From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V1 #39 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Sunday, April 15 2001 Volume 01 : Number 039 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] Disney jokes (ns) [Dana L Paoli ] Re: [loud-fans] Disney jokes (ns) [JRT456@aol.com] [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" [Holly Kruse ] [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV [MarkWStaples@aol.com] [loud-fans] CD cataloguer? ["Amy B. P. Lewis" ] RE: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics [Tim Victor ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 09:47:32 -0400 From: Dana L Paoli Subject: [loud-fans] Disney jokes (ns) For some reason we're watching the Disney cartoon "Recess" this morning. Two jokes from the show: "My research proves that the Donner party ran out of condiments." "...so I said to the Superintendent, 'that was no kindergartner, that was my wife.'" [delivered by a teacher sitting in a hot tub] Huh??? - --dana ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 10:56:56 EDT From: JRT456@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Disney jokes (ns) In a message dated 4/14/01 6:55:11 AM, dana-boy@juno.com writes: << For some reason we're watching the Disney cartoon "Recess" this morning. Two jokes from the show:.... "...so I said to the Superintendent, 'that was no kindergartner, that was my wife.'" [delivered by a teacher sitting in a hot tub] >> I knew that Victor Salva was back working for Coppolla. I didn't know Disney had hired him back, too. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 14:06:28 -0700 From: Holly Kruse Subject: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" Miles wrote: > I hail from the great "pop" belt, so this was all a shock to me when > I moved here... I too experienced culture shock when, after having spent my whole life in The Pop Belt (aka the Upper Midwest, and in my case, Iowa City, IA and Champaign-Urbana, IL), I moved to the East Coast. Whenever I referred to a cola or similar drink as "pop", I was greeted with befuddled looks. I pretty quickly switched from "pop" to "soda". Now that I'm in Louisville, which probably sits on the great pop/coke/soda dividing line, I'm just very confused. It does raise the question of whether Pop Belters are an identifiable demographic group. And if so, will we find them as a Prizm category? For scary fun with marketers' visions of you and your neighbors, take a look at http://www.delluke.claritas.com:80/YAWYL and enter your zip code. I have a tiny bit of shameless self-promotion, because today in the mail I received the massive tome that is _The Garland Encyclopedia of World Music, Vol. 3: The United States and Canada_.... and if you flip through the almost 1400, you might stumble across a small essay by me called "Indie Pop in Champaign-Urbana," right after Neil Rosenberg's piece on bluegrass. The check I got for this wasn't huge, but I see that Amazon sells this book for $250 (!), so I can't complain! It even comes with a CD of musical examples to accompany the text, although they all seem to be things like "Beautiful Dreamer" by Steven Foster, "In The Pines" by Lead Belly, "Lam Khon Savane" (Laotian-American), and "The Gloucester Witch" (traditional, New England.) Apparently Adam Schmitt and Nick Rudd weren't of sufficient ethno- musicological interest, but I think the CD will still be a rollicking good listen. Holly Kruse hkruse@infi.net (who may not be a prolific, hyper-literate music critic with an encyclopedic knowledge of rock music like some loud-fans whose opinions I always read with great interest, but who is the proud owner of another big heavy book.) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 14:28:06 EDT From: MarkWStaples@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV In a message dated 4/13/01 10:08:18 AM Eastern Daylight Time, outdoorminer@mindspring.com writes: << At least most Americans actually know that South Carolina is a real state, and I can assure you that the same isn't true about West Virginia. Heck, my best friend in Nashville, who's otherwise super-smart and able to master just about any form of knowledge, will still ask me "so, are you going home to Virginia for the holidays?" >> That's a shame. West Virginia is the most beautiful state I've ever seen. The poverty there is not beautiful mind you, but the place itself is. I helped a friend move back there in 1993, (for extra driving challenge, load down a 3-cylinder Daihatsu Charade with two football player build guys and as much crap as you can stuff in every nook and cranny and drive through mountains) and we went to visit his folks before he moved back, and I went to visit him after, and each time I would say to myself, I could live here. He grew up in outside of Union WV, which is I guess near Beckley? and it was so quiet and dark at night, in bed you could hear your heart beating, and, there was no bothersome light pollution...just stars. The air was so clean and you could OD on all the nature...I especially liked the remoteness of where his folks lived. The people seemed pleasingly attitude-free, but there was the obligatory contingent of "These Colors Don't Run" types in rifle-racked rusty trucks, but hey, we've got those here. When my friend moved to White Sulfur Springs to taking a nursing position in a rest home there, I went to visit, and I couldn't believe how charming the town was. There's that resort there where they had the nuclear conflict shelter for the President and Congress (the Greenbriar?) and I wouldn't mind spending the weekend there once, though I'd better get some clothes from Brooks Brothers, and my income better increase about tenfold (not gonna happen on either counts). It looked like a Lionel train set come to life. With the influx of population in the Appalachian Mountain range states in the past decade according to recent census data, I'm sure the state is changing rapidly, but I'm glad I got to see a glimpse of it before it got homogenized like the rest of America. But if this homogenization brings some much needed jobs there, then bring it on. M np Matthew Sweet INSIDE ps Have a pleasant Easter (and to Loud-fans too) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 16:34:10 -0400 From: "Amy B. P. Lewis" Subject: [loud-fans] CD cataloguer? a friend of mine asked if i know of any good (windows-based) CD- + MP3-cataloguing software, and all i could offer back was a shrug. he currently uses music at (not sure if i rendered that right), which he likes for CDs -- because it sucks all the artist/track info from an online database . for MP3s, however, it doesn't seem able to organize the tracks in the correct playing order. if anyone has any advice, i'd be mucho obliged. please contact me offlist. thanks! amy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 18:56:14 -0400 From: Tim Victor Subject: RE: [loud-fans] Lonely Spartanburg Flower Stall lyrics On Friday, April 13, Miles Goosens wrote: > (In Nashville and points further south, "Coke" is a generic term for "soft > drink" -- a correct answer to my query could be "Pepsi," "7-Up," "RC," > etc. I hail from the great "pop" belt, so this was all a shock to me when > I moved here...) This one's been a puzzler to me lately. Only in the last couple of years have I heard reports of "Coke" being used generically. And having lived in Greensboro (straight east on I-40 from Nashville) off and on since the age of three, I've never personally heard it used that way. Have I been mixing with the wrong crowd or something? What I do hear often is, "can I get you a Coke?" Used this way, I take it as a general offer of a beverage. I could ask, "you have any tea?" if that's what I'd prefer. When I've visited relatives in Buffalo, they'll usually make a similar offer of "can I get you a beer?" But I wouldn't make the claim that "beer" is a generic word for "beverage" in western NY on that basis. (It might be more accurate to say that it's the only beverage in western NY. ) When I ask for Coke in a restaurant, I'll often be asked, "We have Pepsi. Will that be OK?" I've never been offered Dr. Pepper or Mountain Dew as an option, but maybe I just don't get out enough. Best wishes, Tim Victor TimVictor@csi.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 19:31:44 EDT From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" In a message dated 01-04-14 14:16:38 EDT, hkruse@infi.net writes: > have a tiny bit of shameless self-promotion, because > today in the mail I received the massive tome that is > _The Garland Encyclopedia of World Music, Vol. 3: The > United States and Canada_.... and if you flip through > the almost 1400, you might stumble across a small essay > by me called "Indie Pop in Champaign-Urbana," right after > Neil Rosenberg's piece on bluegrass. The check I got > for this wasn't huge, but I see that Amazon sells this > book for $250 (!), so I can't complain! It even comes > with a CD of musical examples to accompany the text, > although they all seem to be things like "Beautiful Dreamer" > by Steven Foster, "In The Pines" by Lead Belly, "Lam > Khon Savane" (Laotian-American), and "The Gloucester > Witch" (traditional, New England.) Apparently Adam > Schmitt and Nick Rudd weren't of sufficient ethno- > musicological interest, but I think the CD will still > be a rollicking good listen. Congrats! Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 03:03:59 +0100 From: "md.robbins" Subject: [loud-fans] Tape Review: Jon Gabriel's 'Rhythm Is Gonna Get You.' Many thanks here to Jon for the tape. Unfortunately, truth to tell, a lot of stuff here wasn't immediately 'up my street' though several things have 'grown' on me. As ever it's down to the irredeemably and apologetically subjective...... Side One Macha Loved Bedhead - You And New Plastic 'Oh Manchester: such a lot to answer for' - like a few tracks here this does put me in mind of The Divies/New Order and 'our Hooky''s influence in particular. Powerful but nonetheless a bit err.......relentless [not necessarily a bad thing .]...first Mancunian Candidate [couldn't resist that one..] of the tape. Broadcast - Come On Let's Go This might be near top of the pile of the mini 'genre', but this particular school of electro post MOR does tend to leave me fairly uninspired. The 'Home Counties' mock debutante flavour to the female vocals is all too pervasive over here I should mitigatingly add, even in Rochdale... Stereolab - Household Names Ok - so this bunch are the originators: I caught Stereolab mania a few years ago, enthusiastically scarfed up a few albums and then lost it just as fast when they all conflated into a high calibre musak of which this is another superlative example. So it goes Mr.V...... To Rococo Rot - She Loves Animals Hmmm... far too 'electro' for my tastes, 'dull' 'old' 'reactionary' that I am........but then I never dug Cabaret Voltaire either... Komeda - Frolic More of my less than favourite female vcls: some minor 7th ish chords a la 'Light My Fire' fuel this, with a George Benson 'talkin' guitar solo' in the middle and some damned catchy scat singing: K is for kwirky and 'klectic...our friends eclectic [hic]. Optiganally Yours - The Outer Space Not my cup of Earl Grey, though the extra terrestrial cooing owl noises are cute..I go more for the John Shuttleworth D.O.R. Brylcreem school of synth burbling m'self. Fine China - We Rock Harder Than You Ever Knew That New Order influence strikes me anew, even down to the Sumneresque vocal whisper and the smooooth synth sprinklings. Of Montreal - The Problem With April Nice line in lite Baroque a la Van Dyke Parks/Rufus Wainwright. If these guys don't wear straw boaters they should: I have mine on right now, as it happens. I like this a lot, but then one would...nice ring to the name too: Joy Division should've called themselves Of Macclesfield, ahem.... Thingy - Ob1 A Star Wars tribute in mock nursery rhyme form? Why? [A Rhetorical Question.] For Against - You Only Live Twice Again, a track that seems reminiscent of those dark UK days of the late 70s/early 80s ['yore'] when every other band Peel played had this 'cathedral' guitar sound, courtesy of The Holy Chorus Pedal I assume. [They were mandatory back then over here - you had to own one even if you didn't own an electric guitar - 'Up North' we used to have to walk around with 'em hung around our necks like medallions - don't even ASK about the 'settings' nuances.....] Half String - Eclipse Again: that rousing, but for me, all too time encapsulised post 70s/80s cusp indie sound. [And I taped almost all those sessions, even Modern Eon [who?], for my sins: 'I can smile about it now but at the time it wasn't quite so terrible', to gratuitously and joyfully paraphrase the recently maligned Mr Morrissey in his retrospectively now irrefutable heySmithday.] Reminds me of the admittedly little Ride I've heard. Swervedriver - Duel Ooh, surging Iommian power chord slabs to give you a big fatpiggyback Laney grin/grimace.Again Factory's favourite sons kinda peep mischievously through, tracing incomprehensible yet curiously suggestive finger animal shadows on the wall as if imparting arcane Mancunian obscurities or at the very least mother's secret lobby [that's hotpot to non UKers] recipe... Starflyer 69 - Play The 'C' Chord [live] Err....heavy with breathy vocals. "They will / they will / rock you." WAIT A MINUTE - have I just heard my first 'shoegazer' band? Side Two Starflyer 69 - Blue Collar Love [Joy Electric dub] The sound of Venusian washing machines alternately stalking an unforgiving landscape and indulgently pampering their young.... Heavy synth action. A grower. Magnetic Fields - I Don't Want To Get Over You Only the 2nd MF track I've heard: so he sings like this ALL the time then? Jupiter Affect - Drusilla, I Dig Your Scene I lurved the early Clockers [haw] - not sure about the downright peculiarly incongruous heavy handed guitar riffing/sound mix here: seems to work against Quercio's vocal style as much as did the Clock's blander latterday soundscapes. And on the evidence of this it still seems like he hasn't quite regained the knack for the killer pop song: limper wrists Michael, or for whoever the guitar player is anyway...... Try a Marr type maybe: now there was a chorus pedal... The Negro Problem - The Rain In Leimert Park Yet another great NP track - I'm postponing buying their albums just to have something to look forward to after if and when I ever track down the Tommy Keene albums... Stephen Malkmus - Jo Jo's Jacket 'Epic Indie'? - honestly don't know what to make of this... how seriously do artists like this want one to take 'em? 'Empire of the Bedroom' Rock? Wrens - Fire, Fire Had a Wrens album which I loved on first hearing, mainly for the nth post punk/sonic aesthetic but somehow never wanted to play it again. Robert Pollard - Pop Zeus Was persuaded to finally investigate GBV via 'Do The Collapse' and loved it, quite possibly down to the surprisingly enduring pop sensibility input of old hack Raybans Ocasek [and the 1st Cars lp actually now sounds great.] Pollard certainly has a nice line in catchy one finger walking guitar runs: eventually I must investigate even further. Badly Drawn Boy - Everybody's Stalking If I was going to, shall we say, descend to the 'Well I can't take anyone seriously who....' level I'd here blithely refer to that bloody stupid hat gimmick. In 'mature' mode however, I remain steadfastly unconvinced as to his inexplicably much vaunted talents no matter how much I hear: it's a culturally specific type thang [eh?], I suppose... Yazbek - No More This has an endearing and curiously Mike Lloydish [October Country, The (American) Smoke, no not theWCPAEB] feel to it: nice string sections [synths?] in it and a refreshing keyboard based song style too. Belle And Sebastian - The Model Aw Hell: not a cover of the Kraftwerk number after all; what a lost opportunity. Can't honestly say I go for this nth post Drake 'so pale and precious' school, not merely or necessarily because as such they probably wouldn't entertain such a jape in the first place.That said this could grow on me: Hell, Drake did for awhile, like moss on ye olde oak tree do: eventually it itches though. Heard 'Northern Sky' on Stuart Maconie's Saturday night BBC Radio 2 prog, UK loudfans [and Big Star too].... Antonio Carlos Jobin - Aguas De Marco Wonder why the female vocals in this kind of stuff remain so persistently and irresistably exotic: though I can't help visualising the male half of this duet sporting the greezy 'tache and the straining cumerbund ['good name for a group'] : ah, stereotypes, eh? [Another chapatti vicar? - hi jen : )] God knows what they're singing about but at one point they both chuckle knowingly, the fiends.......... Carlos Vives - La Hamaca Grande Accordion [?] flourishes galore: sounds like these hearty fellows are having far too good a time. Again though, Philistine that I am I don't speak the lingo, so they could be ironically imparting a harrowing tale of earthquake survival for all I know. Thingy - Mayday Kinda thunders and judders nicely enough along, with all hell being knocked out [as y'do given half a chance] of what sounds like at least 2 basses or one with a string surfeit. Nice dynamics. Macha Loved Bedhead - Believe To these ears this sounds like a doleful take on a Cher hit I barely recall, with a subtler vocoder touch: shurely shum mishtake on my part unless it turns out this is the original version or a sang froid cover; after all, I know so little of these things.....I hope whoever's playing/with the touch tone phone in the background finally gets through. Again, many thanks to Jon for the tape. Happy Easter everyone. [The bonfires are passi: now we are amassing piles of rotting livestock corpses: Damien Hirst eat yer heart out , so t' speak...] md Reality Check: 'I had to walk on some people too, just to save my life' - Journalist survivor of the recent South African Football Stadium disaster. np: 'Swans'/'Prisoner of the Past' - Prefab Sprout ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 23:27:26 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Re: Wild, Wonderful WV On Sat, 14 Apr 2001 MarkWStaples@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 4/13/01 10:08:18 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > outdoorminer@mindspring.com writes: > > << At least most > Americans actually know that South Carolina is a real state, and I can > assure you that the same isn't true about West Virginia. Heck, my best > friend in Nashville, who's otherwise super-smart and able to master just > about any form of knowledge, will still ask me "so, are you going home to > Virginia for the holidays?" >> > > That's a shame. West Virginia is the most beautiful state I've ever seen. > The poverty there is not beautiful mind you, but the place itself is. I Hmmm...must have experienced different parts of it than we did. What I remember: highways perched precarious midway between turgid, polluted rivers and admittedly impressive mountaintops; lots of factories belching smoke to obscure said mountaintops and provide second adjective for said rivers; general air of dirt and grime every which way. Memory perhaps negatively enhanced by two further experiences: stopping at a gas station and being asked repeatedly something that sounded like "w'allya tainya?" We finally made out that the woman was saying "what all your tag number?" - which, it took us a while to discern, meant "what is your license plate number?" Rose insists that, as soon as it was obvious we had no idea what she was saying, her accent grew ever more kudzu-esque. Second, utterly non-person-connected negative memory: realizing that our brakes were not working well, just as we were on the descending portion (and I do mean descending) of our trip through the state, at dusk, in a misty rain, at about 40 degrees, on a road otherwise traveled exclusively by folks who know every curve and jigger by heart, and therefore who drove the road at James Bond-like speed, becoming very irritated at us tremulously creeping along in our not-necessarily-roadworthy 1974 Opel (there were not that many areas where passing was feasible). Oh John Denver, so much to answer for... On an utterly unrelated note: we just got back from seeing _Memento_. Both of us recommend it highly - but here's an amusing detail (not a spoiler): The actor who played Sammy recently appeared on _The Lone Gunmen_...playing a guy whose memory had been affected by an accident. Humorous coincidence, or slightly premature endorsement-casting? - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::a squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous...got me? __Captain Beefheart__ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 23:51:10 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" On Sat, 14 Apr 2001, Holly Kruse wrote: > It does raise the question of whether Pop Belters are an > identifiable demographic group. And if so, will we find > them as a Prizm category? For scary fun with marketers' > visions of you and your neighbors, take a look at > http://www.delluke.claritas.com:80/YAWYL and enter your > zip code. This is truly bizarre. Apparently, since college I have never lived in an "appropriate" neighborhood. I also seriously question how many people with household income in the low 20s can afford to do much serious chatting with brokers... I ran in a few zip codes around here whose demographics I'm somewhat familiar with - and either the system lacks discernment or Milwaukee's zip codes don't correlate well with neighborhood boundaries (and why should they? I don't think that's how zip codes were assigned). As an example, they completely miss the large presence of coffee-shop habitueing, paint-splattering, tattoo-getting, club-going crowd in 53212 (a/k/a Riverwest, where we lived before moving several years back), noticing only the poorer residents of that neighborhood. Actually, the crowd I mention may not have that much more money, but that's more because of student status or "bohemian" tendencies than it is poverty as such. But if this thing's supposed to tap into "lifestyles," it's missing a lot. But that's okay - I'm happy not to be accurately marketed at, or fit too well into anyone's little segment or cluster. Here's an interesting tidbit, though: as far as I can tell, Loudfans are pretty diverse in terms of income, ranging from starving student-types to folks who run through many, many pictures of Ben Franklin - but in many other ways, we share a lot of common interests. I shouldn't say this (in case anyone's listening in), but anyone who monitored this list for a year or so could easily target-market us pretty well (and not just in terms of music, either). - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey, cheering gigantic books but being always irked at how unwieldy they are to actually read J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::does "anal retentive" have a hyphen?:: ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 00:26:36 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [loud-fans] jewelbox nirvana A couple of years ago, I asked here if anyone knew where one could buy just single components of CD jewelboxes - i.e., just the back, just the front, just a tray. No one knew. I've found a place. Since it seems more of my front covers crack than any other component, this is a real find - I have a gazillion backs and trays with no fronts floating around. I haven't actually ordered through them yet, so I can't vouch for their service, but here's the uRL: http://sleevecity.nviclassical.com/ - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::Watson! Something's afoot...and it's on the end of my leg:: __Hemlock Stones__ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 01:35:13 -0400 (EDT) From: dmw Subject: Re: [loud-fans] The "Pop Belt" On Sat, 14 Apr 2001, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > On Sat, 14 Apr 2001, Holly Kruse wrote: > > > It does raise the question of whether Pop Belters are an > > identifiable demographic group. And if so, will we find > > them as a Prizm category? For scary fun with marketers' > > visions of you and your neighbors, take a look at > > http://www.delluke.claritas.com:80/YAWYL and enter your > > zip code. hey, my category is: :::: Unexpected Error :::::::::e.toString(): java.lang.NullPointerException (twice, yet.) why does this not surprise me? > other ways, we share a lot of common interests. I shouldn't say this (in > case anyone's listening in), but anyone who monitored this list for a year > or so could easily target-market us pretty well (and not just in terms of > music, either). well, we might all buy a new loud family record ;) no, but, really. i don't think loudfans makes a very cohesive market group at all. i'm curious as to what you think we (all 300ish?) could be sold. - -- d. - - oh no, you've just read mail from doug = dmw@radix.net - get yr pathos - - www.shoddyworkmanship.net -- post punk skronk rawk = the new thing - - www.pathetic-caverns.com -- books, flicks, tunes, etc. = reviews - - www.fecklessbeast.com -- angst, guilt, fear, betrayal! = rock music ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V1 #39 ******************************