From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V1 #232 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Saturday, September 15 2001 Volume 01 : Number 232 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] grant lee phillips [jenny grover ] Re: [loud-fans] repay with a blessing [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] grant lee phillips Jeff Brenneman wrote: > > hey all! > > went to the grant lee phillips show last night in hollywood. phenominal! i > highly recommend the show to anyone. I want to second this! I saw the Portland show and found the man to be very entertaining and charming. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2001 11:51:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] repay with a blessing On Fri, 14 Sep 2001 Vivebonpop@aol.com wrote: > An old friend (seminary students always have scripture floating around in > their heads) sent me this Wednesday, in response to an e-mail I had sent him > in regards to Tuesday. I thought his response was an interesting > perspective, and I wanted to pass it along. > This is the Bible passage that keeps rolling through my head, I Peter 3. > 8-12: "Finally, all of you, have unity of spirit, sympathy, love for one > another, a tender heart, and a humble mind. Do not repay evil for evil or > > I keep thinking this because of the rhetoric George W. was using last > night, that this is " an act of war," and we were attacked "because we are a > beacon of freedom." Also, with this verse in mind, we as a country were > being repayed with evil because of the evil we have raged and sponsored > as a nation in our position being the lone "superpower," read "bully." > Though we are right to be outraged as a nation, I pray that we as a > nation will interrogate how terrorism plays into our foreign policy as a > nation, and though we may want to repay this evil with more evil, I pray > that we will follow Jesus' commandment by turning the other cheek, and > not a middle finger. I wouldn't go so far as to say "turn the other cheek" - in context, the notion of "even if you hit me again, I will not repay you" sounds almost grotesque - but in general, I would agree. My beliefs, doubtless like those of many others, have been tested by the events of the last few days. I understand the urges people have for reprisal and vengeance - but as soon as I think about it at all, and think about what we know about terrorism, I'm reconfirmed in my belief that very little good can possibly come of any armed response, and quite possibly much harm. It was quite disturbing to read in the paper yesterday a retired military Lt. Col. stating that under the circumstances we need to get past our revulsion at civilian casualties. Let me get this straight: in order to show that we will not tolerate the killing of innocent civilians, we need to accept the death of innocent civilians. Each one of those civilians we would kill would leave behind wives or husbands, mothers or fathers, brothers or sisters, friends or coworkers, each of whom would feel exactly the grief and horror we're experiencing right now. They would, however, have the slight relief of having a known and named enemy, a party responsible for their suffering. That would be us...and thus, the germs of yet more terrorists take root. I wouldn't want to overstate this, or claim that there's a moral equivalency (there is a difference between soldiers aiming at a military target and using civilian aircraft as a bomb against a non-military target) - but I firmly believe military action can only reinforce anti-US feelings, particularly if (as seems almost inevitable) innocent parties are made to suffer along with the guilty (or, even worse, on their behalf). Terrorists, as has been said many times, do not listen to reason. It is quite clear they do not listen to the threat of death and violence either. What to do? I wish I knew - but probably the best thing in the long run is to try to minimize conditions that encourage the sort of resentful rage that can lead to terrorism. We must become less arrogant. No, this will not provide foolproof assurance against terrorism - nothing can - but if it can reduce its likelihood, isn't it worth it? - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::[clever or pithy quote]:: __[source of quote]__ ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V1 #232 *******************************