From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2014 #761 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe:mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website:http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Monday, May 19 2014 Volume 2014 : Number 761 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Malka reads [Vincenzo Mancini ] Re: pitch [Dave Blackburn ] Tuning To The Birds - VIDEO [Laura O ] Malka reads [Vincenzo Mancini ] Re: JMDL Digest V2014 #758 [David Gizara ] RE: Hejira pronunciation ["Robert Sartorius" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 19 May 2014 20:06:10 +0100 (BST) From: Vincenzo Mancini Subject: Malka reads some excerpts from her book and tells that she didn't want to know Bob Dylan... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytiRRP0n2OM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2014 07:33:38 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: Re: pitch And then there was Vari-speed, a control on analog tape machines that adjusted the motor speed by small amounts. Before digital recording it was common practice to slow the tape machine a little for extra fatness on a track or speed it up a little for extra pep, without regard for the poor student trying to play along to it. The A440 reference, then, has been disregarded many many times since it was adopted. Those who cite 432Hz as a better pitch reference are in fact hearing a little more fulness and low end than if the same music is played at A440; I dont think theres anything celestial, spiritual or political whatsoever going on, though we love a good mystery when science is involved! On May 19, 2014, at 4:08 AM, David Gizara wrote: > Well, there's the classic tale of how Miles Davis' "Kind of Blue" was mastered a little slow I think. Folks learning jazz who would try to play along with it found the key hard to find. The remastered ""Kind of Blue" had a different feel for a lot of folks. > D > On May 18, 2014, at 8:39 PM, JMDL Digest wrote: ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2014 06:52:56 -0500 From: Laura O Subject: Tuning To The Birds - VIDEO Bob, you reminded me that I remembered some the content of this video you're talking about, where Joni is interviewed from her BC home discussing the songs HITS and MISSES. When talking about Magdalene Laundries she says she came out on this rock (she's seen on the rock with guitar) and tuned her guitar to the day around her, to the 'squawky' birds that have a pitch. She talks about not putting "heavy words with heavy chords" Singing "sad words against cheery chords" (Beat of Black Wings). http://jonimitchell.com/library/video.cfm?id=368 Susan, perhaps this is the video you were referring to as well? Laura ******************************************************** From: Bob Muller Subject: Tuning to the sounds of the day Yeah, that mostly comes up when she's talking about Magdalene Laundries. She says she was on the coast tuning her guitar to the sounds of the day. Wrote a pretty melody but then saw the Magdalene story in the tabloids at the grocery store and used her "pretty" melody to tell a dark tale. Bob ******************************************************** From: SusanBTaylorBand Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2014 #753 I agree it was the most fascinating things I listened to her talk about in the interview. I wish I could find it again so everyone could hear the way she talked about it. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2014 20:10:42 +0100 (BST) From: Vincenzo Mancini Subject: Malka reads Part 1 can be seen at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4GYF1j1VuU ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 May 2014 04:08:14 -0700 From: David Gizara Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2014 #758 Well, there's the classic tale of how Miles Davis' "Kind of Blue" was mastered a little slow I think. Folks learning jazz who would try to play along with it found the key hard to find. The remastered ""Kind of Blue" had a different feel for a lot of folks. D On May 18, 2014, at 8:39 PM, JMDL Digest wrote: > > JMDL Digest Sunday, May 18 2014 Volume 2014 : > Number 758 > > > > ========== > > TOPICS and authors in this Digest: > -------- > Re: JMDL Digest V2014 #757 [SusanBTaylorBand ] > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 22:36:59 -0500 > From: SusanBTaylorBand > Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2014 #757 > > I thought I would get more comments from my post regarding > birdsongs' natural pitch being sung in harmony to A 432 H instead of > A 440 H. Perhaps Joni knows what I am trying to discuss. Does she > ever reply to any of these posts? > > I say this as I wrote music for many years unknowingly on a piano > tuned a quarter step flat because of a broken bass bridge. Taking > the songs into a studio and recording them at A 440 H (the > international standard at this time) changed the "emotional" appeal > of each song. Can anyone on this Digest relate? > > Susan > > Sent from my iPad > >> On May 18, 2014, at 7:02 PM, owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL >> Digest) wrote: >> >> >> JMDL Digest Sunday, May 18 2014 Volume 2014 : >> Number 757 >> >> >> >> ========== >> >> TOPICS and authors in this Digest: >> -------- >> Re: tuning to the birds [jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com >> ] >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 19:35:58 -0400 >> From: jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com >> Subject: Re: tuning to the birds >> >> I don't think she is even aware of the difference. She is so >> intuitive that the translation from "bird" to "chromatic scale" >> happens subliminally. All she knows is that she's writing because >> she honed in on the birds. Her muse (Sadie, her maternal >> grandmother), did the rest. Yeah, I said that. >> >> Jim >> >> >> >>> That sounds like interview-speak to me. All of her tunings are >>> concordant, if unconventional, and conform to the notes in the >>> chromatic scale. Bird song certainly has its pitches, but is >>> unconfined to any scale or temperament. Its more likely Joni >>> found inspiration when out in nature, as probably most artists do, >>> but went a step further to intrigue the interviewer in claiming >>> she actually tuned to the birds.> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> End of JMDL Digest V2014 #757 >> ***************************** >> >> ------- >> To post messages to the list,sendtojoni@smoe.org. >> Unsubscribe by clicking here: >> mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe >> ------- > > ------------------------------ > > End of JMDL Digest V2014 #758 > ***************************** > > ------- > To post messages to the list,sendtojoni@smoe.org. > Unsubscribe by clicking here: > mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe > ------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 15:29:10 -0400 From: "Robert Sartorius" Subject: RE: Hejira pronunciation Was cleaning up my mailbox today when I ran across this old one. I do think I recall Joni telling the story of Hejira, the dictionary, and the "dangling J" in the "Painting with Words and Music" concert. From: Susan E. McNamara [mailto:sem8@cornell.edu] Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 10:01 AM To: Robert Sartorius; joni@smoe.org; onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Subject: RE: Hejira pronunciation Wow, Bob, this brings me on a quest to find a video interview where she pronounces it. It must be in Woman of Heart and Mind at least. Not sure. I was also reminded of the word Haj - another word describing the holy pilgrimage to Mecca. Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu From: Robert Sartorius [ mailto:bobsart48@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 9:49 PM To: joni@smoe.org; onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Cc: Susan E. McNamara Subject: RE: Hejira pronunciation Sue stated: "I've always pronounced it Heh-jeer-a ... and I think that's the way Joni pronounces it. I've heard many variations so I go with the way she says it." I think that's how Joni pronounces it, too, but I cannot pinpoint where I came to that conclusion. Can anyone else confirm? As "widely known" here on the list, the word does not appear in the song's lyrics - just the title. My "bible" (er, dictionary) has been the Random House Unabridged. I own the second Edition, which is copyrighted in 1987, and so is now 26 years out-of-date. Still, it is a magnificent tome, with exquisite dissertations on nuances of related words, to answer essentially every question that has ever come up in my conversations. Said "bible", inexplicably, does not list as one of its definitions (u.c., natch) "a masterpiece album and song by Joni Mitchell". They define(d) it as "hegira - def. 2", with a preferred pronunciation of " hi JEYE ruh" (i.e., short i in first syllable, long I in second syllable, accented). This is the pronunciation that I have used since I first "looked it up".The alternate pronunciation is "HEJ uhr uh", short e in first syllable, accent on first syllable. The pronunciation of Hegira is the same. The primary definition under Hegira (also, hejira) is "Islam. Hijra". The second definition is "any flight or journey to a more desirable or congenial place". Hijra (HIJ ruh) short i in first syllable, accent on first syllable, in turn, is 1. The flight of Muhammad from Mecca to Medina to escape persecution A.D. 622, regarded as the beginning of the Muslim Era. 2. The Muslim Era itself. Also, Hegira, Hijrah (the latter of which is suggested as the Arabic source word). The Muslim Era is defined as the period since the flight of Muhammad from Mecca in AD 622 - also known as Hijra. Of course, similar loops could be constructed from any other dictionary, with numerous variations, no doubt. And, with the increase in the frequency of usage of Islamic terms in written and spoken English over the past 26 years, there has no doubt been some evolution since then. If this were Joni's name, I would argue that she gets to make the call. [For example, my wife's maiden name is Rosenbaum, and she pronounces the last syllable as "bomb" - which, it has been decreed, is her prerogative ;-)] But Joni admits she stole her title from her dictionary, so it seems to me that her dictionary's pronunciation should control, no? All Joni needs to do is to produce the one she consulted in 1975, and I will be happy to change the way I pronounce Hejira ;-) Bobsart ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2014 #761 ***************************** ------- To post messages to the list,sendtojoni@smoe.org. Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------