- >> >> ------------------------------ >> Judd, >> >> Yeah, we were friends in the early nineties. And if >> you don't recall >> what happened, I'll remind you. I had a pilot at MTV >> called "Yard Dogs" >> about a rock band living in Hollywood. I told you >> about it and you proceeded to >> completely rip it off, storyline and all, for the Ben >> Stiller show. You >> called it "Grungies." MTV and UTA were working on an >> overall deal >> (MTV's idea) with me, based on that pilot. When it >> turned up on your show >> everything went away overnight. I had just had my son >> Jack and I had no >> job, no money, nothing. There's a saying, "I forgive >> but I don't >> forget. And I don't forgive." So, now you know. >> Although I kind of think that >> you already did. >> -Mark >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> Mark, >> I truly don't remember anything you are talking about. >> Jeff Kahn wrote >> The Grungies sketch, a parody where we did Seattle >> bands as The Monkey's. I >> don't remember you ever calling me after that saying >> you were mad. Ben >> and I would get fifty sketches a week from the writers >> and then we'd pick the >> one's that we thought were funny. I never connected >> the two. Even now they >> don't seem similar. Ours was a goofy over the top >> parody, not a situation >> comedy about musicians in LA. Nobody watched our show >> so I don't see how that >> could be the reason your pilot died. That sketch aired >> once up against 60 >> Minutes, so it didn't have any impact in town. I am >> sorry you are upset. I am >> not a thief of ideas. I'm sorry you believe >> differently. >> Judd Apatow >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> --- >> --- >> >> ------------------------------ >> Judd, >> The show I wrote was also over the top and it let down >> the fourth wall. >> Since it's registered at the WGA, you could compare >> the two. And as an >> Exec Producer, we both know you have input into every >> sketch. As for no one >> seeing the show everyone knows everything in >> Hollywood. There are no >> secrets. Personally, I feel you've made a career out >> of being a >> sycophant to Carrey or Shandling or Roseanne and when >> you weren't kissing ass, you >> were stealing from lesser known comics or leeching off >> other people's ideas >> (Celtic Pride, Cable Guy). I noticed how outraged you >> were to not get a >> writing credit on Cable Guy until it came out and was >> panned. You >> dropped that cause like the showbiz weasel you are. >> You may not think you're a >> thief but most comics know otherwise. And again, you >> know that too. Have you >> ever read "What Makes Sammy Run"? I think you'd like >> it. Get cancer. >> Love, >> Mark >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> --- >> --- >> >> ----------------------------- >> Mark, >> Come on, we all wrote for comics at the beginning of >> our careers. I >> wrote for Roseanne, you wrote for Dennis Miller. If >> that makes me a >> sycophant, then I guess I am. And so are the writers >> for Caesar's Hour. I dropped >> my Cable Guy law suit not because the film got bad >> reviews, but because I >> spent eighty grand on it and my lawyer told me I was >> going to lose. You would >> be upset if you re-wrote the vast majority of a script >> and received no >> credit. I wish you had called me about this years ago. >> I'm sure we could have >> worked it out. Try not to be so angry. Not everyone is >> as bad as you >> think. You should call Jeff Kahn and ask him how that >> sketch originated. If >> it turned out that I didn't steal your idea would you >> still want me to get >> cancer? I swear to God that I didn't know you were mad >> about this. >> Until six weeks ago I was still referring to you as an >> old friend. Maybe one >> day I'll be able to say that again. >> Judd Apatow >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> --- >> --- >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Mark, >> It's come to my attention that you are upset with Judd >> Apatow about >> the sketch, "The Grungies." I completely understand >> why you would have been >> pissed off about seeing something similar to what you >> were working on at >> the time. However, the idea for, "The Grungies," and >> all the initial >> writing and rewriting came from me. I also cast it, >> acted in it and edited it. I >> was and still am influenced by pop music and I thought >> it would be funny to >> satirize the seriousness of the Seattle grunge music >> scene with the >> ridiculous superficiality of "The Monkees" 1960s show. >> I hope that >> this clears up any misunderstanding. >> By the way, I am a huge fan of "That 70's Show." >> Congratulations on >> its well deserved success. I also think it's cool you >> set it in Wisconsin. >> I went to the University of Wisconsin at Madison and >> loved it. >> If you have any other questions don't hesitate to >> E-mail me. >> Jeff Kahn >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> --- >> --- >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> ----------------- >> >> >> Mark, >> I have no interest in talking with you on the phone >> any more. I know >> you are very successful and think that gives you the >> right to judge people and >> berate them regardless of the facts, but I have had >> enough of you for one day. >> >> I know it's hard to believe that your rock band TV >> idea, which every >> writer in this town has thought of at one point, was >> not on my mind half a year >> after you told it to me. Yes, you thought of breaking >> the fourth wall. >> Groucho and George Burns stole it from you. Maybe you >> should sue Bernie Mac. >> Why don't you sue the guys who have that new show "How >> To Be A Rock Star" on >> the WB. I must have told them your idea. Nobody has >> ever goofed on rock >> bands, not Spinal Tap or The Rutles or 800 Saturday >> Night Live sketches. >> >> I should have told everyone on the show, no rock band >> sketches, that's >> Brazil's area. So hold on to your hate and rage, even >> though it makes no sense. >> >> I'll go back to my life of thievery and leaching. As >> for the cancer, I'll >> wait till you get it and then steal it from you. By >> the way, that joke was >> one of my writer's, Rodney Rothman (see I credited >> him). See, I have no >> original thoughts. Sorry I bothered to figure this >> out. >> Judd >> ---------------------------------------- >> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Judd >> How appropriate that you had to use someone else's >> joke to take a swipe >> at me. I told you my idea. You did it two weeks later, >> VERBATIM. Spew >> revisionist shit all you want. Everyone knows you're a >> hack. Also, >> everyone knows how you fucked over Paul Feig on the >> new show. All your press >> mentions "your" brilliant Freaks and Geeks, as if Feig >> didn't even do the series. >> It must have killed you when the true genius behind it >> got nominated for an >> Emmy. Is your wife still livid about someone in the >> neighborhood >> building a house just like hers? Tell her I know how >> she feels. The reason I >> called was to tell you to piss off. We'll never be >> "friends", regardless of >> the pussy whining from your last e-mail. I respect you >> zero. >> See ya at the upfronts, bitch! >> Well...unless you get canceled before that. >> Until then, die in a fiery accident and taste your own >> blood. >> (Is that too angry?) >> Love, Brazill >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------- >> ----------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Mark, >> >> I hope your anger is a joke, because if it >> isn't...wow. Here's a line >> by line reply. I have starred (*) the replies if you >> are confused by my >> format. >> >> How appropriate that you had to use someone else's >> joke to take a swipe >> at me. >> >> ***That was the joke. How interesting that you >> couldn't understand >> that. >> >> You would think someone with the lineage of "Yard >> Dogs" would have the >> intellectual acumen to pick up on that. I feel for the >> writers that >> have to pitch to you. Never doubt how much they hate >> you. >> >> I told you my idea. You did it two weeks later, >> VERBATIM. Spew >> revisionist shit all you want. >> >> ***How could I hear your idea, steal it, and then have >> it air two weeks >> later? It was a filmed sketch show . Sketches were >> written months >> before they aired. They were filmed six weeks before >> they aired. I thought >> you were a producer. Shouldn't you understand how >> these shows are made? Do >> you start writing episodes two weeks before they air? >> Maybe you stole >> "Yard Dogs" from me. >> >> Everyone knows you're a hack. >> >> ***That's why I kiss the ass. Let me know who thinks I >> am a hack so I >> can kiss their ass as well. I also suck dick lately. >> That's how I got my >> Dreamworks deal. >> >> Also, everyone knows how you fucked over Paul Feig on >> the new show. All your press >> mentions "your" brilliant Freaks and Geeks, as if Feig >> didn't even do the series. >> >> It must have killed you when the true genius behind it >> got nominated for an >> Emmy. >> >> ***I'm sure it's hard for you to believe, but I do not >> control the >> national media. That is only true in your paranoid >> mind. If I create a show >> they often mention the last show. If you create a new >> show by yourself, I >> doubt they will spend a lot of time talking about the >> Turners. When they >> write about "That 80's Show" I am sure they won't ever >> mention "That 70's >> Show." >> I wrote an entire article in the LA Times, a cover >> story in the >> calendar, that credited Paul for his work. He went >> from a struggling actor to an >> established writer/producer over the course of a year. >> He is still my >> friend and I am very happy that he was nominated for >> two Emmy's. He deserved >> it. >> I wasn't upset about his Emmy nominations, I already >> have enough. The >> certificates are so big you can only hang so many >> before it starts >> looking tacky. >> >> >> Is your wife still livid about someone in the >> neighborhood building a >> house just like hers? >> >> *** Yes. >> >> Tell her I know how she feels. >> >> ***I'm on it. >> >> The reason I called was to tell you to piss off. We'll >> never be "friends," regardless of >> the pussy whining from your last e-mail. >> >> ***The funniest part of these e mails is how bad your >> sense of humor is. >> >> You neither get nor can tell a joke. After you said >> "get cancer" did you >> really think I was looking to heal our relationship? >> Usually the cancer insult >> is a closer. I'm sure everyone who has suffered with >> that appreciates your >> sharp wit. >> >> I respect you zero. >> >> ***Oh no. >> >> See ya at the upfronts, bitch! >> Well...unless you get canceled before that. >> >> ***If you think cancellation hurts me at this point, >> you haven't been >> following my career as closely as I thought. I guess >> you are too busy >> tracking my real estate problems. >> >> Until then, die in a fiery accident and taste your own >> blood. >> >> ***That's a Sam Kinison line you stupid fuck!!!! >> Hypocrite!!!! >> J'accuse!!!! >> >> (Is that too angry?) >> Love, Brazill >> >> >> ***Mark, I have enjoyed this. It's good to see the >> tragedies of the >> past few months haven't watered down your passion. I >> guess if Mark Brazill >> doesn't go insane over stuff that makes no sense, the >> terrorists win. Good luck >> with "That 80's Show." And I look forward to "That >> 90's Show." >> >> Judd Apatow >> >> >> >> >> >> __________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 19:04:58 -0800 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The Long Road... Roger Winston wrote: > They've recently archived 20 years of Usenet articles at Google. Here's > the Rob Poor post where I first heard about the Loud Family. It also had > the info I used for subscribing to the mailing list which eventually became > this List. > http://groups.google.com/groups?q=%22scott+miller%22+%22loud+family%22&start=180&hl=en&scoring=d&rnum=186&selm=5639%40rosie.NeXT.COM If anyone hasn't yet checked out the searchable Usenet archive at groups.google.com, it's a great way to waste productive time. Finding the first mention of your favorite semi-obscure band, looking up current and former friends by name or email, even looking through your own drunken newsgroup posts from years gone by. There's a timeline at the google page, linking to the first mentions of Microsoft, Madonna, Mosaic. etc etc..Here are a some more Usenet "firsts" that I found this afternoon. First mention of the *band* "Game Theory" (Aug 27, 1985) http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=153%40ucbingres.ARPA First mention of the *band* "The Loud Family" (May 8, 1992) http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=3797%40rosie.NeXT.COM (also the first mention of "Anton Barbeau".. Where was I on 5/9/92, and why wasn't I at this show?) ..and the first time Rob Poor called his band list "loud fans" (Jan 1993) http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=6681%40rosie.NeXT.COM How many other bands had electronic mailing lists in 1992-93? Another wasted afternoon, Steve ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2001 00:05:30 EST From: Vivebonpop@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Christmas tunage In a message dated 12/11/01 2:22:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, AWeiss4338 writes: Andrea says of her faves: > The Christians And The Pagans Dar Williams > I LOVE this song! The pies are burning... M np The Best of Morrisey nr The Warhol Diaries (finally got this to read over the holidays..._War and Peace_ is shorter!) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2001 00:07:14 EST From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Christmas tunage In a message dated 12/14/01 12:05:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, Vivebonpop writes: > Andrea says of her faves: > > >> The Christians And The Pagans Dar Williams >> > > I LOVE this song! > > The pies are burning... > M > > 'And she hit the kitchen,' :-) Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2001 00:28:37 -0500 From: Dana L Paoli Subject: [loud-fans] glennfactor (ns) Did someone yet mention that glenn's site gets a plug (for his piece on the most recent Guided By Voices album) in the new Chickfactor. I was a big fan of this review, and I'm glad to see it singled out for praise. In celebration, I say we all bop around our rooms to groovy french pop while drinking fizzy champagne and asking our friends who their supercrush is. - --dana ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2001 00:36:36 EST From: Vivebonpop@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] pressure cooked chicken, sad stringy pop covers.... I was in a free-standing Chick-fil-A the other morning having breakfast and the sound system in the place had Muzak playing, quite loudly. Not the Muzak of now, mind you...I heard some Posies in a drug store a couple of years ago in a Muzak style, but it was a modern style of Muzak. This was the type of Muzak that you used to hear in elevators and department stores...heavy on the strings, like that song "Theme From 'A Summer Place.'" I told the cashier, "I feel like I'm in Belk's (a regional dept. store) in 1974." I about busted out laughing hearing a sad version of "The Way We Were" on a forlorn lone violin. It was so embarassingly ironic. I was waiting for "Do You Know Where You're Going To?" or Michael Jackson's "Ben" to come up next (suicidal '70s pop...the kind where you want to drive your Pacer off a cliff...or you try and slit your wrists with waffle fries). Apparently they still make this stuff? I thought the target audience for this stuff were pushing up daisies by now. Surprised, M ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V1 #339 *******************************