From: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org (loud-fans-digest) To: loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Subject: loud-fans-digest V1 #18 Reply-To: loud-fans@smoe.org Sender: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-loud-fans-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk loud-fans-digest Monday, April 2 2001 Volume 01 : Number 018 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [loud-fans] NP/NS Jason Long? [=?iso-8859-1?q?Stef=20Hurts?= ] Re: [loud-fans] Two tech questions [AWeiss4338@aol.com] [loud-fans] Memento [dorseycc ] [loud-fans] Hey Kid, wanna be a star? [John F Butland ] Re: [loud-fans] rhyme crime [Dan Sallitt ] Re: [loud-fans] (review) Semi-Literate Poppy Stuff [Dan Sallitt ] [loud-fans] Brian Wilson tribute [MarkWStaples@aol.com] Re: [loud-fans] Roadrunner? (ns) [Steve Holtebeck ] Re: [loud-fans] Roadrunner? (ns) ["Andrew Hamlin" ] [loud-fans] chat [Jer Fairall ] Re: [loud-fans] Memento ["\(The Arch-Villain\) West" ] Re: [loud-fans] Memento ["Andrew Hamlin" ] [loud-fans] My Mother and I would like to know ["Andrew Hamlin" Subject: [loud-fans] NP/NS Jason Long? Yesterday I got a double mix CD from someone called Jason Long from Welland in Canada but I can't for the life of me remember what the occasion was he sent me a mix for. The track listing indicates it might be someone from the Loud Family list but I could be wrong. Toodlepip, - -Stef Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 08:35:42 +0800 From: Elizabeth Setler Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Two tech questions At 8:21 PM -0500 3/30/01, AWeiss4338@aol.com wrote: >One of the things I would like to do to publise my book is have a web site. >What would be the best how to book I could buy, like a 'Dummies' type book >for that. There *is* a Web Design for Dummies book out, which is just fine, but you can probably learn everything you need to know by following tutorials online. http://dogwood.botany.uga.edu/tutor/begin/index.htm is an excellent starting point... for the trickier stuff, I like the tutorials at http://www.echoecho.com . >And if I was going to have someone design it, what would it cost. I know AOL >does give free space for a site, but you have to design it yourself I beleive. >Any advice is good advice. Web designers actually aren't allowed to discuss their pricing publicly... it constitutes price fixing, or something. Or at least that's what everyone says. :-) But you can generally expect to pay anywhere from $20 to $100 an hour, depending on the level of experience. (Speaking as a web designer who works on this fee structure, I can tell you that you can run up some really scary bills if you don't have a clear idea what you want before the work starts. I had a client recently who had me redo every single part of his 3-page website every time he came across a page somewhere that he likes... what should have been a few hundred dollars went to a few thousand, and that was even after I cut the billing in half because I felt bad about it.) Some designers also offer flat-rate designs based on your using one of their templates. There are a ton of sites where you can download graphic sets - backgrounds, buttons, etc. - and then add the simple HTML content yourself, but I think most of them are only free for non-commercial use; since you're selling a book, you might have to pay a usage fee. If you're interested in looking into any of this, I can pull together some links when I have more time... - -- Elizabeth ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 18:41:10 +0100 From: "Phil Gerrard" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Salomanda Paloganda Andy wrote: > Oddly enough, Love now has a new band with Louise Post, called > Bastard. Wasn't that also Lemmy's original choice of name for Motorhead? > In the RS staff fashion segment in the new issue, I took one look > at David Fricke in his bad Johnny Ramone hairdo and outfit and > almost pissed myself laughing. It's 2001--get a freakin' haircut!" > --Johnny Chiba, in reaction to the band Candiria, which has ties > to him, being named by Rolling Stone as one of the 10 best > heavy metal bands. Well! Not sure about the David Fricke pop - I'm still of the opinion that Fricke's one of the good guys, plus the snide Ramones reference felt a little ill-timed to me given the current stories about Joey's state of health... anyway, judging rock critics by their appearance and perceived loserdom seems a pretty short-sighted approach for any band, particularly a metal band, to take. I mean, to turn it around, are Candiria's audience really likely to be comprised solely of the beautiful and successful? I sort of doubt it... peace & love phil ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:50:20 -0800 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Salomanda Paloganda > I'm still of the opinion >that Fricke's one of the good guys, plus the snide Ramones >reference felt a little ill-timed to me given the current stories about >Joey's state of health Just to clarify, Joey's the one who's been diagnosed with cancer. Johnny's the one with the legendarily horrible bowl cut. And Candiria's technically a punk band, which I guess explains the ire. Not that I've ever heard them, Andy "Some parts of the country do not observe the change. They include Arizona, Hawaii, the part of Indiana in the Eastern time zone, Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands and American Samoa." - --from an Associated Press story on Daylight-Savings time on Yahoo! today. Oddly enough, the article says "The official time to change the clocks was 2 a.m. Sunday," giving the impression that we should have been using Daylight-Savings this entire past week. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 20:41:57 EST From: AWeiss4338@aol.com Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Two tech questions In a message dated 01-03-31 11:45:48 EST, elizabeth@fringehead.com writes: > >One of the things I would like to do to publise my book is have a web site. > > >What would be the best how to book I could buy, like a 'Dummies' type book > >for that. > > > There *is* a Web Design for Dummies book out, which is just fine, but > you can probably learn everything you need to know by following > tutorials online. http://dogwood.botany.uga.edu/tutor/begin/index.htm > is an excellent starting point... for the trickier stuff, I like the > tutorials at http://www.echoecho.com . > > >And if I was going to have someone design it, what would it cost. I know > AOL > >does give free space for a site, but you have to design it yourself I > beleive. > >Any advice is good advice. > > > Web designers actually aren't allowed to discuss their pricing > publicly... it constitutes price fixing, or something. Or at least > that's what everyone says. :-) But you can generally expect to pay > anywhere from $20 to $100 an hour, depending on the level of > experience. (Speaking as a web designer who works on this fee > structure, I can tell you that you can run up some really scary bills > if you don't have a clear idea what you want before the work starts. > I had a client recently who had me redo every single part of his > 3-page website every time he came across a page somewhere that he > likes... what should have been a few hundred dollars went to a few > thousand, and that was even after I cut the billing in half because I > felt bad about it.) Some designers also offer flat-rate designs based > on your using one of their templates. There are a ton of sites where > you can download graphic sets - backgrounds, buttons, etc. - and then > add the simple HTML content yourself, but I think most of them are > only free for non-commercial use; since you're selling a book, you > might have to pay a usage fee. If you're interested in looking into > any of this, I can pull together some links when I have more time... > -- Thanks for the info. I did buy the "dummies' book today, and yes it does look good. Thanks for the addresses, I suspect they will be helpful too. And thanks for th infor on building a site, I would like those links they sound very intersting. Andrea ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2001 11:15:49 -0700 From: dorseycc Subject: [loud-fans] Memento Has anyone seen this movie? It was fascinating thriller about a man who has no short term memory. I thought it was really good. I walked out the movie feeling disoriented-the editing definitely had an effect on me. I'm still trying to piece together what happened in this movie. Carolyn ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2001 11:26:51 -0300 From: John F Butland Subject: [loud-fans] Hey Kid, wanna be a star? Hey Folks, As our favorite 'bot-master Jeffrey Norman has mentioned on a couple of occasions, I'm editing the CD reviews section over at Toast Magazine - www.toastmag.com - and have dragooned him into contributing his unique perspective on various CDs. But, as good as he is, I can still use more reviewers. This is the most literate bunch that I've run into, so naturally, I'm turning to you. I like to keep the reviews section as eclectic as possible, so there's little chance that your tastes are to obscure or outrageous. I'm particularly keen to get more hip hop and metal into the mix, so if you are a closet homeboy or metalloid, have I got a deal for you! But, anything you're willing to review is fine. There's no pay other your name up in electrons, my gratitude, a warm fuzzy feeling (maybe), and a method to scam some free CDs. If this sounds like a gig that you'd like to get in on, contact me off-list and I'll forward the Toast Reviewers FAQ(tm) to you posthaste. I now return you to our regularly scheduled programming, How to Influence Friends & Enemies With Depleted Uranium. ;^) Thanks. best, jfb John F Butland O- butland@nbnet.nb.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2001 11:15:00 -0500 From: Dan Sallitt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] it's tha bomb! (swap review) > >Richard Thompson and Danny Thompson - "Big Chimney" > >Fireplace to chimney.. I like that! I never picked up the RT/DT > >INDUSTRY album, but I should because this song is so great! > > You really should! I don't know why, but this got absolutely *scathing* > reviews when it came it. I think maybe it's because it doesn't > particularly sound much like your average Richard Thompson album, but on > its own merits, it's a much more interesting record than it was given > credit for at the time. There's almost a jazzy feel to a lot of Richard's > playing, like he'd been listening to a lot of Wes Montgomery albums. I love this record too, but be aware that half the tracks are Richard's and half Danny's, and their work is quite dissimilar. Danny's cuts are instrumentals, more jazzy and less folk-rock than Richard's stuff. - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2001 11:16:52 -0500 From: Dan Sallitt Subject: [loud-fans] Waxwings > > The Waxwings - "Fragile Girl" > > I saw the Waxwings live a while back, and they rocked, but I still > > haven't picked up this album (LOW TO THE GROUND).. Guess I should. > > Yes. I believe LTTG was one of ten best releases last year...I like the > harmonies of these guys. This is one disc that seems to have fallen through > the cracks in indie circles somewhat, but the critics seemed to all agree on > it. They are all right on this one. I must confess that I didn't enjoy this album - the retro mood was a little oppressive to me, and the songs didn't wow me. - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2001 11:20:14 -0500 From: Dan Sallitt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] rhyme crime > Another idle thought: Fulks has written a song about Hoffs, Pat DiNizio has written a song about Michael Steele ("Behind The Wall Of Sleep") - has anyone ever written a song about either of the Petersen sisters? Well, Peter Holsapple's "Invisible Boyfriend," on the first Continental Drifters CD, is said to be about Vicki and her boyfriend who died long ago. - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2001 11:22:33 -0500 From: Dan Sallitt Subject: Re: [loud-fans] (review) Semi-Literate Poppy Stuff > 2) Meet Me on the Ledge - Continental Drifters > This has a lovely sleepy quality. Like the Beatles' Blue Album or anything > Crowded House, it has the feel of just-barely-tipsiness. Is all of their > stuff like this? I need more mellow drinking music. I don't think it's been pointed out that "Meet on the Ledge" is another Richard Thompson song, from his Fairport days. The song fits in well with the Drifters' style, but it's not the cut I'd use to exemplify them. - Dan ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 14:14:25 -0400 From: Dana L Paoli Subject: [loud-fans] Roadrunner? (ns) I found a sort of an odd CD at the Salvation Army the other day and have a question. It's one of those "Hits Post Modern Syndrome" promos, from 1993. The cover art is all by Robyn Hitchcock, and there's a poem by him called "Always the Bridesmaid" written in his calligraphy on the back (I'm wondering if this was ever turned into a song). Anyway, the CD includes a version of the Modern Lovers song "Roadrunner" that I've never heard before, and I'm wondering what it might be. It's got drums and electric guitars, but no discernable keyboards. It's definitely not the album version, it's not live, and it's not the Kim Fowley produced version. It sounds too rocking to be from his folkie period. And it's very good, in fact I may prefer it to the official version. The liner notes are less than helpful: "Roadrunner" Blackheart: The kind folks at Blackheart have blessed us with a CD compilation that represents PoMo pre-history as it appeared on the tiny Berkely-based label Berserkley. This, of course, is the label that brought us bold new music from Greg Kihn, the Rubinoos, Earth Quake (remember their version of "Friday On My Mind?) and PoMo Godfather Johathan Richman, whose Roadrunner appears in this form on CD for the first time." Does anyone know what this is, and if it (and hopefully other similar stuff) has appeared on CD since '93. - --dana np: Guided by Voices/Isolation Drills ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 16:30:44 EDT From: MarkWStaples@aol.com Subject: [loud-fans] Brian Wilson tribute Any NYC loudfans go and see the Brian Wilson tribute show featuring the Go-Go's, Aimee Mann and Paul Simon at Radio City Music Hall? "Brian Wilson is like Mozart to us." Belinda Carlisle ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2001 14:16:33 -0700 From: Steve Holtebeck Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Roadrunner? (ns) Dana L Paoli wrote: > > I found a sort of an odd CD at the Salvation Army the other day and have > a question. It's one of those "Hits Post Modern Syndrome" promos, from > 1993. The cover art is all by Robyn Hitchcock, and there's a poem by him > called "Always the Bridesmaid" written in his calligraphy on the back > (I'm wondering if this was ever turned into a song). > > Anyway, the CD includes a version of the Modern Lovers song "Roadrunner" > that I've never heard before, and I'm wondering what it might be. It's > got drums and electric guitars, but no discernable keyboards. It's > definitely not the album version, it's not live, and it's not the Kim > Fowley produced version. It sounds too rocking to be from his folkie > period. And it's very good, in fact I may prefer it to the official > version. > > The liner notes are less than helpful: "Roadrunner" Blackheart: The > kind folks at Blackheart have blessed us with a CD compilation that > represents PoMo pre-history as it appeared on the tiny Berkely-based > label Berserkley. This, of course, is the label that brought us bold new > music from Greg Kihn, the Rubinoos, Earth Quake (remember their version > of "Friday On My Mind?) and PoMo Godfather Johathan Richman, whose > Roadrunner appears in this form on CD for the first time." > > Does anyone know what this is, and if it (and hopefully other similar > stuff) has appeared on CD since '93. It's the Beserkley single of "Roadrunner", with Richman backed by members of Earthquake and the Rubinoos. It was originally released on the BESERKLEY CHARTBUSTERS sampler album in 1975, and may have been the first time the song was ever issued, because the Modern Lovers album didn't come out until 1976. It has four Jonathan Richman songs, the others being "It Will Stand," "Government Center," and "The New Teller.", all done in a similar style. The CHARTBUSTERS album was reissued by Rhino in the late 80's and came out on CD in 1993, but hasn't been reissued since then (to my knowledge) - -Steve ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 14:36:22 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Roadrunner? (ns) >Anyway, the CD includes a version of the Modern Lovers song "Roadrunner" >that I've never heard before, and I'm wondering what it might be. It's >got drums and electric guitars, but no discernable keyboards. It's >definitely not the album version, it's not live, and it's not the Kim >Fowley produced version. It sounds too rocking to be from his folkie >period. And it's very good, in fact I may prefer it to the official >version. Looks like we've got "Roadrunner Four Times"! When you say "the album version," to which album do you refer? If it's got no keyboards, it could be the version from BESERKLEY CHARTBUSTERS VOLUME ONE. If the effusion at the end exactly matches the transcription in Greil Marcus' LIPSTICK TRACES, you've got a match! But is that "Roadrunner Once" or "Roadrunner Twice..." Andy Bono Paints the Town He's long been accused of toting a "holier than thou" attitude, but U2's Bono has also made his share of bad judgment calls. On November 11, 1987, U2 played a free outdoor concert in San Francisco's Embarcadero Center, segments of which would be filmed for their forthcoming "discovering America" documentary, Rattle & Hum. During the show, Bono climbed aboard a modern sculpture by Armand Vaillancourt, and proceeded to spray paint it with the words "Rock and Roll" and "Stop The Traffic." Unamused by the singer's "rebellious" antics, the city issued a warrant for his arrest and fined him for vandalizing public property. Bono & Co. would themselves be pranked a few years later, when indie goofballs Negativland released U2, an EP that included a sound-collage titled, "I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For." Unsuspecting U2 fans still pay big bucks for it at record shows. [from a article on "Rock & Roll's Ten Wackiest Pranks" by Dan Epstein, http://www.rollingstone.com/news/newsarticle.asp?nid=13573&afl=msn#middle ] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 15:20:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Jer Fairall Subject: [loud-fans] chat Anyone up for a loudchat tonight? If so, I'll be hanging out in irc.eskimo.com #loudfans for a while... Jer Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 18:02:52 -0700 From: "\(The Arch-Villain\) West" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Memento > Has anyone seen this movie? It was fascinating thriller about a man who has > no short term memory. I thought it was really good. I walked out the > movie feeling disoriented-the editing definitely had an effect on me. I'm > still trying to piece together what happened in this movie. Holy moley! This picture is outstanding! My girlfriend and I were going back and forth for hours, deconstructing and reconstructing the story in our heads, speculating what happened to whom and why. We both love movies that demand your attention and inspire discussion afterward. I've been meaning to check out the film's website (www.otnemem.com) since I saw the movie; I think I'll go look at it now. For those of you in the dark, Miss Carolyn is right -- guy, no short term memory, wants revenge on dude who killed his wife. The gimmick is that the story unspools in reverse: the first scene is the end of the story, and each scene thereafter actually precedes the one before it. (Did I say that right?) For example, at the beginning of one scene, the protagonist is frantically searching for something when he is interrupted; the next scene reveals what he was searching for and why (my blood ran cold) and ends with him beginning his search. And so on. It actually works much better watching it as a movie than reading it as an e-mail that gives oblique descriptions in a lame attempt to avoid spoiling the story for you. But to be fair, after seeing the movie, you will feel as though you have been reading oblique e-mail all day. I can't wait for Memento to come out on DVD -- I fully intend to program my player to watch it in sequence. West Don't believe his lies ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2001 21:31:24 -0400 From: jenny grover Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Memento my husband, who is a neuroscientist, said that the protagonist is not suffering from short term memory loss, but rather from global anterograde amnesia (which can be caused by any kind of injury that damages both medial temporal lobes). he actually has short term memory (the ability to remember what is happening as long as he is concentrating on it), but the inability to form new long-term memories, which means, if he is distracted from what he is doing, he won't remember what it was. people who suffer from this generally retain long-term memory that predates the brain trauma. Jen ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 19:12:25 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] Memento >my husband, who is a neuroscientist, said that the protagonist is not >suffering from short term memory loss, but rather from global >anterograde amnesia (which can be caused by any kind of injury that >damages both medial temporal lobes). he actually has short term memory >(the ability to remember what is happening as long as he is >concentrating on it), but the inability to form new long-term memories, >which means, if he is distracted from what he is doing, he won't >remember what it was. At first I thought the fellow remembered everything until he fell asleep, but I had to give up on that idea. So his answer to "Amnesia"'s chorus question would have to be "....huh?..." Andy "I'm loading my guns. See you in prison." - --Steve Hodgson's reaction to Jim Thirlwell, aka Clint Ruin, aka Foetus, aka a lot of other things, announcing (at least) new albums for 2001: FLOW by Foetus, and VOLVOX TURBO by Manorexia. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 19:36:06 -0700 From: "Andrew Hamlin" Subject: [loud-fans] My Mother and I would like to know My mother has, God knows why, this prog-rock trivia question. I leave an answer in the capable brains of this list. Thanking you in advance, Andy > Do you know the name of the Jethro Tull song in which one of the lines is >something about a watch tower and a later line about Bibles? Maybe a >reference to Jehovah's Wits? Thanks for helping out your poor old witless >mother. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 23:05:00 -0400 From: "glenn mcdonald" Subject: Re: [loud-fans] My Mother and I would like to know > > Do you know the name of the Jethro Tull song in which one of the lines is > >something about a watch tower and a later line about Bibles? I can't find any Jethro Tull lyrics about watch towers, but "Locomotive Breath" does have a line about Gideon Bibles near the end. Maybe she heard "All Along the Watch Tower" and "Locomotive Breath" back to back and missed the break? glemm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 23:19:16 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [loud-fans] NP/NS Jason Long? On Sat, 31 Mar 2001, [iso-8859-1] Stef Hurts wrote: > Yesterday I got a double mix CD from someone called Jason Long from > Welland in Canada but I can't for the life of me remember what the > occasion was he sent me a mix for. The track listing indicates it might be > someone from the Loud Family list but I could be wrong. He's one of ours. I just got back from our trip to Mpls. to see the Soft Boys - excellent. (Alas, i didn't see the message about meeting folks until tonight.) Brief report: how come Kimberley Rew looks like he just got back from an audition for Spinal Tap? And what's the name of that (new?) song that ended the first encore - something about the rain, "Mr. Kennedy," that ended with a wonderful, extended, nearly Television-esque set of duelling guitar solos? New swap mix list should go out within the next few days - contact me if you want in or out and you're not already. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::sex, drugs, revolt, Eskimos, atheism:: ------------------------------ End of loud-fans-digest V1 #18 ******************************