From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V1 #109 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Thursday, June 7 2001 Volume 01 : Number 109 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [loud-fans] Moulin RAV [JRT456@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Moulin Rouge [popanda@juno.com] Re: [loud-fans] are we nearly there yet? (ns) [Roger Winston ] Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus [Miles Goosens] Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus [JRT456@aol.co] Re: [loud-fans] Moulin Rouge [JRT456@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Rico Aube [dmw ] Re: [loud-fans] Rico Aube [Matthew Weber ] Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus [Dan Sallitt <] [loud-fans] [NS] Negro Problem/Sugarplastic show review [Miles Goosens ] Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert [Stewart Mason ] Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert [DOUDIE@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Rico Aube [Miles Goosens ] Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert ["glenn mcdonald" ] Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert [popanda@juno.com] Re: [loud-fans] my new favorite art piece ["Andrew Hamlin" ] Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus ["John Sharple] Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus ["Andrew Hamli] Re: [loud-fans] aube vs reed vs ? round one (take one) [mweber@library.be] Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus [Miles Goosens] Re: [loud-fans] aube vs reed vs ? round one (take one) [Dan McCarthy ] Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 06:54:37 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Moulin RAV In a message dated 6/5/01 9:38:02 PM, jenor@csd.uwm.edu writes: << --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey, laughing at the notion that I'm a "hipster" >> If it helps, nobody said you were hip. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 09:05:02 -0400 From: popanda@juno.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Moulin Rouge On Tue, 05 Jun 2001 23:28:44 -0600 Stewart Mason writes: > At 05:55 PM 6/5/01 -0400, popanda@juno.com wrote: > >Thanks, but anything with a setting before about 1955 bores me to > tears. > > Because god knows nothing interesting ever happened before the > invention of > the Swanson TV dinner. > > >I won't be seeing it. > > Thanks for the update. > > S > . M ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 06:51:45 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] are we nearly there yet? (ns) At Tuesday 6/5/2001 04:32 PM -0600, Stewart Mason wrote: >At 04:17 PM 6/5/01 -0600, Roger Winston wrote: >>It's a good thing the Fellows are listed first, because if Minus Five >>were, then you'd have to file it right at the beginning of the CD >>collection. My reasoning there is that the group name is actually "-5", >>which comes before practically everything (even 10cc) in ASCII-betical >>order. This is important if you're using a database program to keep track >>of your CDs. > >Wait, what about Nine Below Zero? Why, that would be filed under "N", Silly! Later. --Rog - -- When toads are not enough: http://www.reignoffrogs.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 08:58:16 -0400 From: "Aaron Milenski" Subject: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus Wow! I figured Loud Fans would want to know about this. I had some very nice visits to this store with some great loud-fan pals. (Hi Janet and Andy!) > > Landmark music store burns; 70,000 titles lost > > > > Used Kids Records opened in 1986 in a basement storefront > > > > Tuesday, June 5, 2001 > > Alice Thomas > > Columbus Dispatch Higher Education Reporter > > > > A pile of charred music drew a crowd of scavengers and mourners to the > > sidewalk outside Used Kids Records yesterday after an early-morning >fire. > > > > The scene was a fitting tribute to a store whose unique inventory >attracted > > bargain-hunting college students and serious collectors for 15 years. > > > > "It's a family is what it is -- a really open family of people who care >about > > music," said Keith Hanson, an English major at Ohio State University. >"You > > hear what people are saying when they see this. They act like it's a >death > > -- and it is." > > > > Since it opened in 1986 in a basement storefront at 1992 N. High St., >Used > > Kids had become a hard-to-see landmark in an era when independent >businesses > > along the busy street are dwindling. > > > > Now, its future is uncertain. > > > > A short in the ceiling wiring at the adjacent Used Kids Annex caught >fire > > about 2:45 a.m., said Kelly McGuire, spokeswoman for the Columbus >Division > > of Fire. > > > > "The main thing right now is the loss of income," co-owner Dan Dow said. > > "We're looking into maybe relocating temporarily." > > > > Gone are tens of thousands of records and CDs -- and a favorite hangout >of > > music lovers. > > > > Hanson, who lives next door in an apartment above Buckeye Donuts, said >he > > dropped into Used Kids about five times a week to look for music and >chat > > with friends. > > > > That's not unusual. The store survived because of its regulars, who'd >stop >in > > to get money or trade credit for CDs and check out ever-changing >offerings. > > > > "It's a total downer," OSU freshman Conor McCarthy said as he walked >past > > the pile. "They've also got a lot of CDs that other places don't have, >like > > imports." > > > > But the feeling wasn't all gloom and doom. Store manager Ron House had a > > quick, sarcastic answer for a group of curiosity-seekers who stopped to >ask > > what had happened. > > > > "There was this hard-core band down here and they were really >(expletive) > > hot," House said with a smile. "They burned the place down!" > > > > Used Kids' patrons were accustomed to a healthy dose of punk rock-style > > cynicism. In the wake of recent riotous parties in the off-campus area, >the > > store advertised discounts to customers who brought in plastic > > "knee-knocker" pellets fired by police. > > > > But it also had a serious side: Used Kids had a reputation among record > > collectors who bought and sold rare albums and 45s at the store and, in > > recent years, via the Internet. > > > > Included among the estimated 70,000 CDs and records lost were rarities >such > > as a John Lennon/Yoko Ono album that came with a special calendar, as >well > > as valuable rock-art posters. > > > > Also destroyed was a collection of about 1,000 jazz records bought last > > week, employee Tom Shannon said. > > > > "The amount of vinyl coming off the streets -- it shrinks every year," >Shannon > > said. "It's just less and less common." > > > > Estimating the value of the loss is difficult, he said. > > > > "It takes a long, long time just to build up an inventory of stuff." > > > > Since Campus Partners began its effort to revitalize the area, many >stores > > along High Street -- particularly south of Used Kids -- have >disappeared. > > > > Campus Partners isn't interested in the Used Kids property, said Terry > > Foegler, president of the nonprofit group. > > > > The structure can be saved, but other businesses in the building -- the > > Pita Pit > > and the Great Wall Chinese restaurant -- also were damaged. > > > > McGuire said the total damage to the building is estimated at $133,000. > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 08:14:42 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: [loud-fans] Rico Aube OK, the discussion of their packaging proclivities has me curious -- what do/does Aube sound like? later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 08:29:03 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus At 08:58 AM 6/6/2001 -0400, Aaron Milenski wrote: >Wow! I figured Loud Fans would want to know about this. I had some very >nice visits to this store with some great loud-fan pals. (Hi Janet and >Andy!) > >> > Landmark music store burns; 70,000 titles lost >> > >> > Used Kids Records opened in 1986 in a basement storefront Argh. Like Aaron, I've spent some fun hours in Used Kids with Janet and Andy (and Benjamin!); here's hoping that they can rebuild, or that someone else can fill that hole-crammed-full-of-obscure-music College Town slot. Too bad about the irreplaceable stuff that's gone. Plus if anyone was thinking about getting the first two Ass Ponys albums, Used Kids pretty much ran the Okra label, so that may be in doubt now as well... later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 09:31:17 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus In a message dated 6/6/01 6:10:13 AM, amilenski@hotmail.com writes: <> Those stories from "The Onion" just keep getting funnier. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 11:19:03 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Moulin Rouge Our story so far: <> <> <<. >>> "Meet Mark, who's lived most everywhere, That you could park a trailer there. But Stewart's only seen the things The pizza man bring when the doorbell rings-- What a crazy pair! But they're pop geeks, Identical pop geeks all the way. One pair of matching CD racks, Different as Stipe is gay...." I'm going to make a goddamn fortune. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 11:26:33 -0400 (EDT) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Rico Aube On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Miles Goosens wrote: > OK, the discussion of their packaging proclivities has me curious -- what > do/does Aube sound like? Noise. See furia.com/twas for a longer version, but if you've never listened to metal machine music for the fun of it, i doubt aube will be your cuppa. however, aube are not a patch on sensorband. i played sensorband without headphones once, in my office with the door close, and several people in the office thought computers were about to explode. - -- d., *still* frigging wrestling w/ glitchy b/u tapes np unwound _leaves turn inside you_ w/ a tip o' the hat to danaboy. (i like "challenge for a civilized society" pretty well too) = i do what i am told. i am not opinionated. i accept without | dmw@ = questioning. i do not make a fuss. i am a good consumer. |radix.net = pathetic-caverns.com * fecklessbeast.com * shoddyworkmanship.net ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 08:54:50 -0700 From: Matthew Weber Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Rico Aube At 11:26 AM 6/6/01 -0400, dmw wrote: >On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Miles Goosens wrote: > > > OK, the discussion of their packaging proclivities has me curious -- what > > do/does Aube sound like? > >Noise. > >See furia.com/twas for a longer version, but if you've never listened to >metal machine music for the fun of it, i doubt aube will be your cuppa. Nonsense! Aube is *far* superior to METAL MACHINE MUSIC, as antifreeze is a far superior drink to meths. Matthew Weber Curatorial Assistant Music Library University of California, Berkeley Life's but a knife-edge, anyway....Sooner or later people slip and get cut. Larry McMurtry, _Streets of Laredo_ [1993] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 12:11:14 -0400 From: Dan Sallitt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus > Plus if anyone was thinking about getting the first two Ass Ponys albums, > Used Kids pretty much ran the Okra label, so that may be in doubt now as > well... Ulp. Really? The first two Schramms records, including the classic WALK TO DELPHI, are on OKra. They were later released on East Side Digital in revised form, with some songs rerecorded as well as remixed. OKra still sells (sold?) the originals; the only way to hear the (superior, in my opinion) version of the Schramms' classic "Number Nineteen" is (was?) through them. (Dave Schramm became embarrassed over the years about adulterating Emily Dickinson's poem with some of his own lyrics, and used the poem exclusively for the lyrics of the revised version. It's not quite the same, for me.) The albums of another fine group, Hank McCoy and the Dead Ringers, probably reside (resided?) more or less exclusively in the OKra warehouse. - - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 12:43:21 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: [loud-fans] [NS] Negro Problem/Sugarplastic show review This comes from the Sugarplastic list about a show last Sat. in L.A. With the interest in both bands here on Loud-Fans, thought you all might enjoy this account. >From: Dean >To: Spastic-laughter >Subj: Re: [Spastic-Laughter] Notes on 6/2 Gig > >>Anyone go to the Sugarplastic show at Spaceland last Saturday? > >I was there. I have to admit I was a little disappointed, but as you say it >was still pretty damn good. At first I thought the mix was really poor, >since you could hardly hear Ben. But later he admitted to having problems >with his voice, so that explained the weak vocals. > >They did seem to rock harder than I have seen before. Kira's bass playing >always blows me away. Does anyone know any other bass players that strum >the bass the way Kira does? I can't recall seeing anyone do this as >regularly as Kira does. > > >>If you were there, what's the name of that song that they opened >>with. They always play it but its not on the 3 albums > >I am really bad with song titles. But I have a set list from the 12/16/00 >show, and the songs that are on the list that aren't on the albums are >Casino, What Do I Know, Sunny Radiation, 29 Cent Stamp, Have You Heard, >Johnny Apple and Levitate. Some of these are really familiar to me, because >they play them all the time. > >>The evening's main draw was The Negro Problem. They covered Michael >>Jackson's "Thriller" (Minus two songs. Plus The Beatles "Rocky >>Raccoon" as an encore.) That was funny and fun. > >This is one that I could go on and on about, but maybe I will have to save >that for the appropriate list. I am a huge Negro Problem fan, and they >always blow me away. This was no exception. Highlights for me was the one >note No Wave version of PYT, Wanna Be Startin' Somethin' played with the >music from The Great Leap Forward (a Negro Problem song) and a note perfect >version of Thriller. BTW, the encore was actually the funk classic She's A >Bad Mama Jama (She's Built, She's Stacked), with a bit of Rocky Raccoon >seamlessly weaved in. Have I mentioned that Stew is a genius? Oh yeah, >wrong list. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 16:21:55 -0400 From: Dana L Paoli Subject: [loud-fans] clientele alert NYC loudfans: Just to let any interested parties know, the Clientele (who strongly deny that they sound anything like Belle and Sebastian) are playing at the knitting factory next tuesday. I'll be there w/Shari, trying to stay awake until they hit the stage at 10:00. I hear that they're spellbinding in concert, although my source is an old copy of chickfactor, and gail always lies. New Jersey-ites can check them out at Maxwells on Saturday, where their opening band is some fat guy who does Prince covers. - --dana ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 14:38:46 -0600 From: Stewart Mason Subject: Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert At 04:21 PM 6/6/01 -0400, Dana L Paoli wrote: >New Jersey-ites can check them out at Maxwells on Saturday, where their >opening band is some fat guy who does Prince covers. Undoubtedly to promote the long-delayed CD issue of Dump's THAT SKINNY MOTHERFUCKER WITH THE HIGH VOICE, out this week on Shrimper. I have no idea if it's different from the cassette that came out two or three years ago, but that cassette is a lot more entertaining than you might imagine, and since Dump concerts are less rare than visitations from la Virgen de Guadalupe, this should be fun. Stewart, whose editor once ran his reviews of albums by Dump and Pee in the same column NP: CITY THRILLS--The (Boston) Thrills ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 17:08:29 EDT From: DOUDIE@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert Clientele is also playing (for free) at other music on Monday night at 8. Though I have a feeling that Clientele might be boring live, in the way that Galaxie 500 was and in the way that I hear Low is. Steve Matrick NP Death Cab for Cutie (love this guy's voice) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:40:56 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Rico Aube At 11:26 AM 6/6/2001 -0400, dmw wrote: >On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Miles Goosens wrote: > >> OK, the discussion of their packaging proclivities has me curious -- what >> do/does Aube sound like? > >Noise. > >See furia.com/twas for a longer version, but if you've never listened to >metal machine music for the fun of it, i doubt aube will be your cuppa. Hm, I've listened to METAL MACHINE MUSIC out of curiosity, and played it to frighten and annoy folks, but I really can't envision listening to it for pleasure. I did read glenn's Aube extrapolations, and after digesting them, I've concluded that I enjoy glenn's descriptions much more than I would probably enjoy listening to the albums myself. Thanks to doug and Matthew for pointers and analogies. later, Miles, wondering how JRT would really make money off of his "Identical Pop Geeks" series -- the target demographic doesn't sound very large... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 17:45:43 -0400 From: "glenn mcdonald" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert > Though I have a feeling that Clientele might be boring live, in the way that > Galaxie 500 was and in the way that I hear Low is. [Steam pours out of glenn's ears.] My attempts to describe what it's like seeing... Low: http://www.furia.com/twas/twas0086.html#entry1 The Clientele: http://www.furia.com/twas/twas0290.html#entry5 I've only seen the Clientele once (until four days from now), so I can't vouch for their consistency, but if the first show was representative, they're right up there on my most-astonishing-live-experience list with Low, Ida, Mecca Normal and solo shows by Tori Amos, Emm Gryner, Mark Eitzel and Billy Bragg. glenn ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 19:38:38 -0400 From: popanda@juno.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert SUBURBAN LIGHT is such a pleasure to listen to. They remind me more of early Felt than B&S, though. What a thrill to be able to see shows like this. I'm a little envious. Hopefully soon, I can go to good shows, without it being like preparing for a trip to Disney World. Wait a minute, what am I saying? I'm sure One Eyed Jack is playing down at the Blind Horse Saloon near the Krispy Kreme by the Greenville airport this weekend! WHOOOEEEE!!! They do a chilling cover of "Boot Scoot Boogie." Whose bed have YOUR boots been under??? - -Mark, hopefully soon to be released from cultural purgatory (I'm only teasing. It's not THAT bad here...this place has come a long way, though for some reason the music scene here was better in my fake ID days than now...bands don't come through here anymore...guess they got tired of only playing to me and about 5 other people) p.s. Some people apparently think I'm self-absorbed. I'm gonna go to my bedroom and ruminate about this for a few hours while listening to Belle and Sebastian or the Smiths and then write about it in my journal, where I star my "i"s rather than dot them... On Wed, 6 Jun 2001 16:21:55 -0400 Dana L Paoli writes: > NYC loudfans: > > Just to let any interested parties know, the Clientele (who strongly > deny > that they sound anything like Belle and Sebastian) are playing at > the > knitting factory next tuesday. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 17:35:46 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] my new favorite art piece You HAVE to go back and get this guy's name, you realize. Wondering if any darts stick still (Claes Oldenburg patrons must be green), Andy "If you can follow the simple instructions exactly, you can make A LOT OF MONEY. The most exciting part is it really works!" - --from some spam I got last Tuesday ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 23:30:50 -0400 (EDT) From: dmw Subject: [loud-fans] aube vs reed vs ? round one (take one) On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Matthew Weber wrote: > Nonsense! Aube is *far* superior to METAL MACHINE MUSIC, as antifreeze is not disputing that for a moment, but i think appreciating aube takes the same sort of mindset that puts "machine" on a second time, with an attitude of "ok, what's really there...or not there, and the case may be." that is, if you can't get past the abrasiveness, neither have anything to offer you. i probably shouldn't be allowed a critical opinion on aube, because i've only heard three discs, and made it through only one of them (_flare_) twice in its entirety. but here it is: the sonic maniupulations that the 'source sound' undergoes are so drastic that there are virtually no distinguishable traces of the source sound in th e finished work. moreover, the transitions are abrupt enough that the listener has little chance of following the sound through its torturous signal path. (this is unlike sensorband, who we actually got to open for, and who i found fairly jaw-dropping. some of the most exciting moments of their performance involved manipulation of a bbc shipping broadcast; i found the moments where it slid in and out of recognizable as human speech -- and even more, the moments where it was still recognizable, but only in context -- utterly enthralling) further, in the three aube works i've heard, there's a distinctly similar sensibility to the sounds that result from the manipulation. i don't want it to sound like i'm down on aube, though. i think it would be a more interesting world if more people had an opportunity to hear aube, and similarly extreme work. i don't think that aube (or sensorband) are "music;" they have none of the attributes i think of as defining "music" other than that they're delivered through the medium of vibrations in air. i prefer to think of aube as "sonic sculpture," which is pretentious, but i think more accurately describes (my flawed interpretation of) aube's artistic goals than "music." on the other hand such stuff as the shaggs, frith & kaiser, etc. does seem like "music" to me. if i hadn't heard sound recordings that pushed the boundaries i never would have thought about where i draw those lines and why. ...and of course this all helps me be a better punk rock musician. (whoops, was that an oxymoron?) - -- d. = i do what i am told. i am not opinionated. i accept without | dmw@ = questioning. i do not make a fuss. i am a good consumer. |radix.net = pathetic-caverns.com * fecklessbeast.com * shoddyworkmanship.net ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 23:58:09 -0400 From: "John Sharples" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus >> > A pile of charred music drew a crowd of scavengers and mourners to the >> > sidewalk outside Used Kids Records yesterday after an early-morning >>fire. Ack! That's the place where I got Sam P.'s OMNIPOP, an extra used copy of INTERBABE and Sunny Day Real Estate, traded for cardbord cutouts of Miles and Melissa. RIP, JS ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 21:04:20 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus >Ack! That's the place where I got Sam P.'s OMNIPOP, an extra used copy of >INTERBABE and Sunny Day Real Estate, traded for cardbord cutouts of Miles >and Melissa. Where does one obtain these cardboard cutouts of Miles and Melissa? Hadn't thought about window dressing, but hey, Andy NASHVILLE  John Hartford, the author of "Gentle on My Mind," one of the most recorded songs in mainstream American popular music, died at 4:30 p.m. Monday at Centennial Medical Center in Nashville after a 21-year battle with non-Hodgkin's lymphoma. He was 63. "John Hartford was one of the nicest and most unassuming people I've ever known," said Frances W. Preston, president and CEO of Broadcast Music Incorporated (BMI), the performing rights organization that collected royalties for performances of Hartford's songs. "I don't think he realized how great he really was, even though his 'Gentle on My Mind,' one of BMI's most performed songs, is now in its fifth decade of popularity. He was a gifted songwriter, a music historian and a wonderful storyteller. As a friend, I will miss him." Hartford appears twice on the "O Brother, Where Art Thou?" soundtrack, the million-selling CD credited with inspiring a revival of interest in acoustic traditional music. He emceed a concert May 24, 2000, at Ryman Auditorium in Nashville featuring artists who appeared with him on the soundtrack. Hartford was born on December 30, 1937, in New York. He grew up in St. Louis, where he acquired a lifelong love of riverboats. After achieving some success as a professional musician, Hartford found time to pursue his love of riverboat lore, even working for a time as a boat captain. A talented multi-instrumentalist, Hartford was also drawn to the music of Flatt & Scruggs. He moved to Nashville in 1965 and released his debut album, John Hartford Looks at Life, in 1966. Hartford's own version of "Gentle on My Mind" went to #60 in 1967 on the Billboard country chart, and Glen Campbell's recording of the song went to #30 country and #62 pop the same year. A year later, Campbell released the song again and it climbed to #39 on the country chart. The song's popularity is better measured by the number of times it has been recorded  between 400 and 600 times, by one estimate  and performed  more than 6 million, according to one count. The song also won three Grammys. Hartford wrote the song after going to see "Dr. Zhivago." "I have never really understood commercial music like I've wanted to," Hartford admitted in Dorothy Horstman's book, "Sing Your Heart Out Country Boy," "and I have no idea, except for the message in that song, why it was a hit." Hartford's fame increased through regular appearances on '60s TV shows "The Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour" and "The Glen Campbell Goodtime Hour." His first love, however, remained traditional American music in all its forms. "He was more devoted than any musician in Nashville to the history of the music," said country music historian and Middle Tennessee State University professor Charles Wolfe. "He would talk to older musicians and get their stories. His last big project was a massive book about Ed Haley, a legendary fiddler who never made any commercial recordings." Wolfe also praised Hartford for his musicianship. A popular entertainer, onstage Hartford always sported a black vest and a black bowler hat. "He was probably the most respected musician in Nashville. During the last couple of weeks, there's been virtually a who's who of musicians who have dropped by to pay their last respects to John." Hartford was "joined at his home by his family and friends telling stories and reliving a wonderful life," his Web site says. "He enjoyed having some of his musical heroes play old songs and recount stories of 'show business.' Although he could no longer join in, he delighted in listening to the music that he so dearly loved and spent a lifetime creating." Visitation will be at Hartford's home in Madison, Tennessee, on Wednesday and Thursday. The funeral will be on Friday, also at the home. Survivors include his wife, Marie; a son, Jamie; a daughter, Katie Hogue; and stepchildren Ricky, Gerry and Christy Barrett. The family has asked that donations be made to the Sarah Cannon Cancer Center, 2221 Murphy Avenue, Nashville, Tennessee, 37203.  Jay Orr, with additional reporting by Michael Gray [ Tues., June 5, 2001 12:05 PM EDT ] (from Music News Of The World at sonicnet.com) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 21:14:59 -0700 (PDT) From: mweber@library.berkeley.edu (Matthew Weber) Subject: Re: [loud-fans] aube vs reed vs ? round one (take one) At 11:30 PM 6/6/1, dmw wrote: >On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Matthew Weber wrote: > >> Nonsense! Aube is *far* superior to METAL MACHINE MUSIC, as antifreeze is > >not disputing that for a moment, but i think appreciating aube takes the >same sort of mindset that puts "machine" on a second time, with an >attitude of "ok, what's really there...or not there, and the case may be." >that is, if you can't get past the abrasiveness, neither have anything to >offer you. OK, I'll go for that. >i probably shouldn't be allowed a critical opinion on aube, because i've >only heard three discs, and made it through only one of them (_flare_) >twice in its entirety. but here it is: the sonic maniupulations that the >'source sound' undergoes are so drastic that there are virtually no >distinguishable traces of the source sound in th e finished work. >moreover, the transitions are abrupt enough that the listener has little >chance of following the sound through its torturous signal path. Yeah, and I think that's part of the point; the artist limits himself to one strictly circumscribed source for his work, and then mutates that source into unrecognizability. My criticism of Aube is that the trajectory of a track, his methodology if you will, is fairly similar from track to track, CD to CD. I will say, though, that Aube is one of the few Japanese noise artists whose work I find to be worth a damn. >(this is unlike sensorband, who we actually got to open for, and who i >found fairly jaw-dropping. some of the most exciting moments of their >performance involved manipulation of a bbc shipping broadcast; i found the >moments where it slid in and out of recognizable as human speech -- and >even more, the moments where it was still recognizable, but only in >context -- utterly enthralling) Haven't yet heard Sensorband, but they sound pretty firmly in the musique concrete line. Nothing wrong with that! >further, in the three aube works i've heard, there's a distinctly similar >sensibility to the sounds that result from the manipulation. I think that here you're getting at the same thing I was above. >i don't think that aube (or sensorband) are "music;" they have none of the >attributes i think of as defining "music" other than that they're >delivered through the medium of vibrations in air. i prefer to think of >aube as "sonic sculpture," which is pretentious, but i think more >accurately describes (my flawed interpretation of) aube's artistic goals >than "music." on the other hand such stuff as the shaggs, frith & kaiser, >etc. does seem like "music" to me. if i hadn't heard sound recordings >that pushed the boundaries i never would have thought about where i draw >those lines and why. Now whoa there, pardner. I submit to you the following: music is that which is created or interpreted as music. In other words, if someone has decided to make a piece of music, no matter what the materials, it's music; likewise, if someone is interpreting occurrences not intended as music in a musical way, it's music. John Cage has something to say about this, but I forget what. This allows for quite a bit of leeway (note that the question of whether the music is good or bad is open, intentionally so), but I think it's the best, nay, the only, workable definition. >...and of course this all helps me be a better punk rock musician. >(whoops, was that an oxymoron?) Absolutely not. >-- d. Matt Parliamentarianism is nauseating to anyone who has ever seen it at close range. Peter Kropotkin, _Words of a Rebel_ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 23:46:02 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Fwd: [terraobscura] sad news from Columbus At 11:58 PM 06/06/2001 -0400, John Sharples wrote: >>> > A pile of charred music drew a crowd of scavengers and mourners to the >>> > sidewalk outside Used Kids Records yesterday after an early-morning >>>fire. > >Ack! That's the place where I got Sam P.'s OMNIPOP, an extra used copy of >INTERBABE and Sunny Day Real Estate, traded for cardbord cutouts of Miles >and Melissa. Hope they weren't the cause of the fire -- Jeffrey, you should have made us flame-retardant. By the way, I've been assured by e-mail that the OKra Records masters and stock are fine, and there's an update on the Used Kids situation at their home page, http://www.usedkids.com. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 21:52:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Dan McCarthy Subject: Re: [loud-fans] aube vs reed vs ? round one (take one) > i probably shouldn't be allowed a critical opinion > on aube, because i've > only heard three discs, and made it through only one > of them (_flare_) > twice in its entirety. but here it is: the sonic > maniupulations that the > 'source sound' undergoes are so drastic that there > are virtually no > distinguishable traces of the source sound in th e > finished work. > moreover, the transitions are abrupt enough that the > listener has little > chance of following the sound through its torturous > signal path. Granted, though "Pages from the Book"- my favourite Aube release and one of only two CD's left in my Aube collection (the other being Cardiac Strain) since I felt that owning any more would just be redundant- does less manipulation than other recordings. The sound of pages being flipped and fluttered around is quite distinguishable. > > (this is unlike sensorband, who we actually got to > open for, and who i > found fairly jaw-dropping. some of the most > exciting moments of their > performance involved manipulation of a bbc shipping > broadcast; i found the > moments where it slid in and out of recognizable as > human speech -- and > even more, the moments where it was still > recognizable, but only in > context -- utterly enthralling) > Reminds me of a more noise-oriented Scanner a.k.a. Robin Rimbaud, whose namesake derives from his trademark live-on-stage manipulations of intercepted phone conversations via a portable scanner. Edgy and possibly illegal, but fantastic concept! (the other) Dan Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 00:49:06 -0400 From: "John Sharples" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Rico Aube Miles: >Hm, I've listened to METAL MACHINE MUSIC out of curiosity, and played it to >frighten and annoy folks, but I really can't envision listening to it for >pleasure. You should check out George Harrison's ELECTRONIC SOUNDS if you haven't. Sounds like the 4-track home demos for METAL MACHINE MUSIC. Cool artwork... JS ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 00:36:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] clientele alert On Wed, 6 Jun 2001 DOUDIE@aol.com wrote: > Clientele is also playing (for free) at other music on Monday night at 8. > Though I have a feeling that Clientele might be boring live, in the way that > Galaxie 500 was and in the way that I hear Low is. Re Low live: instead of typing "no" a thousand times with the caps lock key glued down, I'll merely note that *every* time I've seen them (including Alan Sparhawk solo a few weeks back) has been about as close to the much-abused and cliched term "magical" as real life can come. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::beliefs are ideas going bald:: __Francis Picabia__ last played: curiously, also Death Cab for Cutie. Before that, Yo La Tengo covering "Ready-Mades": is it Bonzos' night or what? (No Bonzo connection to the MK Ultra CD I played before those, though...) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 00:51:54 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] aube vs reed vs ? round one (take one) On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Matthew Weber wrote: > >i don't think that aube (or sensorband) are "music;" they have none of the > >attributes i think of as defining "music" other than that they're > >delivered through the medium of vibrations in air. i prefer to think of > >aube as "sonic sculpture," which is pretentious, but i think more > >accurately describes (my flawed interpretation of) aube's artistic goals > >than "music." on the other hand such stuff as the shaggs, frith & kaiser, > >etc. does seem like "music" to me. if i hadn't heard sound recordings > >that pushed the boundaries i never would have thought about where i draw > >those lines and why. > > Now whoa there, pardner. I submit to you the following: music is that > which is created or interpreted as music. In other words, if someone has > decided to make a piece of music, no matter what the materials, it's music; > likewise, if someone is interpreting occurrences not intended as music in a > musical way, it's music. On principle, I'd agree...but this does beg the question of what qualities we're looking for when we're creating/interpreting music. Doug said that Aube has "none of the attributes [he] thinks of as defining 'music'" - what are those attributes? He offers the term "sound sculpture": how does that differ from his definition of "music," and what are its attributes? Finally, the "intending/interpreting as music" thing is all well and good - - but it does seem we'd want to preserve *some* sort of definition, if only to distinguish music from other sonic events. If I stand up and start reading the phone book, of course you as a listener are free to interpret the sounds I make as music...but I wonder how successful I'd be, on any level, if I *intended* those sounds as music...or if I just started talking to the audience, reciting Shakespeare, etc. I guess if the audience were in on it, so to speak, such actions *could* work - but I suspect one problem would be (in all but the phone book example) that the linguistic connotations would have a difficult time separating themselves from the purely sonic aspects that, presumably, would constitute the music here. There's a clear analogy to various trends in visual art in the 20c (and probably 21c too)... Perhaps someone has, but it would be amusing to create a work that consists of taking, say, four slats of wood, nailing them to the wall in a rectangle, and calling whatever's inside that rectangle one's artwork... In both cases (music and art), the question really is: what distinguishes art viewing, or music listening, from some other mode of apprehending the same objects? - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::it's not your meat:: __Mr. Toad__ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 00:55:17 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Rico Aube On Thu, 7 Jun 2001, John Sharples wrote: > You should check out George Harrison's ELECTRONIC SOUNDS if you haven't. > Sounds like the 4-track home demos for METAL MACHINE MUSIC. Cool artwork... Any musical trend can be antipicated or exemplified in the recordings of the Beatles, jointly and severally. So sayeth John Sharples...I bet. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::a squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous...got me? __Captain Beefheart__ np: _Metal Machine Music Unplugged_: that jokester Lou set up a whole mess of microphones then set fire to an acoustic guitar factory... ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V1 #109 *******************************