From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V1 #41 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Monday, April 16 2001 Volume 01 : Number 041 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] Loud Family Live ["Joseph M. Mallon" ] RE: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" ["Keegstra, Russell" ] Re: [loud-fans] Loud Family Live [steve ] Re: [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV [Miles Goosens ] RE: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" [Tim Victor ] Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" [JRT456@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics (fwd) [Elizabeth S] Re: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics (fwd) [Cindy Alvar] Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" [Dana L Paoli ] Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" [Roger Winston ] Re: [loud-fans] Elmore Leonard? [Dan McCarthy ] Re: [loud-fans] Scott's solo [Dan McCarthy ] Re: [loud-fans] Loud Family Live [MarkWStaples@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: [loud-fans] unexpected eno appearance(ns) [Steve Holtebeck Subject: [loud-fans] Loud Family Live On Sun, 15 Apr 2001, Vallor wrote: > Hello Louds- Firstly, I understand Scott has a solo CD coming around the > same time as Bradley Skaught's band's CD on Joe Mallon's 125 label, how come > no chatter about this? Or is my information totally off, I only saw Scott > for a minute at the Soft Boys show and have been under the weather since. > Have I missed some chatter, which would be typical of me...I have about 550 > mostly irrelevent emails backed up. Thanks to Dan & Roger for clearing this up. Once again: 125 Records is releasing 3 CDs in June: 1) GARDEN ABSTRACT - Belle Da Gama 2) ANTOLOGY II - Anton Barbeau 3) FROM RITUAL TO ROMANCE - The Loud Family (a live record) There will be a release party Saturday, June 30th at the Starry Plough in Berkeley. All three bands will be playing, although we're still not sure what form the Loud Family will take. It'll be Scott & some other people. If there are any questions, please ask me, although I may be a little late in answering, as I'm in Norway on business. On Sun, 15 Apr 2001, Andrew Hamlin wrote: > "THE MEXICAN SNATCH > > BLOW DRY > > THE BROTHERS" > > --four consecutive listings on the marquee for Seattle's Metro Cinemas, a > few weeks ago Would've been funnier with BLOW instead of BLOW DRY. Thanks! J. Mallon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 07:45:02 -0500 From: "Keegstra, Russell" Subject: RE: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" Holly: >It does raise the question of whether Pop Belters are an >identifiable demographic group. And if so, will we find >them as a Prizm category? For scary fun with marketers' >visions of you and your neighbors, take a look at >http://www.delluke.claritas.com:80/YAWYL and enter your >zip code. Hmm, this is great fun. Certainly explains a lot of the crap that I get in the mail. Russ, who grew up with "soda" in the midwest, and never could get the "pop" habit when we moved to Jersey. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 08:52:44 -0500 From: steve Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Loud Family Live On Monday, April 16, 2001, at 06:25 AM, Joseph M. Mallon wrote: > > Thanks to Dan & Roger for clearing this up. Once again: > > 125 Records is releasing 3 CDs in June: > 1) GARDEN ABSTRACT - Belle Da Gama > 2) ANTOLOGY II - Anton Barbeau > 3) FROM RITUAL TO ROMANCE - The Loud Family (a live record) > ........ > If there are any questions, please ask me, although I may be a little late > in answering, as I'm in Norway on business. The obvious question - where do we send the money to get all three? > > On Sun, 15 Apr 2001, Andrew Hamlin wrote: >> "THE MEXICAN SNATCH >> >> BLOW DRY >> >> THE BROTHERS" >> >> --four consecutive listings on the marquee for Seattle's Metro Cinemas, a >> few weeks ago > > Would've been funnier with BLOW instead of BLOW DRY. One might make the argument that BLOW DRY is more.... esoteric. - - Steve __________ Is this thing on? Sent via OS X Mail. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 10:08:04 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV Jeffrey, then Andy H.: >>Hmmm...must have experienced different parts of it than we did. What I >>remember: highways perched precarious midway between turgid, polluted >>rivers and admittedly impressive mountaintops; lots of factories belching >>smoke to obscure said mountaintops and provide second adjective for said >>rivers; general air of dirt and grime every which way. > > >I guess Jeffrey (or Miles) could answer this question, but I'm wondering if >Mr. Norman found himself near the West Virginia/Ohio border, the territory >lensed in GUMMO. The part of WV Jeffrey seems to be describing in that paragraph is the Kanawha Valley, which indeed is chock full of chemical plants. Most of them are all too prominent on the I-64 stretch between Huntington and Charleston, including the DuPont plant at Institute, WV -- the doppelganger of the notorious Bhopal, India, facility. It's not a part of the state I'd want to show off, but unfortunately, it's a common point of entry from the Midwest into West Virginia, and thus one of the memories travellers take away. I remember driving westward toward Ohio in the mid-80s to the strains of Robert Plant's "Little By Little," and just as we cleared notoriously smelly Nitro, WV, the song reached the point where Plant sings "I can breathe again!" Everyone in the car cracked up, because it was true, we finally could! Harmony Korine actually spent most of his life in Nashville, and as Andy noted, did indeed film GUMMO here. He's a loathsome insect, though. Back to Jeffrey's Mountain State travelogue: >Memory perhaps negatively enhanced by two further experiences: stopping at >a gas station and being asked repeatedly something that sounded like >"w'allya tainya?" We finally made out that the woman was saying "what all >your tag number?" - which, it took us a while to discern, meant "what is >your license plate number?" Rose insists that, as soon as it was obvious >we had no idea what she was saying, her accent grew ever more kudzu-esque. That sounds like a slurred/drawled phrase you'd hear further south, in places you'd be more likely to find kudzu. Or maybe to northern ears, *everything* we say sounds like "w'allya tainya." :-) >Second, utterly non-person-connected negative memory: realizing that our >brakes were not working well, just as we were on the descending portion >(and I do mean descending) of our trip through the state, at dusk, in a >misty rain, at about 40 degrees, on a road otherwise traveled exclusively >by folks who know every curve and jigger by heart, and therefore who drove >the road at James Bond-like speed, becoming very irritated at us >tremulously creeping along in our not-necessarily-roadworthy 1974 Opel >(there were not that many areas where passing was feasible). That sounds more like the bulk of WV, the part I know and love, where there's not any room between the mountains to put a chemical factory! It's the prettiest part, but at dusk in the mist, not a lot of it is visible. Plus flatlanders might find the whole experience somewhat less terrifying if they could see where they're going. Then again, I'm reminded of a story Dale Dickens, the former admissions director of my alma mater, Concord College, told about a girl from Indiana he was recruiting. Mr. Dickens' office had a large bay window with a spectacular view of the slopes around the campus. When he was interviewing the Indiana gal, he noticed her visibly *leaning backwards,* face frozen in fear. When he asked her what was wrong, she said "I'm going to fall out of the window!" even though she was standing a good fifteen feet away from it, with both Mr. Dickens and his desk in the intervening space. Lord only knows how she survived the serpentine drive to and from Athens... I'm sorry that Jeffrey and Rose had such a bad experience travelling in my home state. If they ever come back through and have some time to sightsee, I suggest making the trip between April and October, spending the night at a decent hotel in Huntington, filling up the gas tank there, then striking south (and away from the Kanawha Valley) the next morning, either via US 52 along the Tug River (the WV-KY border, Hatfields & McCoys country, and you'll pass by the real Matewan), or via WV 10 to Logan -- either way you'll eventually end up on US 52 going towards Welch and Bluefield and past all the places of my not very misspent youth. Or heck, I-77 from Charleston to Bluefield is a gorgeous drive, though it'll cost you three tolls at at least $1.25 a pop (I haven't made this drive in a while, it could be more now!)... >Oh John Denver, so much to answer for... Indeed, but blame here has to be shared -- "Take Me Home, Country Roads" was primarily written by Bill and Taffy Danoff, though Denver gets a cowriting credit. All the places namechecked in the song are actually in *VIRGINA,* but that didn't stop the fantastically, grotesquely stupid West Virginia legislature from making it one of the official state songs. your expatriate native of the Free State of McDowell, Miles np: Larry Tucker's nifty comp, NEITHER HERE NOR THERE - review forthcoming! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 10:33:05 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" Tim Victor sez from a ways over on I-40: >This one's been a puzzler to me lately. Only in the last couple of years >have I heard reports of "Coke" being used generically. And having lived in >Greensboro (straight east on I-40 from Nashville) off and on since the age >of three, I've never personally heard it used that way. Have I been mixing >with the wrong crowd or something? Then Holly Kruse (congrats on the publication!) said: >I too experienced culture shock when, after having spent my >whole life in The Pop Belt (aka the Upper Midwest, and in >my case, Iowa City, IA and Champaign-Urbana, IL), I moved >to the East Coast. Whenever I referred to a cola or similar >drink as "pop", I was greeted with befuddled looks. I pretty >quickly switched from "pop" to "soda". Now that I'm in >Louisville, which probably sits on the great pop/coke/soda >dividing line, I'm just very confused. I've been in Nashville since 1988, and it's "Coke" 75%-80% of the time, with "pop" taking up the other 20-25%. Greensboro, which may be a straight shot from here, true, is an eight-hour straight shot, and firmly in the Pop Belt, so I'm not surprised at Tim's befuddlement at the generic use of "Coke." Holly probably does live at the Texarkana of pop/coke/soda. Anyone for renaming Louisville "Popcoda?" As far as I've been able to determine, there's three main "soft drink" belts: *Soda - New England, the upper mid-Atlantic, and probably the eventual winner, since it's the dominant term on TV and in the movies. I used to think this followed the pattern of New England migration across the United States -- New England across the Great Lakes to the Upper Midwest, then across the country to Washington State -- but I've run into too many people from Minnesota and Iowa who say "pop." *Pop - the lower mid-Atlantic, the Applachians, and parts of the midwest (*definitely* Iowa and parts of Minnesota). To me, a Coke is specifically a Coke, and "soda" would be pop with ice cream in it, i.e., a float. *Coke - from the Cumberland Plateau in Tennessee west to Arkansas and Texas, and from southern North Carolina to the south and and southwest, including all the traditional "Deep South" states (South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi). Pre-World War II Florida was probably a "Coke" state, but with all the migration there from other regions since, who knows? There are other "soft drink" terms -- for instance, I know several people from the *very* rural South who say "cold drink" -- but I'm sure these are the major ones. Maybe I should start a website tracking this stuff. later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 11:33:29 -0400 From: "Larry Tucker" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV >np: Larry Tucker's nifty comp, NEITHER HERE NOR THERE - review forthcoming! Welcome back Miles! For any of you Soft Boys fans, fellow fegmaniac Ed Poole has made available some Quick Time movie clips of the show he shot at Fletcher's in Baltimore. The audio is courtesy of me standing about 6 feet behind him. ftp://fegmaniax:jooves@hellrot.suddenindustries.com/Video%20Clips/ - -Larry _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 08:49:21 -0700 From: Matthew Weber Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" At 10:33 AM 4/16/01 -0500, Miles Goosens wrote: >As far as I've been able to determine, there's three main "soft drink" belts: > >*Soda - New England, the upper mid-Atlantic, and probably the eventual >winner, since it's the dominant term on TV and in the movies. I used to >think this followed the pattern of New England migration across the United >States -- New England across the Great Lakes to the Upper Midwest, then >across the country to Washington State -- but I've run into too many >people from Minnesota and Iowa who say "pop." You can extend the "soda" belt (west branch) down at least to the SF Bay Area. >*Pop - the lower mid-Atlantic, the Applachians, and parts of the midwest >(*definitely* Iowa and parts of Minnesota). To me, a Coke is specifically >a Coke, and "soda" would be pop with ice cream in it, i.e., a float. Ohio and Michigan are also "pop" states. Lots of folks in Ann Arbor refer to it as "soda", but they're mostly from the East Coast. Matthew Weber Curatorial Assistant Music Library University of California, Berkeley It seemed the world was divided into good and bad people. The good ones slept better...while the bad ones seemed to enjoy the waking hours much more. Woody Allen, _Side Effects_ [1981] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 11:48:43 -0400 From: Larry Tucker Subject: RE: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" |*Coke - from the Cumberland Plateau in Tennessee west to Arkansas and |Texas, and from southern North Carolina to the south and and |southwest, |including all the traditional "Deep South" states (South |Carolina, Georgia, |Alabama, Mississippi). Pre-World War II Florida was probably a "Coke" |state, but with all the migration there from other regions |since, who knows? | |There are other "soft drink" terms -- for instance, I know |several people |from the *very* rural South who say "cold drink" -- but I'm |sure these are |the major ones. I started my life in the *very* rural South of eastern North Carolina where they were always referred to as "drinks". And what you got was a Pepsi Cola unless you asked for Coke specifically. The other common picks would have been a Nehi (orange or grape) or a Yoo Hoo. - -Larry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 12:08:48 -0400 From: Dennis_McGreevy@praxair.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" Miles demarks: As far as I've been able to determine, there's three main "soft drink" belts: *Soda - New England, the upper mid-Atlantic, and probably the eventual winner, since it's the dominant term on TV and in the movies. I used to think this followed the pattern of New England migration across the United States -- New England across the Great Lakes to the Upper Midwest, then across the country to Washington State -- but I've run into too many people from Minnesota and Iowa who say "pop." *Pop - the lower mid-Atlantic, the Applachians, and parts of the midwest (*definitely* Iowa and parts of Minnesota). To me, a Coke is specifically a Coke, and "soda" would be pop with ice cream in it, i.e., a float. *Coke - from the Cumberland Plateau in Tennessee west to Arkansas and Texas, and from southern North Carolina to the south and and southwest, including all the traditional "Deep South" states (South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi). Pre-World War II Florida was probably a "Coke" state, but with all the migration there from other regions since, who knows? There are other "soft drink" terms -- for instance, I know several people from the *very* rural South who say "cold drink" -- but I'm sure these are the major ones. <><><><><><><><> I grew up in southern Wisconsin, in a town which is a major summer resort for people from Chicago and it's suburbs. The majority of the surrounding area is primarily rural, but the annual infusion of vacationers outnumbering residents at a ratio of something like 3 to 1 leaves the local culture less "rural Wisconsin" more "John Hughes lite". We used the term "pop". But in high school, I transferred to a school about a half hour away, but clearly outside the vacationer tide. There they called it "soda". Most folks also had pronounced Wisconsin accents. I recall these two phenomena together, because it was the "o" in "soda" (pronounced as in the word "sold", where the end of the "o" begins to form the "l") that started my fascination with differences in regional accents, and vowels in particular. So rural Wisconsin is definitely "soda", despite the region's other similarities with "pop"-talking Minnesota. - --Dennis "What was John Lennon's wife's name?" - --My friend Greg's favorite question to ask of his Wisconsin transplant suitemate at some college in North Carolina ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 09:46:53 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV >Harmony Korine actually spent most of his life in Nashville, and as Andy >noted, did indeed film GUMMO here. He's a loathsome insect, though. Hm...I look in my dictionary under "loathsome insect" and find "stunning, challenging example of what other people could do with film if only they would try." You better read me back your book's "tomato," though. Are we talking Israel Kamakawiwo'ole's "Take Me Home Country Roads," or Toots and the Maytals'? Andy "You live by the punk sword, and you'll die by the punk sword. I wish I'd been more like Ricky Martin, grooving on the Latin thing. He probably has a better life than punk rockers do, walking around tied up in metaphysical knots." - -- Former Clash frontman Joe Strummer getting wistful about la vida loca not taken, in Spin magazine. [as reported by Amy Reiter in her Nothing Personal column at Salon.com, April 12, 2001] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 13:02:08 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics (fwd) Somebody said: > > Such is also the case in southern California (as well as Nevada, a college > > acquaintance tells me). > > It is not unusual to ask for "a coke" at a fast food joint and have them > > say "what kind?", entirely without irony. To which this from my California correspondent: - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 08:05:55 -0700 From: Susan Lowry To: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics Tell your Loud Fan list that this SoCal native is debunking this myth. We call all drinks double grande lattes. ;-) But really, we don't call carbonated, sugar-laden beverages cokes or pops (as many do in the upper midwest, right?). We call them a lot of things--but this is so far from the South south, there's really no cultural connection. For one thing, it's the heat, not the humidity, out here. - ---------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 13:06:00 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" On Mon, 16 Apr 2001, Matthew Weber wrote: > At 10:33 AM 4/16/01 -0500, Miles Goosens wrote: > > >As far as I've been able to determine, there's three main "soft drink" belts: > > > >*Soda - New England, the upper mid-Atlantic, and probably the eventual > >winner, since it's the dominant term on TV and in the movies. I used to > >think this followed the pattern of New England migration across the United > >States -- New England across the Great Lakes to the Upper Midwest, then > >across the country to Washington State -- but I've run into too many > >people from Minnesota and Iowa who say "pop." > > You can extend the "soda" belt (west branch) down at least to the SF Bay Area. And, following Dennis McGreevy's post, to parts of Wisconsin: Milwaukee is solidly in the "soda" region. I recall as a kid visiting my cousins in (the gawksomely named) Libertyville, Illinois, and being amused by their references to "pop." - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::As long as I don't sleep, he decided, I won't shave. ::That must mean...as soon as I fall asleep, I'll start shaving! __Thomas Pynchon, VINELAND__ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 12:24:40 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey on 2001/04/16 Mon PM 12:06:00 MDT wrote: > And, following Dennis McGreevy's post, to parts of Wisconsin: Milwaukee is > solidly in the "soda" region. I recall as a kid visiting my cousins in > (the gawksomely named) Libertyville, Illinois, and being amused by their > references to "pop." I grew up in Rockford Illinois, not too far from the Wisconsin border, and that was "soda" territory, from what I remember. Colorado is "pop" land, at least in the urban/suburban areas, which confused me when I moved out here. Not sure why I'm contributing to this Staplian thread... must be a slow day... or maybe I'm just glad to see Miles back... Who took Frank Black's guitars?? Later. --Rog Roger Winston/Reign delle Rane ``Not every candle burns'' http://www.reignoffrogs.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 14:41:11 -0400 From: Tim Victor Subject: RE: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" On Monday, April 16, Miles Goosens wrote: > Greensboro, which may be a straight > shot from here, true, is an eight-hour straight shot, and firmly in the Pop > Belt, so I'm not surprised at Tim's befuddlement at the generic use of > "Coke." OK, thanks for the clarification, Miles. I didn't think I would miss something like that. In a place where soft-drink partisanship is a way of life, saying "Coke" when you mean "Pepsi" seems unthinkable. Most folks here think the two drinks have about as much in common as tap water and battery acid. They were ready to take to the streets over New Coke. On Monday, April 16, Larry Tucker: > I started my life in the *very* rural South of eastern North Carolina where > they were always referred to as "drinks". And what you got was a Pepsi Cola > unless you asked for Coke specifically. What Tucker said. Asking for "pop" here will only get you a funny look unless your waitron happens to be a transplanted Yankee. It's important to remember that "drink" doesn't have the suggestion of alcohol in these parts, I guess because of the strong Baptist influence. Everyone drinks, they just don't admit it or do it where the preacher might see them. Best wishes, Tim Victor TimVictor@csi.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 14:31:57 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" For balance, my many years throughout the South has never seen "Coke" referring to anything less specific than a cola. Any other carbonated drink is ordered by the proper descriptor or brand name. "Seltzer," however, is better ordered down South as "soda water." Also, New Jersey seems to be primarily a "soda" state, although the Pennsylvania border could very well bring you into "pop" territory. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 11:31:16 +0800 From: Elizabeth Setler Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics (fwd) At 1:02 PM -0500 4/16/01, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >Tell your Loud Fan list that this SoCal native is debunking this >myth. We call >all drinks double grande lattes. ;-) But really, we don't call carbonated, >sugar-laden beverages cokes or pops (as many do in the upper midwest, right?). Ah, I'm so glad it's not just me! Having lived in Southern CA for fourteen years now, and having ordered probably thousands of Cokes in hundreds of restaurants, I've never had anyone treat it as a generic fizzy beverage request. Although I will confess that even as the word "coke" slithers past my lips, I'm really hoping for a Pepsi. I hail from Pittsburgh originally, and that's definitely a "pop" area - - which basically ensures that that term shall never be used by me, as I can't help but hear it in That Accent. I usually go with soft drink, although my preferred method is to order the specific thing I want (if there's any way to ascertain the options). On an unrelated and strangely musical note, since I'm pretty sure it was this list that turned me on to Hawksley Workman in the first place, I should return the favor by telling y'all that his new Canadian-only release, "Last Night We Were The Delicious Wolves," has hijacked my CD player for the last two weeks straight. And despite its foreign nature, it's easy and inexpensive to come by... check hmv.com for starters. - -- Elizabeth ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 11:49:20 -0700 From: Cindy Alvarez Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics (fwd) >Somebody said: > >> > Such is also the case in southern California (as well as Nevada, a college >> > acquaintance tells me). >> > It is not unusual to ask for "a coke" at a fast food joint and have them >> > say "what kind?", entirely without irony. > >To which this from my California correspondent: > >---------- Forwarded message ---------- >Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 08:05:55 -0700 >From: Susan Lowry >To: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey >Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics > >Tell your Loud Fan list that this SoCal native is debunking this myth. We >call >all drinks double grande lattes. ;-) But really, we don't call carbonated, >sugar-laden beverages cokes or pops (as many do in the upper midwest, right?). >We call them a lot of things--but this is so far from the South south, there's >really no cultural connection. For one thing, it's the heat, not the >humidity, >out here. Well, I grew up in Southern California (unfortunately), and we certainly did call them that. But your friend and her double lattes, sounds more like an L.A. gal (fancy coffee still hasn't really 'caught on' in my hometown, despite the presence of a couple of starbucks), and the difference between the metropolitan areas and the large-but-suburban cities is immense. As of my last trip home at Christmas, though, I can certainly vouch for the coke belt. c ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 15:06:36 -0400 From: Dana L Paoli Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" Not sure why I'm contributing to this Staplian thread... must be a slow day... or maybe I'm just glad to see Miles back... >>>>>>>> It would be more accurate to call this a Normanian thread, as when this exact topic was discussed commencing on September 26, 1999, it was essentially instigated by Jeff, although a case could be made that Carolyn was ultimately the responsible party. An interesting quote from *that* thread: "Hey, I think we've done this before!" provides more ammunition for the argument that every 18 months Jeff's program repeats. - --dana ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 13:27:13 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" Dana L Paoli on 2001/04/16 Mon PM 03:06:36 MDT wrote: >> Quoting Roger Winston: >> Not sure why I'm contributing to this Staplian thread... must be a slow >> day... or maybe I'm just glad to see Miles back... > >>>>>>>> > It would be more accurate to call this a Normanian thread, as when this > exact topic was discussed commencing on September 26, 1999, it was > essentially instigated by Jeff, although a case could be made that > Carolyn was ultimately the responsible party. I was speaking more of thematic content than of assigning responsibility. > An interesting quote from *that* thread: "Hey, I think we've done this > before!" provides more ammunition for the argument that every 18 months > Jeff's program repeats. Well, this is true. It just goes to show you that there's a bit of Staplism in all of us, even in the 'bots. We're one big happy family!! Smoochies, Later. --Rog Roger Winston/Reign delle Rane ``Not every candle burns'' http://www.reignoffrogs.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 16:18:39 -0400 From: Dan McCarthy Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Elmore Leonard? At 01:43 PM 4/13/01 -0400, Aaron Milenski wrote: >>Can anyone here recommend their favorite Leonard books? > >I tend to like the older ones. GLITZ and 52 PICKUP (the latter about a >pet topic of mine, snuff movies, which, by the way, DO NOT EXIST) Actually, I'm fairly certain that snuff movies do exist. I have no proof of that, of course, but I think we can all agree that it's impossible to prove the non-existence of something with 100% conclusiveness. My reasoning is that humans will find an incorrect or immoral use for just about any form of media, and why should film be an exception? It's highly unlikely that someone, somewhere, out there in the vast world we all live in, has NOT filmed or video'd a murder or rape taking place. And certainly art has depicted some unsavory subjects. Goya, H.R. Giger, there are all kinds of painters that have earned their reputations through the depiction of dark subject matter. Dan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 16:36:52 -0400 From: Dan McCarthy Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Scott's solo At 03:40 PM 4/15/01 -0600, Roger Winston wrote: >>No Scott solo album - it's a live Loud Family album. > >Just to clarify further, here's a link to Joe's original post on the >subject, back on March 12th: > >http://www.escribe.com/music/loudfans/m18429.html > >Note that the live album is called FROM RITUAL TO ROMANCE. > >Pay attention, people! Later. --Rog That's okay! I'll take it anyway! (the other) Dan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 17:25:16 EDT From: MarkWStaples@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Loud Family Live Hey, I knew about the Loud Family live record (!). I thought there might (in a perfect world) be a Scott solo record as well (if Ken Stringfellow can do it, why not Scott?). Should I be able to get this record through my local record shop, or do I need to go ahead and send you some money? (Fed Ex Priority Overnight!) I'm posting this to the list in case anyone else has the same question. Thanks (more obligatory parentheses). M ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 18:32:08 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV On Mon, 16 Apr 2001, Miles Goosens wrote: > The part of WV Jeffrey seems to be describing in that paragraph is the > Kanawha Valley, which indeed is chock full of chemical plants. Most of > them are all too prominent on the I-64 stretch between Huntington and > Charleston, including the DuPont plant at Institute, WV -- the doppelganger > of the notorious Bhopal, India, facility. It's not a part of the state I'd > want to show off, but unfortunately, it's a common point of entry from the > Midwest into West Virginia, and thus one of the memories travellers take Yep, that's right. Since we were indeed coming from the midwest and heading toward Charlottesville, VA, by what seemed the most direct route, that's almost certainly the way we went. > Back to Jeffrey's Mountain State travelogue: > >Memory perhaps negatively enhanced by two further experiences: stopping at > >a gas station and being asked repeatedly something that sounded like > >"w'allya tainya?" We finally made out that the woman was saying "what all > >your tag number?" - which, it took us a while to discern, meant "what is > >your license plate number?" Rose insists that, as soon as it was obvious > >we had no idea what she was saying, her accent grew ever more kudzu-esque. > > That sounds like a slurred/drawled phrase you'd hear further south, in > places you'd be more likely to find kudzu. Or maybe to northern ears, > *everything* we say sounds like "w'allya tainya." :-) Perhaps she was a recent emigre from Alabama? > >(and I do mean descending) of our trip through the state, at dusk, in a > >misty rain, at about 40 degrees, on a road otherwise traveled exclusively > >by folks who know every curve and jigger by heart, and therefore who drove > >the road at James Bond-like speed, becoming very irritated at us > > That sounds more like the bulk of WV, the part I know and love, where > there's not any room between the mountains to put a chemical factory! It's > the prettiest part, but at dusk in the mist, not a lot of it is > visible. Plus flatlanders might find the whole experience somewhat less > terrifying if they could see where they're going. We flatlanders would have found the experience less terrifying if our brakes had been in good working order (and if we hadn't, flatlander-like, applied them constantly on hills, instead of downshifting). > I'm sorry that Jeffrey and Rose had such a bad experience travelling in my > home state. If they ever come back through and have some time to sightsee, > I suggest making the trip between April and October, spending the night at > a decent hotel in Huntington, filling up the gas tank there, then striking > south (and away from the Kanawha Valley) the next morning, either via US 52 > along the Tug River (the WV-KY border, Hatfields & McCoys country, and > you'll pass by the real Matewan), or via WV 10 to Logan -- either way > you'll eventually end up on US 52 going towards Welch and Bluefield and > past all the places of my not very misspent youth. Or heck, I-77 from > Charleston to Bluefield is a gorgeous drive, though it'll cost you three > tolls at at least $1.25 a pop (I haven't made this drive in a while, it > could be more now!)... I think that latter route we may have taken on another trip - but since I wasn't driving, I'm not sure. But yeah, if ever we have time and money to take all the trips to visit all the people we'd like to, that sounds good. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::As long as I don't sleep, he decided, I won't shave. ::That must mean...as soon as I fall asleep, I'll start shaving! __Thomas Pynchon, VINELAND__ ps: welcome back, Miles! So tell us of your experiences in the belly of the whale... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 19:29:44 -0400 From: Dana L Paoli Subject: [loud-fans] unexpected eno appearance(ns) Just found a CD (on Sub Pop, '91) by a band called the Walkabouts entitled "Scavenger." I wonder if this is well known...I'd never heard of them before. I picked it up because it was cheap, and because it listed Brian Eno as playing keyboards and back up vocals on one song. Natalie Merchant also makes a guest appearance, which isn't a big deal to me, but that was probably another factor. The price ($1.99) didn't hurt either. There's not much to say about the first nine songs (which are eno free). They seem like competent indie rock, and occasionally remind me slightly of Game Theory doing one of their non-Scott detours into competent mediocrity. The tenth, however, is where eno steps in, and boy does it make a difference. Sounding sort of like what I expected the Cale/Eno collaboration to be, it's a slowly building almost-spiritual (chorus: there's a late train to Mercy but I hope it never comes, there's a late train to Mercy...) that winds up in an extended On-Some-Faraway-Beach-y ending that goes on, very nicely, for about four or five minutes with string quartet and keyboards pulsing and ebbing. What's especially odd is that eno didn't write or sing the song, but his stamp is unmistakeable. I can't think of many people who can do that while just playing keyboards (ok, he sings backup too, but you'd never know it was him). I guess I'm posting about this because it was so unexpected. I wonder how many other indie-rock albums contain odd cameo's like this. And I really wonder how the hell these people hooked up with eno. They don't seem to have much to do with the kind of stuff that interests him. - --dana ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 18:57:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" On Mon, 16 Apr 2001, Dana L Paoli wrote: > It would be more accurate to call this a Normanian thread, as when this > exact topic was discussed commencing on September 26, 1999, it was > essentially instigated by Jeff, although a case could be made that > Carolyn was ultimately the responsible party. > > An interesting quote from *that* thread: "Hey, I think we've done this > before!" provides more ammunition for the argument that every 18 months > Jeff's program repeats. Dammit! You're onto me! So, uh, what is the deal with all these Loudfans having grown up within 100 miles of me, anyway? (Note also that Shalini Chatterjee went to school in Madison...) Wait a minute - Roger grew up in Rockford? Did you go to school with Rick Nielsen? - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::I play the guitar. Sometimes I play the fool:: __John Lennon__ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 18:08:26 -0600 From: Roger Winston Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" At Monday 4/16/2001 06:57 PM -0500, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >Wait a minute - Roger grew up in Rockford? Did you go to school with Rick >Nielsen? Jeff, I *am* Rick Nielsen. Whatever happened to all this season's losers of the year? Later. --Rick Roger Winston/Reign delle Rane "Not every candle burns" http://www.reignoffrogs.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 19:24:25 -0700 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: Re: [loud-fans] unexpected eno appearance(ns) Dana L Paoli wrote: > Just found a CD (on Sub Pop, '91) by a band called the Walkabouts > entitled "Scavenger." I wonder if this is well known...I'd never heard > of them before. I picked it up because it was cheap, and because it > listed Brian Eno as playing keyboards and back up vocals on one song. > Natalie Merchant also makes a guest appearance, which isn't a big deal to > me, but that was probably another factor. The price ($1.99) didn't hurt > either. > > There's not much to say about the first nine songs (which are eno free). > They seem like competent indie rock, and occasionally remind me slightly > of Game Theory doing one of their non-Scott detours into competent > mediocrity. The tenth, however, is where eno steps in, and boy does it > make a difference. Sounding sort of like what I expected the Cale/Eno > collaboration to be, it's a slowly building almost-spiritual (chorus: > there's a late train to Mercy but I hope it never comes, there's a late > train to Mercy...) that winds up in an extended On-Some-Faraway-Beach-y > ending that goes on, very nicely, for about four or five minutes with > string quartet and keyboards pulsing and ebbing. What's especially odd > is that eno didn't write or sing the song, but his stamp is > unmistakeable. I can't think of many people who can do that while just > playing keyboards (ok, he sings backup too, but you'd never know it was > him). > > I guess I'm posting about this because it was so unexpected. I wonder > how many other indie-rock albums contain odd cameo's like this. And I > really wonder how the hell these people hooked up with eno. They don't > seem to have much to do with the kind of stuff that interests him. > According to Chris Eckman's notes at http://www.TheWalkabouts.com/COLL.htm The Walkabouts hooked up with Eno because "he happened by the studio that night, almost by chance and recorded some tracks only after we got him drunk".. Looking at the list of collaborations, they've also worked with Peter Buck and most of Camper Van Beethoven. I have a handful of Walkabouts albums (including SCAVENGER), and I think they're quite a bit better than "competent mediocrity", and don't think it's at all strange that they'd work with Brian Eno, or he'd work with them, so I'd never even thought of it before.. Steve ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V1 #41 ******************************